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Missing the point

Wednesday, Aug 27, 2014

* I suppose the biggest news in this Dan Mihalopoulos column is that the Illinois Republican Party no longer believes that sending armed private investigators to the homes of Libertarian Party petition signers and gatherers was a good idea

On Tuesday, though, the state party’s spokesman provided this “updated” statement: “We do not support the practice of any investigator wearing a firearm while verifying petition signatures. If even one person felt intimidated, that’s unacceptable.”

Well, that’s heartening. A bit on the late side, but heartening.

* And he finally got the Rauner campaign on record

“Bruce wants as many people engaged in the political process as possible,” Rauner spokesman Mike Schrimpf said in an e-mail. “Bruce has no knowledge of these alleged activities, and if they are true, he strongly denounces them. Bruce doesn’t agree with any form of voter intimidation.”

* And, like the comment section here, he found a handful of direct ties to various players, including the private security firm, which is owned by a member of the GOP State Central Committee who is a big Rauner supporter. A notary used in the effort to kick the Libertarians off the ballot is also a member of Rauner’s staff. His conclusion

It’s not enough for Rauner to say he was blissfully unaware of what was being done on his behalf. Not when those efforts involved many people he knows well, people he has relied upon heavily in what he says is a campaign to clean up Illinois politics.

But no mention at all that the governor has called for state and federal investigations into the alleged intimidation? I don’t get it. That’s serious news. Every time Rauner talks about how this or that is corrupt, the media’s all over it. But not on this?

* The Quinn campaign’s latest response…

“When it comes to his own campaign’s use of voter intimidation with guns right under his nose, again we see Bruce Rauner choosing to hear no evil and see no evil.

“Mr. Rauner’s previous claims that he was not linked to the individuals involved in these actions have turned out to be untrue. Even more alarming, Mr. Rauner is directly linked to the individual carrying out voter intimidation with guns.

“As we’ve said before, these are serious matters that should be investigated by the State Board of Elections, Cook County State’s Attorney, and the U.S. Department of Justice Civil Rights Division.”

“What happened in Oak Park was unacceptable. No voter should be intimidated from making their voice heard as part of the political process.

“If this is how Mr. Rauner is going to run his campaign, what does this say about how he’s going to run the state of Illinois?”

* Again, we have allegations of armed voter intimidation, coupled with a call from the governor for law enforcement action and nobody covers it?

Especially when coupled with statements like this

[Illinois Republican Party Chairman Tim Schneider] wasn’t divulging details, but did say the party is identifying areas to keep an eye out for voter fraud.

“I’m not going to open up my playbook, but I will tell you that we will have a significant voter-integrity program,” he said.

And this

I was provided video by RIKEESHA PHELON, Illinois spokeswoman for the Democratic Governors Association, of Republican gubernatorial candidate BRUCE RAUNER at a Nov. 23 term limits town hall meeting in Elmhurst. Rauner appeared there with Chicago-area radio talk show host and former U.S. Rep. JOE WALSH, R-McHenry.

An audience member asked, “How do we make sure that those who love (President Barack) Obama don’t vote six, seven, eight, 10 times?” He wondered how Rauner could win, given that the system is “so corrupt.”

“Fair point,” Rauner responded, adding, “We have a massive voter fraud, voter-integrity issue in Illinois. That’s just true.” He said there should be “rigorous accountability controls inside our voting process to try to bring back integrity. We need identification checking. We need poll watchers.”

Rauner also he would be “driving another initiative, and raising money for that as well, and volunteers around the state to bring a voter-integrity process to our next election cycle and put it in place for the future.”

That video is here.

- Posted by Rich Miller        


64 Comments
  1. - Under Further Review - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 10:45 am:

    This is an embarrassing episode. Rauner cannot claim to be ignorant of what Sean Morrison and his associates are capable of. All that he need do is to call Dan Patlak.


  2. - dupage dan - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 10:51 am:

    Wow, what did PQ do to earn the cold shoulder of the entire Illinois press corps? This story ain’t got legs. It ain’t got feet. It ain’t even got toes. Where’s the liberal bias in the media?


