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Daily Herald demands unspecified House rules changes

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Illinois

* Daily Herald editorial…

To change things in Illinois, Democrats first must take the courageous step to vote Madigan out of power. And then they must agree to reforms in House rules that start breaking down the hermetically-sealed decision-making structure Madigan has enjoyed all these years — so that we don’t replace him with someone else who can wield the same unchecked power.

Your thoughts?

posted by Rich Miller
Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 8:54 am

Comments

Uneccessary

Comment by Wow Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:00 am
Glad to see the Daily Herald is current with the state of the Statehouse…

Comment by Gary Hart Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:00 am
Who is running their bureau nowadays?

Comment by Nat Sound Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:07 am
Newspaper editorials are not written to address the concerns of the informed. Sad but true.

Comment by don the legend Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:09 am
Looking forward to the protests,
“What do we want?”
“[indecipherable angry noises]”
“When do we want it?”
“Now (banned punctuation)”

Comment by Monadnock Pigeon Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:09 am
The DH and Tribune are kind of the good cop/bad cop of the Republican Party.

I can’t imagine the Chicago Tribune accepting a black House Speaker. Not just because of Kass and McQueary’s views on race, but also because any member of the Black Caucus will be viewed with distrust because of their current loyalty to Madigan.

I don’t see the DH defending or celebrating the election of a black Speaker.

Neither editorial board will be satisfied with a Speaker who keeps “Madigan’s rules” or “Madigan’s map” in place either.

Like the French Revolution, once the beheadings begin it really is not clear where they end.

Comment by Thomas Paine Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:13 am
=== And then they must agree to reforms in House rules that start breaking down the hermetically-sealed decision-making structure Madigan has enjoyed all these years — so that we don’t replace him with someone else who can wield the same unchecked power.===

They woulda been better served if they said…

“The Illinois House should once and for all reject the rules they took from Pate Phillip and…”

… but that would first take some institutional knowledge and then they couldn’t make it about “Democrat Party” rule as the undercurrent.

If the chambers decided to go back to rules “Pre-Pate” and look at those as the base of running the chambers, that would be a start, but arbitrarily writing what they wrote is like in “before times” talking to your in-law uncle, married to your favorite aunt, and looking for any chance to get away from the tick box list of ridiculousness.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:14 am
We want change. Don’t care what kind. Just Change.

Comment by Bruce( no not him) Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:19 am
DH cracks me up.

When the dust settles it will either be House Speaker Madigan or House Speaker Harris, and Springfield will soldier onward…

Comment by Touré's Latte Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:20 am
The hermetic seal is what has kept Madigan preserved all these years.

Comment by Ok Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:20 am
“and then they must agree”

See, there’s your problem.
Step 1 hasn’t been completed and you’re already talking about Step 2.
And Step 1 ain’t gonna be a cake walk.

Comment by Flyin' Elvis'-Utah Chapter Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:22 am
Be nice if the DH had a person in Spfld who could explain the operational realities: Start with 6000 submitted bills — for which each sponsor feels they are fully entitled to submit, and personally being shortchanged by the leader if their bills are not heard in committee, read three times on the House floor, and passed.
Beyond budget implementation, there are probably less than 50 key bills that we really need in a year, and there are not enough minutes in a year to come close to handling what individual reps demand. True in other statehouses and in Congress as well. I am all for removing some of the egregious partisan practices in handling specific bills, but grandiose rule change demands crumble under any knowledgable analysis.

Comment by walker Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:23 am
Regardless of history or histrionics, their point is valid. Once the king is disposed, a reset of the rules is warranted. One that is transparent to the public and media no matter where they reside in the state.

Comment by Jo Jo Monkeyboy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:23 am
“The Illinois House should once and for all reject the rules they took from Pate Phillip and…”

OW for the win!

Comment by Anyone Remember Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:26 am
The funny thing is that a lot of people forget that the rules in the House changed dramatically in 1995, when Lee Daniels became Speaker, and essentially copied Pate Philips draconian rules from the Senate. A ton of minority protection and decentralized power was eliminated from the rules.

