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* The last time I posted something about a bill to lay out requirements for recycling supermarket plastic bags, we got some comments like this one…
Just recycle the darn plastic bags people. It’s not hard. Take a big bag. Stick all the little plastic bags in it. When full. take to store for recycling. I do it all the time. I still get the convenience of plastic bags but know that I’m minimizing their footprint by recycling them.
And we need a law for this why???
* But the Kankakee Daily Journal has a much different take…
How many of these plastic bags are there? No one really knows. Estimates on the web range from 4 billion new bags a month to 7 trillion a year. Many countries — about a fourth of the world’s population — either ban or heavily tax them out of existence. The bags are either illegal or rare in Belgium, Italy and Ireland.
Because the bags are light, they float and blow easily and travel long distances. It takes only about a dozen bags carelessly discarded, stuck in the trees, to pretty much ruin the appearance of a park. And because the bags have a shelf life of as much as 1,000 years, they will be with us a long time. The Nina, Pinta and Santa Maria have long since decayed. The sword of Charlemagne is a relic. The bag from a foodmart is eternal.
State Rep. Michael Tryon, R-Crystal Lake, has a bill in the hopper requiring plastic manufacturers to set up a network of recycling sites. Most, but not all, grocery stores already have them. Chicago already has a recycling program.
But most people could not be bothered. Tryon noted that only two percent of the bags are recycled now. By contrast, the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency estimates that 72 percent of all newsprint and 85 percent of all cardboard is recycled.
Tryon’s bill is a start. [Emphasis added.]
Discuss.
posted by Rich Miller
Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:18 pm
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How many of those bags are used as garbage can liners? That re-use replaces the need to buy carbage bags and cuts down on overall plastic in landfills. They don’t count as recycled bags. Numbers can be tricky.
Comment by Thinking Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:23 pm
Impose a 5 cent fee and put it in GRF. Washington DC does it.
Comment by Anon Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:24 pm
Frankly all the plastic bottles bother me as much or more than the bags, but both are bothersome and unnecessary.
Comment by AtALoss Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:25 pm
Plastic bags stuck in trees and blowing in the wind were referred to as the National Flag of Ireland. They’ve been banned there, and I could support a ban here.
I used cloth bags at the grovery store and either recycle or reuse the plastic bags I receive elsewhere. But I’m in the minority it appears. The vast minority.
Litter is a private act that becomes a public problem and therefore demands a public response. Wishing the problem away isn’t working.
Comment by 47th Ward Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:26 pm
Didn’t take long for a tax based solution to surface did it?
I’ve seen some dirty looking recyclable bags in use. I sure don’t want them in my grocery store.
Offer a small bonus per pound of bags turned in and watch the streets get cleaned up. No need for any complicated solutions.
Comment by Plutocrat03 Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:41 pm
All through high school, college, and even since, I used every grocery bag I got as a garbage liner, a (duh) bag, ice pack, or some other repeat use. I know my roommates, family, etc., did the same. We never tossed ‘em. Paper bags? Pitched ‘em almost every time.
Heck, glancing down I realize the small garbage next to me is lined with a grocery bag right now. I’m just a case study, but I find them way more useful then paper bags and always prefer them.
Comment by Liandro Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:44 pm
I use them as trash can liners, but I’d rather not have them at all. Setting up more recycling centers is not likely to help. I live in the seriously out there boondocks and these bags are in the fields. Better not to make them at all.
There is a movement to call our era the Anthropocene because of the wide-ranging impacts we are having on the environment. A friend of mine suggested it would be better to refer to it as the Plasticene.
Comment by Pot calling kettle Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:44 pm
I have long suggested that all of those things that we see floating or flying that are made up of discarded plastic need to be made of a material that breaks down fairly quickly in the environment.
We have the technology to make those packing peanuts out of orgqanic materials that will break down over time. Every other plastic container, holder, etc. should be made of the same material. It should be able to withstand a couple of soakings, ie: you are carrying your groceries in during a downpour you don’t want the bag to disintegrate. But if it gets blown away in the wind a couple weeks in the elements would cause it to break down into something that would be beneficial to the environment.
