Wind NIMBYs lose a big one
Thursday, Jun 20, 2019 - Posted by Rich Miller
* From April 4th…
* Current state law allows counties to establish standards for wind farms and windmills. But some townships in Douglas County have decided to impose their own rules and a company that wants to spend $340 million on a 200-megawatt wind farm is suing.
Illinois has 102 counties, so that patchwork of regulations is bad enough. But imagine the potential problems if 1,432 townships step in with their own rules.
Hard pass.
So, a bill was introduced in February and amended last month to make it clear that counties - and only counties - have the authority to regulate these things.
The bill passed both chambers and was signed into law by the governor.
* Yesterday…
Construction crews are already heading to Douglas County, where board members voted Wednesday in favor of giving EDP Renewables a permit to build a 48-turbine wind-farm complex.
Within hours of the long-awaited vote, EDP officials said the work to upgrade public roads to handle the construction activity is expected to begin within the next couple of weeks.
“I think the board in general is just relieved that we have come to this point, and I honestly think that all of us feel like our vote was the right vote,” board Chairman Don Munson said soon after Wednesday’s 5-1-1 vote, which brought a relatively quiet end to a long and at-times-loud process. […]
Wednesday’s vote had been postponed by about two weeks after a required public hearing on the issue drew a large crowd and a lot of public comments — both for and against the project.
* From the Stop the Douglas County Wind Farm’s Facebook page…
The sellout of Douglas County began this morning when the county board voted 5-1 (one abstention) to approve the permit application of Energias de Portugal to construct 48 nearly 600’ towers in two townships, with more to come-likely stretching across the county. Obviously only Bibby Appleby cares anything about the health and property values of the residents of this county. Thank you, Bibby McKay Appleby!
Now it’s time to take serious action against the board, and we need your help. There is a GoFundMe account (see this page for details), or you can send donations to KMAC, PO Box 47, Camargo, IL, 61919.
It ain’t over yet, kids.
The GoFundMe effort has raised just $465 in the past month.
* Related…
* Study: Wind farms don’t appear to impact a county’s aggregate rural home values
* ADDED: No, President Trump, wind turbines don’t cause cancer: Still, the President’s casual offhand remark that perhaps the noise from a wind turbine could cause cancer appeared to resonate in Newman Township, an old coal town where more than 90 percent of voters supported the Republican in 2016. A surprising number of local residents repeated the rumors that perhaps the arrival of new wind turbines could somehow lead to a spike in cancer.
- PJ - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:12 am:
Joke’s on them: Bibby Appleby is obviously not a real person
- Downstate - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:17 am:
Lakeland College has recently removed all of their windmills due to the high maintenance cost. The LLC solar projects and geo-thermal projects have each been winners.
A former Illinois Ag director’s nephew was forced to flee his home due to the devastating impact of sound waves emitted from nearby windmills. The home was sold a few times, at dramatically reduced values until it was finally abandoned by the final owner.
I’m not sure these communities realize the full impact of these windmill farms.
- Da Big Bad Wolf - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:17 am:
Bibby Appleby, is that a restaurant?
We at Bibby Appleby only use fresh ingredients, because Bibby Appleby cares.
- OutOfState - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:21 am:
Downstate, source? I couldn’t find any stories about the sound waves online after a brief search.
- Candy Dogood - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:21 am:
Good for you, Douglas County.
===Lakeland College has recently removed all of their windmills due to the high maintenance cost. ===
How old were they? I frequently get a new automobile because of high maintenance costs, that doesn’t mean the problem is automobiles.
- Jibba - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:23 am:
I am totally for wind farms, but locals need to be protected. Guarantee the predevelopment sales price for landowners who must move due to impacts after startup, within a set distance (half mile?). But not for future buyers. Puts the risk on the profit maker.
- Leatherneck - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:23 am:
- PJ - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:12 am:
Joke’s on them: Bibby Appleby is obviously not a real person
—————–
Is Bibby Johnny Appleseed’s next-door neighbor?
- SWIL Voter - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:26 am:
The Lakeland Wind Turbines suffered extensive damage after a lightning strike and several brownouts
- SWIL Voter - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:28 am:
Jibba, if you support wind farms, why do you want to impose restrictions on them that wouldn’t apply to most other types of development?
- Colin O'Scopy - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:28 am:
If an entity wanted to construct a hospital for orphans with cancer, someone, somewhere would oppose it. Sheesh.
I am not saying the wind farms are synonymous, but there will always be opposition to progress. Even in this age of technology, we are surrounded by Luddites.
