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“It’s the worst situation I can remember in the 50 years I’ve been around state government by far,” said former governor Jim Edgar, a Republican who served two terms in the 1990s. “Every day we go without a budget it gets much worse. It does permanent damage.”
…Adding… More…
Former Gov. Jim Edgar: A #stopgap measure is the "worst kind of budget you can have" #twill #The21stShow pic.twitter.com/Esxe2grTJG
— The 21st (@21stShow) May 31, 2016
*** UPDATE *** More from that Public Radio interview…
On whether voters understand the hardship resulting from the budget standoff
Oh, no, I don’t (think they understand). I think a lot of people haven’t been affected yet. Many have, and many are coming more and more to realize. But if you shut the schools down, you’d have a budget resolved in a matter of days. If you didn’t have any state workers, I think that’d put a lot of pressure on. A lot of state services are still being provided. A lot of people who don’t rely on specific grants from the state, I don’t think yet have felt it. They just think these guys are down there fighting and “why don’t they resolve it?” If you’re in education, particularly higher education; if you’re in social services; if you’re; in any program that relies on state funding, you know it. But there’s a lot of people who haven’t yet felt that.
I think more and more every day are, but still I don’t think there’s enough outcry to get this thing resolved. And that’ll have an impact. If the schools didn’t open … in the middle of August, I think by the end of August you’d have a budget. I think then you would have enough pressure that everybody would have to back off a little bit and find some compromise.
posted by Rich Miller
Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:43 pm
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I’m a Jim Edgar Republican, a Jim Thompson Republican, and neither took it upon themselves to hold a state hostage to leverage anything they already knew they couldn’t get 60… and couldn’t get 30.
Rauner destroying Illinois is like taking out his anger that he can’t destroy Labor.
Governors look out for the people of their state, not put the people in a state of dire consequences.
Period.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:47 pm
True Dat!
Comment by Norseman Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:47 pm
Strong words from a very good Governor.
Comment by Anon Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:48 pm
Exactly that, Willy.
Comment by PublicServant Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:49 pm
Gov. Ryan knew how to count noses, work with Pate and the Gorillas, but never put the state of Illinois in peril at the cost of anything Ryan felt needed to be forced upon this state.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:50 pm
To Raunerites, Edgar is a bogeyman they attack to distract from Rauner’s failed policies. To those who care about governing, Edgar is an asset.
Comment by Norseman Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:52 pm
Politics (whether it is work-politics or gov’t-politics) is not supposed to be personal. How often do you hear “don’t take it personally, it’s just politics.’
This is clearly a personal agenda. We don’t know if it was personal from the get-go or has become personal but it’s time to settle this and sing-off on a budget. It’s not going to feel good to either side which makes it the perfect time.
Comment by Belle Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:53 pm
Governing is a little harder than opining at Chicago social events for the rich and powerful.
Comment by Liberty Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:53 pm
OW - nail on the head. Man, to what depths we’ve fallen in the past couple decades
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:54 pm
Where does all this leave social services? Current situation is not only destroying state it’s destroying actual people in need of help.
Comment by Kfc Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:54 pm
oopps
SIGN off not sing off. Maybe some singing would do the trick?
Comment by Belle Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:55 pm
If Gov Edgar had held out we wouldn’t be in this position today. Sometimes you must hold out for what is moral. Passing on the massive debt to another generation is not moral.
Comment by Hickory Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 12:59 pm
Far better to push of any sort of economic reforms or fiscal responsibility to the next generation. Kick the can, Edgar and Daley style, right?
Just modify the pension =ramp=, reduce our payments under Rauner to elevate them for the Governors who follow, and bingo. Instant balanced budget, a la Edgar.
smh.
Comment by Formerly Known As... Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:01 pm
=If Gov Edgar had held out we wouldn’t be in this position today. Sometimes you must hold out for what is moral. Passing on the massive debt to another generation is not moral.=
Ok, I’ll bite, exactly what are we holding out for?
Comment by pundent Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:04 pm
This the same Jim Edgar that set the timer on the Edgar-Dillard pension ramp time bomb?
