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* Gov. Pat Quinn reacted harshly to skepticism yesterday from a spokesman for the Northern Indiana Commuter Transportation District that Illinois can find the money to build a commuter rail line from the Van Buren Street Station to Balmoral Park racetrack. Quoth the spokesman…
“We still have difficulties understanding where they’re coming up with the startup funds, so we don’t know how this will impact us,” NICTD spokesman John Parsons said. “It might not.”
Quoth Quinn…
Quinn, while acknowledging that startup funds would not be set until the Illinois General Assembly gives him a capital bill to consider later this year, said he didn’t appreciate the attitude.
“I think Indiana would be better off taking more of a team approach and working with us,” the governor said. “I don’t think criticizing Illinois all the time is a good idea.”
* From the Tribune…
When a University of Illinois student was denied admission to a dual-degree program last fall, her parents turned to their state legislator for help and sparked a series of events reminiscent of the admissions scandal that rocked the state’s flagship campus in 2009.
At the request of state Sen. Dan Duffy’s office, the university’s chief lobbyist in September sent a letter to admissions staff regarding the denial. Her office also followed up with a phone call a few weeks later. The inquiries were logged on a list that tracks when outside parties insert themselves into the admissions process, one of the post-scandal reforms.
Sen. Duffy responded on Facebook…
Tribune reporter Jodi Cohen is pathetic. A frustrated SENIOR at U of I contacted my office. The student qualified for a double major and was not allowed to receive it. We contacted the Dept.of Higher Education per state policy. Cohen is now saying we were using “clout” and are part of “Admission Scandal”? Cohen never even bothered to interview me for her story before printing the manufactured nonsense!!
The Senator has apparently blocked me from accessing his FB site. He reportedly suggested in a caucus meeting the other day that no Senate Republicans should ever speak to me. Yes, he has quite the little temper. Anyway, a good friend sent me the quote and the screen shot…
* The 46th Ward runoff featuring Molly Phelan and James Cappleman got a bit catty this week…
“The big difference between Mr. Cappleman and me is that I’ve committed to spending $1.3 million dollars to put more police on our streets,” Phelan said, referring to discretionary funds alderman control. “Mr. Cappleman wants to spend it on decorator flower pots and benches.”
I wonder what she’ll say when shown this letter to the editor by Mr. Cappleman…
One cost-saving measure would be to curtail costly and aggressive medical treatment for patients near death.
Medicare costs have to be controlled. Maybe using the skills of ethicists in providing direction on cutting health-care costs would be an answer to this moral dilemma.
Death panels!!!
* Trouble in paradise? Rep. Lou Lang usually carries the gaming expansion bill in the House, while Sen. Terry Link handles the duties in the Senate. Lang’s latest bill just includes more slots, no new casinos. Link is already turning thumbs down…
Lang will begin talks on his plan in the House. In the Senate, Sen. Terry Link of Waukegan typically sponsors gambling-expansion plans.
And the plans Link carries typically include new casinos, including one in Lake County.
“I don’t think he’s going to have any support from the industry,” Link said of Lang’s plan.
* The SJ-R editorial today is pretty harsh on those who’ve been hollering about Attorney General Lisa Madigan’s opinion that the names of FOID card holders should be made public…
We’re accustomed to gun rights advocates being vocal, rigid and determined in their pursuit of what they believe are their Second Amendment rights. We are not deaf to their concerns. In fact, we recently have called for Illinois to adopt a law defining the right of FOID holders to carry concealed firearms.
But this is not a gun ownership issue and the negative reaction to last week’s ruling has been nothing short of hysteria. This decision is about open government and preventing a government body, in this case the Illinois State Police, from keeping secret information it gathers on the public’s behalf.
As is the Tribune’s…
That business about the dangers of releasing public records is a stretch, though. Gun enthusiasts, lobbyists and some lawmakers are waving their arms, warning that if the FOID records are released, bad guys will use them to determine which houses can be safely burglarized because their occupants don’t have guns. Or they’ll use them to determine which houses are occupied by permit holders so they can break in and steal those guns.
Those arguments came up in Florida, too, though nobody could name a time when anything like that actually happened. But never mind. Sooner or later someone’s bound to get hurt, the gun crowd says, and when it happens, it will be Attorney General Lisa Madigan’s fault for telling the ISP to hand over the records.
What a crock. Their quarrel is with the public records law, not the attorney general.
posted by Rich Miller
Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 9:34 am
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How would you EVER run this blog without Senate Republican input….
