Latest Post | Last 10 Posts | Archives
Previous Post: House returns mid September for Lottery lease bill *** UPDATED x1 ***
Next Post: Question of the day
Posted in:
* It’s hard to fathom how Sen. Dick Durbin could be this stupid…
Nor does Durbin agree with the characterization that Palin’s experience as governor means she is more prepared than the Democratic ticket of Barack Obama and Joe Biden to take over as vice president or, if needed, as president.
“How you could possibly draw a parallel between that experience as Alaska governor and being a vice president or even president of the United States is a stretch, as far as I’m concerned,” he said.
That’s just a blatant insult to Alaska. Yes, it has fewer residents than Lake County. But remember what Barack Obama said just last week in Denver? “Change doesn’t come from Washington, it comes to Washington.” This tack by Durbin just doesn’t jibe with last week’s message.
* The Republicans were obviously woefully unprepared to defend their nominee in the face of this crazy storm of criticism, innuendo and probing. And they’ve flip-flopped completely about “experience” since just last week.
If you don’t feed the Beast, the Beast will feed on you. The Beast is now feeding like crazy on Palin.
But Durbin walked right into it. His party has a standard bearer with zero administrative experience (not counting his so-far impressive campaign), and Durbin wants to talk about the experience issue?
* Billy Dennis pointed to this Andrew Sullivan piece the other day…
Palin looks to me like a lovely person and a good local politician, with some inevitable rough spots. I’d be delighted if she took a leadership role in the GOP in the future. But in the same league as Obama?
Do Republicans really think that little of him?
I guess they do. We are looking at a different person.
* As somebody wrote the other day (can’t remember who, but I think it was Larry), this is the same sort of mindset about Obama that Illinois Republicans had in 2004. Just get a well-spoken black guy to run against the Democrats’ well-spoken black guy and things will cancel themselves out. Big mistake.
It’s also, obviously, at least some of the mindset behind Palin. Hillary supporters are unhappy? Well, let’s throw a woman out there. No matter that her political beliefs are completely the opposite. She’s got the right chromosome arrangement.
* But local and state leadership is way too often dismissed by the Beltway crowd (including, as we can plainly see, Dick Durbin) as insignificant and irrelevant. It’s part of the problem with that town. Anything or anyone outside of their tiny radar screen just isn’t worth examining. Obama was almost universally dismissed at first because nobody in the punditocracy had apparently ever attended a cocktail party with him. That goes quintuple for Palin.
As a result, the Palin pick has caused one of those oh so special media frenzies that the DC establishment press revels in like pigs at the trough. It’s fascinating to watch, of course, but completely goofy. We’ve got the teen pregnancy thing, the secessionist thing, the Ted Stevens thing, the Abramoff thing, the car wash thing, the book banner thing, even the wacky preacher thing. It’s all coming at us faster than we can comprehend, and without the proper context or perspective, it’s just an infotainment blur.
Because of this gross overreaction, the bar has now been set exceedingly low. A decent convention speech by Palin tonight - one that defies the media portrait of a backwards, white trash mountain woman (which should be pretty easy to accomplish, since she isn’t) - will likely settle things down quite a bit. After things have calmed, a follow-up press conference should do the trick. Reporters will look like raving lunatics, and if she keeps her cool and answers the questions, she’ll come off fine.
* Let’s do our very best in comments to keep the multitude of goofy DC talking points out of our discussion. Try to be original, please. I know this story is like crack cocaine, but we can attempt to rise above.
posted by Rich Miller
Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:22 am
Sorry, comments are closed at this time.
Previous Post: House returns mid September for Lottery lease bill *** UPDATED x1 ***
Next Post: Question of the day
WordPress Mobile Edition available at alexking.org.
powered by WordPress.
Because of this gross overreaction, the bar has now been set exceedingly low
And, from a McCain point of view, how is this bad? No one’s talking about the O, it’s all R all the time.
And let us not forget how HC was helped in New Hampshire by a backlash.
Who did mcCain have problems with? Hard core R.
Who HATES the media? Hard core Rs. It’s difficult to come up with a better way to rally the troops.
It’s hard to fathom how Sen. Dick Durbin could be this stupid
It’s so hard being a good boy.
But if you get to discussing the VP of one party compared to the head of the ticket of the other, how does that hurt the VP, and NOT hurt the standard bearer?
No one can possibly say this was planned, but McCain must really be like the little boy in “Animal house”
looks up, says “Thank you God!!”
Comment by Pat collins Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:29 am
From a campaign standpoint, I think there is an impact that I haven’t seen discussed too much. Regardless of whether Palin ends up mired in scandal or whether she is a true reformer, the media and public discussion about her is sucking the air out the convention and McCain’s message. Nothing else is getting through right now. The reason candidates get a bump post-convention is because people are paying more attention for four days. Nobody’s paying attention right now because it’s far more interesting to talk about the pending Russian invasion of Alaska, Trooper-gate, baby-gate, granddaughter and unwed mother -gate, third party separatist-gate, and now anti-israel-nutjob-with-Palin-in-the-front-row-at-her-church-gate.
How do you compete with that? And contrast that to how tight and on message the DNC was last week.
Comment by Don't Worry, Be Happy Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:33 am
I love the comparison to crack cocaine Rich! Lol. . . it really is isn’t it?
Comment by My Opinion Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:38 am
It is killing the liberals that the first woman Vice President will be a conservative Republican woman. They may deny it but since they don’t understand how someone could be pro-life (especially a woman), it aggravates them that this is the type of woman who may be VP. I think it is great!
Comment by GOP Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:40 am
Something else the pundits overlook is that while Alaska is a tiny state in terms of population, it’s bigger than Texas in terms of area, and has lots of oil and other natural resources. Energy, the environment and transportation are critical issues there, and they are important issues nationwide.
Don’t mess with Texas — but don’t diss Alaska either.
Comment by Secret Square Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:42 am
How can so many pundits and politicians look so stupid over one decision by McCain?
they are setting aside the VERY legitimate reasons to dismiss Palin, and McCain, by screamingly sexist and urbanist remarks.
one could write an entire book about the last few days of
sexist remarks, sadly. But the urbanist views on Alaska,
hunting, fishing, outdoor sports, the ethnic composition
of Alaska (uh, can you say Native Alaskans…..), all speak
very sadly of politicians and the media who believe our
country is one giant city and suburb. or should be.
maybe the mindset was tipped when Mayor Daley said
that the Democratic ticket was the first urban ticket.
even Howard Dean, NRA loved governor of a state with a
smaller population than Alaska, which could fit in a teeny
space in Alaska, seemed to avoid the scrutiny the media
gives Palin for her experience with guns and state government.
How did he get a pass? Yes, because he is a man, but also
because he was raised in New York and went to Yale and because Vermont seems to be viewed as some suburb.
so, Howard Dean, is qualified to run for President, and Sarah Palin is not? Sexist and urbanist. and now Dean runs the Dems.
the true shame of all the screwball commentary is that it is
taking everyone’s eye off the ball which is that McCain and
Palin don’t represent what the voters in play, the
Clinton voters wanted. But, the more the ubanist/sexist echo chamber screams, the more likey it
is that Clinton voters will sit on their hands or stage a protest
vote….see Susan Estrich recently on Fox for her estimate
that 30% of Clinton voters could go the way of the war hero
and the hunter.
Comment by Amy Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:45 am
Bonehead move by Durbin. He’s got moth to camera lights syndrome. Same with Biden who talked about how “good-lookin” Palin is.
Mark my word, Biden’s lack of discipline will be a big problem for Obama before it’s all over.
This is similar to the Quayle and Ferraro media frenzies. When it was all over, Quayle didn’t stop Bush from being elected, and Ferraro was a non-factor in Mondale’s trouncing by Reagan.
The fact is, Veep choices are irrelevant to presidential elections. In the mass communication age, the only Veep choice who had a significant effect on a presidential election was LBJ, who combed the graveyards of south Texas to find enough votes to barely deliver the state for JFK. He also brought Big Oil money, back in the day when that really meant something.
It’s the political silly season. Pay no attention to those two wars, a growling Russian Bear, foreclosures, economy, etc.
It used to be that the Enquirer was shunned by the mainstream press. Now, the Enquirer sets the agenda. No wonder they’re all going broke.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:46 am
all points well taken, Rich. Someone on Morning Joe show (a Democrat) made the point that the media went haywire/negative because they were “surprised” by the choice. They apparently don’t want to be surprised….how dare McCain?? What a bunch of effete, wussy snobs!
Comment by You Go Boy Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:49 am
-It’s hard to fathom how Sen. Dick Durbin could be this stupid-
Though I agree with you on “message” when it comes to the “experience” issue - I don’t think BO should be making the “executive” arguments because it does further the “lack of experience” tag line. But I disagree with your assessment on the substance of the argument Sen. Durbin was attempting to make(at least what i think he was attempting to make). Alaska is a completely different State when it comes to revenues and spending. It’s oil revenues provide a REBATE to each citizen. Compare that to the budget issues here in Illinois, California, New Jersey. Let’s be realistic about this - the “real” decisions a governor has to make really centers around the budget - it’s what has created the mess here and and most other “cash strapped” states. One should merely ask - what were the “tough” executive decisions Gov. Palin had to make? - It appears there is a refusal to ask this question by the media, DC pundits - they are all concerned with 1. frivolous issues and 2. the lack of experience card. - So I say let’s focus on this supposed “experience” and see what it is.
Comment by Chicago Law Student Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:52 am
I think it’s sexist to say that Palin was picked exclusively because she was a woman, and it’s absurd to cry foul that political calculation was used to make a *political* decision in a *political* campaign.
Yes, she’s a woman, but there were plenty of other women he could have picked. Why this one?
She’s the only one that bucked her party, she solidly unified the base in a way that hasn’t been seen in years (note the 10M McCain has raised in **primary** money after the announcement that he had to very rapidly dump on something) and it pushed all the right buttons for Democrats to go nuts. It’s instructive to see that McCain has been pushing these buttons for weeks, I don’t see this as a gutshot pick.
But she’s the only one with any executive experience in the field… albeit very little. Even as mayor of Wasilla, she’s managed more people than Biden and Obama combined with their Senate staffs. (I’m sorry, I don’t really count how many people you have on your campaign staff as managerial experience in the governing sense, it’s a different animal when you give orders to the “true believers”).
The interesting thing is that the comparison now is between Obama and Palin as if SHE is running for President. Sure, she’s a heartbeat from the Presidency, but the odds are slim that McCain falls over on Inauguration Day. Obama comes in with just as little, and the debate highlights that. But it is very off for one party’s pres. nominee to debate having more experience than the other party’s VP pick.
