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Not good enough

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Illinois

* The Chicago Tribune editorialized on the secrecy surrounding denials of concealed carry permits...

So far, the state has handed out 62,258 permits, denying some 1,620 for not following the rules or failing to meet some requirement. The Tribune’s Kim Geiger and Dahleen Glanton reported that local authorities have opposed some 2,400 applications (more than half of the objections coming from Cook County Sheriff Tom Dart), and 809 individuals have been rejected. Overall, Illinois has not been stingy with licenses.

But some of those who were turned down say they don’t know why — and can’t find out. One is Michael Thomas, of Chicago, a former Air Force reservist who was honorably discharged. “I have never been arrested or convicted for any offense, either misdemeanor or felony, in the state of Illinois or any other state,” he said in a letter to the Illinois State Police. But neither the state police nor the board will tell him why he was refused.

So the National Rifle Association is suing the state on behalf of 194 rejected applicants. It argues that the opaque process denies them due process, because they are not informed of the basis for the decision or given the chance to challenge it.

We don’t often say this, but the NRA has a point. We supported giving the state some discretion in handing out permits to carry loaded guns in public. Local law enforcement officers often know of risks (such as gang associations) posed by particular people who have not been convicted of crimes. Common sense argues for erring on the side of keeping firearms away from anyone who poses a discernible danger.

* As did the SJ-R…

But the law also allows the agency to object to an application even after those requirements have been met. The Concealed Carry Licensing Review Board, made up of people with federal, state and local law enforcement backgrounds, reviews the agency’s objections in private, and the state police says the board doesn’t have to explain its reasons unless ordered to do so by a court.

* So, the coppers have come up with some new rules…

Under the new rules, persons denied a concealed carry license will learn the reason, and be told what law enforcement agency made that determination. They then have to hurry to find evidence that proves they’re not a danger to themselves or others or a threat to public safety — they get ten days to make their case to the board.

It’s not clear, though, if the new rules will satisfy gun rights’ groups demands for due process, or what it will mean for the ongoing litigation.

The new rules are here. They’re inadequate. Giving applicants just ten days to respond and keeping all hearings closed to the public just aren’t good ideas.

posted by Rich Miller
Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 12:47 pm

Comments

I think I figured out where McCarthy got his training from. http://youtu.be/64yianfGvzc

Comment by William j Kelly Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 12:53 pm
The other funny thing about this is that they are trying to submit these as emergency rules NOW. While basically trying to head off some lawsuits that are in for people that have no reason to be denied.

Comment by RonOglesby - Now in TX Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 12:59 pm
Those wondering why they were denied could call their local lawmakers for help, except that would then trigger another Tribune “clout” story, this time about lawmakers skirting the sacrosanct concealed carry process to get guns in the hands of questionable applicants.

I’m still trying to figure out if the bureaucracy is supposed to be the good guy or the bad guy.

Comment by Michelle Flaherty Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:05 pm
After all these years of getting their ears pinned back by the NRA and IRA, do the “coppers” really think this lame change will satisfy them?

Comment by dupage dan Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:05 pm
—
Those wondering why they were denied could call their local lawmakers for help, except that would then trigger another Tribune “clout” story,
—
Actually, you cant. Some that have tried are told that the board records and proceedings are not even open to legislators…

Comment by RonOglesby - Now in TX Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:07 pm
The new rules are a start however the 10 days to respond is a joke 30 days would be more reasonable. I understand the principle of keeping the hearings closed to protect the privacy of the applicants that said some public oversight is clearly needed.

Comment by Mason born Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:08 pm
–After all these years of getting their ears pinned back by the NRA and IRA, do the “coppers” really think this lame change will satisfy them? –

What are you talking about? Todd would tell you that they lined up most law enforcement in favor of c-c.

Nothing gets done in 10 days. Too short.

Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:19 pm
RonOglesby,
Thanks for the cold water.
I was attempting to use snark to make a broader point.

Comment by Michelle Flaherty Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:22 pm
Little cheap shot there from the Trib at Tom Dart. Given the size of Cook County and the crime rate, Dart also probably has under his jurisdiction more than half the state’s total number of people who shouldn’t be allowed to use handguns.

Comment by Angry Chicagoan Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:24 pm
—
RonOglesby,
Thanks for the cold water.
I was attempting to use snark to make a broader point
—

Sorry. my snark filter was not on.

Comment by RonOglesby - Now in TX Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:27 pm
Assuming JCAR proceeds as usual, ISP will get a good whoopin’ and that 10 days will get fixed in the final rules.

Comment by Arthur Andersen Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:31 pm
Mutual regard for due process of law is the glue that binds society together. I hope this time the NRA pins them to the wall, and I don’t often say that either.

Comment by Skirmisher Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 1:57 pm
We should be a land of laws, and I thought we were innocent until proven guilty.

Comment by facts are stubborn things Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 2:02 pm
62,000 cc permits issued.

2/3 of those objected to by local law enforcement still received cc permits.

194 apparently have a real problem because they were denied and cannot find out why.

Waiting for the ISRA to declare the fate of civilization is hanging in the balance. Along with their fundraising plea.

Of course, there should be a way for the 194 to get a quick answer. Sounds like the initial problems with the no-fly list, some of which still linger.

Comment by walker Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 4:11 pm
walker,

Just curious where did you get the 2/3rds of objected receiving permits. I haven’t seen that anywhere.

Comment by Mason born Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 4:15 pm
walker

809/2400 i got it sorry.

Comment by Mason born Tuesday, Jul 15, 14 @ 4:16 pm