- anon - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:33 am:
As to the study: Emphasis on “aggregate” home values. It completely zeroes out a home’s value if you are next to one.
- Jibba - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:34 am:
SWIL…I would impose the burden of proof (and consequences) on applicants for most things. Ever been in a permit process? Typically, the winner is the rich permittee whohires high powered talent, which the board agrees with because the opponents can’t fight back. One side wins and the other loses. I say make them prove their assertions and pay if they are wrong.
- Ducky LaMoore - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:38 am:
I think we’re all indebted to Bibby Appleby… for clearly stating what needed to be said. I am particularly glad that these lovely children are here today to here that speech. Not only was it authentic frontier gibberish, it expressed a courage little seen in this day and age.
- SWIL Voter - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:43 am:
Jibba, while I’m certainly not an expert in permitting, I have been involved in it on several occasions, which is why the requirement to guarantee predevelopment property values was strange to me. I’ve not seen that imposed on any other form of development I’m familiar with.
- Jibba - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:44 am:
Why do we have to be either pro or anti development? Protecting those impacted might not cost a lot (let an engineer express his “best professional opinion” on that), but why should that burden rest with neighbors? That is a cost of doing business that should go 8nto the bottom line of the project.
- SpfdNewb - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:45 am:
So I can create a facebook page for free with a GoFundMe link and profit on misdirected rage? All the while using a false identity? I’m obviously in the wrong business.
- Anon221 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:48 am:
The term NIMBY is insulting, as are the comments on Mrs. Appleby’s name. I doubt many if you have sat through hours of testimony from both proponents and opponents of Wind Enegry Conversion Systems (WECS). I also doubt that many have ever taken the time to think about safety and health issues surrounding these systems, and I’m not talking about Trumpster talk of cancer. WECS that are the next generation will be nearly or more than 600 feet tall. 1.1 times that as a setback from a property line or a residence doesn’t even meet the worker safety requirements as established by the manufacturers.
So, continue with name calling. Some day, if wiser heads don’t prevail and it continues to be all about the money, some one is going to get hurt through a turbine incident- field fire out of control, ice throw, storm damage to blades, tower failure resulting in tip over. ALL of these events have happened with shorter towers. Add more and larger towers to the mix and keep the same level of ordinance restrictions designed for far smalller units, and there will be the increased possibility of a “NIMBY” getting hurt or killed.
- NeverPoliticallyCorrect - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:49 am:
Makes sense to not have over a thousand different approvals for one state. But long term wind and solar are not the answer, unable to provide stable baseload, unfortunately the green crowd doesn’t understand or care about this. We will face a much less reliable and more expensive electric system in the future because of this.
- Rich Miller - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:51 am:
===The term NIMBY is insulting===
Tough.
===as are the comments on Mrs. Appleby’s name===
Agreed.
- JT11505 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:52 am:
So, Bibby is apparently a real person. She is the Tourist Center Director at Atwood Economic Development.
Kinda weird that someone who works in economic development would be against economic development.
- Jibba - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:58 am:
SWIL…
You’re right, it is not typically done because permits are usually win or lose. Let’s try something new, which might greatly facilitate the permit process and end up saving money.
- Three Dimensional Checkers - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 10:59 am:
I’m glad the WNIMBYs lost. “Ice throws” or towers tipping over sounds like worry about lightning strikes or other very low probability events.
- Anon221 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:00 am:
Then, thank you for insult. I am facing the prospect of having 4 of these with a half mile of my home, and I have done the research and listened to experts in many fields. The most dangerous problem with siting in our county is the interference with the National Weather Service Radar. I lived through the 1968 outbreak, and if our county gets covered with WECS, then more than my individual safety is at risk. You would think December 1, 2019 would have made an impact on perceptions surrounding WECS interference on Doppler radar. It certainly had an impact on the large machine shed within Radford Run WECS that was destroyed by the tornado Lincoln couldn’t see because of the WECS interference.
Siting is important for WECS. They shouldn’t be in some “backyards”.
- SWIL Voter - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:02 am:
The Douglas County setback requirement is, I believe 1,000 feet, 1.67 times the height of a 600 ft tower, 11% above and beyond industry standard setbacks
- Colin O'Scopy - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:03 am:
In re: NIMBY, you notice there is never a NIYBY (not in YOUR back yard)?
