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Updated and bumped up and comments are now open. Check update “2″ for some breaking news. We’ll use this later today to live blog the House debate on Madigan’s resolution asking members for an up or down nonbinding vote on whether they support the GRT and I’ll open comments at that time.
*** UPDATE 24 *** The Farm Bureau website has a clip of Madigan’s comments, or you can click below…
Also, the rollcall is now online. Click here.
*** UPDATE 23 *** The rollcall still isn’t online, but the “PRESENT” votes were: Marlow Colvin, Will Davis, LaShawn Ford, Connie Howard, Chuck Jefferson, Al Riley and Eddie Washington. I don’t know if it makes any difference, but they are all African-American Democrats.
*** UPDATE 22 *** Madigan went straight to his office without commenting to reporters.
*** UPDATE 21 *** You can find the rollcall at this link in a few minutes.
*** UPDATE 20 *** 0 YES; 107 NO; 7 PRESENT
*** UPDATE 19 *** Speaker Madigan closes the debate.
“A proposal for the imposition of a gross receipts tax in Illinois, would constitute a fundamental shift of philosophy of taxation in this state.”
This would be the first time that Madigan has specifically come out against the GRT.
Madigan said that when people start companies they figure on losing money in the first year or two, and the GRT would harm those business plans.
“The gross receipts tax is a regressive tax.”
“Even his own lt. governor has stated opposition to the tax. The mayor of Chicago has stated opposition to the tax…”
“I plan to vote ‘NO’ today.”
*** UPDATE 18 *** Rep. Bill Black: I don’t want to see unnamed sources say, there’s really 35, 45, 55 votes for the gross receipts tax… they just didn’t want to vote against the Speaker… and at a date to be determined they will rise and say they support it.
No means no.
*** UPDATE 17 *** From the Tribune’s Clout Street blog [emphasis added]…
Earlier today, House Speaker Michael Madigan (D-Chicago) made his strongest comments to date on the governor’s plan, saying there seems to be more support for an income tax than the governor’s gross receipts tax. Blagojevich has promised to veto an income tax increase.
Madigan, speaking to WGN-AM’s Spike O’Dell this morning, repeated his position that some type of tax increase is needed. But he still isn’t saying what he favors.
*** UPDATE 16 *** House GOP Leader Tom Cross: “From a policy standpoint (the GRT) just doesn’t work.”
*** UPDATE 15 *** Stephens moved that the resolution vote be exempted from the Century Club award. Madigan: “We were ahead of you. That was the plan.”
*** UPDATE 14 *** Rep. Ron Stephens: The governor mentioned yesterday that the electric rate issue is so critical, but the governor has not yet bothered to even call a meeting to negotiate the issue.
*** UPDATE 13 *** Rep. Julie Hamos: Also voting “NO” today. “I hope that our votes today will not be misinterpreted that… (we need) efforts to change (business tax structure).” “The governor has made a compelling case… that businesses are not paying their fair share in Illinois.” Suggests a “modified GRT,” perhaps a “value added tax” or a “gross margins tax.”
*** UPDATE 12 *** Rep. John Bradley: Disagrees with Hoffman when he said that the House should wait and see what the money will be used to fund. Bradley is saying that it’s important to look at the GRT for what it is, a regressive tax.
*** UPDATE 11 *** More Hoffman: The resolution doesn’t even match the changes that the Senate made.
Hoffman also read a letter from SEIU and the Laborer’s Union, which claims that the vote on the resolution is “premature.” The labor leaders (Ed Smith and Tom Balanoff) ask that all members vote “NO.” Hoffman said he would also vote “NO.”
*** UPDATE 10 *** More Hoffman: “I don’t understand why people can’t hear that (speaking of the governor’s promises not to raise income or sales taxes)… Unless we have 71 votes in this House to raise the income tax, why are we even talking about it?”
*** UPDATE 9 *** Rep. Jay Hoffman, Blagojevich’s House floor leader, is speaking. “We have three weeks to get together, to pass a budget… Why are we doing this today? Who would vote for a tax increase without knowing where the money is going to go?”
*** UPDATE 8 *** Rep. Rosemary Mulligan just asked Madigan whether they should continue with the vote because of the governor’s request that everyone vote “NO.” Madigan: “I would recommend that we engage in a good faith (debate)”
*** UPDATE 7 *** Paul says that House Republicans have signs on the back of their laptops which read: “No means no governor”
*** UPDATE 6 *** The House has begun debating the Madigan GRT resolution. Go here for live audio and video.
*** UPDATE 5 *** A reporter buddy just cracked that the guv’s request for “No” votes on Madigan’s resolution is like “the high school coach who forfeits the game rather than get skunked.” lol
It doesn’t appear, from that comment and the AP story below, that reporters are impressed by this move.
