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Two sides in the same paper

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Illinois

* News-Gazette editorial…

Madigan wants higher taxes, and Rauner said he’s willing to consider raising taxes. Rauner wants some significant legislative changes that Madigan said he won’t consider. His idea of a compromise is for Rauner to surrender. Is it any wonder they have yet to make a deal?

* Former GOP state Rep. Bill Black in the same newspaper...

The Republican governor is up against an old, wily Democrat who knows the rules of the General Assembly, is head of the state Democratic Party, has super majorities in both the House and the Senate and is winning the public relations battle in the budget standoff, portraying Rauner as a heartless man of great wealth while Democrats stand up for the poor, vulnerable, aged and infirm.

“They do an excellent job of putting it this way,” said Black, “‘We’re doing what we can to keep your aging grandmother comfortable in her assisted living facility. And we’re trying to give your children and grandchildren a decent year in school.’ They’re very good at winning public opinion and turning it.” […]

“I miss being over there,” he said. “I miss the people I worked with but I don’t miss this stuff. This is what gave me ulcers, gave me a heart attack. This stuff I don’t miss at all. You get so damned frustrated sitting over there, watching these people play these games. It doesn’t have to be this way. I think that’s what the governor is saying.

“But he came into a situation where the deck was completely stacked against him. I think he thought he could divide and conquer, but that’s not easily done. I wish him the best in his quest because he’s right.”

posted by Rich Miller
Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:08 am

Comments

I miss… Bill Black.

The Owl Sandack could learn a lot from Bill Black.

You read Black’s comments, that is a Republican, rallying Republicans, but the underlying reality IS Black’s reality, and that’s giving his words credibility.

That’s not a “sham”, The Owl Sandack. Read. Learn. Understand.

Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:18 am
“Rauner wants some significant legislative changes that Madigan said he won’t consider. ”

I think by enlarge MJM has considered them, and the house has rejected them. You don’t get large changes like Rauner is wanting with huge majorities in both chambers of the other party. Elections have consequences and any kind of “turn around agenda” like the one Rauner is demanding will take many elections to accomplish. He is holding the budget up insisting on the impossible. The people of Illinois did not elect super majorities in both houses to see the kind of agenda he is proposing. I think most people thought Rauner would be a good balance and that total Dems rule is not the best idea.

Comment by Facts are Stubborn Things Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:20 am
I wanted to add that often a split government is one that can accomplish things because both sides can claim victory and blame the other.

Comment by Facts are Stubborn Things Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:20 am
– Rauner said he is willing to consider raising taxes.–

LOL, yeah, “willing.” Rauner is dying to raise taxes, he just wants a couple of face-saving “victories” before he does so.

Otherwise, he would have taken those 20 approp. bills and line-itemed and reduced them to get a state budget within current revenues.

Governors can do that. They’re quite powerful, when they want to be.

Comment by Wordslinger Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:21 am
All I ever hear from the Republicans is that the issue with the budget is not revenue it is spending. Where are the cries from the Republican house and senate member for Rauner to veto the budget bill line by line and cut the spending. What an opportunity to control spending. Cut the budget and see how things work out. If more spending is needed then negotiate it. This “turn around agenda” is just a bust the union proposal.

Comment by Facts are Stubborn Things Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:25 am
===This is what gave me ulcers, gave me a heart attack. This stuff I don’t miss at all. You get so damned frustrated sitting over there, watching these people play these games.===

I had to imagine him screaming these words like he might have on the House floor. I miss Bill Black.

Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:32 am
Let’s forget for a moment personalities, political ambitions, image, ideologies, and give our Governor all benefits of doubt. Let’s assume he fully believes in his Turnaround Agenda for Illinois, and helping Illinois is his only agenda.

Question: What would you have done to achieve your agenda? What would you do this year?

Examples to ponder:

Would you treat the budget address primarily as a call to action, never mind if the numbers were clearly achievable?

Would you tie agenda items to other bills?

Would you start the legislative bargaining with working groups?

Would you try to push your agenda at every level of government?

Would you leverage budget differences to the max to achieve turnaround?

Would you attempt to manage legislators by demanding support and backing that with a promise of funding?