This is a prediction, because this is what I would do. Come Oct. 28th when Rezko’s sentence is announced (or his settlement for that matter), I’d start running ads… Palin attacked corruption in her own party, Obama profited from corruption in his own party and show some nice pictures of Obama and Rezko.
It’s a direct attack on “Change we can believe in”… Snowe, Hutchison, et al, simply could not provide that line of attack that goes straight to Obama’s fundamental message.
Comment by John Bambenek Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:55 am
John, she bucked her party like Rod Blagojevich bucked his party. She loved the pork, campaigned for Ted Stevens, was endorsed by him for governor, then did a total flip-flop on everybody and threw Stevens under the bus.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:57 am
Also, John, her tax hike on oil companies was a lot like RRB’s GRT. And she was in love with deficit finance when she was mayor. Love the hockey stadium.
Actually, she’s a lot like Rod. Check out what the GOP Senate Prez says about Palin. It’s a lot like what MJM says about our governor.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:59 am
Durbin has missed the point completely. Palin has been elected and served as the “chief elected official” in both local and state governmental units. How many chief elected offical positions of governmental organizations has Durbin served in? Zippo! He is but one of 100 policy makers in one legislative body. He does not bear direct total organizational responsibility in the same way as a mayor or governor. Palin has the appropriate governmental CEO leadership experience that U.S. Senators do not have.
Comment by One of the 35 Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:00 am
I don’t think McCain’s choice of Palin was ever really aimed at disgrunted Hillary supporters. (Leave it to the DC pundits to assume it was). No, I believe it was squarely aimed at getting social conservatives, particularly socially conservative women (whom the national media assume to be nonexistent), firmly behind a candidate they hadn’t been particularly enthused about.
If that was McCain’s strategy, I suspect it’s working. At least one woman in my own family (senior citizen, pro-life, devout Catholic), who didn’t plan on voting at all this year because she didn’t care for either candidate, now says she will “definitely” vote for McCain.
Whether Palin will attract enough social conservative votes to McCain to offset the lost votes of independents or skeptical Democrats who will now reluctantly vote for Obama, vote third party, or not vote at all, remains to be seen.
Comment by Secret Square Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:01 am
===I think it’s sexist to say that Palin was picked exclusively because she was a woman, ===
Palin on Hillary complaining about sexism…
“She does herself a disservice to even mention it, really,” Palin said. “When I hear a statement like that coming from a woman candidate with any kind of perceived whine about that excess criticism, or maybe a sharper microscope put on her, I think, ‘Man, that doesn’t do us any good, women in politics, or women in general, trying to progress this country,’” Palin said. “I don’t think it bodes well for her.”
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:02 am
– She loved the pork, campaigned for Ted Stevens, was endorsed by him for governor, then did a total flip-flop on everybody and threw Stevens under the bus.–
To paraphrase the great Willie Brown, “If you can’t take their support then turn around and screw ‘em, you’re in the wrong business.”
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:02 am
So, according to Durbin Palin doesn’t have the experience. What about Clinton? Governor of Arkansas =’s President of the United States?!?!
This, though, is also a tactic that Durbin used against Rep. Durkin. Durbin said that a state rep doesn’t have the experience to be a US Senator.
Comment by SangamoGOP Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:02 am
The best thing about this pick is that Obama is debating her about who has better experience. He is addressing his own biggest shortfall.
That, combined with the fact Obama picked an insider from DC, despite badmouthing them during his run. For the people who it matters to, the Dem ticket is not balanced. the most and third most liberal members of the senate and all that blah, blah that will be spoken about. McCain the moderate picked a conservative to woo the right.
Yes, she is a woman. She is an outsider, a conservative, executive and percieved as a reformer. Given the scandals, she has proven that she is pro-life and not some hypocrite in that regard.
Comment by Wumpus Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:05 am
Rich - as always great analysis of a way too crazy media frenzy.
I think that the GOP spin about her ability to energize the base is way premature. While I could care less about her family or how many babies they have, I do think that one story will take some shine off of her star with many evangelicals.
The GOP is spinning her too much. I saw Durkin say on ABC7 the other day that Palin was “Commander in Chief of the Alaska National Guard” which is in fact not true. The Alaska Governor is Commander in Chief of a volunteer citizen militia police force. Not the same thing.
Don’t Worry Be Happy hit the nail on the head - the McCain coverage is so limited - he’ll speak on Thursday, but the Palin story has wiped out the convention for the GOP.
Comment by siriusly Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:06 am
Considering McCain’s age, Sarah is probably not the best choice for VP. Her ridiculously reactionary, right wing beliefs are to the right of GW Bush and 90% of the American people. At least, McCain is somewhat moderate when he is being truthful and lucid.
The same reverends who were praying for rain during Barack’s acceptance speech will all be praying for Mccain’s early demise should they, by some strange chance, get elected. It is the only way that they will ever get one of their whacky soulmates into the White House.
Way to put “Country First”, McAncient!
Comment by Bill Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:09 am
I think you will see, that palin is a right choice and she has revived the base. She will help mc cain in some of the major swing states.. MO PA as examples…She does have more managing experience than OBAMA and she has put the democrats in a frenzy.
Comment by ironman Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:09 am
Rich-
Before she became governor, she nailed her own party chairman for corruption, nailed the AG, and then ousted a corrupt governor from her own party.
Maybe she picked up the anti-corruption winds and ran with it, maybe it is ingrained ideology, who knows. But the fact is, she took on her own party’s corruption.
Are you seriously contending that Blago did anything close to that? Has this pick turned you that blindly partisan?
Comment by John Bambenek Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:11 am
ironman, try not to slavishly repeat DC talking points. Explain things. Any other posts like that will be deleted.
And, Bill, geez, man, lighten up a bit, eh?
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:13 am
I think, if it weren’t for all this other stuff coming out about Palin, that she is a good choice for McCain. Too often, the voices supporting the Pro-Life cause come across as judgmental, mean, and not personally involved with the issue. This is a woman who has walked the Pro-Life walk. She chose to bear her Down Syndrome child, a choice many other women (even some putative Pro-Lifers) have not made. She packages Pro-Life into a pleasant package, even with the unconventional grandchild (after all, Bristol could have had a quiet abortion and no one ever would have been the wiser).
However, she does seem to have a bit of baggage. And the claims that being mayor of a small town is executive experience makes me smile. I’m imagining the mayor of Mattoon as qualified to be President, and I’m just not seeing it. Governor of a state? Maybe, but if that’s the gold standard for being president, McCain has never been an executive either, and she hasn’t been a governor for long enough to be seasoned anyway. Rod Blagojevich has served as governor of IL (a much more populous state with an urban center and a huge agribusiness economy) for more years and I doubt anyone here wants him in the White House.
Comment by cermak_rd Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:13 am
I don’t know if McCain’s choice will end up being very stupid or brilliant. But Rich is right that the DC insiders are so out of touch that they often end up looking like fools. But lucky for them, the DC media types obfuscate on behalf of their friends - so we have lone voices in the wilderness like Rich to call them on it.
But for Rich to compare Palin to Blagojevich is silly. She was appointed to an oil commission, found corruption and got the bad guys out. Her real reformist credentials got into the Executive Mansion. She immediately and completely revamped the way the state deals with Big Oil. Of course she made enemies in her party. But she is wildly popular with the public. She gets things done. Palin at 80% approval, Rod at 20% - sorry, Rich, there’s no contest. Fact is she has meaningful governmental executive experience and has gotten ahead by taking on (and not accommodating) corruption. The Democratic Presidential nominee is, dare I say it, a polar opposite. This stuff is addictive.
Comment by phocion Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:15 am
John, when you present it that way, in full DC spin mode, you can make any kind of argument you want. Take a closer look.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:16 am
Also, that 80 percent approval rating is more DC spin. It’s dropped. It’s 64 percent, which ain’t bad at all, but it’s no 80.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:19 am
I like Ms. Palin and I hope these two months in the extreme turbulence of national presidential politics will not end her political career should she and McCain lose, which seems more likely than not. A long Republican retreat on the national level, similar to the long Republican retreat we are still experiencing in Illinois, would be disastrous for the country. We badly need talented leaders in both parties with one party functioning as an effective opposition, questioning everything the party in power is doing.
Her choice does, though, raise questions about McCain’s decision-making processes. It almost seems as though he was so angry that certain conservative groups derailed his plan to choose
Lieberman that he chose Palin, and the huge risks a comparative unknown entails, in a snap decision made out of anger. He would have done far better to try and get Robert Gates or some other highly experienced indivdual without close Bush ties into the race–someone who could keep the brakes on him and his temper.
Meanwhile, Ms. Palin should be encouraged. If they ever put up a website where you can demonstrate support by contributing to her directly in this campain, I will most definitely contribute.
Comment by Cassandra Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:22 am
I hope they do make the “not a reformer” argument.
Then we all get to talk about the reform in Illinois
Comment by Pat collins Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:24 am
“Siriusly,” I wouldn’t assume that her daughter’s pregnancy will necessarily turn evangelical Christians away from Palin.
I think most evangelical Christians, including those who do all the right things, save themselves for marriage, etc., know people who have been through this — their own teenage or adult children or grandchildren, other relatives, children of friends, etc. — and can sympathize.
Comment by Secret Square Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:24 am
He would have done far better to try and get Robert Gates
And what state would that have brought it? What group of voters? I see Palin as doing two things, and she does them well.
1) Rally the base. They are well and truly rallied now.
2) Take away the “two white men” argument.
Comment by Pat collins Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:26 am
Rich-
Maybe she has baggage, maybe she isn’t a true believer, and maybe there is more that comes out later. But let’s be honest, even if it was political expedience, she still took on her own party. Has Obama? He could have taken on the passing of the Cook County Presidency down as a heriditary title, but he didn’t. When Emil repeated the stunt and coronated Threemil, he could have spoken up, but didn’t. He could have spoken out on Blago or Daley, but hasn’t.
Now, I’m not going to pretend that Palin is a reformer because of deeply held conviction. Maybe it is, maybe it isn’t, but I’m not going to do long distance psychology.
However, her record at least shows a willingness to take on her own party…
Hell, I recall a column or article by you begging Obama to come back and fix Illinois to prove he can be the agent of change he says he is. At least I can point to times when Palin has done it, political calculation or not.
And again, I think it says something that we are comparing the Dem headliner to the GOP VP pick. That only emphasizes who the real heavy-weight is here, namely, McCain.
