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Question of the day

Posted in:

• Illinois

* Your response to the governor’s budget address?

posted by Rich Miller
Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:00 pm

Comments

1. Smoke and mirrors without compassion

   Comment by anon Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:00 pm

2. tl;dr - Governor OnePercent tells workers, municipalities, colleges, the sick, the poor & foster kids they must all “tighten their belts.”

   – MrJM

   Comment by MrJM Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:01 pm

3. Where’s the beef???

   Comment by Chicago Cynic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:02 pm

4. D.O.A.

   Comment by M Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:02 pm

5. Wow!! We are in for a bumpy 4 years.

   Comment by 36th Warder Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:02 pm

6. I’ve heard Lou Lang give longer speeches in committee. That was lame, both in terms of presentation and content.

   He basically said nothing.

   Comment by siriusly Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:03 pm

7. Making it more attractive to leave Illinois!

   Comment by jogger Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:04 pm

8. Mostly expected generalizations. Verbiage went a bit overboard on the blame of the debt.

   Comment by Rufus Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:04 pm

9. Madigan and Cullerton aren’t buying what Rauner is peddlin’.

   Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:04 pm

10. Cruel

    Comment by North Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:05 pm

11. Question of the day: who will have more losses this year, Bruce Rauner or the Cubs?

    My reaction to the speech: won’t pass.

    Comment by The Captain Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:06 pm

12. Would GTCR really buy a business that had no money in the bank and spent every dollar it earned every month?

    Local governments do keep cash on hand, they need to and they are supposed to according to the bond rating agencies and their own auditors. His attack on local governments having cash reserves is totally misguided.

    Comment by siriusly Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:06 pm

13. So much left unsaid. Pension proposal sounds no more constitutional than SB 1. Tier II for all current public workers? Smoke and mirrors in regard to $ for municipalities. Certainly there is a long range plan but it will be hidden as long as possible.

    Comment by Bill Menendez Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:06 pm

14. Victory, in Rauner’s eyes, at any cost.

    Comment by Higher Ed Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:07 pm

15. He’s going to change his tune about pensions when the Supreme Court does rule…regardless of his intentions, because no Tier 1 employee in their right mind is going to volunteer to go to Tier 2.

    Comment by Captain Illini Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:08 pm

16. Not sure how the cut in higher education spending benefits the working families the Governor says he wants to help.

    Comment by Summerwind Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:08 pm

17. And we thought Blagojevich was delusional…!

    Comment by Ducky LaMoore Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:10 pm

18. No, oliver you may not have more gruel. We are looking into warm water as a lower cost alternative. Please excuse me my fillet mignon should be here shortly.

    Or if you prefer….. Let them eat cake!

    Comment by Ghost Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:10 pm

19. So many words that said so little in explaining what this budget is going to look like.

    I’m going to reserve my detailed critique, for when I get a detailed budget that is up for discussion.

    Here is what happened. Today;

    Governor Rauner gave just enough information to conclude… we don’t exactly know…what his budget will exactly…be.

    That’s it. It’s bad as much as it is “good”. It’s honest as much as its hidden.

    It’s a roadmap as much as we don’t know where we end up.

    That’s what happened today.

    I’ll wait to see what we’re going to be discussing come May, but for today;

    “This won’t be popular, but you can’t dislike what exactly you haven’t seen”.

    Then there’s that pesky Constitution…

    Lots of work to be done by all…

    …but the preposin’, that’s on the Governor right now.

    Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:11 pm

20. If Rauner succeeds there may not be a word to describe how deep blue this state will turn.

    Madigan may give rauner and the gop the rope they are asking for and in 2016 the gop may become and endangered species.

    Comment by Ghost Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:12 pm

21. So now we see if the House and Senate can just override him for four years while he yammers on about how relevant he is? Okay. Should be fun to watch.

    Comment by ArchPundit Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:12 pm

22. Stark. Pulled no punches. When he said he was willing “to take arrows” on this topic, he wasn’t kidding.

    Comment by Louis G Atsaves Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:13 pm

23. Wow, underwhelming! Why is it I learned more from reading CF this am than listening to the horse’s mouth. And this guy is our governor? He’s still dropping a lot of g’s and it ain’t folksy.

    Comment by Doug Dobmeyer Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:14 pm

24. To save money Rauner will eliminate the “g” in College. Thus creatin’ lotsa savin’s in Hi’er Educatin’ spendin’

    Comment by 'inG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:14 pm

25. As Pres Cullerton just pointed out, you can really expect to lower local property taxes and cut local gov’t revenue sharing too. Can’t have it both ways.

    Comment by Just Sayin ... Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:15 pm

26. I would like an explanation of the $2.2B pension savings the governor is taking. Since SB1 is still unsettled, where are the savings coming from?

    Comment by howard Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:16 pm

27. Definitely time to find my old Eat The Rich button.

    Comment by alas Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:16 pm

28. I only hope the ISC makes it clear that forced pension plan changes without diminishment are a non-starter.

    Rauner is reading the pension clause “benefits” as “past benefits” and not benefits of the actual *contractual relationship* . I’d love to break a contract and say, “Hey, you get to keep whatever we had up to today. But now the contact is null and void according to me. I don’t care what you think.”

    Comment by Frenchie Mendoza Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:17 pm

29. whoops — I meant ” … pension plan changes without *consideration* are a non-starter.”

    Comment by Frenchie Mendoza Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:17 pm

30. draufgängerisch

    Comment by Western Ave. Doug Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:17 pm

31. If you want to cut funding for orphans and the developmentally disabled, have the guts to say it in your speech, not hide it in the budget books. Own it.

    He wants to be seen as a tough guy budget cutter, but he doesn’t want to talk about many of the cuts he’s making. This was easily one of the most cowardly speeches I’ve ever heard.

    Comment by 47th Ward Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:18 pm

32. Good Delivered well with a consistent message. Smart cuts in many areas.

    Bad Pushing for additional pension theft is a non-starter. It is also offensive and certainly unconstitutional.

    Now we will see the alternative cuts and tax hikes suggested by others who oppose his plan. What do they want to cut instead? What do they want to tax instead? That will determine a lot about how this plan is received.

    Comment by Formerly Known As... Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:18 pm

33. Clueless

    Comment by Precinct Captain Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:20 pm

34. 47th… We may not always agree… But, WOW do I agree with you on that!! Very true.

    Comment by Walter Mitty Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:21 pm

35. I think many snark but are secretly glued to this because we all know we wouldn’t run our own finances like this state has and he is the best adult hope we have seen from a political office holder in a very long time.

    Comment by Rat Race? What's that?? Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:22 pm

36. - 47th Ward -,

    I will say this. If he owned it, then that’s really playing “chicken”, heads-up, “here I am, your move”.

    Gotta eat it, gotta own it. That’s what a governor does.

    Today is rolling out a sales pitch. It’s not the governing part.

    To the governing part,

    Riddle me this;

    No facts or figures, even for Legislative Staff?

    Yeah, that ain’t governing too.

    See, why is this a sales pitch?

    It’s the talk before the bill of sale is signed, and the goods are delivered.

    No synopsis for Staffs is just preppin’ for the sellin’

    Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:25 pm

37. #Making it more attractive to leave Illinois!#

    I plan to leave Illinois soon if it continues to be business as usual. My property taxes will force me out of my house that I have owned for 28 years.

    Comment by blankster Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:25 pm

38. Waiting for the budget detail to be released and then to see how agencies would implement before commenting.

    Comment by Cassiopeia Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:25 pm

39. Na ga ha

    Comment by moby Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:25 pm

40. Delivered just as you would expect a vampire capitalist to deliver a budget address.

    Comment by Skeptic Tank Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:25 pm

41. What kind of threats will he make at the bargaining tables to cohearse employees to accept tier 2

    Comment by foster brooks Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:26 pm

42. ===Bad Pushing for additional pension theft is a non-starter. It is also offensive and certainly unconstitutional.===

    So, Why is he counting 2.2 billion from his pension “reform” proposal in his “balanced” budget then, FKA? At the very least the savings will not be available in FY2016 due to the sure challenge to it in the courts.

    Comment by PublicServant Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:26 pm

43. Even with using the proposed pension cost saving, it’s probably the most honest budget proposal we’ve had in over 12 years. Of course people are mad, this is the State of our budget and finances folks and it ain’t pretty.

    The Governor has outlined his budget and now the process of 60, 30 and 1 begins.

    Comment by Ahoy! Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:26 pm

44. Necessary

    Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:26 pm

45. ” Gov: regardless of what Supreme Court decides on SB1 pension law, more ‘reform’ is needed. $1 out of every $4 goes to pension benefits. ” Rauner thinks he is above the law. Lets hope the ISC tells Rauner he must follow the law when they release their ruling.

    Comment by Mama Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:27 pm

46. So, was Rauner fibbing when he said that he, Cullerton and Madigan are “days away” from unveiling a deal on the current budget?

    Comment by james Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:27 pm

47. 47th Ward - Exactly

    Comment by ArmyMan Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:27 pm

48. Cassiopeia:

    Its all right here. Have at it (it ain’t pretty):

    budget.illinois.gov

    Comment by okgo Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:28 pm

49. Budget address pretty empty of actual plans. He might have them, but how to hit some of these numbers, especially Medicaid and pensions, remains to be seen.

    Comment by walker Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:29 pm

50. /Snickers….

    Right…

    Comment by ah HA Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:31 pm

51. “But moving forward, all future work will be under the Tier 2 pension plan, except for our police and firefighters.”

    Is this the next EO?

    Comment by Person 8 Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:31 pm

52. Someone must have explained to him that 401ks were a bad idea

    Comment by foster brooks Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:32 pm

53. As it stands right now, one out of every four dollars taken from taxpayers by the state goes into a system that is giving more than ELEVEN THOUSAND government retirees tax-free, six-figure pensions worth as much as, in one case, $450,000 per year!

    That says it all! Illinois politicians love millionaires- at least the ones who work for the state.

    Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:32 pm

54. So this guy is some kind of financial genius and this is best he can come up with. Unbelievable.

    Comment by sparky791 Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:33 pm

55. I am going to come at this from a different angle.

    How many voters - not the general public, but people who actually vote in both presidential and gubernatorial election cycles - know a thing about some of these programs that Governor Rauner has proposed cutting or eliminating? My guess is that very few know much (if anything) about the programs in question. That shows that our state’s budget process is both opaque and meant to confuse the electorate. I know that sounds harsh, but it seems like a lot of these programs operate on autopilot and then are never checked for efficiency, need or, at worst, the potential for elimination. For the last decade-plus most people under the statehouse dome assume these programs will just keep going without a check and/or balance. Clearly that is not what Governor Rauner is intending.

