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* Press release…
With the strong support of Governor JB Pritzker, the Illinois State Police (ISP) is taking wide ranging steps to improve operations, firearms services processes, and information sharing to aid law enforcement officials statewide with enforcement of Firearm Owner’s Identification (FOID) card revocation laws. These first steps are part of ISP’s continued commitment to improving the enforcement of existing gun laws in Illinois.
“While the weaknesses of our nation’s background check system remain daunting, we must take whatever steps we can, large and small, to strengthen the fabric of these systems because any improvement could be the one that makes the difference,” said Brendan F. Kelly, Acting Director of the Illinois State Police. “While we simply cannot do it alone, we must increase sharing of information, the quality and value of information shared, and most importantly enforcement. Mailed letters are not enough.”
ISP Information Sharing
Access to firearms data within the Department and outside the Department by law enforcement agencies and state’s attorneys cannot be limited and siloed at the expense of public safety. FOID revocation and Firearm Transfer Inquiry Program (FTIP) data must be readily accessible to all Illinois law enforcement agencies. To that end:
· The ISP Firearms Services Bureau is providing the entire current list of individuals with revoked FOID cards to every District and Zone Commander within the ISP.
· Every ISP Patrol and Zone Commander has been instructed by the Director to deliver to each sheriff, police chief, and state’s attorney in their respective zone a current electronic list of all individuals with revoked FOID cards within each jurisdiction and confirm receipt of the list.
· The Firearm Services Bureau has been directed to share FOID card revocation data and FTIP data with the Statewide Terrorism and Intelligence Center (STIC) for appropriate dissemination to state and local law enforcement.
· The Firearm Services Bureau has been directed to require its IT vendor to modify the secure law enforcement web portal to include a FOID revocation list accessible 24/7 to all Illinois law enforcement with a mechanism to log each agency’s date of access.
· The Department is working with our federal partners to ascertain the scope of criminal cases that may have a federal identification number associated with a fingerprint record, but no correlating state identification number for Illinois.
· The Department is working with state entities like the Illinois Criminal Justice Information Authority (ICJIA) to determine if funding to law enforcement agencies and courts can be tied to substantial compliance with criminal record submission requirements.
Quality and Value of Information Provided by ISP
Firearms Services Bureau eligibility determinations for FOID, Firearm Concealed Carry Licenses (FCCL), and FTIP must be standardized, thorough, and inspected. Furthermore, thousands of general notices that simply indicate an individual has a revoked FOID card are not useful data in a law enforcement environment with unending demands and limited manpower. Potential threats can only be assessed and prioritized if law enforcement has useful context and detail. To that end:
· The Firearms Services Bureau has been directed to require all firearms eligibility analysts to follow a standardized FOID/CCL protocol and a comprehensive checklist when conducting and completing FOID/CCL application reviews.
· The Firearms Services Bureau has been directed to increase quality assurance measures for FOID, FCCL, and FTIP transactions to include random reanalysis of approvals, scrutinizing those samples, reporting results to the Director monthly, and taking immediate corrective action as needed.
· The Firearms Services Bureau has enhanced the FOID revocation list shared with all law enforcement to indicate if the revoked FOID has been returned and/or if a Firearm Disposition Report has been submitted to ISP. This information is critical for law enforcement to determine whether a revoked FOID card holder has complied with Illinois law.
· The Firearm Services Bureau has enhanced the FOID revocation list shared with all law enforcement by adding descriptors that include the reason for revocation, such as a felony charge, a clear and present danger determination, an order of protection, mental health prohibitor, or other regulatory reasons for revocation. This will enable law enforcement to properly vet and triage the law enforcement response for a revoked FOID card.
· The Firearms Services Bureau has enhanced the FOID revocation list shared with all law enforcement to include FTIP history which indicates firearm purchase history as well as the number of firearm purchases utilizing FTIP.
Increasing Enforcement
Enforcement must be increased through greater training and awareness among law enforcement stakeholders of FOID laws and penalties, use of FOID data in routine law enforcement, and implementation of specialized gun violence task forces. To that end:
· The Director is working with sheriffs, police chiefs, and state’s attorneys to increase awareness of FOID provisions and penalties.