Comment by Vote Quimby! Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 9:40 am
Dan Duffy wants to hold everyone to a higher standard except himself. If he wants to throw mud randomly then he needs to expect to have some thrown back.
Comment by Spliff Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 9:42 am
Oh, Dan Duffy. Good thing those red light cameras are watching him.
Comment by Samwise Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 9:42 am
Dragging up the old U of I admission scandal reminds me of another of Quinns lies. He stated he would terminate the trustees that didn’t resign but then didn’t for political reasons. One more for Quinns highlight reel of lies. New edition coming soon with his I support the death penalty lie about to be exposed.
Comment by Fed up Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 9:45 am
So, there’s a distinct difference between holding a FOID card and being a gun owner. I have a FOID, but do not own a gun. As such, I take issue at assuming the former necessarily implies the latter.
Comment by DaveM Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 9:57 am
Yes, if FOID holder names are publicly disclosed, burglars will rob people with or without guns.
Comment by Draznnl Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:01 am
- As such, I take issue at assuming the former necessarily implies the latter. -
Is it really worth your time to think about this?
Comment by Small Town Liberal Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:02 am
Fed up - Dude, can you stay on topic once in a while? This is not some kind of 6 degrees of separation game, we already get it that you like to call Quinn a liar. Anything new to add?
Comment by Small Town Liberal Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:04 am
Small Town Liberal:
Yes, because my privacy is implicated, and as a non-gun owner, and someone in favor of gun control restrictions, I don’t want to be lumped in with “RPGs for all!” nuts.
However, perhaps not, because I’m moving out of state in a few months, and it’ll all be moot for me.
Comment by DaveM Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:06 am
It is about time that we get rid of the FOID.
Can you name one other fundemental right guaranteed by the Constitution where you hve to have an identification card? Do we need to implement a “Freedom of Speech Identification card” or a “Freedom of Religion identification card?”
If the FOIUD is such a great idea, hoiw come Americans living in 49 other States aren’t required to have one?
Comment by Bud Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:09 am
===Can you name one other fundemental right guaranteed by the Constitution where you hve to have an identification card? ===
Press pass. Can’t get on the floor without it.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:11 am
Also, you can’t buy any property for over $10K cash without filling out a form.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:12 am
So Duffy didn’t even contest the facts of the Tribune story?
– MrJM
Comment by MrJM Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:13 am
And, lobbyists have to register with the government.
Those who want to protest must obtain a permit.
Shall I go on?
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:14 am
It was unbelievably inappropriate for this joker from Indiana to question another state’s financing of a joint project. He is not to know. It is not his job to know. His stupid response was unprofessional if intended and amateur if not.
Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:16 am
Lobbyists? Press pass? buying property over $10K
I am sorry where are those described as fundemental rights in the US Constitition?
I don’t mind debate but please try to stick to the respopnse that I submited. Or do I need to define the legal term “fundemental right” to you?
There is no fundemental right to a press pass, or to lobby.
Comment by Bud Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:19 am
We have a required instant background check to determine if a gun buyer is eligible already. The FOID card is redundant.
Comment by Federal Farmer Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:22 am
And speaking of amateur, unprofessional and less than an optimal response from an elected state representative, there is Senator Duffy. Mr. Duffy’s FB posting exposes a serious lack of respect towards those he was elected to work with.
People are not pathetic if you are unclear as to their often unpathetic reasons on an issue. It was his job to discover and resolve those reasons. Not dismiss them.
Temper is a poor excuse for unprofessional behavior.
Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:25 am
- I am sorry where are those described as fundemental rights in the US Constitition? -
Are you kidding? But, if that’s the way you want to go, can you tell me where the right to carry a concealed handgun is described as a fundamental right in the constitution?
Comment by Small Town Liberal Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:25 am
Careful with using that kind of supposed logic STL. I’m recalling you throwing that kind of thing at other posters on other issues too.
You will discover that many positions you support as a fundamental right are not specifically written into our Constitution. If you want to play Constitutional Fundamentalism you will not like where it takes you on your own deeply held opinions.
Stop using it as an argument if you do not fully embrace it.
Find another point to defend your argument please.
Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:37 am
Bud, are you freaking kidding me? You ever read the 1st Amendment?
Idiot. Goodbye.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:37 am
He might have been more tactful in voicing it, but I can understand Duffy’s frustration. He didn’t do anything wrong yet he is lumped in with the actions of that horrible UI board. Meanwhile, most of the senior and mid-level staff that enabled the bad conduct of the prior UI board continues to work there.
Comment by Meanderthal Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:37 am
My two cents: Lobbying/Right of Assembly/1st Amendment are fundamental rights. Duh?
