Latest Post | Last 10 Posts | Archives
Previous Post: Keeping up with Scott Kennedy ain’t easy
Next Post: *** UPDATED x1 *** Pritzker pledges not to dictate to Democratic legislators, Kennedy won’t commit to assault weapons ban
Posted in:
* A different sort of gerrymandering. From the Chicago Reporter…
In Illinois, about 90 percent of the prison population of 50,000 is incarcerated outside of Cook County, even though Cook County accounts for three out of every five prisoners. This spatial mismatch is a consequence of political decisions about prison growth. All of the state’s prisons built after 1941 are located at least 100 miles from Chicago, and the average distance between Chicago and a state prison is more than 200 miles.
This is the spatial story of Chicago and Illinois. And this story is a racial one as well. While seven out of 10 incarcerated by the state identify as black or Latinx, about 95 percent of the prison population is located in counties that are overwhelmingly white. Of the 10 counties with the highest percentage of prison residents, for example, eight of them had general populations that were at least 85 percent white.
When lawmakers use census counts like these to draw electoral districts without regard for prison gerrymandering, the effects are clear. White votes in downstate Illinois are inflated at the disproportionate expense of folks of color in the Chicago area.
These political decisions don’t just punish individual voters convicted of crime. They punish whole communities, even those innocent of any wrongdoing. Crime victims who disproportionately reside in urban areas are more likely to have their collective political power deflated from diminished voting blocs as a result of prison gerrymandering — adding not only insult to injury but injury to injury.
There’s a simple solution to the problem of prison gerrymandering: Count inmates as residents of their home communities, not their prison cells. But this methodological flaw is unlikely to be corrected prior to the 2020 Census. And no other federal action can be expected at the current political moment. Therefore, the onus is on state and local governments to make change.
* Democratic Rep. La Shawn Ford and Republican Reps. Dan Brady and Christine Winger are sponsoring a bill to stop this…
Creates the No Representation Without Population Act. Provides that the Department of Corrections shall collect and maintain an electronic record of the legal residence, outside of any correctional facility, and other demographic data for each person entering its custody after January 1, 2017. Provides for the minimum records that the Department shall maintain. Requires the Department to provide certain information to the Secretary of State after the decennial census. Requires the Secretary of State to request similar information from agencies that operate federal incarceration facilities. Requires the Secretary of State to prepare redistricting data to reflect the incarcerated persons at their residential address, rather than the address of the facility in which the person is incarcerated. Provides that for persons form whom a legal residence is unknown or not in the State, and for all persons reported in the census as residing in a federal correctional facility for whom a report was not provided, the Secretary of State to allocate the person to a State unit not tied to a specific determined geographic location, as other residents with unknown addresses are allocated. Requires the data collected to only be used as a basis for determining Legislative and Representative Districts. Prohibits the use of the data for the distribution of State or federal aid. Contains severability provisions. Effective immediately.
* The Question: Should prisoners be counted as residents of the legislative districts where they lived before incarceration or where their prisons are? Click here to take the poll and then explain your answer in comments, please.
posted by Rich Miller
Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 1:27 pm
Sorry, comments are closed at this time.
Previous Post: Keeping up with Scott Kennedy ain’t easy
Next Post: *** UPDATED x1 *** Pritzker pledges not to dictate to Democratic legislators, Kennedy won’t commit to assault weapons ban
WordPress Mobile Edition available at alexking.org.
powered by WordPress.
They should be counted where they are imprisoned. And it has nothing to do with allowing them representation. When a prisoner comes into IDOC they come from their committing county. They self report their home address when taken into custody. Some put their families residence, some put their current residence, some put the police station address where they are in custody. This in turn makes it harder to determine just which district would represent them. Legislative districts are determined by population and where people live. Not if they are registered to vote at that area. So they should be counted where they are residing at the time of the census.
Comment by Spliff Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 1:37 pm
Not trying to be glib here, but they should be treated much like college students who’ve gone away to school, but maintain their legal residence at home.
Comment by A guy Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 1:41 pm
But college students can register to vote in the town where they go to college. They just can’t vote at school and at home.
Comment by Cheryl44 Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 1:45 pm
why are they voting in the first place?
Comment by anonime Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 1:50 pm
As a convicted felon, serving their time, they are actually almost a non-person because they can’t vote.
In Illinois, their voting privilege isn’t restored until after they are released. For federal elections, the google says they cannot vote until two years after probation/supervision are completed.
I say don’t even count the ones that have more than ten years left on their sentence. They aren’t entitled to representation based on their forfeiture of their voting rights.
