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* Regarding Gov. Pat Quinn’s proposed Medicaid cuts…
But Republicans say more could be done to stop fraud in the Medicaid program.
“And you don’t have other people in the system that drive away in a Cadillac and a Lexus and have people in the program that shouldn’t be in the program,” said Rep Patti Bellock, (R) Westmont.
posted by Rich Miller
Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:01 am
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As far as I’m concerned, she’s free to find those people and kick them off the rolls, but I don’t think that’s going to add up to $2.7 billion.
Comment by Yossarian Lives Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:03 am
Before another clueless republican opens their mouth, they ought to spend a little time in an environment where medicaid patients receive care. You know; like that “Undercover Boss” show. Go in on the sly, and see how many people drive off in a Caddy or a Lexus.
Comment by PublicServant Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:08 am
These GOP lawmakers in Springfield are a joke.
If they were serious about saving taxpayer money, how about they get rid of their own bloated pensions, top shelf benefits, and too high salaries they receive for their PART TIME job that most of them are really bad at?
Heaven forbid one of these clowns lead by example.
Comment by just sayin' Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:08 am
I suppose we should also know how new the Caddilac or Lexus is before purging them from the system.
Comment by Hawkeye Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:09 am
Hey, find that nickel here and the dollar there and eventually you have $100 towards fixing the $1M problem. So how much fraud is actually present? Enough to knock 20,000 off the medication rolls because 3 people drive used Lexus?
Comment by zatoichi Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:13 am
Yes there is fraud better enforcement would be nice we can not afford those that are really in need much less those gaming the system. Let’s have some audits of participants and some prosecutions where fraud is found. That still won’t dent the huge funding issue Springfield has created.
Comment by Fed up Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:13 am
Maybe I’m missing the context of this, but I took it as Rep Bellock saying we should be eliminating the fraud before we start cutting from the truly needy. I have never thought of Rep Bellock as being insensitive to the less fortunate.
Comment by Realist Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:13 am
Is that how Medicaid fraud works, patients roll up in a Caddy and demand that health providers order tests, treatments, surgeries, prescriptions, etc?
Is she under the impression that Medicaid is sending money directly to patients and not providers?
In my experience, you go to the doctor or hospital, and they order the services. I don’t ever see a dollar from insurance. It goes to the providers.
Comment by wordslinger Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:19 am
Reagan’s welfare queen returns.
Yossarian Lives, zatoichi, and Fed up get it right: yes, we should eliminate fraud. But there just ain’t that much fraud in the system. And to the extent that there is fraud, you’ll find more of it on the provider end.
But it fits with the Republican narrative since Nixon’s Southern Strategy: it’s those darned poor inner city people that are stealing from the hard working middle class.
Comment by the Other Anonymous Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:21 am
Shame on you. What is fraudulent is turning the Medicaid program over to your friends in the insurance industry. But hey, Representative, your socialized health care comes from the taxpayers, so why should you care. Shame on you!
Comment by Health Care Justice Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:21 am
Maybe Patty could waddle around the doctor’s offices with her smartphone camera, snap some picture of all these Lexus and Caddies. We are guessing she is talking about crooked docs and pharmacists, nursing home slumlord owners in DuPage not recipients.
Fire, Aim, Ready
Comment by CircularFiringSquad Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:36 am
the office of inspector general at dhs has a fraud research/investigating unit. they take tips from the hotline, do research to document fraud, and send the documentation to investigators to take it further. the investigative side, far more often than you can imagine, does nothing and sends the cases back “due to lack of manpower”. thats your fraud control.
Comment by langhorne Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:38 am
Two things on the fraud argument, yes there is fraud and there is going to be fraud. Anyone who tells you that all fraud can be eliminated from any large program or entity (public or private) is either a fool or lying to you.
That being said….
I think you need to show that you are going after it hard and doing additional means testing (looking at assets to some extent) if you are going to talk about increasing taxes or significantly reducing payments. You have to establish credibility with the public that you have made a good faith effort to deal with the waste/fraud issue.
Comment by OneMan Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:42 am
@Huggybunny - I suggest that you learn how LINK cards work before you post wild stories about their abuse: http://goo.gl/1Wwha
– MrJM
Comment by MrJM Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:46 am
If Illinois were to set our benefits in line with those of its surrounding states, there would be $1.2B in savings. There is an estimated $300M in outright fraud. If we were to undertake REAL tort reform, several hundred million could be saved in unnecessary tests costs. The ALLKIDS program is a disaster. While we’re ate it, we can eliminate the high speed rail program and program another few hundred million into the care of our most needy residents.