Just think of all of the beverage rings, bait containers, solo cups, and the myriad styrofoam items that you still see laying every place you look. Wouldn’t it be nice to see them disappear after a short time?
With this approach you don’t do away with jobs that are tied to the production of the items. You don’t cut into the profits of the manufacturers by taxing them or forcing them to provide recycling. And you cover more than just plastic bags.
Comment by Irish Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:52 pm
Why should plastic bag manufacturers be the ones to set up recycling sites? They are in the business of manufacturing plastic bags, probably at a couple manufacturing plants not setting up a big network of dropoff sites. I’d prefer simply a high tax on purchases of plastic bags.
Comment by Robert Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:54 pm
Its weird that the Kankakee Daily Journal first mentions how 1/4 of the world’s population has banned or taxed them out of existence and then calls for support of Tryon’s bill. The environmental community is opposed to Tryon’s bill because it would prohibit the rest of the state outside of Cook County from doing just that, banning plastic bags or taxing them. Its an industry bill intended to prevent communities from taking stronger action against plastic bags by playing lip service to the problem.
Comment by WAK Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:55 pm
“Just recycle the darn plastic bags people. It’s not hard. Take a big bag. Stick all the little plastic bags in it. When full. take to store for recycling. I do it all the time. I still get the convenience of plastic bags but know that I’m minimizing their footprint by recycling them.
And we need a law for this why???”
Ditto. Is it wrong to ditto my own comment?
Comment by Chicago Cynic Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 1:55 pm
Just because bags are collected, doesn’t mean they will actually be recycled. I don’t believe there is a viable market for the grocery bags that are brought back to grocery stores now. Just like certain items put in curbside recycling containers are not “recycled” either.
Comment by Tubbfan Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 2:01 pm
Upon further reflection, if the rate is really only two percent, then perhaps something needs to be done to stimulate compliance. But establishing recycling centers where they don’t exist won’t cut it. Must put either an incentive to do it or disincentive not to. Penny a bag tax?
Comment by Chicago Cynic Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 2:06 pm
As long as I walk behind 2 large dogs 3X daily, I have no problem using the bags up.
train111
Comment by train111 Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 2:11 pm
Around us, people willingly use cloth grocery bags for many items but also ask for, use, and recycle plastic retail bags. As proof, the receptacles for plastic bag return and recycle at both the local Jewel and Dominicks are frequently near the top and people have to ask the manager to have them emptied.
Around home we use plastic grocery bags for disposal of kitty litter, to pick up dog doo, as garbage pail liners and to transport things that might “leak” in the car trunk and in suitcases. The plastic bag encasing our daily newspaper on the driveway kept it from being soppy wet and unreadable both today and on Sunday. The plants for our charity plant exchange had their roots kept moist and safe inside plastic grocery bags till they got to their new garden homes. Plastic bags used responsibly are a gift and blessing of modern science.
Any improved framework for recycling to keep plastic bags out of the landfills and oceans and waterways and out of animals’ fins and bellies is good. The bag from a foodmart need not be eternal or last 1000 years. Encouraging technological advances that will speed the normal destruction/degradation cycle of plastic bags makes tremendous sense. Banning plastic bags entirely does not. Taxing them to oblivion does not.
Comment by Responsa Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 2:18 pm
How about instead of a tax on each bag, you have a deposit, much like (insert a state name that doesn’t start with “Illinois”) has for bottles and cans? Crazy, I know, but it’s an idea.
Comment by What planet is he from? Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 2:47 pm
==As proof, the receptacles for plastic bag return and recycle at both the local Jewel and Dominicks are frequently near the top and people have to ask the manager to have them emptied.==
Maybe tax the purchase of plastic bags instead, with half the revenue going to help balance the state’s budget and the other half the revenue going as tax rebates to grocery stores for the number of bags they recycle.
Comment by Robert Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 2:48 pm
Like others here, most of our plastic bags end up being used for trash bags. They also make good packing material. We use reusable bags a lot, but if I forget them, I take plastic.