When Madigan regained the gavel in 1997, he largely kept those rules.

So when the GOP likes to rail about the unfairness of the Rules, I think its important to remind them they were the ones that wrote them in the first place.

Comment by SpiDem Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:26 am
agree with Walker

can’t claim to be credible on some of these issues if you’re not actually doing your own reporting. Why doesn’t the DH have a Springfield reporter?

Comment by Siriusly Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:27 am
It took me “0.19” seconds, and I found some info that coulda helped the Daily Herald.

Chicago Tribune, January 28, 1993

shorturl.at/ELY56

Excerpt;

=== Under the new rules, conference committee reports must now pass through the Rules Committee before the full House can even see them.

…

Democrats say the changes mean more equality for all members.

“Those (changes) really allow members the opportunity to review a measure and really prevent the sneaking through of last-minute legislation,” said House Parliamentarian Michael Pollak, who is appointed by Madigan.

The rule changes follow similar changes pushed through the Senate earlier this month by its new president, GOP Sen. James “Pate” Philip of Wood Dale.

“We’ve taken some of their ideas,” Pollak said. “We’ve not mirrored what they’ve done. I think the Senate has really mirrored what we’ve done.===

Google is their friend.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:28 am
Interesting how the usual Madigan sycophants who rail against a dictator in Washington are fine with dictatorships as long as they protect their interests above the state’s.

Comment by Lucky Pierre Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:33 am
“”I don’t see the DH defending or celebrating the election of a black Speaker.”"

With respect, I disagree. My guess is that they’d be fine with a new Speaker, from any source, at least for a while.

I have found the DH editorial writers well-meaning, open to substantial change, and responsible to their civic mission of a critical press. Unfortunately, I think they’re often naive and underinformed — (but of course that’s usually when we disagree.)

Comment by walker Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:44 am
House Republicans have mostly Lee Daniels to blame for the current rules. Pate changed the Senate rules when he took over in 1993 and it took away options from the minority party. In 1994, Lee slowed down the House process under the more lenient rules through endless floor debates and the filing of amendments which had to be voted up or down, not simply held in rules. Lee then blamed Madigan repeatedly for losing control ofthe process. He would not let Madigan have the same opportunities to harass him in 95-96 and adopted Pate’s rules.

It’s true Madigan did not change back to the old rules in 1997. However, for several sessions after, he did not seek to completely control the committee process and floor action.
This gave the House Republicans a fair chance at passing many of their bills. Of course, they also had a Republican Governor then and a caucus of 56-58, rather than Pritzker and 45 members.

Comment by Oldtimer Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 9:53 am
If it results in the elimination of shell bills, I’m in.

Comment by Just Another Anon Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:00 am
“Newspaper editorials are not written to address the concerns of the informed.”

⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐

– MrJM

Comment by @misterjayem Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:04 am
Like always, OW hit the nail on the head. Pate was the first to institute the rules the GA operates under. These rules make it easier to herd the cats.

Comment by Norseman Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:06 am
== So when the GOP likes to rail about the unfairness of the Rules, I think its important to remind them they were the ones that wrote them in the first place. ==

For many years, GOP legislators such as Mike Bost railed against Madigan’s rules, even though they had voted for the same rules to empower Speaker Daniels.

Comment by anon2 Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:11 am
All anyone has to do to get rid of Speaker Madigan is to get up earlier, work harder, work longer, and be smarter. The question is, who is willing to do that?

Comment by Downstate Dem Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:12 am
=== My guess is that they’d be fine with a new Speaker, from any source, at least for a while ===

Walker, they just told us they won’t be satisfied with a new speaker without new rules. I am going to take them at their word.

The DH is still a Republican paper, They hope the next Speaker to be someone they have endorsed from the Democratic fold, and the Chicago Tribune wantsthe same thing. The presumption is always that you will have greater influence in the future over someone you have influenced in the past, and all editorial boards seek to influence, it is their nature.

