Unclear on the concept
Wednesday, Nov 18, 2020 - Posted by Rich Miller
* Rep. Joe Sosnowski (R-Rockford)…
There is no scientific data that supports lower occupancy limits or for keeping restaurants closed to indoor dining.
Joe, the more people who are in an enclosed space, the more likely it is that somebody will catch a virus - any virus, not just COVID-19. It’s not just science, it’s simple common sense, man.
Also…
On the same day local enforcement began of COVID-19 mitigations aimed at bars and restaurants, the Sangamon County Department of Public Health released contact tracing data Friday showing where people who tested positive for COVID-19 and their close contacts had been the two weeks prior to the positive test.
Restaurants and bars top the list
* This WLDS story from yesterday afternoon did not age well..
A Highland, Illinois attorney who has been giving Governor J.B. Pritzker grief with multiple lawsuits around the state appeared in Jacksonville last night at Bogart’s Banquet Hall to explain to bar & restaurant owners their rights according to their businesses and the state’s ability or inability to close them under current executive orders. There were approximately 70 people in attendance from Morgan, Cass, Greene, Sangamon, and Macon counties – many of whom were bar & restaurant owners. […]
DeVore said near the end of the presentation that bars and restaurant owners should stay open whether ticketed or not and continue moving forward. He implored businesses to not give into what he called fear tactics and shoddy statistics surrounding COVID-19 being distributed by the media and state government, and to take their fights to the courts if they have to.
1) If “giving Governor J.B. Pritzker grief” equals “losing a bunch of cases, then that lede is spot on;
2) Following DeVore’s sage advice to remain open resulted in the ordered closure of several of his restaurant clients yesterday…
A Sangamon County judge Tuesday granted the Sangamon County Department of Public Health a temporary restraining order against four Springfield restaurants operating without food permits.
Circuit Judge Raylene Grischow’s ruling goes against D&J Café , also known as DJ’s Café, 915 W. Laurel St.; Charlie Parker’s, 700 W. North St.; Fox Run Restaurant & Lounge, 1130 Legacy Pointe Drive and Sweet Basil Café , 4241 Conestoga Drive. All four restaurants had their food permits suspended by Public Health Sunday. […]
All five were serving indoor diners Sunday in defiance of the mitigations prohibiting indoor dining that went into effect Friday.
Three of the restaurants, D&J Café, Fox Run and Sweet Basil, had been fined also last week.
Wilhite confirmed that the owners of the suspended restaurants have requested hearings with the board of health, though their doors will remain shut in the meantime.
Meanwhile, the Illinois Supreme Court transferred all of the in-person dining cases to Judge Grischow’s court.
- Flyin' Elvis'-Utah Chapter - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:17 am:
Suckers, DeVore will be requesting his fee, in full, probably by the end of the week.
- DownSouth - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:18 am:
Just in case anyone is interested in attending Mr. DeVore and his “brothers” are hosting a benefit Deer Season Breakfast fundraiser in Donnellson Friday, Saturday and Sunday - Dine in of course!
I have not yet been able to ascertain exactly what charity will be receiving the funds raised at this event though.
- JS Mill - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:23 am:
=I have not yet been able to ascertain exactly what charity will be receiving the funds raised at this event though.=
Tom DeVore probably. The guy loses more battles than France.
- thisjustinagain - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:27 am:
DeVore’s legal advice now ignores a binding Appellate Court precedent saying the exact opposite. Hello, ARDC, are you paying attention to this??
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:31 am:
An attorney contining to to advise people to break the law. At what point is Devore’s conduct so unethical that it becomes a basis for the revocation (or at least suspension) of his law license?
- Yellow Vest Club - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:31 am:
Tom DeVore has a lot of courage to stand up for basic civil rights. Can’t honest folks just make a living?
- Norseman - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:32 am:
Here we have an ambulance chaser who not only fails to help his clients, he creates more problems for them. Sounds like the bar should look into his actions. Perhaps, require DeVore to wear a warning sign noting his losing record.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:34 am:
==Tom DeVore has a lot of courage==
You have an odd definition of courage. He’s despicable.
==honest folks==
That’s not the term I would use for people breaking the law.
- Lt Guv - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:34 am:
JS Mill for the win.
- Buzz McCallister - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:35 am:
Tom Devore is representing approx. 50% of the Illinois population that does not think the governor has the right to shut down businesses for a virus. At some point people need to take a stand.