One further thing to get over is the mindset that we are leveraging money from the Feds. Two things to think about, we are spending money we don’t have, even without the leverage, and we are paying the costs of the Federal match as taxpayers.
Patti Bellock is one of the most caring and committed legislators in Illinois. She cares deeply about the plight of those legal Illinois residents who are most in need, and realizes that the current system will eventually rob us of the assets we need to take care of these most vulnerable people. Anyone who thinks differently is an idiot.
Comment by Cincinnatus Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:47 am
If that genius would spend a couple of dollars investigating fraud and plugging that leak, it would be far better than putting needy elders out on the damn street. I can only hope that someday karma kicks him in the butt and he needs or a relative needs medicaid. Lavishing in our tax dollars makes that very unlikely, but he needs to walk a mile or even a block in the shoes of an elderly person that has gone completely through their personal fortune and are totally broke and “unfortunately” still alive and in need. What a genius this guy is.
Comment by Old geezer and caregiver Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:48 am
===eliminate the high speed rail program and program another few hundred million into the care of our most needy residents===
You want to use bonded money for Medicaid expenses? Really?
Comment by Rich Miller Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:49 am
Cincy, are you on the payroll for DuPage Republicans, or can you just ascertain what they “care deeply about” through Jedi Mind Powers?
Comment by wordslinger Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 10:59 am
- Anyone who thinks differently is an idiot. -
So is anyone that thinks you can cut 2.7 billion in Medicaid without harming lots of people that are truly, honestly in need.
Comment by Small Town Liberal Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 11:09 am
So today’s kerfuffle is to bristle at the assertion that there is fraud in the system.
To paraphrase Everett Dirksen a dollar here, a dollar there, soon you are talking real money.
Abuse comes at all levels. Caregivers who game the system need to be sanctioned, users of the system need to be channeled in to more cost effective use of services. The savings can be plowed back into services for more people. It is just dumb to argue for the status quo.
Comment by Plutocrat03 Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 11:12 am
Rich is right…you can’t use one-time revenues for Medicaid if you dont cut the rate of growth, the problem will just be back, even worse the following year. The cuts the Gov is making do make structural changes that would help to bring down the trajectory of spending.
That said, some of those cuts will no doubt have unintended consequences that could devastate a lot of lives. They need to implement those cuts in a way that protects the really vulnerable. I sure don’t envy the Gov in that respect.
Comment by Raising Kane Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 11:17 am
ws, I know Rep Bellock pretty well and I think Cinci describes her pretty accurately. Like many of our elected officials she does struggle with levying taxes to pay for the things they think we should do, but she is far from alone on that.
Comment by steve schnorf Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 11:17 am
–If Illinois were to set our benefits in line with those of its surrounding states, there would be $1.2B in savings.-
That sounds pretty snappy and easy, but show us. Because I’m pretty sure that the Medicaid systems in Wisconsin, Iowa, Missouri, Kentucky and Indiana are not all that in line with each other.
Plus, all states bordering Illinois get a much higher percentage of their Medicaid funds from the federales (that would be you and me, because as one of the wealthiest states, Illinois is always at the bottom on return of federal dollars).
http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparetable.jsp?ind=184&cat=4
Comment by wordslinger Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 11:18 am
Lets all continue pointing fingers and questioning motives, while the problems in medicaid, pensions, and deficits continue on a path to insolvency and total collapse. Unless both legislators, and pundits check their egos and politics at the door and work for practical solutions, the results will be that Illinois and the US becomes the 21st century equivalent of the Roman and British empire.
Comment by formerwrmnpolitics Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 11:24 am
–It is just dumb to argue for the status quo. –
No one’s doing that, although you’re concerned about cuts to providers.
It ain’t going to be easy or painless, and you can’t pretend you’re going to make it up through chasing ineligible recipients.
Comment by wordslinger Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 11:27 am
===Anyone who thinks differently is an idiot.===
I don’t disagree with your simple-sounding solutions Cincy. Why don’t you ask Bellock to put all of that into bill form and introduce it?
Cincy, you’ve just repeated above every GOP talking point for the last five years on this subject. When will someone introduce the bill?