If under ten years, count them where they’re sleeping.
Comment by cdog Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 1:50 pm
The whole premise is assinine, they can’t vote, therefore they shouldn’t be counted.
Comment by Toast Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 1:54 pm
Here are the Census Bureau Residence Rules for counting where a person lives.
https://www.census.gov/population/www/cen2010/resid_rules/resid_rules.html
They seem pretty consistent in that their rule is to count college students, prisoners, and soldiers basically by where they sleep most of the time.
Comment by Joe M Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 1:57 pm
Yes, inmates should be counted in their home districts.
I see were some are feeling that because someone may not be able to vote that they don’t deserve representation — seriously????
Comment by We'll See Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:00 pm
Count them as 3/5 of a person. We have precedent for that treatment of people unable to vote.
If the politicians want them so badly, vote to imprison them locally.
Comment by Last Bull Moose Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:02 pm
Also, it’s a bit curious to me that the bill has two GOP sponsors as I see where it could result in larger rural-geographic districts and an increase is the number of metro districts.
Comment by We'll See Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:03 pm
“As a convicted felon, serving their time, they are actually almost a non-person”
There’s a good deal more truth in this than may have been intended.
– MrJM
Comment by @MisterJayEm Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:04 pm
@Toast, not counting them while they are incarcerated has its own drawbacks. For example, if some prisoners are released right after the Census, then they are not being counted even though they are once again able to vote. I like cdog’s idea of not counting them if they are going to be spending another decade in jail, but otherwise they should be counted at their prior residence.
Comment by Perrid Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:05 pm
stop playing identity / racial politics. the incarcerated are no longer members of their former communities. The solution is to count them in neither downstate or Cook County.
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:10 pm
I saw a heat map of counties in IL by percentage of the population that was black a few years ago. Brown county, in west central IL, was just about the only county besides Greater Cook and St Louis to have more than 12% of its population be black, according to the 2000 census. This confused my Dad and me, since we live in the area, my Dad worked in Mt. Sterling for a decade, and we were pretty sure this wasn’t true. My dad eventually came up with the fact that Mt. Sterling has a prison. Brown County has less than 7,000 people, so up to 2,000 convicts is kinda a huge influx for the county. It does skew things.
Comment by Perrid Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:12 pm
===stop playing identity / racial politics===
Lemme make a wild guess: You’re white.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:13 pm
Since many federal and state programs do funding based on Census counts - and since they are being counted in the area they are being incarcerated in - and those areas provide services and roads and other infrastructure for the prisons, then they should continue to be counted in the areas they are serving time. Otherwise it would be unfair for those communities with prisons to not be receiving the federal and state funding for services and infrastructure they are providing.
Comment by Joe M Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:15 pm
“stop playing identity / racial politics”
Man I wished that would be a reality in Illinois and across the globe — but it’s not.
You must be a big Mike Ditka fan.
Comment by We'll See Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:17 pm
First of all the right to vote has nothing to do with the right to be counted for census purposes. Lots of benefits depend on the number of people living in an area and this is determined by census. So if you have a large prison population in an area they might get more funds because of the number of people in a prison. Secondly I doubt that the prison population generating the money uses many city facilities.
And no while in prison they do not vote, but as I said has nothing to do with being counted. Also once you are released and are off probation you can vote in Illinois, not however if on work release.
Finally when released you are released to your home address that you gave when entering prison. If the prison sites want to count them as population I suggest they be released into that community. See how fast the law would change then
Comment by DuPage Saint Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:22 pm
Prisoners should be counted as residents of JB’s mansion. First to re-connect the plumbing is awarded parole.
Comment by City Zen Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:29 pm
Census (unlike voter registration) is based on actual enumeration where people ARE not where they came from. Homeless people are counted wherever they happen to be, not where they last lived. And of course the enumeration includes citizens and non-citizens if they are here.
Comment by Put the fun in unfunded Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:33 pm
Saint. They are not released to their home address. They are either released at the prison they were being held to the residence they are being paroled, not always the same as where they lived prior, or if their sentence is fully up like sex offenders who rarely find a place to be paroled they are released at the gates of the prison.
Comment by Spliff Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:34 pm
For those saying they shouldn’t be counted at all…
First, redistricting is based on residents, not voters.
Second, just because you are a felon does not mean that you give your right to be represented. You may give up your right to vote for a time (though, I would argue, they shouldn’t have to do so), but they don’t give up their right to be represented.
An elected official represents everyone in their district - registered voter or not, felon or not, child or adult, etc.
