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* From Sunday…
“Today we talked about the budget for 14 minutes,” Madigan said, and then actually provided the tick-tock. “From 10:16 to 10:20 and from 11:15 to 11:25 we talked about the budget.” The meeting ended at about 11:38 or so.
* This is a big reason why it only lasted 14 minutes. The Republicans unexpectedly turned the table on the Democrats…
However, Radogno argued that the brevity of discussion was by state Democrats’ design.
“Today we said, ‘OK, what are your ideas on the budget?’ ” Radogno said. “[Madigan] had Greg Harris there — his appointed spokesman — unprepared to talk about the budget.”
* Rep. Harris had kind of a lame excuse…
Rep. Greg Harris, D-Chicago, countered that unknowns in the future of the state’s economic situation needed to be “accurately accounted for” before a substantive discussion could take place. […]
Harris argued lawmakers have a number of questions to answer before substantive progress can be made. Among them, Illinois’ new road lockbox amendment, which requires all transportation related fees and taxes be used exclusively for transportation-related expenses. Harris also referenced the incoming Trump administration and looming questions regarding block grants for Medicaid.
“These will have profound implications on our state budget-making,” Harris said.
No doubt those will have profound implications, but Trump won’t even be inaugurated until after the second half of the stopgap starts. And he has to pass a whole lot of bills for whatever he wants to do. Illinois can’t wait to deal with the rest of this fiscal year while DC sorts itself out. Leave that talk to next fiscal year.
So, maybe by tomorrow, when the leaders meet again, the Democrats can walk in with a plan.
posted by Rich Miller
Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:49 am
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Great point, Rich. The Democrats can make a solid case that we should be focusing on spending and revenue, because that truly is the ballgame. But they can’t do that if they don’t have their own ideas on spending and revenue.
Comment by South of Sherman Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:54 am
Lame excuse. Has the State ever not passed a budget while it waits for a new President to take office? Ridiculous.
Comment by Not It Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:56 am
==before a substantive discussion could take place.==
So they want to talk about the budget but not substantively. Haven’t they been doing that for two years now? Wonder when they intend on having a substantive conversation?
Comment by Demoralized Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:56 am
Rauner asked for the tax rate to be cut back. They need to talk about that the next time they are asked about their plans. “The incoming Governor said that he could manage a budget at a rate of 3.75 and we are waiting for him to either tell us how he intends to do that or to tell us what he wants the new rate to be.”
Comment by Anonymous Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:56 am
This has a distinct smell of a reform revival, 14 minutes of budget talk? Stalling till I get my reforms, good grief
Comment by Rabid Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:57 am
No one wants to say “tax hike” first, when those words will be in a political ad 25 minutes after the end of the meeting. A lack of trust keeps any solutions from occurring.
Comment by Simple Simon Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:57 am
–countered that unknowns in the future of the state’s economic situation needed to be “accurately accounted for” before a substantive discussion could take place.–
That’s what studies and projections are for. You can’t just sit and do nothing and wait for these things to happen first. At some point you have to make an educated guess.
Comment by Ron Burgundy Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:58 am
The states that expanded Medicare are in for a rueful awakening when the aged scut back on paying for it. Madigan is going to find out that running a big blue state is a lot less fun
Comment by Sue Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:59 am
To the Post,
Rauner “won” again.
I personally have nominated Rep. Harris for Golden Horseshoes because he understands and understood the wonkish stylings and the political realities few, even today, don’t fully grasp.
The absolute obvious play with Harris in there was…
“What about funding agencies? What is the cost? What is the way you see a budget looking if you got whatever?”
The play always was…
“The Governor talks about these needs for a budget, and when you ask him what that budget look likes, Bruce Rauner has no answers.”
To the Rauner pivot…
“Yeah, they asked. What was confusing is asking what we want, given if the Governor gets what he wants, the budget then works. That’s not our plan, so how can we even know how it all fits without the Governor’s budget, cuts and revenue included?”
Ugh! (Face Palm)
Harris walked into the “what’s your plan” when the reality is Harris “had” them with…
“When you get these reforms, what does this do for your budget?”
And…
“What governor fights for reforms to help make a budget better, with no budget showing the better… in the budget?”
