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* And here’s another result from the 2012 Paul Simon Public Policy Institute poll…
Which of the following three statements comes closest to your position on the legal rights of gay and lesbian couples in Illinois
Gay/lesbian couples should be allowed to legally marry 43.6%
Gay/lesbian couples should be allowed to form civil unions 31.8%
There should be no legal recognition of relationships between gay and lesbian couples 20.2%
Other/ Don’t know 4.4%
* Compare those results to how the numbers looked two years ago, in the 2010 Paul Simon Public Policy Institute poll…
Which of the following three statements comes closest to your position on the legal rights of gay and lesbian couples in Illinois?
Gay and lesbian couples should be allowed to legally marry 33.6%
Gay and lesbian couples should be allowed to form civil unions, which would give them some legal rights 33.9%
There should be no legal recognition of relationships between gay and lesbian couples 26.5%
Other/Don’t know 6.0%
So, the number of people who say gays should be allowed to marry is up ten points in just two years, while those opposing all recognition of gay unions has declined by over 6 points. The most recent poll’s margin of error is 2.77 points, so this is real movement.
That’s pretty amazing.
posted by Rich Miller
Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 10:44 am
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equality is an awesome concept.
Comment by amalia Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 10:50 am
Now that civil unions exist, people can see how they work in practice and that they pose no threat to traditional marriage. Alternatively, the older demographic most opposed is dying off and younger people most in favor are entering the samples. Just guessing of course.
Comment by Excessively Rabid Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 11:01 am
Excellent news. The sooner gay marriage is legalized nationwide, the better. I’m 100% confident that kids 50 years from now will find opposition to gay marriage just as confusing and impossible to understand as kids now have an impossibly hard time fathoming how anyone could support Jim Crow or be opposed to interracial marriage 50 years prior.
Comment by TJ Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 11:03 am
Well, the sky didn’t fall, and Western Civilization didn’t collapse.
And my own marriage doesn’t need “defense” from this human rights movement.
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 11:10 am
There are bumps in the road, but the arc of freedom is consistently on the rise in America. There is also a healthy strain of mind your own business, too. Nobody likes a buttinsky, always in your business.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 11:33 am
I’ll back any candidate who adopts that slogan.
– MrJM
Comment by MrJM Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 11:41 am
Western Civilization isn’t collapsing? Been to Europe lately?
Comment by Fight for Athens Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 12:47 pm
–Western Civilization isn’t collapsing? Been to Europe lately?–
What did I miss?
Has Germany invaded France and Russia again?
Are they in a constant state of war as they were for centuries in the good ol’ days?
Are the gas chambers smoking?
Or are they just trying to figure out how to manage a common currency?
Such a collapse of Western Civilization.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:00 pm
Check out the birth rates in Europe. The sky is falling may not be the best phrase to describe the depopulation of those countries. Maybe the sky doesn’t want to have children - but that sounds weird.
Comment by dupage dan Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:05 pm
Meanwhile, the Catholic Bishop of Springfield offers an opinion in this week’s Catholic Times that a vote for a candidate who supports or promotes same-sex marriage places the eternal salvation of the voter in serious jeopardy. Here’s a link to the column: http://ct.dio.org/bishops-column/59-think-and-pray-about-your-vote-in-upcoming-election/text.html
Comment by GA Watcher Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:06 pm
–Check out the birth rates in Europe.–
What does that tell you, other than that they are relatively wealthy, educated and have emancipated women?
Are those signs of a civilization in decline?
If high birth rates are a measure of of the good life, then it must be a sweet ride these days in Niger and Zambia.
http://www.economist.com/node/14743589
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:16 pm
Thanks for the link to the Bishop’s statements. I absolutely go nuts when religious leaders weigh in on politics. To specifically refer to party platforms is beyond the pale in my opinion. It is also my opinion that the Bishop is walking very close, or even over, that fine line of advocating a certain political party over another. Churches need to stay out of the political arena. Period. If they cannot do so then they have relinquished their identity as a church and have become just another advocacy group.
As for the comment about one’s salvation being in jeopardy for supporting a candidate that believes in same-sex marriage, I can tell you Bishop that I am a gay Christian and have no fears about my salvation. Preaching of such hatred is inexcusible. Perhaps as a Bishop in the Catholic Church you might be more concerned about the salvation of those sex-abusers your brothers and sisters in the ministry covered up. Your job, Bishop, is to lead your flock and not to condemn them. I feel sorry for the Bishop that he holds such hatred inside him.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:17 pm
From the Bishop:
–Again, I am not telling you which party or which candidates to vote for or against, but I am saying that you need to think and pray very carefully about your vote, because a vote for a candidate who promotes actions or behaviors that are intrinsically evil and gravely sinful makes you morally complicit and places the eternal salvation of your own soul in serious jeopardy.–
Says you.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:22 pm
Good, the more people get use to the idea the more they understand it does not harm anyone else or affect marriage in general. A gay person getting married has no affect on my own marriage what so ever. As someone else mention a lot of people in the generations most opposed to gay marriage, ect, have been dying off.