  3. - Chicago Cynic - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 10:56 am:

    “We have a massive voter fraud, voter-integrity issue in Illinois. That’s just true.”

    Umm, no, that’s just false. There is zero evidence to support Rauner’s assertion. Zilch. Please point to the investigations and prosecutions of this type of fraud. Oh right, you can’t.


  4. - Sir Reel - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 10:57 am:

    Rauner continues to say whatever his audience wants to hear. I’m surprised he didn’t say poll watchers should be armed because, you know, the widespread fraud is occurring in “dangerous neighborhoods.”

    It’s interesting that one post talks about ballot initiatives as a way of getting voters to the polls (meaning few people vote) and another post quotes an Einstein who believes voters can vote multiple times (implying people can vote so much to throw an election).


  5. - phocion - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 10:59 am:

    This “story” wasn’t even covered in Oak Park’s hometown newspaper - and they’re hardly pro-Rauner. Sorry, Rich, maybe you’re the outlier thinking this is news, while the rest think it’s just so much noise.


  6. - train111 - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:01 am:

    If you can’t beat em —-

    it was fraud


  7. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:03 am:

    === Sorry, Rich, maybe you’re the outlier===

    Maybe I am, but when’s the last time you saw a governor call for a federal investigation and it’s completely and absolutely ignored by the media?


  8. - mcb - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:03 am:

    -cynic-

    I think the idea is that without something like voter id’s, you wouldn’t have any clue as to who is actually voting, thus making any discovery of the issue nearly impossible. So if that idea is true, then it certainly wouldn’t be shocking that there aren’t investigations or prosecutions because there would be no evidence.


  9. - too obvious - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:05 am:

    So Tim Schneider and Bruce Rauner should have no problem joining in a call for a criminal investigation.

    Use of intimidation in the petition process is a Class 4 felony under Illinois law.

    But I don’t know how Rauner separates himself with at least one of his salaried staffers linked to this.


  10. - Nonplussed - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:09 am:

    Rauner has no problem giving details about how he will stop black people from voting. He wants to bring voter ID laws to Illinois.


  11. - Adam Smith - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:14 am:

    Absolutely no allegation of any illegal actions having taken place.

    Boneheaded? Sure. Ill-advised? No doubt. Heavy-handed? I suppose. But please tell me what is illegal about duly trained and licensed PI’s carrying the guns they are allowed by law to carry.

    So the lawyers and investigators trying to throw the Libertarians off the ballot are closely tied to the Republicans? Got it. Again, anything illegal here?

    Every time the Republicans step up to try and fight fire with fire everyone gets their panties in a bunch.

    Voter intimidation and skullduggery of every stripe have been staples of the Democrat machine forever, but this has everyone freaking out?

    I suppose it is just the mere mention of guns, which are so inherently horrifying to progressives, that ignites the moral indignation.

    Meanwhile, illegal hiring at IDOT, using taxpayer dollars to pay off political cronies in the NRI scandal, and the continued stench of corruption is simply ignored by the Quinn administration.

    Again, friends, no one has claimed a single law has been broken here. I’m sure the Obama Justice Department will descend upon this to help their pal Pat and they will huff and puff about appearances and whatnot. But is all just more smoke and mirrors from Team Quinn.


  12. - jocko - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:14 am:

    ==“We have a massive voter fraud, voter-integrity issue in Illinois. That’s just true.”
    ==
    Someone needs to create a table contrasting Sasquatch sightings with instances of voter fraud, broken down by state.


  13. - VanillaMan - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:21 am:

    No one loves libertarians or conservatarians, that’s why.


  14. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:22 am:

    ===Absolutely no allegation of any illegal actions having taken place.===

    Wrong…

    (10 ILCS 5/29-4) (from Ch. 46, par. 29-4)

    Sec. 29-4. Prevention of voting or candidate support. Any person who, by force, intimidation, threat, deception or forgery, knowingly prevents any other person from (a) registering to vote, or (b) lawfully voting, supporting or opposing the nomination or election of any person for public office or any public question voted upon at any election, shall be guilty of a Class 4 felony.