The Dems lost the day by forgetting fundamentals.
That’s exactly how Rauner wins. Every day.
Comment by Oswego Willy Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:59 am
Medicaid. Sorry
Comment by Sue Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 9:59 am
Permanent campaign from both sides instead of solutions for making the state work.
Rauner started this mess, but Dems hoping elections will bail them out is getting tiring.
Be smarter.
Comment by Blue Bayou Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:00 am
Exactly right, Sue.
When the GOP wrecks healthcare and people are without coverage, states like IL are going to be hard to manage by those who believe in government’s role in providing a safety net.
Comment by Blue Bayou Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:02 am
More than lame on Madigan and Harris’ part, actually. Pretty embarrassing.
The “ideas” the Dems present, if any, may prove instructive. Because it appears at this juncture, from afar, that Madigan has no interest in getting anything done and instead wants to bring State government to as much of a stand-still as possible. Incredibly, I don’t think Rauner has much of a problem with that … their only “agreement” is a tacit one neither will admit they want and agree to?
These guys both think the other will wear the jacket of blame with voters and apparently are willing to bet the State’s future on it. That more than sucks, by the way, because those two can pick up and leave anytime should they wish.
Comment by Deft Wing Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:07 am
Mr. Willy,
You are, of course, correct on the politics of the situation. And, you are further correct that politics is the only way this is going to get done. Someone has to lose, and someone has to win. If there was a middle ground, it would have been found by now.
I’m not naive, I understand the dynamics here. Normally, I’d relish in the big political fight. I’d love the moves, and counter moves and bask in the great game.
Those days are over. It’s no longer a game. Whether one thinks that government should be smaller and taxes should be lower, or they think that government is the solution to all the worlds problems, this “stalemate” is hurting our state. I am no longer amused by the gamesmanship. Who “won” or “lost” the day is irrelevant. There are no winners anymore. This is WW I trench warfare. The war to end all wars and the casualties keep piling up.
I just don’t have the patience for this game any longer.
Comment by Try-4-Truth Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:12 am
Or……maybe the Governor could walk in there with a plan. He is, you know, the Governor, after all.
Comment by Michael Westen Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:19 am
Rauner and Madigan in unison: “I’m right, you’re wrong!”. A long, pitiful, power/ego-based selfishness story that continues to drag us along with it thru the muck.
Comment by Anonymous Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:19 am
All rhetoric aside Mr. Harris is right and I stated my thoughts in support of his missives last week. It is entirely possible that ACA and Medicaid funding will be ratcheted down substantially for the next federal fiscal year. However the federal fiscal year starts three months after ours - and that is assuming that the House and Senate can agree to full year budgets for every agency and program - so we at least need a budget to carry us through the summer. I will not be holding my breath.
Comment by Team Sleep Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:21 am
If all five of the leadership group were to miraculously disappear, Illinois would be a better place.
Comment by oldman Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:23 am
If both parties spent the time on figuring out what a budget should look like rather than trying to make sure the other party gets blamed, we would have had a budget already. They need to identify core services the State can’t do without and figure out what that will cost. If there is any money left over, then add other services until there is either no money left or they are willing to raise the tax rate to pay for it.
Comment by ANONIME Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:23 am
Shut it down Mendoza. Then these jokers will get off their backsides and do something.
Comment by Chucktownian Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:34 am
Blue- I guess that’s because the ACA works so well
Comment by Sue Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:37 am
Oldman - while that might be a bit much I do somewhat agree with you in regards to the concept of delegates hammering out a deal or framework of a deal. I truly believe that the working groups might have come up with something - anything! - until they pretty much disbanded. When leadership that is so entrenched and unwavering in their ideas refuse to budge then maybe surrogates are the best idea going forward.
Comment by Team Sleep Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:45 am
While I understand when the federal budget ends, human service providers are greatly worried how any repeal or changes to the ACA and Medicaid expansion will impact state budgets.
Many states under both GOP and Dem govs have built their current budgets and human service systems around the ACA and Medicaid expansions. Changes could, and will blow holes in a lot state budgets.