Comment by RMWStanford Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:28 pm
Don’t care about religion, but have become more anti-catholic as I have gotten older. As a male, I can only wonder about women taking orders from (supposedly) celibate men regarding birth control and abortion- none of them will ever suffer the pain of childbirth or deal with raising children. Some of the far-right protestants are just as bad-when someone proclaims themselves to be a “saved” Christian, my tendency is to run….
Comment by downstate commissioner Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:38 pm
I’m just guessing, but I’ll bet I disagree with the bishop on which candidate “promotes actions or behaviors that are intrinsically evil and gravely sinful makes you morally complicit…”
Comment by Cheryl44 Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:46 pm
Just one in five IL voters still opposes any accommodation on marriage to gay residents.
That shriveling minority is who every Senate Republican except Rutherford represents, since he was the sole GOP vote for civil unions. (There were a handful in the House.)
The GOP is so out of touch with public opinion that it’s no surprise they will get their clocks cleaned again on Nov. 6.
Comment by reformer Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 1:55 pm
As a non-practicing Catholic, the bishop’s comments in that link are one of the main reasons I’m a NON-PRACTICING Catholic.
I believe in the faith, not in the church.
Comment by TJ Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 2:04 pm
I wonder if some of the 31.8% that favor civil unions knew that civil unions would not give same-sex couples actual federal marriage rights, they might change their support to marriage equality.
I would have to assume that many believe (wrongly) it’s the same rights, just a different name.
Comment by late to the party Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 2:37 pm
Hardly surprising, given the now stop propaganda and uncritical media reporting on this issue. There has been virtually no equal time permitted to proponents of traditional marriage. Sort of like Obama’s 2008 campaign — can anyone remember when the President opposed same sex marriages before he reversed himself for the second time on this wedge issue? He was given a pass in 2008 because he needed to be elected, so he kept mum until later on.
Comment by Esquire Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 3:55 pm
Esquire, are you saying that the American people have been somehow brainwashed?
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 3:57 pm
“If high birth rates are a measure of of the good life, then it must be a sweet ride these days in Niger and Zambia.”
Exactly, only the ignorant would return to the days of high birth and death rates. Zero population growth is fast approaching in the developed world and we can much more easily deal with the problems that
Comment by wishbone Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 3:59 pm
…that causes than those of over population.
ps Sorry for the disconnected comment.
Comment by wishbone Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 4:01 pm
Word, that column by our local bishop was a hot topic of pre-game conversation at the Catholic high school football game last weekend. Not well received was the general takeaway.
Comment by Arthur Andersen Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 4:06 pm
I didn’t push for high birth rates - please highlight where I did.
Birth rates in Italy have dropped so much they are not replacing those who have died. It is pretty true in many other European countries - replacement rates are also near the negative point. Italy will likely not have any native Italians in less than 100 years. Russia would likely follow suit - their birth rate is also below replacement levels currently.
Comment by dupage dan Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 4:29 pm
–Italy will likely not have any native Italians in less than 100 years.–
You can’t possibly believe that.
According to CIA World Factbook, Italy has a population of 60.6 million, 92% of whom are native Italians.
The fertility rate is 1.41 children born/woman.
Where do you expect all those millions of Italians are going?
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 4:45 pm
===You can’t possibly believe that.===
I’m sure he does.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 4:53 pm
What kind of crazy water does dupage dan drink?
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 5:11 pm
==There has been virtually no equal time permitted to proponents of traditional marriage.==
First, that is a laughable statement. I seem to remember Chic-fil-A getting all kinds of time for their owners ridiculous statement. Second, why would anyone want to give the time of day to hatemongers and bigots?
Afraid of the bogeyman gays coming after you Esquire? I mean, you can already see how gay marriage, civil unions and the repeal of DADT has caused civilization to collapse.
Your cause is finally almost lost. Move on to another topic you can spew bigotry towards.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 5:14 pm
–Birth rates in Italy have dropped so much they are not replacing those who have died–
And this is related to marriage equality in what way? (Not to mention the fact that there is no marriage equality in Italy.)
Comment by Jabes Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 5:15 pm
Esquire, how does supporting the ability of gays to get marry make you anti-traditional marriage? I support gay marriage and seeing as I am married myself in traditional marriage I sure as hell dont see myself as anti-traditional marriage.
Comment by RMWStanford Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 5:31 pm
dear RC Bishop of Springfield…how are you guys (and heavy emphasis on the guys) still in business?
Comment by amalia Wednesday, Sep 26, 12 @ 10:24 pm
–Italy will likely not have any native Italians in less than 100 years.–
Ummm..you do understand that negative growth wouldn’t go to zero, right? It would even out at some point.
Of course, Italy has positive growth because of immigration into the country. Though as immigrants move into developed economies their fertility rates tend to go down as well though the generations born into Italy would be naturally born, just not necessarily of Italian ancestral heritage.
IOW, they would become more like the US. Don’t worry, the best Italian restaurant in Saint Louis is run by a pair of Ethiopian brothers.
Comment by ArchPundit Thursday, Sep 27, 12 @ 12:12 pm