*** UPDATE 4 *** The AP’s take on the situation…
Facing the possibility of a serious defeat, Gov. Rod Blagojevich began lobbying lawmakers to vote against his very own tax plan Thursday.
The Illinois House plans to vote on a resolution testing whether lawmakers support the governor’s plan for a $7.6 billion business tax. The tax is widely expected to suffer a sound defeat, which would be a serious blow to Blagojevich’s chances of ever getting it passed.
So Blagojevich announced that he wants lawmakers to vote “no” - but not because they oppose the plan. He’s portraying a “no” vote as “a clear message that this issue is too important for a rush to judgment on a nonbinding resolution.” […]
Spokeswoman Abby Ottenhoff denied the request for votes against the plan was an attempt to put a better spin on an inevitable defeat.
*** UPDATE 3 *** My interview this morning on WBEZ can be found here, or you can listen below…
*** UPDATE x2 *** This just in from the governor’s office [emphasis added]…
“Yesterday was a good and productive start to the budget discussion in the House of Representatives. Members asked good questions, raised valid concerns and expressed an interest in working together to meet our state’s biggest challenges like healthcare and education.
“Considering that this meaningful dialogue was initiated just 24 hours ago, it would be premature to conclude the discussion today and ask members to make a decision before they have an opportunity to get answers to their questions and offer their ideas. So we are asking all members to vote ‘no’ to send a clear message that this issue is too important for a rush to judgment on a non-binding resolution.â€
It looks like Madigan may get the trophy after all. LOL
*** UPDATE 1 *** If you were wondering about my mention of the House’s “Century Club” trophy, here are a couple of photos. The trophy is “awarded” to members whose bills receive at least 100 “NO” votes. Madigan’s resolution on the GRT might get close. These were taken with my Treo, so they’re not great.
Check out the photo behind the trophy in the first example. Madigan hisself…
A closeup of the trophy…
WBEZ just called asking for an interview, so some posting might be delayed. I’m supposed to be on around 9ish, so tune in your radio or click here to listen on the Intertubes.
posted by Rich Miller
Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 10:14 am
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They voted no because I told them to, see. A no vote actually is a vote for the GRT… yeah, that’s it, that’s the ticket…. I’ll be President soon… and I can fly like Superman…and sing like Elvis…
Comment by la la land Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 11:32 am
Actually, I think it’s a pretty slick move. The Gov will argue that the vote is indecipherable and, therefore, meaningless.
Comment by steve schnorf Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 11:43 am
Maybe the Republicans and the naughty nine will vote yes so they can be opposed to the governor.
Comment by Bill Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 11:50 am
Does this mean that Rod was for the GRT before he was against it?
Steve, I agree that the Gov is trying to make the best of a bad situation, but I don’t think the press is going to buy that spin. Worse, the Gov might be accused of still refusing to get the message, and worrying more about damage control than the future of the state.
I’m betting that this strategy was adopted after the Gov’s folks tried to pressure House members into voting for the Resolution and found out that even the Gov’s closest allies aren’t foolish enough to go on record as supporting a tax increase that will never actually see the light of day.
Former State Sen. Pat Welch made that mistake in voting for the Gov’s 13th hour $450 million tax increase. I say 13th hour because the House had already adjourned when the Senate voted, so the vote was purely symbolic. Alas, Sen. Welch’s reward for his blind, unflinching loyalty to Emil and the Governor is that he is no longer with us.
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 11:52 am
It will be sweet watching the GRT go down
Comment by RMW Stanford Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 11:53 am
Dog, you and I know it’s all about control of the news cycle, and they’re very good at it.
Comment by steve schnorf Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 11:55 am
I agree that this is a pretty bright move on the part of Blago’s staff after they realized they were headed for a massive defeat, but it would have been more believable if they had asked members to vote “present” rather than “no”, perhaps. The press generally won’t be fooled, but the sheep-like voters in this state may well be, especially given Blago’s resources (i.e., campaign cash) to publicly spin the issue and vote however he likes. IF he was sincere, why didn’t he mention this in his speech yesterday– wasn’t he still asking for “yesses” then, and he knew the vote would be taken today.
Comment by team america, world police Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 11:59 am
Maybe Rod should have paid more attention when he was a back-bencher in the House.
