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* From Rep. Jonathan Carroll…
Due to the unintended divisive nature of HB4259, I’ve decided not to pursue this legislation. Based on feedback and further reflection, we need to heal as a country and work together on common-sense solutions to put the pandemic behind us. Since taking office, I’ve always tried to have civil discourse with those who’ve disagreed with me. However, violent threats made against me, my family and my staff are reprehensible. I hope we can return to a more positive discourse on public health, especially when it comes to this pandemic that has tired us all.
Carroll said they received “several” threats. As we have discussed before, the bill would’ve violated federal law.
…Adding… Rep. Carroll is saying now that he didn’t intend to be divisive, but here’s what he told the Sun-Times…
(I)t all boils down to frustration between those who have “been following the science and … trying to do the right thing” and those who are “choosing not to get vaccinated, who are able to, for whatever they choose.”
“I think it’s time that we say ‘You choose not to get vaccinated, then you’re also going to assume the risk that if you do catch COVID, and you get sick, the responsibility is on you,’” Carroll said.
posted by Rich Miller
Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:08 pm
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I’ve heard more racial and homophobic slurs in the last 72 hours than I have in the entire rest of my life combined. Our voicemails are vitriolic, but I have to check them for casework. This whole episode has left my faith in humanity pretty shaken, truth be told.
Comment by Carroll staffer Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:13 pm
We need to work on common sense solutions, while sponsoring legislation that violates federal law. No comment, just stating the facts.
Comment by Almost the Weekend Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:16 pm
When you rush to the front of the line for a press pop and not fully research the issue. …
Comment by Wow Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:21 pm
He got what he wanted National press and now he will get National press because he is withdrawing because of threats.
Comment by DuPage Saint Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:25 pm
Let’s be real, he pulled the bill because it was needlessly cruel and divisive in its nature. I’m sure when he offered the bill he did it with a cute little smirk, I’m gonna make those republicans pay for their sins of not being vaccinated.
And undoubtedly the cruel realization was probably brought to him that there are significant minority populations, who choose not to be vaccinated, and would be hurt the hardest with legislation like this.
Let this serve as a lesson. Bills entered to spite a population will never serve as good policy. Do better Rep. Carroll. Please do better
Comment by MaddyMoon Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:26 pm
It is awful that people need to make violent threats against any public official for proposing legislation. It shouldn’t happen and would be nice if the police could track some of these people down and charge them with something.
The proposed legislation was a terrible idea, though. Even if it didn’t violate federal law, it would be a very slippery slope down the path to things like overweight people not being covered for diabetes or heart disease since they could have eaten less or worked out several hours a day.
Comment by Benniefly2 Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:27 pm
How can you propose legislation that violates federal law and claim not to be divisive?
Comment by Pundent Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:28 pm
=However, violent threats made against me, my family and my staff are reprehensible.=
Most schools have experienced the same thing. These people are absolute cowards and afraid of what America really represents. They name themselves in jingoistic terms yet are completely totalitarian in their actions by using mob tactics to squelch other speech or intimidate.
The last two years have revealed the lack of character on the part of our society.
Comment by JS Mill Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:30 pm
health insurers already have ability to have higher premiums on smokers than non-smokers, same can be done with COVID for those who do not vaccinate. Perfectly legal under any federal law
Comment by truthteller Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:36 pm
I’m not troubled the bill is being canned, it’s a bad idea and legally deficient. What does bothering me are the threats if true.
Comment by Norseman Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:37 pm
==I’ve always tried to have civil discourse with those who’ve disagreed with me.==
He’s giving Pinocchio a run for his money with this line. When it came to the Bears in Arlington Heights, bozo Carroll said anyone who was against it is “incompetent.” Sounds like the only incompetent one is sitting in his chair, using his voice, and filing bills in his name.
https://repjonathancarroll.com/october-21-monthly-email-update/
Comment by Shield Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:38 pm
“bother”
Comment by Norseman Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:38 pm
Well as he hopes for more positive discourse on public health. Mr. I just picked up another $100K Tom DeVore filed a lawsuit on behalf of teachers against 22 school districts. Of course he had his normal spot on WMAY this morning to explain how the Governor’s mandates are taking away their livelihoods and he won’t stand for it. As he’s cashing their checks to pay his fee. Let that sink in.
