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* From Michael Robertson at SolidOpinion.com…
Hey Rich,
I watch Illinois politics from afar. (My brother in law lives there.) Your site has unique content and amazing engagement and here’s a way to generate revenue with no sales effort. (My state CA has many similarities with IL.)
My company is launching “promoted comments”. This is where users can bid to push their comment to the top of the comment list. Users can still comment for free but any user can also pay to have their comment listed in the top 3 slots. It’s a fantastic way to generate revenue just using your natural visitor engagement. There’s no selling on your part. Commenters are given the option to pay using points (which are purchased with cash) to have their comment at the top of the list. Think of it as a mix between ebay/google ads/comment section. It’s super easy to implement. Just replace your current comment code with code from my company SolidOpinion. You get a check each month for 50% of whatever revenue is generated. You get more engaged users, relevant content and revenue!
A little about me. I’m the guy behind digital music pioneer MP3.com. This is my new company. We’re launching with Yahoo in their politics section in October and with a major finance site. I’m looking for a few marquee smaller publishers to launch with to show how it will work for any size publisher. Your site looks perfect.
Attached is a mockup of a non-profit news site based in San Diego that may use our technology. Please let me know if you have any questions. I’m happy to get on the phone or answer more questions via email.
– MR
* The attachment…
* I had some follow-up questions and he provided some answers. I added some emphasis…
1) How much do they pay to promote each comment?
The publisher (you) can set a minimum but the “market” sets the price much like a seller on ebay. If nobody wants it then you may not even get the minimum. If lots of people want it then they can outbid each other.
Lets say somebody bids 100 points for the top slot. If another commenter wants to list theres above that person they will have to bid more than 100 and so on and so on.
2) What payment method is used?
Commenters buy points using Paypal. It’s 88 points per dollar and they buy them in $10 increments.
3) Can they pay to promote somebody else’s comment?
Absolutely!
4) How about if I post this email and ask my commenters what they think?
Sure why not? I imagine some will be negative because everyone would rather have everything free. However, creating a market is actually a service to the community because if people feel strongly they have an avenue to insure their voice is heard.
Remember free comments are still available. They’re just displayed below up to 3 promoted comments.
There’s another benefit you might appreciate. Our commenting engine has a built-in reputation system so your time to manage comments will be greatly reduced. Here’s an example of a site running our comment engine: http://nextbigfuture.com/2015/09/nasa-confirms-evidence-that-liquid.html
They aren’t running “promoted comments” yet because that isn’t available until October 10th. It is very easy for you to turn on/off promoted comments. Our hope is that you have a very un-intrusive way to generate revenue for your site that some users actually see as a service.
Btw, the promoted comment must be relevant to the story or it removed. We believe promoted comments can enhance the content and help publishers generate revenue from their efforts!
Let me know if you have any questions. The company is: SolidOpinion.com
– MR
I’ll make the final decision, but I most definitely want your input.
Also, keep in mind that this is not a “pay to comment” system. It’s simply a “pay to promote a comment” system.
* The Question: On a scale of 1 to 5, with 5 being the most supportive, how do you feel about switching over to this new commenting system? Take the poll and then explain your answer in comments, please.
posted by Rich Miller
Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:39 am
Sorry, comments are closed at this time.
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By all means. You work hard to create great content everyday. Would not detract from the experience of the site at all in my opinion.
Comment by Very Fed Up Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:41 am
Geez, can’t you just get a “like” button?
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:42 am
Voted “5″.
Your shop. Your business. I’m not going to be the “1″ to say you shouldn’t.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:43 am
Do we really want to give the Raunerites another way to purchase public opinion, with their seemingly limitless supply of cash? Thanks, but no.
Comment by South of Sherman Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:43 am
-5-
Absolutely, allow idiots to spend money “promoting” their comments. It’s like economic Darwinism.
Comment by PravdaOnThePrairie Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:43 am
I think your comment section is populated by regulars who know what they’re getting and what they’re getting themselves into. I think if paid comments existed and people want to avoid paid comments they could quickly adapt. I also think that it would be very interesting to see what comments are being paid for and to be able to make assumptions about who is paying for them so that’s why I support it. My only caveat is that once before you tried to implement a new commenting system and it ran into all sorts of technical headaches, this new system could have a bunch of technical problems as well.
Comment by The Captain Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:46 am
Try it. It can’t be worse than the time you changed the layout of the blog.
Or can it??!? Naahhhhh
Comment by Jordan Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:46 am
I’m not of the opinion that speech should be subject to any “market” but the marketplace of ideas, but hey, that’s just me. I’ll still visit CapFax either way.
Comment by Tournaround Agenda Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:48 am
Fascinating idea. I like it as a revenue source for you. As a commenter, I may even use it.
BUT as a reader, I don’t always start at the top, sometimes I scroll down to the bottom to see where the conversation is heading before I post my comments.
Comment by siriusly Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:49 am
One other consideration, your current system is quasi-anonymous and that has its pros and cons, but definitely some pros. If switching to a new system forces people to register and provide some sort of identifying information (like an email address) and/or provide a credit card number (or some combination thereof) I’m sure it would have an impact.