    At the federal level, the leviathian-sized budget is so big that it swallows up smaller programs like this. MOCs and Senators forget about the programs and they run on autopilot. The feds can also print money and keep running up the deficit. Illinois cannot do that. We have a constitutional mandate to balance our budgets. Like with anything else, the programs themselves may seem minute in cost. Cobbled together and various minor programs and line items in the state budget really add up.

    Comment by Team Sleep Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:33 pm

56. There can be no realistic fix for this state without significant revenue. We need an increase in income tax and a real effort to overhaul the state tax structure. The popular millionaire’s tax couldn’t hurt, either. There do have to be cuts, and they will be painful - but they cannot be cuts that will push the burden down even further onto local governments. And there was an opportunity to try and state a vision, between last week and this speech, that might have been inspirational and outside-the-Arduin box. But guys like Rauner don’t think that way. He’s not an outsider. He games the system from the private sector as well as anyone does from inside. He sold the state a package wrapped in a Carhartt and delivered in a crappy van. Now we have to hope the GA will try yo act like the adults in the room for four years.

    Comment by Archiesmom Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:36 pm

57. 47th. Amen.

    Comment by Soccermom Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:36 pm

58. The speech was rather vague and cowardly. I want to see the public reaction when the details set out by Rich get publicized.
    I am still having a hard time believing this is happening. It just seems so “not Illinois” with the draconian cuts and all. I feel like I suddenly–and unwillingly–moved to Kansas or Mississippi. And to think we have at least four more years of living in this Bizzaro Illinois World. Geez. It is embarrassing my state has this guy with his priorities as our chief executive.
    Now I want to see all these GOP legislators going out there defending these cuts.

    Comment by Call Me Crazy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:36 pm

59. No real details but they are now starting to leak out from sources. Question his savings on pensions. Higher ed cuts means more tuition increases and that impacts middle class families who don’t qualify for FAFSA and other aid. So that means taking out more student loans. I have friends who say they and/or their children will be in debt for years and years to pay for college.

    It would seem to be a good thing to see more funding for K-12. Where is that coming from? Decreasing other social welfare programs that poor folks need. We see so many students come to school with needs we cannot meet. I know colleagues who bring clothes their children have outgrown to share with students along with food to take home for the night or on weekends.

    Comment by Nearly Normal Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:37 pm

60. Complaints from the commentators…no solutions…so essentially the last 20 years.

    Comment by DuPage Moderate Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:37 pm

61. ===one out of every four dollars taken from taxpayers by the state goes into a system that is giving more than ELEVEN THOUSAND government retirees tax-free, six-figure pensions===

    And 3 of those 4 dollars is going to pay back debt, money taken from the pensions to pay for state programs while you kicked back and enjoyed a 3% flat tax that didn’t come near to paying for the programs that our representatives voted for…

    Comment by PublicServant Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:37 pm

62. Hire New CFO’s for each agency and fire those responsible. People like Terri Swago and Mike Casey from HFS are culprits in mastermind schemes to stack the deck to get lobbyists money.

    Comment by Call for Action Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:38 pm

63. == I would like an explanation of the $2.2B pension savings the governor is taking. Since SB1 is still unsettled, where are the savings coming from? ==

    From thinking he can ARBITRARILY move existing employees to “Tier 2″ on July 1.

    Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:38 pm

64. Maybe you should hold the representatives who voted for all that nonsense for the past 30 years accountable in stead of Rauner

    Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:39 pm

65. He has to be disappointed with himself so far, because if he isn’t - he is the only one.

    He is just a hair shy of the guy smiling at you and shifting cups around on the top of a card table, imploring you to guess under which cup the pea is located.

    Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:40 pm

66. Kind of pointless to have a budget address when you haven’t proposed a budget. Details and line items are what budgets are.

    Will this guy ever get to it? Been waiting more than a year now for these “comprehensive, detailed plans.”

    Comment by Wordslinger Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:41 pm

67. - Shoedoctor -

    And most of those $100K+ pensions are former politicians, judges, school administrators, or agency directors.

    They sure aren’t the average State retiree.

    Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:42 pm

68. If someone took the word corrupt from his vocabulary, he wouldn’t be able to speak. Everything he dislikes is corrupt.

    I also love the transparency of hiding the budget from the legislature and media before the speech. (s/)

    Comment by Norseman Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:44 pm

69. ===Maybe you should hold the representatives who voted for all that nonsense for the past 30 years accountable in stead of Rauner===

    The courts are the ones that are going to hold you and I responsible for repaying the debt bud. That’s assuming you actually live in Illinois, and are not some Kochhead from Kansas.

    Comment by PublicServant Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:44 pm

70. It was interesting to see Rauner talk about one side of the ledger sheet. What about the other side?

    Comment by forwhatitsworth Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:47 pm

71. right let’s let Madigan and Cullerton off the hook and have 100 posts bashing Rauner. Why would someone from Kansas care about Illinois politics?

    Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:47 pm

72. RNUG….but he wants the general public to believe that most state employees enjoy a huge retirement benefit. Say it enough, people start to believe it!

    Comment by Finally Out (and now very glad to be) Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:47 pm

73. WOW, what a novel concept…spend only what one has and if your agency’s operational costs are not equialled to the revenue it brings in, this overage will not be subsidized by the taxpayer! How about this for a concept: If it costs $X for a ride on mass/public transit, charge $X not $X-$Y! Use this concept for the entire stae which is what Rauner is doing. Why is this so wrong???

    Comment by bouttime Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:49 pm

74. Is Blagojevich out of prison yet?
    What about Ryan?
    Is Kerner still dead?
    Jim Edgar - he can’t be that busy, right?
    Is Pat Quinn still sore about us kicking him out?
    Sarah Palin - she still doing SNL?
    Can anyone get a séance going and get in touch with Stratton?
    Is Evelyn still only a heartbeat away?
    HELP!

    Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:49 pm

75. Shoedoctor has a lot of fact finding to do. But that’s what happens when your emotions get out of control.

    Comment by AnonymousOne Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:51 pm

76. 11,000 retirees do enjoy an unbelievable retirement with a 3% raise every year. How many private sector retirees have this kind of guarantee? Companies realized this years ago and witched to a 401K system. Government pretended this was affordable and it is not

    Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:52 pm

77. Shoedoctor you drink evian right?

    Comment by moby Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:52 pm

78. “And most of those $100K+ pensions are former politicians, judges, school administrators, or agency directors.

    They sure aren’t the average State retiree.”

    Correct.

    Comment by Mouthy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:52 pm

79. ==Details and line items are what budgets are==

    The budget books and line-item budgets have been up on the OMB website since the time his speech started.

    Comment by Formerly Known As... Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:52 pm

80. no I ma not a State retiree I drink tap water

    Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:54 pm

81. Dear Call for Action, please take your medicine - now.

    Comment by alas Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:54 pm

82. === - Shoedoctor -

    right let’s let Madigan and Cullerton off the hook and have 100 posts bashing Rauner.===

    Because it’s the Governor’s Budget Address…

    Dope.

    Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:56 pm

83. If you’re keeping score at home (and I was) BR dropped 47 percent of his g’s this time, down from 51 percent at the SOS — http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/zorn/chi-rauner-slips-to-47-percent-on-the-folksymeter-20150218-story.html

    Comment by Eric Zorn Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:57 pm

84. Shoedoctor evian is code for naive.

    Comment by moby Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:58 pm

85. WOW, what a novel concept…spend only what one has and if your agency’s operational costs are not equialled to the revenue it brings in, this overage will not be subsidized by the taxpayer!

    Yeah - first, we suspend gravity, then take Illinois off the Dollar and replace it with gold bullion, then put a jar next to every cash register in a café for spare change to help the poor, then we hold a bake sale for road construction money, then we just tell the Federal Government we’re not going to comply with all those laws right now because, well, because we have to go back to the novel concept of running Illinois like a flea market - because - novel concepts!

    Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:58 pm

86. WOW, what a novel concept…spend only what one has and if your agency’s operational costs are not equialled to the revenue it brings in, this overage will not be subsidized by the taxpayer!

    I had no idea that the word “novel” was also defined as “insanely naïve and unrealistic”.

    Comment by VanillaMan Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 1:59 pm

87. “right let’s let Madigan and Cullerton off the hook and have 100 posts bashing Rauner.”

    Well, you can’t very well bash Madigan and Cullerton for what Rauner said.

    Comment by Arsenal Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:02 pm

88. Oswego…

    The ENTIRE budget (all 400+ pages) is available online. Now you can go read it and get us those comments.

    Comment by 1776 Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:03 pm

89. - Shoedoctor -

    Go read Eric Madiar’s pension analysis, the CBTA analysis, and even the preface to SB-1 … then come back here and talk intelligently about the pensions.

    HINT: They all say the primary cause of the pension fund problem is the State’s failure to properly pay their share. Benefit increases, etc. were a minor contributing factor. And as far as the 3% AAI goes, that is actually paid for by part of the employee contribution.

    Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:04 pm

90. It is a hard thing for a doctor or paramedic to tell a patient that they are bleeding to death and that unless an arm or leg is amputated,the patient is assured of a slow but certain death. This was Rauner’s “Olgilvey Moment”.

    People want painless and “feel good” sound bites and not long drawn out discussions that make you have to think. Rauner is neither a hero nor a villain today. He is simply acting as the messenger carrying an unpleasant message to the king. There is no doubt that he is going to be eliminated for carrying the unwanted message. Rauner knew this when volunteering for the upcoming unpleasant journey. Yet he had the courage and the strength of character to still agree to be the sacrificial lamb. He even agreed to pay for the match to light the fire that was going to burn him at the stake. Bruce Rauner has my respect. I never saw Mike Madigan, John Cullerton, George Ryan or anyone else agree to take the necessary walk to the electric chair for the sins of those who came before him. Even Lisa refused to fall on a sword for the sins of her father. Nope, Rauner has got my respect.

    Comment by Rowdy Yates Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:04 pm

91. shoedoctor — maybe that’s what you should stick to. What do you think guys that retire from Fortune 500 companies at the top get? Their retirement compensation may be in the form of cash 401k money, huge bonuses, company stock, whatever. But you can be sure they are getting more money than their equivalent in government. Why don’t you take a look at what the Sec. of Transportation comes away with from Illinois versus the head of a consulting engineering firm. Enough with the cheap shots.

    Comment by kimocat Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:06 pm

92. For land’s sake, he’s a politician who proposed a budget that neither adds up nor makes the state any better. He’s not Jesus Christ.