And yes, I’d point out that McCain doesn’t have any exec. experience and that is a problem. I don’t like the concept of Senators (or Reps for the matter) elevating to the presidency without any exec. experiences whatsoever. And that includes McCain (who wasn’t my first pick). Would it be better if Palin had 8 years experience instead of 2, sure. But at least it is SOME executive experience. Sure, maybe she needs more “seasoning”, I’ll grant you that. But it only highlights deficiencies in the Dem ticket.
And let’s be honest about foreign policy experience… the only way you get that is either being in the White House or the State Department. Perhaps the Defense Department.
What I find the **possibly** most compelling part of picking Palin, and time will tell if this is true, is that it has the potential to remake the GOP. The party has long since abandoned its core beliefs as people have hung around in office and got addicting to feeding at the trough…
You’ve got people like Palin and Jindal that, in a few years, can legitimately return the party to its roots. If that’s McCain’s idea, it’s brilliant, because Palin (and Jindal and others) have the potential of being everything that the calcified DC GOP is not.
Comment by John Bambenek Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:28 am
Just a tongue in check thought, After Bill Clinton and George Bush, maybe someone without experience and a fresh insight may be preferable. An Obamba/Palin ticket would certainly make that happen.
Comment by downstate hack Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:30 am
Sorry, I get this way at election time. Let’s hug.
Comment by Bill Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:31 am
The more Dems that take swings at her, the more the party is going to get stuck to non-winning, non-substantive arguments, and apologizing later for statements they can’t get out of. The media will gladly do its part - it beats covering a boring party platform or long winded debate. Palin just needs to be very quiet right now. And Obama has how many weeks left to resist taking a swing?
Comment by RemusKnew Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:33 am
Rich i think mccain made a bold choice for vp but would they stop saying because she has been gov of alaska she is more experienced than obama because by that standard she is more qualified than mccain too!
Comment by anon Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:33 am
anon,
Actually she probably IS more qualified than McCain.
Comment by Bill Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:35 am
Senator Durbin wields the hatchet for his party and cuts himself in the shin. What else did you expect from him?
Comment by Enemy of the State Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:40 am
Experience for President is a nebulous thing… there are far too many things that you are perceived to need to be an expert in things… far too many things that is really possible for one person to master.
Can McCain be a Chief Executive? Dunno… it is an area of concern because historically legislators don’t make good executives.
Being a governor helps, but running a state and running the federal government, while analagous, is not the same.
The best training possible for being pres, probably is being VP (assuming the pres uses you that way).
Comment by John Bambenek Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:41 am
George W. Bush had executive experience prior to becoming President, and we all see where that got us.
Comment by Old Shepherd Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:42 am
The attacks on Palin & her pregnant child are over the top. I truly expected many lefties to be supportive of a woman on the ticket. Instead we see attack after snarky attack. I watched Bob Beckel on CNN question whether or not she is fit to serve because her daughter is pregnant. Saying “What kind of mother is she”? Yet there is very little outrage about the blatant sexism & chauvinism from the left. Or the media for that matter.
It seems that the D’s want diversity if and only when those of represent the Democrat Party. Lincoln created the created the Republican party and freed the slaves. Colin Powell, Condoleezza Rice, Justice Clarence Thomas, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales. All appointed by republicans Yet they are all attacked by the left and it seems the media as well. It seems they really don’t want diversity after all.
Comment by Larry Mullholand Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:42 am
One note (and I hope this doesn’t take this thing off track). I agree with Obama et al. that discussion of Palin’s daughter is off limits.
That being said, I’m still shocked that over at Illinois Review, there is a photo of Sen. Obama’s daughter, sitting and holding a flag with the flag touching the ground. The Illinois Review types think a tired 10 year is the proper subject of debate and ridicule.
I keep thinking that they hit a new low and can’t get any deeper, and then they do something like that. What a shame for a site that claims to have the moral highground.
Comment by Skeeter Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:45 am
If you’re gonna say this about Obama/Biden, you gotta say it about McCain too — no executive experience.
- John Bambenek - Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:55 am:
But she’s the only one with any executive experience in the field… albeit very little. Even as mayor of Wasilla, she’s managed more people than Biden and Obama combined with their Senate staffs.
Comment by Don't drink the Kool-Aid, from either side Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:51 am
I love watching this, but lets get a handle on things. Its a VP pick. Its a woman. Ok, story over. VP’s go to funerals. Does anyone still remember who is running for President of the country?
Comment by Speaking At Will Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:52 am
TO the point, I think Palin was chosen as a Washington outsider, to appeal to women and primarily to highlight OBAMA’s lack of experience. TO have a real and ongoing debate about who’s more qualified Obama for president or an unknown former mayor of a town of 9,000 as VP is priceless. It centers the debate on squarely Obama’s primary weakness. Experience.
I had to laugh when I heard Biden’s speech at the convention talking up Obama’s dramatic life altering legislation he passed in Illinois as State Senator. Those of us that have spent time under the dome can attest to Obama’s significant legislation that Biden trumpeted…um well there was a, the a, oh, wait no it was uh uh…..what was it again? Oh well, Biden sounded good on National TV right?
Comment by Larry Mullholand Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:55 am
Eventually, the pundits will see what a brilliant pick this was for McCain on so many levels, the risk not withstading.
First, as has been pointed out, this pick has motivated a base that was doing little more than treading water in the campaign. His support among Republicans is now 92%, and the party’s right wing is in a frenzy to get the ticket elected, whether you agree with their motivations or not.
Second, while she is a woman and adds an interesting twist to how to target the undecideds and voters “in the middle” some of which may be Hillary voters, a more significant point is her appeal to Independents and Conservative Democrats as a fresh face, an outsider, and a fellow “maverick” to complement McCain.
I say it’s significant because of the states Hillary beat Obama in during the primary - West Virginia, Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio and in “blue” states with some potential for McCain like Iowa and Minnesota. In swing states, what is the biggest demographic to go after? Suburban women. Obama early on was seen as unbeatable because of this demographic. With the emergence of a stong, good-looking professional mom on the scene, I predict many suburban women will see her more as “one of us” - especially as long as the media continues to attack her on such ridiculous double standards as having too many kids to raise to run for VP.
She definitely has her risks - the experience thing being the biggest one because of McCain’s age, but I think her positives far outweigh the negatives, and she has turned this race into something much more interesting to watch.
The fact that she may somehow “suck all the wind” out of the convention is ludicrous. She IS the wind blowing through the convention, and I think that’s what the McCain people were after. She also sucked all the wind out of the coverage of Obama’s speech last Friday. He didn’t even have national politicos talking for 24 hours before all the news switched to her.
I look forward to her speech tonight to see how she handles all of this and to her debate with Biden.
Comment by Amuzing Myself Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:03 pm
What we saw this week is what happens when so-called political experts are surprised. Instead of rationally discussing Gov. Palin, her history and experience, they became a hate-filled lynch mob.
Their bigotry, sexism and discriminations took over. Their emotions replaced rationale. At every tiny fact uncovered, we watched these so-called professionals drop their masks and reveal their utter lack of professionalism. They seethed with fury at Governor Palin because of what they saw in her, not because of what has been presented during the past week.
We witnessed the resurgence of an obsolete disgust towards pregnant teens, even if they were engaged in marriage. We saw jaw-dropping fury at a three month old infant because he has Down’s Syndrone. We heard bellows of disgust questioning how a woman governor could be so selfish to abandon her children for her political career.
We heard glee from so-called professionals as they regugitated 22 year old DUI arrest for a candidate’s then-22 year old husband. We were told of fishing licenses violations as though they had uncovered a murder conviction.
As these so-called professional reporters were shredding Governor Palin over Internet conspiracies, demanding DNA evidence she mothered her children, or wore a “fat suit” to fake a pregnancy, they also feigned disgust at their own behavior - then condemned her for forcing them to behave in this manner. These so-called news professionals seemed entirely comfortable blaming the Governor for their lack of professionalism.
Finally, once again we are not seeing reporting. We are seeing so-called professional reporters engaged in the battles instead of reporting. We are seeing angry talking heads foaming at the mouth over a set of stories they have formed out of fluff and rumors. We are seeing that we are not getting news, but instead, we are getting a slanted, biased opinion from a millionaire TV news superstar demanding that we don’t think for ourselves, don’t listen to all sides of a situation, don’t weigh priorities as to what is important to us, don’t let them see you as an ignorant conservative, and to follow the fashion as they dictate.
What we have been witnessing is the death of professional journalism. Honestly, it has come to the obvious fact - we can do better than they can when it comes to listening, judging, and determining if Governor Palin would make a good Vice President, then the so-called experts.
We are hearing a death knell for journalism. And good riddance if this is the best they can do.
Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:22 pm
===But she’s the only one with any executive experience in the field… albeit very little. Even as mayor of Wasilla, she’s managed more people than Biden and Obama combined with their Senate staffs. ===
As the Mayor of Wasilla, Palin was in charge of 50 employees. Obama has almost as many people on his Senate staff and his campaign is composed of 2,5000 people. That’s truly a stretch.
Comment by Kevin Fanning Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:27 pm
Oh boy, and I was leaning (just leaning, not totally there) towards McCain. I had come to the conclusion that since we had a dem controlled house and senate in Illinois with a governor who is a product of Chicago politics (actually worse than that - Rodo is really the #4 clone from Multiplicity), did I want a dem controlled US congress with a president who is a product of Chicago politics. Now Rich, you point out so many ways that Rodo and Palin are alike. What’s a voter to do now? I guess I’m gonna have to stick with my dem roots and hold my nose when I vote.
Comment by Little Egypt Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:28 pm
==As the Mayor of Wasilla, Palin was in charge of 50 employees. Obama has almost as many people on his Senate staff and his campaign is composed of 2,5000 people. That’s truly a stretch. ==
Talk about regurgitating a talking point!
She is a Governor!
Why don’t you just claim she is an old beauty queen and use that as a basis she can’t be VP.
It is weird for Obama to use his own politically ambitious presidential campaign to claim he has more experience than an opponent who was once a mayor - and not mention that she is now a governor. Weird!
Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:32 pm
Does anyone really care what the Washington pundits care about right now as they feverishly vet Palin and uncover, OMG! Her husband’s 20 year DUI! OMG! Her teenager daughter is pregnant! OMG! During a meeting once she yelled at someone! OMG! She fired a few people while in office! OMG! OMG! OMG!
Enough!
Name one big time Washington/national pundit who a year ago predicted Obama/Biden vs. McCain/Palin? 18 months ago? None you say? OMG! This makes the whole lot of them ill-informed and out of touch. They still are.