Comment by The Captain Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:49 am
1. What will capt Fax do with extra time?
A. More exercise
2. Can we use state contract $ for ‘ments?
A. This will be very important to TeamBungle
3. Will dark money lobby groups ( IPI,BGA) be able to “buy in”
We voted 5 anyway
Comment by Anonin' Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:49 am
I voted 3 because I don’t have any strong feelings about it. I don’t begrudge you a little revenue opportunity. As long as comments can be made for free that’s all I care about. My ego doesn’t require top 3 status.
I would expect the top spots to be populated by Raunerbots willing to spend their money.
Comment by Norseman Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:50 am
I voted 2. It would be tough to follow the conversation/arguements if this gets changed to a free market system where comments get pushed to the top b/c of $. I would not be able to tell what is a reply to a different comment, or if it is a comment to the article or information posted on the blog.
However, when I voted I was looking out for my own interest. Rich has his own, and I can’t blame him either way. It’s his site.
Comment by Almost the Weekend Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:50 am
I voted 3. One concern is losing the chronological thread of comments
Comment by very old soil Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:50 am
5. You’re in this to make a buck, right?
I don’t know how it will pay off, but it’s worth a shot.
Comment by Wordslinger Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:51 am
It’s your business, so you have to do what you must and I know that we will all be fine and supportive whatever you do. it’s your space and we love it.
but this would change the room, and I don’t think for the better. of course, it will become apparent who pays to move up, and they may be the recipient of blog ire due to that but on balance I’m not a fan.
Comment by Amalia Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:51 am
I voted 2. Should be given consideration but as a reader I would be less likely to participate in the dialogue. I agree with South of Sherman comments that those with limitless cash would be able to use the site for personal or political purposes.
All that being said, I understand that this is ultimately your business and you are entitled to profit from it.
Comment by Stones Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:51 am
I have a feeling Bruce Rauner will appropriate 3 million for comment promotion.
Comment by John A Logan Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:51 am
I have sometimes puzzled at letting freeloaders like me have equal footing with paid subscribers. I certainly think you might place paid subscribers at the top.
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:52 am
Just FYI, if I do this I will likely ask for a much more generous split from the company.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:52 am
Voted No, but I would like to have a “like button” next to comments.
Comment by modest proposal Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:53 am
I voted 1 because one of the great things about the commenting community here is its small-d democracy. With all the money floating around Springfield to buy influence, why open yet another avenue?
But as some commenters noted above: your blog, your rules. If paid advertisements didn’t make me stop reading, promoted comments won’t either.
On the issue of anonymity, though: I strongly think that promoted comments should not be anonymous so that we can judge the bias or interest behind it, if any. Regular comments should continue to be anonymous, if it all feasible.
Comment by the Other Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:54 am
Voted 4. Sounds “icky” at first.
But your business, go for it. Plus you’ve never hesitated, and commenters have never hesitated, to disagree with your advertisers. It’d be funny to see a paid promoted comment get mocked by the unpaid ones.
Comment by Robert the Bruce Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:54 am
My view-
As a subscriber, I am already paying for content and I am happy to do so. I have no problem with my comments moving down or up but would prefer they be seen in order of comment.I think it makes more sense if you are trying to follow a “conversation”.
That said, I wouldn’t stop subscribing or commenting if the pay to promote process is utilized.
Comment by JS Mill Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:54 am
Voted 5, it wouldn’t bother me in reading comments and seems like a decent way to make a little revenue. However, hold out for 70%.
Comment by Earnest Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:55 am
I chose 3 because it’s up to you. Won’t affect me one way or the other.
However…
If you do this, I am going to be entrepreneurial and set up a “Go Fund Me” page for Willy. Even a little slice should cover the cost of a subscription! (total snark!)
Comment by A guy Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:55 am
I voted “2″ mostly because I am adverse to change and I love this site as it is. But far be from me to stand in the way of the continued financial success of this media enterprise of yours. Much respect.
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:56 am
You have been known to promote a charity now and again. What if you tried it to raise some money for the chosen non-profit cause - just to try it? Although I join those who say you are entitled to any profit you can get!
Comment by WonderfulWorld Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:56 am
Sorry, I am the “anonymous” above.
Comment by Jake From Elwood Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:56 am
47 is right. Just get a like and if you want a dislike button. I don’t want to see promoted posts in comments.
Comment by Chicago Cynic Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:56 am
The above comments provide a pretty good list of the pros and cons.
It’s your site, do as you wish.
Comment by Federalist Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:57 am
Go for it. You deserve to get paid as much as possible for the great content you generate.
Comment by Jerry 101 Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:57 am
I think it would be really confusing to track ongoing discussions/arguments if they could be prioritized by paying. Not to mention I would frankly look down on someone who had to pay to prioritize their point. Trolls would totally love it. And just saying that those of us who can’t afford a subscription but really rely on this site might feel ostracized in the “free zone”. Speaking for myself, I don’t need more help in having my comments ignored. Actually what might be neat is a rewards system for those who comment with quality comments. Maybe freebee points for those comment and engage often. like frequent flier points. Points to be rewarded by Rich. That way fareshares like myself might be able to have a post highlighted now and then. OOOOh and if you have a post deleted by Rich he can take free points away. I don’t know. I still don’t particularly like it. It favors trolls with money and time.
