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I don’t think I’ll ever understand Mapes’ rationale

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Illinois

* My weekly syndicated newspaper column…

I don’t think I’ll ever fully understand why Tim Mapes allowed himself to be put into this situation.

Not one of the lies former Illinois House Speaker Mike Madigan’s former chief of staff is accused of telling a grand jury while under a grant of immunity was about illegal activity. During his two hours on the stand and through 650 questions, he was never once asked if he’d witnessed any sort of crime or suspected wrongdoing by others. And now he’s standing trial on federal charges of perjury and obstruction of justice.

His alleged lies were in response to fairly benign queries, like, for instance: “Did [Madigan’s top lieutenant Mike McClain], after he retired, kind of give you any insight into what his interactions with [Madigan] were that you weren’t privy to personally?”

Mapes’ response: “No, that wouldn’t — that wouldn’t happen.”

But it did happen. And the feds recorded quite a few instances of it happening.

That’s another thing about those questions: The feds didn’t ask Mapes anything they didn’t already know in advance.

And Mapes knew all too well that the government was likely listening in. Mapes testified to the grand jury in February 2021. The Chicago Tribune reported as far back as November 2019 that investigators had tapped McClain’s mobile phone. McClain has since been convicted based in part on those very recordings.

The feds basically set a trap for Mapes with the grand jury. Mapes knew the trap was likely there, but then he jumped right in anyway.

Maybe he was just being a tough guy like in a gangster movie.

But this is real life, not a movie, and the man has a real-life family. And he wasn’t being asked to say anything particularly incriminating of either Madigan or McClain.

The federal government doesn’t usually ask a judge to involuntarily impose immunity on a witness to compel grand jury testimony under oath if that witness has been cooperative during an investigation. I’ve assumed all along Mapes really ticked off government investigators during the interview process.

There are those who say Mapes was so arrogant after decades of amassing power that he couldn’t shake the habit while on the stand. And his strict Madigan gate-keeper status (a sign on his office wall read: “Nobody gets in to see the Wizard”) may have naturally compelled him to mum up under questioning.

His non-answers to simple questions about whether Madigan had “any sort of esteem or regard” for the late Mayor Richard J. Daley or if Madigan ever talked about Daley points to that. Madigan loved to talk about old man Daley, who Madigan used as a model for his entire political and patronage structure.

That Madigan wouldn’t have ever spoken to his highest level employee about his political idol and personal mentor is truly difficult to believe.

Mapes, in the end, just seemed like he wouldn’t cop to anything.

And now he’s looking at up to 20 years in prison for an obstruction of justice charge and another 5 years for perjury.

None of the federal government’s released recordings of Mapes’ conversations show that anyone he spoke with talked about actually committing a crime. The government apparently didn’t have Mapes on anything. I suppose Mapes might have been trying to protect himself about something else, but he probably would’ve received a far better deal if he’d just fessed up then.

Aside from opening statements and cross-examination, we have as of this writing yet to hear Mapes’ full defense. His lawyers have claimed in previous filings that the feds have twisted Mapes’ deliberately careful and cautious answers into lies.

That’s also difficult to believe in its entirety.

“I have no knowledge or recall of that,” Mapes said during his grand jury appearance when asked if McClain had been in contact with a House member whom McClain wanted to push out of the legislature after a very public scandal that was never actually proved to be true.

“But according to the wiretapped calls, [the legislator in question] was a frequent topic of conversation between Mapes and McClain,” Hannah Meisel reported for Capitol News Illinois last week. She then gave her readers some examples.

Mapes was widely considered to have a very detailed memory when he was Madigan’s chief of staff, but maybe he did somehow forget. Even so, he most certainly had “knowledge” of the calls because he was on them.

Other Madigan “made men” have testified for the prosecution in Mapes’ trial, so perhaps Mapes believes he did the honorable thing by not fully cooperating. But those other folks are going home to their families. Mapes may not.

Your thoughts?

posted by Rich Miller
Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 8:42 am

Comments

We will never know why he allegedly lied but it was his choice. He made the bed, now he must rest in it. At the end of the day you make your own decisions.

Comment by Red headed step child Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:01 am
==Maybe he was just being a tough guy like in a gangster movie.==

Rich, I genuinely think this is the reason. I think the Madigan inner-circle started to think of them as this mafia-style group and that’s why they used goofy nicknames and such to communicate mostly legal (if ethically shaky) things.

Had they just been slightly more above board I don’t know if any of this even happens - it’s bizarre.

Comment by bingo Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:04 am
some are unconditionally tuned to never give up the boss, or someone right under the boss. see Chicago City Hall c. 2005/2006 trials.

Comment by Amalia Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:10 am
It is simple hubris. These guys (and the CommEd folks) just never took seriously the idea that they would ever be called to answer for anything they did for years and years. So when it started happening, I think they just collectively wildly misjudged the likely consequences of their actions.

No one ever thinks they will get caught. It is part of why long prison sentences and the death penalty don’t work as deterrence.

