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Chicago vs. Downstate

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Illinois

* From the Chicago Reader’s take on Chicago vs. Downstate…

The animosity between Illinois’s largest city and its smaller towns is almost as old as the state itself. I say “almost,” of course, because Chicago, incorporated in 1837, is 19 years younger than Illinois, which is set to begin a yearlong celebration of its bicentennial on December 3. Downstaters have always thought of Chicago as a black hole of street violence and political corruption, sucking up tax dollars generated by honest, hard-working farmers. Chicagoans have always thought of downstate—when they’ve thought of it at all—as an irrelevant agricultural appendage full of Baptists and gun owners who’d just love to turn Illinois into North Kentucky.

For most of Illinois’s history, the two spheres have been evenly matched in influence, with downstate contributing some of Illinois’s most important political figures, from Abraham Lincoln to Adlai Stevenson. Downstate was also the forcing ground of internationally known industries: Moline gave us John Deere, Peoria gave us Caterpillar, and Decatur gave us Staley, which in 1920 hired George Halas to coach a company football team he would move to Chicago the following year and rename the Bears.

More recently, though, the misunderstandings and alienation between Chicago and downstate have been ramped up by two particularly 21st-century phenomena: globalization and political polarization. As the big global city in the northeastern corner of the state sucks jobs and college graduates out of the rest of Illinois, downstate is becoming older, less educated, less prosperous, more reactionary, and more Republican. Politically, downstate is in complete opposition to the Chicago area, especially on such culturally charged matters as gun rights, LGBT rights, and abortion. But it lacks the votes to bend the state to its will on any of those issues. This was never more evident than in 2010, when Governor Pat Quinn defeated state senator Bill Brady, a social conservative from Bloomington, despite carrying only four of the state’s 102 counties—and could’ve won by carrying only Cook County. […]

Obviously, a lot of downstaters are mad as hell about losing political and economic influence to Chicago. But do Chicagoans even notice? And if they notice, do they even care? No, and probably not. Culturally, Chicagoans don’t identify with—or even think much about—the state they inhabit. As a friend puts it, “I’m not an Illinoisan. I’m a Chicagoan.” I once mentioned to another Chicago friend that I’d just visited a small town in southern Illinois, “down by the border with Kentucky.” She looked at me quizzically. “Illinois doesn’t have a border with Kentucky,” she said. (This is someone with a master’s degree—but not in geography.)

posted by Rich Miller
Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 8:37 am

Comments

So if in the event of separation I find myself living in Northern Kentucky, can I legally call my ’shine “Bourbon”?

Comment by Enemy of the State Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 8:47 am
Lack of perspective beyond one’s self is, in my humble opinion, a growing social problem and one that increasingly keeps our politics, our government and our society from being able to move forward.
It manifests itself in both the downstater and the Chicagoan who can’t see let alone bother to care about a life, a community different than their own bubble of existence and train of thought.
The politics of dismissiveness.
I hold little hope for improvement anytime soon.

Comment by Michelle Flaherty Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 8:54 am
I was born and raised in Chicago. Attended Evanston High School and DePaul Law School. I moved downstate in 1974 and my observations are similar to yours. My family in Chicago think I live in “Hicksville” Many people here think Chicago is a hell hole, (except when it comes to the Cubs and Bears)

One change I have noticed over 40 years is that when I came here in 74, Springfield was still the hub of state government albeit only for 6 months a year. State officials lived here, (many educated their kids here) and there were far more state employees that there are presently. To some extent this has made the Chicago-downstate divide even greater.

Comment by Stuart Shiffman Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 8:57 am
The contrast between Chicago and the rest of the state is not all that different than what’s happening across the country. Globalization and technology has fundamentally changed the way that things get done. Jobs will continue to dwindle in less populated areas that historically relied on manufacturing and increase in the more densely populated urban areas that are better able to attract the talent needed to support the tech enabled economy. And as those trends continue to accelerate the political divide will only deepen and opportunist will effectively pander to it on that basis.