Comment by Thomas Paine Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:12 am
Is this the same Daily Herald editorial board that doubled down on Amy Grant after her “clumsy and insensitive statement”?

Comment by Jocko Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:15 am
==Is this the same Daily Herald editorial board that doubled down on Amy Grant after her “clumsy and insensitive statement”?==

Yep,the same one that acquired and listened to then entire tape, identified the existence of more than one crime, and confirmed her words were spliced out of context. That one. Might surprise a knave like yourself who provided that full tape.

Comment by A Guy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:24 am
… and - A Guy -, who supports the racist President will of course support the racist thoughts Grant had as “misunderstood” and support the Daily Herald.

The Daily Herald is a paper trying to keep the Trumpian thoughts, and in this case, failing to recognize what happened in 1993, and in 1995 with then Speaker Daniels, but the need to feed misinformation to historic context is what drives the divide consistently.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:29 am
===confirmed her words were spliced out of context===

I listened to that entire tape and I didn’t change my mind about what was on it.

Comment by Rich Miller Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:32 am
Not a racist bone in her body nor mine. Never was. Your repeating it is just a sickening representation of the person you are. Always were. So smart. Just ask you.

Comment by A Guy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:33 am
Because you didn’t want to. Editors who listened did. Same with other authorities. If you didn’t conclude it was illegally created and significantly tampered with, I can’t help you.

Comment by A Guy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:35 am
If it results in the elimination of shell bills, I’m in.

As am I. That is the key thing to dump. Let’s legilate in the open….

, identified the existence of more than one crime

Crime??

Comment by Fav Human Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:36 am
=== Because you didn’t want to.===

#AlternativeFacts

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:37 am
===Not a racist bone in her body===

Bones are not racist.

Comment by Rich Miller Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:39 am
==All anyone has to do to get rid of Speaker Madigan is to get up earlier, work harder, work longer, and be smarter.==

Heh. Whether one agrees or disagrees with their editorial the DH is honestly reflecting what many of its subscribers and other Illinoisans are thinking both about the situation and about the current make-up of the legislature and leadership. They feel helpless. Many people do understand and do not like that every two years a single state congressional district essentially also selects the Speaker of the Illinois House –and has for years–as it continually re-elects Mike Madigan as its representative. And once that occurs each election cycle everything else broken down in Spgfld also has stayed the same. Most struggling Illinoisans do not know or care what somebody did in 1993. Pointing fingers at Pate Phillip seems sort of useless and silly, at this point in time no? This is the 21st century and our beloved state is dying.

Comment by Responsa Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:41 am
=== If you didn’t conclude it was illegally created and significantly tampered with===

Now it’s “tampered with”? Grant said the words.

Excusing racist thoughts… hmm.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:42 am
To bring it back to the post,

While I can agree the lack of coverage by the paper directly to the legislature or even state government will never excuse anyone unwilling to at minimum Google the historic context, unless it’s the feature, not the bug, to ignore institutional knowledge.

Yes, they need and lack real coverage.

Yes, too, the lack of research on its own is a failing to this specific piece.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:45 am
==Bones are not racist.==

Cute. And beneath you. Neither is she or I; bones flesh, nerves, cells or thoughts.

Perhaps you had just a bit too much in it to spin on a dime on this one. Simple consideration. Many reached an entirely different conclusion than you when they heard “everything.” Whatevs.

Comment by A Guy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:45 am
The Daily Herald editorial board wouldn’t know where to find the House Rules let alone know what they actually say.
And always remember, the Daily Herald cared so much about coverage of what happens at the Capitol that it shuttered its Springfield bureau.

Comment by Leigh John-Ella Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:47 am
=== Many===

Speak for yourself.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 10:48 am
Walker and OW are spot on.

=Editors who listened did.=

Oh, well in that case… who cares.