Comment by Homebody Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:12 am
I am so glad these people are finally all going down.

Comment by The Truth Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:20 am
Tim put his loyalty in a man instead of the State for which he was employed. Unfortunately, not unique in the political game of power. He forgot the public when he was a public servant.

Comment by Norseman Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:20 am
The classic lesson of Watergate - the coverup is worse than the crime. We see it broken over and over again.

Comment by Stones Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:20 am
My take is Madigan and his buddies were bullet proof for so long they started believing their own BS. Then when it hit the fan they started scrambling in the worst kind of way.

Comment by Big Lou Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:22 am
It may not have been a conscious choice. When you’re scared you’d want to deny everything. “I didn’t see nuthin, didn’t hear nuthin, don’t know nuthin.”
Now, he had plenty of time to prepare for being questioned, and good lawyers presumably preparing him, so that may not hold that much water, but I do think it’s the most likely scenario.

Comment by Perrid Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:29 am
Honestly, I’ve never understood why anyone ever talks to the feds.

Comment by JoanP Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:39 am
Good grief (exclamation point). How hard is it to say “Not sure.” for two hours.

With guaranteed immunity and the knowledge that the feds have wiretaps and my emails, I would have been singing like Pavarotti on the stand.

Comment by Jocko Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:44 am
No real idea either. The law is pretty clear. If you are approached by a law enforcement agent, just say you want to speak with your attorney. That’s it. But people get caught up lying to the feds all the time. Everyone thinks they’re Whitey Bulger.

Comment by Three Dimensional Checkers Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:46 am
After Madigan tossed Mapes overboard Mapes stood right next to the Speaker in the receiving line at the subsequent annual Island Bay funder in Springfield.
Does he think the feds don’t know that too?
Just arrogance.

Comment by Eire17 Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:56 am
I think we’ve seen Mapes’ protect-the-boss instinct combined with the “if you just say ‘I can’t recall’ they can’t get you” approach to testifying. That might work in a deposition for a civil case, but it ain’t working here.

Comment by Telly Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 10:00 am
also, I’ve met lots of folks in government whose whole identity is wrapped up in the man (usually man) they serve. portrait of the man in their office, speaking of the man in always reverential tones(beyond respect), never ever saying no to them even if it is in their best interest. they just have the weirdest sense of their own personal integrity. everyone take a good look in the mirror and NOT do all of that.

Comment by Amalia Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 10:04 am
Amalia - 100 percent!

Comment by This Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 10:10 am
=== I’ve met lots of folks in government===

The Shakman exempt folks seem to think of staff in terms of who you work for and not what kind of employee you are. The people actually doing the government service often don’t care.

Comment by Three Dimensional Checkers Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 10:14 am
It does not matter how smart you are if you think your smarter than you are.
A corollary about absolute power corrupting absolutely.

Comment by Drake Mallard Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 10:21 am
Perhaps there is a line of thought that involves the fact none of topics discussed on the wire were were crimes. We think raised this point last. Time will tell.

Comment by Annonin' Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 10:25 am
I’m getting a strong (to paraphrase HR Haldeman) “Every House Speaker needs a son of a b****, and I’m Madigan’s” vibe.

Maybe Mapes knows exactly what he’s doing and he’s fine with the consequences. They threw Robert Sorich a party in Bridgeport, after he got released.

Comment by ZC Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 10:36 am
@ThreeDimensionalCheckers, yes. yay to regular workers. unfortunately there are so many governments in Illinois and therefore so many elected leaders who seemingly need some political appointment sycophants, sycophants who fawn away at them.

Comment by Amalia Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 11:12 am
I think misplaced loyalty is as good a rationale as any. It is strange the feds weren’t asking him about criminal activity, given his prominent role in Madigan’s orbit. So maybe self-preservation was a motivating factor? Complete speculation on my part, but the only three people on the planet that fully understood any and every scheme of Madigan’s operation were himself, McClain and Mapes. Maybe taking one for the team on perjury/obstruction was preferable to spilling the beans on other shenanigans for which he might have been vulnerable to further prosecution?

And for me, regardless of his rationale, his choice to force the feds to trial is only going to lengthen his sentence. That was his choice and it doesn’t make much sense to me.

But really, none of this makes sense. These guys were at the pinnacle of power in Illinois. They didn’t need money, the didn’t want anything more than what they already had. And they threw it all away just to keep their allies fat and obedient.

You should write a book about this Rich. The source material is all in your archives.

Comment by 47th Ward Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 11:16 am
===Honestly, I’ve never understood why anyone ever talks to the feds.=== He was granted full immunity so he had no choice but to appear before the Grand Jury.

Comment by Frumpy White Guy Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 11:21 am
Rich, great read.

I’ve said my piece to this, I can’t believe Mapes is “here” and not in a vacation home somewhere reading how MJM is facing charges and wondering when he’d have to testify.

Not one soul will visit him on the daily if he goes away, there was no 2nd act of a career to think he’d have if he goes away too.

Large specific lies, if proven, aren’t even worth being called a “liar” let alone doing time for.