Comment by Give Me A Break Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:46 am
I honestly don’t understand why Rauner isn’t forced to account for the fact that he’s in violation of the IL constitution’s clear requirement that the gov submit a balanced budget. 2 years now in violation.
Rauner will never get serious as long as he sees outlets like the Tribune will let him get away with anything.
Comment by GOPgal Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:52 am
Oh goody, more spin from the Illinois GOP about the minutiae of inertia.
Comment by hisgirlfriday Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:57 am
Sue, what do you think is going to work better?
Facts are hard, I know.
Comment by Blue Bayou Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:58 am
So, Harris is the chief budget negotiator for Madigan, and he has no clue what the lockbox amendment means? It’s only been on the ballot since the summer. Guess they didn’t have enough time to figure it out. Here’s a hint: transportation revenues go only to transportation purposes. Talk about a lame excuse for the Democrats to stall.
Comment by phocion Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 11:14 am
Ugh. Someone needs to remind the Governor AND the GA that dinner is over and the check is 13 Billion.
Bruce has to start with his constitutionally mandated “ask”, the GA counters with their “offer”, then Bruce “counters” until he eventually signs. No amount of websites, editorials, or press ops change how things are done.
Comment by Jocko Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 11:28 am
Harris and Madigan’s positions are ridiculous. As are Durkin’s and Radogno’s and Rauner’s.
It’s just a big game of chicken on who puts a number on a tax increase first.
There are always going to be “unknowns” going forward, and adjustments will always have to be made.
But FY17 is a train-wreck through no help of anyone outside of Springfield. It’s all on the governor and the GA.
Get your own house in order.
Comment by wordslinger Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 11:33 am
== It’s just a big game of chicken on who puts a number on a tax increase first. ==
and this
== [M]ore spin from the Illinois GOP about the minutiae of inertia. ==
Comment by Hamlet's Ghost Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 11:41 am
Radagno continues to fiddle while Illinois burns.
Comment by Anonymous Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 11:42 am
And the Governor wins again. The correct answer was, “We in the House passed our ideas last spring. Which ones did you not like?”
Comment by Whatever Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 11:47 am
WTH… Why can’t both sides put forth their version of a balanced budget and then everyone at least has something to discuss. So far nobody has anything to even argue about!
Comment by Anon Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 12:18 pm
Madigan should show his hand. He should simply lay out the votes on the various scenarios. For example, there are probably 50 or fewer Democratic votes for bringing the tax rate back to 5%, fewer than forty to hike it above that. There might be 25-30 votes for W/C reforms, but they’d need to see the bill first to give a better estimate. There are zero votes for term limits because that bill WILL NEVER BE CALLED so please stop asking.
P.S.: Happy New Year Governor. Good luck keeping the lights on.
Comment by 47th Ward Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 12:31 pm
- Try-4-Truth -
I hear ya. And thanks for seeing and understanding, as I know you do, the political and the governing within the political.
I really try not to dismiss the real (zero snark) anger and frustration many, me included, feel. I can sympathize and empathize with your last sentence, and while my patience is waning, it’s not ok my control to move the WWI mentality, even as I see it clearly happening before me.
For you, - Try-4-Truth -, me, and the state, I wish it would end. But, seeing what I see, it’s not me pushing the continuation, it’s actually forcing one or both in a corner to get to the end game.
With great respect, and thanks.
Comment by Oswego Willy Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 12:36 pm
wordslinger beat me to the “game of chicken” on who proposes first a tax hike number comment.
So little trust on both sides. And both eager to blame the other politically for proposing a tax hike, as we saw last week.
It’d be nice if they could agree on a tax hike “trigger” that would automatically happen only if enough spending cuts aren’t agreed upon by a certain date (knowing full well that they won’t agree upon enough spending cuts).
I’m not optimistic. Is anyone?
Comment by Robert the Bruce Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 12:45 pm
Turns out, there is video of the weekend negotiations:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnTmBjk-M0c
Comment by 47th Ward Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 1:12 pm
At least ACA pays its medical providers unlike the state.
Comment by Honeybear Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 1:16 pm
Honey Bear- that’s true but the ACA is the driving force behind this past years explosion of the deficit. One thing about Obama- he had no apprehension about spending our money
Comment by Sue Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 2:54 pm
Well, I guess they haven’t taken two years to negotiate the shape of the table as others did in 1972 in Paris… All in all, an up day.