Comment by JoeMaddon Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:34 pm
Each state House district should have a total population of around 100,000. 50,000 inmates, one could argue, denies Cook County about half a representative (assuming every inmate came from Cook).
So I don’t think this is a huge deal. And as much as it might inflate white voting in rural counties, it also makes those counties less white and younger, lol. If you haven’t been paying attention, Illinois has about 72 counties that have fewer than 50,000 residents. Many of them are 95% white or more, and a fair number have 1 in 5 or more residents who are aged 65 or older.
Rural, white and old: that’s the story for most Illinois counties. Not sure if the prison residency thing makes much difference.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:41 pm
Over time with the shrinking of the population of these counties and the relative constant prison population this will only increase the impact.
Comment by Annon3 Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:41 pm
It doesn’t make sense to me that convicts should lose their voting rights at all. It’s not an effective deterrent, and even if you commit a crime there are still political decisions made by government that affect you and the people you care about. And because the prison population is not representative of society, the disenfranchising effect is also not representative.
Comment by A Young Person Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:42 pm
For purposes of drawing legislative borders, they shouldn’t count at all - they can’t vote, they can’t choose where they’re going to live, and no district should get the benefit of housing a prison. It’s as-if they are residents anywhere and everywhere in the state. If they have to be counted it should be where their last residence was.
Comment by lake county democrat Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:50 pm
I have mixed feelings on this, but I do feel it points up a serious underlying issue, and that is the problem of people being incarcerated far from their home communities.
Strong family and community ties improve post-incarceration outcomes, so we should be doing everything we can to promote those ties. Instead, we make it difficult for families to visit and otherwise communicate with their imprisoned loved ones.
Comment by JoanP Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:50 pm
It seems they should be counted as residents of their last address before prison. When released this is most likely the community to which they will return so everything connected to who lives in an area should include them.
Comment by Ghost Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:51 pm
It is unfair to expect a population to be house, fed, served and processed in a county, without giving government support to the county doing all the work involved in this, right?
Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:53 pm
Clarification we have less than 25,000 incarcerated in IDOC, another 25,000 on parole who would be counted where they are living. Both numbers are too high in my opinion.
Comment by Spliff Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:53 pm
@lake county democrat -
Oh for pete’s sake, the census is not a count of eligible voters. It is a count of the population. Should we not count minors because they can’t vote or (generally) choose where they live?
Comment by JoanP Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:54 pm
===without giving government support to the county doing all the work involved in this,===
The state is paying 100% of expenses, so I’m not sure you have a point. Also, the local area gets the jobs and many of the contracts.
We use prisons as economic development projects in Illinois. That’s why they are located where they are located.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:56 pm
==It doesn’t make sense to me that convicts should lose their voting rights at all. ==
I’d vote myself free. I’d vote out the sheriff, the judge, the prosecutor, the DA who sent me to prison.
I’d vote to raise their taxes to pay for nicer stuff in jail. I’d vote to legalize the crime I was convicted of. I’d vote to open court cases to get the addresses of the witnessed used against me, so my friends on the outside could follow up.
You are very naive.
Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:58 pm
VM you mean support like thousands of jobs, payments for local services and payment to local papers for ads? The.locals get the cash cow no need to count the inhabitants…. but it does beg why not put such a cash cow in a low income Chicago area that could use thousands of local jobs…..
Comment by Ghost Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 2:58 pm
-VanillaMan 2:53-
Counties do not support any state facilities — there all funded by the State. Counties do benefit from the jobs facilities create and the goods and services purchased locally.
Comment by We'll See Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 3:01 pm
===why not put such a cash cow in a low income Chicago area that could use thousands of local jobs===
As a bonus, the state would save a bundle on bus fares for released inmates. Seems like most released prisoners end up in Chicago’s poorest neighborhoods now, they’re just coming from farther away.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 3:03 pm
You’re not getting the point. When counted as members of those communities, those communities qualify for types of federal grants, assistance for low-income individuals that those communities would not be eligible for otherwise. Eligibility for programs that incarcerated individuals would not be able to participate in
Comment by unsqueezed Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 3:24 pm
The local prison is 7% of our county population and around 600 jobs. Seven percent population reduction would make a dent. The prison population does skew programs and demographics. The same happens in college towns. It looks like some folks need to pick up some Angela Davis and have a read.
Comment by 100 miles west Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 3:35 pm
Those federal and state funds, based on Census counts, do go towards programs in the communities of the prison that benefit the prisoners.
Just a few examples would be water treatment plants, roads, fire protection. Inmates appreciate good water. Their families appreciate good roads - as do the vendors who bring food and supplies to the prison. And heaven forbid there is a fire at the prison, I’m sure the inmates would appreciate the local fire departments being able to put that fire out, etc.