He seems to have forgotten that members get to explain their votes. It will be hard to spin this when 100+ members get up and say “No means No.”
Comment by Old Elephant Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 12:01 pm
POA is throwing in the towel to avoid the slaughter rule.
Comment by Huh? Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 12:08 pm
YDD - good stuff.
How can he say that this vote is a rush to judgement. He presented the GRT nearly two months ago and they had an all day hearing yesterday. They’ve given it more consideration than the puppets in the Senate who voted for it the other day.
Comment by Napoleon has left the building Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 12:21 pm
Governor Blagojevich = Weasel Factor
It’s not a good day for you Rod, nor will the ones that follow!
Now Illinois can breathe a little easier for now.
Comment by Memo to Rod Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 12:24 pm
I can’t believe the media falls for Rod’s “no means yes” crap.
Comment by Operation Idiots - Illinois Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 12:29 pm
So how many votes against his plan is enough for the governor to declare victory?
Comment by Frank Booth Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 1:03 pm
There he goes flip-flopping again….is he FOR it or Against it? I am “Dazed and Confused” (a little Led for your head Rich)
Comment by He makes Ryan look like a saint Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 1:10 pm
One wonders how his spokesperson can say this with a straight face.
Comment by ChampaignDweller Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 1:17 pm
Is Harold Katz’ name on the trophy?
Comment by Cal Skinner Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 1:31 pm
Hilarious…vote “no” to indicate you’re not in a rush…How embarassing. Maybe he should instead start talking about cuts
Comment by 105th Blues Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 1:53 pm
Perhaps the House should make Pat Fitzgerald an honorary member of the club. His number of orange jumpsuit wearing politicians is north of 60 and steadily creeping toward the century mark.
Comment by Arthur Andersen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 2:03 pm
What does Cross know about anythng “from a policy standpoint”? Gimme a break!
Comment by Bill Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 2:27 pm
Gotta love it Bill, get ready for cuts. Maybe even your job.
Comment by Poolside @ Hotel Ibiza Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 2:37 pm
So I guess that answers the question “Who’s Yer Daddy Now ?”.
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 2:43 pm
It’s now 2:46 PM. I expect to see a statement from the propaganda machine saying the GRT is “alive and well” and has “legislative support” in about, oh five seconds.
Comment by Bomber91 Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 2:47 pm
Cross knows a lot about policy. He was right to begin the revolt against the GRT, when no one else seemed willing to begin the debate.
Comment by leigh Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 2:53 pm
In the total lack of leadership on the governor’s part Speaker Madagin has shown the capacity to efficiently and effectively fill both rolls! I vote for a significant pay increase for the Speaker. Since he is doing BOTH jobs he deserves it.
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 2:56 pm
Hot Rod claims it wasn’t to save face…whatta bald faced liar. This is gonna be a long hot summer…
Comment by Crimefighter Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 3:11 pm
Most interesting part: Following the debate and the vote, Madigan announces that House Democrats will caucus next Tuesday morning to discuss an alternative tax proposal.
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 3:29 pm
Governor Blagojevich hasn’t been in touch with reality since took the oath of office 4+ years ago. All his handlers do, is fawn all over him, telling him how good looking he is and how great everything is and how the people love him so. If he doesn’t have a prepared speech or soundbite for the public or the media he’s toast.
Wonder if Rod had displanary problems when he was being brought up?
Time to take a Time Out Rod!
Comment by Uttal Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 3:46 pm
Limerick where are you? Today would be a good day for one or two.
Comment by Tea Leaves Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 3:50 pm
Alternate tax plan? You mean, like House Bill 750? That’s a pretty good alternate; and as a bonus, it comes pre-packaged with a lot of support.
Madigan gets to exempt himself from the trophy?
Comment by Squideshi Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 4:07 pm
No matter how Rod spins it, he got severely
“SPANKED” today.
Thankfully, the adults prevailed.
Comment by Poolside @ Hotel Ibiza Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 4:09 pm
Where’s demgrrl at now? Probably trying to do things for “people.” (What does that even mean?)
Comment by Gene Parmesan Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 4:24 pm
Squid - I’m guessing that the alternative will be more along the lines of what the Metropolitan Mayor’s Caucus is suggesting when it comes to revenue streams: 1. Increase corporate and personal income tax; 2. Create an alternative minimum tax (sounds like madigan wants it to apply only to established companies though, which could be tricky); 3. Expand gambling (which also is a top issue of the Chicagoland Chamber); 4. Possibly include a consumer services tax (a.k.a. expand the sales tax).