Comment by Honeybear Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:57 am
4/5 - Your blog… do what you want. Not really sure why anyone would vote a 1 since it’s only three comments that could be pushed to the top.
Comment by Wondering Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:58 am
I would actually prefer something like the NYT comment section - both the NYT Picks (Rich’s favorite commentators) and the Readers Picks’ (something akin to “like” on FB)
Comment by uptown progressive Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:58 am
So much for the free expression of ideas and opinions! At what point is it no longer a free press and no different than the Chicago Tribune? Bought and paid for by the rich. Avoid this “slippery slope”!
Comment by Old and In the Way Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:58 am
I voted 1 because I’m generally opposed to the idea of paid tier systems in online communities. It reminds me of the net neutrality argument. That being said, I won’t blame you if you do. You have every right to be creative in your revenue generation. And if someone really wants to be a top comment badly enough to pay for it, than sure.
Comment by horse w/ no name Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:59 am
Don’t do it. Lobbyists and special interests (or intense party loyalists) will pay to promote their agenda in the comments, thereby reducing comments to garbage.
I would much rather see a button for people to “like” or “agree” with poignant or well thought out comments.
Comment by Just Me Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:01 pm
Disappointed. I guess it is an option if the blog is teetering on the edge of a financial abyss. This would not be a world ending change. But it seems contrary to what you’ve built. I know money buys better access in Springfield; but here?
Comment by south side Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:02 pm
Guess speech is not free anymore. Voted 1. Presents disadvantages for those lacking deeper pockets. But then most “free” media is paid for by the 1% now anyway. Can you donate the $ to the homeless or people who can’t get low-income childcare support anymore?
Comment by bluecollargal Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:02 pm
Most threads generate less than 100 posts. Usually it’s not too hard to follow along, unless its a thread about Plummer, when OW goes crazy with the #’s.
Your blog, your rules. As long as it’s free to continue to post I say why not.
If it would help cut down on the ‘anon’ posts that would be great though.
Comment by How Ironic Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:04 pm
This system is exactly the kind of innovative, market driven approach to policy discussion I have spent a lifetime working against. I would rather we just be able to shout down, drown out and vilify the opinions that differ from the status quo that will allow me to retire from my state job in two years with a six figure pension.
Comment by Bob the Slob with a Cushy State Job Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:04 pm
I voted 4. I do like the idea of upvoting comments similar to how reddit works. Maybe you could have a portion of the profits go to a local animal shelter in honor of Oscar?
Comment by Tie Your Shoes Kyle Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:04 pm
Those with the money already have enough power everywhere else.
Comment by Joe M Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:05 pm
Voted 3. It is up to you. I would just skip the first 3 comments if they are promoted, like I already do for the two promoted emails on the “Promoted” email tab on my gmail.
Comment by 32nd Ward Roscoe Village Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:05 pm
Not until the Turnarounud Agenda is passed.
Comment by lurks Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:07 pm
I read all the comments, not just the first three. So whoever pays the most money wins???
I do, however, LOVE the like/dislike button idea.
I’m completely a fan of your continued success so do what you gotta do.
Comment by L.A. Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:08 pm
===Just FYI, if I do this I will likely ask for a much more generous split from the company.====
I voted 5. Of course I have my own reason for wanting it. Hopefully it allows you to keep your subscription fee at a reasonable level.
Otherwise I don’t think it will matter much.
Comment by Been There Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:09 pm
76% are saying no or hell no. Seems pretty clear.
Comment by Chicago Cynic Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:09 pm
If you do this some commenters are going to need to get jobs.
Comment by Miami Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:11 pm
If it will help plug the state’s budget hole, I’m all for it. I do think it would demonstrate once and for all that comments on this blog are worth far more than 2 cents.
Comment by Decaff Coffee Party Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:11 pm
I understand it would be a nice revenue generator for a hard working guy, but it is another fine example of American “free” speech. Maybe if I want my opinion out there, I too can purchase a major metropolitan newspaper!
Comment by The Equalizer Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:12 pm
It wouldn’t stop me from reading and commenting but I would probably skip past the promoted comments.
Comment by Anonish Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:13 pm
No way. After the initial fun of mocking the ego-driven “ME FIRSTer’s”, I think somehow the value, the good, of this set-up would be diminished in some way. Why pee in the soup?
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:13 pm
I voted 5 as I would love to make some of the serial commenters pay for loading up the board. At the same time, the comments are now adds and not really comments so maybe I will rethink it and post twice now so I don’t have to pay for comments later.
Comment by Name/Nickname/Anon Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:14 pm
I voted “1″. This site has always been about the free exchange of ideas, thoughts, feelings and opinions. Like others here, I am all for your ability to make a buck.
But should I have to read past “paid content”, I just won’t have the same faith in this site I have now. I’ll always think someone with an agenda — a paid agenda at that — is trying to influence my “take-aways”.
Comment by Colin O'Scopey Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:15 pm
Let the free market decide who is most on point.
Comment by lurks Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:16 pm
While this might provide our hard-working host with deserved revenue, I’m concerned about the IPI and certain others trying to push their agendas. Also will make it harder to follow threads.
Bottom line: if this system is adopted, I will ignore all promoted comments and will scroll down to the real discussion amongst the adults.
