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Lite guv candidates debate on WTTW

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Illinois

* Last night was the first time that the two major party lt. governor candidates have faced off. Rate the debate…

Plummer found himself immediately on the defensive as he struggled to answer why he refused to release his income tax returns when quizzed by moderator Phil Ponce on WTTW-TV’s “Chicago Tonight.”
“It’s not a leadership issue,” said Plummer, who is the running mate of Bill Brady, the Republican candidate for governor. “It’s just, I think, a privacy issue.”

Plummer tried to dismiss the question, saying he won’t let Simon or her running mate, Gov. Pat Quinn, distract voters with “these silly issues.”

“That’s not an issue that’s ever come up with the voters,” Plummer said.

* AP…

The two differed starkly over a host of issues, including rights to carry hidden weapons. Plummer said it should be allowed as long as a gun owner meets key requirements. Simon said flatly that it shouldn’t be permitted.

Creation was another point of dissension. Plummer said he believed in a Biblical version of creation, although he said local districts should decide whether it was appropriate to teach that in schools.

But he paused and declined to answer directly about whether he thought the earth was created in six days and is a mere 10,000 years old

“My faith is my faith,” he said. “But that that’s not an issue voters are talking about.”

* And Green Party nominee Rich Whitney protested outside WTTW with some high school kids…

“Like, I personally think that’s amazing.”

posted by Rich Miller
Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 4:47 am

Comments

Agree with the 2nd line in AP story that “Plummer held his own” - and then some.

Fairly lopsided in Plummer’s favor the last 15 minutes or so, starting when Ponce refers to the military training/service as a “gig”. Distinct shift in tone and tempo of the whole conversation after that point.

Noticed Simon’s failure to provide much detail in her answers throughout. She’s grown on me a bit, but still doesn’t convey a sense of strong leadership… moreso a nice person who means well but lacking in vision and detail.

Comment by S Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 6:12 am
One additional lingering impression: methinks Simon (and even Ponce, somewhat) underestimated the lad entering the debate.

Comment by S Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 6:20 am
I didn’t see the last Jason Plummer appearance on Chicago Tonight, but after watching the Quinn “glee” ad, I tuned in hoping to see a skewering. Instead, I saw Ponce caught off guard. The use of the word “gig” seemed a tad unprofessional.

There have been some moments in Chicago Tonight’s coverage that have left me scratching my head, such as Elizabeth Brackett’s question to Dold/Seals, “If you could buy anything for yourself, what would you buy?”

Really?

Comment by Jerad Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 7:44 am
Hmmm Plummer staunch creationist…. Madigan loves to eat the fruit from the tree of knowledge… should make for interesting match ups.

Comment by Ghost Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:09 am
What happens to Quinn when the IEA figures out his federal tax dollars come with mandate to break unions and institute merit based pay? (see Newsweek on Obama). What happens when the Republicans take over the house in and no federal money comes next year to prop up schools and the teachers get cut anyway.

To be honest, I little part of me hope Quinn wins. Teachers that endorse a Governor who with his predecessor have cut education spending more then in any 8 year period in IL history are too dumb to teach my kids. I just hope they can figure out the unemployment forms.

Comment by the Patriot Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:10 am
I saw Plummer and Simon debate in the city about 2 months ago. He really seemed to have a much better grasp of facts and actually answering questions at that forum. I figured when tuning in last night that she would have been more prepared after the last time. My opinion? Not really. I don’t get her (or Quinn’s selection of her). Plummer takes last night, but I hope they match up again.

Comment by Eric the Red Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:15 am
As someone else has already noted this morning, Plummer is the single best reason voters have to stick with Quinn. It’s beyond arrogance that Daddy Plummer ran this wholly unqualified kid for a job that puts him a heartbeat away from being the chief executive of the country’s 5th largest state. The boy blunder did a terrible job last night, not as bad as his prior appearance on Chicago Tonight but that was an awfully low bar. The kid is a disaster when he has to go off the script with the handful of talking points he’s been given.

Comment by just sayin' Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:36 am
I look forward to the debate Thursday. However, I came away with two things last night: 1) Plummer had far and away the best data/knowledge…and Simon was the one reading from notes the entire night. I was honestly impressed. 2) The minute the show was over I turned to the couple watching it with me and commented that Quinn/Simon should be glad is was only 1/2 hour because it seemed the longer it went the worse it was going to be. They agreed. I really thought there was a clear distinction in the two.