    Comment by Arsenal Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:06 pm

93. - 1776 -,

    Thanks. I’ll take a gander…

    Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:07 pm

94. Let’s all take this opportunity to thank Governor’s Thompson, Edgar and Ryan who hired all the public employees and made the promises that created this mess.

    Rauner can try to cut his way out of it, but in the end current retirees will have to pay.

    AND that all along is Rauner’s plan. Cut everything until the special interest groups, the mothers, the middle class, demand cuts to current retiree pensions.

    Comment by Millennial Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:07 pm

95. Saw and heard the Senate and House Republicans do a lot of clapping, but lets wait and see how many of them grab on and embrace these various actions once they are put into a bill form.

    Comment by Buzzie Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:08 pm

96. Rowdy Yates — I guess it matters whose lamb you are sacrificing. I’d have a little more respect for Rauner if he added, “and Ya’ know what? Guys like me should be paying more too.” Guess I won’t hold my breath waiting for that one.

    Comment by kimocat Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:09 pm

97. ===Yet he had the courage and the strength of character to still agree to be the sacrificial lamb. He even agreed to pay for the match to light the fire that was going to burn him at the stake.===

    It’s Ash Wednesday…not really a good time to be yapping about sacrifice.

    - Rowdy Yates -, I thought you were just a mindless Raunerbot with the Reagan comparisons hours after the swearing-in, now Rauner is a savior?

    Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:10 pm

98. == … demand cuts to current retiree pension ==

    They can demand all they want but a political solution is not legal or constitutional.

    Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:10 pm

99. ===He even agreed to pay for the match to light the fire that was going to burn him at the stake===

    A bit melodramatic aren’t we Rowdy? He’s a Billionaire. The only place he’ll be burning a steak in 4 years is on his yacht. Illinois spends more than it takes in…We already know that. His medicine and his underlying rationale (facts and figures) is what the issue is. He wasn’t being straight with anybody today. As 47th said, it was the most cowardly speech that I’ve ever seen.

    Comment by PublicServant Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:12 pm

100. “He is just a hair shy of the guy smiling at you and shifting cups around on the top of a card table, imploring you to guess under which cup the pea is located.”

     Perfect imagery, VanillaMan.

     – MrJM

     Comment by MrJM Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:13 pm

101. Shoedoctor—educate yourself about IMRF, a defined benefit program funded at over 90%, paying THIRTEEN checks per 12 month year. It is operating smoothly because by law, employers were required to contribute their share (something our state employers laughed at, producing the deficits you now see). Several states who have moved their employees into 401Ks have gone back to defined benefit programs because they were cheaper. Yes, everything works just fine when everyone follows the rules. Our state employees always paid their share. Our deadbeat legislators did not. Please don’t confuse the facts. Don’t blame workers who have contributed to their future (deferred compensation) and have done nothing wrong. This blame game is exactly what is so very strongly desired by those who messed up. It’s working too.

     Comment by AnonymousOne Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:15 pm

102. His proposals today show the wisdom of having constitutions. They also show the wisdom of having a separation of powers with a legislative and judicial branch overseeing the executive branch.

     Comment by Joe M Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:15 pm

103. Radogno and Durkin say they’ll be the ones sponsoring Rauner’s budget bills. The 20 million dollar blackmail seems to be working on the surface. Let’s see how many caucus ducklings fall in line.

     Comment by PublicServant Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:18 pm

104. Is the governor taking questions? I didn’t see him giving an interview after the speech. Oh well, I’m sure we’ll see him on Chicago Tonight.

     Comment by PublicServant Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:26 pm

105. –if your agencies operationals costs are not equialled by the revenue it brings in, this overage will not be subsidized by the taxpayer!–

     That is a novel concept, as you said, and interestingly put.

     Tell me, how close do you think the “revenues” produced by the Department of Corrections are to its “operational costs?”

     What are you going to do about that “overage” (whatever that means). Throw open the prison gates?

     P-12? IDOT? Health care? Pick any agency, any function, at any level of government, and apply your standard.

     Congratulations. That might be the most clueless comment I’ve ever read here. What possessed you to write it and send it?

     Comment by Wordslinger Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:29 pm

106. Jim Edgar on pensions, “we will have to pay this”.

     Rauner would do well to take Edgar’s advice.

     Comment by DuPage Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:32 pm

107. Mercifully brief.
     anyone askin’ for the name of the $430K pensioner?
     anyone looking for the towns with the $15 billion “surplus”
     First to report gets shiney new quarter

     Comment by Anonin' Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:38 pm

108. === My property taxes will force me out of my house that I have owned for 28 years. ===

     The Gov has promised to freeze your property taxes.

     === We need an increase in the income tax. ===

     Rauner won’t let that happen, and Dems won’t/can’t pass it on their own. On to plan B.

     Comment by anon Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:40 pm

109. Take the pain, and don’t let up.

     Comment by Sunshine Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:40 pm

110. The Governor’s sudden inability to properly enunciate and pronounce some words ending in “ing” was annoying and distracting. His lack of details was disappointing, and now we continue to wait for actual proposals. Having said that, I wouldn’t want to be in his shoes trying to fix years of fiscal mismanagement. No matter how he tries to fix the financial problems in the state, people will be upset. It’s a lose-lose for the Governor. Let’s just hope it ends up being a financial “win” for the State so that we can start digging ourselves out of a huge financial hole.

     Comment by Stephanie Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:41 pm

111. Anonin — Just a guess, but 21 year Illini coach Lou Henson is probably the 430k pensioner

     Comment by Smallest violin maker Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:44 pm

112. Unconstitutional.

     Comment by Smitty Irving Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:44 pm

113. Wow, Rowdy, you’re really tripping on the violent imagery.

     With Rauner, you saw today “a sacrificial lamb” who’s going to be “eliminated,” “burn at the stake” AND “take the necessary walk to the electric chair for the sins of those who came before him.”

     Sounds exhausting.

     Gee, a couple of weeks ago, you said Rauner was the second coming of Reagan. Now, I guess he’s just the Second Coming.

     Don’t be surprised if Mel Gibson calls about the movie rights to your opus.

     Comment by Wordslinger Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:47 pm

114. The Fox is in charge of the hen house.

     Comment by Enviro Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:51 pm

115. Meh. About what I expected. Being “Ovenor” is the first official thing he isn’t successful at. So far anyways.

     Comment by Jorge Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:52 pm

116. Governor one-tenth of one percent. Governor scorched earth. Governor I Hate You Illinois.

     I am curious as to what people think would have happened if the Democrats, fresh off another thumping legislative win, had renewed the five percent tax before the end of the last session.

     Comment by Angry Chicagoan Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:53 pm

117. ==If you want to cut funding for orphans and the developmentally disabled, have the guts to say it in your speech, not hide it in the budget books. Own it.==
     Bingo! Tho I do give Rauner credit for at least putting this stuff in the budget books rather than relying on unexplained growth and trickle down pixie dust.

     Comment by Robert the Bruce Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:57 pm

118. I was hoping against hope that Rauner would realize that the state can not be fixed by cuts alone. Are cuts needed, yes. But so it an increase in revenue. I had hoped he would have looked beyond any potential national political career, bit the bullet, and proposed a restoration of the 5% income tax. He could then use the bully pulpit of governor to make sure that that money was used to pay down debt, stabilize the budget, and limit any new spending. How can he continue to use the term compassion when the proposed budget hurts the most needy in society?

     Comment by G'Kar Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:59 pm

119. I saw the report on the 430K pensioner. He is a world renowned doctor at U of I medical school. He paid in an amount based on a percentage of his salary. He earned that pension, just as every other public employee has done.

     Comment by DuPage Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:59 pm

120. Nothing will be reformed and everyone who produces anything who has a brain larger than a pea will continue to leave Illinois (and the nation) as taxes rise and services diminish to pay back old political favors and enrich the corporatists who have run this state and this nation for decades.

     Comment by libertysghost Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 2:59 pm

121. Waiting to hear from those mayors who supported Rauner for governor. Any buyer’s remorse yet?

     Comment by anon Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:00 pm

122. Rauner class warfare

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:03 pm

123. When does he give the speech with the details?

     Comment by William j Kelly Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:04 pm

124. ===…will continue to leave Illinois (and the nation) as taxes rise and services diminish to pay back old political favors and enrich the corporatists who have run this state and this nation…===

     What country are the people flocking to?

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:06 pm

125. Exactly what was expected. With Donna Arduin on board it was inevitable that this would be a slash and burn budget with NO meaningful new revenue sources. Now to see how this plays out with a Democratic super majority in the General Assembly.

     Comment by Bulldog58 Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:06 pm

126. Give the Governor harrumph!

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:07 pm

127. A Rookie Govenor with too many dangerous budget ideas. Now I need to trust MJM and Cullerton to protect me from this invasion of every bad idea that did not work in 27 other states.

     Comment by Makandadawg Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:07 pm

128. Oswego Willy…get out more. I know you would like to think us young folks just have to stick around and pay for all the treats you “voted for yourselves” in the last couple generations but decided not to pay for, but we don’t…and we won’t. You go ahead and chant your “USA USA…” while you continue your gen war. There’s too many better options to list. Travel off the resort and actually talk to people and you might see what I mean.

     Comment by libertysghost Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:10 pm

129. “The Gov has promised to freeze your property taxes.”

     His promise and a couple dollars will get you a cup of coffee.

     Comment by Arsenal Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:12 pm

130. “If it costs $X for a ride on mass/public transit, charge $X not $X-$Y!” Would you ride the bus if it cost, say, $5 each way? What if you were working for minimum wage? I thought not.

     Mass transit doesn’t make money. Period. If you don’t subsidize it, it collapses. Period. Mass transit is a good thing. We should encourage more people to use it, not fewer.

     Comment by Skeptic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:16 pm

131. ===I know you would like to think us young folks just have to stick around and pay for all the treats you “voted for yourselves”====

     I have no idea what that means, I don’t think you know what that means, but golly you sound…worldly.

     ===There’s too many better options to list.===

     You can list one. No one is stopping you…

     ===Travel off the resort and actually talk to people and you might see what I mean.===

     “Travel off the resort”?

     I get it, that means “Cripes, I got called out and really don’t know too much”?

