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* From the Southern Illinoisan…
Nearly one in ten Illinois voters don’t have a photo ID, according to the latest poll results from the Paul Simon Public Policy Institute.
Roughly 9.4 percent of registered voters asked in the poll said they don’t have “a current, unexpired Illinois-issued ID” that includes a photo, the institute, housed at SIU Carbondale, found in its recent statewide poll.
The institute released the findings Wednesday in light of a Pennsylvania judge putting a stop Tuesday to that state’s new and controversial voter ID law. Many states require people show a photo ID at the poll.
It’s aimed at preventing fraud, but in this election cycle critics have complained the rules keep away poor and minority voters, which tend to be the people without a current photo ID.
* The paper left out some information, however. From the Institute’s press release…
Subgroup responses in the Simon Poll show that instances of voters without IDs are higher in groups that tend to vote Democratic.
Registered voters with a high school education or less were more likely than average to be without ID (14.6 percent), as were African Americans (16.2 percent), voters under 35 (13.4 percent) and those with household incomes below $50,000 (14.0 percent).
According to the crosstabs, 18.2 percent of Latinos say they have no state-issued photo identification card.
…Adding… Per a commenter’s request, the poll found that 7.2 percent of whites said they had no state ID card.
9.6 percent of Chicagoans, 9.1 percent of suburbanites and 9.6 percent of downstaters say they have no state-issued identification. 10.5 percent of Democrats, 11.3 percent of independents and 7.7 percent of Republicans say they don’t have a state ID. Just 3.6 percent of people making over $100,000 a year have no official ID card.
* More from the Institute…
Illinois’ number is slightly less than the national statistic provided by the Brennan Center for Justice, which estimates that as “many as 10 percent of eligible voters” do not currently have or will be able to get proper identification in order to vote. Illinois is in line with estimates that show Pennsylvania with 9 percent estimates of eligible voters without a picture ID. The Simon Poll’s estimate of 9 percent is higher than a recent 7 percent estimate in New Hampshire and a 6.7 percent estimate in Minnesota.
…Adding… Here’s how the question was asked…
Do you have a current, unexpired Illinois-issued ID with your picture on it, like a driver’s license?
posted by Rich Miller
Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:19 am
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The GOP voter suppression efforts were transparent. But still, you make your life more difficult than it needs to be by not having a photo ID.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:35 am
I am the night manager of a homeless shelter in Lake county, and have been for 7 years. Nobody can enter unless they have a PADS ID. We allow some in on their licence or Social Security card one time, but they have to have a PADS ID the next time. We start the process at the shelter if it the first time or very cold outside. PADS does not charge them for the ID and will give a card to anyone in need.
How many fewer people have an State ID since the price went up to get one? Who raised the prices? Jessi White or the legislature did for more revenue. BTW A PADS ID has name birth date and social security number on it.
Comment by Votecounter Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:42 am
So I’m curious about the difference between white and minority voters since the claim in Pennsylvania and elsewhere is for disparate treatment. the 16+ and 18+ percent means that the numbers must be less for whites. what do the crosstabs show?
Comment by in the know Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:44 am
Why must ID be State issued? Is a US Passport, or Military ID in some way insufficient?
Comment by chefjeff Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:48 am
How does one operate in today’s society without a photo ID?
Comment by Cal Skinner Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:49 am
===what do the crosstabs show? ===
7.17%
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:50 am
I think if you are going to require a photo ID to vote, you need to provide one for free.
Comment by Lucky than Good Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:52 am
thanks Rich. Although there is more to the analysis than simple math, its hard to argue there isn’t a racial disparity,so from an appearances perspective, pretty hard to make the argument.
Comment by in the know Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:57 am
I’ve had a state-issued photo ID since I got a driver’s permit, when I was 15. That was 30 years ago. I’ve also had a military ID since I joined the navy 27 years ago. I don’t think I know any adult who doesn’t have a state-issued photo ID.
Comment by Conservative Veteran Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:59 am
I believe you should have a photo ID to be able to vote. I’m not sure what a “PADS” ID is, but feel it would be acceptable to vote. Without a photo ID, corruption runs rampant. Especially in Chicago. This opinion comes from personal experience on voting day in Chicago.