- Stu - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:36 am:
===Just in case anyone is interested in attending Mr. DeVore and his “brothers” are hosting a benefit Deer Season Breakfast fundraiser in Donnellson Friday, Saturday and Sunday - Dine in of course!===
I’d pay to see the State Police step in and shut it down (is that a bounty?)
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:36 am:
==At some point people need to take a stand.==
And the Courts have told those people time and time again to go fly a kite.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:39 am:
==for a virus==
And, as per usual with the covidiots, you describe it as just a virus. Go tell that to the 200+ thousand people that have died. It’s all about you isn’t it?
- Sox Fan - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:39 am:
==Tom Devore is representing approx. 50% of the Illinois population that does not think the governor has the right to shut down businesses==
Where does that 50% number come from?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:40 am:
=== Tom Devore is representing approx. 50% of the Illinois population that does not think the governor has the right to shut down businesses for a virus. At some point people need to take a stand.===
First, show your 50%
LOL, by losing every court case… y’all are easy marks… seeing why grifting is super easy for DeVore.
=== Tom DeVore has a lot of courage…===
This is like saying the Washington Generals have a lot of courage getting beat night after night… while getting paychecks to lose.
It’s quite embarrassing to read this.
- Flyin' Elvis'-Utah Chapter - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:40 am:
“representing approx. 50% of the Illinois”
Bub, DeVore is representing those gullible enough not to understand the powers the Executive office has.
Unless you’re willing to waste money on his “representation”, he wouldn’t look at you twice.
- Fixer - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:40 am:
People need to take a stand against folks like DeVore, who are recklessly and wantonly are endangering folks with their disregard of the law. You may not like the law, but frankly, your feelings on this do not matter a single bit. The courts have ruled multiple times Pritzker is within his rights to issue these restrictions and ignoring them isn’t going to help anyone at this point. Grow up.
- cermak_rd - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:41 am:
Is it really 50% though? I mean maybe in the summer when our rates were lower but man it’s ugly out there now. Have you seen the IL rates? You’d have to be a complete daredevil to eat in a restaurant with other people that are outside your bubble right now.
- essentially working - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:42 am:
“Courts have told those people time and time again to go fly a kite.” - Just so we are all clear, your kite flying must be done alone, while wearing a mask, in a minimum wind of 20 mph sustained, no closer than 150′ from the nearest inhabited structure. Sharing of kites is strictly prohibited. /s
- Fixer - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:43 am:
Buzz, 95% of all made up statistics are made up.
- Jibba - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:44 am:
===Tom Devore is representing approx. 50% of the Illinois population that does not think===
You could stopped right there, but I would add that most folks know nothing about whether it is legal or not. You can be as wrong as you want to be, until you take an action.
- Tommydanger - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:46 am:
Well if the restaurateurs wish to cut off their nose to spite their face, perhaps it will lessen their chance of contracting the virus.
- RNUG - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:48 am:
FWIW … This morning Fox Run has staff working, deep cleaning the entire place, and getting ready for a long, if not permanent, shutdown.
- Just Wondering - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:53 am:
And also FWIW–Any State Employees that have been back in the office for some time will still be expected to come to work in State Buildings, even if able to work remotely, when we start Tier 3 Friday. Even though I’m sure Foxes once Ran at the sites of modern-day state buildings perhaps 200 or so years ago.
- Morty - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:54 am:
If Charlie Brown were a laywer, he’d be Ton DeVore
- cermak_rd - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 10:58 am:
Man DeVore is like a less-reflective Hamilton Burger
- Skeptic - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:00 am:
“Tom Devore is representing approx. 50% of the Illinois population” Citation please. You know who represents far more than 50% of the State? Governor Pritzker. And who else? 144 or the 209 State Senators and Representatives. Nice try though.
- Flyin' Elvis'-Utah Chapter - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:02 am:
Assuming DeVore had other non-covid related clients, what are they thinking right about now?
- Need common sense - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:04 am:
Need more of a local guidance. The same list has health clubs as (2) yet we have to make reservations and wear masks the ENTIRE TIME we are exercising? Same with outdoor sports?? Who’s gonna wear a mask golfing and when running. My goodness.
- truthteller - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:08 am:
if those people/establishments want to pay the healthcare bills of those who catch COVID, I say, sure go for it. Otherwise quit taking actions that have real impact on others
- Failing New York Times - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:08 am:
==There is no scientific data that supports lower occupancy limits or for keeping restaurants closed to indoor dining.==
These people should be sanctioned for willfully misleading the public. Absolutely deplorable behavior for a person that holds public office.