This weekend I went door-to-door delivering signs for the Kirk campaign. The folks I delivered signs to are incredibly excited over this choice and incredibly angry over the national press “crucifixion/mauling” of her. (Not my words, but a word routinely used as in “The national press is going to crucify her because they don’t know her.”) And they were mad, not at McCain, not at Palin, but at the press. “Out of control press.” “Why don’t they question Obama like that?”
McCain will have the last laugh on this choice. The out of touch national punditry machine that is freaked out right now and is falsely portraying her as some backwoods hunting anti-abortionist moose dressing trailer park union member Jerry Springer family type of backwater chick was selected for VP under their very noses and their reaction to this selection is offensive and over the top.
That CNN interview was preposterous. “Name one instance when Governor Palin called out the national guard or acted as commander in chief of the national guard?” How stupid of a question was that, let alone the constant interrupting with the rolling of the eyes in front of the camera. I guess the correct answer would have been “every day she serves as the commander in chief of the Alaska national guard” but the real answer was not what she was looking for in asking taunting questions.
I thought us lawyers had boorish behavioral problems. The press makes us looks like saints!
Comment by Louis G. Atsaves Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:42 pm
[…] Rich covers the basic problem well: […]
Pingback by ArchPundit | Durbin Steps on the Message Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:42 pm
VM-
She’s been Governor for little over a year. Obama wasn’t running his campaign on experience, and has also been vetted for close to two years now. How does this pick assuage voters who feared Obama’s experience and liked that about McCain?
Comment by Kevin Fanning Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:43 pm
Rich, I agree with you in general that the media feeding frenzy has been ridiculous, and that the experience argument is kind of a wash, but I defy you to find any traditional media or even non-fringe blog that is characterizing Palin in any way as a “white trash mountain woman”. This is completely your projecting onto coverage.
Pointing out a lack of experience isn’t calling her “white trash” or a “mountain woman.” Neither is pointing out the tininess of her town, or the fact that her husband belonged to a secessionist movement.
I expect you’ll remove that part of your post unless you can come with a pretty concrete example of that characterization.
Comment by ramsin Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:44 pm
Documents Show While Mayor Palin Had Thank You Notes to Campaign Donors Printed by Her Assistant on City Time and Arranged Campaign Travel from Her Office. “The Voice of the Times, a separate editorial section within the opinion pages of the Daily News, made the original public records request that produced many of the documents that Murkowski’s campaign handed out Thursday, including a stack of telephone records, e-mails — such as a campaign note from her mayor e-mail address to Ruedrich — and invoices from Wasilla City Hall. The documents appear to show, for example, that on one occasion Palin arranged campaign travel from the mayor’s office. On another, her city administrative assistant printed thank-you notes to campaign donors. The administrative assistant, Mary Bixby, said in brief interview with the Daily News in late July that she was directed to perform those tasks while on the clock for the city.” For any mistakes she did make, Palin said, “I apologize.” [Anchorage Daily News, 8/18/06]
Wasilla’s Pension Was Only Funded at 73 Percent When Palin Left, as Opposed to Almost Completely When She Became Mayor. In fiscal 2002, Wasilla funded 73 percent of its defined benefit pension plan obligation and had 52 percent unfunded liability as a percentage of its covered payroll. In fiscal 1995, Wasilla funded 97.5 percent of its obligation and had 4.3 percent unfunded liability as a percentage of payroll. [Wasilla Comprehensive Annual Financial Report 2003, page 29; Wasilla Comprehensive Annual Financial Report 1996, page 45]
Comment by Like Blago, or Like Ryan? Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:49 pm
You expect wrong, Ramsin. They talk down to her or they talk down when speaking of her. Seems pretty clear to me. Sorry your feelings were so hurt for them.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:51 pm
Kevin,
That “Obama managed his campaign successfully” meme is already fading, and it never was a good argument.
First, Obama’s campaign was managed by Axelrod & Co., and they’ve probably lost years off of their lives cleaning up after gaffes like “clinging to guns and religion” and “wouldn’t want to punish my daughter with a child.”
Geez, Obama won because Hillary was too afraid of losing the black vote in the general to run with the Wright issue right before Iowa. If she had, he’d never have beat her.
If you do want to stick with “successful campaign” meme, then the winner of the whole enchilada has to go to McCain, who has raised far less money, was considered down for the count in the primaries, and too broke, old, and stupid to beat the “2nd coming of Camelot.”
Yet, there he is, with in easy striking distance of Obama BEFORE he even gets his convention bump. If marshaling assets and playing them well is how “managing campaigns” are measured, then McCain blows Obama away.
Rich’s analysis at the end of his post is right on, and it is the same trap that the left and the media always walk into.
Thinking that they (media, elite, Ivy league left, etc) are truly much smarter than any of those dumb hicks who vote Republican, they create such a caricature of the right that all one has to do is speak normally and intelligently to make the media and far left detractors look much dumber than any “conservative hick.”
You’d figure that after getting embarrassed by Reagan, Bush II, and soon Palin, they might learn. But they are the media elite, and that makes them a good bit dumber than the first 100 names in the phone book.
Obama may yet pull it off by sucking down every dollar from dumb, rich liberal suburbanites and using the money to mobilize the far-left, but at the end of the day, the sheer numbers of “center-right” voters probably won’t turn the nation over to a Cook County Political Hack who gives a nice speech, but in the end has accomplished nothing more than stellar success at promoting himself.
The icing on the cake will be watching Palin destroy Biden in a debate. My prediction is that picking Biden will go down in history as the most egregious mistake Obama made, which brings us again to the fact that he really hasn’t managed his campaign well at all.
Comment by Bruno Behrend Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:51 pm
I think the Palin pick is pretty simply understood from a statistical perspective. I think we can agree that McCain’s election is an unlikely outcome (not 5%, just not the majority of outcomes if you rolled the dice a hundred times.) Anyway, Palin raises the volatility of the simulation. (Much as Biden lowered it, or Romney would have.) The underdog likes adding volatility; the leader does not.
I say, if you don’t care between losing small and losing big, you might as well add volatility, since it adds more positive outcomes to the mix.
Comment by Greg Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:53 pm
The investigation into abuse of power/office agains Palin could prove to be a bigger hurdle then McCain anticipated. This investigation of her abusing her office goes to the very heart of legitmate concerns anyone should have over her being a VP, and it looks bad for her. She is alleged to have acted through a staffer to demand that the ex-husband of her sister be fired. When the command was not followed she allegedly had the person who failed to carry out the order fired. Intial reports indicate is it undisputed that the comments from her staffer could be interpreted as suggesting her sisters ex be fired. The defense is simply that she did not order it - i.e. the staffer was acting on their own. I am not persuaded that her staffer accidentaly implied her sisters ex-husabnd should be punatively fired, but we will see what the investigation reveals. ALso of note, Palin trying to stop the investigation by saying the legislature can not investigate the temrination. Instead of just co-operating and laying the whole thing to rest she is insetad trying to block the investigation!! The conduct by Palin is very Bush like and should send chills of concern.
The bit about her stongly supporting abstinence education for birth control and her 17yr old becoming pregant is an irony that even murphy can appreciate.
Comment by Ghost Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:56 pm
One reason for the feeding frenzy is that she wasn’t a part of the primary season. Governors who are themselves presidential candidates may not have any foreign policy experience, but they have to talk about it every day, and the media pokes and prods them about all of their family issues. If McCain had chosen any non-candidate non-Beltway insider, the political press would have swarmed them; it happens that because she was a dark horse, she’s getting swarmed even more, and the frenzy is more intense than it would have been for Romney or somebody like that. Add in the fact that she’s a woman with a new baby, and the Bristol situation, and it’s a perfect storm. Unfortunately, in the mad rush, a lot of people are saying a lot of stupid things, and a huge distraction from what should be driving voters, which are the issues — you know, the economy, the war, health care, stuff like that. On that, there is a clear contrast between the tickets, and I wish more people would vote based on that contrast, not on all of the sideshow stuff.
Comment by Trent Green's Clipboard Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 12:59 pm
Rich-
I am surprised you think the media will calm down a bit after tonight. I agree with you that Palin will probably give a good speech and will *seem* relatively normal. But the media loves all these scandals, probably because it is what the American people love to read about and talk about.
I think instead the media will try to paint her into a corner as much as possible. They will scrutinize every possible thing she says about her record and find a way to contradict her.
This should have been expected by the McCain campaign. Every politician has “flip-flops” and skeletons in their closet. The difference is that we have had plenty of time to come to terms with the skeletons of the Clintons, Barack Obama, Joe Biden, John McCain, or anyone else on the national scene. But anytime you pluck some random politician out of nowhere and throw him or her into the spotlight, a lot will surface. For the McCain camp to think that the media or the American people will forget about all the scandals or not keep looking for more in the next two months is naive.
Comment by Law Student Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:05 pm
===The conduct by Palin is very Bush like ===
It is really more Nixonesque than Bush like but excellent point!
Comment by Bill Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:12 pm
I love the nonsense coming from most of the TV/radio the talking heads because someone outside the in-crowd has popped into the picture. They suddenly have to resuffle the talking points to stay ahead of the National Enquirer and US magazine “investigative” reporters to keep themselves relevent and rationalize that national contract.
Palin has been a great choice to keep the spin meisters going. Will she be good as VP? Truman, LBJ and Ford all did pretty well when they stepped into the top job. Truman had minimal experience and did a pretty fine job. Give her a shot. She and McCain had to know what was going to happen once her name was announced. The Pres and VP need to surround themselves with the smartest/best people they can find while oordinating and make the final decisions.
The issue of her being a good choice will never die, but she can show if she can play on a national stage over the next several weeks. Glad to see her there. Drive them nuts.
I do wish the press would leave all the other family stuff out of the picture. Not relevent unless the candidate wants them there or some major hypocrisy really jumps out. Stuff happens in every family. Roll with it.
Comment by zatoichi Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:13 pm
===Obama may yet pull it off by sucking down every dollar from dumb, rich liberal suburbanites and using the money to mobilize the far-left, but at the end of the day, the sheer numbers of “center-right” voters probably won’t turn the nation over to a Cook County Political Hack who gives a nice speech, but in the end has accomplished nothing more than stellar success at promoting himself.===
First off, I don’t even know how to touch the first part of that. But you’re falling into the same trap that Rich wrote about in the post. To paint Obama as a “Cook County political hack who makes a good speech” is to grossly underestimate his abilities. Just ask Hillary Clinton how that worked out for her.