· The ISP Academy has been directed to review current training of new cadets as well recurring training requirements regarding FOID laws and update as needed.
· The Director’s designee on the Illinois Law Enforcement Training and Standards Board(ILETSB) will encourage ILETSB to review local police training requirements on FOID laws.
· ISP officers in Patrol within each District have been directed to always query FOID revocation status when conducting patrol enforcement activity.
· ISP officers in Investigations within each Zone have been directed to always query FOID revocation status when conducting an investigation.
· The ISP Communication Services Bureau has been directed to require all telecommunicators to query FOID revocation status when officers are conducting enforcement or investigation activity.
· The Firearms Services Bureau has been directed to provide each ISP Investigative Zone with a list of revoked individuals who may have provided false information on a FOID or CCL application to determine if an investigation and request for charges of Forgery may be warranted on a case-by-case basis.
· Each Zone Commander has been directed to review the most current revocation list with local state’s attorneys to determine if investigation and citation for violation of various FOID laws is warranted on a case-by-case basis.
· The Division of Operations has been directed to immediately triage the FOID revocation list by Zone, develop a plan of action for the highest risk individuals, work with sheriffs and local police to plan enforcement actions as appropriate, work with state’s attorneys to seek search warrants as appropriate, and conduct ISP-only enforcement operations as appropriate.
· The Division of Operations has been directed to plan for more specialized enforcement over the long term. In late January 2019, the Office of the Governor requested from ISP the funding, manpower, and new cadet requirements necessary to establish a potential gun violence task force that would include FOID related enforcement to be submitted as part of the budget for FY 2020. That proposal was submitted February 8 and included in the Governor’s budget proposal.
· As part of these efforts, Gun Liaison Officers will be designated in every Investigative Zone to collaborate with local law enforcement agencies, coordinate FOID revocation details with an emphasis on getting guns out of the hands of the most dangerous individuals, and ensuring information regarding FOID card revocations is shared with local law enforcement agencies on an ongoing basis.
This is an aggressive, exhaustive effort within existing ISP manpower and statutory parameters. The ISP Office of Governmental Affairs and Public Information Office have been directed to provide any and all available information to the public and policy makers as further action is considered by the legislature.
This is all long overdue. Many kudos to Director Kelly for taking this on.
Your own thoughts about individual aspects?
posted by Rich Miller
Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:12 am
Sorry, comments are closed at this time.
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Will the database identify when other people at the same residence have valid FOID cards? This can complicate gun searches and seizures.
I hope they are smart about how they detain individuals thought dangerous during the search. Finesse could be better than force.
Comment by Last Bull Moose Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:24 am
Need to hired more state troopers and staff to help with the increased work load.
Comment by Huh? Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:24 am
No money unfortunately.
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:29 am
–The Division of Operations has been directed to immediately triage the FOID revocation list by Zone, develop a plan of action for the highest risk individuals, work with sheriffs and local police to plan enforcement actions as appropriate, work with state’s attorneys to seek search warrants as appropriate, and conduct ISP-only enforcement operations as appropriate.–
This appears to be direction for dealing with the powder kegs out there. I guess time will tell if there is actual increased enforcement.
A marker has been laid, though. If someone whose FOID card has been revoked goes off like Aurora, there should now be a paper trail as to why they still had their guns.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:29 am
==work with sheriffs and local police to plan enforcement actions as appropriate,==
I’m curious how this is going to work with southern Illinois sheriffs like Rohlfing who have claimed that they will refuse to enforce state firearm laws. If they’re going to ignore Illinois state legislation in certain cases, would they refuse to cooperate with certain Illinois State Police enforcement actions as well?
Comment by Lester Holt’s Mustache Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:37 am
The GA should work half as hard and get cracking on Illinois’ perilous condition.
One item would be getting Acting Director Kelly and all the other Acting Directors approved or rejected.
We have an emergency situation here. Let’s act like it. No off days, no one minute sessions. Big problems require tireless efforts.
Would we take a weeks vacation if our family was on the brink of a terrible calamity? Of course not.
Comment by don the legend Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:38 am
Sounds like some good moves overall.
I did see one item that concerned me a bit as a legal gun owner.