Comment by Pundent Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:05 am
Good article, being a downstater, I don’t think Chicago politicians respect the fact that we have different needs and we need different things to be competitive economically. Rural Indiana, Iowa and Kentucky are doing better than Illinois because they have different policies and and are more business friendly. Chicago can get away with policies that downstate Illinois can’t, but we can’t get a break down here because Chicago Politicians have to appease their base.

I use to think Mitchell was nuts when he introduce the bill creating two states, but now I’m wondering if it’s the only solution for Downstate Illinois economic future.

Comment by Ahoy! Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:12 am
Shiffman

These jobs didn’t go to Chicago. State jobs in Springfield just like private sector jobs disappeared because of automation or outsourcing. For example there’s no need to print and mail out state checks anymore when you have direct deposit. I believed that facility was in Litchfield. The private sector has also made state run distribution centers for prisons and other government facilities irrelevant and too expensive.

Democrats abandoned these towns after labor unions left it’s embarrassing and they wonder why they voted for Trump. Seeing them just as votes and not vital members to the state and country. Republicans do the same thing just look at the tax cuts. I agree I don’t see the divide between Chicago and downstate being resolved anytime soon.

Comment by Almost the Weekend Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:12 am
this rural/urban divide is not just an Illinois thing. heard it all the time about family in other states.

Comment by Amalia Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:16 am
Now downstate has a super-powerful representative in the governor’s seat who’s made Illinois far worse and caused more per capita damage arguably than any governor in history. This sitting governor bought an entire political party and spent millions of dollars in politics to push his influence while governing. Ironic, for the folks downstate who scream about how bad and corrupt Chicago Democrats are.

Comment by Grandson of Man Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:18 am
Aesop fables, the town mouse and the counrty mouse

Comment by Rabid Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:20 am
I wonder does…
Northern California and LA have a similar dynamic?
Northen Nevada and Vegas?
Northern Florida and Miama?

Having a few acquaintances from New York state, I have come to understand NYC and upstate NY to have a similar ‘rivalry”.

It seems to me this may be an unavoidable consequence of a major metro area and it’s surrounding rural state.

Comment by Anonymous Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:23 am
As the President might Twit, “sad.”

Comment by Lt Guv Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:25 am
@ Rabid 9:20
Great comparison, one sided perhaps, but certainly shows that this is nothing new in society.

Comment by Anonymous Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:26 am
==I use to think Mitchell was nuts when he introduce the bill creating two states, but now I’m wondering if it’s the only solution for Downstate Illinois economic future. ==

As the article indicates, this would be an economic disaster for downstate. Chicago pretty much funds itself, the collar counties add revenue, and downstate takes. That’s reality. Don’t fool yourself; in a split, the collar counties would stick with Chicago.

I’ve lived and worked all over Illinois (deep south to Chicago). The resentment of downstaters is real, but it is fueled by politicians like Mitchell who reinforce the idea that downstate supports Chicago, when the opposite is reality.

Comment by Pot calling kettle Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:27 am
Once again it is worth reading the entire article.

I am reminded of a Twitter post that my niece wrote some time ago. She is finishing a professional program at a prestigious private out of state university. I will try to paraphrase -

“I sometimes regret meeting new people. For example -
HE - Where are you from?
ME - Illinois
HE - Oh, Chi-
ME - NO !!!”

That says a lot.

Comment by illini Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:27 am
Not all Chicagoans and suburbanites are that ignorant of our place in the Midwest. Some of us actually drive to other places, see them, visit them. Learn about them.

Agree with Pundent’s comments at 9:05. The differences between rural and urban environments continue to deepen.

Comment by poe Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:39 am
Ahoy, if you think central planning by state politicians is anything more than a minor factor in the movement of international capital, I have a diamond mine in Lincoln County to sell you.

Where does this idea come from, other than self-serving politicians and snake-oil grifters like Arduin, Laffer and Moore? No one from U of C is winning Nobel prizes in economics selling that stuff. No economists are peddling it at all.

Consumers drive the economy and rural
America has been depopulating for 100 years relative to metro areas. You don’t need a passel of kids to farm anymore for the free labor. It’s a much more capital-intensive enterprise.

Same with manufacturing in the United States. Fewer workers to operate smarter machines.