Comment by Kevin Fanning Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:14 pm
What was the TV show with Geena Davis? She played an inexperienced politician who becomes VP and then President when the old guy dies.
That might be a prophetic show and good news for Palin. The bad news is the show only lasted half a season.
Comment by Phineas J. Whoopee Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:16 pm
lol
Comment by Kevin Fanning Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:16 pm
“Do Republicans really think that little of him?
I guess they do. We are looking at a different person.”
Its not that we think that little of him. Its just we don’t think he has more experience than her, because he doesn’t.
Mayor/Municipal Govt vs. State Senate
Sitting at your desk for years in the GA only to actually get stuff passed your last year is fine. But don’t anyone compare that unremarkable state senate tenure with her tenure as mayor of a city, no matter how small. As mayor you make decisions on all levels, every day. You don’t have the luxury of picking an issue or two and pushing them without making real decisions. The buck stops with you.
Business Experience
From what I understand, the Palin’s owned a small stake in car wash and owned and operated their own commercial fishing business. Barack has NO business experience or experience managing a company. He was a community organizer, so he did walk around and talk to people, but didn’t run anything. Oh, actually I forgot about Annenburg Challenge, which he ran with Bill Ayers. they did manage something rather unique here — they squandered $110 million, from what I understand.
Governor vs. US Senator
No contest. Obama actually worked in the Senate for some 100 some odd days until he began campaigning. As an Illinois resident, I feel we are being cheated!! He has not done much and has taken no real chances. He backed out on a bipartisan ethics deal with McCain and he didn’t support the Gang of 14. He has a subcommittee for NATO and Afghanistan and although he aggressively advocates that Afghan needs help, he has never held a meeting of the subcommittee, which is vital to our NATO mission in Afghanistan. His response — he was too busy running for POTUS. Palin, on the other hand, has enjoyed 80%+ approval ratings and has successfully negotiated a natural gas pipeline deal. She instituted tax reform and negotiated with big oil on her terms.
Reform
Palin stepped down from her position on the Alaska Oil and Gas Consortium(?) when she spotted corruption and took down the GOP chairman. She then took on the incumbent Gov from her own party and beat him. Then she went after crooked legislators, even in her own party. She has stood up to the corruption in her own state party.
Barack — still waiting for him to do something.
Foreign Policy
Barack did the Nunn-Lugar-Obama bill on nuclear anti-proliferation, he lived in Indonesia as a kid, and he rode with a traveling circus through Europe. He’s visited Iraq twice, Syria, and Israel once. His first foreign policy decision was a gigantic flop when he angered the Chancellor if Germany for presumptuously being scheduled at the Brandenburg gate. Instead, and this is his greatest foreign policy achievement, he gave a speech to 200,000 Germans in front of a Nazi monument.
Palin is the Gov of a state which carries with a TOP SECRET clearance. She is the commander of the national guard, which in Alaska carries with it an active duty guard unit that is part of the US missile defense program. She also negotiated directly with the Canadian government on the construction of a natural gas pipeline. She negotiates with Japan, Russia, and others regarding fishing rights. She has been to Iraq twice, and did visit the medical center in Landsthul to see injured troops from Alaska. The Illinois troops were waiting there one day for their US Senator, but he never showed. He said he had to work out instead.
Baggage
Barack endorsed Blago (twice), Stroger, Daley, and Jones was his mentor. He had Rezko help him buy his home when he couldn’t afford it, and he has a horrible record on public housing. His racist pastors and of course, the lovable terrorist from the south side. Bill Ayers.
Palin has a current ethical investigation into a possible abuse of poeer. The investigation was launched by the Sen. Pres., a Repub and political rival. She got a citation for fishing without a permit. Her 17 year old daughter is pregnant and soon to wed.
Now, who is more experienced? Barack said he is because his campaign is SOOO big that he has 2,500 employees and millions of dollars a month in budget. He compared that to her town budget. One problem, Barack — she is Gov of a state with a $10+ billion budget and 15,000 employees. She got you there too! And campaigning does not translate into competent governance. Your boy Blago proves that point. Our #2 is more experienced than your #1
Comment by Bud Man Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:16 pm
The East Coast Elitists of the mainstream press — famously characterized as the “nattering nabobs of negativism” by Spiro Agnew via William Safire — are in full vent. What a spectacle.
I’m still now sure about Palin (nor do I think veep choices ultimately matter) but McCain clearly struck a nerve with the Best and Brightest.
I remember how Reagan was characterized as a dimwitted failed B actor by the East Coast Elite. Didn’t stop him from winning 44 states in 1980 and 49 states in 1984. I guess the people just didn’t know what was good for them.
If the mainstream press keeps pounding on Palin, and especially her daughter, it’s to McCain’s benefit.
Remind me again, just why is Palin’s daughter an issue, anyway?
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:16 pm
===Remind me again, just why is Palin’s daughter an issue, anyway?===
I think because the McCain campaign sent out a press release announcing the pregnancy. It had been rumored, discussed, etc., but not really published.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:19 pm
Rich, it is disgusting the outrageous attacks on Sarah Palin. The Republicans failed to defend her correctly in the first place and that only seemed to ramp up the feeding frenzy.
I see mentioned over and over the comments about big oil. I’ve seen many stories questioning McCain’s commitment to Republican conservatism. Why aren’t the big media outlets discussing the pipeline deal she signed with a Canadian company? What about the recent Republican push for drilling in ANWR? Is it even remotely possible McCain picked her for her state’s energy reserves and her ability to negotiate deals with big oil?
I won’t vote for the ticket since she is still talking about a 35-year-old decision on abortion (strike one). At least on that Obama has it right — why aren’t we dealing with the root cause instead of still arguing over the result?
I think I read somewhere she’s in favor of teaching creationism in schools (strike two).
She shares strike three with Obama — she hasn’t completed the first term she won. Neither of them seem to have much of an attention span for us to believe they could commit to four years at their next job since they are so quick to leave their current terms behind.
Comment by ValleyGal Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:22 pm
The whole Palin media frenzy also points out the contradictory, unspoken and, to some extent, unrealistic expectations we have of modern presidents. (I realize Palin isn’t the one running for president but the whole media frenzy is based on the possibility that she could end up having to serve as president.)
We want someone with experience who is also an outsider. We want someone who knows the system inside and out, but isn’t a part of it. We want a super-smart father (or mother) figure, well-versed in all areas of foreign and domestic policy, attractive, elegant and always well-spoken, but we also want them to be just like us working stiffs.
If McCain had chosen a veep candidate with multiple advanced degrees in economics, administration and foreign affairs, years of experience as a diplomat, in Congress or in another president’s cabinet, plus experience in the private sector, and a perfect family with no potential embarassments or scandals — we’d be complaining about how his choice proved he was “out of touch” with the average American, and how disappointed we were that he had chosen a “Beltway insider” who undermined his “straight talk” image.
Comment by Secret Square Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:24 pm
I don’t think it is to McCain’s benefit at all if the media keeps pounding on her.
And despite the fact that the media does go overboard, I am glad they are actually doing their jobs and digging up the dirt. This woman is the VP nominee and considering McCain’s age, could be President in the near future (although I seriously doubt at this point that they will be elected). The public deserves to know everything about her, especially since the Republicans are trying to spin her record and experience. It is the job of the media to question things, and I am glad they are finally doing it.
As for her daughter, it also raises the very important issue of teen pregnancy and how best to reduce it.
Comment by Law Student Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:24 pm
===Neither of them seem to have much of an attention span for us to believe they could commit to four years at their next job since they are so quick to leave their current terms behind.===
C’mon. You really believe that? What’s she gonna do? Take a job with a PR firm midway through her first term as veep?
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:25 pm
The Kos and the DU pushed a fake story that her fifth child is actually her daughters child, and Gov. Palin covered for her teenage daughter by acting pregnant.
I know. It’s absurd. But the Enquirer was going to go with it and CNN had a camera crew up there poking around the friends and the boyfriends houses. So they had to release it. I guess a Labor Day, with a hurricane hitting New Orleans, and the first day of the convention is as good as a day as any to get it out there??
It is still shameful that the MSM has been reduced to reporting on rumors on lefty hate sites. Its almost surreal. They are really threatened by this woman.
Comment by Bud Man Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:27 pm
Bud Man- you really think they are threatened by Palin? As an Obama supporter, I was worried on Friday, but since then everything that has come out has been CRAZY. I mean, it is like watching a soap opera.
Also, one random commenter posted the story on the Daily Kos. As someone who reads “liberal” blogs, I never even heard the rumor until Palin announced herself her daughter was pregnant. Besides, she had to announce it. If she thought no one would notice her daughter’s growing belly in the next two months, then she doesn’t give us enough credit….
Comment by Law Student Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:31 pm
Anybody here ever been to Alaska? Anybody understand what a mind-boggling huge, magnificent place it is? Anybody understand how independent-minded its geographically (and ethnicly and politically) spread-out voters are?
And how old was Reagan the second time he was elected? And how many of us are, or know, cancer survivors?
So could we please just answer those questions for ourselves and then spend some time between now and November 4 concentrating on McCain’s and Obama’s qualifications to be president so each of us can vote intelligently?
Comment by been there Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:31 pm
The Kos piece I believe was simply a reader diary from a first-time poster that got rated up. The Enquirer claims that the story came out because the mom wanted to keep it secret and the daughter demanded disclosure.
And if you want hate sites, go visit the comment section of any newspaper website. Much worse than any stories you’ll find at Kos.
Also, I highly doubt that the media feels “threatened by this woman.” They’re overreacting in complete darkness and it’s pretty grotesque to watch.
The rollout was horrible. But that doesn’t excuse all of the media overreaction, and it doesn’t justify Durbin’s goofiness.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:37 pm
When comparing the experience of Obama and Palin, I go back to their education. Obama is a legal genius who was the 1st black president of the Harvard law reveiw and is someone whom people have had their eyes on all his life because of his vast talents.
In Palin’s case, she seems to have been an average student who did well in extracurricular activities.
Who would you want to run your company?
I personally would want my CEO to be a genious and let the average girl with the good attitude work in marketing.
Comment by Phineas J. Whoopee Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:39 pm
Kevin,
First, forgive me for my rhetorical overreach re: “rich, white suburbanites,” but if Kansans are “dumb” or “misled” for voting against their own economic interests (a popular notion among the left & elite who read Thomas Franks), then one could easily argue the same thing about rich white suburbanites who support Obama. His policies will make them poorer, and quite quickly.
Second, what abilities? Sure, he’s been successful at self-promotion, but he’s easily the most untested candidate this nation has ever seen. His patina of “reform” and “change” are negated by record.