Truly this is insanely ignorant that Mapes is here.

Comment by Oswego Willy Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 11:36 am
Reminds me of Martha Stewart. She lied about things that she did that were legal, if she had told the truth she never would have gone to federal prison.

Comment by Big Dipper Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 12:18 pm
Title for Rich’s book: “Falling from the Pinnacle”, or how Illinois politicians and political operatives sent themselves to prison”. Non-fiction. 500 pages. Published 2025.

Comment by thisjustinagain Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 12:21 pm
===Your thoughts? ===

It always seemed kind of fishy that this guy was the volunteer executive director of the Democratic Party of Illinois. I’m surprised this can didn’t get kicked, but maybe it is a can that the feds didn’t need to kick.

Comment by Candy Dogood Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 12:21 pm
This is just the preliminaries til Madigan testifies.

I hope he remembers to bring his apples.

Comment by Loop Lady Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 12:35 pm
==I would have been singing like Pavarotti on the stand.==

100%. Thats why I had no problem with what Moody and Cullen are doing. It cant be easy but is the correct move.

Comment by low level Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 12:52 pm
=== It always seemed kind of fishy that this guy was the volunteer executive director of the Democratic Party of Illinois. I’m surprised this can didn’t get kicked, but maybe it is a can that the feds didn’t need to kick. ===

What does this mean? Are you implying that there was something shady about Mapes being the ED of DPI? If so, then what? Not sure that the feds can do much in the way of interfering with the operations of a state political party.

Comment by Hannibal Lecter Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 1:05 pm
Lying when he didn’t have to… lying when he could easily have answered truthfully in very general terms… not getting himself properly prepared for the interview — all these things indicate he handled this poorly and foolishly. Why? Poor representation? His own arrogance? Or is he just not very smart? Probably all three IMO.

Comment by Lincoln Lad Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 1:12 pm
I kind of like the book title, “Madigan and the Yellow Brick Road to Prison”.

Comment by Old School Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 1:57 pm
If there was no incriminating speech in the conversations, the defense should clearly be about that fact, rather than Tim’s “forgetfulness” about the comings and goings of others (Lang, etc.), or legislative strategies about corralling votes. There does not seem to be any real smoke, so no fire. Just 2 guys talking trash.

Comment by FHAnalyst Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 2:06 pm
This is my question as well. It makes no sense. Going into the trial, I figured Mapes was being careful; if you don’t know what, exactly, the feds have on tape, you must be very careful with what you say because even the smallest deviation can result in charges of obstruction, lying to a federal officer, etc. But, the stuff in this trial has been so general. The “I don’t recall” response makes sense if they are asking for specifics, but general questions along the lines of “did you talk to person X about person Y”…c’mon man.

Comment by Pot calling kettle Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 2:18 pm
I see it this way: Tim Mapes’ identity was so tied to Madigan, so inextricably linked, that he couldn’t find a way to uncouple himself from Himself. And, let’s face it, Tim always thought he was the smartest person in the room, and that extends, obviously, to the grand jury room.

Comment by Anon 2:30 Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 2:30 pm
Seems likely that he was trying to avoid the ensuing questions that would have followed. Do you recall any times when X occurred? Yes. What were those specific examples?

I do think there was some arrogance there that will sink him. He should have been more vague. I can’t think of any specific examples off the top of my head, but it’s possible that happened. Why don’t you play me one of your recordings and see if it jogs my memory.

Comment by Jed Bartlett Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 2:39 pm
=== There are those who say Mapes was so arrogant after decades of amassing power that he couldn’t shake the habit while on the stand.===

Agreed. The judge spelled out that he had an obligation to tell the truth, or else prison.

His attorneys undoubtedly did the same.

For decades, Mapes could say whatever he wanted. And no one dared cross him. Until now. He will have lots of time for regret.

Comment by Langhorne Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 2:55 pm
==Seems likely that he was trying to avoid the ensuing questions that would have followed.==

Agree, but he should have used the “I don’t recall” stuff on those details. That would make sense and would be much more difficult for the prosecution to call a lie.

Comment by Pot calling kettle Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 3:05 pm
Others have said it. The Speaker’s office had become so powerful that those in it thought they were untouchable. They were in control and would bat down anyone who defied that authority. That control lead to arrogance and the sense of invincibility. Day after day, month after month year after year they successfully ruled their empire. The one set of rules they didn’t control were outside of IL and the feds found a way to crack the empire, but they were clueless to see it. Their response in hindsight looks foolish but their years of being in control and subsequent arrogance did not allow them to see common sense.

Comment by Just Sayin... Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 3:48 pm
I think it’s very simple regarding Mapes. Some guys just can’t live with themselves being a “rat”. I’m not condoning nor condemning such behavior. I’m only pointing out that there are still some(very few) that will never cooperate. They choose to do so even though they know they will be doing time. I highly suspect Mr. McClain will also not cooperate and would rather go to prison than compromise his sense of honor. Not everyone sings like Pavarotti.

.

Comment by Ryder Monday, Aug 21, 23 @ 9:27 pm