Make no mistake, Edgar set in motion the train wreck that is happening today, not Rauner.
Comment by The Reality Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:05 pm
“Every day we go without a budget it gets much worse. It does permanent damage.”
Well DUH…
Comment by Mama Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:06 pm
Edgar was the king of kicking the can down the road. Had he raised taxes instead of going his ramp we wouldn’t be in the mess we are in. He should remain silent
Comment by Sue Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:07 pm
“Rauner destroying Illinois is like taking out his anger that he can’t destroy Labor.”
Its good to know Rauner can not destroy Labor.
Comment by Mama Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:09 pm
Every single time someone chooses a side of Rauner over Edgar I’m reminded I’m a Republican and not a Raunerite.
There’s a big difference. One is Edgar cared for this state, Rauner cares for an ambiguous agenda.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:09 pm
To echo some of the above comments, has Jim Edgar ever apologized for his (critical) role in creating this public pension nightmare?
Has any journalist ever asked him whether he takes responsibility for his share of the blame?
Comment by gopower Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:18 pm
==Ok, I’ll bite, exactly what are we holding out for?==
How about the first balanced budget in four years, for starters?
Comment by Formerly Known As... Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:19 pm
===his (critical) role in creating this public pension nightmare?===
Passed both chambers (one GOP controlled). Everybody knew or should’ve known what was in the bill. When the ramp started increasing, they all ran away screaming and made the problem much worse.
So… meh. They had time to prepare and didn’t. Some of us suggested a more gradual phase-in and nobody listened. Instead, they skipped and skimped payments.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:21 pm
I guess he’s choosing when he’s “being around” or not. What’s uglier? What got us here or where we are?
Comment by A guy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:22 pm
===How about the first balanced budget in four years, for starters?===
lol
From everything I’ve seen, that isn’t an immediate priority. They want the TA. A truly balanced budget can wait for the “growth” to kick in.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:23 pm
Willie: I once heard someone ask Gov. Thompson if Gov Rauner had ever called him for advice. His answer was “Um, No”. The next question was: “What advice would you have given him if he had?” His response: “Don’t pick fights with people you’re going to need.”
Comment by Way Way Down Here Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:24 pm
- Way Way Down Here -
Great comment because it’s great perspective.
Funny how advice like that seems to carry over far beyond single snap-shot moments.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:27 pm
Its good to know Rauner can not destroy Labor.
I don’t think he can even destroy afscme. He could’ve if he played nice with Madigan and passed a budget with no poison pills for the rest of labor. Not so anymore. It’s now Rauner against the rest of Illinois. His arrogance has backed him into a corner. He needs to make me one of his highly paid super stars so I can tell him this lol
Comment by DHSJim Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:28 pm
==A truly balanced budget can wait for the “growth” to kick in.==
Beautiful.
Now we can add to the $140 Bill we already owe, in a bipartisan manner of course. /s Ugh.
Comment by Formerly Known As... Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:29 pm
===Passed both chambers (one GOP controlled). Everybody knew or should’ve known what was in the bill. When the ramp started increasing, they all ran away screaming and made the problem much worse.===
Thanks Rich for dropping some historical perspective.
Great stuff.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:31 pm
=How about the first balanced budget in four years, for starters?=
So I’ll put you down for a tax increase. Not exactly going out on a limb there seeing that you can’t fund things without one. I am however still waiting for Rauner to deliver on his promise that we could run state government without one.
Comment by pundent Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:46 pm
As Crain’s says
=Edgar set a goal of having the systems 90 percent funded by 2045. For the plan’s first 15 years, payment levels were set artificially low - effectively shorting the pension systems each year - and then ramped up significantly in later years. This allowed politicians to comply with the required payments at the start while hoping that future leaders would find billions of dollars down the road.