Any one who endorsed Todd Stroger isn’t a reformer of any kind. Does Obama represent change? Sure. Is it change for the better? I don’t think so, and on election day, most Americans probably agree with me.
This isn’t to say that he might not yet win, as the skids have been greased for him like no other. But really, if he were the God-send he’s made out to be, he’d be up 15-20 points by now.
Comment by Bruno Behrend Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:44 pm
===For the McCain camp to think that the media or the American people will forget about all the scandals or not keep looking for more in the next two months is naive.===
Nah. That’s naive.
DC types are notorious for being far too easily wowed by a performance. Witness Obama’s ‘06 speech and how it started the big buzz.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:44 pm
Thanks Rich. You are not doing this everyday are you? I enjoy this site get away from this.
Comment by Bud Man Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:46 pm
Rich, I understand it was announced and reported. My question is why is it an issue in the context of public policy or fitness for office?
I’d suggest to you that when you strip away all the rationalizations, the interest is simply prurient.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:48 pm
We only occasionally delve into national politics here, as you can plainly see why by reading some of the above comments. I only jump in when I have something to say and it has an Illinois angle.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:48 pm
===My question is why is it an issue in the context of public policy or fitness for office?===
Some of it is prurience. Some of it is the white trash meme. But, she did cut funding for housing for pregnant teens. And she is of the wing of the party that constantly complains about Hollywood values. So, it’s not entirely unfair, but it is wholly unpleasant.
Personally, I would never subject my own pregnant teenaged daughter to that kind of salacious worldwide exposure. But that’s just me.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:51 pm
==As for her daughter, it also raises the very important issue of teen pregnancy and how best to reduce it.==
That’s just silly and a rationalization. The press could raise the issue of teen pregnancy any time they like (I don’t think this is the first one).
I haven’t see the big to-do over Down’s Syndrome. Maybe they’re getting to that.
She’s an issue because it’s teen sex. The Washington press corps gets to do their Britney and Paris Hilton thing and pretend its serious journalism.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:56 pm
Word, there is a very tenious connection to Palin pushing abstinence based education as the best form of birth control. It does suggest that a policy of hers is ineffectual.
Comment by Ghost Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:57 pm
Rich, can I post a link?
Interesting analysis from an outside the beltway type from San Diego. The tidbit about the base is important. Many at the convention say they haven’t seen excitement like this since the 80s. And these revelations are only galvanizing support within the base. Those foot soldiers are desperately needed and now the so-cons have a poster child to work hard for.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articl
es/2008/09/country_will_benefit_from_mcca.html
Comment by Bud Man Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 1:59 pm
Who would I want to run the country?
Sure as hell not a lawyer… I’m just saying.
Comment by John Bambenek Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:05 pm
Ghost,
She is not against birth control. She is a member of feminists for life, a pro-life group that does not oppose birth control. But, you know, there are several states, including Ed Rendell in Pennsylvania, that have begun to look at abstinence education and have obtained grants for such programs. The current “teach it all” approach is honestly not working, so why not try a different approach?
Comment by Bud Man Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:05 pm
Rich and Ghost, I hear you, but that’s not why it’s getting the play.
Sex sells.
As far as the effectiveness of policy, abstinence does work. My high school years are a testament to that. I think birth control methods should be taught as well (I’m not a believer in promoting ignorance). But let’s not judge someone on the basis that her teenaged daughter didn’t listen to her.
As TR said about his wild child, Alice: “I can run the country, or I can run Alice. I cannot do both.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:06 pm
Personally, I would never subject my own pregnant teenaged daughter to that kind of salacious worldwide exposure. But that’s just me.
And I agree, this media frenzy and attacks from the left (and sure, the right does it to when the time is right) makes normal people not want to run for office.
And then we complain about our choices.
Comment by John Bambenek Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:09 pm
Rich, I would have to respectfully disagree with you regarding the media forgetting about all the Palin scandals. The media reports on what sells. If you go to CNN, NY Times, Washington Post, etc. and check out their most viewed articles and most emailed articles, it is about Palin. For better or worse, this is what people are interested in. Palin is even on the cover of US Weekly, a celebrity gossip magazine! The media will keep looking for more new scandals until they have have left no stone unturned. Palin is an easy target right now because no one knows anything about her. Of course all of this will die down eventually, I just don’t think it will die down in the next two months.
Comment by Law Student Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:09 pm
Don’t twist my words.
Any person with half a brain could see that they would be exposing their daughter to international attention and ridicule. We have a free press. We’re also free to criticize that press, but it is what it is and most in politics have some understanding of consequences.
I wouldn’t do it. There are some things more important than power. But, again, that’s me.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:11 pm
Palin’s daughter was news before she released news she was pregnant… and people release this information all the time. It doesn’t make it ok to sit there and eviscerate the girl for it.
This rationalization on why it’s all the sudden ok to go scortched earth on people really just encourages this “win at all costs” partisanship that is ruining our country.
Comment by John Bambenek Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:13 pm
Honestly, if this is the best the MSM can do with a governor running for VP, no wonder they’re losing subscriptions and going under.
Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:18 pm
John, chill and reflect just a bit.
It’s your party, remember, that haranged against the “Murphy Brown love child” “scandal.” People who worked for the current president of your party smeared one John McCain 8 years ago for fathering a black child out of wedlock. IL Review’s founder repeatedly went after the IL Senate Majority Leader’s personal sexual history after she proposed a mandatory vaccine for girls. What did Bill O’Reilly say about the parents of Britney’s kid sister? The list goes on and on.
From what I can tell, the Obama people are not making the girl an issue. Just the opposite.
Partisanship isn’t to blame for the media frenzy on the pregnant kid. A totally bungled rollout and the media’s freakout are.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:26 pm
One of the things that people gloss over is that O’Bama’s “experience” is made up predominantly of being a serial campaigner.
Shortly after being elected to the Senate; he was running for congress. Shortly after that failed effort, he ran for the U.S. Senate. Very soon thereafter he is now running for President of the United States.
The reason he has been able to accomplish so little legislatively (everything is relative) is because that government service only fell into the brief periods of time when he was not campiagning for something else.
Another interesting point is that much of the most well known material written about OBama has been written by OBama himself.
The fact that his campaign surrogates have engaged in immediately drawing comparisons between himself and the Vice Presidential nominee, suggests to me that they would prefer that voters make that comparison, rather than to compare him to McCain.
Comment by Repeat Offender Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:28 pm
Kevin & others, Your attempt to trivialize what experience Palin does have is disappointing from an aspiring “journalist”.
IF you know know a good campaign and a good campaign manager, you would also know that VERY few real decisions are made by the candidate. SO for You and the Obama crowd to claim that running for president is experience to be president is laughable.
Secondly, IF OBAMA was actually managing his own campaign AND the day to day decisions, then he should immediately apologize for inviting 35,000 people to Springfield on hot day without planning to provide them enough water so they don’t create mass emergency that would detract from his VP Announcement!
3rd IF Obama is truly managing his own campaign, as well a being a candidate for the WORKING MAN, Then Obama should, again, immediately apologize for REFUSING to pay a required tip on the sandwiches he ordered from PANARA BREAD that were delivered by working men and women to his private jet plane by 3pm on Saturday. So much for supporting the working man.
Comment by Larry Mullholand Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:29 pm
Let’s be clear. Kevin is not an aspiring journalist. Don’t malign him as such.
And your complaints are quite trivial. Take a breath.
GWB is the president. So if a White House employee forgets to tip the waitress we blame him? Please.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:33 pm
Good Lord, 62 more days of this?
It doesn’t matter who is right or who is wrong. It only matters who can shout the loudest. And it will get worse before it gets any better.
The uninformed debating the stupid. That’s what we’ve settled on for our national political discourse.
As Dierson would say: very sad.
Comment by 47th Ward Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:39 pm
“One should merely ask - what were the “tough” executive decisions Gov. Palin had to make?”
You seem to have missed it but she took out a sitting Republican Governor in the primary and a former Democratic Governor in the General Election because she disagreed with how they were running the government.
Comment by True Observer Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:43 pm
==She’s been Governor for little over a year. Obama wasn’t running his campaign on experience, and has also been vetted for close to two years now. How does this pick assuage voters who feared Obama’s experience and liked that about McCain? ==
For almost two years we have been watching a media infatuation with a half-term senator, hearing how much we need change. How often have I been told by Rich that experience is over rated. I disagreed then, and I disagree now. Experience is important. I’d rather have a half-termer as a vice president, than as a president. The Democrats have their presidential ticket upside-down, while the GOP has it right.
Now we have a half-term governor and instead of treating this person with a smidgen of the adulation shown Obama, and taking into consideration the differences between her vice presidential candidacy and his presidential candidacy, we’re watching the media attack her teen daughter, insult her state, claim she couldn’t be a good parent, and so on.
We are hearing claims that McCain will die in office to justify their attacks, but not once mention a similar scenario where a President Obama faces that 2 a.m. phone call a week after inauguration.
The press bias between how Obama and Palin are treated can sicken even the strongest Alaskan bull moose. The news media is crashing and it is the blatant biases destroying it. Election 2008 could be the last of it’s kind. Or does anyone want to bet that the NYT will be operated like it is today four years from now?
Voters are tiring of the Chris Matthews, the Sean Hannitys, the Rush Limbaughs, and the Keith Obermans ruining public dialogue. We are tired of watching these goons smear innocent people then claim they were just doing their jobs.
Even if Bristol Palin was not pregnant, an Ivy League student, or something uncontroversial, today’s MSM would consider her fair game when an Internet goon claims she had an abortion, just as they claimed McCain’s daughter had when she was 14. Or claim that Bridget McCain was the Queen of Sheebah’s daughter before she was handed to Saint Mother Theresa.
What we have witnessed over the past week is sickening and the worse kind of press event since Hurricane Katrina saw Oprah bawling over the dozens of imaginary bodies “pile up like lumber” in the rape-rampant, crime infested Superdome and so-called reporters were claiming that “ten thousand” dead.
We cannot depend on news from sources so incapable of rational reporting and so biased towards one of the political parties.
It is broken!
Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:46 pm
Rich-
You’d notice my comments didn’t spare Republicans either… this is just another episode of “how to make politics as unpalatable as possible for normal people”… and like I said, both parties do it.
Comment by John Bambenek Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:49 pm
===We cannot depend on news from sources so incapable of rational reporting and so biased towards one of the political parties.===
Ridiculous.