Then he went on a rant about the Governor. He really dislikes the Governor.
Comment by Club J Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:40 pm
Federal law matters… violent threats have become the new norm… and we’ve become something I don’t recognize. Will the days of caring for your neighbor, where truth matters, and standing for what’s right .come back?
Comment by Lincoln Lad Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:43 pm
So phone and email threats are all it takes now to defeat a bill? Not trying to make light of the situation, but how are you ever going to get anything important done? This is the legislative version of negotiating with terrorists. Anything that is the least bit controversial, all the trump people have to do now is leave threatening messages because they know you’ll fold.
Comment by Lester Holt’s Mustache Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:47 pm
===Anything that is the least bit controversial, all the trump people have to do now===
Stop. This is a press pop bill, not a real bill. You don’t risk anyone’s safety over a bill like that.
Comment by Rich Miller Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:50 pm
We are in so serious of an event that you will be threatened to keep yourself protected.
Comment by Real Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:52 pm
@Lester Holt’s
I wish Rich let us post screenshots here. This wasn’t just threats. They were posting photos of his kids, home address, it was truly terrible stuff. Fortunately twitter was pretty quick to remove those after we reported them. This wasn’t a pushover move. Go check our facebook post on it, people are saying that they threats were justified.
Comment by Carroll Staffer Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 1:52 pm
@Benniefly2
The proposal itself was a threat.
Comment by Real Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:01 pm
I hope all threats are turned over to the FBI and pressure is put on the Biden administration to investigate. I don’t care about the particulars of the bill we have got to normalize as a society that threats of violence against democratically elected representatives or their staff are always, always wrong and that perpetrators are always tracked down and charged.
Comment by cermak_rd Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:05 pm
Carroll Staffer, I feel lousy for you and your cohorts being subjected to threats and doxxing. But you need to talk to your boss about why he would introduce this bill in clear violation of federal law, knowing what the reaction would be. In other words, here’s that attention he ordered.
Also, congratulations to Rep. Carroll for further convincing the Trumpers and nutters that these tactics work and should be repeated.
Comment by Roadrager Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:07 pm
Some of you disturb me just as much as those making threats. Was it a bad bill? Yep. But that in no way justifies the calls. So stop trying to defend those.
Comment by Demoralized Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:07 pm
===because it was needlessly cruel===
Was it? Illegal, yes, but not needless or cruel at all. Those are adjectives for the willfully unvaccinated, who want the right to infect me and mine to make a political statement.
Comment by Jibba Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:07 pm
===So stop trying to defend those===
Nobody that I’ve seen has done this.
Comment by Rich Miller Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:16 pm
Threats are stupid and very unproductive.
This bill was studid and very unproductive.
Stupid is as stupid does.
Comment by A Guy Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:20 pm
“ The proposal itself was a threat.”
Like charging higher insurance rates for smokers is a threat?
Comment by VerySmallRocks Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:25 pm
Honestly, this is a financial burden that 35%-40% of our population is choosing to place on all of us.
If they are free to choose to avoid the vaccine, why are all of us paying for their $500,000 hospital stay through insurance and/or public funds?
It’s not a pre-existing condition. It’s anti-scientific nonsense. Where do they all go when they get Covid and it’s really bad? The hospital. Because they have science and scientists there. So let’s follow the science ahead of time, too.
This bill may not be the right way to do this, but I am fully supportive of people taking financial responsibility for their actions.
Comment by Pappy Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:28 pm
-Like charging higher insurance rates for smokers is a threat?
Smokers are being compared to healthy individuals being threatened simply for existing and making a choice not to receive a potion?
Comment by Real Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:40 pm
There is no obligation for the person identifying themself as a Carroll staffer commenting here to respond. But I respectfully ask this question: were you personally aware that this bill proposal was against federal law? If so, did you alert Carroll to this fact to make sure he understood that before the original announcement was made?