== FTIP history which indicates firearm purchase history as well as the number of firearm purchases utilizing FTIP. ==
On the one hand, purchase records are supposed to be available for inspection at each FFL dealer. I’m not familiar with he contents of FTIP. This statement implies there is a centralized database of purchases. I’m wondering if it has more than just name / address / date because I thought the State was not supposed to be maintaining records on actual firearms owned by model and serial number.
Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:42 am
One can only hope the ISP expends effort on removing weapons from the bad guys who never bothered with the FOID/CCL process.
Comment by Behind the Scenes Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:45 am
This one seems like a useful measure…
“The Firearms Services Bureau has enhanced the FOID revocation list shared with all law enforcement to include FTIP history which indicates firearm purchase history as well as the number of firearm purchases utilizing FTIP”
As many have mentioned here before having a FOID does not necessarily mean one owns firearms . Linking the revoked FOID to FTIP data will give LEO a better idea if weapons may need to be searched for.
Comment by Donnie Elgin Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:46 am
Kelly is phenomenal leader and I believe the best Director pick of the lot.
Comment by Honeybear Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:51 am
I continue to be amazed that the FOID card fee is $10 for 10 years ($1/yr!). A fishing license in IL costs $15 per year. The FOID card fee should be raised and the additional revenue should be used to cover ISP costs of issuing the card and for gun violence prevention.
Comment by Barbara Shaw Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:55 am
FTIP numbers growing rapidly ..
number_of_firearm_transfer_inquiry_requests year
151520 2002
154641 2003
157440 2004
154633 2005
162320 2006
160924 2007
189735 2008
225022 2009
229444 2010
275894 2011
https://data.illinois.gov/dataset/553isp_firearm_transfer_inquiry_ftip_requests/resource/2aa710f3-0575-4dbc-87f3-46b2cfc746d2
Comment by Donnie Elgin Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:12 am
RNUG –
the FTIPdatabase contains a transaction number shich the dealler logs in to their A&D book and on the 4473. A date it was issued, and the dealer it was issued to. LEs can then trace tht back to the dealer and pull a 4473 and get make model and serial number.
In years past, CPD used this as a fishing expedition at times when Chicago didn’t allow handguns.
Comment by Todd Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:15 am
Looks like a good start and I hope they follow through.
Additional support to the Bureau that supports LEADS would also be a good idea. They have been woefully under funded/staffed for a long time.
Comment by Bit Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:15 am
RNUG, my understanding of FTIP is that they record the name and address of the purchaser as well as whether the firearm is a long gun or handgun. That was predicted on the old 24 and 72 hour waiting period. Now that the waiting period is 72 hours across the board I’m not sure if that’s still the case.
Comment by Gruntled University Employee Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:18 am
As active LE I wonder why there is no mention of an automatic response being added whenever a LE Officer runs a person that the FOID has been revoked as they do now that says person holds a FOID. It should actually state it has been revoked. If the person still has possession it gets confiscated then and there as do revoked DL’s.
Comment by Anon Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:21 am
My question is will the lines get blurred and what happens when a FOID holder’s card expires and failed to renew? Is this treated like a revocation?
Comment by GreatPlainser Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:23 am
Amazing that this forum only allows those post that reflect Rich Millers point of view. Very biased.
Comment by Just saying Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:23 am
Good steps forward by the ISP and the Governor’s Office.
Comment by West Wing Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:24 am
Having purchased a firearm via private sale; the ISP has a portal where the seller has to check if buyers FOID is in good standing. The ISP creates a authorization number if the FOID is OK . The seller is then required to keep a record of the authorization number, the buyers FOID number, model and serial number of firearm , and the date of the sale. Seller must keep records for 10 years. The ISP only issues the authorization - they would have no way of knowing the type of firearm.
Comment by Donnie Elgin Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:25 am
Three things come to mind.
By dumping this on local law enforcement. Is this the type unfounded regs Shemp and others talk about.
Why use terms like ‘triage’. Sounds way to militaristic for my liking.
The FOID card process does nothing to make us safer than other states. IMO.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:29 am
Don’t allow folks to transfer firearms if their card is revoked, require weapons to be surrendered.
In most cases, I think that the local law enforcement agency that siezed the firearms ought to be able to auction off and keep the money.