Comment by fan of cap fax Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:05 pm
–I think if you are going to require a photo ID to vote, you need to provide one for free.–
You could be right. A layman’s reading of the 24th Amendment suggests that’s a reasonable assumption.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:06 pm
Go to any veterans hospital in IL and you’ll find dozens, if not hundreds, of IL citizens who have the right to vote but do not possess the type of identification that would pass muster under the various voter ID laws. Many has their IL ID expire while serving. Many no longer serve, so they don’t have valid military ID. Many have been in the VA for extended periods of time and have no reason to update their passports, drivers licenses, state ids.
Comment by IDmadness Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:14 pm
@chiefjeff
In PA, the reason that military/veteran’s ID cards weren’t acceptable under the state’s voter ID law was that they do not have an expiration date. The PA law apparently dictated that acceptable ID cards had to have an expiration date.
Comment by Phil Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:18 pm
And yes I do have a Illinois drivers license. Got it just over 41 years ago but have never been ask for ID at the poll. Probably because only around 100 vote there.
Comment by nieva Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:24 pm
You have to go beyond free ID if you are going to require one. The office would need to be open 24/7 to accommodate everyone who needs the ID but can’t afford to take time off work to go get one.
Comment by Cheryl44 Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:24 pm
How many without a state-id purchase cigarettes, alcohol, lottery tickets?
Comment by reallife Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:27 pm
So how does anyone get anything without proper ID even a Link card? Or is stuff handed out to just anyone?
Comment by geronimo Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:35 pm
- Yes I do and why don’t these people. It’s way to easy to get one if you are legal. -
It has nothing to do with being “legal.” There is no law that requires you maintain valid ID in Illinois, and frankly you can get through life pretty easily without one if you don’t drive or don’t buy products that require ID.
If you’re a senior citizen or disabled adult who doesn’t leave the house much, why would you necessarily take the time to go to a drivers facility every few years to get a State ID if you have no use for it?
Comment by huh Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:37 pm
In order to work you have to present verification of citizenship, to cash check, government or otherwise you have to show ID. It seems that without identification of some sort you will not be able to conduct a life.
Comment by RMD Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:45 pm
Fan
PADS is an Acronym that is different in each county in Lake co. it stands for Providing Advocacy, Dignity and Shelter. It is the agency that delivers help to the homeless,hungry and needy of Lake county IL I work in Waukegan at St Anastasia. the point I wanted to make was the homeless have to have a photo ID to access help. People go out and find homeless people on the streets and bring them to the PADS offices to make sure they know how to get help, The Homeless all know they have to have the ID and make sure if they lose it they get a new on ASAP.
Comment by Votecounter Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 12:58 pm
I find this issue very disturbing on so many levels. Is it really that difficult to obtain a photo I.D.? If it is and it is so discriminatory, let’s just eliminate photo I.D.’s for everything. We can just trust everyone, problem solved.
Comment by Holdingontomywallet Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:06 pm
I agree, I tend to find it difficult to fathom navigating our world without a government ID — that being said, perhaps we, commenters here, don’t have a clue on how some people lead their lives.
Comment by Just Observing Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:13 pm
How do these people ever get into their local court house? Coles county requires id, or your lawyer, to enter the court house.
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:19 pm
= Is it really that difficult to obtain a photo I.D.? =
It’s not just about obtaining a photo ID, it’s about having the right kind of photo ID.
Most voter ID laws require a valid identification card, with an expiration date, that includes the voters name, current photo, and current address. Military IDs don’t include this information, and neither do most college IDs.
Also, for many elderly and poor people it is difficult to get obtain a photo ID when you have to pay $30 for it.
Comment by huh Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:21 pm
I’m not sure why some of you people are so flabbergasted about the ID thing. After my grandfather stopped driving he wouldn’t have had a valid photo ID according to some state laws because his license expired. He had no reason to renew it. He was in his 80’s and 90’s. Nobody asked him for ID for cigarettes or beer. The bank knew who he was. Later when he didn’t go out much other people did everything for him. What did he need an ID for?
Also, do you know that 1 in 12 people in America don’t even have a bank account? Yes, that’s 8.2% of the country. 10 million Americans. You can cash some checks without ID. These people work from cash and cash-loaded debit cards. Again, no need for a photo ID.