The total environmental cost of a plastic bag this is reused is a lot smaller than that of a paper bag that is recycled.
Comment by Lakeview Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:05 pm
Irish has a great idea! and Illinois can create jobs by making bags that break down.
Comment by amalia Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:06 pm
“tried to save a tree
bought a plastic bag,
the bottom fell out
it was a piece of crap…
Piece of Crap!”
Neil Young
Comment by Pickles!! Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:09 pm
Plastic bags may have been created by “modern science,” but they are a pervasive symbol of a “throwaway society.” It’s good to see that some people find a way to reuse them, but for the most part they end up in landfills and to a lesser extent as litter on our roads and waterways. The typical plastic shopping bag is processed from petroleum or natural gas feedstock, and it takes energy to manufacture them. I would like to see more made from recycled (or maybe compostable)content, which should reduce their energy and environmental impact during manufacture.
I’m all for banning the bags, but doing so at the local level is not going to happen in most municipalities due to the lobbying power of the retailers, chemical industry and bag manufacturers. I like the Aldi approach, or something that would require the retailers to charge for a bag so that consumers stop and think about their bag usage and alternatives.
If they are going to be recycled, it’s best to have the bag manufacturers develop the recycling infrastructure, and incorporate that cost into the price of the bag. I would include some fairly ambitious statewide recycling targets in the pending bill, scaled up over time. If the targets are not met, municipalities would have the right to opt out of the program and impose a ban. I’m not sure if this approach would work, but we need an incentive to ensure the industry develops a program that will recover the vast majority of plastic bags for recycling.
Comment by Going nuclear Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:22 pm
Tryon’s bill seems like an end-around to preempt local hand wringers (insert your favorite here: Oak Park? Evanston?) from doing anything substantive like taxing or banning or otherwise regulating plastic bags.
Sure, uniformity of regulation is good. And yeah, it should be statewide. No one wants 147 towns and 8 counties with differing plastic bag policies.
But statewide uniformity as a ruse to cut off prudent public policy initiatives is not good.
Blend the two: have a statewide policy of substance. Like — require that the bags biodegrade! Throughout Illinois!
A statewide bag collection program is, in effect, a ruse to permit the bag companies to conduct business as usual. Which is, of course, exactly what they want.
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:46 pm
Save all your small plastic bags so you and others can put all the crap that comes out of the General Assembly into them. Send them all to Madigan Cullerton and Quinn’s offices.
Comment by Fed Up! Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:46 pm
I doubt that banning them would lead to an illicit market, like marijuana, or lead devotees to push state legislators to create exceptions for the medical or religious use of plastic bags.
Maybe they could be used for home insulation. Stuff the plastic bags behind dry wall like old time razor blades were once dropped in bathroom medicine cabinet slots.
Comment by Kasich Walker, Jr. Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:46 pm
==How many of these plastic bags are there? No one really knows. Estimates on the web range from 4 billion new bags a month to 7 trillion a year. Many countries — about a fourth of the world’s population — either ban or heavily tax them out of existence. The bags are either illegal or rare in Belgium, Italy and Ireland.==
At first blush I was going to let this pass but I find that I just can’t. Regardless of the merit of the overall subject matter, near-hysterical, badly written and completely non-sourced “editorials” are an insult to the reading public and do need to be called out. It really does not matter if it’s an editorial printed in one of the nation’s prestige large circulation papers or in a small regional newspaper in corn country. “How many… are there? No one really knows.” (Billions trillions? No one knows, but by golly we’re here to say it’s a really really really big problem.) “A fourth of the world’s pop. either ban them or tax them out of existence.” (Well, tiny Belgium, Italy and Ireland do, anyway.)
The Journal editors claim a plastic bag from the dollar store will last longer than mighty Charlemagne’s sword. A powerful mental image to be sure —and the proof and logic of this statement is????
I’m almost certain that if a commenter tried to put this kind of stuff with these sorts of “facts” on his blog Rich would call them out on it in a New York minute.