Comment by Thomas Paine Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:31 am
===this forum only allows those post that reflect Rich Millers point of view===
Just Saying, when you try to post a comment that reads in part “They think think will help save lives, yet they are about to pass the most liberal abortion laws in the country to kill babies. This state is SO screwed up,” you not only trigger one or two of my comment moderation screens, you also expose yourself as one of those over the top Facebookers, which then tempts me to add your IP address to my moderation list.
Also, a quick search using your IP address shows 18 of your 23 comments since January of 2018 have made it through my filters.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:37 am
Thomas Paine, so your response to mental illness is to seize property.
Comment by Last Bull Moose Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:39 am
===so your response to mental illness is to seize property===
Cute. Try harder.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:43 am
Agree with Thomas Paine about not allowing firearms transfers if their FOID is revoked. Remember the Nashville Waffle House shooter transferred his guns to his father, only to get his guns back when he moved out of state.
Firearms should be seized by law enforcement and only returned upon specific approval from a judge.
Comment by Dance Band on the Titanic Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:47 am
RNUG - “This state is SO screwed up,” you not only trigger one or two of my comment moderation screens, you also expose yourself as one of those over the top Facebookers, which then tempts me to add your IP address to my moderation list.”
Appreciate the response back and my apologies if I stated something in the wrong way. . I was mrerely trying to point out the 2 extremes of their thinking, one is to try to curb violence, yet the other seems quite the contrary with what they want to allow with babies. Did not realize that saying the state is screwed up triggers a comment moderation. Should I use the word messed up instead?
Comment by Just saying Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:55 am
Good. This is the sort of prioritization and enforcement I expect we pay law enforcement for. Not the sort where they join hands and make their “top” priority influencing state legislation to eliminate a 5 plant legal personal cannabis home grow provision, which is currently a misdemeanor offense anyway. There are plenty of important laws to enforce and the ones involving gun safety efforts get my vote. Thank you, ISP.
Comment by XonXoff Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:55 am
FOID section of ISP has been a mess for a long time due to lack of manpower and out of date technology. Those suffering most were law abiding sportsmen caught up in their inefficiencies. I know. I dealt with them and their frustrations on a regular basis in my job. Let’s hope that the inadvertent violator of FOID law isn’t swept up in this new found fervor with the those who need their cards revoked and/or their guns confiscated.
Also, let’s teach those ISP cadets what the law is - not what ISP brass wishes it was and have them go out seizing guns when it isn’t called for.
Comment by Leave a light on George Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 11:02 am
FOID card holders do not exist in a vacuum. Their weapons may have sentimental value to others in their family. They certainly have financial value. That value should be recognized if seized and compensation paid.
If I were to have mental problems that made me unfit to own weapons, I would want my wife and children to decide what to do with them. Not our local sheriff.
We just had a Supreme Court case banning seizures that resulted in being unreasonable fines. My mental decline, which will happen if I live long enough, will cost my family enough grief. Why add property seizure to the mix?
Comment by Last Bull Moose Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 11:16 am
Last Bull Moose. You are so right.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 11:19 am
My gun collection is additionally insured for $60,000. I know dozens and dozens of fellow enthusiasts that make my collection look like peanuts. This action could theoretically cost the state millions per year.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 11:30 am
–If I were to have mental problems that made me unfit to own weapons, I would want my wife and children to decide what to do with them.–
That brilliant thinking directly led to four dead and two wounded at the Nashville Waffle House.
Society has a right and and a responsibility to protect itself from armed lunatics.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 11:40 am
LBM, seems like a succession/legal transfer plan for your guns and ammo should be on you as a responsible gun owner, while you’re of sound mind. Are you suggesting that when you die your beloved guns and ammo go to non-FOID-holding heirs in your family and future generations deal with whatever the fallout is from that?
Comment by XonXoff Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:01 pm
==That value should be recognized if seized and compensation paid.==
So you’ve broken the law and you want to be compensated for it?
==Why add property seizure to the mix?==
If your guns have been seized as a result of mental illness then those guns shouldn’t remain in the possession of anyone in your house or for that matter with your family. As Rich said, look at the Waffle House shooting.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:02 pm
Demorilized.couldnt disagree with you more. The state should have to reimburse for excessive asset forfeiture.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:07 pm
I am not arguing for people whose FOID cards are revoked to keep firearms. Just to have the family handle their disposition.