- Chatham Resident - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:09 am:
I say leave the restaurants closed. Springfield and many other cities have way too many restaurants for a city that size. Too many options equals too few pieces of the pie.
- Jocko - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:22 am:
==the governor (doesn’t have) the right to shut down businesses for a virus.==
What part of ‘Disaster Proclamation’ don’t you understand?
- don the legend - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:25 am:
==Springfield and many other cities have way too many restaurants for a city that size==
I’m so glad we have you to decide there are too many restaurants.
. What is your number of restaurants that we should have? Number of hair salons, tax accountants, lawyers, doctors, clothing stores?
- The Dude - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:29 am:
Might want to look at the massive standford study released a little over a week ago.
Clear science using quantifiable data. The people literally are the definition of ignorant.
- Cottonwood - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:31 am:
* 144 or the 209 State Senators and Representatives. Nice try though.*
The ones that have completed abdicated their responsibilities throughout this mess? Nice try though.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:34 am:
=== The ones that have completed abdicated their responsibilities throughout this mess?===
Explain in detail what the GA should be doing?
They are choosing, as is their choice, to leave this to the governor.
I’m not saying it’s a first, good, or best choice, but it’s their choice
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:35 am:
“The guy loses more battles than France.”
Debore is trying out for a spot on the Washington Generals basketball team.
- Club J - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:47 am:
Just drove by DJ Cafe and they are closed.
I guess in DeVore’s world that’s WINNING.
- Pot calling kettle - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:49 am:
==Might want to look at the massive Stanford study released a little over a week ago.==
For those who want to read the study: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2923-3
Top locations for spreading the virus:
#1: full-service restaurants
#2: fitness centers
#3: cafes & snack bars
#4: hotels & motels
#5: limited service restaurants
#6: religious organizations
- Cottonwood - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:49 am:
If they approve of pritzkers mitigations, they should be willing to put a green light on it.
- Buzz McCallister - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:51 am:
==the governor (doesn’t have) the right to shut down businesses for a virus.
What part of ‘Disaster Proclamation’ don’t you understand?==
I understand the laws. Jim Crowe Segregation was also a law. Doesn’t make it right. Our courts have failed to uphold the constitution and are making this up as they go. When the legal system grossly oversteps there boundaries, don’t be surprised when people stop giving them blind obedience.
- Monadnock Pigeon - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:55 am:
==And also FWIW–Any State Employees that have been back in the office for some time will still be expected to come to work in State Buildings, even if able to work remotely, when we start Tier 3 Friday. ==
What is the source of this information?
- Truthteller - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 11:55 am:
Pay my medical bills and have you restaurant open, let’s see owners scream bloody murder,
- Benjamin - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:00 pm:
==Tom DeVore probably. The guy loses more battles than France.==
Hey now, why insult France by comparing it to Tom DeVore?
- Need common sense - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:01 pm:
When you post studies that are nationwide and not local, you’re distorting the places of POSSIBLE contact. I’m no virus naysayer nor am I saying we shouldn’t have masks and restrictions. What I am saying is personal responsibility for the virus is the number one defense and has always been explained that way. When we as humans ignore it, unfortunately, it doesn’t fall into category of civil unrest which require curfews etc.
- JS Mill - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:02 pm:
= Our courts have failed to uphold the constitution and are making this up as they go. When the legal system grossly oversteps there boundaries, don’t be surprised when people stop giving them blind obedience.=
Please, for the love of pete, cite some evidence. Just because you don’t like the decision does not mean it isn’t correct. Especially when you have state and Federal courts saying the same thing.
- Man Named Sue - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:04 pm:
- Truthteller -
It’s your body, your life. If you choose not to eat in a restaurant more power to you.
- Norseman - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:04 pm:
=== I understand the laws. ===
The courts don’t understand, but you do. LOL
Maybe DeVore could use an assistant.
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:07 pm:
=When you post studies that are nationwide and not local, you’re distorting the places of POSSIBLE contact.=
So these places:
Top locations for spreading the virus:
#1: full-service restaurants
#2: fitness centers
#3: cafes & snack bars
#4: hotels & motels
#5: limited service restaurants
#6: religious organizations
Function differently based on location? In that light your handle makes perfect sense.
It is precisely the nation nature of the tracking data that gives it greater validity.
