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You may have seen this news story…
Classes at a Metro East elementary school resumed Tuesday as investigators tried to pinpoint why an 84-year-old woman drove her car through a cafeteria wall the previous day, killing an 8-year-old student and injuring two others.
The mother of the little boy was understandably distraught and angry, sending the driver this note that was made public by Ryan Wesling’s survivors.
“I pray every day that you remain on this planet you see my son when you close your eyes,” Amanda Wesling wrote, adding that she hoped an Illinois law someday would bar seniors from driving once they reach a certain age.
And now she’s calling for action.
“We very much support a mandatory limit on the driving age for seniors,” Amanda Wesling wrote in a missive directed at driver Grace Keim, who authorities say was en route to a driving class at a senior citizen’s center Monday when she struck and killed 8-year-old Ryan Wesling.
Here are some recent incidents cited by that AP report.
–In November, an 89-year-old man whose car hurtled through a farmers market in California in 2003, killing 10 people and injuring more than 70 others, received five years of probation because a judge deemed him too ill to go to prison.
–Last August, a sport utility vehicle driven by an 89-year-old man plowed into pedestrians and vendors at an open-air public market in Rochester, N.Y., injuring him and 10 other people. Police say the man’s foot slipped off the brake pedal and hit the accelerator.
–In October 2005 in North Dakota, an 87-year-old woman on her way to a doctor appointment smashed her car into the hospital’s lobby, injuring five women. She was not charged.
According to the AP, two dozen states require seniors to jump through certain hoops to keep their licenses. Illinois requires road tests after age 75.
Democratic Illinois state Rep. Kurt Granberg says setting an age for drivers to hand over their keys wouldn’t be appropriate because “everyone’s different.” But Granberg says he wouldn’t be surprised if Ryan’s death prods lawmakers to revisit the state’s requirements for older drivers, perhaps asking the secretary of state’s office for its input.
Thoughts? And let’s try to have some empathy for all sides, please.
posted by Rich Miller
Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 8:50 am
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85 seems to be to be a reasonable limit. Another limit, in addition, would be if you can’t see over the steering wheel. Granted, some age better than others but overall if you reach the ripe old age of 85, and you are still driving, you should have the presence of mind and experience to know that you pose a potential threat to yourself and others when you drive. In the least, require the oldster to be accompanied by a much younger driver.
Comment by Justice Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:03 am
Yes everybody’s different . . . however, a driver’s license is a privilege and not a right. We already place greater restrictions on those individuals just learning how to drive. Why?
Because studies have shown that that sector of the population has a hire proclivity to be involved in accidents.
I would imagine that studies do (or will) show the same for persons reaching an age of ____ and older.
Accordingly, why not have additional requirements or screenings every year rather than every 4-5 years.
One final note: My grandmother recently passed . . . my father had a hell of time getting her to give up the keys because I think she knew that once she did that, her days of individual independence were over. She shouldn’t have been driving, but the State of Illinois continued to authorize it.
Comment by Sporty41 Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:07 am
Doggone it - 85 is OK. If you can see how my grandmother and her boyfriend drive, you would not only take away their keys, you’d crush their cars before they do. It is freaking insane to allow these two on the road. No one has been able to talk them out of it, and they keep passing the driver’s exams in Florida. So, not only are they a danger in St. Petersburg, they are a danger when they return to Chicago. You should see what they do to their cars - they have so many dents and scratches, their Toyota and Honda look like large raisins on wheels.
Get these people off the road. We can’t do it. Make it a law. I’d love to see them no longer driving if they live to 85.
Thats long enough!
Comment by VanillaMan Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:13 am
Just as there are some dangerous teenage drivers (which our legislators have no problem focusing new laws upon all teens), there are some seniors who are just as big a risk and should not be behind the wheel. The difference is that as time goes on, the teen will become a better driver with experience. The senior will just become an even bigger risk. Oh, and legislators are afraid of the seniors.