Bellock’s wording was unfortunate, but she’s been in the General Assembly for a long time. I would have thought she’d have discovered how to propose legislation by now.
I do think you touched on what she might really have been trying to say when you wrote: “She cares deeply about the plight of those legal Illinois residents who are most in need…”
If she wants to introduce legislation banning undocumented Illinois residents from participating in Medicaid, again, nothing is stopping her from drafting a bill.
Comment by 47th Ward Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 11:45 am
One thing missing from Wordslinger’s and 47th Ward’s criticisms is THEIR ideas.
My posts indicate my ideas, let’s see yours.
My posts further describe my personal respect of Rep. Bellock. No Jedi mind tricks. First-hand knowledge of the lady since I know her, and see to her a couple of times a week when she’s not in Springfield.
Several people before my post took pot shots at Patti. She knows more about this issue, and cares more about helping the unfortunate people who need this program it than many, if not all of you.
Comment by Cincinnatus Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 12:08 pm
Somehow it seems to me that my Rs are saying that rate cuts aren’t cuts. Of course they are, so the Gov’s proposal has about $2B in cuts.
Comment by steve schnorf Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 12:11 pm
In Bellock’s territory, especially near Westmont which is home of the most luxury Automobile dealers, Lambordini, Lexus, Porshe, BMW, Mercedes, Aucura, Audi, Volvo Porshe etc. Somehow Toyota was allowed in. I am sure that’s all she she sees because Westmont Borders Hinsdale, Oak Brook, and the other side of these burbs is Western Springs and Burr Ridge.
She needs to take a visit to the South Side of Chicago, or many other areas where people aren’t driving new and newer luxury cars.
She is out of touch, plain and simple.
Comment by 3rd Generation Chicago Native Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 12:18 pm
I’m sure Rep. Bellock is a fine person, but in the quote she sticks to the tradition of suggesting that poor people must look and act poor. Because one’s life circumstances can change dramatically in a short period of time, it is reasonable to expect that someone who owns expensive clothes or an expensive car might fall on hard times and look to the government for help. Should they be required to sell everything they have that looks expensive before they can receive services? I hope not.
I’m all for good ideas to improve the efficiency of government services, but to frame the conversation in the cloak of “the poor need to look and act poor” is what I find objectionable.
Comment by Pot calling kettle Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 12:21 pm
I’ve got an idea for you Cincy,
There ought to be a law that says everybody must purchase health insurance. Getting rid of the free riders who are sucking up Medicaid money would go a long way to bringing Illinois back from the brink of insolvency without raising taxes.
Is that something you could support?
Comment by 47th Ward Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 1:10 pm
I would like to see every session of the House and Senate opened with a reading from the Preamble to the Illinois Constitution, just to remind everyone what they are there to do:
We, the People of the State of Illinois - grateful to Almighty God for the civil, political and religious liberty which He has permitted us to enjoy and seeking His blessing upon our endeavors - in order to provide for the health, safety and welfare of the people; maintain a representative and orderly government; eliminate poverty and inequality; assure legal, social and economic justice; provide opportunity for the fullest development of the individual; insure domestic tranquility; provide for the common defense; and secure the blessings of freedom and liberty to ourselves and our posterity - do ordain and establish this Constitution for the State of Illinois.”
Yes, it’s hokey, yes it’s corny, but those words were written for a reason, not just because they look pretty on a page.
Comment by Colossus Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 1:21 pm
The only idea the Republicans can come up with is no to all of the above.
Comment by mokenavince Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 1:51 pm
Are there problems within the system? Sure. And honestly, the legislature has made things far worse with ‘expansions’ and ‘refinements’ to the different programs.
The core digital processing systems for most of this area uses technology based in 1980’s and some 1990’s era technology. There’s been lots & lots of updates, mods, tweaks, etc, etc, - but the truth of the matter is that the back office portions of the overall system are slowly failing.
With the current environment, I’d put money on the fact that there’s sure to be individuals getting benefits who shouldn’t be getting them. There’s also an equally, if not higher likelihood that there are also individuals who have been denied/lost benefits who should be receiving them.
The problem is, the back office systems currently ‘operational’ (such as they are) don’t provide easy access to identify specific cases.
Truth is, until the digital ‘back ends’ are completely rebuilt in a coherent fashion, everybody is just blowing smoke at each other.