     What resort? Where are these countries people are flocking to? lol

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:17 pm

132. Guys,
     We have a real problem hear to be focusin’ on here. Quit all this jibber jammin’ about the budget and what he is gonna’ cut, nobody knows yet, and it might be worse and it might fix everythin’ but my guess is not much will be changin’! But we got some bigger fish to fry. This State ain’t goin’ be Governornin’ itself. Right now it’s bein’ run by a Govern’r that has more holes in his ability to utilize the apostrophe than holes in the budget. Now, I am askin’ not what your Governor can do for you ‘y’all’s; but what can you be doin’ for your Govern’r? Does anyone know how to getin’ touch with Saturday Night Live or any national news that can shame this guy inta’ knockin’ this fake south’n draw off? I would not ev’n mind it if he knew how to be makin’ in flow nicely like the good people that actually talk like that. But he in fact cannot pull it off and I cannot hear a word he is sayin’ when he gets startin’ on usein’ his condescendin’ po’ people voice. We can’t afford to drop this issue or we will be in the same place four years from now, listnin’ to speeches without comprhendin’ the content because we are focusin’ on how painful it is to hear him struggle to sound like he ain’t no well educated, well spoken rich guy.
     #nodropin’theG

     Comment by I'm Ron Burgandy? Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:20 pm

133. So Gov. Rauner gave up ordinary people for Lent.

     “Gave up on,” I guess.

     Takes people to make things happen, genius.

     “Jobless recovery” is now “workerless growth.”

     Comment by crazybleedingheart Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:21 pm

134. My take:

     Mike, John, - your move.

     Comment by CapnCrunch Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:24 pm

135. Details? Can’t give details. Details get videoed and repeated. I deal with the big picture.

     Who gets cut? Not my job at my level. I got people who give the detailed info to those who need to know when they need to hear it.

     How much is cut? That’s details, see above.

     Applause? That’s what Saputo’s was about.

     Smirk? Whata ya talkin bout?

     Comment by zatoichi Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:25 pm

136. None of these cuts have any impact at all on an average person’s day-to-day life. Most people won’t care. “Regular” people (those who don’t read this blog) will read the headlines tomorrow morning in passing and keep sipping their coffee.

     Comment by eh Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:26 pm

137. Miss Quinn yet?

     Comment by Bluefish Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:31 pm

138. “If it costs X to ride public transit…”
     Because even if you discount any environmental benefit, or could care less about that, it keeps cars off the road, leading to less wear on streets, leading to savings due to less maintenance?
     By the way, I’m pretty tired of my tax dollars going to support roads that serve very few people. Just sayin’

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:31 pm

139. I noticed he drops “g’s’ mid-word as well..reco_nize

     Comment by Charlatan Heston Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:32 pm

140. Whoever thought we’d be looking back on the Good Ole Quinn days so soon??!!

     Comment by D.P.Gumby Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:32 pm

141. Did anyone really want 4 more years of Quinn? If you keep doing things the way you’ve been doing them and expect a different result…… Quitchur bellyachin. Short on details? What Governor hasn’t been. The dropped ‘g’ on his words was condescending but I found nothing basically eval in what he had to say. What I find most appalling is that nobody in this state seems to want to give up anything. Nobody seems to have the courage to accept the fact that you cannot keep spending what you do not have. Why doesn’t that make any sense to anybody? Unfortunately it is called sacrifice. A word that the old fuddy duddy generation doesn’t seem to get. Some programs are going to have to be cut. That’s the facts. Grow a set and grow a spine and step up to the challenge. You’re not going to like it, but what other option do we have? More of Quinology? No thankyou.

     Comment by laughingjane Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:33 pm

142. “None of these cuts have any impact at all on an average person’s day-to-day life.”

     A statement full of enough bologna and horse manure that the surplus could cushion the average Illinois family’s food and fuel budgets.

     Comment by crazybleedingheart Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:34 pm

143. so much for his great skills as a business man coming to the rescue of our State…there’s two columns Bruce, debt and revenue….Mike and John will educate Carhardt in short order, fix the budget as best they can, and Run Lisa in 2018…

     Comment by Loop Lady Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:35 pm

144. “We wouldn’t run our own finances like this…”

     Correct. You would quickly go broke if you had to pay the ACTUAL cost of locking up criminals, paying a toll on every road you drive on, public universities, etc etc.

     I suppose you are prepared to pay a $20 toll each time you go on a different street?

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:37 pm

145. I thought the Governor’s speech was not nearly as interesting as Madigan’s response. Rich had already given subscribers more detail than the Governor did by far.

     Madigan drew the true battle-line by proposing a 3% surcharge on personal income over $1million. (I think it should be at least 5%, but never mind). I’d like to see numbers on this, but if the Center for Tax and Budget Accountability is correct, that could replace or perhaps even exceed the lost revenues from the lapse of the Income Tax increase.

     The only question is whether this battle will be fought for FY2015 or FY2016.

     I’d like to read what Steve Schnorf as to say.

     Comment by David Starrett Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:39 pm

146. I really, really hope that Democrats give Republicans an opportunity to vote on the governor’s budget.

     Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:39 pm

147. Rowdy Yates - thank you! Couldn’t agree more.

     Comment by laughingjane Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:40 pm

148. remember how some thought, ok, well the State of the State was meh cause he’ll really hit it with the Budget Address? did….not….happen. just a short, bland, fact lacking piece.

     Comment by Amalia Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:41 pm

149. I’ve been wondering if all the dropped g’s translate to the cuts in the higher ed budget. Maybe he is proposing that all departments that start with a g: Geology, Geography, Gerontology,Gym (as opposed to PE), German, Germanic Studies, Greek, Global Studies, General Engineering, Graduate School etc be cut. That might equal 31% of the Higher Ed budget!

     Comment by G'Kar Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:44 pm

150. - laughingjane -,

     I’m sure you are missing the point of Ash Wednesday…

     Your agreement is ironic, given the significance of today.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:46 pm

151. === Did anyone really want 4 more years of Quinn? ===

     No, but I don’t want 4 more years of Blago-like dysfunction in state government either.

     Comment by Norseman Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:48 pm

152. Can he really be this obvious? New money to prisons so my privitizing friends can get it. Money to K-12 so my charter school friends can come and get it. No money to Higher Ed because we already get your money for our privitized universities.

     Comment by Makandadawg Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:51 pm

153. The speech itself was awful in terms of providing any information. It was far too vague. There is a lot proposed in the budget. You obviously can’t get into all of the brutal details but a few might have been nice.

     And did anybody else think that the teleprompter wasn’t moving a couple of times in the speech? He seemed to stop and/or giving one. word. sentences. in a couple of places. I felt bad for him at those times. What an awful thing if the teleprompter was an issue. I feel bad for him on that one.

     Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:51 pm

154. Bruce Rauner = the Cowardly Bully!

     Comment by Anontwo Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:52 pm

155. YDD- was thinking the EXACT same thing.

     Let the GOP leaders in each chamber sponsor it - if they would. Bruce may have to put out a “Sponsors Wanted” sign - like “Help Wanted” to get someone to do it.

     But yes. Bring all these ideas up for votes. Individually. Has a bill supported by a Gov ever reach the Century Club (100 No votes for our new friends visiting today as Raunerbot cheerleaders).

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:52 pm

156. For all those who are asking if we “miss Quinn yet?” It’s hard to miss him when the issues with his budget and his governance keep arising. What you heard today was the result of skipping on paying the piper for far too long. I don’t miss any of the last 4 Governors who contributed mightily to this mess.

     The folks who stay in Illinois and continue to fix it are the real heroes.

     Comment by A guy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:53 pm

157. As bad as this budget is, imagine what cuts would be needed without his imaginary $2.2 billion in reductions to pension contributions.

     But anyone who’s been paying attention already knew there were no easy solutions, no painless cuts to solve our fiscal problems. I suppose maybe some of us were hoping that in this budget Rauner would have to own up to the fact that without more revenue, devastating cuts would have to be made to almost everything the state does. Instead, his budget proposes to close more than half the $6.6 billion deficit with $2.2 billion in pension cuts that cannot be made and by diverting $1.3 billion of tax revenue from local governments to the state.

     Comment by drew Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:56 pm

158. Somehow, I missed Senator Brady and Rep. Kay’s reactions to the proposed cuts in college funding.

     Could someone please repost?

     Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 3:58 pm

159. A new state conceived in Arduin austerity. Rauner couldn’t get more Lincolnesque.

     Comment by vole Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:01 pm

160. === Somehow, I missed Senator Brady and Rep. Kay’s reactions to the proposed cuts in college funding. ===

     I think they’re checking the list of 10 to see if they would have a “F…… Problem.”

     On the subject of problem. Noticed Radogno covering the Govs’ rear on the alleged threat. Nice to have money to buy everybody.

     Comment by Norseman Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:02 pm

161. Ok, “Sociopath” is the wrong word.

     Comment by Skeptic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:02 pm

162. Oswego Willy…nice try. I assume you can read so stop changing the subject by taking me out of context. You’re embarrassing yourself. If you really don’t know what I mean than I am wasting my time. I suspect you are instead just deflecting…whine on this board all you want about how you shouldn’t have to pay the debts that were incurred while your generation ran the state in to the ground. I won’t be around to care much…and neither will my kids.

     Comment by libertysghost Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:02 pm

163. Rauner knows the 2.2 billion pension money will go nowhere. I assume he simply wants to put AFSCME on the spot. If there’s a 2.2 billion hole in 6 months, he’ll look to AFSCME to fill at least part of it up.

     Comment by Frenchie Mendoza Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:02 pm

164. Sorry Rich, I humbly apologize.

     Comment by Skeptic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:02 pm

165. Jane: “It’s called sacrifice”.

     Well, heavens to Betsy (miss you Bill B). The $30,000 a month contract to Arudin, the $75,000 a year job to the 25 year old sister of the campaign operative, the $100,000 year gig to Diana Rauner’s “COS” - that all is included in sacrifce, right?

     As a matter of fact, the Governor is setting records for salaries to top level administration officials.

     The Governor sure knows how to lead by example and show how everyone should “sacrifice”.

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:03 pm

166. Help me understand this–State contributions to SURS for Retiree healthcare is zeroed out in the budget. Are Universities supposed to pick up this expense in addition to the 31.9% cut in state appropriations? Is there some other source of funding? (Table 1-B, http://www2.illinois.gov/gov/budget/Pages/default.aspx

     Comment by redeft Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:03 pm

167. Apropro of Rauner’s attack on pensions, a new study out showing that in three cases (WV, AK, MI), a switch from a DB plan to a DC plan cost taxpayers more, did not reduce liabilities, and gave retirees a smaller benefit (obvi).

     http://www.nirsonline.org/storage/nirs/documents/Case%20Studies/public_pension_resource_guide_-_case_studies_of_state__pension_plans_that_switched_to_defined_contribution_plans.pdf

     Comment by chi Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:04 pm

168. “Did anyone really want 4 more years of Quinn?” No, many of us were unhappy with the choices that were offered.