Comment by Meanderthal Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:39 am
Hey Bud. Lobbying is specifically mentioned in the First Amendment. It is the “right to petition the government for redress of grievances.” And the Supreme Court knows how to spell “fundamental.” You’re not very good at this, are you?
Comment by Ray del Camino Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:39 am
===There is no fundemental right to a press pass, or to lobby. ===
You really are moronic.
And banned.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:40 am
It turns out that Bud the Troll is commenting in Americus, Georgia. The foreigner will no longer be trolling here. lol
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:42 am
I’ll let someone else sock the press no-brainer Bud just teed up. I think it’s called the 1st Amendment guy.
Back to Dan Duffy. Yes in a short time he’s already established himself as one of the biggest hotheads around.
And I love the “no one talk to so-and-so” nonsense. That’s so typical of the Republicans in Springfield. Same old immaturity. Still act they’re in high school.
Just a bunch of frustrated hot heads sitting around doing nothing, deciding who they want to exclude from their little clique that does nothing in the first place. And then they wonder why they stay in the minority.
Comment by just sayin' Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:45 am
Gotta hand it to the Tribbies…they continue to milk this non story, hoping against hope that someone hands them an award….NOT
BTW….anybody else wonder why Ms. Coen fails to tell the reader that her expert, Bernard Judge , was a editor at the Trib who got sacked?
Hmmmmm maybe it was Bernie who had a grandkid who could not get into U of I
Comment by CircularFiringSquad Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:45 am
One must register to vote but voters lists are exempt from FOI per 10 ILCS 5/5-7.
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:45 am
I thought Bud was from St. Louis.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:47 am
===One must register to vote but voters lists are exempt from FOI per 10 ILCS 5/5-7. ===
Voter lists are available, however. I could make a quick call and pull up your voting history in five minutes.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:47 am
Rich,
You mean this First Amendment:
(emphasis added)
Huh… I guess it ain’t all about going to the Federal Building and chanting “Hey! Hey! Ho! Ho! ___ ___ ___ has got to go!”
– MrJM
Comment by MrJM Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:48 am
- Careful with using that kind of supposed logic STL. I’m recalling you throwing that kind of thing at other posters on other issues too. -
VMan, I wasn’t using that kind of logic, I was pointing out a fallacy. As to your recollection, I’ll stick with my logic, you can keep your advice.
Comment by Small Town Liberal Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:49 am
I think it’s pathetic that people call their state senator to fix their college scheduling issues. I would think the senator would have more important things to do.
Comment by shore Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:52 am
=== press pass ===
To digress:
When I saw those words all I could think of was Niedermeyer’s spit-soaked “pledge pin?”
Rich, don’t get so worked up over our idiotic comments that you need to provide towels to those around you.
Comment by Joe from Joliet Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 10:57 am
Hey, Circular — Bernie Judge
a) served on the Admissions Review Commission as an expert on journalism, which is appropriate, considering he is a member of the Chicago Journalism Hall of Fame.
b) is a prince of guy.
HIs resume is more impressive than yours and mine put together.
Comment by soccermom Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:00 am
So Sen. Duffy used his position to right a wrong for one of his constituents? What was the basis for denying a double major if the student was already enrolled? This doesn’t seem like a scandal unless there are a lot more details…which the reporter doesn’t have. If anything, it is a very minor scandal concerning why a qualified, currently enrolled student wasn’t allowed a second major.
Or maybe the student wasn’t qualified? Maybe the student ticked off the dean, lol? There is far too much info missing to start attacking a legislator for inquiring after a problem one of his constituents was having. Frankly, it smacks of gossip at this point. Get us the damaging details, Tribune, before insinuating damage.
Comment by Liandro Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:04 am
Oh please.
Your “where in the Constitution…” come back on a number of issues is weak. You want to play fundamentalist here when it suits you. You are capable of stronger arguments than this.
We all know that most of our current issues are not specifically spelled out in our Constitution. We also know better to not bother with that line of argument because it opens us to a fundamentalist view no one wins.
Take it from an old fundamentalist, please don’t bother pointing out obvious fallacies.
Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:09 am
===We all know that most of our current issues are not specifically spelled out in our Constitution.===
Mine is. And so are all of my commenters and my subscribers.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:11 am
Not to defend Bud (he’s 100% wrong on the merits) but I’ve been told my ISP at time identifies me as from KC or Detroit, while I’m actually sitting at home in the 42nd Ward. Might be a Sprint thing.