Now, with the systems still less than 43 percent funded, the state faces a crippling drain on its budget. In 1996, as the ramp required, only $614 million went to the pension systems. The amount due in the state’s 2016-17 budget year: a staggering $7.6 billion. That accounts for roughly 1 out of every 4 dollars in the state’s general fund, a trend that will continue for the next three decades.=
Comment by Formerly Known As... Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:03 pm
I’m no fan of Rauner but I have no idea how Edgar has the ego to go to the media and talk about the permanent damage to the state. His pension ramp has led us to this cliff. He needs to stop getting a pass by the Central IL media that adores him for the pure fact he’s a central IL Republican.
Comment by Almost the Weekend Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:07 pm
==So I’ll put you down for a tax increase.==
Please do. And I’ll put you down for some basic reform comrpomises that have been mentioned here many times. Not exactly going out on a limb there seeing you can’t turn around the direction of this state’s economy and debt crisis without them. I am, however, still waiting for Madigan to pass any meaningful compromise, alternative, or reforms other than saying NO to everything and everyone else, including Senate Dems.
Comment by Formerly Known As... Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:08 pm
At the time of the last constitutional convention the pensions were funded at about the same percent as they are today. So Rdgar started the problem huh?
Comment by steve schnorf Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:10 pm
==The amount due in the state’s 2016-17 budget year: a staggering $7.6 billion.==
Coincidentally, that is almost exactly the amount of the $7.5 Bill imbalance in Speaker Madigan’s =money tree budget=.
Astounding how much easier it is to balance a budget when you don’t make full pension contributions, isn’t it?
Comment by Formerly Known As... Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:15 pm
Different times, dynamics, issues and personalities. Not to mention the money involved.
My awareness of Illinois politics goes back to when Paul Simon was a very young member of the GA - my parents were close friends with him since he was a teen. I had college friends who worked for both Thompson and Edgar, and a cousin who had a special assignment with both administrations.
That being said, and I guess that makes me fairly old, I have to admit that I did not fully begin to understand the personalities and the complex problems my state has to address.
Thank you Rich for this site. Since I found this blog quite a few years ago, it continues to educate and inform me in ways that my local papers never could.
Comment by illini Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:19 pm
Some very good responses here today. It’s been mentioned here many times that with each passing month of a budget impasse the fix becomes more costly and the health of the state worsens. It’s clear that the ideologue Governor cares more about ending the Union presence in the state than he does improving the health of the state.
BTW, that was a great quote from Jim Thompson, “why pick fights with those you are going to need”. Just a huge strategic blunder right out of the gate by the Administration.
Comment by The Dude Abides Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:27 pm
If magically Edgar was the Governor tomorrow, I wonder how long it would take to have a budget?
Comment by Saluki Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:40 pm
@FKA
With all your calls for reform, tax hikes, and Madigan bashing, you must be Pat Quinn’s absolutely biggest fan! LOL.
Comment by Ducky LaMoore Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:41 pm
The Edgar Ramp…the governor got legislation passed to address a problem, legislation that had real, actual numbers attached, and signed it. Agree or disagree, he got something done and something specific. He didn’t say all sorts of things to distract from a problem while intentionally making things worse.
Comment by Earnest Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:55 pm
“If the schools didn’t open … in the middle of August, I think by the end of August you’d have a budget. I think then you would have enough pressure that everybody would have to back off a little bit and find some compromise.” There in lies the rub.
Comment by burbanite Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:58 pm
—At the time of the last constitutional convention the pensions were funded at about the same percent as they are today. So Rdgar started the problem huh?—
I don’t think Edgar started the fire, to quote Billy Joel, but I don’t think the pension ramp was effective at putting out the fire either.
I think history has shown that the ramp created an environment that is allowing the pension payment to balloon. Edgar didn’t cause a recession, skip payments, give raises, or create the great recession after he left, but the ramp was a lot more rampy because of those things.
Comment by A Modest Proposal Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 3:12 pm
OW@1:09. I have come to agree with you about half the time. The Edgar thing, not so much. Edgar’s actions speak louder than his words. Past and present.between his pension, and now his salary through the UofI, aggravates most Illinois residents to no end.
Comment by Blue dog dem Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 3:21 pm
As someone who was around at the time, and who saw a lot of number-crunching on alternative ramp scenarios, Rich is absolutely right that “everybody knew….”