I think that they might also put the old version of “closing corporate loopholes” back on the table too, but that was only $300 million, according to Madigan.
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 4:40 pm
I don’t trust Elvis. He didn’t ask for a “NO” vote on this unless he’s got Plan B. He’s not going to go down in defeat on this and Plan B will make us wish we had Plan A.
Comment by Little Egypt Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 5:08 pm
Time to cut the patronage fat!
Subtract employees this time, that doesn’t mean ADD employees Rod.
If the CTA can do it, certainly the State of Illinois can do it.
Comment by Medwyn Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 5:10 pm
The gov has shown his unleadership skills. His plan B is not to have a plan. He wants Madagin and Jones to “force” a plan on him so he can veto it and suffer the humiliation of an overide. Then he will run to the bank to get and spend like an openended credit card. Then he’ll run for reelection for the next 2 or 3 years saying he didn’t raise taxes. He has made himself irrelevant but still wants the spotlight. Time to move on . . . MM will make the important decisions and the state will survive. But come next election just remember there is no functioning governor to reelect.
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 5:18 pm
i’m back!
gp - doing things for people? I guess that means trying to help people make a better life for themselves and their family, which maybe you don’t know all that much about.
when are you folks going to wake up and realize that an increase in income and sales tax is far more regressive than the grt could ever be? how can you accept making low and middle income people pay more for the state’s needs when these big corps with their multi-million salaried ceos are paying zip? do you want to pay more in taxes? if so, fight on for a sales or income tax increase.
Comment by demgrrl Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 5:50 pm
psssst drmgrrl - the grt is dead, gone, no longer in play, caput, etc. Now, where is the gov’s leadership? You know, getting folks to come together and compromise for the good of all? Not to worry, Madagin will provide that leadership - at next Tuesday’s caucus meeting. Where will the gov be then? At home in Chicago where he is most of the time anyway. And totally sheltered from the peoples press for Q & A, unscripted. He’s a loser and by his own hand has become irrelevant.
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 6:02 pm
Demgrrl…just got through this thread, as I see you did as well. I must say that I enjoyed our free exchange of ideas yesterday, and even though I think you’re completely wrong on the topic and you would likely say the same about me…and, frankly, even though I think you toe the administration’s line just a little too much…I appreciated the dialogue.
However, if I hear one more supporter of the GRT reference ‘big corps’ with ‘multi-million salaried ceos’, or something like that, I think I’m going to snap.
My father owns a small business in the suburbs. The GRT would take away almost his entire profit margin. This is not an exaggeration — this is a hard fact. Looking at the numbers over the last several years, this is abundantly clear.
Today was my father’s birthday. I haven’t talked to him yet, but I’m pretty sure this ‘0′ vote is the best present he could have received. It means he gets to stay in business. It means his 20 or so employees get to keep their jobs and health insurance.
In case you’re curious, my mother is a teacher who has held picket signs demanding more funding. So I try to straddle both lines.
There has to be a better solution out there, and to find it everyone will have to consider every option. Ruling several choices out at the get-go helps no one, yet the Governor has done that.
Give Representatives more credit than the Governor’s press team did — the Gov’s assertion that the discussion has just begun, that Representatives weren’t listening to the first two months of the Governor’s campaign for his plan (and yes, that’s what this has been, a campaign), is just pap.
At least Representatives brought him and his supporters in, along with others, to hear what they had to say.
The Governor has so far shown no willingness to do that.
Comment by So Ill Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 6:03 pm
Yellow,
Don’t get all excited.
Madigan said “a tax plan” not an alternative tax plan. Who knows what they will talk about? Besides can he get enough repub votes to override the Gov’s veto of the most massive, draconian, regressive, punitive tax increase in Illinois history. Those rich guys over at the Chamber gotta be having a good laugh over this. They won’t have to bear any of the cost.
Comment by Bill Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 6:50 pm
Are those like Bill and Demgrll willing to admit the GRT is dead? I don’t think anyone wants higher taxes, but it seems clear everyone wants something to happen. Why not compromise. I’m sure some sort of GRT or a variation thereof could be worked out with other revenue enhancements. It’s silly for the Gov to continue this my way or the highway mentality of his.
Comment by Anon Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 6:57 pm
What is it about “the GRT is DEAD, DOA, off the table etc.” that you don’t get. My way or the highway has become “the highway”. MM will start cleaning up the gov’s mess next Tuesday. Sharpen your pencils, get a new legal pad and prepare for a lesson in real governing.