Comment by Jasper Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:18 am
==It turns out that Bud the Troll is commenting in Americus, Georgia. The foreigner will no longer be trolling here. lol==
I think they just have their own edited version of the Constitution in that neck of the woods, without all those confusing First Amendment rights…
Comment by Go Rich! Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:18 am
The UofI is a state institution with a thick buearcracy, so it is the type of thing that is not unreasonable to contact a state elected official for help with. I once had to mediate a dispute between microsoft and a customer about an internet account when I worked for an elected official. It’s basic constituent services. When the people elect you and ask for help, you give it. The problem is when an elected official only helps those that helped them.
Comment by CLJ Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:21 am
It’s hard to type this, but I agree with Shore about Duffy sticking his nose into academic decisions. A good part of the problems facing U of I is the constant micro-managing from Springfield politicians. Legislators should legislate and educators should educate. It’s inconceivable that parents and a state senator can be so certain that this student earned a dual degree, certain enough to overrule the university’s decision. Sheesh. Next we’ll have legislators getting GPAs raised for connected students.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:23 am
===Might be a Sprint thing. ===
Could be. However, it’s more fun to ridicule an alien. lol
Ah, the blog life.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:24 am
- Your “where in the Constitution…” come back on a number of issues is weak. -
VMan, bud used that argument. I said that to point out that it was a stupid argument. Can you not put that together?
Comment by Small Town Liberal Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:27 am
I agree with your point on micro-managing, 47th, but it’s only micro-managing if you are tending to every detail. In this case its seems (emphasis on seems, since there is a severe lack of details) that Duffy’s office was only responding to a problem, not micro-managing all details.
I went to the Univ. of Michigan, and if UoI compares at all it is easy to get swept into the cracks of major universities like that. A paperwork mistake, a peeved bureaucrat, or a deadline no one knew about (including advisers) can be a nightmare and lead to long-term consequences.
If they were going to make a permanent decision that was unfair and incorrectly issued, why on earth wouldn’t the student’s family seek help? Not everything needs to be solved with lawyers, which is presumably a next step when denied a degree you are qualified for.
At UoM we had multiple court cases, including some that made it to the Supremes (iirc) based on admission, acceptance, and process issues and procedures. Again, no idea on the details of this case because none are provided, but if there is an easier solution go for it.
Comment by Liandro Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:35 am
Yes, Liandro, more details would help us understand what happened here.
I had enough credit hours earned to have a double major in History. Except I didn’t take a non-western history course, which was required to earn the degree. I didn’t run to my state senator crying about it. And Lord knows my parents would have just slapped me silly if I complained to them. If I wanted that double major, I had to take another class. And I didn’t want it that bad.
The U of I has a team of academic advisors, counselors and faculty in every department who work with students to address and sometimes correct errors just like this. And if that fails, it has an ombudsman whose sole function is to address these types of issues.
Why on earth is a state senator calling the university’s lobbyist? There are FERPA laws that prohibit sharing this type of student data, even with parents.
The U of I is not a state agency. It is a state supported university. Legislators would be wise to fund it and stay the heck out of academic decisions.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:50 am
–I thought Bud was from St. Louis.–
Bud is King in St. Louis.
Comment by wordslinger Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 11:59 am
Bud WAS King in stl…
Comment by vote quimby! Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 12:14 pm
Under a “strict” reading of the Second Amendment, the gov’t should not be able to deny guns to convicted felons I suppose. Then again, the FOID card could be seen as a way of maintaining a well regulated militia.
All of our rights are regulated in some way or another, that’s one of the jobs of gov’t.
Comment by Pot calling kettle Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 12:28 pm
now some Europeans own Bud…
Duffy has no business messing with U of I decisions…this beahavior is indirectly due IMO to the legislative scholarship program which gives pols the inaccurate impression that they hold sway at U of I…I say get rid of this perk especially in light of the fact the State of IL owes U of I hundreds of millions of dollars and then asks for a free ride for hundreds of students under this legislative perk that is little more than a play to pay ploy for many legislators and their donors…
Comment by Loop Lady Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 12:36 pm
Nothing worse than being a student and told no by a bureaucrat and I get that he wants to help a constituent but most people when they have an issue with their school beuracracy turn to their advisor or department head. There’s also the idea that when you enroll you’re given a packet stating various requirements for degrees.
Comment by shore Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 12:49 pm
I would hope that if a constituent stopped by the office of a Rep. or Sen. with a concern that an inquiry to the appropriate agency would be made.