Given the assumptions above, these are interesting strategic options to consider.

Comment by walker Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:34 am
Rauner needs to pivot and say to the Illinois citizens that he can not accomplish his turn around agenda without changes in the legislature. he must however as governor govern until then. He there fore will agree to a tax increase in exchange for a tough (more cuts) budget that addressed both the structural deficit and at the same time makes budget reforms and discipline.

Comment by Facts are Stubborn Things Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:41 am
My net on Rauner, giving him all benefits of doubt: He is a wide-ranging strategic and risk-taking chief executive, but a pretty miserable operations manager. He just has not covered for his own shortcomings with his senior staff. Too much campaign and image professionals around him now.

Comment by walker Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:41 am
Rauner’s play is “Accept my public and private union-castrating, public-bankruptcy-allowing, agenda, and I’ll discuss (regressive) taxes to balance the budget…or, social programs suffer while I seek to avoid responsibility for the shutdown caused by my refusal to accept anything but capitulation to my agenda demands. If people wanted that Bruce, they would have dumped the Dem supermajorities. Since they didn’t, those demands of yours aren’t going anywhere, nor should they.

Comment by PublicServant Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:43 am
==But he came into a situation where the deck was completely stacked against him.==

Yeah, you would think a smart guy like Rauner would have known that and slow played his hand. But instead he went all in before the flop.

Comment by Ducky LaMoore Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:44 am
People want redistricting and term limits by an overwhelming margin Public Servant.

Comment by Shoedoctor Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:52 am
My question above was, of course, meant to be “what would you have done if you were Rauner?”

Comment by walker Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:57 am
I’m not conceding that the Democrats are “winning the public relations battle” in the long term. Rauner has conceded he will be very unpopular well into his term. He accepts that as gospel. Talk to me in Feb. of 2017 and we’ll see how the lay of the land looks. It takes a macro vision to see this.

Comment by DuPage Don Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:59 am
Some commenters here have the crazy idea that Rauner should have line item vetoed a Democratic budget and therefore have the GOP, alone, wear the shirt for all the cuts.

Come on, people, grow up.

Comment by Harry Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:02 am
@Dupage Don

Will there be a budget by then? Haha.

@Harry

Yeah, the people that want the cuts would own them. Such a pity.

Comment by Ducky LaMoore Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:07 am
-OW- You really need to get your personal animosity toward Ron Sandack under control. It undermines your argument many times!

Comment by DuPage Don Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:08 am
==I’m not conceding that the Democrats are “winning the public relations battle” in the long term==

I wouldn’t even necessarily concede that they’re wining it now.

Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:09 am
Um, - Harry -…

===Some commenters here have the crazy idea that Rauner should have line item vetoed a Democratic budget and therefore have the GOP, alone, wear the shirt for all the cuts.===

You do know, that’s the job of governor, and the AV is a tool of the job.

This isn’t cartoon “Schoolhouse Rock”. Maybe you need to understand governing.

Rauner chose. Governors choose. The AV, that’s a choice, a constitutional choice. Please, catch up.

Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:09 am
-Anonymous- Yes, you have lurched into the truth!

Comment by DuPage Don Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:11 am
- DuPage Don -

“Everyone’s a critic…”

Sometimes, …I’m not writing for you, as an audience.

Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:13 am
- Shoedoctor - Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 9:52 am:

People want redistricting and term limits by an overwhelming margin Public Servant.

Let’s also remember that Rauner won a close election against a very unpopular Governor. It’s not like Illinois gave him a huge mandate for his agenda

Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:13 am
– “Madigan wants higher taxes, and Rauner said he’s willing to consider raising taxes.” –

Here’s what I think is the fundamental problem with Rauner’s approach: he does not realize (and neither does the News Gazette) that Democrats don’t WANT to raise taxes. It’s a miserable vote for Democrats. They don’t want to do it.

What Democrats want is more government services, and for them that’s the tradeoff. They will take the miserable vote on taxes to get more services.

Rauner is basically telling them, “Make the miserable votes in my Turnaround Agenda, and I’ll give you the opportunity to make more miserable votes.” Is it any wonder Democrats aren’t biting?