As an imperfect analogy, when people lose their drivers license we do not seize their cars. A person who drives after a DUI conviction is dangerous. How many people each year are killed by drivers with revoked licenses?
Comment by Last Bull Moose Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:10 pm
===should have to reimburse for excessive asset forfeiture===
So… you’re gonna reimburse somebody who, let’s say, committed a felony by lying on their FOID application?
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:13 pm
===Just to have the family handle their disposition===
That obviously did not work with the Waffle House murderer.
Next!
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:16 pm
No Rich. But for some reason i am deemed with a mental disorder that may or may not lead to violent tendencies. You darn right i should be reimbursed. If a felon has a gun and loses his FOID do you think his guns will ever be found?
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:21 pm
–If a felon has a gun and loses his FOID do you think his guns will ever be found?–
Apparently, you thought so.
A couple of weeks ago, you told a long, evolving story about how you knew these two drug dealers, and their FOID cards were revoked, but you knew they had guns, so you told the authorities, and they looked but couldn’t find them.
When you informed the coppers, wasn’t it your hope and belief that they would find the guns?
Remember that story?
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:30 pm
Word. Not drug dealers. Drug users who got busted with amounts deemed too large. Our drug coalition/help group has law enforcement members as active volunteers. They acted appropriately. And yes, no weapons were removed from society. Whats your point or question again.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:37 pm
These actions will be good when the individuals applying for and who have the Foid and CCW permits have never been outside Illinois. Other jurisdictions outside the State need to report better as well. Aurora was because another State failed in reporting.
Comment by FormerParatrooper Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:44 pm
– Whats your point or question again.–
Like everything posted here, it’s in writing and can be easily referenced.
But, you wrote:
–If a felon has a gun and loses his FOID do you think his guns will ever be found?–
And then I wrote:
–Apparently, you thought so.
A couple of weeks ago, you told a long, evolving story about how you knew these two drug dealers, and their FOID cards were revoked, but you knew they had guns, so you told the authorities, and they looked but couldn’t find them.
When you informed the coppers, wasn’t it your hope and belief that they would find the guns?–
Also, in your original story, you wrote the two involved had their cards revoked “for drug dependency/selling felonies.” So, based on your words, that would make them drug dealers.
Your original story was also in writing and can be referenced, if you need to refresh your memory.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:52 pm
I have already disposed of several weapons so my family does not have to deal with them. Not demented yet, so I think I have time on what is left.
The seizure should be comparable to the crime. And lying on a FOID application is different than having mental problems. There is no crime in being crazy. Just in what you do.
The Waffle House murders happened in part because his father broke the law when he returned the weapons . I have not heard what happened to the father.
Comment by Last Bull Moose Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:07 pm
-Todd-, thanks for the clarification. I didn’t know.
…
I guess I missed all the fun
Been working under the hood of a friend’s classic car; just taking a lunch break and catching up now.
Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:08 pm
==And yes, no weapons were removed from society.==
And that’s a good thing in your mind?
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:11 pm
==Just in what you do.==
Which is why the guns are being taken. So you don’t do anything.
I’m failing to see the unreasonableness in any of this.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:12 pm
For the record. The Firearms Disposition Record would allow me to transfer my collection to my wife. Assuming I am in a mental condition to enable me to process this form.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:22 pm
Move to Missouri its nicer over here
Comment by Anon Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:24 pm
==would allow me to transfer my collection to my wife==
Yes, let’s leave the firearms in the same house as the person who has been declared mentally ill. Great plan.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:26 pm
==Move to Missouri its nicer over here==
Do they allow criminals and the mentally ill to keep their firearms? I’m not sure that qualifies as “nicer.”
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:27 pm
Of the states surrounding Illinois, none have a FOID card requirement, and all except Missouri, have less gun crimes.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:45 pm
Demoralized –
the premis leads to sticky issues. So a person looses their right to own a firearm. They have to surrender to liquidate the asset i.e. guns. Now what do you do if you have a household with multiple FOID card holders? Do they all loose their right to own or keep a firearm?
How are you going to seperate his guns from her guns and prove it? While it seems straight forward its more complicated than just pick up the guns.