Comment by Responsa Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:41 pm
===why are all of us paying for their $500,000 hospital stay===
Yep. Just like taxing retirement income, this may be a third-rail issue that is going nowhere. Just like taxing retirement income, some may say it is illegal. It may be illegal in some forms, but there are variations that accomplish the same goal that would not be illegal. I am disappointed that this was only a press pop bill, because I think it is a very valid public policy topic that warrants debate. Without intimidation.
Comment by thechampaignlife Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:52 pm
=== Just like taxing retirement income, some may say it is illegal===
Um, it is currently illegal in Illinois. No state law could be changed to make Carroll’s bill legal.
Comment by Rich Miller Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:54 pm
== This is a press pop bill, not a real bill.==
Appreciate the confirmation that Carroll is a fraud who wastes everyone’s time and tax dollars trying to get attention with a bill that was never intended to go anywhere.
Comment by Lester Holt’s Mustache Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:59 pm
When you get a routine vaccination, you pay 75 cents to the feds. A triple shot like MMR, $2.25, 75 cents per dose in the shot. This money all goes into a vaccine injury compensation fund (NVICP). Because vaccines are generally low-profit for drug manufacturers, the feds removed them from ordinary tort liability and put them into an automatic payout system (similar to national tort law in New Zealand). Every one of us who gets a vaccine pays a tiny amount into that fund, every time, to guarantee payment for the very small number of people who suffer from vaccine injuries.
I propose that we establish a state or national NON-vaccination fund. For approved and recommended vaccines, if you do not have a (clear, limited, approved) medical exemption, you pay a fee that covers the costs of those injured by the disease you refuse to vaccinate against, including public health costs. So, refuse to vaccinate against tetanus, whatever, it’s not contagious, you’re just going to die in a very stupid way, it’ll cost you $1. Refuse to vaccinate against pertussis? That will get very expensive, very quickly, whenever pertussis becomes resurgent.
I did some back-of-the-envelope math for the public health costs for the measles outbreak in California around 2015? Looked at data for MMR vaccination rates in children under 18, figured up how many doses they would have had, divided the public health costs by the number of skipped doses. (Note I did not include anything like the significant costs from SoCal tourism having to shut down, OR the individual health costs born by innocent families, including the couple of infants too young to be vaccinated who died.) Anyway, when you work out what that mini-measles epidemic cost the state of California divided by the number of skipped doses in California, every single skipped dose cost $10,000.
So, yes. Let’s make it a personal responsibility issue. You get vaccinated, you already take on the financial responsibility for those very few people who suffer vaccine injuries. It costs you 75 cents a dose. So let’s create a fee for skipping vaccines, taking on the financial responsibility for the harm that you do for skipping a dose. Every dose, every time.
So what has Covid cost since vaccines became available? And let’s divide that by the number of willfully unvaccinated. If they’re willing to pay that amount, then heck yes, they can make their own personal choices.
But it’s crappy for those of us who make responsible public health choices and willingly take on the (tiny) risks of vaccination WHO ALSO voluntarily pay for the (tiny) number of people who are hurt by vaccines to ALSO have to pay for the jerks who refuse to get vaccinated, who refuse to pay their share.
So let’s mandate vaccine refusers paying their share. They want to make choices and take personal responsibility for their health. Let them — but don’t let them socialize the costs of those decisions. They pay full freight.
Comment by Suburban Mom Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:00 pm
While I disagree with the policy proposal that was being suggested - this was certainly not well thought out by Representative Carroll. To withdraw the bill and cave in just emboldens the fringe and radical factions of the right who think it is okay to threaten, intimidate and bully those they disagree with. I hope that any person making these threats and trying to stifle our democratic process is caught and arrested.
Comment by David Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:02 pm
=Stupid is as stupid does.=
So the logic response to political stunts, which neither party has a monopoly on, is violence? Yikes.
Comment by Pundent Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:02 pm
===No state law could be changed to make Carroll’s bill legal.===
If it were not just a press pop, the bill could be changed to make it comply with federal law while accomplishing the intended purpose of making the unvaccinated pay for their own costs through higher premiums, discounts to the vaccinated, or something else. It should be open for discussion without threats.