Inquiring is not the same as telling that agency what to do. The article’s headline and subheading imply a request for action, but the article only has evidence that an inquiry was made. The article does not support the contention that this was a “clout attempt.” If the reporter has such evidence, she should include it in the article.
Comment by Pot calling kettle Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 1:00 pm
Pot, I agree with you. His reaction, however, was goofy and post-worthy.
Comment by Rich Miller Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 1:10 pm
True that!
Comment by Pot calling kettle Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 1:38 pm
Sen. Duffy needs to let a staffer write his Facebook posts.
Comment by Pot calling kettle Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 1:42 pm
The U should know better than to enable legislative inquiry into any academic matter. Allow inquiry into program elegibility, and you encourage legislative advocacy that a B should be changed to an A. This is a plain attempt to interfere with academic decision-making, and attempts to qualify it as something else are pretty “pathetic”. I might be convinced that hapless legislative inquiry to encourage that a student get into a particular dorm does not violate the spirit of the new “rules”, but not much else. And, allowing a U lobbyist to send academic-related inquiry to a Provost is just as abusive. If a student referenced in such a legislative inquiry obtains the requested action, nobody will be able to prove the clout did not make a difference. Use your brains, U lobbyists, and stop passing along this stuff.
Comment by Chad Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 2:36 pm
As the locally elected representative, it is appropriate for a legislator to inquire on all things government. It is also appropriate for the Univ. to reply “Sorry, under FERPA, we cannot release that information.” Which the legislator should report back to the constituent.
An inquiry is just that, an inquiry. Agency folks need to treat them as such and provide an answer when appropriate (and legal). If a legislator pushes for more, the agency people should record and report to their superiors who should report back to the legislative leaders.
Comment by Pot calling kettle Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 3:14 pm
Rich
Ricky Hendon said more offense things walking the halls of the state house every day but got a frequent pass. This might post might show more than just Sen Duffys thin skin.
Comment by fed up Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 3:14 pm
“Never get into a $%$%@$#% match with guys who buy ink by the barrel.” - State Rep. Tom Holbrook
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 3:59 pm
Pot Calling Kettle: I would normally go along with your very reasonable analysis, but here the facts and recent history reflect spectacular misjudgement on the part of the University. After all the Tribune reporting, Mikva inquiries, and slow “train-wreck” resignations — for the U spokesman to attempt to justify the lobbyist actions because it concerned the academics of a current student (rather than an applicant) is a streach beyond reason. And for him to state that the U will now direct legislative academic advocacy communications to the chief academic officer is a real blow-out. This is not Duffy’s problem. It is the problem of a University administration that, after all the extreme national reputation-damaging coverage, still does not “get it” that legislative advocacy concerning academic matters is entirely inappropriate in any form, no matter the status of the student and no matter to which U office it is directed. Tomorrow the new U of I President is in town. Someone should ask him whether the new Trustees or Hogan himself signed-off on this “Y’all came and tell my lobbyist and Provost what you want” statement.
Comment by Chad Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 4:04 pm
Gosh, the invective flies around here these days. I’m sorry for Rich that his increased popularity has resulted in more comments from those with more opinions than intellect.
Long live the First Amendment, I say.
Comment by Formerly Berwyn Bob Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 4:45 pm
–Can you name one other fundemental right guaranteed by the Constitution where you hve to have an identification card? Do we need to implement a “Freedom of Speech Identification card” or a “Freedom of Religion identification card?”–
Bud definitely was “fundemental” today.
Voter card — you have to register to get one. A lot of freedom-loving Tea Partiers want more proof before you can exercise that right.
You also have to prove, or swear under oath, that you’re a citizen (Amendment 14) in many cases to get a job or services. Many of those same alleged “small government” folks would like to make that more strict, as well.
Comment by wordslinger Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 5:24 pm
I’d give you a break STL, but your previous usages of that tactic didn’t include Smokin’ Bud from Georgia.
Comment by VanillaMan Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 6:16 pm
VM, a long memory isn’t good for blog commenters. You of all people should know that. Pixels never die, and you’ve left several years of pixelated comments to peruse for those with extra time on their hands.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 7:06 pm
=== Gosh, the invective flies around here these days. I’m sorry for Rich that his increased popularity has resulted in more comments from those with more opinions than intellect. ===
Heh. There’s nothing like a good Second Amendment post since Blagojevich fell off the face of the earth.
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Tuesday, Mar 8, 11 @ 7:28 pm
47th is right VMan, so feel free to go back and find these “previous usages” so I know what the heck you’re talking about.
Comment by Small Town Liberal Wednesday, Mar 9, 11 @ 8:12 am