As for just sayin’ above, I consider myself a fairly open-minded guy and “the kid” won that debate running away. What were you watching?

Comment by Just tootin' Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:50 am
just sayin, I didn’t see the 1st part of the debate but I did see about 15 or 20 min and Plummer won what I saw.

Comment by Phineas J. Whoopee Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:52 am
It was unfortunate that Plummer had to debate two people. Did anyone else notice that? I actually thought he did quite well. I imagine he would have ran away with it on a level playing field.

Comment by CLB Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:55 am
I don’t support Plummer, but I do agree that Phil Ponce seemed one-sided against Plummer in the questioning.

Comment by Jerad Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:58 am
simon wasn’t prepared at all and looked horrible. Plummer had her on the defensive in the 2nd half and she had a few small snide comments that went nowhere. When you consider that she’s old enough to be his law professor, it was a pretty amazing thing she got decked.

the suntimes for its part ripped plummer a new one this morning….

http://www.suntimes.com/news/commentary/2834400,CST-EDT-edit26.article

Comment by shore Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 10:04 am
Look, I am not a Brady/Plummer fan by any stretch of the imagination. However, how anyone could pretend that Plummer did not win last night is beyond me. He avoided Ponce’s traps well and he took it to the opposition tastefully. It was a good showing for him, less so the Quinn/Simon peeps.

Comment by Sugar Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 10:05 am
I kept trying to stay awake for the debate repeat but was unsuccessful.

Comment by Chicago Cynic Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 10:14 am
Plummer clearly had a better command of some of the facts, but bullying bluster should not be confused with leadership and command. Unfortunately for Sheila, she seemed under the weather, and I mean that actually, not metaphorically. Plummer strikes me as a spoiled rich kid who likes to push people around.

the Quinn campaign should use that incredible bit about his claim to a job because he was in the application process for three years. while I realize that it is an intel job in the reserves, Plummer came off as particularly smarmy and privileged in that exchange. my husband, whose natural inclination would be to not like a Sheila Simon type, was astounded at Plummer’s arrogance in that exchange in particular and it solidified his vote.

Comment by Amalia Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 10:26 am
The Brady/Plummer staffers are paid to post on here that Plummer did well. I get that.

But the reality is Plummer again wasn’t honest about his tax returns, his military training, and the non-union nature of daddy’s business. That’s a lot of dishonesty for a 30 minute debate.

I think the thing the Brady/Plummer staff need to wake up and realize is, you guys are in a bubble. Your bosses aren’t very smart, so you start thinking everyone else is equally dim. Meanwhile the reality is the better educated Chicago Tonight viewer could see right through Jason Plummer last night. Jason’s got a long way to go to be a skilled liar like Mark Kirk.

Comment by just sayin' Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 11:29 am
In hindsight, I also thought it was interesting Simon had an endorsement revoked during her mayoral race for dishonesty and unnecessary attacks.

Kind of like some of the random comments above. I’m not sayin’… I’m just sayin’.

Comment by S Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 12:07 pm
just sayin’…feel free to use some facts. Trying to put the lid on a stinker for Simon is understandable, but replicating the same talking points? I’m not on any payroll, but I think you might be right. Try a mirror. And your comments are strikingly similar to those on the other post from Ghost. Copy and paste much?

Comment by Just tootin' Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 12:26 pm
I am a Republican who has never been impressed by Plummer, and have considered him to be a bit of a lead weight on the ticket, but I thought he did quite well last night. That may be due to low expectations, but I came away from the debate feeling pretty good about his performance. He certainly seemed comfortable with most of the issues, and had a good grasp of the facts.

Comment by lawyerlady Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 12:44 pm
Plummer promoted himself better, but both of them mostly dodged the facts. Watch the whole thing again, neither provided much in the way of substance, and Ponce actually was pretty easy on Plummer.

Throughout the debate Plummer would switch between talking about the need for cuts and then criticizing Quinn for cutting things (the one that really stood out to me was his criticism of Quinn for cutting social service agencies). Ponce should have stopped him and asked how they would cut $3 billion and not cut social service agencies.