- Ducky LaMoore - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:16 am:
@Anon221
I understand what you are saying about Doppler. In my neck of the woods, there are 200 or so windmills. We have not had issues with weather tracking. I don’t know if those windmills interfere with the Doppler or not, or if it doesn’t matter as much with satellite and conventional radar technology in use. But if a large machine shed can interfere with the Doppler too, are we supposed to not have large machine sheds either? Kind of seems like an antiquated argument to me.
- SpfdNewb - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:17 am:
I will apologize for assuming that Bibby Appleby is not a real person. To me, her name reads like something created just for the internet.
- Urban Oasis - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:21 am:
Is this yet another quality of life factor driving folks in rural areas to move to the cities and suburbs?
- Six Degrees of Separation - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:24 am:
A buyout or guaranteed property value guarantee is not unusual as a result of permitting processes involving projects that may pose a public nuisance to residents. I was not able to find it online, but I think something is in place in Adams County re: wind farms. Also, buyouts or property value guarantees are in place at some of the frac sand mines in La Salle County.
Agreed that township level regulation is too uncertain and patchwork to rely on in regulating wind farms, but 102 counties don’t exactly have a uniform policy either. With current trends and this case in particular, the IL Commerce Commission may someday have overriding statewide regulation.
- Six Degrees of Separation - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:26 am:
===Is this yet another quality of life factor driving folks in rural areas to move to the cities and suburbs?===
For the farmers collecting royalties on wind turbines on their property, probably not.
- Huh? - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:28 am:
If you don’t like NIMBY, how about CAVE - Citizens against virtually everything. Or my favorite- BANANA - Build absolutely nothing anywhere near anything.
- Urban Oasis - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:30 am:
==For the farmers collecting royalties on wind turbines on their property, probably not.==
Agreed, but what about the big corporate farmers and other absentee landowners that don’t live in the impacted community?
- Anon221 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:35 am:
SWIL Voter- That’s Industry standards, NOT manufacturer standards. Do some Googling of Vesta turbine safety standards for workers on site at turbines, then tell me 1000 feet is “safe”.
- Ducky LaMoore - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:35 am:
@Urban Oasis
If wind farms are your last straw for leaving a rural community, you were going to leave anyway. They really don’t have any substantial impact on one’s well-being.
- Donnie Elgin - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:36 am:
“For the farmers collecting royalties on wind turbines on their property, probably not”
The royalties are one calculus designed to cover the loss of production- however the turbines all have huge foundations and generally a transformer box resulting in off balance sheet ” farmability costs” like operating farm equipment around turbines, aerial spraying and drainage issues.
- Anon221 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:37 am:
Huh?- glad you like labeling someone you have never met. That really helps the discussion.
- Rich Miller - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:38 am:
===Is this yet another quality of life factor driving folks in rural areas to move to the cities===
Doubtful. The noise in big cities makes this look tame.
People who leave rural areas usually do so for jobs or opportunities to be themselves elsewhere.
- Rich Miller - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:39 am:
=== the IL Commerce Commission may someday have overriding statewide regulation.===
Agreed.
- SWIL Voter - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:43 am:
Anon, my understanding is those standards are over a decade old and have long since been updated
- Huh? - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:46 am:
221 - just providing an alternative to NIMBY.
I know people who live around wind farms and love them. I have gone out and stood under turning wind generator to hear the swish of the blades as they pass. I couldn’t hear anything until I was under the blades.
- Chicago Bars - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:50 am:
But can townships still exercise zoning power over unincorporated areas to limit where they are placed? Like with radio & cell towers IIRC?
Read some wind turbine contracts presented to farming relatives about 5 years ago. Royalty payment looked great until he did all the “farmability” costs mentioned above. Then math got a lot worse for them. The older farmers nearby who don’t do spreadsheets or acre by acre yield analysis signed up pretty quick though. It’s a decent income stream as they, very gradually, retire and wait to see if any family will take over the operation.
- SWIL Voter - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 11:52 am:
Huh?, that’s has also been my experience living near them and standing under them. The sound was similar to that of a plane flying high overhead, and dramatically quieter than a semi driving by the house
- Anon221 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 12:15 pm:
SWIL Voter- Please Cote your references. Here are mine- https://www.google.com/amp/s/patch.com/massachusetts/falmouth/amp/27333978/vestas-wind-turbine-blade-throw-safety-zone-1640-feet
- SWIL Voter - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 12:46 pm:
Anon, so my documentation is that what you posted is from a 2007 document, I believe, and I’m unable to find anything more recent than that from them and they’ve begun claiming they’re no longer making such recommendations
- VerySmallRocks - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 12:57 pm:
When I see these NIMBY’s fight “industrial” farms in their communities with their air land and water pollution, their noisy, polluting machines clogging up roads and the unsightliness of silos and other tall structures, then I might believe them. Until then, they just hate change at best, or, more likely, reactionary activists of AstroTurf climate denier groups.