- North Park - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:09 pm:
==Our courts have failed to uphold the constitution==
That’s the system we have, though, and without it we devolve into mob rule. Maybe that’s what you want, though, as long as its your mob?
- More common sense - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:10 pm:
Yes. Because in our local contact tracing release fitness centers were basically LAST, not second.
- DownSouth - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:12 pm:
=== I’d pay to see the State Police step in and shut it down (is that a bounty?)===
Given that De Vore’s “Deer Hunter Breakfast” is at Langham Outdoors, LTD maybe some CPO’s instead?
Additionally the location appears to be in Bond County, and there is this little nugget per Bond County HD web page
“Temporary food serving activities must have a permit if the event lasts 3 – 14 days. The Application for a Temporary Permit is due at least 3 days prior to the event, and the $30.00 permit fee must be paid at the time the application is submitted. If the Application for a Temporary Permit is submitted late, the permit fee is $50.00.”
Wonder if that permit was obtained? Or if that’s a violation of his rights as well…
- Norseman - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:12 pm:
=== It’s your body, your life. ===
If this was truly about “your body, your life,” I would agree with you. This is about what you do affecting my life and my body. That’s why government action is necessary.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:13 pm:
= ==Our courts have failed to uphold the constitution===
Losing cases in court doesn’t mean the constitution isn’t working.
Geez, Louise.
- WestBurbs - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:14 pm:
Buzz - am I understanding you correctly — you think a ban on indoor dining is comparable to Jim Crow laws? If so, that is not only ignorant but also offensive. What’s next - mask mandates as bad as slavery? And you guys wonder why nobody takes you seriously.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:16 pm:
=== When the legal system grossly oversteps there boundaries, don’t be surprised when people stop giving them blind obedience.===
You do realize if they ruled in your favor… I’d be judicial activism… right?
=== It’s your body, your life. ===
The virus wants the host to spread it, “It’s your body, your life.” is you helping the virus… right?
Whew.
- State Employee - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:19 pm:
==What is the source of this information?==
I’m one of them and so far, unless I later hear otherwise, it’s business as usual in my state agency office (Secretary of State, but non-drivers facility).
- BTO2 - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:24 pm:
Maskless customer at Chatham Subway was just told, no mask, no service. Customer left and came back with mask on.
First time at any restaurant I’ve seen this. Maybe some in Sangamon County are starting to get it.
- Ghost of George Sutherland - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:27 pm:
Judicial activism can be a misguided term when judges uphold the text of the constitution .
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:29 pm:
=== Judicial activism can be a misguided term when judges uphold the text of the constitution===
… as these cases DeVore keeps losing seems to say.
The judges are following the law. What more do you want?
- Ghost of George Sutherland - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:33 pm:
The law might not be consistent with the ever expanding definition of the 14th Amendment. Who knew the 14th Amendment dealt with gay marriage until recently? Who knows what other newly discovered rights an activist U.S. Supreme Court can come up with. The possibilities are endless. I’m not saying it is right.
- JoanP - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:35 pm:
=DeVore’s legal advice now ignores a binding Appellate Court precedent saying the exact opposite. Hello, ARDC, are you paying attention to this?? =
Why would they?
“binding precedent” means that *other courts* must follow it unless and until overruled by a higher court.
It does *not* mean that attorneys cannot continue to raise the issue if they think the prior case was wrongly decided.
And a good thing, too. Imagine if the NAACP had sighed and said, well, Plessy v. Ferguson is binding precedent so we better not argue that “separate but equal” is unconstitutional.
When I was practicing law we *constantly* raised issues that had theoretically been decided. And won sometimes, too.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:37 pm:
=== the ever expanding definition of the 14th Amendment.===
We’re past that, Clarence Darrow, DeVore’s list of losses say so.
=== Who knew the 14th Amendment dealt with gay marriage until recently? Who knows what other newly discovered rights an activist U.S. Supreme Court can come up with. The possibilities are endless. I’m not saying it is right.===
Whew, glad you were able throw in bigotry and hatred as your concern fit the 14th amendment. No ambiguity. Thanks.
- Ghost of George Sutherland - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:42 pm:
Who knew the U.S. Supreme Court had so many bigots on it?
https://tinyurl.com/y4vnhujs
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:44 pm:
=== Who knew the U.S. Supreme Court had so many bigots on it?===
You said it, I didn’t.
People showing who they are was the Trumpkin way, abd the Trumpkin Legacy.