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 7:04 pm
What I find interesting about all of this is how disorganized the Democrats are. They have the Governor, House, and Senate, but they can’t get on the same page. This is getting down-right embarassing. They basically told Rod to “go fly a kite” today - and not in a nice way. I can’t wait to see what happens next. They are acting like a bunch of selfish school girls. How about talking with each other and coming up with some solutions instead of playing all of these games? You were elected to govern the state….
Comment by Holdingontomywallet Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 8:11 pm
Speaking of leadership, has anyone heard anything from Emil Jones on this issue? I remember when he was a big supporter of the gov’s failed grt plan. You’d think he would have something to contribute to the process, huh?
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 8:28 pm
OH! My mistake - he did. He had his 7 Chicago area African American senators vote present instead of for or against. Wow, quite the parlementarian! Guess they couldn’t find some arcane cute maneuver to pull, like last week on the energy, screw the billpayers, issue.
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 8:40 pm
This is as much of a non-starter issue as Dubya’s social security privatization. Regardless of the facts and the opinions, the general public and the lawmakers are scared. An increase in taxes, coupled with the soaring energy and oil costs, could be a final nail in the coffin. I think the general public sees the governor and wonders why he can’t commit to cutting government waste if he wants to provide more services and programs. They see the governor and wonder why he and the lawmakers cannot act like a family that is forced to tighten its budget when times are tough. Well, times in Illinois are lean. That is a reality.
Comment by Team Sleep Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 9:15 pm
I find it curious that the $7 Billion number was picked, even though it varies up to $10 Billion from speech to speech. I thought you needed a budget first and then you checked your available revenues and made the necessary adjustments. My thinking is that a whole lot less is actually “needed” if the state sticks to only what it is mandated to do.Like maybe $1 Billion. Thoughts? And remember this is not a candy store, this is serious business.
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 9:24 pm
demgrrl you ask “do you want to pay more in taxes?” No, I don’t. And I don’t want other low and middle income taxpayers paying more either. Not through a sales and income tax and not in a grt. Check out the results on the other page asking bloggers the same thing. Whole lotta #3’s over there.
Comment by Gene Parmesan Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 9:28 pm
Blago himself is the biggest problem with the GRT. It’s not that anyone is against health care reform or school funding, or a restructuring of the tax system. It’s that they don’t trust the Current Non-Occupant to handle that money well, especially with so many other bills going unpaid.
BTW, I read a story today that says Illinois state colleges and universities are suffering a HUGE financial burden because the state is not paying for the veteran’s tuition grants… and it’s forcing them to raise fees and tuition for other students. See a pattern here? If this keeps up, someday Illinois public universities are going to start treating veterans the way doctors treat Medicaid patients. Since my husband is a full-time student on a veteran’s grant, and my daughter was on Medicaid for two years (thankfully not anymore), I don’t trust Blago farther than I can throw him, so to speak.
Personally I wouldn’t mind if the income tax were raised half a percent or so… I don’t think it would be a make-or-break thing. It would be better to have a small tax paid by a lot of people than a large tax paid by only a few. I would prefer a moderate income tax hike to the GRT (even though I am not a business owner) because the economic ripple effects might be less. But I don’t trust the current administration to do it.
Comment by Lainer Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 9:30 pm
The gov said he wanted the $7-$10 Billion GRT or he would cut out $1 Billion in state costs. Looks like we’re ahead by $8-$11 Billion at this point. Doubt it’ll hold though. But just maybe not even $1 Billion more is “needed”.
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 9:54 pm
A baaaaad 2 weeks for Jones & Blago. Back to the drawing board. Fire the person who brought in the kooky Doug Kane and start over. Keep it under $3 billion this time, will ya?
Comment by Truth Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 10:19 pm
$3 Billion for What? How about a budget cut and cutting taxes? Course that would take real reform and renewal leadership. Not from the gov’s executive branch!
Comment by A Citizen Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 10:39 pm
Demgrrl, how many of “these big corps with their multi-million salaried ceos” actually exist in Illinois? 1,000? 2,000? How many companies exist with under $10M-$20M in rev that will be effected by this? My guess, well over 500,000. Probably several in your town keeping 40-50 people working. They are paying taxes, their employees pay taxes, their money gets taxed several times as it moves through the economy, and CEO salaries are far from 100x the lowest salary person. Go after the whales if the urge is there. Leave the minnows alone to keep doing what they are doing, providing good jobs in local economies. Seems DOA anyway.
Comment by zatoichi Thursday, May 10, 07 @ 10:52 pm