     Comment by Skeptic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:04 pm

169. ===…whine on this board all you want about how you shouldn’t have to pay the debts that were incurred while your generation ran the state in to the ground. I won’t be around to care much…and neither will my kids.===

     So…what countries are they flocking to?

     Where are these resorts?

     Got that 1 country for me?

     Dope.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:06 pm

170. Anyone suspect that a University or College or two might get chopped…or I mean “consolidated”? Would that detail be in here already? If so…where are you laying your odds? Is an EIU a possibility? Or more likely Gov State/Chicago ST?

     Comment by libertysghost Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:07 pm

171. - libertyghost -

     Hit the Google key.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:11 pm

172. @libertysghost

     The odds are 0. He can’t do that without legislation and nobody’s going to vote to close/consolidate any universities.

     Comment by Demoralized Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:12 pm

173. Reviewed much of the actual budget on the OMB site. Good format overall, though the intro was a bit campaign-like.

     General notes:

     It acknowledges that the actual state employee headcount has substantially declined from 2001, and that Rauner-2016 slightly increases the employee headcount. Maybe he realizes we just got too small to work effectively.

     The real saves are almost entirely in reduced employee benefits, especially pensions, and general public healthcare benefits. Pushing off costs to the local level is a big piece as well.

     Everybody had to cut from present “maintenance” levels, which had been occurring for most units previously.

     All this might help meet his fiscal objectives, but where is the “restructure” of government we were promised? This budget is mostly squeezing the present structure even further.

     Is “restructure”, outlined by Arduin and crew, what he will provide after the pension reduction plan fails to move forward?

     The DCEO plan and scope are pretty reduced. Will we see a major public-private partnership replacing that unit wholesale?

     The 2015 budget is described as $1.6B out-of-whack from the get go, but Rauner 2016 depends on $2.2B in saves from an awfully unlikely change to pensions by July this year. No old bills are paid down until after this 2016 budget. They will actually increase in the short term.

     This is a very big challenge, and credit to Rauner to come up with something this short into his term.

     Much more to be done.

     Comment by walker Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:17 pm

174. ==Jim Edgar on pensions, “we will have to pay this”.

     Rauner would do well to take Edgar’s advice.==

     If Edgar would’ve listened to his own advice when he was in office, we wouldn’t be in this mess.

     Comment by Anonymoiis Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:18 pm

175. @ Makandadawg 3:51 === Can he really be this obvious? New money to prisons so my privitizing friends can get it. Money to K-12 so my charter school friends can come and get it. … ===

     That’s exactly what I’ve been thinking — all this happy talk about more money for education is going to lead up to more charters and privatization. Look for a classic bait-and-switch.

     Comment by olddog Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:23 pm

176. This speech is obviously a rauner strategy to deflect attention away from Rahm being the most hated politician in Illinois.

     Comment by William j Kelly Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:24 pm

177. Tax foundation 2015 State comparison (high rank = high taxes) has IL 44th in Property tax, 38th in Unemployment taxes, 34 in Sales Taxes, 47th in Corporate income taxes. 11th in Income tax. So there’s one area we aren’t the in the bottom half in the nation. I was surprised that the speech didn’t focus on making Illinois more competitive (aside from the workers comp reform). Maybe that doesn’t poll well. But a growing economy (not just based on tax cuts) really would solve our problems. Illinois leads the nation in people moving out. Why? Jobs, taxes, the Winter… Unfortunately today’s speech and the SOS had some seeds but no vision, no details and unrealistic.

     Comment by Midway Gardens Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:26 pm

178. This emperor hasn’t any clothes.

     Comment by Wensicia Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:32 pm

179. “Why can’t we all just get along?” Jeepers. Remember his lovely wife (Cassandra) from the opposition party once candidly warned everyone, “He really is going to drive all of them nuts in Springfield. Really!”

     Comment by Rodney King Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:33 pm

180. Not seein’ too many positive comments - with good reason. Disappointing. Gotta get off the tired class warefare-type themes and get on with the real work odf how to fix the mess. I don’t think anyone is expecting a “magic bullet” at this point, but let’s at least get some solid reasoned and reasonable steps. Lead.

     Comment by Mister M Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:34 pm

181. Overall, as expected, Rauner proposed much of the same things Quinn would have proposed for this budget cycle, (and previously did), if he didn’t get the tax rate extension he wanted. Quinn would not have had the major cuts to Medicaid, however.

     I was looking for more real government restructure: CMS, DCEO, contract and grant management, for example.

     The attack on union dues, tort reform, and workers’ comp are not direct budget issues. On those, Rauner will clearly be different from Quinn.

     Comment by walker Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:36 pm

182. Ayn Rand

     Comment by dawn Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:38 pm

183. A link for Midway Gardens

     http://taxfoundation.org/article/2015-state-business-tax-climate-index

     IL comes in as more pro-business than WI & OH

     Comment by Helpful Hardware Man Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:39 pm

184. Anonymoiis
     “If Edgar would’ve listened to his own advice when he was in office, we wouldn’t be in this mess.” Thumbs up!

     Comment by Anyone Remember Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:40 pm

185. To the budget: I see he forgot to zero out the executive air fleet, but did not forget to give OEIG and Executive Ethics a haircut.

     Comment by crazybleedingheart Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:41 pm

186. Why didn’t the gov have John Tillman just deliver the speech since he was the one who wrote it? I never thought I would smile listening to Elaine Nekritz speak about pensions (on WBEZ this afternoon), but she questioned the Gov’s “fuzzy math” on pension savings. How would it save any money? Unless… oh yeah– the state could decide not to contribute its share which has been its off and on habit since 19forever. I agree that there must be some sacred cows and inefficiencies somewhere in the state that can and should be trimmed, but making non-starter proposals and cuts that harm the middle-class (higher-ed) while shirking revenue ideas that he himself has mentioned (taxing services) smacks of self-important ideologue rather than smart businessman or crafty politician. In short, just what I expected, but not what I had hoped for.

     Comment by Exasperated Teacher Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:42 pm

187. P.S. that’s not a compliment…

     Comment by dawn Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:44 pm

188. Archiesmom
     Now we have to hope the GA will try yo act like the adults in the room for four years.

     Really??? Who do you think has been giving us these budgets the last 20 years? i hope you are not that naive. Just in case you did not know. those were never Quin budgets. We had to go beg and plead with the Senate and the House for the budgets. Who let Medicaid double in the last decade? This is a spending problem as much as revenue. Evrytime Legilature proposes new taxes they willfully over estimate. Look at the Cigarette tax increase. The budgets have been jokes for years.

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:45 pm

189. Or how making commute times even longer, via cuts to mass transit, helps the business climate in the state?

     So much for the fast and efficient movement of goods that all businesses rely on.

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 4:50 pm

190. == Help me understand this–State contributions to SURS for Retiree healthcare is zeroed out ==

     Yep, the State is not paying that any longer. He expects either the University or the retiree to pay for it.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:08 pm

191. == When does he give the speech with the details? ==

     You have to read the Budget Book

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:09 pm

192. In my opinion Gov. Rauner said what has needed to be said for a very long time. This state is in dire straits, & it is going to be painful. However, something has to be done.

     Comment by Southern IL Voter Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:12 pm

193. @Southern Il Voter,

     “However, something has to be done”

     Yes, something has to be done. Thank God we have the poor, foster kids, and disabled to rely on to get us out of this whole.

     I mean, good heavens, we can’t expect the ‘job creators’ or upper-middle class (or…the wealthy) to have to ever think about paying a little more.

     And revenue enhancements? Nonsense. Lets just take a chainsaw to the social safety net.

     That’ll show the poor how poor they REALLY can be.

     If he really (Rauner) had the virility, he should have gone through line by line on his cuts. He just wanted campaign and donor lines for future speeches.

     Comment by How Ironic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:20 pm

194. Let’s remember Bruce Rauner’s background. Mass firings and lockouts are definitely in his repertoire. In the context of union contract negotiations, these could be real threats to force Tier 1 employees into Tier 2.

     Comment by David Starrett Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:21 pm

195. The US Federal Government is the monopoly issuer of dollars, and thus has no functional constraint on its ability to spend money to move real resources around the economy to achieve full output and employment. The F

     Comment by jwmaurora Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:21 pm

196. Should have been ‘hole’. Sorry.

     Comment by How Ironic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:21 pm

197. austerity and sequestration are hurting this country and people must wake up

     Comment by jwmaurora Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:24 pm

198. RNUG–Wouldn’t having the retiree pay healthcare costs contravene Kanerva v. Weems?

     Comment by redeft Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:27 pm

199. the present value of the “world renowned” Doctor’s pension is over 9 million dollars

     The fact someone can defend this and every other retiree who has a million dollar pension says alot about the greed of these privileged public servants.

     Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:32 pm

200. Rauner is a puppet for Pete Peterson

     Comment by jwmaurora Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:32 pm

201. Helpful - yes and more pro-business climate than Iowa too. Though being 31st isn’t exactly a selling point. It’s not just taxes. It’s too many units of government, its a disinvestment in the ports, rail, mass transit, education and road infrastructure that could be our key advantages. It’s no plan to attract industries that are fresh water dependent…. Our economic plan seems to have consisted of throwing tax breaks at any large employer who threatens to leave.

     Personally, I’d be willing to have a CA type solution where there is a temporary tax dedicated to paying off the outstanding bills. Though politically we were sold that approach with the temporary income tax and it’s going to be a tough sell.

     Comment by Midway Gardens Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:33 pm

202. - redeft -

     Kanerva only convered the 20 year retiree, not their dependents. It also didn’t specify what level of health insurance had to be provided.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:33 pm

203. We finally have a leader that is willing to have an adult conversation with the citizens of this state. We’re out of money, we can’t tax ourselves out of this hole, and painful cuts need to and will be made.

     Comment by econ prof Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:35 pm

204. - redeft -

     Darn typos when I type tooo fast …

     Kanerva only covered the “premium free” 20 year retiree, not their dependents. It also didn’t specify what level of health insurance had to be provided in terms of co-pays and deductibles.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:35 pm

205. == we were sold that approach with the temporary income tax ==

     Yes, and only 1/2 of the entire plan was passed and implemented. If they are going to try it again, the whole thing needs to be in just one bill.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:36 pm

206. the reason we are out of money is because of the deficit hawks in Washington pushing sequestration and austerity most of the money is going to the wealthy

     Comment by jwmaurora Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:44 pm

207. I think it is cowardly that the Governor doesn’t own up to this intense level of cuts during his speech, but rather relies on his agency heads and department CFO’s to wear the cuts and have to answer questions at post budget address briefings. True leaders lead from the front and don’t hide behind their subordinates.

