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Meanwhile… In Opposite Land

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* News Channel 9 in July…

Repeat juvenile offenders in Tennessee are now no longer the only ones who could find themselves in legal hot water.

A law now in effect in Tennessee aims to also punish their parents.

The Parental Accountability Act took effect July 1st.

It fines parents whose children are found delinquent by a court more than twice up to $1,000.

[Republican Rep. John Gillespie] says the fines will start at $250 dollars for a misdemeanor, $500 for a felony act, and can go up to $1,000 if a judge decides it’s warranted. The law also offers the option for the parent to do community service.

More on the Tennessee law is here if you’re interested.

* Governor Pritzker was asked at a news event yesterday if he’d consider signing any legislation that would target parents of repeat juvenile offenders…

Reporter: We saw an uptick in juvenile arrests last year in Peoria, and it’s been mentioned by our police chief that a lot of those kids are repeat offenders. And it’s been pondered by some on the City Council if it would be realistic to see legislation out of Springfield that could possibly hold parents accountable for children who are repeat offenders in the crime system.

Is that something you would view as reasonable or realistic if the General Assembly would put something like that on your desk?

Governor Pritzker: Look, parents absolutely have responsibility to raise their kids as best they can in the circumstances that they’re in, but you’ve got to recognize that there are a lot of circumstances that are traumatic and can be challenges that parents face and it’s very difficult for a parent to overcome some of those circumstances all on their own.

So the idea they we are going to hold them criminally liable, which is what I think is the suggestion you’re putting forward, doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. Obviously, there are unusual circumstances they might be taking into account but it would be hyper-unusual from my perspective.

What we really need to do is to give parents the resources that they need so that they can help their kids get through these challenging circumstances. They come up in traumatic, you know, communities, or communities that cause trauma for their children, and then there’s nothing for them to do with their children to try to overcome those circumstances.

So we need to elevate sometimes in the early childhood world we call it Two-gen solutions. These are two generation solutions. You can’t just address this with the child, but [you need to address it with] the child and their parent or whoever their caregivers are. So I would suggest that we need to provide more support and it’s less about policing than it is about helping parents do their best. Because every parent I think wants the best for their child and so if we can help them get that I think we’d all be better off.

Thoughts?

posted by Isabel Miller
Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 9:50 am

Comments

JB is right.

Comment by NewToSpringfield Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:05 am
JB nailed it. Lack of family support is just one of many risk factors associated with youth involvement in the legal system. Other contributors include exposure to community violence, child poverty, and generational cycles of incarceration in families initiated by the so-called war on drugs.

Comment by Politix Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:10 am
Pritzker:

you’ve got to recognize that there are a lot of circumstances that are traumatic and can be challenges that parents face and it’s very difficult for a parent to overcome some of those circumstances all on their own.

So the idea they we are going to hold them criminally liable, which is what I think is the suggestion you’re putting forward, doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.

Illinois may be the best governor in the union.

– MrJM

Comment by @misterjayem Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:14 am
Along those lines, an article about teaching citizenship to kids.
How one preschool uses PAW Patrol to teach democracy.
https://apnews.com/article/preschool-voting-democracy-education-paw-patrol-adccecd533294838bbb2cb08fcd41258

Back in 2017, wrote a prescription for america for a list of citizenship items that schools need to be doing.

Comment by sal-says Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:15 am
I’m not a real big fan of punishing parents for the actions of their kids unless there its crystal clear that a parent was negligent in something. The fact that a kid does something doesn’t automatically mean that there was a failure by the parents.

Comment by Demoralized Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:19 am
I believe the Tennessee law makes it possible for the parent or guardian to be responsible for the the fine up to $1,000.00, not the crime. So the answer our Governor gave seems to be made to an interpretation of the question asking him if he favored legislation holding the parent or guardian criminally liable. We already have a Parental Responsibility Act.(740 ILCS 115/3) (from Ch. 70, par. 53)

Comment by DEE Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:20 am
Interesting to note that the current Democratic presidential nominee used the justice system in California as district attorney & Attorney General to hold parents accountable when their children were found chronically truant. It is just interesting to consider in this context.