  15. - MrJM - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:24 am:

    While we’re on the subject, the Illinois Firearm Concealed Carry Act does not specifically prohibit guns from polling places — cf. Missouri — but they are prohibited from schools, libraries, buildings under the control of local governments, courthouses, legislative and executive buildings, nursing homes, hospitals, park district buildings, university buildings and nuclear power plants. 430 ILCS 66/65

    In addition, the ban from pre-schools might include many churches.

    Of all the places I’ve voted in the last two decades, concealed carry firearms would/could only be permitted at the lumber yard.

    – MrJM


  16. - MrJM - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:26 am:

    “Every time the Republicans step up to try and fight fire with firearms everyone gets their panties in a bunch.”

    Fixed that for ya.

    – MrJM


  17. - Brass - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:27 am:

    When the Madigan(s) are held accountable for the shady things alleged by many campaigns over many years that will be news.


  18. - Northsider - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:30 am:

    So the candidate whose wife says he has no social agenda would have subjected marriage equality to a referendum (how would that have gone when it was time to legalize inter-racial marriages?) and is now echoing the Republican “voter fraud” canard which, as we’ve seen from other states, is nothing less than voter suppression.

    Bruce, Diana: Which of you is lying here?


  19. - Tim Snopes - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:36 am:

    Reporters are just lazy these days. And all editors want to do is run tea party / Illinois Policy Institute / pro-Bruce Rauner / anti-Madigan editorials.
    What ever became of the liberal media?


  20. - Manley - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 11:37 am:

    I don’t think Rich is hyperbolizing the issue. Intimidating and threatening circulators and petition signers is heinous and illegal. This ain’t Pyongyang.

    Thank you Rich for following up on this story.


  21. - FedUp - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:03 pm:

    I am a retired LEO and a decades long political participant. The facts of whether an individual is licensed to carry a firearm is not the issue. As a police officer, I carried a firearm almost 24/7. In uniform, my firearm was easily visable. Off duty, my firearm was concealed. The only purpose for an legally armed individual engaged in political work to open carry, is purely to intimidate. If any police officer, on their own personal time, were to expose a firearm during political work, I can guarantee that PO would be brought up on disciplinary charges.
    Rauner has been rolling in the mud with the dogs of the GOP from day one. They old saying goes, “If you want to know who I am, look at the company I keep.” I do know the company you keep, Bruce, and that’s why this Republican is working hard to keep you and your ilk out of the Governor’s Mansion.


  22. - Ghost - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:05 pm:

    === I think the idea is that without something like voter id’s, you wouldn’t have any clue as to who is actually voting, thus making any discovery of the issue nearly impossible. So if that idea is true, then it certainly wouldn’t be shocking that there aren’t investigations or prosecutions because there would be no evidence. ===

    yeah if they only had some kind of system where they recorded the name and address of the people voting, which could then be checked or verified if there was a question about whetehr that person really existed or voted. Say you took this crazy record of names and addresses and compared it against utility records, phone books etc to also verify.

    yep no way to validate or prove fraud since we have no system of records for people…..


  23. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:11 pm:

    == “We have a massive voter fraud, voter-integrity issue in Illinois. That’s just true.”==

    Except that it isn’t. And why would he say to the dope who said people were voting six or seven or eight times that it was a fair point.

    ==Again, friends, no one has claimed a single law has been broken here. I’m sure the Obama Justice Department will descend upon this to help their pal Pat and they will huff and puff about appearances and whatnot. But is all just more smoke and mirrors from Team Quinn.==

    Yeah, it’s smoke and mirrors to claim that voter intimidation was going on which is against the law. The only smoke and mirrors I see are coming from you by downplaying this.


  24. - olddog - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:13 pm:

    === “We have a massive voter fraud, voter-integrity issue in Illinois. That’s just true.” ===

    No it’s not. It’s a national Republican talking point that has been used to enact Jim Crow laws in other states — it’s good to have Rauner on record parroting it.