- Anon221 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 1:06 pm:
SWIL Voter- who is “they”? The developers who submit the special use applications and redact that information citing its confidential business information, or the manufacturers?
- Bibby Appleby - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 1:07 pm:
Hello everyone. This is Bibby Appleby–The real Bibby Appleby. Some of your posts have given me a chuckle and I appreciate your views. I just want to let you know that I believe history will prove my stance to be the correct stance but–well–we’ll just have to wait and see, won’t we?
- Going nuclear - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 1:07 pm:
= Makes sense to not have over a thousand different approvals for one state. But long term wind and solar are not the answer, unable to provide stable baseload, unfortunately the green crowd doesn’t understand or care about this. We will face a much less reliable and more expensive electric system in the future because of this. =
Baseload power that runs pretty much all the time is becoming outmoded under our rapidly changing energy landscape. Power companies and utilities are looking to integrate more renewable energy resources into the nation’s power grid because they are less expensive to operate, more flexible (i.e., ramp up and down quickly) and help achieve carbon reduction targets. And innovations like demand management, regional transmission lines, batteries and pumped hydro will provide the coverage that baseload power previously generated.
- Chad Hays - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 1:35 pm:
I once had a constituent provide this commentary on the wind farm controversy . . . . .
“Have you received the first phone call from any party receiving a check from this dynamic? That is the magic potion . . . .a check to cash.”
- Da Big Bad Wolf - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 1:40 pm:
Hi Bibby. Thanks for checking in. And being a good sport.
- #Ditch Miller - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 2:24 pm:
Rich Miller is laughable. His writing is squarely in line with thoughts and musings of the wind factory top echelon. Get out of your office Rich, get out in the country away from the asphalt and concrete. Many of the commenting is surely also coming from the followers of this particular wind company, they have to do something to keep their checks coming in, and there is plenty of subsidy money to throw around. I doubt Rich has followed this story except for what he is fed by EDP.
- Da Big Bad Wolf - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 2:28 pm:
Anyone here get a check from EDP Renewables? I sure didn’t.
- Rich Miller - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 2:31 pm:
Wolf, same. I’ll check the mailbox though.
This is another thing that bugs the heck outta me about NIMBYs and anti-vaxers. If you don’t agree with them, you’re obviously in on some grand conspiracy.
- northerwatersports - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 2:57 pm:
–”If you don’t like NIMBY, how about CAVE - Citizens against virtually everything. Or my favorite- BANANA - Build absolutely nothing anywhere near anything.”–
Belly laugh of the day!! Must be something in the water nearby….
- Anon221 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 3:36 pm:
I’m not aware that I ever conjured up some”great conspiracy “, Rich. So if I’m still a “NIMBY”, then that’s a wall you built.
Reasonable discussions need to be had. Research needs to be done and closely scrutinized. People should be listened to instead of dismissed. What may seem like an answer/solution to our energy needs, may turn out to be a problem or several problems lying in wait down the road. Maybe There are other less divisive ways to generate these MW and GW.
- JB13 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 3:40 pm:
I am a big supporter of wind farms, and think we need more.
I have, however, always found it scientifically odd how much better wind resources consistently are in the middle of Bupkis, Illinois, where “nobody” lives, than, say, in Lake Michigan, off the North Shore.
It’s all very, very strange.
- Fixer - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 3:58 pm:
Anon, you seem to have a personal, vested interest in this. Are one of these going up near you against your wishes?
- Urbanana - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 4:17 pm:
== I have, however, always found it scientifically odd how much better wind resources consistently are in the middle of Bupkis, Illinois, where “nobody” lives, than, say, in Lake Michigan, off the North Shore. ==
Offshore wind turbines are far more expensive - both in terms of initial capital expenditure and ongoing maintenance costs - than onshore turbines. They also undergo more wear and tear due to the wet environment (of course, in a lake is better than on the ocean).
- Anon221 - Thursday, Jun 20, 19 @ 5:01 pm:
To ADDED- I’ll play along.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.smh.com.au/environment/sustainability/can-wind-turbines-disturb-sleep-research-finds-pulsing-audible-in-homes-up-to-3-5km-away-20190617-p51yik.html