     Comment by Xavier Woods Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:48 pm

208. also we don’t make any thing in Illinois any more because of these free trade agreements and our trade deficits show a lot of US Dollars leaving this state and country, we need fair trade agreements and stop TPP

     Comment by jwmaurora Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:51 pm

209. What Illinois needs is US sovereign fiat currency to help the economy

     Comment by jwmaurora Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:57 pm

210. @Shoedoctor:

     the present value of the “world renowned” Doctor’s pension is over 9 million dollars

     “The fact someone can defend this and every other retiree who has a million dollar pension says alot about the greed of these privileged public servants.”

     Get.A.Clue. PV of the pension isn’t relevant unless he were able to take it out all at once.

     Secondly, would you prefer that the pension fund not have the balance? Do you know how compound interest works?

     Your logic is so faulty, it’s really not worth wasting time one.

     Go back under your rock. You’re embarrassing yourself.

     Comment by How Ironic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:06 pm

211. He needs a 50% cut in salary in order to share the common man’s pain. (I think it would be 50 cents).

     Comment by jt Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:10 pm

212. i would prefer we do not offer 11,000 people 6 figure pensions, I think most people get this. Just because this board which obviously has alot of state workers does not agree is no surprise. When you are over the target you can expect alot of people firing on you

     Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:13 pm

213. - Shoedoctor -

     Prefer all you want. The Constitution is going to have the final say.

     You could hold your breath until you turn blue…if you prefer.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:20 pm

214. Higher ed cuts add up to hundreds of millions, but the Monetary Award Program (MAP Grant) unchanged - proposal for FY16 is $373,254,500, if I’m reading the spreadsheet right.

     This is likely to be wiped out from the student / family perspective if Illinois public universities raise tuition to cover some of the cuts they are about to undergo. So are the real winners here private universities in IL, who still get some of the MAP money and see their relative tuition disadvantage to the U of I system shrink?

     Comment by ZC Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:21 pm

215. jwmaurora
     also we don’t make any thing in Illinois any more because of these free trade agreements and our trade deficits show a lot of US Dollars leaving this state and country

     Umm, do you realize Illinois exports over $8 billion in grain every year and $180 billion in food products. Most of this has improved due to the trade agreements. Talking points are old and not factual accurate.

     Comment by fly on the wall Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:23 pm

216. The problem with your fixation on this pension thing, Shoedoctor, is this: People like you love to extrapolate this information onto everyone who collects a pension. It is as ignorant as believing that if you work in an office for a private company you are the equivalent of Bill Gates or Warren Buffet , salary-wise. Would that be reasonable? If you’d like to be outraged at what you’re speaking of, go ahead. But you really do need to learn the facts about what average pension payments are by various groups. Of course, most on this site wouldn’t even bother to explain all this to you but you are just so annoying. Please educate yourself.

     Comment by AnonymousOne Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:23 pm

217. What does this matter the GA will push the budget through just like the last decade and no one will care it is full of wholes. Still remember a few budgets ago our agency had to prepare 450 layoff notices due to budget short fall and in the 11th hour the $$ was passed in a supplemental. That is why we are here today.

     Comment by fly on the wall Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:29 pm

218. “Get.A.Clue. PV of the pension isn’t relevant unless he were able to take it out all at once.”

     The ShoeDoc is trying to say that the retiree has a “virtual” safe investment that has a present value that while not real, will never be depleted and will provide a pension with an annual 3% increase for life. Relevancy depends on how contented one is with the amount of the pension.

     Comment by CapnCrunch Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:30 pm

219. - RNUG - Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 5:09 pm:

     RNUG — Should State employees start to look for new jobs?

     I respect you and all of your knowledge and am very scared about the future, please advise.

     Thanks

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:30 pm

220. Be outraged at the GA pensions. Not the common workers. GA gets paid a lot more and vests much faster. It will make you sick to look at some of them.

     Comment by fly on the wall Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:31 pm

221. Single-party rule is intrinsically corrupting. Self-righteousness is often a masquerade of self-interest. The “pension thing” is taking 255 of the revenues of the state and that is not enough. I have not said a word about the average retiree, just the lucky 11,000 who get 6 figures. Why don’t you try to address that? I never extrapolated anything to everyone who collects a pension. You are lying

     Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:32 pm

222. So, how long until 10 GOP state reps and 5 GOP state senators are willing to sign an affidavit allowing a Rauner recall petition to be circulated?

     At least this budget won’t be voted on within minutes of it being released, like has been done in years past. And hey, if Madigan and Cullerton don’t like Rauner’s budget, all they have to do is pass their own. So, maybe I spoke too soon and this year’s budget will be voted on within minutes of it being released by the Dem leaders.

     In any event, Rauner looks to be the best thing to happen for Illinois Democrats since George Ryan.

     Comment by Jeff Trigg Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:37 pm

223. A pension is not a gift than one’s social security is a gift from the federal government. It is earned by the worker and contributed to by that worker just like social security. Of course, some work more than others, apparently ( compared to GA “work”).

     Comment by AnonymousOne Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:38 pm

224. Meant ….a gift any more than one’s social security…

     Comment by AnonymousOne Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:39 pm

225. @- CapnCrunch - Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:30 pm:

     “The ShoeDoc is trying to say that the retiree has a “virtual” safe investment that has a present value that while not real, will never be depleted and will provide a pension with an annual 3% increase for life. Relevancy depends on how contented one is with the amount of the pension.”

     1. Let’s let ShoeDoc speak for themselves, because I don’t think either of us really know what they are talking about.

     2. If the pension obligation is large, it’s because the salary was large. If the job paid well, it makes sense the pension follows.

     All I hear is “too much, too much” w/out any factual evidence on the contrary. And the Gov is already suspect of cherry picking the data.

     If you have to fake it to make a point, it’s probably not worth making.

     @Shoedoc:

     “I have not said a word about the average retiree, just the lucky 11,000 who get 6 figures.”

     If they worked for the state, played by the rules, and earned the pension, who are you to retroactively claw it back? Why don’t you tell us where you work. We’ll give your employer a call, and suggest they drain YOUR retirement account, simply because we think ‘it’s too rich’.

     Comment by How Ironic Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:41 pm

226. comparing social security to a $400,000 pension

     talk about apples and oranges

     Comment by Shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:42 pm

227. Shoedoctor - the only people making a six figure pension are those that made a six figure salary. You can bet that’s not the guy emptying bedpans at the mental institution or the secretary typing letters. It’s former politicians and football and basketball coaches.

     Comment by Ugly Rumours Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:49 pm

228. Regarding the Governor’s budget address he did not mention that corporate tax breaks cost Illinois taxpayers billions of dollars and are a big cause of this state’s budget problems.

     Comment by Enviro Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:50 pm

229. - Shoedoctor -,

     It appears the pension system here, and joe pensions are earned in Illinois is lost on you.

     If this was easy, following the Constitution to change pensions as protected, it would have been done.

     Explain how you would change things. Otherwise your Raunerite Talking Points are tired and aren’t helping you, Rauner or leading to a solution.

     The only thing you haven’t said yet is “Get off my lawn!”

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:50 pm

230. What do I think? I hate to be “that guy” but I will. He keeps dropping the g’s one his gerunds. In an interview on Chicago Tonight from 2/20/13, available on YouTube, he has about 23 opportunities to drop a g. How many does he drop? Zero.

     He’s a big phony. Beware.

     Comment by The Drummer Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:51 pm

231. here is what I would do. Fire every employee and offer them their jobs back the next day with a 401 K retirement plan. That would end future $400,000 pensions. Everyone would keep what they have earned so far. I have not suggested anything that would raid what people have already earned. There are so many straw man arguments here I would hate to light a match

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:56 pm

232. That was me I used a different browser.

     Comment by shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 6:59 pm

233. - shoedoctor -,

     Hit the Google, there is a 6 month rule prohibiting that type of fire/hire…thingy

     Got something else?

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:01 pm

234. It a statutory “time out”

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:02 pm

235. Shoedoctor: At the risk of feeding a troll…

     Approximately 621,091 public pensions were being paid out by the various State of Illinois pension systems as of 2012.

     11,000 of those pensions offend you. (Those paying $100,000 or more)

     1.7% of the pensions paid.

     These pensioners you vilify were not run of the mill state employees. They were high salaried individuals whose earnings while working were similar to those of many C.E.O.’s (whose retirement packages seem not to offend you a bit).

     I wonder why that is?

     If both groups earned similar amounts, and “contributed” similar amounts over time for retirement income, why is one deserving and the other offensive?

     It is not like these “workers” didn’t earn that pension or pay substantial amounts into it.

     Perhaps the fact that they worked for the state bothers you?

     Comment by vttk17a1 Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:06 pm

236. == Should State employees start to look for new jobs? ==

     - Anonymous -

     Oh man, that is almost impossible to answer without knowing a bunch of somewhat personal information, so I’ll try to generalize a bit. It’s probably a bit pre-mature since the IL SC hasn’t weighed in on SB-1 yet. Also, it’s just one opinion and I most likely have different considerations / valuations than you do.

     If you are “Tier 1″ and close to retirement / rule of 85, just keep your head down and watch the court cases creep through the system.

     If you are “Tier 1″ with a significant number of years (20ish or more?) in, I would be tempted to ride it out. I don’t really expect the courts to allow any pension changes to existing employees, be they Tier 1 or Tier 2.

     If you are Tier 2 with only a few years, I might be looking around but not yet ready to jump. Part of that is because it’s going to depend on what really gets passed and part of that is some thoughts about if you do want to jump and a 401K or buyout option comes along, it might be to your advantage to take that deal, then jump.

     In between, it really depends. Do you have skills that are in high demand in the private sector? Are you working for government because you just like the money or because you think you can really make a difference by serving the citizen’s of this state?

     If you’re there more to serve the citizens and are Tier 1, again I would be tempted to ride it out.

     Some of the items you will have to ask yourself is what value do you place on the DB pension? How much do you like your current job? Do you have a particular reason for staying in your geographic location and how much is that worth? Basically, all the questions you would normally ask if you were looking at changing jobs. Everybody is going to come up with a different answer / valuation to those questions.

     In any case, you can most likely assume the next four years will be a roller coaster ride, with state employees being victims with no raises, increased health insurance costs, and other things of that nature … including the possibility of an extended lockout of most union employees as part of a heavyhanded approach to getting the kind of contract Rauner wants. I want to be wrong but I think the government unions here in Illinois are going to be tested like they never have before, and the individual members don’t have a clue what it will be like.