  25. - too obvious - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:18 pm:

    Translation: Rauner and the State GOP don’t support the practice of getting caught deploying armed men to intimidate petition signers and circulators.


  26. - too obvious - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:22 pm:

    Attention Adam Smith, I’m claiming a very serious Illinois statute has been violated here:

    See 10 ILCS 5/29-4:
    Prevention of voting or candidate support. Any person who, by force, intimidation, threat, deception or forgery, knowingly prevents any other person from (a) registering to vote, or (b) lawfully voting, supporting or opposing the nomination or election of any person for public office or any public question voted upon at any election, shall be guilty of a Class 4 felony.


  27. - Left Leaner - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:29 pm:

    Bruce playing to the base. A base so clearly misinformed about “voter-integrity” that one has to wonder if they aspire to ignorance.


  28. - fair and balanced - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:35 pm:

    This seems to be nothing more than a campaigns white noise… noise typically being made up by a losing campaign at the given time and date…campaigns seeking attention from the libertarian & Quinn side.

    note that the “journalist” stops short of claiming the person(s) were harassed or that targeted intimidation actually took place, but rather only relates a claim that the person(s) who are the subject of the actual petition challenge stated they felt intimidated after. Also a point seems to be missed that these statements have actually come out from and on behalf of the Libertarian and Quinn campaigns through their respective spokes persons.


  29. - too obvious - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:38 pm:

    “those who love (President Barack) Obama don’t vote six, seven, eight, 10 times?”

    Gee, wonder who that guy was really referring to? Rauner and Joe Walsh express no problem of course with the hateful nonsense. Really disgusting.


  30. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:51 pm:

    No legs, DD. You have no problem about an armed man knocking on your door and questioning you about your political activities?

    There should be investigations, the law seems pretty clear on that.

    For crying out loud, Rauner is basing his whole campaign now on the “outrage” over his purposely flawed term limits amendment getting tossed off the ballot by the courts.

    But trying to keep candidates off the ballot by sending armed men to knock on doors in the middle of the night is okay? Unbelievable.

    As far as the media, goes…. beats me. The whole print media is sending out resumes, i suspect.


  31. - Skeptic - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 1:05 pm:

    Left Leaner @ 12:29: It think you’ve just defined a “Low-Information Voter.”

    “these statements come out from and on behalf of the Libertarian and Quinn campaigns.” Well, if no Rauner supporters were intimidated then that might just explain why nothing has come from their campaign.


  32. - JS Mill - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 1:13 pm:

    Something that has not been emphasized is that the “PI” showed up at someone’s private residence with a weapon. I am not a gun nut but, show up at my front door, uninvited with a weapon that is clearly visible, on MY property and you will get to see part of my gun collection.

    This is just common sense/decency you do not go to another persons home carrying a gun unless you are a member of law enforcement. Oh sure, the nutjobs might claim it is their right but, according to the law it is not “(a-10) The owner of private real property of any type may
    prohibit the carrying of concealed firearms on the property under his or her control.”
    Just my take on the issue.


  33. - Da Moat - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 1:14 pm:

    If an amendment is “purposely flawed” and brought before a tribunal, would that be sanctionable?


  34. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 1:21 pm:

    ===“Bruce wants as many people engaged in the political process as possible,” Rauner spokesman Mike Schrimpf said in an e-mail. “Bruce has no knowledge of these alleged activities, and if they are true, he strongly denounces them. Bruce doesn’t agree with any form of voter intimidation.”===

    Or

    ===”We have a massive voter fraud, voter-integrity issue in Illinois. That’s just true.” He said there should be “rigorous accountability controls inside our voting process to try to bring back integrity. We need identification checking. We need poll watchers.”===

    Which Rauner do you believe;

    The Rauner wanting everyone in the process …

    …or the Rauner thinking corruption is rampant bad voting rights need to be “curtailed” or questioning the “integrity”…of others… in the process?

    Pretty pathetic.

    As to the press’ silence?

    Quinn’s juicy failures seem to Trump … Billionaire Bruce’s and the ILGOP’s…missteps(?)