I don’t know if there should be a mandatory age where we take away their licenses, but I do believe that we should start requiring testing ever two years at age 60 and annually at age 70. And perhaps nighttime driving restrictions at a certain age. And automatic license revocation if caught driving more than 15 MPH under the speed limit on a busy expressway or if they cannot see over the steering wheel.
Comment by Bluefish Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:18 am
Accidents happen. Seniors need to get out and buy groceries, attennd church functions, doctor visits, etc. Most seniors 80+ still drive because they have active lives. My mother
Comment by Mr. Ethics Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:19 am
Sorry for a double post. To finish the thought - We already have laws that seniors pass a road test every two years I believe after age 80. My mother just passed at age 85 and was renewed for two years. If there was a problem, then it is with the SOS testers who keep passing them, or maybe they actually still can drive.
Comment by Mr. Ethics Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:25 am
Maybe seniors would be more willing to give up the keys if there were better alternatives such as low-cost, easily accessed and frequent transportation services for seniors. This probably isn’t an issue for really wealthy seniors–they can hire drivers. But for those who not wealthy yet actually are trying to live independently and have to get to the dr, the grocery, etc., the loss of driving privileges is a huge blow.
Anyway, seniors vote, so I really doubt that legislation curbing their driving age is going anywhere. Persuasion and cheap individualized alternatives is the way to go.
Comment by Cassandra Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:28 am
Bottom line: Seniors vote, teens don’t (or can’t)
If there was a million-member strong AATP (American Association of Teenage People) turning out the vote every election, 13 year olds would be behind the wheel if they wanted it.
Comment by Frank Booth Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:33 am
Consider what the marketplace does.
Rightly or wrongly, rental car agencies simply don’t do business with people under age 21. And if you’re under 25, you pay extra fees and have restrictions on the types of cars you can rent.
Anecdotally, I’m now hearing that some car companies have stopped renting altogether to people over age 65. How ’bout THEM apples?
And there’s also automobile insurance to consider. If you’re a new or young driver, you pay a higher premium, right? (And does one pay more with advancing age? I don’t know.)
Age restrictions are arbitrary — but we have them anyway. Age of majority: 18. Period. No alcohol sales to under-21s. Sorry. Retire as a police officer/firefighter/airline pilot at age sixty-ish. Tough toodies.
The marketplace DOES bracket age with respect to driving. It’s time for public policy to follow.
In short: up the start age for driving to 18, and set the stop age at 70. And throw in some hardship waivers based on testing.
Comment by Dooley Dudright Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 9:38 am
This is my favorite part:
“Democratic Illinois state Rep. Kurt Granberg says setting an age for drivers to hand over their keys wouldn’t be appropriate because “everyone’s different.—
Now I skipped the comments to post this so I hope it hasn’t been brought up already. We have a lawmaker immediately saying that all old people shouldn’t be restricted. But young people, thats a different story. Lets just yank licenses from all of them. It’s such a double standard. If an old person does something totally stupid, its just one bad apples, but if a teen does something stupid then all teens aren’t mature enough to drive.
Comment by Robbie Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 10:02 am
I attempted to yank my 85 years old aunts driver license because she could no longer drive safely - believe me. She had a drivers renewal test coming up so we agreed to let her take the driving exam. The driver examiner passed her. I was so outraged I confronted the examiner demanding to know how he could let her drive. His comment to me was I swear “Jessie doesn’t want us to take licenses away from seniors”. I sold her car to keep her from driving. I guess its all about votes not safety.
Comment by JW Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 10:13 am
The greiving mother’s proposal is an emotional response to the tragedy she just faced.
Needless to say, emotionalism is the absolute worst basis for any type of government action. And rushing into something makes it even worse.
All sides need a cooling off period. Then adhere to a deliberative process.
Comment by MJ Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 10:23 am
Spend a couple of weeks driving around in Florida and you will have lfew qualms with a reasonable age limit on senior driving. The time to do it is now before the baby boomers get old.