Comment by Incandenza Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:33 am
We already are holding parents responsible in certain shootings done by a child so why would wouldn’t this be one part of an accountability process? Certainly it should take into account the specific circumstances.

Comment by Center Drift Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:33 am
I’m someone who generally pushes for far, far more criminal enforcement. I think I would sentence anyone who points a gun at someone and pulls the trigger without legal justification to 20+ years in prison. With that said, though, I think it’s unconstitutional–or at least it should be–to hold someone criminally liable for something they didn’t do or help orchestrate.

Comment by Garfield Ridge Guy Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:34 am
If parents are struggling now with handling the responsibilities, and Tennessee, I’m sure, is not as strong as Illinois with support systems, you’ll just increase the cycle downward.
Holding parents “accountable” through criminal charges is unrealistic and worsens a difficult home situation.
Investing in opportunities for afterschool programs, anti-gang and drug initiatives, and workforce enhancement programs would be a better course of action.

Comment by Frida's Boss Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:49 am
Agree with JB. Also, there are currently laws on the books to charge adults with criminal neglect/association to a crime. No need to duplicate the matter.

Comment by Central IL Centrist Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:50 am
Right up there with punishing homelessness with tickets and jail time. This doesn’t solve any problems, it just makes lives worse for the people who are likely already dealing with various other problems (poverty, rough home lives, high crime neighborhoods, etc.)

The people who push these bills are one of three things: (1) completely daft and actually believe their talking that these are just moral failings that people need to be punished for to change their behavior, (2) are trying to drive the targets out of their districts, or (3) are just bad people who get off on cruelty.

But literally no one pushing these sorts of bills is actually trying to solve the problem.

Comment by Homebody Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 10:57 am
Pritzker experienced some tough times growing up. His sympathy for others who are struggling in terms of family dynamics is natural. He has been there.

I do not see much benefit in enacting new laws to punish parents for their kids acting badly. There are already sufficient laws on the books.

Comment by Gravitas Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 11:01 am
Peoria’s local government has been pushing many counterproductive ideas regarding youth, some prima facie unconstitutional. It would be nice if it stopped doing that.

Comment by Stephanie Kollmann Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 11:19 am
A lot of the bad ideas do come specifically from one 74yo council member who is running for mayor on a platform of cracking down on kids.

Comment by Stephanie Kollmann Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 11:29 am
==Holding parents “accountable” through criminal charges is unrealistic and worsens a difficult home situation.==

Maybe, but it’s a simplistic response for the MAGA party to spread on FOX News. Sure beats thinking about an issue.

Comment by don the legend Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 11:37 am
I’m all for prosecuting parents that recklessly leave access to guns and drugs to their kids, causing the death and maiming of others, but it seems to me that making parents criminally liable for jailtime and fines for more petty offenses would only result in an increase of crime given the reduced lack of attention and resources at home that parents would be able to give kids. Being locked up or having less money, and all.

Feels like a move that you push for to appear like you’re tough on crime rather than actually trying to fix an issue.

Comment by TJ Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 11:44 am
A juvenile felony charge should at least require a visit by DCFS to the legal guardian.

Comment by Chicagonk Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 12:00 pm
This is such an intricate issue that deserves more than a ham-handed solution. We all have heard of of know (I do), people who are really bad parents. But, I also know households where one child grows up to be exemplary and another child rightly ends up in prison. Once again, I am truly glad JB is my governor.

Comment by levivotedforjudy Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 12:06 pm
Imagine you’re a single mom with three kids and you work. Your oldest is a gangbanger. You come home late at night and spend your remaining free time helping the two younger kids. You can’t control what the older one is doing in the streets, especially without support. That’s nuts. Instead of penalizing the parents, how about actually hold the kids accountable? Trying them as adults when they kill and more…

Comment by hmmm Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 12:10 pm
JB made a valid argument that these cases are all unique. You would have trouble writing the law in a way that doesn’t make things worse for some of the families while addressing the worst of the parents. It’s reactive versus proactive. I would like to see some way to focus services on the problem parents that isn’t punitive as the first response. You can drop the hammer if the first corrective action doesn’t prove effective.