     —————

     Instead of the longwinded replay above, maybe I should have just quoted the cover of “The Hitchikers Guide to the Galaxy”: “Don’t Panic”

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:10 pm

237. shoedoctor, you can’t fire every employee with a state pension. I’m guessing, but it would probably be less than 5% of the people with state pensions who could be fired on a whim like that.

     I hear you about overly generous pensions being very bad optics to the general public, but you can only change the pension system for new hires in a very small minority of the jobs with state pensions. The pension bills will have to be paid over the next few decades, there is just no way to get around it.

     Comment by Jeff Trigg Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:11 pm

238. No one on this board has any suggestions to fix the problem. No one can tolerate any reduction in the state budget, there is only support for raising taxes

     Comment by shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:22 pm

239. how about no pay raises until they agree to a reduces pension benefit for future work?

     Comment by shoedoctor Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:25 pm

240. Jeff - “Bruce Rauner may be the best thing to happen to IL Dems since George Ryan” Agreed 100%.

     What none of the Raunerbots seem to realize is this they aren’t in Kansas anymore. Or Florida

     30 and 60. That’s the reality. And you ain’t startin out to strong either. Have all been votin’ who wish? Anyone wishin’ to vote?

     Mr. Clerk, start takin’ the record…

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:27 pm

241. == Fire every employee and offer them their jobs back the next day with a 401 K retirement plan. ==

     Can’t do it; violates the pension clause.

     If you’re going to comment, be informed first. To quote RIch, use the Google.

     At bare minimum, go read Eric Madiar’s Welshing document and I’ll give you that link:

     http://www.illinoissenatedemocrats.com/images/pensions/D/Pension%20Clause%20Article%20Final.pdf

     Read and understand those 77 pages … then come back and make an informed comment.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:27 pm

242. - shoedoctor -,

     Speaker Madigan stated he will work with the Governor, suggesting cuts with raising revenue.

     The discussions will focus on how rigid Rauner will be, how many votes Rauner can deliver, and what will it cost the Governor for, at the barest of minimums, 13 House Dem votes, and 10 Senate Dem votes.

     - shoedoctor -, governing is difficult.

     That’s why the discussion here and elsewhere is talking around the proposals here, because frankly, it’s really about what can get passed.

     So, when you decide to just list rote talkibg points versus the realities, you face scrutiny.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:28 pm

243. == how about no pay raises until they agree to a reduces pension benefit for future work? ==

     Nope, already been tried and ruled unconstitutional.

     You don’t have a clue. Go read Madiar’s paper before you come back with any more inane stuff.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:29 pm

244. Rowdy Yates: “It is a hard thing for a doctor or paramedic to tell a patient that they are bleeding to death and that unless an arm or leg is amputated,the patient is assured of a slow but certain death. This was Rauner’s ‘Olgilvey Moment’.”

     It’s not an arm or leg that Rauner is planning to chop off, instead he’s going to try and ’save’ the patient by chopping off his head. And besides, the arms and legs of this patient have been chopped off already during previous administrations.

     And why is it always the poor, the elderly, and the disabled who are first in line to receive this harsh medicine, while guys like Rauner continue to ride high on the hog? We DO have growing divide between the rich and poor in the US (including Illinois), and it is the rich and big business who are NOT paying their fare share of the taxes, hence the chronic budget deficits.

     Comment by Ultimata Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:30 pm

245. I don’t always make speeches, but when I do, I speak many words and say very little….

     Comment by illinois fan Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:30 pm

246. - low level -,

     Hopefully, the realities of “30″ and “60″ will leas to a real pause of what needs to be done, and what can get done.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:32 pm

247. Shoedoctor at 6:42

     Comparing apples and oranges==

     We now are dealing with your reading context problem too? THe point of my post BEING: retirement programs funded by employees being “gifts”. Figure it out.

     Comment by AnonymousOne Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:37 pm

248. - shoedoctor - Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:25 pm:

     You must be Rauner

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:37 pm

249. == No one on this board has any suggestions to fix the problem. ==

     You want suggestions on fixing the pension system and the overall budget problems?

     Go read the last sevral years of Rich’s blog here. All of us regulars with both budget knowledge and understanding of how the systens work have made many constructive and legal suggestions.

     The problem is most of those solutions are not politically palatal to the people who can enact the necessary legislation.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:38 pm

250. fly on the wall you are wrong the US does not have a trade surplus it had a trade deficit of 505 billion in 2014 http://www.bea.gov/newsreleases/international/trade/tradnewsrelease.htm

     Comment by jwmaurora Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:38 pm

251. our trade deficit is a half of trillion dollars leaving this country in 2014 alone, no wonder Illinois is broke

     Comment by jwmaurora Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:40 pm

252. Ultimata, I couldn’t agree more. This State is long overdue for a scalable income tax. The poor pay more of their income out as taxes, be it sales, gas, property, etc. than the wealthy when looked at as a percentage of their income.

     Comment by Ugly Rumours Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:41 pm

253. I sure hope so, OW. Otherwise, they’ll be meetin’ through Halloween and the state’s credit rating will go down even further citing lack of confidence that a solution will be agreed to by the executive and legislative branches.

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:42 pm

254. - RNUG -, well done.

     You are too modest; many of the pension discussions here are constructive because of you, your expertise, and your “Crew” of - AA - and - steve schnorf -, just to name two, that drill into what CAN be done.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:42 pm

255. “Mass transit doesn’t make money. Period. If you don’t subsidize it, it collapses.”

     All forms of transportation in the US and Illinois are heavily subsidized by local, state, and Federal tax dollars, not just mass transit. And yes, that includes roadways for motor vehicles.

     Comment by Ultimata Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:44 pm

256. All I can say is you sure don’t hear about Colorado’s pension problems.

     Comment by Ugly Rumours Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 7:54 pm

257. Can the IL Sct put the pension system into receivership and give Ralph Martire the authority to administer it? Only 50% snark…

     Comment by Toffee Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:05 pm

258. 100% Reality - The state cannot declare bankruptcy. That includes the pension. Paying back the money used to keep Illinois income taxes artificially low at 3% for decades is the only legal, and might I say, moral thing to do. /0% snark

     Comment by PublicServant Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:09 pm

259. “No solutions on this board…”

     There seem to be a lot of new commentators recently…
     (Not that it’s bad, by all means - Rich may make 300 comments on this one.)

     I just remember some time ago the “lots of new commentators” charge when the issue was state workers or pensions maybe? Was it in regard to SB1?

     Anyway, the insinuation was that there was some left wing effort to get people to post - like something nefarious was afoot.

     I’m staring to wonder about these new Raunerbots…
     Most seem only capable of reciting Grover Norquist talking points without serious discussion.

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:13 pm

260. - Oswego Willy -

     I’m going to assume that was for the Douglas Adams reference …

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:14 pm

261. Ultimata, the Illinois State Toll Highway Authority is completely self-sustaining, or about as close to it as you can get. Until recently, interstate highways were paid for almost exclusively by user funds generated by motor fuel taxes, but the last several years have seen bailouts by fund transfers into the federal highway trust fund. Local roads and streets are more heavily subsidized by property taxes.

     Comment by Six Degrees of Separation Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:19 pm

262. PublicServant - But they could start allowing units of government below the state level to declare bankruptcy in Illinois, and start making those units of government pay the full pension contribution amounts. Legal, if not very moral.

     Its also not very moral for Illinois to tax our working poor at the 2nd highest rate in the US behind only Washington, so you can’t count on the GA ever having decent morals.

     Comment by Jeff Trigg Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:20 pm

263. ” Raurnerbots” are not a minority

     He won by a significant margin

     They are also not trolls they are the majority in Illinois

     The truth hurts

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:41 pm

264. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:41 pm:

     ” Raurnerbots” are not a minority

     He won by a significant margin

     They are also not trolls they are the majority in Illinois

     You are wrong. People voting for him doesn’t mean that they are like you

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:44 pm

265. @Bluefish 3:31 pm: NO

     Comment by Soccertease Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:48 pm

266. “- Anonymous -”

     Hit the Search key as to what a Troll is, then read back the Raunerbot Talking Points.

     And…only Raunerbots can claim to be both a majority and a victim. Good Luck with that here.

     -RNUG -,

     I missed it, but let me clarify my personal intent;

     You speak on Pensions, I know better. I need as much knowledge as possible, so I won’t be looking for the Readers’ Digest version. Much respect. Share. Please.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:49 pm

267. Who said I was a victim you are a clown Willy

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:52 pm

268. It looks like we made it all the way to 8pm before someone mentioned bankruptcy. That could be some kind of record.

     Comment by dupage dan Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:56 pm

269. “- Anonymous -”

     You did. Reading hurts.

     Also, I wouldn’t call me a clown, maybe a Street Performer, a mime that speaks, a corner crooner, but clown? You can do better than clown.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 8:56 pm

270. I am deeply comforted…

     Comment by Black Ivy Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:03 pm

271. “Raunerbot” doesn’t refer to Rauner voters, but to a small number of hyperactive partisans who can’t engage here in any meaningful or informed way on issues beyond shallow pre-approved themes or talking points.

     Comment by Wordslinger Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:05 pm

272. - Oswego Willy -

     I’m willing to share what I know … but most of it can be found in a bunch of documents from the State and others … and there is a lot I don’t know about some of the non-SERS systems but I know where to look it up. I also share what I guess in most, but not all, cases. If nothing else, I’ve really learned to quickly read the Annual Pension Fund reports for the relevant data.

     FWIW … I actually started reading seriously about the pensions in the early 1980’s.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:08 pm

273. Why is the number of years never considered with pension reform? If you did a comparison on the top pension benefits I bet the number of years in state government is 15 years and under. The loyal state workers that work for 30 years for their pensions are not collecting big retirements. If the number of years was raised to a minimum of 20 years of service before any payout/benefit, the cost savings would be huge and resolve the problem.The politicians are just worried about their short timer buddies with high salaries.

     Comment by hardworker Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:21 pm

274. Adding to my 7:15 PM comment about staying / going …

     If one where to decide to leave, speaking generally, I would advise anyone with “Tier 1″ SERS pension credit to just leave it sitting in the applicable State pension fund. If you take it out, you only get your contributions back which is pretty much a losing deal … and if you don’t roll it over properly, you will have to pay taxes / penalities on it. Leaving it, it’s a future DB pension and you will always be entitled to claim it at the appropriate age / time. Plus, under the current rules, if you ever came back to the State you would be placed back under the “Tier 1″ plan.