Comment by Responsa Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:49 pm
Let’s get serious. If the goal is to recycle the most plastic bags possible this is the best solution. A statewide program will reduce waste faster than waiting individual municipalities to pass programs. Even if every town passed a program it would not cover unincorporated areas. If you are serious about recycling that this is the BEST OPTION!!!!!
Comment by Get Serious Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 3:59 pm
I recycle these bags at home because they have the little recycling logo on them… are they not being recycled with residential recycling pick-up?
But… I very often decline a bag when I buy one or a couple of items at a store. When I go to Walgreen’s and the clerk automatically puts my greeting card in a bag, I take it out of the bag and give the bag back to the Clerk.
Comment by Just Observing Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 4:07 pm
Shopping bags can be made out of cornstarch. I owned a food store that used them in 1986. ADM has the technology. See Metabolix MBLX is the ticker symbol for more.
Comment by Chefjeff Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 4:07 pm
We also need to re-train every single person who works retail to *ask* if the customer wants a bag. Because half the time my stuff is in one of their plastic bags before I can hand them my canvas one. And once it’s in a plastic bag, most stores won’t let the cashier re-use the plastic one for the next customer.
Comment by Cheryl44 Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 4:22 pm
I’ve been having more clerks ask me if I want a bag or not on minor purchases. I always say no thanks because we recycle everything you can at my house.
Comment by Lil' Enchilada Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 4:35 pm
And I have clerks taking my canvas bag and putting their plastic bag with my stuff in the canvas. I do use them for the litter box, it’s not that I throw them on the ground or anything. It’s just somewhat annoying.
Comment by Cheryl44 Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 4:59 pm
Put a nickel surcharge on these bags and the landfill/litter problem goes way down. That’s a precedent that’s worked in other cities (most notably Washington DC a couple years ago), and one that would both reduce waste going to landfills and raise a little cash for the governing body that adopts it.
Deposit laws on plastic bottles would raise the recycling rate for those containers (and why on earth anyone would buy bottled water over Lake Michigan tap is beyond me), but the beverage container industry grew very effective in the 1980s at preventing those laws from going through.
Comment by Boone Logan Square Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 5:23 pm
I never considered plastic bags to be an environmental problem until I went to Ireland ten years ago this summer and discovered at a Tesco that they imposed a fee on customers who took plastic bags home to carry their groceries. I believe it was something like 5 or 10 cents a bag, not a big deal, but enough to make me think and to inspire me to never go to that grocery store again without having my own bag to carry things home.
This seems like a much better solution than pushing for bag recycling, at least if the Chicago plastic bag recycling program is any comparison. I try to use canvas bags when I can because it’s much more convenient, but without that fee on each bag sometimes I backslide and will just let the clerks go ahead and put my stuff in the plastic bags. I know I’ve seen a bag recycling box at a Dominick’s in the Gold Coast but can’t recall ever seeing any other such efforts here. In fact, I wasn’t aware Chicago had a bag recycling program until this post.
Comment by hisgirlfriday Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 5:35 pm
Sure pass a law, look like a hero to the libs.
OR….take one side of the bag in one hand, the other side in the other hand, and tie an overhand knot. Problem solved. you can recycle it or pitch it, but it will never blow around again. and you’ll save a tree (or part of one). Takes one second of your time.
Or pass a law
Comment by park Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 6:38 pm
Those stupid BAS%+#!s haven’t got anything better to do than come up with stupid bills like this. How about they roll their pension plan into the regular state employees plan!!!
Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 7:40 pm
Many “conservatives” don’t understand their alleged ideology shares a root with “conservation.” Waste not, want not.
You don’t s— where you eat, and you don’t p— in your cash register.
There’s no natural-law, Constitutional right or entitlement to dump tons of non-biodegradable chemicals into the environment every day because it’s convenient.
You don’t have a right to change your oil over the storm sewer or chuck your old car battery in the garbage or toss your worn tires on the side of the road. Those actions would cause environmental and health problems that impact everyone.