Comment by Give Us Barabbas Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 12:18 pm
“move that you push for to appear like you’re tough on crime”

All while supporting a 34-time convicted felon. Maybe national news media outlets can ask Republicans how can they lock people up in jail and push law and order while supporting Trump. What kind of message does that send to society?

Comment by Grandson of Man Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 12:28 pm
===I also know households where one child grows up to be exemplary and another child rightly ends up in prison===

Same, including a few I can think of in my own extended family.

Comment by Rich Miller Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 12:34 pm
nothin’ wrong spreading a little parental responsibility into the world.
GOPie VP whiz JD Vance was about accountability for the parents of school shooters. He said taxpayers needed to pay to harden schools.

Comment by Annonin' Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 12:44 pm
I am coming at this from the perspective of a veteran school administrator of 30 years or something like that. I have been very vocal about parental responsibility or the lack thereof for most of my time posting here. In my career I have learned never to hold a parent against a kid or a kid against a parent. Good kids have bad parents and good parents have kids that do bad things.That is the lens I view this through…

Schools are held accountable for many things that really should be parent responsibility but often well meaning legislators pass it to the school in search of an answer. Health care, food, clothing, mental health care, basic attendance. That is not to say that we should not help provide with some basics for our students. Not saying that at all. Not saying that parents should be dragged into court because their child misbehaves or even commits a crime.

When the parent is complicit or negligent, especially in a violent criminal act, they should be held accountable and we already have laws that address that, they are just so rarely used.

I will say, I agreed with Kamala Harris when she upheld the state laws and held parents accountable for non attendance. She was upholding her responsibilities. In my experience, and I don’t have a hard data point to share because this is across multiple districts, parents are mostly responsible if their kids don’t go to school. Maybe the child is too big to force to go, but that environment was usually established years before through enabling or simply negligent parenting.

Comment by JS Mill Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 1:11 pm
Good source on this overall topic and it should be required reading by all parents.

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/what-the-illinois-parental-responsibility-law.html

There is also the sticky issue of parental rights’. For instance a parent does not have to have permission or even notification of their child’s access to an have an abortion.

There needs to be a lot more thought on the many layers of parental rights and responsibilities and how this is to be legislated.

Comment by Mason County Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 1:24 pm
Families in these situations need help and support, not punishment. What exactly is the end goal for supporters of this type of legislation? I understand what they ‘think’ will happen but the logic is flawed.

Comment by Cubs in '16 Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 1:31 pm
==parental responsibility or the lack thereof==

Yes, you have been very vocal of trying to pass the buck for doing your job.

==Not saying that at all==

And yet you said it.

Comment by Demoralized Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 1:51 pm
-Pritzker experienced some tough times growing up.-

Common sense, compassion and character are often forged on the crucible of hardship.

Comment by Dotnonymous x Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 2:06 pm
Beware those in whom the desire to punish is strong.

Comment by Dotnonymous x Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 2:23 pm
=Yes, you have been very vocal of trying to pass the buck for doing your job.

==Not saying that at all==

And yet you said it.=

And yet I did not. @Demoralized, words are important. Let me know when and where I said schools are not responsible for student achievement.

Seriously, I expect so much more from you.

Comment by JS Mill Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 2:45 pm
“What exactly is the end goal for supporters of this type of legislation?” One only need to look at the community’s affected by all the tough on crime that’s been done for more then 50 years in this country….

Comment by Union thug Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 3:22 pm
We had 5 boys in our family. 4 of us were good and the one brother was always in trouble (first time I remember the cops bringing him home he was 10). Anyway, that brother never turned around and none of it was our parents fault.

Comment by Lurker Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 4:09 pm
@JS Mill stated: Seriously, I expect so much more from you.

That makes one of us because I emphatically do not.

Comment by Lurker Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 4:31 pm
Fining families that are struggling….makes them struggle more.

Are Peoria juveline courts doing anything at all to provide coordinates services to those families?

Comment by Thomas Paine Friday, Oct 4, 24 @ 4:37 pm