Comment by Curmudgeon Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:16 pm
This poll is beginning to mirror the current situation in the General Assembly. lol /s
Comment by A guy Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:16 pm
I voted 1. Just do like/dislike buttons please.
Comment by Joe Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:17 pm
+1 to the like comment idea.
I chose 5. Google, Twitter, Facebook all have promoted material. The social media generation is used to this popping on their scroll. And why shouldn’t Capt. Fax make more money? Maybe he’ll reduce the subscription fee? Also, will be interesting for Rich to see who is paying to promote comments.
Comment by Stand & Deliver Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:18 pm
I vote 4. Give it a shot. If you feel it undermines the quality of the dialogue/drives people away because they have a hard time following a conversation, then turn it off.
On a related note, I just filed the paperwork for my Comments For A Strong America PAC.
Comment by Montrose Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:18 pm
Colin, what media sources do you consume now that don’t have paid content?
Comment by Wordslinger Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:18 pm
Go for it. just keep RNUG’s comments at or near the top.
Comment by SaxMan Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:21 pm
===But should I have to read past “paid content”===
You already do. For instance, today: https://capitolfax.com/2015/09/29/illinois-credit-unions-%E2%80%93-a-smarter-choice-5/
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:23 pm
Voted 1. I would hate to see multi-posts for photo captions go away because the poster is charged.
Comment by Bogey Golfer Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:23 pm
Word, in my opinion, “commenters” are not media sources. Rich already has paid threads, without comments I might add, and banner ads on the sides.
I like how it is now in which Rich asks us our opinions in a thread, on the topics at hand and we respond, sometimes forcefully, sometimes with snark, but usually from the heart, not the pocketbook.
Comment by Colin O'Scopey Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:24 pm
I like the idea of comments promotion, paid or otherwise. Selfishly, I would like to see comments promoted how it is on Reddit. But, you’re a businessman who has created a top-notch product and you deserve to earn to its potential. Doesn’t sound like this promotion program would drastically change your blog…and if somehow it did, you can always revert back to the way it was.
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:25 pm
Yeah dude. Do it. I just timed how long it takes to scroll three comments. Not long. I don’t see myself doing it, but if others want to pay to promote their opinions, go for it.
It’ll be clear what comments are promoted.
Comment by LizPhairTax Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:26 pm
Agree with those who are concerned about interfering with the chronology of comments. I think it would get especially jumbled with a post that has multiple updates. Seems like it would be difficult to follow the arguments.
Also agree that special interests could take over the discussion.
How ’bout a bake sale or a car wash instead?
Comment by And I Approved This Message Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:26 pm
I think my only worry would be the potentially chilling effect on the meaningful commentary we see today. IE why bother commenting if labor, biz, IPI, etc will be spending so much promoting comments that I could essentially be buried. That’s one of the best parts of Capfax - the quietest (and often most insightful) voices are still encouraged and heard.
Comment by Juan MacLean Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:30 pm
I think if Rich does this (and clearly it’s his business to do so), having paid comments might attract a discourse that isn’t here now. It could alter the tone and direction of this site irreparably.
Comment by Colin O'Scopey Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:31 pm
Manipulating commentary, at a price, is the same as advertising someone’s views. Apart from that, some of your comments are spontaneous, in reaction to the comments of others. That might diminish as comments are increasingly directed to the straw man at the top of the heap. Nah, leave opinion (and news) manipulation to the editors.
Comment by Keyser Soze Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:31 pm
Losing the chronological order would be a big negative. Folks who read every day may respond by ignoring the top 3. And [snark] then there’s the issue of how wealthy certain occasional commenters (Arizona comes to mind…) are!
Comment by The Historian Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:32 pm
5 Will the outbid move down or back?
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:33 pm
If you do this, it could bankrupt O.W
Comment by Anon III Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:34 pm
I would imagine that politicians with a budget could hijack the conversation quite nicely.
Comment by Aldyth Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:34 pm
I’m in the “your circus, your monkeys” camp.
Comment by thunderspirit Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:35 pm
I assume the Cable Association and the Satellite providers could purchase Rich a new car every year if they had to bid for comment space!
Comment by Colin O'Scopey Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:36 pm
The Citizens United world. Everyone has free speech, it’s just that those who can afford to have better free speech.
Comment by BeenThereB4 Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:40 pm
Voted for it! Why shoudln’t CapFax be “Pay to Play” like the rest of the state?
Comment by Really? Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:40 pm
I wish I could elevate my comment in this thread, since I believe I have an unassailable point of view, but then sadly, I’m out of RaunerBucks, which, by the way, I nominate as the name for the points system, if it is allocated.
Comment by PublicServant Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:43 pm
As somebody who uses this website for his primary source for news, and gets it for free, I’m all for anything to help Rich make more money off of this.
Go for it.
And now back to the most important matter of the day — Arsenal and Olympiacos in the Champions League.
Comment by Gooner Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:44 pm
“Just FYI, if I do this I will likely ask for a much more generous split from the company.”
I was thinking that, as well. Especially since they are going to leverage your site to get more customers.
One other thing to consider is how this will affect your editorial decision making. For example, if there is erroneous information in a paid comment, will you correct it? Or will you treat it like an ad?