Geez, people lived quite a long time without plastic bags. Maybe we can muster the energy and courage to adjust for the greater good.
Liberty is not at stake here. A community response is more than reasonable.
The price of liberty is responsibility and it requires collective action some times.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 7:51 pm
A recycling network will simply insure that we have more of these bags floating around through eternity. Ban the bags. We are all responsible for the environment and if we can’t keep track of cloth grocery bags, then we should be forced to buy new cloth bags at the store.
We should not be coddled in our hideous wasteful practices.
(There should also be a law that each citizen is given one fork, spoon, plate and cup in a handy mess kit to travel with and that’s what we eat on at fast food restaurants!)
Comment by Dan Bureaucrat Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 8:29 pm
The real Illinois solution remains banning the sale of anything requiring a bag. Once there is nothing to put in a bag, there is no longer any need for the bag itself. Problem solved.
Comment by Legislator Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 10:05 pm
Thanks for saying it so well Wordslinger.
Comment by 47th Ward Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 10:52 pm
–The real Illinois solution remains banning the sale of anything requiring a bag.–
C’mon dude. You can’t be that outraged.
It’s not an Illinois thing. It’s international.
There’s no right to be a slob and it’s not that big of an adjustment to change our ways for the greater good.
My farmor and mormor (grandmas, for you unfortunate non- Norwegians) never saw a plastic bag in their lives. Somehow, they muddled through, providing for their eight and ten children in Depression and occupation in WWII.
Were you born with a plastic bag in your mouth? It’s a real issue, but it’s low-hanging fruit. We’re big boys and girls, so we can deal with it without too much trouble.
Then, we can move on to the next issue. There’s always a next issue. That’s life in the NFL.
Comment by wordslinger Wednesday, May 9, 12 @ 11:28 pm
Wordslinger, did you just win a bet to see how many random non-sencical things you could string together?
Comment by Rail sitter Thursday, May 10, 12 @ 8:04 am
–Wordslinger, did you just win a bet to see how many random non-sencical things you could string together? –
I’m not sure. What’s a “non-sencical?”
Comment by wordslinger Thursday, May 10, 12 @ 8:32 am
I don’t understand how a tax on plastic bags is going to stop them from blowing around and littering parks.
Or are we assuming that Illinois would only use that tax money to pay for park cleanup?
Comment by Stuff happens Thursday, May 10, 12 @ 8:38 am
Ban them Statewide and go back to the days of returning glass soda bottles to be refilled. Plenty of other States and/or Cities have already done that. Every year, the leaves fall off the trees and there are more Walmart bags to look at.
Comment by Dead Head Thursday, May 10, 12 @ 9:19 am
Of all the places I thought I would encounter “mormor” outside of my ex-in-laws, this would have been the last.
For those of you who say you reuse these bags to clean the litterbox, that’s not recyling the bag. That’s putting non-degradeable petroleum products in a landfill. Recycling means taking the item and reusing it in a way that doesn’t add to landfill. These aren’t being refolded and reused by Walmart, they’re being melted down and turned into new bags: http://earth911.com/recycling/plastic/plastic-bags/how-plastic-bags-and-film-packaging-are-recycled/.
This is what the Reagan Revolution has wrought. 30 years later, an entitled population snorts at the idea that government is in any way remotely useful and insistent on personal convenience while blithely ignoring the consequences of their actions. Meanwhile, we have whole islands of trash floating around the oceans and the rest of the world is showing us the way to take small steps to prevent public problems.
I think this kind of private behavior that leads to public problems is exactly what the government is there to fix. So, someone figured how to make something a while ago that became very popular. Then we, collectively, started noticing that while the item was useful, there were bigger problems that we couldn’t have foreseen at the time. So now that we know better, it’s time to act on that knowledge, not hide your head in the sand. This process was applied in the past to heroin in medicine, fenfen, thalidomide, asbestos, mercury and oil. If you oppose a ban, I think it’s up to you to show why this particular product, known to be an environmental hazard and easily replaced, must exist.
Comment by Colossus Thursday, May 10, 12 @ 9:55 am