Comment by JS Mill Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:01 am
Sadly the Daily Herald has forfeited any hope of offering informed editorial comment especially on state issues.
Previous commenters have noted Pate provided the rules they whine about. Perhaps the Senate should be told to overhaul their rules too.
Maybe some House Ds will think they can vote for Madigan and new rules and get off the hook
NOPE
And BTW they should all expected to be attacked as Madigan Pawns-Tools-Stooges even if Madigan is gone.

Comment by Annoin' Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:12 am
=== Once the king===

My gosh, wear a mask with that mouth breathing, for your own health. Geez.

=== Interesting how the usual Madigan sycophants who rail against a dictator in Washington are fine with dictatorships as long as they protect their interests above the state’s.===

Narrator: These are Pate Phillip rules.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:14 am
=== We want change. ===

What happened to “reform”?

Comment by PublicServant Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:19 am
=== Regardless of history or histrionics===

“We don’t need no stinkin’ history”, lol

The point is… the Daily Herald wants this as a Dem thing, when in actuality, it was a “Pate” thing.

Keep up.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:19 am
“All anyone has to do to get rid of Speaker Madigan is to get up earlier, work harder, work longer, and be smarter. The question is, who is willing to do that?”

As Tom Cross showed, it would help if “anyone” wasn’t interested in golf. /s

Comment by Anyone Remember Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:27 am
OW - don’t forget to call people Raunerite’s. You haven’t said that this whole thread. Keep up

Comment by Walleye Soup Nuts Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:28 am
- Walleye Soup Nuts -

The adults are talking.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:29 am
The Daily Herald is famous for writing editorials that don’t actually say anything or are uninformed or underinformed.
I’ve often found they choose not to let policy, laws, common sense or even reality get in the way of the way they think things should be.

Comment by Father Ted Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:30 am
Sorry, meant to say “…get in the way of how they think things should be.”

Comment by Father Ted Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:32 am
What the Herald misses on is that the power lies within the gavel. Or as my friend OW preaches 60 and 30.
Having worked under several versions of rules I can say they are great when they work for you and they (prohibited word) when they don’t.

Comment by May Soon Be Required Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:41 am
=== Most struggling Illinoisans do not know or care what somebody did in 1993. Pointing fingers at Pate Phillip seems sort of useless and silly, at this point in time no?===

Not for context to a partisan snipe that counts on people’s lack of institutional knowledge.

Otherwise, “we don’t need no history” is a thing… for you.

Not great.

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 11:52 am
=Interesting how the usual Madigan sycophants who rail against a dictator in Washington are fine with dictatorships as long as they protect their interests above the state’s.=

Interesting how the usual Trump sycophants who rail against a dictator in Springfield are fine with dictatorships as long as they protect their interests above the Country’s.

There, fixed it for you.

Comment by JS Mill Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 12:03 pm
I’m guessing the people on this post who keep calling the Daily Herald a “Republican” paper don’t actually read it. Their endorsements and editorials have always leaned center-left, until it started to become obvious over the past 3-4 years that this place was starting to fall apart. No harm in correcting course, wish more of our pols would do it.

Comment by SumGai1986 Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 12:51 pm
===Their endorsements and editorials have always leaned center-left===

Example?

Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 12:53 pm
===Their endorsements and editorials have always leaned center-left===

You must be reading a different paper.

Comment by Rich Miller Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 12:58 pm
So I provided a list of examples and my post gets deep-sixed? Boo.

Comment by SumGai1986 Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 1:39 pm
SumGai1986, and yet the paper’s editors routinely ordered up “How can Republicans reclaim the suburbs” stories after each ensuing election loss, brushing aside the more relevant story of the social and political changes happening in the suburbs.

Comment by Leigh John-Ella Friday, Dec 18, 20 @ 2:40 pm
The first change I would make would be to place term limits on the speaker and senate president positions.

Comment by Twirling Towards Freedom Monday, Dec 21, 20 @ 11:23 am