If the vacuous DC talking points crud continues, I’m gonna shut down this post.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:50 pm
Rich this may not be original, but i dont think you will see it in any TP’s - and it isnt directed at you.
“Dont hate the player, hate the game”
Comment by Anon Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:59 pm
And VanillaMan, what exactly do you propose to fix the system? How should the media be reporting? Should they ignore when the government, Republican or Democratic, botches something, say helping citizens evacuate a city underwater from a Hurricane? Americans may like trashy reporting, but we are also incredibly generous people and stepped up to help the Hurricane victims.
As for Obama, he may not have as much experience as McCain, but where has McCain’s experience gotten him? People are losing their homes or seeing their home values decrease, losing their jobs or seeing their salaries decrease, and we are spending more money on gas and food. It is depressing!
I am certainly no sap, but I am happy that Obama can at least inspire millions of people to feel good about their country and get up off their asses to get involved in the political process. Clearly, that is what people need and want right now, which is why he is bringing in more money, can get more crowds, and currently has enough electoral votes to win the presidency.
Comment by Law Student Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 2:59 pm
Law Student - please articulate how it is McCain’s fault that people overextended themselves in a volatile real estate market? Could you also elaborate on how someone who has advocated for more energy supply is to blame for higher gas prices? Further, many folks blame corn ethanol for higher food prices - have you studied McCain’s position on corn based ethanol?higher gas prices? Further, many folks blame corn ethanol for higher food prices - have you studied McCain’s position on corn based ethanol?
Comment by Anon Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:05 pm
Back to the topic, please.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:07 pm
It does seem as though this community manages to treat each other more civilly (and less boringly) when it stays to matters affecting IL. Is it that the national topics bring strangers to the discussions or do we members of the community change when attention turns to matters national?
Comment by cermak_rd Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:08 pm
Besides, the real story is Palins abuse of power, and her attempt to cover it up by trying to have the investigation disbanded.
Comment by Ghost Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:26 pm
Cermak, I think it’s both.
There’s no doubt in my mind that the national media (and I mean this is the broadest sense, both news and entertainment media) tend to bring out the worst in everybody. They deal mostly with people whom we don’t know and issues we may not completely understand. So we reduce them to abstractions and stereotypes.
When we (meaning the regular Cap Fax commenters) talk about state and local issues we are dealing with things we grasp better. We discuss people whom we may actually know, or whose policies we have seen in action, and issues we have reasonably well-informed opinions about. Therefore the level of discussion tends to be higher.
Comment by Secret Square Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:28 pm
My apologies. I thought Kevin was an aspiring and his comments displayed otherwise.
“Take a breath?” My comment was not posted in hast or anger… rather reasonable I say.
The point is Rich, they can’t have both ways. Either he IS the executive in charge of his campaign or he is not.
To your point RICH; If they, the OBAMA team are going to claim Obama is the executive in charge of the day to day operation then he MUST take the responsibility of the decisions. Where does the buck stop for Obama?
I don’t think for a moment Obama is responsible for failing to provide water to the masses. Nor do I think he is managing the day to day activities as they seem to claim.
Regarding the refusal to provide a tip to the working men & women who provided lunch, I DID NOT SAY that someone forgot as you stated in your reply. I was quiet clear and truthful when I said the OBAMA campaign REFUSED to pay a tip that was on the invoice and clearly stated they were NOT paying the TIP. In fact, the campaign has not paid the tip to date. They did pay for the other portions of the invoice they just refused to pay the tip.
Please don’t confuse the facts in your defense of Kevin. That does not seem trivial at all.
Comment by Larry Mullholand Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:28 pm
What surprises me the most in this thread and are the near-fainting spells and indignation of the McCain supporters that this is all happening with the Palin announcement. The first thing I said to my wife after the announcement: “Watch what happens now. She’s not going to know what hit her when the media start poking around.” Are all you seasoned politicos and wonks who visit this site that biased that you don’t see this happening to every candidate every time they run for office?
Alas, I forgot what the topic was. Just let me close by mentioning that the experience debate is bogus, the McCain campaign screwed this up royally by not vetting Palin properly, there’s not enough Republican base in America anymore to win this thing for McCain, and the other thing I said to my wife is “Palin won’t make it through October.” She has serious problems politically, and they are going to hurt the McCain ticket.
Comment by Lefty Lefty Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:32 pm
===Therefore the level of discussion tends to be higher===
Nah. I think the level of discourse naturally trends to the bottom in any national politics discussion during a presidential election year.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:39 pm
If the GOP hadn’t made Obama’s “lack of experience” such a central theme of the race, then the choice of the inexperienced Palin wouldn’t smack of a 180 by the GOP. It’s stunning, the reversal on the experience issues, after hammering Obama for months.
Comment by there he goes again Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:43 pm
“Personally, I would never subject my own pregnant teenaged daughter to that kind of salacious worldwide exposure. But that’s just me.”
Actually, Rich, it’s not just you, it’s lots of people. And, it leads to the issue of this election, at least for me. For a lot of people, Republicans and Democrats, experience is more than a talking point. For me, judgement is more than a talking point. I’m not a parent and I’m not female, and yet I wouldn’t dream of going to work (even if I were governor) the day after my child with Down syndrome was born, let alone expose my 17-year-old pregnant daughter to this vitriol, yet that’s exactly what Mrs. Palin did. And honestly, she’s a former newsperson, so if she didn’t know this was coming out sooner or later, she’s naive, which is another strike against her.
And, if I were running for president, I wouldn’t dream of nominating a Veep who hadn’t been fully vetted (please don’t tell me she was because I am certain she wasn’t) and who immediately changes the narrative because s/he negates one of my best arguments against my opponent. A talking head (don’t remember which one because I dislike them all, left or right) made what I thought was a telling comment. Paraphrasing, it was that the method of the Palin choice seemed similar to the method that fighter pilots, like McCain was, sometimes have to use. I can’t speak from personal experience, but I have a number of close family members who are/have been fighter pilots. They agree that when you’re in that seat, a lot of times you don’t have the luxury of making decisions with advisors or by committees. It seems to me that’s exactly how he made this one. In my opinion, he whiffed, and it directly speaks to judgment.
I’m also, frankly, sick of the elitist talk. Do we really want a president who’s just an “average” guy/gal? I certainly don’t. I want someone who strives and achieves, not a guy who finished fifth from the bottom of his Naval Academy class (894 of 899), like John S. McCain III, or an admitted “average hockey mom.” Our country really does deserve better than that. Our most recent regular guy, that guy everyone wanted to have a beer with, good ol’ W, hasn’t turned out so hot.
Comment by Rich Miller said Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 3:59 pm
Who really has the experience to be President? Did Abe Lincoln? Teddy Rosevelt? Bill Clinton? Keep naming them. Running a state is not like running the country. Being in Congress is not like running the country. NO candidate will possess all the traits the presidency needs. CEO’s would be the most qualified, but they would not take it because it doesn’t pay enough.
I don’t know what is more frightening an outsider getting in office or an insider!
Comment by He Makes Ryan Look Like a Saint Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:01 pm
Sorry Rich, I gotta disagree with you on not accepting a VP spot because my teen daughters prego.
If I thought I could help this whole crazy world and influence billions of peoples lives for the better by being the VP of the country, I would tell my daughter to thicken her skin and grow up quick.
Comment by Phineas J. Whoopee Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:15 pm
I think the “outrage” that Republican commentators have shown is affected. To wit, hear for yourself what Mike Murphy and Peggy Noonan really think about the choice of Sarah Palin when they were accidently caught on a hot mic.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0908/Noonan_Murphy_trash_Palin_on_hot_mic_Its_over.html
Comment by Whoops Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:25 pm
What Durbin should have said is:
“Americans are questioning whether Sarah Palin has the experience and the values to be a heartbeat away from the Oval Office. Can someone who just months ago had no opinion about the Iraq War be Commander in Chief? Do we want someone who wants to punish women by forcing them to have a rapist’s child appointing the Supreme Court? These are the questions that John McCain must answer.”
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:28 pm
Obama has been running for president (officially or unofficially) since July of 2004. He knew he’d have a cakewalk against Keyes or whomever. After he gave that well received speech, his eyes were on the Oval office.
Obama is arguing experience with the VEEP nominee.
Obama should not have made change…a theme of his campaign then picked an insider. This season has given me a headache!
Comment by Wumpus Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:31 pm
Rich,
Your integrity can be maddening. The feeding frenzy is clearly silly, but your characterization of the media portrait is heavy on your “reading” of it and light on concrete examples. I’ve heard nothing but praise for her “blue collar” background; for every article that may have poked fun at it, we could find another that predicts it will be appealing. And for you to say this:
one that defies the media portrait of a backwards, white trash mountain woman (which should be pretty easy to accomplish, since she isn’t)
Should require some back-up documentation, don’t you think? Surely accusing the media of portraying her as “white trash” is pretty serious. “White trash” is the white equivalent of the n-word, isn’t it? I mean I’m brown, so that’s what I’m assuming.
Believe me, I don’t “feel sorry” for the opinion makers who think a pregnant daughter or big family are liabilities for higher office. This isn’t a matter of that; but your accusation seems pretty serious.
The DC chatterers should lay off the smallness of Alaska (although the GOP is inviting it by referring to it as the “largest state”) and her family troubles, but her brief period in state-level office and potential mismanagement of a very small town are certainly relevant to her qualifications.
You’ve covered village board meetings haven’t you? Could you possibly argue that running a part-time village hall of a town smaller than Metamora is not equivalent to being the Mayor or an alderman in a city like Joliet, Aurora, or Chicago?
It isn’t “condescending” to point out that that experience while not irrelevant is certainly suspect.
You made the jump from that to saying the chatterers are calling her “white trash”. That’s serious and deserves some further exploration.
Comment by ramsin Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:34 pm
Haven’t had time to read everyone’s comments - will try catch up tomorrow.
John McCain failed the VP Test. He effectively ceded the election to Obama with his poor judgement. It’s the McCain tenmperment rearing it’s ugly head - he couldn’t stand Mitt Romney personally, the cultural conservatives wouldn’t let him pick Senator Joe Lieberman or even Tom Ridge. So McCain rolled the dice, and he lost his gamble with history big time.
I could care less about Palin’s ideology. It’s painfully obvious to anyone woth a shred of objectivity that Governor Palin is not qualified to be a heartbeat away from the Presidency, particularly when the Presidential nominee is 72 years old. It’s probably the worst VP choice in modern history - at least Tom Eagleton was qualified in terms of experience and stature.
This election is “over” before it really began. If you don’t believe me ask Peggy Noonan, who was caught on a live microphone telling the truth, instead to toeing the party line in her column.