Comment by wordslinger Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:41 am
Excellent article. Should be required reading. And to the comment about splitting the state being the only economic hope for Downstate, I would refer you to the article on the Ohio River valley counties cited a day or two ago.

Comment by Out Here In The Middle Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:41 am
>Dan Krankeola, president and CEO of Illinois South Tourism, which serves 22 counties south of Interstate 70, says he barely bothers marketing to Chicago.

Missed opportunity. Michigan and Wisconsin market heavily and effectively in Chicago and Southern Illinois has a lot to offer.

Comment by Earnest Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:51 am
In my experiences, it’s been a lot of folks you moved to Chicago from out of state who contribute to seem to bask in the “Chicago bubble.” As a lifelong Chicagoan, I do not subscribe to the “I am a Chicagoan, not an Illinoisan” thinking at all. Central and Southern Illinois is beautiful country.

Comment by perrier Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 9:59 am
wordslinger you have missed my point entirely.
Communities the similar size of Decatur, Peoria, Champagne & Springfield are doing better in other states. Most likely because other states have a more favorable political climate which leads to a better business climate which means more jobs and opportunities.

I grew up Central Illinois, my classmates didn’t leave for Chicago, a lot of them just left the state. And yes, I believe the State Government has created an environment where people and capital move away from our state.

Comment by Ahoy! Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:00 am
=== Most likely because other states have a more favorable political climate===

And take care of their regional universities.

Comment by Rich Miller Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:01 am
Downstate needs to take partial responsibility for its own demise. Most of these towns and cities have lack a clear development plans. Most have structural problems that exacerbate economic issues:
- farmland is taxed at a much lower rate than residential ( 2%). Farmers don’t reinvest in their communities, they take their money out of state.
- local governments are addicted to sales tax revenues, which has become a big issue since the advent of the internet.
- before the internet, local governments sold out to big box out of state chain retailers, investing public funds in business loops moving retail from downtowns to outer areas, and destroying locally owned businesses.
- central/southern communities spend too much tax dollars on public safety ca education.
- there is a development at all costs attitude which has lead to ugly unorganized sprawl. Many of these communities now lack the character and charm that would be an incentive for investment.

Comment by Keywahnee Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:03 am
Semi-random thoughts:

–Note that Mitchell’s proposal is Cook County only–the collar counties would stay in New Illinois (name contest for both?), thus helping balance the books.

–Pro Publica recently set up shop here in IL and one of the reporters posed the question –honestly and with a desire to learn–”what is “downstate Illinois”?

https://www.propublica.org/article/defining-downstate-illinois

–As one born and raised in Chicago, now living in the suburbs, and working closely with staff and government types in central IL, I can state unequivocally that I don’t give a rat’s behind about “Chicago v. Downstate.” Do your job. Pay your taxes. Don’t be sexist or racist.

–The politics of division are what’s messing everything up right now. This along with the undue influence of money in politics is corrupting the system more than ever. Why, for example, would there be a SB1451 (the Small Cell Wireless Bill) if telecoms weren’t in Springfield influencing policy? Oh, and look–it doesn’t apply to Chicago!

Comment by Lefty Lefty Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:14 am
Central planning by Springfield is precisely the reason for the decline in the non Chicago areas of the state.

How can a company in rural Illinois compete with our neighboring states for jobs and capital when the Chicago Democratic politicians have hamstrung them with workers comp, other regulations and higher taxes imposed on them but not their competitors in our neighboring states that are all RTW?

Chicago Democrats or central planners even went as far to impose criminal penalties on local officials who voted to go RTW.

Interesting how we have lost more population and jobs than all of our neighboring mostly rural states but the usual suspects continue to deny, deflect and mock.

Comment by Lucky Pierre Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:24 am
Great piece. Lays out the issue very well. Unfortunately, I don’t see a solution to the rural-urban/liberal-conservative dichotomy. Will the state eventually split? I would say there is at least a 50-50 chance, eventually. Same could happen in California and other places. I see “balkanization” as the eventual trend in the country given the extreme political and cultural polarization now rampant. Unfortunately, the Civil War is not over. It was just on hiatus for a century.