Comment by quicknote Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:47 pm
Hey Rich:
Have you pondered using a Disqus-like system that allows for threaded comments? Sometimes one has to scroll through to find discussion threads. I am not saying Disqus is the best system. I am just wondering if it would be suitable for you. Would this new proposed commentary software allow for threaded discussions? Like buttons would be nice too. Hope you are feeling better.
Comment by Scamp640 Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:48 pm
I worry the proceeds will pay for some nice meals each month but not so much more. On the other hand, there is a big upside in the sale of the site some day. Then the site will be valued by the number and growth of your users. Don’t want to do anything to mess up the free-flowing commentary that is a huge compliment to your excellent reporting.
When the time is right, Capitalfax would be a natural for a national news site looking to bulk up on a popular perspective on local, insider news. Think how prominent columnists drive traffic at those sites.
National advertisers often want scale north of a million impressions before they place an ad. A large site could bring advertisers and revenue that CapitalFax is too small to access on its own.
Think how prominent columnists drive traffic at those sites.
National advertisers often want scale north of a million impressions before they place an ad. A large site could bring advertisers and revenue that CapitalFax is too small to access on its own.
Comment by Lurking MBA Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:50 pm
My concerns: maintaining chronology of comments; how much their system “manages” comments (specifically: how do they know if a comment is “relevant to the story”?)
Comment by Pot calling kettle Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:52 pm
Horrible idea plus I’m not sure “bidding” works. Say you post a story at 8am and JohnQPublic, Sally Smith, and Pat Quinn buy ads by 10am. Then I come along at noon and want to outbid them all. Do I now get a spot and if so, does Pat Quinn get a refund. He’s been top three for a few hours until he’s outbid.
I truly don’t think that many people will pay so I don’t think that the revenue is substantial.
Comment by 4 percent Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:54 pm
Eww… if wanted to read that I’d subscribe to the Tribune.
Comment by James Knell Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:54 pm
Better bones for Oscar, gets my vote.
May be hard to manage with lengthy posts and trolls.
Suggest you keep the timestamps with promoted posts double posted.
You already pull particularly good comments into the initial narrative. Really appreciate the work you do.
Comment by Last Bull Moose Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:55 pm
I went with number 2 since obviously you’ve already thought about it.
In reality it doesn’t matter one way or another to me. My posts aren’t noteworthy and wouldn’t ever use the service.
Comment by Mouthy Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:55 pm
As a paid member, I vote no. You could set it up a program yourself by charging $1 per comment & cut out the company who would otherwise take money away from your company. Can that company use your articles or people’s comments for their own profit?
Comment by Mama Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 12:57 pm
Ok with it as long as you also give us an edit button and like/dislike. I figure some commenters will make up in quantity what they don’t have in positioning, anyway.
Comment by Six Degrees of Separation Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:00 pm
Mrs. Miller votes 5, she wants Rich to earn more money for Christmas shopping.
This comment is sponsored by the Retirees are People Too Association. It does not necessarily represent the views of the Association.
Comment by Norseman Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:00 pm
3. Sounds obnoxious, but I can always just skip the first three comments.
Comment by Excessively Rabid Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:01 pm
P.S. Open a webstore and sell Capitol Fax t-shirts and coffee mugs. I bet that works out better for you. Also, install a “toilet button” where superpacs can flush their money directly to your favorite causes without you ever knowing it, lol.
Comment by James Knell Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:01 pm
E bay for blogging, not a fan. What’s next, buying nicknames?
Comment by pool boy Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:06 pm
Interesting concept, however I would like to see subscribers and registered (of course meaning adding a registration system) user have a base number of “points” per month for which they can use to offer a differing view to the promoted comments if desired. Personally I don’t take much stock in someone’s statements that they have to pay to promote, however I can see this being a useful tool for special interests with small pockets being able to reach the “powers that be” within the state.
Comment by Jon Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:07 pm
Doesn’t matter to me. I will still go straight to comments from Oswego Willie, Wordslinger and MisterJayEm
Comment by Concerned Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:07 pm
Voted 1 because I feel like comment threads should be about what people are saying and not become bidding wars to fight for exposure, but some of the commenters on the 4-5 side made good arguments. I’m now more like a 2 or 3 on the idea.
If you do this, don’t move the promoted comments to the top, COPY them at the top instead. That way someone who skips the promoted comments and starts reading from the first down will still see them, and no one will get confused.
Comment by lollinois Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:08 pm
I’m neutral on it. I think the unfolding conversation here works well as it is. I’d rather see a likes-type system that would let the community determine relevance or quality.
Comment by fisher Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:08 pm
=== E bay for blogging, not a fan. What’s next, buying nicknames? ===
I’ve got dibs on Rauner is a Grass Bowl.
Comment by Norseman Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:08 pm
Voted “1″ but after reading the comments, I think the Other Anonymous - @ 11:54 am had a proposal that would answer my concerns about special interest dollars vs. the free exchange of ideas: “I strongly think that promoted comments should not be anonymous so that we can judge the bias or interest behind it, if any. Regular comments should continue to be anonymous, if it all feasible.”
If you ID’d the paid commenters and time-stamped the promoted comments, my vote changes from “1″ to “5.” It would bring you some revenue, and I think with those modifications you could maintain the high standards of public service you offer now with the comments on CapFax.