And those ares with prisons have to spend more money on those services and infrastructure in order to serve the prison. So it makes sense that the prison population is counted at the site of the prison, so those areas are eligible for federal and state funds and grants based on that prison population.
Comment by Joe M Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 3:48 pm
Someone serving 40 years in prison should be counted as a resident of where they lived 20 or 30 years ago? No, it makes no sense. Also, the prisons don’t pay property taxes but call for local assistance for fire, ambulance, police help for riots or escaped prisoners. The prisoners should be counted where they sleep at night.
Comment by DuPage Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 3:49 pm
“I’d vote myself free. I’d vote out the sheriff, the judge, the prosecutor, the DA who sent me to prison. I’d vote to raise their taxes to pay for nicer stuff in jail. I’d vote to legalize the crime I was convicted of. I’d vote to open court cases to get the addresses of the witnessed used against me, so my friends on the outside could follow up.”
And you would lose that vote.
But you actually do understand how elections work, so you knew that already.
– MrJM
Comment by @MisterJayEm Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 3:58 pm
This is a non-issue. I was incarcerated in a State prison for a white collar crime. We used to joke about how the prison population could have swayed local elections if we were allowed to vote and our votes were counted from where we slept. Since prisoners cannot vote in this State until after they have been released, most of their letters to legislators go without response. Not surprisingly, they don’t have an especially strong lobbying presence.
Comment by Ex Con Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 3:58 pm
-Joe M @ 3:48-
You’ve made some good points. I am bit curious which side you were on when Obama used the same basic argument for business/corps paying more taxes uttered the infamous “you didn’t pay for that.”
Comment by We'll See Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 4:05 pm
Joe M the prison pay for all those services so they don’t need the population count, they get actual dollars. The steady income from the prison allows for bonds etc. If you remove the population zero impact to water districts etc. They still get paid, and she they request federal grants they just include the prison population in support. So basically none of that matters functional to locals if inmates are counted where they live. Locals get money anyway and grants are based on info in the grant request
Comment by Ghost Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 4:22 pm
I find the whole article from the Chicago Reader to be racist.
50,000 people are in jail and have lost their right to vote. 25,000 from Cook Co. I’m sick that 7 of 10 prisoners is a minority but those individuals, 10 of 10 of all colors, were too cool for rules. Ask their moms.
To try and make an argument that pits blacks and latinos against whites is the definition of racism.
Stop it. Adding, the entire argument was beyond weak, and worse.
Comment by cdog Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 5:48 pm
What Joe M said. Count the prisoners where they reside, in the town where the prison is located.
Ghost - The prison population does matter to the municipalities. Their MFT allotments based on population. Suddenly strip out a fairly large segment of the community will adversely impact the amount of money they receive from the State.
If this is enacted, it is a lawsuit waiting to happen.
Comment by Huh? Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 6:08 pm
This bill has been run before (by Rep. Ford) and fails every time. Prisoner’s count in the Federal census in the facility where they are located because Federal law says so. This bill would ONLY affect how they are counted for local elections. Where would you count them if it isn’t where they are located (many came from places that they will never return to, either because they are serving a life sentence or because the place no longer exists). For example, if you used to live in Cabrini Green before you were incarcerated, you aren’t returning there (it’s been torn down). You can’t use the address they provided on intake, since that address is self-reported and often not very accurate (many report the jail at 26th and Cal is their last address). What about people who last resided out of state, where would you count them? No, they count in the prison where they are located. They are not eligible to vote while in prison, so why would they be counted where they last lived?
Comment by Ferris Bueller Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 7:37 pm
Do the Republican legislators representing areas with prisons respond to letters from prisoners? I doubt it. The ones who do respond are legislators who hear from constituents who have a family member in prison. In short, counting prisoners where they are incarcerated gives them no representation. To the extent they have any, it comes from the areas they used to live in.
Comment by anon2 Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 8:38 pm
-cdog-
“To try and make an argument that pits blacks and latinos against whites is the definition of racism.”
Maybe you should look up the definition.
Comment by We'll See Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 8:48 pm
Census data is also used to dole out federal spending and probably state spending.
Comment by Johnny Justice Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 10:59 pm
We’ll See, I stand by my premise, and defining example of racism.
This is a grab by politicians. These incarcerated criminals have other things in their minds. I wonder if they even voted when they could, before they made bad choices.
Comment by cdog Tuesday, Oct 10, 17 @ 11:05 pm