Buying into the cartoon version of liberal ideology — that tax increases are the goal in and of itself — is not really an effective way to persuade Democrats.

Comment by the Other Anonymous Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:17 am
I’m glad that Bill is retired. I’d hate to see him operating as spokesman for the purchased.

Comment by Norseman Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:18 am
=== Some commenters here have the crazy idea that Rauner should have line item vetoed a Democratic budget and therefore have the GOP, alone, wear the shirt for all the cuts. ===

Rauner said he could handle the heat. Rauner said he would shake things up. Rauner wants a balanced budget and had the chance to make one of his choosing. He didn’t. Why? You’re on point in that he doesn’t want to wear the shirt. He knows he can’t cut the amount required to balance the budget. He knows he needs a tax increase to balance the budget. He knows he campaigned against taxes so he wants political cover to get where he needs to be. So Harry, this is all about the politics of governing as usual. Your guy is not such a strong guy after all.

Comment by Norseman Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:28 am
===I’m glad that Bill is retired. I’d hate to see him operating as spokesman for the purchased.===

That’s about as perfect description as to my feelings, with “The Owl Sandack” as my example.

Well said.

Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:29 am
Let’s remember there is little or no concensus on TeamBungle’s issues really helping state…work comp already down, tort reform handled by SC a few year back, remap January 2023, term limits…check Missouri…..taxfreeze/screw workers….200 towns vote no.
Legislative spending plan reflect services required by law….start repealing.
The PR war is more of whimper from theBobblehead….$2 million Zell bucks down the sewer…front group robbo calls and mail make Proft look gifted…and the coup de grace is +30% of the rental checks have not been cashed…..what a humiliating scene…no wonder polls numbers are down.
Y

Comment by Anonin' Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:36 am
==I miss being over there==

And many miss you.

Comment by Formerly Known As... Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:54 am
Shoe doctor and dd- if you have a state rep or state senator that you like and think they are doing a good job… Why would you throw them out of office? Is it because good work needs to be punished? Term limits will get nut case extremists that hate government and lack basic cognitive skills. Basically you run out of competent legislators because they are termed out. the American Legislative Exchange Council knows exactly that term limits will get them less competent and lazy Legislators that will gladly submit their bills that are detrimental to their constituents. I hate to tell you guys but Governing is a skill and I for one am not in favor of throwing anyone out of a job the do well. Also DD I would say that when you’re using your superpower of macro vision it really distorts you view of reality. Speaker Madigan in giving your guy a lesson in governing.

Comment by Triple fat Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 10:59 am
Rauner is dying to raise taxes on the middle class. Happily for him, Madigan and the Democrats also want the middle class to feel the pain of their bipartisan tax increase. When the current dance is over, they’ll pounce. Let the rich be-they deserve their wealth.

Comment by Cassandra Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 11:08 am
@the Other Anonymous

Exactly! Rauner acts as if a tax increase is platinum to democrats, when it is actually copper.

Comment by Ducky LaMoore Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 11:08 am
Dupage Dan “It takes a macro vision to see this.”

That’s what General Custer said.

Comment by Michael Westen Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 11:14 am
“Some commenters here have the crazy idea that Rauner should have line item vetoed a Democratic budget and therefore have the GOP, alone, wear the shirt for all the cuts.”

Well, since the GOP are the only ones in favor of the cuts, who else should “wear the shirt” for them.

And, if they are so convinced the cuts are the right thing, they should proudly “wear the shirt.” Unless they are too ashamed to “wear the shirt” for cruel cuts to poor, old or disabled people.

Comment by Michael Westen Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 11:18 am
Cassandra - was your last post tounge in cheek? If not… Can we leave Union workers alone because we deserve our rights more than the rich being immune from paying their fair share in taxes. It is not their birthright to receive preferential tax treatment at the expense of hardworking middle class Union Workers. Which is what the Governor’s turnaround agenda is trying to do.

Comment by Triple fat Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 11:32 am
=== if they are so convinced the cuts are the right thing, they should proudly “wear the shirt.” ===

Michael Westen for the Win.

Rauner spent $60 million begging for the chance to make these cuts.