Comment by olddog Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:08 pm
I’m Chairman of the company launching “promoted comments”. Love the passionate discourse!
The promoted comments is only the top 3 and then below that is a typical discussion experience. Our commenting engine is very advanced and people can look at comments in any view they like. They can read them chronologically or we have up votes/down votes. The entire discussion system is heavily reputation based which we’ve found encourages polite and productive interaction.
Rich will have just about every feature to turn off/on at his discretion.
Comment by Michael Robertson Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:09 pm
I support both the like button and pay-to-have-higher-comments feature. If you get tired of it, just scroll through the top section of the page. Only downside would be if advertisers try to take over the section. Wouldn’t it be awesome to watch different interest group reps duke it out (and pay for it) in the comment section about some of the issues here?
PS: Rich - I’m also in California. I don’t think we have a west-coast Rich Miller equivalent out here that runs a blog like this. Do you know of any?
Comment by NixonHead Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:11 pm
Adds: I didn’t see lollinois @ 1:08 pm till now, but I like his/her idea: “If you do this, don’t move the promoted comments to the top, COPY them at the top instead.” It would serve the same purpose as my suggestion.
Comment by olddog Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:12 pm
=== Michael Robertson - Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:09 pm:
I’m Chairman of the company launching “promoted comments”. Love the passionate discourse!====
The real passion will begin when the fee negotiation starts! lol
Comment by A guy Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:17 pm
voted 1. The chronology is really so much of the ambiance in the room.
“It favors trolls with money and time.”
(Honeybear@11:57) BOOM.
Maybe to increase cash flow, have three classes of CF participants.
Subscribers
Supporters ($150ish? No Subscriber benefits)
Other
I would participate at a “Supporter” level.
Comment by cdog Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:18 pm
@ Michael Robertson: Will the comments reside on your servers or Rich’s. Will he continue to use his current blog installation? Just curious. Thanks!
Comment by Cheswick Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:18 pm
Yikes!, change is difficult. Now I know why Madigan and Cullerton are so upset!
Comment by Blue dog dem Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:19 pm
Well, was reading too fast and missed the “only the top 3″ point. If that’s the case - then whatever. My only request would be - can the comment marketplace be kept open after happy hour?
Comment by Juan MacLean Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:20 pm
== PS: Rich - I’m also in California. I don’t think we have a west-coast Rich Miller equivalent out here that runs a blog like this. Do you know of any? ==
There is only one Rich Miller, fortunately for us and unfortunately for every other state in the union.
Comment by Cheswick Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:21 pm
I voted 5, but that’s me and not Rich. If it’s in Rich’s best economic interest to have paid comments, then I certainly approve.
I don’t like the idea of organizations and individuals paying to push their viewpoints in the comments section, in this age of Citizens United, and in this age in which a political party is virtually owned by RGU (Rauner, Griffin, Uihlein). If it benefits Rich, then I support it.
Comment by Grandson of Man Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:32 pm
Does he have a copyright on this? Can’t an intern set this up? I don’t really care one way or another, but it doesn’t sound like a “new” product. I think winning a caption contest or horseshoe should be worth a couple points if you go down this road.
Comment by ? Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:34 pm
5 from me. Kind of interesting to see who or if anyone has the motivation to spend money to get to the top of the list of comments. We might learn about those who have a need to preen.
Comment by Plutocrat03 Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:36 pm
I say make the change, primarily so that the site can incorporate “nested” comments. i.e. the ability for responses and banter between a subset of commenters can be followed within its own thread. It makes for a much more meaningful experience both in terms of reading and commenting.
Comment by ILPundit Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:38 pm
Sorry if this was already covered and I missed it above…
Does this commenting platform require a facebook, google, etc login that identifies the person by name?
Many new comment platforms require this to preserve decorum and impose accountability on the commenter. But Rich gets comments from lobbyists, state employees, legislators, (and guys like me who don’t fall into any of these) because they can use monikers. That is a disaster on other sites, but here it works because of community self-policing and Rich’s diligence (which I’m sure is burdensome).
Comment by Jimmy CrackCorn Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:44 pm
I voted 1, but after reading the comments I may be softening.
I think the comment sections here are a huge reason to read the blog, and I’d think carefully about adjusting it. I would think especially carefully about a change that would likely put strident/overly-biased comments as the most visible and most likely to set the tone for the debate.
Comment by Century Club Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:45 pm
I’m guessing that the “top 3″ will be direct answers to the original post and won’t smash up the “flow” of the conversation. If the paid posters have to honestly say who they represent, I don’t have a problem with it.
The other thing: Will people pay for something that doesn’t have an edit button attached?
Comment by Timmeh Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:48 pm
Do something like a Youtube thumbs up thumbs down and rank them by that.
Comment by Come on man! Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:49 pm
Rich. You have often cited the commenters in the most positive of terms. Tossing up this question, and the corresponding opinions, shows how you know your peeps. I’m sure there are sides to the question that you hadn’t thought of…a good businessmans move. Hopefully the plethora of replies all help you decide. Against. Ha
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:55 pm
I voted 1 because I didn’t want to have public opinion sold to the highest bidder, and we all know bidders at both ends of the political spectrum that would play that game endlessly. I also understand the business principle that makes this attractive. So, the question for me really comes down whether the active discourse by a wide array of commenters is most important or the profit end, and its a question that only you can answer.