All this being said, I have no doubt that Palin is a fine person who has energized the base of the Republican Party. Unfortunately for MCCain Palin will not attract independents or disaffected Hillary supporters - they will be repelled by her ideology.
Last but not least, leave the daughter and the hockey stud alone. Kids should be off limits in every election.
Comment by Captain America Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:34 pm
Dear GOP:
Its not killing liberals that the first female VP of the US might be a Republican.
What most people are concerned about has nothing to do with gender. Would America want a VP Sam Palin a heartbeat away from the presidency who:
- Would appoint judges who don’t think rape victims have a right to an abortion;
- As recently as a few months ago had no opinion about the Iraq War;
- Supports teaching Creationism in public schools;
- Opposes scientifically accurate sex-ed, in favor of abstinence-only education, despite evidence close to home that it doesn’t work;
- Is up to their armpits in ear-marking and official scandals involving abuse of power;
I don’t think so.
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:35 pm
When you’ve got five kids, there’s alays some sort of drama going on. If you have something to offer, you need to put it out there regardless. You can’t wait until everything is perfect at home. It never will be for long.
I bet there are alot of good things going on in that family, too. If we must get so personal about candidates, why not take a look at the good things too.
I sound like my grandmother.
Comment by Anon Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:36 pm
This may be a minor issue but I think it’s worth considering.
When people say Palin “went back to work” only three days after giving birth, what does that mean exactly? Did it mean she immediately began spending 8 or 10 or 12 hours in her office or on the road every day, with no contact with her baby during that time? Or does it simply mean she officially resumed her duties as governor at that time — signing bills, etc. — but perhaps on a limited schedule or from home? (If A-Rod can work from home certainly she can!)
If the latter scenario is the case, then those who cite her going back to work so soon as “evidence” of her being a poor mother may be stretching the truth quite a bit.
Comment by Secret Square Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:43 pm
=== Supports teaching Creationism in public schools===
I’m not sure that’s correct.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:51 pm
Also, all those who praise Palin on the bridge to nowhere ought to check this out. Oof.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 4:55 pm
I think someone ought to first see what Palin says before they put words into her mouth, then denouce her.
There are too many comments based on stereotypes and hatred before she even speaks.
This past week shows how low the media has fallen.
Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 5:04 pm
VM
I truly believe it works in the GOP favor to have her attached mercilessly. She has already cemented the base and if women start thinking she is being picked on unfairly, look out.
If it happens, this country will wake up with the worst after election hangover ever. We will be tattooed from ear to rear.
Comment by Phineas J. Whoopee Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 5:11 pm
Barack went over 49% in the latest Gallop tracking poll . He seems to be getting a bigger bump from the Republican fiasco than he did from his own convention. Wait until the stories start hammering Palin about her successionist tendencies and her choice in ministers. In the meantime, no one at the convention even comes close to explaining the McCain Republican plan to solve the burgeoning fiscal crisis.
We hear a lot about drill, drill, drill. Then we hear a lot of shill, shill, shill.
Is it that they are hiding some trickle down program or that they just don’t have an economic program?
Comment by Bill Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 5:31 pm
YDD-
This:
- Is up to their armpits in ear-marking and official scandals involving abuse of power;
is a little party-line-ish. Those accusations haven’t been settled, and while there may be some hypocrisy on the earmarking issues, to say she’s “up to her ears” in it is a little unfair. Also putting those two in the same sentence makes it seem as though she’s had earmarkin scandals, which she hasn’t.
Comment by ramsin Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 6:01 pm
Her town’s earmarks went from nothing to millions after she was elected. She campaigned for guv in favor of the bridge to nowhere and with Ted Stevens’ support, after she supported him.
Up to her ears is about right.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 6:19 pm
Larry,
For ME, I’d say Obama’s greatest accomplishments is a tie between the earned income tax credit and videotaping of capital cases. But Im sure others here could come up with their own examples.
Where have you been the past ten years that you still haven’t read anything about OBAMA’s RECORD?
Ugh. Stop ASKING others to do your homework. Look it up before SPOUTING off with the same “no record” talking point we hate here.
Comment by 47th Ward Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 6:20 pm
The official scandals part, while in the same sentence, is clearly separate to anyone who can read above the 4th Grade Level, Ramsin. If there are those who can’t read at that level here, they don’t last long anyway.
Comment by Rich Miller Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 6:21 pm
=To wit, hear for yourself what Mike Murphy and Peggy Noonan really think about the choice of Sarah Palin when they were accidently caught on a hot mic.=
How come blabbers like Carville never have “hot mic” accidents? On one hand, could be because they will say anything, no matter how stupid it might be, just to hear the sound of their own voice, hot or cold mic. OTOH, it’s not a huge reach into the tinfoil to note that the recent rash of “mic malfunctions” haven’t happened to any Obots. Noonan is way past her prime and two-faced to beat-read her WSJ column today for proof.
I don’t like passing on inflammatory trash, but the WT references to Palin are out there in the blogosphere, Rich. I wouldn’t post them any more than I would the line-crossing stuff on Obama.
I think the Palin rollout was under-executed, to say the least. However, the one-two of Gustav and the incredible amount of venom that came rolling out of the media would have tested the savviest campaign operations.
Word’s first comment, that Durbin’s love for the klieg lights causes his brain to fade and that Biden will have some “vetting” issues of his own are probably the most on-point points of this whole thread.
PS: Gratuitous DC Talking Point Bonus: Mayor Palin got more votes than President Biden. lol
Comment by Arthur Andersen Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 6:40 pm
wordslinger@11:02-
It was Jesse “Big Daddy” Unruh who said it, not Willie Brown. One of my favorite political quotes. I think it portrays the Springfield scene quite well.
Always brings Jim McPike to mind…
Comment by Don't Worry, Be Happy Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 6:48 pm
To 47th Ward
I said HIS accomplishments. Meaning Obama’s accomplishments. Not bill he added his name to as a cosponsor.
Comment by Larry Mulholland Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 6:57 pm
YDD indicates that liberals would be in such hysterics if Governor Palin were a man and had the same conservative beliefs. Why is it then that when conservatives tick off an entire list of policies that make them turn away from Senator Obama’s candidacy, they are called racists?
The columnists and cartoonists are working overtime to reinforce the left’s main talking point that the ONLY way Senator Obama can lose is become America is still racist.
Comment by SangamoGOP Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 7:04 pm
So then you knew and were only being a partisan idiot your comment?
Comment by 47th Ward Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 7:53 pm
Wow. Interesting thread.
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 10:20 pm
This is kinda fun. Did you guys see the Wordles of Biden’s and Palin’s speeches that the Times has? I’ve noticed that more and more writers are using Wordle. Great little program!
http://graphicdesignr.net/blog/2008/09/03/comparing-veep-candidates-speeches/
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:22 pm
Pluto if your only argument in support of Palin is to attck Bill’s character, it appears you have ceded the arguments that Palins conduct, prok spending/earmakrs and abuse of power/office are indefensible. I agree. No matter how many Irish babies Bill had for breakfast, Palin still has the problem of highly quetionable spending to pay off her local friends and using her office to vindictively fire her sisters ex husband.
Comment by Ghost Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:26 pm
It was a major miscalculation on the part of the Obama camp to go after Palin in such a vicious manner. True, Obama, himself, tried to pour oil on the waters, but his surrogates and subordinates were off message and Obama will be blamed for failing to rein these characters in.
The same applies to the stupid attempt to derail Milt Rosenberg’s radio program on WGN a few days earlier.
Palin and Giuliani nailed Obama’s hide to the wall tonight and references to the Chicago machine were there to be heard. The press release response to Palin’s speech was tired mumbo jumbo. It ignored McCain and Palin and blamed W.
Comment by Honest Abe Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:31 pm
Don’t Worry, you may be right, but I’m not sure. I think Willie had my quote. His predecessor, Big Daddy, said “Money is the mother’s milk of politics.”
For what it’s worth, I’m an FDR/Reagan progressive. Reagan voted for FDR four times. The two greatest presidents of the 20th Century.
I don’t know much about her, but I like this Palin. She’s a regular chick. You don’t agree on everything? So what? A real person — I like it.
By the way, Barack’s reaction to her has been masterful. If you haven’t noticed by now, The Hyde Park Comet is the greatest politician of his era, win or lose (and he’s going to win).
Cheer up, America — Obama/Biden, McCain/Palin — tell me when we’ve had a better choice?
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:33 pm
AAAAAAAAAAACK!!! Stop talking about hockey moms and beauty pageant contestants and experience and pregnant minors and Tony Rezko and who supported overpriced briges and ………. AAAAAAAAAAGH ….. 62 more days …. BLAM!!!!!
Too late.
My head blew up before anyone got to the real issues.
Comment by Chris in the western suburbs but not Iowa Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:46 pm
OK, seriously. There are some thing about Palin that seem to make her likeable.
But I am terrified as to McCain TRUE reason to pick her, which was to: 1. appease women, and 2. appease the evangelicals.
And I know the word “PANDERING” has been dropped a million times and I’m too late on it.
So let’s go to point two: the religion thing. Why is it that to be considered a person of faith in this country, you must fall in line with the evangelicals that have been suckling the GOP teat for the last decade?
And why are the Dems so afraid of making this an issue?
Christianity has been mystery for more than 2000 years but all of a sudden the GOP/Rick Warren/Pat Robertson and now Sarah Palin type have all the answers?
Even the Pope isn’t that arrogant.
Sorry. I know this is a ramble. But I’m having such a hard time grasping the religious implications of a McCain/Palin White House.
The phrase “state-endorsed religion” keeps rolling through my head.
Tell me why I’m wrong. Can anyone?
Comment by Chris in the western suburbs but not Iowa Wednesday, Sep 3, 08 @ 11:54 pm
I wonder if the press will make this a race (no pun intended) between Obama and Palin, instead of Obama and McCain. I just heard on the radio this morning that even as the mayor of a town of 5,000, Palin brought in big federal bucks to her community. As a U.S. Senator how much money has Obama brought back to Illinois? I don’t know the answer to that but it is an interesting line of thought to follow, though the press did not seem to make a comparison.
Comment by Captain Flume Thursday, Sep 4, 08 @ 7:56 am
No poll numbers yet for the GOP convention, but Obama got a big bounce from McCain selecting palin.
Word I disagree, looking at her record of using her office to fire her sisters ex and line the pockets of her home town is not what I want to see happening on the Federal level.
Comment by Ghost Thursday, Sep 4, 08 @ 7:58 am