Comment by thechampaignlife Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:10 pm
== I wish Rich let us post screenshots here. This wasn’t just threats. They were posting photos of his kids, home address, it was truly terrible stuff. ==
Carroll staffer, so what does he think is going to happen when he tried to introduce actual important legislation? You know, stuff that (apparently) isn’t just a phony attempt to get media coverage? Is he going to forever just propose bills to rename city streets and other minor issues that are inoffensive to conservatives? I think the idea behind the bill was a good one, and shame on Carroll for either proposing a bill he never meant to stand behind, or for folding to the demands of the wingnuts.
Comment by Lester Holt’s Mustache Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:13 pm
=In other words, here’s that attention he ordered.=
Sorry, but I don’t buy that anyone is “asking” to get doxxed and threatened and harassed by introducing a bill any more than women are “asking” to be assaulted by wearing short skirts.
Comment by LakeCo Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:16 pm
He did what a lot of people at private dinner parties would like to do if they were king for a day. Get vaccinated. Very simple. But his methods were stupid.
Comment by DMC Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:21 pm
Real - Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 2:40 pm:
-Like charging higher insurance rates for smokers is a threat?
Smokers are being compared to healthy individuals being threatened simply for existing and making a choice not to receive a potion?
No…the DECISION that a smoker makes to participate in behavior that is likely to illicit a negative outcome is being compared to the same decision that a person makes for not receiving a vaccination (BTW, it’s not a potion - but thanks for clarifying where you stand) that is likely to illicit a negative outcome. Actions have consequences. I’ve seen many people on here state the phrase “Governors own.” Well in this case, you as a citizen need to own your decision on this issue either. Because as mutations occur and new variants pop up, we need to find ways to limit the stress put on an already overburdened healthcare system.
Comment by Just a guy Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:22 pm
I don’t get it, does this not infuriate anyone else? A dem is threatened and doxxed for introducing a good idea in the form of legislation, but instead of standing up for it we get “oh it wasn’t supposed to be a real bill anyway”? Thank goodness Carroll isn’t a state rep in Georgia or Texas, where this kind of stuff is regularly done to liberals. “Sorry, we’d really like to help with the whole voting rights thing, but we got some threats on Twitter”
Comment by Lester Holt’s Mustache Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:28 pm
=== Carroll is a fraud who wastes everyone’s time and tax dollars trying to get attention with a bill that was never intended to go anywhere ===
Relax. Press bills have been around since the first solon and town crier.
Comment by Norseman Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:34 pm
Do we expect the voters to understand that Carroll’s bill was a publicity stunt and that he didn’t intend to hurt people in their pocketbook?
Is the person in the street to have the understanding that legislation is all about misdirection and trickery?
His tossing up a piece of crud and then withdrawing it over a threat just opened up a whole new avenue for citizens upset by perceived threats from legislators.
Thanks, Jonathan.
Comment by We've never had one before Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 3:47 pm
he didn’t intend to be divisive, but…
But he gots lots and lots of clicks and publicity.
So, mission accomplished.
Comment by Bruce( no not him) Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 4:50 pm
Discrimination is not following the science
Comment by Deserttrek Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 4:55 pm
Carroll Staffer, be sure to save every one of those voice mails. They are evidence.
Comment by filmmaker prof Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 5:02 pm
== Relax. Press bills have been around since the first solon and town crier.==
I’m glad that you’re ok with him wasting your time and tax dollars. It’s weak-minded thinking like this that causes dems to lose elections. “Carroll for State Rep: Vote For A Quitter”
Comment by Lester Holt’s Mustache Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 5:45 pm
Funny how those who refuse to get vaccinated, who are mostly conservatives by the way, suddenly want protections for health decisions. Bet you they all have no issue demanding health decisions like abortion and sex reassignment surgeries being out of pocket, or even prohibiting them altogether.
Comment by Jason Bourne Thursday, Dec 9, 21 @ 6:42 pm