Comment by up2now Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:31 am
So Keywahnee, You think farmland should be taxed at residential rate? Farmers don’t reinvest in their communities? Where do you think farmers spend their money? Try doing a little research before you speak of things which you have no clue. They buy their combines, tractors, seed, fuel, labor and most everything else they use in raising a crop in Illinois. John Deere, Cat, Pioneer, just to name a few. They bank at in their local county and pay huge amounts of property taxes on their ground.

Comment by Nieva Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:31 am
LP, I do not deny that rural America has been depopulating for 100 years, there’s nothing of substance to your handful of talking points to deflect, but your daily robotic chanting is eminently mockable.

I know you dig the simultaneous give-and-take, big fella, I hope that was good for you. But I’m not finding it very stimulating. It’s not you, it’s me.

Comment by wordslinger Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:39 am
While it is true that Southern Illinois takes more state tax dollars than it generates, I am rather certain that most Southern Illinoisans would happily be willing to split the state in half and take the risk that we would lose some state tax dollars.

Also worth mentioning is that this notion exists all over the country in various forms.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._state_partition_proposals

The reason it never happens is that the bar to clear is rather high.

Article IV, Section 3, Clause 1 of the United States Constitution

“New States may be admitted by the Congress into this Union; but no new State shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or Parts of States, without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of the Congress.”

Comment by Saluki Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:45 am
It does not get any more “central planning” than criminalizing your political adversaries in local governments who advocate right to work.

That you deny this was just voted on and passed in the Illinois Senate is eminently mockable.

Why our are neighboring states, who are mostly rural and lack proximity to the economic engine of Chicago, growing manufacturing jobs and we are not?

Chant something about that that makes some sense.

Comment by Lucky Pierre Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:52 am
It was a terrific piece with enough historical background to make the divide (Chicago-Downstate/North-South) more comprehensible.

It’s true that local communities have experience and knowledge of their immediate surroundings, but I don’t see small communities being able to solve a problem no one has solved, beyond suggesting that everybody just leave already.

Solving “the Rust Belt problem” proved intractable even for the Democrats at the national level in 2016.

I’m interested in what gubernatorial candidates will propose for reviving Downstate, not just at the general policy level but at the level of specific proposals.

Comment by dbk Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 10:56 am
The two could coexist if there as realization that one size doesn’t fit all for policies. Numerous statutes except out Chicago in their favor (not by name, but by “any city over 500,000″), yet many policies that may be fitting for the metro, are not fitting for downstate, but they get passed anyway.

And yes, some of the surrounding states, while still having urban/rural divides, do a better job of paying attention to the downstate.

To the point that Chicago sends more downstate than the downstate sends Chicago, I get that. However, if the downstate had more control over policies/statutes, I suspect there’d be more money for locals to work with and make the downstate dollars go farther. Illinois is not a partner to its downstate communities.

Comment by Shemp Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 11:12 am
When I went to NIU in the mid 80s, I was asked, “Where are you from” by many people. I live in Chicago so I said Chicago. They would alwYs respond, “What Suburb”.

I would always have to say back CHICAGO

Of Course, I hate Chicago. It is not because of the politics. I am an independent. It is because the older I get, the more I hate the traffic and it gets worse every year.

Also, the drivers are more aggressive then they used to be. I ha e only seen worse drivers in Manhattan (the rest of New York is equal to Chicagoland), Miami, Las Angeles, and Houston.

The friendliest drivers that I have ever seen have been in Louisville Kentucky by far and a distant second would be in Virginia Beach.

Comment by Anonymous Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 11:14 am
I didn’t say farmland should be taxed at the same rate as residential. I am arguing it should be taxed at a higher rate. I have worked with/for some of the largest farmers in this state. These guys spends my times more on their houses in Naples and Palm Beach, than their houses in Lincoln and Taylorville. Their kids are all set up in investment properties in NYC and Chicago, and their investments are held with out of state money managers. Sure, they buy equipment and supplies in State.

I agree with Lucky that employment restrictions hamper investment. However I would argue that a lack of central planning is a major cause of downstate’s problems. Real zoning regulations and a preference for local business over chains would be an enormous benefit to downstate. The whole economy is based on get rich quick over long term sustainable development.