  35. - fair and balanced - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 1:23 pm:

    - wordslinger - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 12:51 pm:
    …sending armed men to knock on doors in the middle of the night is okay? Unbelievable….

    you have to love your level of hyperbole!
    do you know it was the middle of the night? if so what time exactly? Do you know if it was men who showed up armed in the middle of the night??

    ok my turn at the clueless baseless BS rumor game:

    I heard it was ninja assassins! does that make you feel better word slinger?

    Actually it does feel kind of good to talk complete and utter garbage, wonder if that is why so many folks on here do?? ..HA!


  36. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 1:31 pm:

    @fair and balanced:

    There is nothing made up about this. You can’t wish it away. I can’t believe some of you are even trying to spin this, because there is no positive spin here. It is what it is.


  37. - cant we get along - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 1:50 pm:

    My Take, I agree there are a lot of answers that need to be asked.
    This journalist and story as journalistically factious as it is, unfortunately leaves the bigger picture and questions out in the cold, and from his track record that’s probably by design.
    In the original article it makes only a slight reference to the actual petition case, but then goes on to redirect and “fan the flames of feigned outrage” but offers little to no insight into the discovery of that process and its findings. Tens of thousands of the signatures purposefully submitted by the libertarians were found to have been fraudulent, intentionally deceptive by the organizers of the petition process; the majority of the “super circulators” were discredited and knocked off because they were fraudulent circulators, IE.” Not the actual circulator’s”, plants if you will, and that action is 100% illegal!
    The organization intentionally submitted these petitions to the State of Illinois knowing them to be fraudulent, again 100% illegal. Proof was provided to the hearing officer and they subsequently ruled in that manner.
    Additionally the organization was funded primarily by the Quinn camp and democratic organizations. Why do you think they would do that?
    But most troubling however is why did Governor Quinn and Democrat Money fund this fraud effort? And to what extent did they know that organized fraud was taking place?


  38. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 1:59 pm:

    ===In the original article it makes only a slight reference to the actual petition case, but then goes on to redirect and “fan the flames of feigned outrage” but offers little to no insight into the discovery of that process and its findings. ===

    Did you skip over the people with guns visiting circulators?

    Hmmm.

    “Additionally the armed questioners were funded primarily by the law firm(?) and part of Rauner organizations(?) Why do you think they would do that?”

    Good question.


  39. - Formerly Known As... - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 2:15 pm:

    == Rodriguez displayed a holstered gun when he met her ==

    == a girl who claimed that over the last several weeks, she had been confronted by an armed private investigator multiple times, who had made her “frightened” each time. ==

    Showing up one time with your gun displayed might be a mistake. “Multiple times” is no mistake, particularly when trying to get someone to do something they do not want to do.

    The indisputable Republican connections to this and the initial response defending this behavior are scary.


  40. - cant we get along - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 2:20 pm:

    - Oswego Willy
    Oswego I get it, I truly do,your lively hood depends on a continued democrat governance.
    but doesn’t It bother you.. if for even a minute???
    come on:NRI- IDOT- put Illinois to work project- and on and on????
    at some point when does it end? I have grand kids and I don’t want to leave them with this mess!


  41. - Formerly Known As... - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 2:22 pm:

    == he strongly denounces them. Bruce doesn’t agree with any form of voter intimidation ==

    == We do not support the practice == If even one person felt intimidated, that’s unacceptable ==

    The GOP and Mr. Rauner agree this could be “intimidation”.

    So who sent the guy with the gun?


  42. - too obvious - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 2:28 pm:

    Rauner campaign and State GOP staff and money were used to employ armed men to intimidate citizens into recanting their signatures. This is a very serious criminal and civil rights matter.


  43. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 2:28 pm:

    ===democrat governance.===

    Dog whistle Dopiness.