I just don’t understand why so many people are so up in arms about requiring a photo ID. There is absolutely no evidence that “corruption runs rampant” as one here has claimed.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:22 pm
If you want an ID, you can get one.
Voter fraud needs to be prevented.
Not requiring ID to vote because some people don’t have their ID is a pitiful excuse to open our voting system to fraud.
There is no reason to try to create a voting system that demands no responsibility or we all end up with irresponsible voting results.
Someone has to be an adult, right?
Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:24 pm
*–I think if you are going to require a photo ID to vote, you need to provide one for free.–
You could be right. A layman’s reading of the 24th Amendment suggests that’s a reasonable assumption.*
A couple of years ago, a law was passed in IL that allowed folks that are experiencing homelessness to get a state issued ID for free.
Not to say that such a law addresses this issue, but at least there is recognition that the fee is a barrier and a ID is pretty critical to moving forward in many ways.
Comment by Montrose Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:28 pm
It doesn’t matter if folks make it tougher on themselves by not having a valid photo ID. That has nothing to do with the right to vote.
Have you ever ridden on a traffic ticket? I guess you’ll need a free photo ID, too.
Here’s the text of the 24th Amendment:
Section 1. The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any State by reason of failure to pay any poll tax or other tax.
Section 2. The Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.
So yes, it would seem those cards would have to be free, if they are required to vote in national elections.
Who knew our small-government GOP friends would be at the forefront of a national free ID card movement, all in the name of…. what was the problem, again?
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:31 pm
*It doesn’t matter if folks make it tougher on themselves by not having a valid photo ID. That has nothing to do with the right to vote.*
I completely agree. In a voter ID brawl, one could point to the homeless ID fee waiver as evidence that legislature has acknowledged there is not equal access to IDs and, thus, there is a possibility of disenfranchising people with voter ID requirements.
Comment by Montrose Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:37 pm
VMan, what fraud are you talking about, specifically? What’s prompted this requirement, after all these decades?
Do you really think voter fraud that’s been discovered in the past was the result of streams of individuals presenting themselves at the polls and pretending to be someone they weren’t?
As one of “the adults” here, can you honestly contend that this is not simply the latest in the historically long line of voter suppression strategies targeting the poor and minorities?
http://www.brennancenter.org/content/resource/policy_brief_on_the_truth_about_voter_fraud/
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:41 pm
On the 3 percent of people without id making 100k plus. I have lots of friends who grew up in cities and have never owned a car, learned to drive, or bothered with the id process because they’ve always either walked, cabbed or used public transportation. If you’re trying to figure that number out, that might help and with a few others.
Comment by Shore Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 1:52 pm
==I think if you are going to require a photo ID to vote, you need to provide one for free.==
This is right. The Supreme Court took up this question in Crawford v. Marion County a couple of years. They held that a state had to provide free id’s if they wanted to require voters to show state-issued identification in order to vote. Otherwise, the right to vote would be conditioned upon payment which has been expressly illegal since the 60’s.
Comment by chuddery Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:01 pm
“13% of voters under 35 say they don’t have IDs”
I can imagine older folks, but how do these people get into bars?
Maybe this is indicative to other problems in society?
Comment by Allen Skillicorn Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:03 pm
Since they needed a photo ID to register it would be interesting to know why they do not have a current one. It isn’t enough to point to a general claim thatbis is difficult for the poor to get one since they had one to register in the first place.
Comment by Edison Parker Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:04 pm
My wife was a election judge training and they had someone get visibly upset and walk out of training when they found out they can’t ask all voters for ID.
As for the fraud argument, having been involved in the practical side of elections (tally stuff) for over 15 years now I think I can safely say if you wanted to commit enough fraud where it counted you wouldn’t do it with non-eligible voters. To risky and too time consuming for the relative number of votes.
At some point to be blunt you have to accept some fraud of this type because the costs (financial and others) of getting to truly 0 fraud outweigh the benefits.
Comment by OneMan Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:14 pm
“Since they needed a photo ID to register it would be interesting to know why they do not have a current one. ”
Except that in Illinois, you don’t need a photo id register to vote. You need two forms of id, one of which must have your current address on it, but no requirement for a photo. Thus, a SS card or birth certificate and a utility bill would probably be enough.