Comment by Keywahnee Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 11:26 am
* higher rate than what is being taxed currently, not a higher rate than residential

Comment by Keywahnee Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 11:29 am
Illinois, without Chicago, is largely Appalachia without the mountains.

And how dare “Chicago politicians” try to give us things like worker protection and LGBT rights!

I am not a fan of Chicago (the city — too big, too noisy, too much not for me). But I don’t see that it is the total and terrible city that others might.

And I’ve never lived there — born and bred in Central Illinois.

Comment by IllinoisCitizen Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 11:39 am
Lots of diversity downstate that Chicagoans are intellectually uninterested about … Too many in Chicago have their blinders on … but, in the end, we are one state

Comment by West Wing Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 11:52 am
Finally, someone telling the truth about today’s actual butter and egg men, rather than their politically cultivated portrait of Ma and Pa American Gothic.

Comment by crazybleedingheart Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 11:52 am
@Keywahnee - with all respect I have to challenge the statement and assertions you make about farmers wintering in Palm Beach, buying investment properties in NYC, and having out of state money managers.

These are not the farmers I know. Please don’t paint this broad and untruthful picture. For any example you might be able to cite I can give you dozens of scenarios where that is absolutely not the case.

Comment by illini Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 12:09 pm
===Farmers don’t reinvest in their communities, they take their money out of state.===

Those who live here do. Somewhere north of 50% of all farmland in the state is owned by “absentee landowners.”

And as mentioned elsewhere, farming has lost its need for labor-intensive measures…and to have a generous self-supporting farm income, you need to be owning and farming at least a section (1 square mile) or 2 of land these days, with a few rare exceptions. Over the next 20-30 years, we might even see a greater trend toward urban farming using greenhouse/hydroponic technology, and also weaning ourselves off of ethanol fuel and carnivorous diets, both of which consume the majority of our grain production these days. Most trends point to further urbanization of the populace; increased telecommuting or use of automated vehicles (for those who would prefer rural living) are about the only counter-trends I can think of that would stem it a little bit.

Comment by Six Degrees of Separation Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 12:16 pm
Both Downstate and Chicago are obsessed with the same thing - Chicago.

Comment by VanillaMan Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 12:35 pm
I still remember speaking with a Chicagoan several years back who proudly stated they’d never been south of I80. As a downstater, I couldn’t help responding that they’ve missed seeing the best part of the state then.

Both parts of the state have good aspects and bad. They both have parts with significant poverty too. It’d be nice if they could focus on the common issues instead of the divisive ones.

Comment by logic not emotion Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 12:57 pm
– Illinois without Chicago is largely Applachia without the mountains.–

That is an ignorant and absurd stereotype, as are most of these Chicago/Downstate über-generalizations.

I could take you on a pub crawl in Chicago where you’d hear nothing but rock-ribbed GOP chatter, and another one Downstate where you’d run into nothing but stoned hippies young and old.

Majority status in a geographic area does not equal monolithic status.

Comment by wordslinger Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 1:02 pm
===and another one Downstate where you’d run into nothing but stoned hippies young and old.===

Let me know where and when.

Comment by Ducky LaMoore Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 1:16 pm
== To the point that Chicago sends more downstate than the downstate sends Chicago, I get that. However, if the downstate had more control over policies/statutes, I suspect there’d be more money for locals to work with and make the downstate dollars go farther. Illinois is not a partner to its downstate communities. ==

There has to be some truth to this. Splitting the state is not a panacea by any means, but creating animosity between two regions of one state is a great distraction to actually legislating in a meaningful way, which would include consideration of laws/policies based on how they actually affect the different regions of this great state.

Downstate and Chicago do exist as unique regions, but there’s no cultural reason they can’t both be governed effectively - only political reasons.

Comment by Downstate43 Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 1:35 pm
Like the Baldwin that does’t act, the Osmond who doesn’t sing, Downstate is tired of being asked about its world famous sibling.

Everytime their famous sibling makes news, they get asked how far they are from Chicago. Although they get more out of the fame than they put in, Downstate wants everyone to know they are as good as Chicago.

Sure ya are, little feller - sure ya are.