Many forget that the late Dawn Clark Netsch first floated the ramp idea, not Jim Edgar.
Many also forget, as Rich writes, that the Blago/Filan $2 billion cut from pension funding along with extending the ramp another 7 years added billions upon billions to the unfunded liability.
Very few clean hands under the dome on this one.
Comment by Arthur Andersen Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 3:36 pm
Personally, I’m tired of Edgar drive-by commenting about Illinois & our problems. I think everyone knows that Springfield is a dumpster fire right now & real people are hurting. However, Edgar helped put us on this path & to give his 2 cents now is a bit disingenuous, not to mention stating the obvious. I believe Edgar should bite his tongue similar to how many former Presidents largely refrain from commenting on the current administration or current policies. Exactly what did Edgar say that will help the process? Nothing. But he got his name in the headlines again.
Comment by LGHB Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 4:13 pm
@DLM - except for Quinn’s borrowing to make pension payments, willingness to sign out of balance budgets, failure to efficiently manage or reform major state agencies, and Squeezy.
Quinn could have been good. He lost his way.
Comment by Formerly Known As... Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 4:26 pm
-If you didn’t have any state workers, I think that’d put a lot of pressure on-
I’d hate to see it but you may see this come about if the Labor Board comes back in Rauner’s corner and forces an AFSCME strike.
Comment by Bulldog58 Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 4:36 pm
Neither the gov nor the Labor Board can force AFSCME to strike. Only AFSCME’s members can do that
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 4:47 pm
Neither the gov nor the Labor Board can force AFSCME to strike.
ummm you keep telling yourself that. I think a declaration of “impasse” by the ILRB thus forcing us to accept Rauners Last best final offer would pretty much force us to strike. And yes it would be our choice but we could not accept his last best and final. It would destroy us.
Comment by Honeybear Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 4:58 pm
Maybe Edgar wants to throw his hat in the ring for old times sake?
Comment by burbanite Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 5:30 pm
I am a Republican and Jim Edgar is one of the reason we are in this mess. Remember when he was Governor Mike Madigan and Jim Edgar a long with unions agreed to lowered pension payments into the system in the early years and accounting trickery to balance the budget. Pushing payments back to later years. That is one of the reason we are in this mess.
Comment by Dandy Edward Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 5:44 pm
- Oswego Willy - Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 1:09 pm:
“There’s a big difference. One is Edgar cared for this state…”
EXACTLY!
Comment by Jimmy H Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 5:52 pm
See how governors own, FKA? Your blaming Edgar proves that much. Everyone was on board with the ramp including one GOP-controlled legislative branch. You obviously disagree with the ramp, but Edgar was a leader, achieved consensus, and brought people together just like our political process is supposed to work. Rauner is no leader. He’s just a selfish rich guy who could and did buy the governorship, and the republican legislators in order to attempt to enact his extreme agenda of destroying unions. The rest of Illinois be d@mned. No, he’s no Jim Edgar. He’s nothing but an all or nothing ideologue.
Comment by PublicServant Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 5:57 pm
- Saluki - Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 2:40 pm:
“If magically Edgar was the Governor tomorrow, I wonder how long it would take to have a budget?”
Tomorrow!
When I’m stuck with a day that’s grey and lonely
I just stick up my chin and grin and say, oh
The sun will come out tomorrow
So you gotta hang on
’til tomorrow, come what may!
Tomorrow, tomorrow, I love ya, tomorrow
You’re only a day away!
When I’m stuck with a day that’s grey and lonely
I just stick up my chin and grin and say oh
The sun will come out tomorrow
So you got to hang on ’til tomorrow, come what may!
Tomorrow, tomorrow, I love you tomorrow
You’re only a day away
Tomorrow, tomorrow I love ya tomorrow
You’re only a day away …
-Charles Strouse and Martin Charnin
Comment by Jimmy H Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 5:59 pm
Dandy Edward, yes Edgar owns a piece of this problem, but study your history on the numbers. The 1994 “Edgar ramp” pension law increased pension contributions from previous years’ levels, provided continuing approp authority, and a predictable, albeit insufficient, funding schedule. Yes, it was backloaded, and everyone who supported it and/or cast a vote on it was fully briefed in writing, in advance.