And yes a father was completely wrong to have returned the firearms to his son who was mentally ill. No defense of it. So the question becomes how do you create a system that 1. works, 2. doesn’t tax the manpower or resources of LE agencies, 3. allows for due process of this involved?
Comment by Todd Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 1:56 pm
Todd:
I know what I would do but I’m absolutely certain the Constitution wouldn’t like it.
I guess my answer would be to throw anyone in that house in jail for a long, long time should any of their guns be used by the mentally ill person to commit any crimes. Hopefully that would deter them enough to keep their guns under absolute lock down when they aren’t using them.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 2:14 pm
Dem….the Constitution wouldnt like it. You must be referring to ’stop and search’.
Comment by Blue Dog Dem Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 2:26 pm
In response to Lester Holts Mustache. I guess it work with Sheriff Rolfing the same way it does with the sheriff of Cook county when it comes to illegals and ICE. Follow what ever laws yu want and don’t follows the ones mandated by state or federal law. You choose.
Comment by Roger Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 3:36 pm
This entire conversation is pretty irrelevant given that someone with a revoked FOID can’t FFL a weapon in Illinois **at all**. Seems some of you might want to look into how a gun trust works.
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 4:21 pm
To Barbara Shaw: I agree that it is wrong to charge $10 for a 10 year FOID card. It’s like charging you to ecxercize your right to vote. You might not agree, but the right to own a firearm is enshrined in the Bill Of Rights and the SCOTUS has held that to be true. Can you name one other Constitutional Right that you have to ask for permission and pay money to exercise?
Comment by Lou Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 5:01 pm
==You must be referring to ’stop and search’.==
No, I’m not. No idea what conversation you are following but it isn’t mine.
I was referring to removing all guns from the home regardless of the owner when a person’s FOID is revoked for mental illness or another reason. I know that’s not possible for obvious reasons.
My suggestion was to throw someone in jail for a long, long time if a gun they owned ended up being used by someone from their household who had their FOID card revoked due to mental illness (or otherwise). Hopefully that would act as a deterrent and make those people keep their firearms locked up tight when they aren’t in use.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 5:36 pm
==Can you name one other Constitutional Right that you have to ask for permission and pay money to exercise?==
Yeah. You often have to pay for a permit to exercise your 1st Amendment right to assemble.
Contrary to what some believe there is no right in the Constitution that is absolute. None. All of them come with some sort of restriction. If that fee was ridiculously high then I can see an argument being made. But, $10 isn’t stopping anyone from exercising their right.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 5:39 pm
To demoralized:
=Contrary to what some believe there is no right in the Constitution that is absolute. None. All of them come with some sort of restriction. =
So you agree with me that it is Constitutional to require everyone that wants to vote to pay a reasonable fee to apply for a voters ID card that shows they have have been investigated and proved that they met all the voting requirements.
Comment by Lou Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 6:27 pm
Lou:
That wasn’t the question you asked. You asked a specific question and I answered it. I’m not going down your ridiculous rabbit hole with you.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 6:33 pm
And, you may want to actually read the Constitution. The 24th Amendment dealt with your little scenario.
Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 6:38 pm
–So you agree with me that it is Constitutional to require everyone that wants to vote to pay a reasonable fee to apply for a voters ID card that shows they have have been investigated and proved that they met all the voting requirements.–
Have you registered to vote? What did you have to produce to do so? Were those free?
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:54 pm
If FOID cards really worked then other states would copy the process.
Comment by Realistic Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 11:29 pm
The perceived perception that non violent victimless felons and medical users are a threat to society overreach?
Comment by Rabid Thursday, Mar 7, 19 @ 6:47 am
Got to this late. I’ve got no beef with ISP’s plans. I am curious how they intend to coordinate FOIDS & Legal pot. While it doesn’t affect me per se, sorry pot’s not my thing, it needs to be worked out if it’s federally a crime but legal in IL.
Comment by Mason born Thursday, Mar 7, 19 @ 7:57 am
Create a smart card (we have) that is immediately deactivated if there is a revocation. Any attempt to use it will send an alert in real-time to the ISP where the card is being used. We already built it
Comment by Jeff Leston Tuesday, Mar 26, 19 @ 11:50 am