Comment by Commonsense in Illinois Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 2:56 pm
We all know Madigans most important constituency is organized labor. The unions flood the Dems with campaign cash and in return Madigan protects their interests while the Stats and us taxpayers suffer the consequences. Anyone who argues with this fact is either one of the beneficiaries or totally in denial. As long as Madigan is Speaker there will be neither a balanced budget or any reform.
Comment by Sue Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 3:21 pm
@Sue, how can Illinois have a balanced budget when Rauner refuses to propose one?
Comment by Illinois O'Malley Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 3:31 pm
I’m Malley-Illinois has not had a truly balanced budget considering pension costs in the 40 years I have lived here. If Madigan agrees to a handful of Reforms- Rauner will agree to Revenue. Absent Madigan agreeing- we won’t hzve a deal until 2019
Comment by Sue Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 3:37 pm
–As long as Madigan is Speaker there will be neither a balanced budget or any reform.–
How’d the backlog in bills get cut by $5.6 billion while making full pension payments during the Quinn years? Green Stamps?
Comment by wordslinger Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 3:40 pm
===If Madigan agrees to a handful of Reforms- Rauner will agree to Revenue.===
Except it doesn’t work that way. Reforms are optional, revenue isn’t. And if we have to wait until 2019, so be it. Let Governor Rauner run on his accomplishments: $20 billion in debt, no reforms, and tens of thousands of Illinoisans worse off because of his intransigence.
Comment by 47th Ward Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 3:44 pm
Greg is wonkish and that is why he has been valued through the years in different jobs. but he’s often very biting personally and I don’t value that in negotiations. I’m still not getting why he is in there.
Comment by Amalia Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 3:47 pm
@Sue, stop deflecting, where is Rauner’s balanced budget?
Comment by Illinois O'Malley@ Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 3:50 pm
Reforms are optional
Do you really think reforming Illinois is optional?
Just raise taxes Springfield and call it a day.
Most sensible Democrats believe reforms are essential for Illinois to grow. The Speaker is resisting.
Comment by Lucky Pierre Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 4:22 pm
===Just raise taxes Springfield and call it a day.===
LP, that’s the sort of intentional misreading of my comment that prevents a decent discussion of what’s wrong with Illinois. And it isn’t just infecting state government.
Since Rauner arrived on the scene, all of the new commenters here have brought the same tactics to the debate that Rauner has gotten away with in the news media. It’s turning Cap Fax into a fact-free zone. Not only are the Raunerites never wrong, they aren’t persuadable and they never concede a point, not matter how many times they get schooled. And I think Rauner must pay a bonus to his commenters that get the last word in. For some of the Regular Raunerites, it is pathological.
Sad.
Comment by 47th Ward Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 4:31 pm
47th Ward, I am sure you find the commenters here who defend the Democratic legislature inaction day after day to the same “pathological”standard.
Everyone should be criticizing their failed legislative sessions where they can’t even agree between their supermajority chambers what they should do. Only 50 Democratic votes in the House for the tax increase? What about the other 20 who voted for the 7 billion in deficit spending?
Yet somehow Governor Rauner and his supporters are always wrong.
No movement in the bipartisan working groups until after the election. Veto session come and gone, no fixes to Illinois problems. Now we are told to wait until we find out what President Trump’s admimistration means for Illinois.
Any discusssion of term limits is out of bounds because the legislative leaders who have been in Springfield for over 40 years are irreplaceable and have done such a fine job.
Maybe you can enlighten us when these reforms you believe are necessary will be proposed by the Democrats.
Almost two years in, no movement at all towards compromise. According to you any criticism of this dysfunction is”fact free”. Sad
Comment by Lucky Pierre Monday, Dec 5, 16 @ 10:21 pm
Sad.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Dec 6, 16 @ 7:44 am
I thought that is why Harris was brought in. MJM has said for 2 years, and I agree, that the number one problem facing the state of Illinois is the budget. Ok, when the budget comes up lets be ready!
Comment by facts are stubborn things Tuesday, Dec 6, 16 @ 8:19 am