Plummer also said that since Simon and Quinn were public employees that their taxes should be public information, but that since he and Brady were not they shouldn’t. Ponce should have been all over that as well. Brady is as much a “public employee” as Quinn in that they are both elected officials. Simon is a teacher, does Plummer think all teachers should make their taxes public? Plummer wants to be elected to a position in which he implies his taxes should be made public, doesn’t the public have a right to see those now?

Comment by Pot calling kettle Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 1:24 pm
Also, if your drinking phrase was “the fact of the matter,” you are probably just now getting out of bed with a raging headache.

Comment by Pot calling kettle Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 2:14 pm
Plummer lost votes for the ticket last night. The Brady Bunch can live in denial all it wants.

The boy blunder can maybe get away with his dishonesty and stonewalling down in the sticks but up north we’re more sophisticated and don’t play stooge for some arrogant kid of no accomplishment just because his daddy tells us to.

Comment by just sayin' Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 2:58 pm
Just sayin’: I don’t know where all this person animosity against the guy stems from, but the majority of reader comments (today at least) disagree with you. And most of them offer a fact or two in support of their opinion.

Yours seem to be the only ones involving name calling and personal attacks… are you Sheila Simon?!?!

Comment by S Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 3:35 pm
the fact of the matter is, the line of the night goes to Plummer, who when asked if the state should ban assault weapons, said “i’m in favor of banning things that are illegal, so yes.”

Simon really did not impress. She won the first half, Plummer won the second half and closed well.

Comment by chi Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 4:03 pm
Pot — you are so right about that “the fact of the matter line”! It’s like an annoying tic he says it so frequently. It would have to be a drinking game or else you’d want to stick pencils in your ears!

Comment by Monstrum Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 4:26 pm
Plummer did nothing to “hurt” Brady, but didn’t answer questions on his taxes. Plummer still is going with his “military service” bit that Ponce called him on right away. When Plummer couldn’t answer questions about himself, or even if his Daddy’s company was a “union shop”, he diverted, which is a good debate tactic … and Plummer made Simon play “Defense” which was artfully done, but people are left with 1)No real job but working for your Dad, 2) You blanked last time you were here, 3) I believe the earth is 10,000 years old and was created in 7 days. 4) We are a union shop, unless you count all the people who directly WORK for Daddy.

“C-”,

The peverbial “bar” is so low, if he made sure he didn’t hyper-ventelate the Brady folks would claim victory.

Simon was ill-prepared. She was ill-prepared for anyone, let alone someone she should beat easily. She looked more poised, but also looked like her grasp of specifics were lacking. Also, she didn’t retort back, even when Plummer brought up the taking back of the endorsement. A good response could have been. “I think that is a college newspaper, swayed often by their hearts and “goody-good-ness” not the facts of a specific campaign sometimes, and I guess you might remember it better than I, I am guessing you were still in college when I ran for Mayor, right?” Anything to belittle the paper, the person bringing up a college paper, and the fact that is his “bombshell”. Simon did none of that, and appeared weak.

I do not buy the “Man attacking the Woman” deal. This is Paul Simon’s daughter, so you have to figure she should be tough enough for a good debate, and smart enough to handle something like that.

“C-”

If you believe in a “Supreme Being” be it that your deity created all of us in 7 days, and 10,000 years ago … or not …we all need to pray to “someone”

Brady and Quinn … be healthy, be honest, and complete your terms …because, fellas … did you watch that train wreck????

Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 4:29 pm
Just Sayin’, I agree mostly with your criticisms of Plummer and have plenty of my own to add. However, your line below was needlessly insulting to those of us who aren’t from Chicago:

“The boy blunder can maybe get away with his dishonesty and stonewalling down in the sticks but up north we’re more sophisticated…”

We’re not all stooges down here. Plummer evidently appeals to a certain type of Republican, can we leave it at that? And maybe leave geography out of it? Thanks. (And no hard feelings.)

Comment by Steve Downstate Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:00 pm
Jason Plummer was debating two people IMO. Ponce was all over him and throwing Sheila Simon softballs. It was hilarious.

I noticed when it got into the nitty gritty he outclassed her. I now how she lost that mayorial race.

Comment by Red Truck Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 9:08 pm
Nice to see that Whitney’s making friends at the kiddie table. Maybe he can sit with the adults next Thanksgiving if he steers clear of cannabis…that that the conversation’s any better…but hey, there’s no bed time.

Comment by Tex Tuesday, Oct 26, 10 @ 11:33 pm