And it’s not going to be fixed anytime soon, because of staffing cutbacks, lack of resources, and bluntly, exceptionally poor planning and implementation over the last several years That’s not a slam at Julie Hamos, either. Problems predate her, but they’ve gotten worse.
Comment by Judgment Day Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 1:59 pm
===Patti Bellock is one of the most caring and committed legislators in Illinois. She cares deeply about the plight of those legal Illinois residents who are most in need, and realizes that the current system will eventually rob us of the assets we need to take care of these most vulnerable people. Anyone who thinks differently is an idiot.===
This is waht Patti Bellock THINKS …
“And you don’t have other people in the system that drive away in a Cadillac and a Lexus and have people in the program that shouldn’t be in the program,” said Rep Patti Bellock, (R) Westmont.
I feel … warmth. I feel …compassion. I feel … someone who knows a Talking Point and how to run it into the ground …
I guess I would call her…
“Mushroom, with a hint of Talking Points and … an Elitism, with just a smidge … of Smug-ness”
That’s why Mushrooms should never talk, talking poiints notwithstanding.
Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 2:01 pm
@Cinci -
The problem with reducing health benefits is that it doesn’t make the health problems go away.
So, we can tell 21,000 adults they will no longer get preventative care, but all that does is ensure that someday they’ll show up in the emergency room.
Guess who pays then? You do. Only now, you pay a lot more.
Frankly, I find it extremely hypocritical yet not at all surprising to hear conservatives argue that Illinois should be mirroring federal Medicaid coverage and basing its policies on what the federal government thinks is best for all of us.
When, my conservative friends, did the federal government become the bastion of public policy wisdom, and when did one-size-fits-all solutions become so fashionable?
No dental care? Good luck finding a job and getting off public aid with no teeth. We’ll see you in the ER when your face is rotting off.
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 2:07 pm
As for the “Defensive Medicine Myth,” Texas has the strictest malpractice caps in the country, yet leads in per capita health care costs. So much for lawsuits driving up medical costs.
The real driver of over-testing and over-prescribing is financial incentives for doctors doing the over-testing and over-prescribing. If your doctor sends you to a private lab for medical imaging or other testing, there’s a good chance that doctor has a financial interest in that facility.
Ironically, our state’s malpractice laws help SAVE medicaid money. When a Medicaid patient is injured in a hospital or nursing home, state law requires that Medicaid be paid first out of any resulting verdict or settlement.
And when negligence results in any victim needing follow-up medical care — or in some cases a lifetime of disability services — lawsuits ensure that the person responsible for the injury pays for the damage they caused, instead of the taxpayers.
Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 2:20 pm
@MrJM, thanks for the links, but I already read that info, I know it’s “legal” to get cash off Link cards, the point I was trying to make is there is not enough accountability for the “cash” they get. They get cash, leave the store and go party on it. Maybe you don’t have a problem with your tax dollars being spent that way, but I do. What I posted was something I actually saw and heard, not a story.
Comment by Huggybunny Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 3:44 pm
- They get cash, leave the store and go party on it. Maybe you don’t have a problem with your tax dollars being spent that way, but I do. What I posted was something I actually saw and heard, not a story. -
Did you go party with them? How do you know that’s what they did with the money? Also, as I understand it the cash assistance program in Illinois is time limited and has some strict requirements. I’m not saying there’s zero fraud, but anyone that thinks eliminating fraud would solve the problem is delusional.
Comment by Small Town Liberal Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 4:00 pm
===They get cash, leave the store and go party on it.===
All of them? EVERY one of them? You know that, right? Patty Bellock and you should write down all the license plates check EVERY card …
There may not be enough “accountablility”, but what doesn’t help are the “absolutes”.
Every … All … ya have me, then you lose me.
Talking points that include “Every”, “All” … never a good way to find a solution.
Comment by Oswego Willy Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 4:03 pm
The joint, bi-partisan task force said they need a couple of more weeks to submit their plan. Let’s wait until then, huh? Perhaps there are elements from both that make the system work.
But here is a conservative’s thought… We need to take care of the most needy people, but there might be abuse in the system, there might be eligibility requirements that need to be modified. The very fact that the current system is going broke, and will soon consume an even bigger portion of the state budget, is diluting the ability to aid those with grievous need. This is about priorities, and the fact that while everyone has good intentions, the government cannot afford to fund them all. Government provides a safety net, not a catch all.
Comment by Cincinnatus Friday, Apr 20, 12 @ 4:14 pm