    “come on: Cayman Islands, Payton Prep, Hiding tax returns - and on and on???? at some point when does it end? I don’t want kids to think honesty and integrity, ethics and morals don’t matter! ”

    Better


  44. - Newtrier Tommy - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 2:33 pm:

    - Under Further Review - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 10:45 am:

    This is an embarrassing episode. Rauner cannot claim to be ignorant of what Sean Morrison and his associates are capable of. All that he need do is to call Dan Patlak.

    this is what patlak will have to say, interesting huh?

    http://danpatlaktheliar.wordpress.com/


  45. - Anon - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 2:53 pm:

    If Rauner and his minions know about massive voter fraud occurring, why haven’t they reported it to authorities? Why has there been no massive prosecution, even during the Bush administration??

    Chairman Schneider: Better late than never on denouncing armed intimiadation.


  46. - Formerly Known As... - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 3:14 pm:

    == this is what patlak will have to say, interesting huh? ==

    What a way to prove the Chicago Tribune was right.

    == Sean Morrison’s sleazy ads

    Every election cycle, one candidate runs a campaign more brazenly misleading than all the rest.

    In endorsing Patlak for re-election, we wrote that Morrison evidently knows there is no reason to unseat Patlak: Morrison has built his campaign not on Board of Review issues, about which his knowledge is demonstrably limited, but instead on serial mudslinging that speaks poorly of his judgment — one of this job’s core necessities.

    Successive Morrison ads and mailers spouting his nonstop smears of Patlak further convince us that voters should keep Morrison far away from this low-profile but crucial office. ==


  47. - Skeptic - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 3:21 pm:

    come on:NRI- IDOT- put Illinois to work project- and on and on????

    “come on: Cayman Islands, Payton Prep, Hiding tax returns - and on and on???? at some point when does it end? I don’t want kids to think honesty and integrity, ethics and morals don’t matter! ”

    Yes, you have a choice. Vote Oswego Willy on November 4. This message was not approved by Oswego Willy.


  48. - Grandson of Man - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 3:30 pm:

    “Bruce has no knowledge of these alleged activities”

    More Sgt. Schultz, I see.

    I thought a hands-on man of Mr. Rauner’s acumen knows what’s going on in his campaign (and businesses), something like The Who song:

    “I can see for miles and miles and miles and miles and miles…”"

    We Cap Fax commenters may want to be less antagonistic toward one another. We should consider comforting each other, with the gubernatorial choices we have: Quinn with IDOT and NRI and Rauner with his tax loopholes, businesses and campaign tactics. Ugh.


  49. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 3:38 pm:

    - Skeptic -,

    I am glad to count you in. We kick off this weekend.

    To the Post,

    Tweet, Kerry Lester;

    @kerrylester: .@BruceRauner says he’s “in the middle of the process of getting to know every member of the (IL) General Assembly on a personal basis.”

    Tom Hagen.

    Intimidation, plausible deniability, getting to “know” legislators…

    …buffers.


  50. - dupage dan - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 3:44 pm:

    I certainly hope the feds get involved. Once US AG Holder sees that folks are being intimidated for wanting to be involved in an election by persons carrying weapons……..oops, never mind.

    A conspiratorial person might think that these incidents are too similar for closer inspection. Or maybe that the media is out to get PQ. Or maybe Rauner has bought them all off. How else to explain the utter silence from the 4th estate?

    (I wonder if calling all this snark will prevent a delete?)


  51. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 3:48 pm:

    DD, people have cited a possible violation of law.

    What’s your reference to Holder supposed to mean? Is that some Pavlovian Fox News thing? Is he protecting men with guns from violating election laws?


  52. - leprechaun - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 4:38 pm:

    If what( Cant we get along ) says is true and he seems to know his facts, then Rich will be using the story line IT AINT OVER TILL ITS OVER again. Hello Mr Appeal


  53. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 4:40 pm:

    ===he seems to know his facts===

    lol


  54. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 4:49 pm:

    === …says is true and he seems to know his facts,…===

    What were the facts? I missed them I guess…

    Talking points ain’t facts.


  55. - low level - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 4:55 pm:

    “Voter Integrity Program” Does that mean he will support poll watchers, etc in Naperville, Hinsdale, etc?

    It really means Voter Harassment Program. By the Republicon tea party machine.