- More common sense - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:47 pm:
Also. I’m just gonna throw this out there. When we go to mitigate areas/the entire state, if the situation is as dire as is presented, why the why are we waiting 3 days to implement? It’s a mixed message: this is serious, but really, it can wait 3 days, cause it’s not THAT serious? Come on Illinois. Do better.
- Friends of IPI - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:58 pm:
The name calling from OW is so tendentious.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:59 pm:
==Our courts have failed to uphold the constitution and are making this up as they go.==
That’s the usual whiney response when someone disagrees with a ruling.
==When the legal system grossly oversteps there boundaries, don’t be surprised when people stop giving them blind obedience.==
So you’re basically saying throw out our entire system of government because you believe you should be able to go sit down in Chili’s.
You’re ridiculous.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 1:08 pm:
===tendentious===
That’s a pretty solid vocabulary word.
“expressing or intending to promote a particular cause or point of view, especially a controversial one.”
Is it controversial to see judicial activism as something, depending on your seat, apparently good AND bad… instead of looking at the constitution as so perfect, so perfect it had 10 amendments at jump street…
Seems like… there’s 20+ ways …the constitution needed… amending.
- Heather From Orland Park - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 1:19 pm:
-OW-
You are the one that assumed someone’s motive on the 14th Amendment no one else did.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 1:21 pm:
- Heather From Orland Park -
=== - Ghost of George Sutherland - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:33 pm
The law might not be consistent with the ever expanding definition of the 14th Amendment. Who knew the 14th Amendment dealt with gay marriage until recently? Who knows what other newly discovered rights an activist U.S. Supreme Court can come up with. The possibilities are endless. I’m not saying it is right.===
Explain this. Thanks.
- Skeptic - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 1:33 pm:
“The ones that have completed abdicated their responsibilities throughout this mess?” Whether you agree with what they’re doing or not, my statement about how many Illinoisians they represent is still 100% correct. Nice try though.
- Heather From Orland Park - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 1:43 pm:
As a lawyer, I can state nothing is more contested than the meaning of 14th Amendment .Is it limited in scope or a radical change in the constitutional order? Two books cover much of the debate:
1)No State Shall Abridge: The Fourteenth Amendment and the Bill of Rights by Michael Curtis
2) Government by Judiciary: The Transformation of the Fourteenth Amendment by Raoul Berger
No one could have guessed what the amendment came to mean in the courts. When the debate began on the amendment , in the 39th Congress, Congressman John Bingham and Senator Jacob Howard probably couldn’t conceive of the 21st Century understanding of the amendment if you read the debate.
- Skeptic - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 1:44 pm:
“why are we waiting 3 days to implement?” Um, maybe so people can plan their lives accordingly?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 1:46 pm:
- Heather From Orland Park -
Thanks for the history lesson.
It’s not what I asked.
Thanks.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 1:47 pm:
Also, I’ll need to grab those books.
Thank you.
- RNUG - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 2:08 pm:
== Explain in detail what the GA should be doing?
They are choosing, as is their choice, to leave this to the governor. ==
I realize the GA’s not acting was a choice. But things would have been a lot cleaner, legally speaking, if the GA had just passed a resolution confirming the Governor has extraordinary latitude under the Emergency Powers act and is allowed to make multiple declarations.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 2:16 pm:
=== But things would have been a lot cleaner, legally speaking, if the GA had just passed a resolution confirming the Governor has extraordinary latitude under the Emergency Powers act and is allowed to make multiple declarations.===
Could be going less and not putting votes on things was the plan all along(?)
The super minority was going to wail either way, let them have one target as opposed to 65, 66, maybe 70 targets of ire… then there’s the Senate.
Like most things with any sitting GA… bet on nothing happening.
- thisjustingagain - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 2:43 pm:
JoanP - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 12:35 pm: DeVore CANNOT keep raising arguments directly addressed and shot down by a court in a binding precedent. And unless and until a higher court overturns it, the ruling is applicable to any and all of DeVore’s future cases.
- West Side the Best Side - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 3:17 pm:
Tendentious - “That has something to do with a tendon I believe, Your Honor.” Rudy Giuliani in court.
- Bigtwich - Wednesday, Nov 18, 20 @ 4:11 pm:
==DeVore CANNOT keep raising arguments directly addressed and shot down by a court in a binding precedent==
Actually in a court pleading he can in order to preserve the issue on appeal but is obligated to point out the binding precedent.