Comment by Commonsense in Illinois Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 1:59 pm
I want for you to earn what you are worth here. I consider my small contribution to Capitolfax unworthy most of the time.
Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:01 pm
WOW Rich, it looks like California & maybe other states needs Miller’s capitol news & blog. Maybe you should think about branching out to other states to make more money.
Comment by Mama Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:08 pm
I also voted 1. Rightly or wrongly, I see it as a parallel to our electoral system, where how much money your campaign has is as (or more) important than the message. (And for the record, I’m painting with a broad brush, and not singling out any particular politician.)
Comment by Skeptic Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:10 pm
So we would have pay-to-play - or pay-to-say - on the board? No thanks.
Comment by Team Sleep Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:19 pm
I’m sorry I made a mistake. I voted a 1 and not a 5. That was my intent, to strongly disagree. This is a business, and I support what benefits Rich the most. If I could change my vote, it would be lower than a 1.
Comment by Grandson of Man Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:19 pm
I realize this board is stretching it to be called a ‘democracy’ but this just smacks a little too much of ‘buy your vote’. I admire your work, Rich and I actually do read the ‘paid for’ posts but I would say walk away from this one. It smells funny.
Comment by Not quite a majority Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:20 pm
I voted 3, since I don’t care one way or the other, but I wouldn’t mind the ability to vote on comments.
Comment by Precinct Captain Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:24 pm
I add to the requests for a like button. There are really clever and funny people who comment, and I just want them to feel the love
Comment by Miss Marie Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:29 pm
I voted 5 for the following reasons.
1) This blog is a valuable asset. New revenue will help keep the blog free.
2) Only those who want to pay for a promoted post will have to pay. It won’t make no nevermind to nobody else.
3) Only the top three posts are affected. Fourth is the new first? Meh. We can adjust.
4) The new comment system would come with more tools and I trust Rich’s ability to implement them.
5) Rich has shown a willingness to completely abandon an experiment if it isn’t working. That makes giving it a try much less risky.
6) Does anyone remember who made the first three comments on this post and what they said? Me neither.
– MrJM
Comment by @MisterJayEm Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 2:45 pm
The ability to block posters would be nice. Some people like the repetitive schtick and that could stay for those who want it but for those who would like to skip past it and get to useful new info an ignore feature would be helpful.
Comment by That Guy Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:12 pm
California certainly has no shortage of content.
Comment by NixonHead Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:13 pm
“Does anyone remember who made the first three comments on this post and what they said? Me neither.” Too True.
I originally voted a 1, but have now moved up to 3/4, based on other comments, including all 6 of MrJM’s.
Comment by L.A. Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:14 pm
how about pay for a spell checker
paying to chat/comment will go over like news print….
Comment by Ghost Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:15 pm
I think a followup question should be: How many of you would actually pay to have your comments moved up to the top?
And if so, why? And if not, is it because you wouldn’t want to spend the money - or because you would be embarrassed to show that you have paid to have your comment moved up? I’m guessing the former, because most people posting here don’t seem easily embarrassed.
If not very many of us would pay, this may not be much of a money maker?
Comment by Joe M Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:20 pm
I already “control+F” to my favorite commenters, a pay to comment scheme wouldn’t change that. But it would be rather interesting to see who pays to say what.
Comment by Lowly Scrivner Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:42 pm
Who don’t like to have the last word?
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:44 pm
MP3.com died a horrible death. Just sayin’. Alannis Morrissette tried to finance a tour with that stock. I believe she called it “toilet paper” by her third tour date.
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:49 pm
There’s nothing wrong with this. If some firm wants to pay to get in your top 3 comments, let them. Everyone’s voice still gets to be in thread.
Comment by Tom B. Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:54 pm
Do it. It is your site, and a good chance for you to make a few extra dollars. As he says, it doesn’t eliminate free commentary, just put the top 3 at the top. Who cares? I can skip those three and scroll down. Takes no more time than usual. I don’t see a downside. What’s the worst than can happen? No one uses it? So what? It costs you nothing as far as I can tell.
Comment by Altois Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 3:54 pm
I say go for it. You deserve to earn as much as you can off this site. Have you ever poked around on Get Off My Internets? Alice has a THIS and a NOPE button for each comment which I like.
Comment by Rayne Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 4:02 pm
A few answers to questions:
1) Comments are owned by Capitolfax.com although they would reside our servers. This is called SAAS - software as a service. It’s pretty much how the internet works nowadays. Our comment engine is already in use on hundreds of sites although the promoted comments is not launching until mid-October.
2) Login rules (like most every option of the system) are dictated by Rich. He can require logging in or allow anonymous posts. It’s his choice.
Comment by Michael Robertson Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 4:03 pm
143 comments on this thread.
OK, now I want to promote mine!
(Actually, still keeping to my original thoughts: small d-democracy on the comments is a good thing. But allowing promoted comments won’t stop me from reading.)