Comment by VanillaMan Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 2:10 pm
Just to echo others, indeed an excellent piece. Ted McC’s work is always really 1st-rate (how many folks can recall his famous early 2000 profile in the Reader?) More folks ought to know his work than I think do…
It also reminds me of Emil Jones Jr.’s great line from some years back: “outside of Chicago there’s this place called Illinois”…

Comment by The Historian Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 2:23 pm
No one wants Illinois coal anymore. This isn’t Chicago’s fault. But I’ll take the two senators.

Comment by Da Big Bad Wolf Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 2:48 pm
==..and another [pubcrawl] Downstate where you’d run into nothing but stoned hippies young and old.==
That reminds me of hitchhiking through Texas in the 70s. Met a lot of stoned hippies, young and old.I though Texas was all hippies for a while.

Comment by Da Big Bad Wolf Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 2:55 pm
VanillaMan - if your comment was intended to be snark you failed terribly.

If this does fairly represent your feelings, I can only say that your statement probably epitomize the mindset of many who consider those of us who live downstate as being second class citizens and unworthy of any respect. Sad.

Comment by illini Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 3:10 pm
Like many rural states, many of which run a budgetary surplus, Illinois without chicago or the suburbs would be just fine.

Comment by Toast Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 3:44 pm
===Illinois without chicago or the suburbs would be just fine===

You’d lose thousands of jobs from prison and other facility closings. Your schools would be charging out of state tuition to Chicago-area kids, so you’d lose tens of thousands of those as well. And you’d finally have to start paying for whatever else you get, which you aren’t now.

Don’t be a dope.

Comment by Rich Miller Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 3:46 pm
“Illinois doesn’t have a border with Kentucky,” she said. (This is someone with a master’s degree—but not in geography.)

I think here demonstrates the downstate/chicago struggle. The numbers bear that chicago (actually chicagoland - I have yet to see chicago broken away from cook county) actually subsidizes downstate. But when chicago politicians have policies the kill downstate economic development, stop the expansion of CAT, DEERE, ADM and STATE FARM downstate, and continue to hire madigan as the speaker you can’t blame downstate for having some hard feelings toward chicago

Comment by Anonymous Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 4:34 pm
==If this does fairly represent your feelings, I can only say that your statement probably epitomize the mindset of many who consider those of us who live downstate as being second class citizens and unworthy of any respect. Sad==

OH and they’re really touchy, just like Roger Clinton.

LOL

Comment by VanillaMan Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 4:39 pm
Rich, it may be an oversimplification, but indeed, plenty of other rural states in the plains and upper midwest are in far better shape financially and their rural areas are in better shape. Albeit just one measure, but if I don’t give it, I’ll get the third degree for not citing: https://www.mercatus.org/statefiscalrankings

Comment by Shemp Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 4:40 pm
–stop the expansion of CAT, DEERE, ADM and STATE FARM downstate, –

And how did they do that?

Comment by wordslinger Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 5:17 pm
The article raised some interesting points about the divide in Illinois. When I think about other populous states with large cities there’s always multiple metro areas (i.e. California, NY, Texas, Florida, Pennsylvania) and Illinois has Chicago and then some St. Louis suburbs. I wonder if the lack of another larger MSA to balance economic growth downstate has had some impact on the state of downstate.

Comment by MyTwoCents Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 5:24 pm
===Illinois without chicago or the suburbs would be just fine===

I’ll echo the suburb sentiment. I wasted some of the best years of my life living in a place with all the inconvenience of city and absolutely none of the fun. I need to be in the thick of the city or on a lake in the middle of nowhere. Everything in-between is just filler.

Comment by Ducky LaMoore Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 8:44 pm
Ducky, check out Oak Park.

After many decades, the iron grip of the Women’s Christian Temperance Union has been broken and it ain’t a chore to get a drink anymore. Great restaurant with bars are popping up everywhere in walking distance, there’s new condo and apartment residential going vertical and the Miracle Mile of Madison Street in Forest Park is just a stumble away.

With the Green line, Blue Line, Metra, and Ike, youre in the city quick, and you’ve got easy back door access to O’Hare and Midway. If you’re going mobile, it’s the place to be.

Comment by wordslinger Thursday, Nov 16, 17 @ 11:03 pm