Comment by Juvenal Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 11:50 am
It must be a problem for union members, then, that the Democrats are as allergic to higher taxes on the wealthy as Republicans in Illinois.
They’ve had over a decade to change the constitution. They’ve made only the most token
efforts.

There has been a lot of talk about Rauner being a rich man, protecting the interests of the rich. Michael Madigan is a rich person too, and so are many of our esteemed legislators.

Comment by Cassandra Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 12:10 pm
Cassandra- so you are of the opinion that Speaker Madigan,with Rod Blagojevich in office and without super majorities at that time, would have been able to pass a Constitutional amendment creating a graduated income tax? You are aware that the temporary tax increase was difficult enough to pass during Quinn’s tenure? Are you also aware of the logistics involved in amending the Constitution? “Easy Peezie” you need to take those macro vision glasses off and starting seeing things as they are. By the way, I was not speaking about the graduated income tax, but about how the Governor wants to make it harder for people injured on the job to receive workers compensation; the Governor’s $100 million in proposed corporate tax breaks… Union employees know Speaker Madigan is the true champion of the middle class and the poor. The Governor’s actions belie his claim of protectin the middle class workin folk. Unions and sacrifices made by Union Workers created the Middle class in this country. How dare you be so dismissive of us in your last post.

Comment by Triple fat Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 1:03 pm
===People want redistricting and term limits by an overwhelming margin Public Servant.===

First, ShoeDoctor, if you want the law of the land to be independent redistricting, work for it on the national level, otherwise it becomes just an attack on an otherwise-democratic state, while many republican-dominated states do the same thing. I’m for it on a national level, how bout you? Second, term limits aren’t going to fly here, nor have they worked where they’ve been implemented. They’re undemocratic. You don’t like my legislator, then move into my district, vote against him, get enough people to vote your way…problem solved.

Finally, and most importantly, while redistricting reform, and term limits are, I’m sure, important to our Governor, the poison pills within the pleasantly otherwise titled bills, which eviscerate private and public unions are what he really craves, and will never get approved within the makeup of the current legislature. And that’s not a short term issue. He will need to drop his long term goals from the very short term issue of the 2015 budget negotiations, or we will simply not have a 2015 budget. To think the Democrats who control the house and senate will agree to decimate unions because a governor with 50.27% of the vote has a bug up his plutocrat patootie about unions, before they can expect bi-partisan support for a tax increase to balance either Bruce’s or the Dems passed budget is, well, extreme.

Comment by PublicServant Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 1:45 pm
“But he came into a situation where the deck was completely stacked against him. I think he thought he could divide and conquer, but that’s not easily done.”

He knew that. Worse, he spent $25,000,000 trying to get other GOP candidates elected - and lost. Did he get a clue? NOPE. He got through Inauguration Day and went right into a Pickett’s Charge. Governor Rauner surprised everyone at a time when no one wanted, or needed to be surprised. Instead of smooth stability, Rauner gambled everything he won in his electoral mandate - and flushed it slowly away.

Rauner flushed away his honeymoon and his mandate.

He was always going to be a minority governor. Instead of behaving like a honeymooning minority governor, he behaved like a college freshman at his first fraternity party.

Governor Rauner’s staff is not helping him. Instead of giving the new guy wisdom, they are doing keg stands, blowing chunks at the General Assembly salad bar, and Twittering their selfies while they do it.

I’ve never seen a worse start to an administration, Mr. Black. I bet you wish you didn’t leave. Do you think you can stop buy the Governor’s office and do a little screaming? There doesn’t seem to be any adults in charge.

Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 2:28 pm
Triple fat: Please. A little discernment might be of value. Cassandra and A Guy are clearly not on Rauner’s staff, and do not always agree. More important, your comments on the substance of the thread are better than the ones criticizing other commenters. More of the former please.

Comment by walker Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 3:31 pm
Triple Fat, that’s sexist.

Comment by Michael Westen Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 3:51 pm
True. True. Forgive my angry outburst.

Comment by Triple fat Tuesday, Jul 14, 15 @ 5:52 pm
It wasn’t't sexist

Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Jul 15, 15 @ 1:54 pm