  56. - dupage dan - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 4:59 pm:

    I obliquely referenced a video recorded incident that occurred during the campaign to elect Obama the first time. The tape shows some people carrying what I would call billy clubs at the entrance to a polling place in Pennsylvania. To many it appeared clear that voters could be quite intimidated by their presence. I don’t remember the exact way Holder dismissed any possibility that there was actual voter intimidation but I do know he declined to press the case.

    Pavlov wasn’t involved.


  57. - Leprechaun - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 5:39 pm:

    Willy- He said tens of thousands were tossed and found to be fraudulent. I just assumed that seemed to be a fact not a talking point. If its not a fact Bad Me, if it is then they should appeal. I assume that anybody can put in a foi and get it from the BOE


  58. - Leprechaun - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 5:40 pm:

    A copy of the Hearing I meant


  59. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 5:58 pm:

    ===Willy- He said tens of thousands were tossed and found to be fraudulent. I just assumed that seemed to be a fact not a talking point. If its not a fact Bad Me, if it is then they should appeal. I assume that anybody can put in a foi and get it from the BOE===

    Are the Libertarians on the ballot?

    See, what makes it a Dopey talking point, is the fact, that while bemoaning this fraud, the BOE made it clear, they are on the ballot, after a spirited challenge.

    Also, at the same time these challenges are being done by armed private eyes, seemingly intimidating, by Rauner subordinates, and today…

    The ILGOP and Rauner’s Crew back peddle because this type of intimidation is possibly felonious, and Rich is wondering out loud why the press isn’t “interested “, as those Rauner supporters here spinning away from the felonious acts, but focusing on signatures that, as a whole, allowed the Libs on the ballot.

    You got all that?

    Rauner and his Crew are false reformers.

    They want “voter integrity” while embracing everyone on the ballot; they want intimidation, while seeming welcoming.

    It’s Tom Hagen, while trying to seem honest to the process.

    It’s ignoring hypocrisy, at the cost of the honesty trotted out as the rationale.

    It’s ugly. It’s bad.

    It’s disappointing. It’s Rauner.


  60. - Grandson of Man - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 5:59 pm:

    “To many it appeared clear that voters could be quite intimidated by their presence.”

    What about the billboards in predominantly African-American/minority neighborhoods in 2012, telling them that voter fraud is a felony? These billboards were in Wisconsin and Ohio. That dog whistle screamed loudly.

    The biggest crock of bodily waste of course is all the voter ID laws, whose impacts potentially can negatively affect so many more than the Black Panthers standing in front of the Pennsylvania polling place in 2008–and that’s not to excuse their behavior, but to add context.


  61. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 6:35 pm:

    DD, I believe you’re referring to the Fox News Pavlovian obsession over the New Black Panther Party, the smallest of fringe hate groups.

    The incident you refer to was two dudes, one guy with a billy, who got rousted by a cop after a couple of hours. Apparently, they were trying to dissuade inner-city black voters to not cast ballots for McCain (tough job).

    It’s not fair to compare those two nuts’ voter intimidation tactics to the Rauner campaign and the Illinois GOP. They didn’t have lawyers, guns or money.


  62. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Aug 27, 14 @ 6:48 pm:

    –I think the idea is that without something like voter id’s, you wouldn’t have any clue as to who is actually voting, thus making any discovery of the issue nearly impossible.–

    You have to sign to get a ballot. You have no idea what the signature looks like. You commit your felony, in writing, in front of witnesses (voting judges) who can immediately match the sig with voter registration records.

    One felony, one more vote. You think that’s how it works? It’s lunacy.

    Google “GOP officials admit voter suppression.”


  63. - dupage dan - Thursday, Aug 28, 14 @ 9:17 am:

    Small fringe hate groups are held up as dangerous enemies of civilization by both sides of the spectrum, word. Apparently the entire network of news media - print, radio, tv, online, doesn’t think this is a big issue. Not even the dog. Why do you suppose that is?


  64. - wordslinger - Thursday, Aug 28, 14 @ 9:36 am:

    DD, I’m quite capable of making up my own mind as to what’s a “big deal.” If you need guidance and validation from the working press, that’s your problem.


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