     If you do leave and have a 457 Deferred Compensation plan, I’d still suggest leaving it because of the flexibility when compared to a 401K. You would have the option of taking it out penalty free at any age if you no longer work for a government entity; you will have to pay normal taxes since the money went in pre-tax.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:24 pm

275. “Won by a significant margin”.

     Really? Against Quinn who had the lowest ratings in the country, and after spending $70,000,000, in a GOP wave year, that was a “significant margain?”

     Of all the Raunerbots we’ve had, you are truly a fool. Rauner is going to have to do better if he wants effective Raunerbots.

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:28 pm

276. The percentage raises by how many years you have in service. You sound like a troll.

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:29 pm

277. btw- are you the new state rep in the 95th district?
     Krusty? You not only sound new you sound young.

     Have any solutions to offer that aren’t straight out of Grover Norquist? Do you even know who that is?

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:33 pm

278. I hear you Econ Prof. You’ve deduced that 1) people who
     work for the government should basically work for free and 2) they don’t pay taxes.

     The constant references to the “taxpayers” are nice politics but not based in reality, the notion that somehow govt workers are “moochers” a la Ayn Rand.

     Comment by low level Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:38 pm

279. == Why is the number of years never considered with pension reform? ==

     Actually, I believe (without looking it up yet again) the Joliet police case ruled against changing factors like number of years.

     As you note, there are different rules for the different systems. We can bemoan the political pensions but they do have to contribute at a higher rate.

     As far as service distribution goes, you can find that in the annual reports. For people retiring under SERS in 2014, the average service credit was around 26 years and the alternative formula (police, firefighters, etc.) who retire earlier were included. Exclude that group, and the average service time for for employees retiring in 2014 under SERS was about 28.5 years.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:44 pm

280. With the mention of bankruptcy I have to wonder how far HB0298 and SB0072 will go. Especially with the announcement of cuts to local government.

     Comment by Minnow Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:48 pm

281. Blago II

     Comment by Rauner Wronger Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:50 pm

282. What has Grover Norquist offered about Illinois recently? What makes him relevant?

     I don’t know about that new rep in the 95th, but I gotta believe she’ll be better than the old one in the 10th.

     Comment by Jeff Trigg Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:52 pm

283. low level - Let’s make it simple…..If you work 10 years as a crony for $133,000 a year and at the current retirement percentages you would make a pension of $30K. It would take an average state worker 30 years to make the same pension. If you eliminate pensions of cronies for 10 years you would save $30K times thousands of people. Add it up low level. Simple math.

     Comment by hardworker Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:55 pm

284. 22,211 not 30,000

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 10:04 pm

285. jwmaurora

     Please learn to read. I was very specific. These are exports FROM ILLINOIS. We are one of the top 3 states in agriculture exports. Have you looked around the state at all that farmland you see from the highway. It is very valuable one of the best assets of this state.

     Comment by Fly On the Wall Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 10:04 pm

286. - hardworker - Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 9:55 pm:

     22,211 not 30,000

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 10:05 pm

287. 1) Tax payers need to pay more. For too many years they have under paid and the proposed budget continues that trend.
     2) The employees in the ‘old’ plan (defined benefits plan) will avoid the proposed defined contributons pland in large numbers. The proposed change will probably save much less than you hope.
     3) The people who receive state benefits, espically the poor, will be hard hit.
     4) Everyone of of the three major groups, tax payers, employees, and benefit recepitates, need to help pay for the solution to the pension issue.
     5) The budget plan, as presented, will not be approved by the GA for political reasons.

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 10:07 pm

288. I’m baffled by the comments regarding pension amounts. Regardless of the total it was a contractual agreement and if the parties involved make their contributions and the investments are managed the value grows. Blaming the employee for the state not living up to the contract by skipping contributions is absurd.

     Comment by relocated Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 10:12 pm

289. RNUG, That average time in active service is almost identical to TRS’s 28.5. Fairly consistent over the recent years IIRC.

     Comment by Arthur Andersen Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 10:36 pm

290. I drop the “g”, too. But, that is because the word is nothing - thus one less letter. Folks, let’s recall President Clinton’s explanation at the 2012 Democratic convention regarding how he balanced the Federal budget after President Bush’s term. Math. ’nuff said.

     Comment by Nothin's easy... Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 10:50 pm

291. - Arthur Andersen -

     Thanks. Yeah, it looked pretty consistent for SERS also.

     Comment by RNUG Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 10:56 pm

292. 4) Everyone of of the three major groups, tax payers, employees, and benefit recepitates, need to help pay for the solution to the pension issue.

     But since employees and retirees are themselves taxpayers, you are collecting twice from them. Not sure why they should have to share more, sacrifice more than every other taxpayer.

     Comment by Anonymous Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 11:16 pm

293. One of those 11,000 pensions was Judy Baar Topinka.

     Comment by Yellow Dog Democrat Wednesday, Feb 18, 15 @ 11:44 pm

294. 6 degrees of separation: The vast road network in Illinois and the nation is only partially funded by ‘user fees’ (tolls, gasoline taxes, etc.). About 50% of its money comes from general revenue (income taxes, sales taxes, property taxes, excise taxes on alcohol & cigarettes, etc.). Generally, income from gasoline taxes & other user fees have not kept pace with the rising costs of maintaining this network of roads, bridges, and related infrastructure. In particular, many bridges and overpasses are in serious need of repair in Illinois and elsewhere (the problem of deferred maintenance). Thus, the role of general revenue in maintaining this transportation system has been steadily increasing. The Federal government hasn’t increased its excise tax on gasoline in nearly 20 years. The situation is similar for air travel and other travel systems. Also, it should be kept in mind that most people (or their employers) using mass transit DO pay user fares by the ride or by using passes that are valid for limited periods of time. Then there is the matter of ‘externalities’ or the indirect costs of maintaining this road system, which I don’t wish to discuss here because of its complexity.

     general comment: Rauner’s speech was pretty much what I expected coming from a Republican governor in this day and age. Compared to the past, the Republican party has shifted far to the right. Basically, his speech boils down to this: 1) keep taxing the poor and take away what is left of their declining benefits, and 2) give more tax-breaks and subsidies to the rich. As for the middle-class, their numbers have been dwindling and they won’t be around that much longer if people don’t wake up.

     Comment by Ultimata Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 12:16 am

295. Dave, I’m afraid you won’t like what I have to say. Sorry I’m so late in my comment, but I just got back from Chicago.

     The cuts in this budget are going to be painful for many people, and that’s a shame. But this budget is the direct descendant, the outgrowth, of the budget Rod Blagojevich needed to propose 12 years ago but didn’t.

     12 years ago the cuts wouldn’t have had to be so drastic: painful still, but not nearly as drastic as they have to be now, as the problem was left to fester for 12 years.

     Governor Rauner’s budget shows us how much we can afford to spend based on our revenues. You might argue that he should have cut less here, more there, none here, but none of us can argue that the spending bottom line can increase based on our current revenues. That math doesn’t work, never has.

     Someone has needed to tell us this for a long time (and in fairness, some have, but not Governors) as we have been deluding ourselves, or allowing others to delude us. At the very bottom line, this is the amount of government programs and services we can currently afford. It isn’t pretty, but this chicken has been trying to come home and roost for a long time now, and now it’s here.

     Governors propose, legislatures dispose, and now that process begins. I doubt very much that this particular Governor intends to walk away from the basic precepts this proposed budget is based on, but if you look at his background I can’t help but believe he knows how to negotiate, and you don’t ever start out bidding against yourself. We’ll see. won’t we?

     Comment by steve schnorf Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 12:47 am

296. Hard worker - I understand! Hence my nick / low level bureaucrat. I agree, but Rauner keeps appointing cronies, record top level administration salaries.

     Jeff - Norquist said he wanted to “shrink government so far it went down the waste pipe” The Raunerbot comments all seem to be along the same theme

     Comment by low level Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 5:40 am

297. P.S. Your understanding of pensions is way off - but thank
     you for agreeing about cronies. Rauner sure is leading by example there. Every day there’s another GOP hack he’s hiring as an Assistant to the Deputy to the Secretary.

     Comment by low level Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 5:47 am

298. As far as a I can tell most of the heavy lifting here in cuts is a hope and a prayer on benefit changes: $2.2 billion on pensions, another unspecified $700 million on group healthcare.

     That $2.9 billion in FY16 savings doesn’t exist. If you coulda, you woulda, long ago. Banking it as current savings is flim-flam. Even if this proposal was passed as-is, fhe proposal would go to court, where it’s prospects are highly doubtful.

     This thing is nowhere-near soup as a proposed balanced budget.

     I’m guessing on some sorts of new revenues so everyone can claim victory, plus to fund a new capitol program.

     Comment by Wordslinger Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 8:10 am

299. It should also be noted that despite much campaign talk of a “bureaucracy run amok” the proposed budget increases state employee head count, including 140 at CMS, as AA pointed out earlier.

     As to all that “mismanagement” that’s been going on, the proposal banks just $200 million in “operational efficiencies,” representing one half of one percent of GRF spending.

     Comment by Wordslinger Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 8:29 am

300. == increases state employee head count, including 140 at CMS ==

     Got to have somebody to run and review all those measurement metrics Rauner wants to use.

     Should be interesting to see how that goes. I remember one instance where there was so much documentation to measure things that the headcount had to double in order to do the same work and fill out all the online measurement forms.

     Comment by RNUG Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 8:57 am

301. Judy Baar Topinka waived her pension

     A good example for all the senior people

     Comment by Anonymous Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 9:21 am

302. - RNUG -

     ===Instead of the longwinded replay above, maybe I should have just quoted the cover of “The Hitchikers Guide to the Galaxy”: “Don’t Panic”.===

     I got ya now, I must’ve missed it.

     Like I said, you give me the Annotative, not the Readers’ Digest, please. Much respect.

     Comment by Oswego Willy Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 9:22 am

303. Demonize public employees for two years them expect them to bargain in good faith to destroy their pension. ..lol. good luck on that

     Comment by foster brooks Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 9:24 am

304. Thanks, Mr. Schnorf - right on the money

     Rauner is not going to offer up any new revenue until he forces the issue on cuts, and it is taken seriously, unlike the fake budgets of the last 12 years. This one has some fake to it as well, but it is just the initial “offer” from the governor, and like Steve says, he aint bidding against himself. Up to MJM and JC to make the next move, but I think there will be very little movement by the Gov without a lot of movement by the GA on real cuts. If they give in on changing the way things work in this state on the spending end, I have a strong feeling there will be an allowance for more revenue in some fashion by the Gov.

     Comment by Kodachrome Thursday, Feb 19, 15 @ 11:59 am

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