Comment by Jake from Elwood Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 10:58 am
None of this stuff is easy. I have several 80 year uncles who are sharp mentally and physically (hope that gene was passed along). One of them runs 10Ks regularly. Took my dad’s keys away at 85 as he drifted into Alzheimers. Got two 40 year old neighbors with 3-4 DUIs and two accidents each. No jail and both still drink/drive. Each case has to be individualized with real tests by the drivers license people. I agree with Cassandra about the need for convenitnet mass trans. Easy in urban areas, non existent in many rural areas and small towns.
Comment by zatoichi Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 11:10 am
MJ - I agree that it is smart not to allow emotion to cause overreaction. But I can safely say myself with no emotional scarring that old people need stricter driving rules. Maybe we should restrict the passengers in their cars, not allow them to drive at night, and force them to continually take classes about driving. Wait, those are the proposals for teens, why would we ever want to apply the law to others?
Zat - I do agree there are terrible drivers of all ages. Maybe they should just look into testing all drivers every few years. Because the goal should be safer roads, and that means getting rid of dangerous drivers of all ages, whether they are reckless teens, drunk middle aged people, or senile old people.
Comment by Robbie Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 11:20 am
My in-laws are 85 years old and in excellent physical and mental health. They play golf, cards, go to movies, dining out, shopping etc. It would be ridiculous to take away their driving privileges (yes, I agree a privilege, not a right) because of their age. I understand the parents’ grief but hope legislators don’t pass more laws based on emotion.
Comment by serendipity Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 12:20 pm
One thing teen drivers DO have in common that senior drivers do not, which may justify treating teens in a blanket fashion is INEXPERIENCE. I do think that seniors should be tested very frequently, however, as their mental and physical conditions can deteriorate rapidly between testing periods.
Comment by Ron Burgundy Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 1:24 pm
How many lawmakers will advocate for tougher testing and/or age limits on drivers licenses? Those on this thread who mentioned that old bugaboo, “seniors vote” said all there is to know about legislating age requirements. However, one thing in this story is rarely mentioned…
The school wall was made of synthetic stucco and drywall. That’s it. That car went through it like it was paper. Were there no building standards when that addition was put on?
The driver is at fault, but it would not have come to the tragedy it did had it not been for drywall and synthetic stucco. I just don’t understand how they got those plans approved.
Comment by diane Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 1:44 pm
dear ron, how can one ever get experience if we don’t let them drive? how does one get experience driving at night if we don’t let them drive? how does one get experience with others in the car if we don’t let them drive with others in the car?
Your right, teens don’t have experience. But that is not always a bad thing. Young drivers that haven’t been driving a long time can be more cautious because of their inexperience. Young drivers often pay more attention to their surroundings because they haven’t been driving for as long. Have you ever been thinking real hard about something while driving and realized you weren’t really paying attention? I have had it happen to me when driving roads that I regularly drive. But when I was 16 I could barely take my concentration off the road long enough to turn on the heater. But I guess thats a distraction too. *NEW LAW* no heaters or air conditioners for teen drivers because they cause a distraction. The discrimination against young drivers by some of you commenters makes me want to puke.
Diane - good point about the building. Though not the cause, its something that should be looked at.
Comment by Robbie Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 3:02 pm
From personal experience here - my mom in her early 70s gave up her license after heart surgery and a series of strokes (we were very thankful). She knew she wouldn’t be able to drive again at full capacity. Dad still drives, but knows his time is limited and dwindling due to medical issues, but he takes his test like he’s supposed to and has the dr. okay him also.
However, I have an aunt, on moms side, who has Alzheimers, and her dr. didn’t tell her not too drive! He said just to drive where she’s always driven. And she got lost, more than once. Her kids won’t step up and take her keys away. Scares the heck out of me to think some day she could drive off and end up dead somewhere or killing someone else.
The younger ones in my family seem to have their acts together for driving and the extra time they’ve had to drive behind the wheel has helped that. Much more experience than I had to have.
Comment by Tessa Friday, Feb 2, 07 @ 4:09 pm