Comment by Arthur Andersen Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 6:04 pm
==I’m a Jim Edgar Republican==
I saw this written recently, and although it was in regards to national politics, I thought of you.
“It’s time for actual Democrats, who are most comfortable with Democrats, and feel the most affinity for Democrats, to make their party allegiance official and simply…join the Democratic Party.” [Source: Ace of Spades blog]
Comment by Lomez Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 6:34 pm
Dandy, remember Moynihan. When one’s opinion is founded on untrue “facts”, one’s opinion is worthless
Comment by steve schnorf Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 7:05 pm
Edgar is an elder statesman now but to me he was only a so-so governor. It’s hard to remember significant accomplishments of his term. Some on his team were very professional, but shouldn’t that always be the case? Are our standards so low that mere competence seems remarkable now?
Comment by DuPage Dave Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 7:28 pm
Oh - Lomez -
Making it about me never works.
I’m a Republican, not a Raunerite. We exist. It’s not up for discussion or debate. I’m a Republican of the Jim Edgar mold.
It’s fun that you think of me, warped as it is… lol
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 7:29 pm
==I’m a Republican of the Jim Edgar mold==
Right. One whose idea of a bigger tent means pulling in Democrats and pushing out conservatives. One whose idea of successful governing is opting for illusory stability over mustering the courage to wage the nasty fight that has been needed for decades.
All I am suggesting is that if a Democrat fancies himself a Republican because he is 10% less Democrat-y than Democrats, perhaps it’s time to make the switch. An honest re-aligning would be good for everyone.
Comment by Lomez Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 8:18 pm
- Lomez -
Nah.
===One whose idea of a bigger tent means pulling in Democrats and pushing out conservatives.===
I remember the time of a great majority GOP Caucus of Maureen Murphy and Mark Beaubien.
I bet you don’t even know who they are, LOL
I’m good. You can troll someone else now. I’m a Republican. Too bad.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 8:28 pm
Beaubien is one of your top 2 examples to combat the notion that you’ve unpegged the tent and carried it 100 miles to the left?
IL Republican: social progressive who is still waiting for the right moment to ask — politely — if the Democrats might be willing to have a discussion on our fiscal situation.
Of the same mold, certainly. Mold indeed.
Comment by Lomez Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 8:58 pm
- Lomez -
Ya skipped over Maureen Murphy.
I’m sure that was an oversight, lol
Your anger isn’t compelling.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 9:03 pm
Mr. lomez, I hope you don’t consider this current governor a Republican or a conservative. No true republican would defy capitalism and tilt the economic playing field through tax incentives for a select few.lower taxes for all or stay the heck out of the way. You see us true constitutionalists can’t find that anywhere written by our founding fathers(mothers).
Comment by blue dog dem Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 9:15 pm
==Ya skipped over Maureen Murphy.==
I found it odd you would mention her given the recent edict on whether or not one represents a “stain”.
I was raised not to cause embarrassment for people, so I didn’t raise it.
Comment by Lomez Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 9:31 pm
Aw - Lomez -…
You just called her one… on your own…
I never did.
Funny how words work.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 9:36 pm
==No true republican would defy capitalism==
Huh? Are you talking about Amazon? Also I think your understanding of federalism is um…reversed.
It seems like a somewhat simple decision, assuming you have confidence in the numbers. First, is the economic impact of Amazon greater than the $2 million perpetuity in tax breaks. You’d then want to run that against whatever the BATNA was here, which I do not know.
Am I being outflanked by someone to my right now as well?
Comment by Lomez Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 9:42 pm
==You see us true constitutionalists can’t find that anywhere written by our founding fathers(mothers).==
Fathers. They were all men. It’s OK to say it.
Also — and I’m not sure whether I’m being trolled by someone to my right — but States generally have powers (such as tax breaks) that were not reserved to the federal government. See 10A.
I’m definitely being trolled.
Comment by Lomez Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 9:52 pm