Comment by Crafty Girl Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:24 pm
Particularly interesting is Texas will not accept an ID issued by a State of Texas college / university, but they will accept a State of Texas concealed carry permit.
http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2012/08/30/judges-reject-texas-voter-id-law/
Comment by Anyone Remember? Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:25 pm
Would any commenter’s opinions change if they tried to vote on election day and were denied because someone already voted under their name? I’m not at all saying it has happened, but I would feel like my vote mattered if I knew no one else could vote as me.
Comment by Homer J. Simpson Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:26 pm
Homer J — Well I think I would be able to cast a provisional and there would likely be an investigation into what happened.
Comment by OneMan Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:28 pm
I didn’t have to have a photo ID to register to vote. You have to prove who you are (certified copy of my birth certificate) and that I lived where I said I lived (utility bill). There were no pictures involved.
And when I moved in May, all I had to do is send in my new address on the back of an old voter registration card. They mailed my new card to me. Had it been returned to the Election Board I would not be able to vote other than provisionally in November.
Comment by Cheryl44 Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 2:30 pm
Homer, I’d want to know how they managed to forge my signature. At least around here, we have to sign a form when we ask for a ballot and that signature is compared to the one on the books from when we registered.
Comment by TooManyJens Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 3:33 pm
What I would like to see is a study that goes one step further. Asking if those, of any race or economic background, who do not have a state issued ID or DL, get some kind of benefits at the state or federal level. What did they have to do to be able to obtain those? Do they need a photo ID, Soc. Sec. Card? etc…
I just don’t see the big deal in getting at least an ID, especially to be able to cast a vote.
Comment by Concerned Voter Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 3:51 pm
The big deal Concerned, is the cost. Not of the ID necessarily, but of maybe having to take unpaid time off work and getting to the facility where you can get the ID. I changed the address on my drivers license over the summer. To do so I took some personal time and a train to downtown to the SoS office. If I lived in Oakdale, say, and had no PTO and no car, what was a minor inconvenience for me turns into an impossibility.
Comment by Cheryl44 Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 5:13 pm
For most of her life, my wife never had a state issued ID. However she did have a valid U.S. Passport, which she carried with her to use as an ID.
Comment by G'Kar Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 5:18 pm
driver’s license. think that life without some form of photo id would be difficult.
Comment by amalia Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 9:42 pm
=How do these people ever get into their local court house?=
Never been asked for an ID to enter a courthouse.
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Oct 3, 12 @ 11:28 pm
Anonymous, because you are usually in cuffs and have a sheriff’s escort…heyoooo!
Comment by Wumpus Thursday, Oct 4, 12 @ 9:15 am
Thousands of people do not have required IDs. It is not at all uncommon.
I’m currently living in Indiana and have been for more than a year. I do not have an Indiana State ID and I cannot get one unless I pay for it (poll tax) and cannot get the free voter issued one unless I have my birth certificate (which I don’t have since I was tossed out of my parent’s house when I was 18 after I came out to them).
It’s not uncommon. I am a middle-class person, working on a graduate degree. I work for local government. I facilitate groups for local youth groups and volunteer in the community. I’ve lived here for more than a year and will stay for at least one more. But it’s illegal for me to vote here.
Comment by Danny Thursday, Oct 4, 12 @ 11:57 am
Unless I misread, this was sampled from 1,261 registered voters out of the possible 7,300,000 registered voters in Illinois, a yield of 0.017%. Shawneetown has more residents than those polled. Does this data ring true for the other 99.983% of registered voters? I understand it is unrealistic to ask even half of the total, but “one-tenth of one percent” seems a bit low to me for reliable stats. If they asked 6 TOTAL African Americans, and one had no ID, that could account for the 16%.
In related news, 100% of Illinois residents I asked today said they drank coffee this morning. 0% of Americans say they wanted a second cup. (*The sample size was one person).
Comment by Anon Friday, Oct 5, 12 @ 11:08 am
===In related news, 100% of Illinois residents I asked today said they drank coffee this morning===
If you knew how to conduct a poll, or had the least bit of knowledge about how to do one, you wouldn’t have posted that inane comment.
Comment by Rich Miller Friday, Oct 5, 12 @ 11:11 am