Comment by the Other Anonymous Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 4:14 pm
Please, don’t do it. I like your current comments system because it’s democratic. Once you start introducing money into the situation it will be corrupted. Readers will begin to associate the comments at the top with the most importance. And that’s really the whole point of paid speech isn’t it? The ones with the most money speak the loudest.
Comment by D. Schwarz Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 4:20 pm
I say go for it. Especially if it’ll keep the worse comments away.
Comment by Levois Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 4:29 pm
Voted no way. Part of the joy of reading the comments is the continuity of related comments. Whomever can yell the loudest has little place in this forum.
Comment by papa2008 Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 4:40 pm
Yikes. If you’re going to move forward with this, you better have Lou Lang count the votes. /s.
BTW, the change looks harmless.
Comment by A guy Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 4:47 pm
nice revenue stream for you. i doubt most people would even notice (search engines have been doing this for awhile and nobody has abandoned them). go for it!
Comment by bored now Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 4:56 pm
I voted 5 so people who pay will have a more prominent voice. Much like how corporations are entitled to free speech, the loudest voice has the most bucks behind it.
Comment by PENSIONS ARE OFF LIMITS Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 5:05 pm
It is useful to follow the comments in chronological order.
Comment by Yossarian Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 6:00 pm
Rich - this is your blog and you have every right to change it as you might see fit, and I am not about to suggest what you should do,
I like things as they are and hope that the same access will continue to be available to all commenters as we have it now.
Regardless of your decision ( and your commenters have spoken ) this will still be the one and only source for my information and intelligent discussion about Illinois politics.
Please never dilute the quality and diversity of the discussions posted on this site. Even though we ( or many of us ) may not comment on every topic that does not mean that we have not read and considered the quality of the discussion.
Thus site is a treasure.
Comment by illini Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 6:01 pm
If “sock puppetry” is avoided, and the promoters of promoted comments are clearly identified, then no harm done.
This is a case of distrusting the idea in most hands, but Rich would handle any changes well.
Just a note — good on the entrepreneur for finding and selling to this opportunity, but don’t assume their aren’t potential options available in the marketplace.
The alternative idea of ordering by most popular comment would degrade the quality of the blog. Often the unusual, unpopular, or least expected comments are the most valuable.
Comment by walker Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 6:23 pm
How much to keep my comment where it is but use a cooler font?
Comment by LizPhairTax Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 6:48 pm
Rich, you are already somewhat doing this in your advertisements.
Comment by Soccertease Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 9:08 pm
If nothing else, it will be fun to see who thinks they are especially clever to the point of paying to point it out…
Comment by ArchPundit Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 9:16 pm
Can one still get admonished, deleted, or given the dreaded “bite me”?
Comment by A Citizen Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 10:06 pm
Got to admit, I voted 1. Not a big fan of the idea, but might be more interested in it if paid commenters are identified, with a HUGE disclaimer that they have paid for their position. Might even be funny if Rich could identify their IP addresses.
If you go with this, Rich, I would prefer to keep my name, and the anonymous handle I use a few times a year here. The problem with Disqus, when you tried to use it, was that I lost my name and had to try to remember a new name and a password. (So, yeah, to a certain extent I’m a huge stick in the mud who hates change, and I was happy to see you flip back to this format after you tried a few changes a few years ago.)
Don’t know if any of this helps…
Comment by Lynn S, Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 10:36 pm
5, Rich. Change will be interesting and you are in control of the blog and all elements. Keep a copy of this topic line and all the posters, it will be fun in retrospect. Best wishes! I do worry about ow going broke, but it is voluntary.
Comment by A Citizen Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:25 pm
Those with money always find a way to get their voice heard above all others. Might as well let them do it here too.
Comment by Whatever Tuesday, Sep 29, 15 @ 11:26 pm
I didn’t vote because I have mixed feelings about the whole concept. Probably better than a lot here, I understand some of the issues. Not too long after I started seriously commenting here, I had an email discussion with Rich about what did and did not seem to work at that time in terms of monetizing a website.
Personally, I like it the way it is and would prefer it not change, but I could live with sometime else IF it did not lose the open exchange of ideas.
Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Sep 30, 15 @ 12:04 am
My two cents:
I can’t imagine paying a dime into this system. But I think it’s an interesting, painless experiment that can net you some dollars.
Why not? Try it.
Comment by Yobogoya Wednesday, Sep 30, 15 @ 12:26 am
I voted 5.
There are folks who will happily pay to have their comments featured. I think that’s a very tempting way to ‘tax’ the folks that comment on your blog with a political agenda. Other advertisers have the decency to pay — might as well let the folks posting comments have that opportunity too.
Besides, knowing this group there will be someone that is more than happy to pay to feature a decent comment.
Comment by TaxesBuyCivilization Wednesday, Sep 30, 15 @ 4:36 am
I was a 1 because (1) I am an old curmudgeon who hates change, (2) I like the way the blog functions as a meritocracy and (3) your financials are none of my business so I don’t know how important it is to you.
Comment by SAP Wednesday, Sep 30, 15 @ 9:13 am
Get paid!
Comments are sorted by timing rather than quality right now anyway, and readers will adjust almost immediately to scrolling past ads in the top 3 slots. This won’t negatively impact readers in the least.
Comment by Anonymous Thursday, Oct 1, 15 @ 8:01 am