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* I have to be in Chicago for an early dinner tonight ahead of my City Club gig tomorrow. So, I need to leave fairly soon.
Expect regular blogging tomorrow morning, and then light to non-existent blogging tomorrow afternoon.
So, consider this an open thread.
Have fun, but do your best to behave. Thanks!
posted by Rich Miller
Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:09 pm
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Previous Post: Credit Unions Giving Back
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So Cardinals fans, how ’bout them Cubbies?
Not only did we pants you in the playoffs, we just stole two of your better players. And Heyward took less money to play in Chicago than to stay in St. Louis.
As Nelson Muntz would say: Ha ha!
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:14 pm
Cubs need a catcher and another arm, an arm to eat innings.
You trade Soler or Schwarber, if you has to choose?
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:16 pm
Merry Christmas! Safe travels and a belly full,of delicious holiday food!!!
Comment by cdog Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:18 pm
An interesting new article about Anita and the prosecution of police officers:
http://www.salon.com/2015/12/15/disturbing_new_twist_in_chicagos_police_crisis_embattled_states_attorney_refused_to_prosecute_cops_who_admitted_to_perjury_obstruction_of_justice/
Comment by Keyrock Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:20 pm
Who is going to emerge from the Republican Presidential field? My money is on Rubio.
Comment by Stones Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:20 pm
The Cardinals have done more with less while the Cubs have spent a lot of money in the past and regretted it later. A little early to be crowing, no wait, it’s been over 100 years. Remember your mantra, loveable losers.
Comment by pool boy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:23 pm
People can vote on the name of the Shedd Aquarium’s newest male Pacific white-sided dolphin calf. The choices are Makoa (Ma-ko-ah), which means “fearless”, or Kolohe (Ko-low-hey), which means “rascal”.
As we’ve learned recently, Illinois is already home to “the most persistent rascal on the planet,” so I encourage everyone to cast a ballot for “Makoa.”
http://www.sheddaquarium.org/NameTheDolphin/
– MrJM
Comment by @MisterJayEm Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:25 pm
This just in: Theo Epstein, St. Louis Man of the Year.
Willie, Baby Ruth ain’t going anywhere. He Russell and Bryant are The New Untouchables. All that value, all rookie contracts.
It’s not a sure thing Soler will be traded, either, now that Castro’s gone.
Soler signed a very owner-friendly contract in 2012 — $30 million through 2020.
Comment by wordslinger Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:29 pm
Ya gotta love it when Cub fans puff their chest out and say Heyward accepted less money from the Cubs. The Cubs offered 2 opt outs, the first in three years. Cubs will pay JH $23 mil a year, Cards offer was $20 mil a year.
Does anybody think Heyward will be with the Cubs for 8 years or would have been with the Cardinals for 10 years?
Should be a real battle this year.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:34 pm
There’s no doubt the core is young and owner-friendly with the contracts..
With Baez and Russel, Soler seems to be, maybe not expendable, at least worth seeing if a AA arm is out there, even if the arm is a September 1st call up.
I “like” Schwarber, but his raw talent, he needs to show some improvement because he hasn’t proven to be a “utility” type player.
Man, the Cubs are loaded on paper.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:36 pm
- @MisterJayEm -
If there’s one thing this blog has proven, it has some juice to move numbers.
Voted Makoa. OW
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:39 pm
Wait for the first time Lackey is on the mound in a close game and a fly ball hits Schwarber in the noggin, allowing 3 runs to score. That scene will be priceless.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:41 pm
When Rich is away, it’s become a Cubs/Cards site. Allow me to break this trend…whatda think of the Sox trade to get Brett Lawrie?
Comment by Bogey Golfer Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:45 pm
I’m already seeing those “Magical Cubs” shirts. You know, the ones that, most years, magically disappear around the All Star Break.
Comment by Gruntled University Employee Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:46 pm
I fine with trading Soler for another pitcher. Not a big fan of the Zobrist deal for this same reason; another hitter, but still only have three legit starters. Watching the Cards fans burn their Heyward jerseys has been entertaining!!
Comment by L.A. Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:49 pm
Cubs got a good player in Heyward and a good guy. Cards will probably go after Gordon, who has stats very similar to Heyward.
I wouldn’t clear the dust out of that very small trophy case just yet Cubbie fans.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:54 pm
Any Springfield people know if anything is going where 2 Brothers used to be?
Comment by LizPhairTax Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:58 pm
Thanks for the tip, @MisterJayEm, I was not aware of the naming contest. I also voted Makoa.
Comment by cover Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 1:58 pm
Is it just me or has there been a noticeable absence of Oscar lately on the blog? It would really be nice to get a little more Oscar this time of the year.
Comment by frisbee Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:01 pm
Does anyone think anyone would support/understand university presidents pulling the plug on the spring semester, either in January or mid-to-late spring? It would be a tough coalition to keep together since their missions and publics differ so much, but their history has always been to say to politicians, “Thank you, sir, may I have another” as they bleed out from a thousand cuts.
Comment by scholar athlete Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:02 pm
LPT, the 2 Brothers building sold not too long ago so I’m guessing there’s gonna be someone new in there but haven’t heard who yet.
Comment by 35/Shields Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:02 pm
Thanks 35/Shields. Hopefully they put in more mirrors and make it narrower.
Comment by LizPhairTax Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:04 pm
Uh oh, I should have read posts before posting. My bad. In the immortal words of Roseanne Roseanroseadanna, “Never mind.” I feel like the dimwit who crashed the party. Sorry, guys.
;-)
Comment by scholar athlete Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:05 pm
LPT, I’m hoping there’s a student of interior design out there who can make that happen!
Comment by 35/Shields Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:11 pm
I heard that whoever bought it is going to open it back up as 2 Brothers….again….
Comment by L.A. Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:11 pm
What always scares me about the Cards, and why I respect the franchise when it comes to their 40-man roster is that if they need to pull from that 40-man, and bring a guy up, short or long term, they produce.
They’re like the Patriots;
“Who are these guys?”
The Cubs, I hope, get a solid 40-man, and keep the core bug league club together and continue develop players that people ask “who IS that?”
Nothing is ever guaranteed.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:13 pm
You have to love Cubs fans, you would think they won something last year, or last century.
Comment by Give Me A Break Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:14 pm
Cardinals have been smarter than Cubs for a long time. Remember Lou Brock. Not crazy about Zorbist either.
I not sure who got the best it these signing - Is it addition by subtraction or ?
Have not hear a Rahm resign story today. Well there is a real debate tonight.
Comment by Cannon649 Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:15 pm
L.A.,
Sweet. That 2 Brothers, Vacant Lot, Marian Center stretch of Monroe is a fascinating microeconomy.
Comment by LizPhairTax Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:25 pm
–I not sure who got the best it these signing - Is it addition by subtraction or ?–
On what planet is losing Heyward “addition by subtraction?”
I was amazed the Braves let him go to the Cards. He’s going to be a monster for the next 10 years, a true five-tool-player.
To get one of those at 26 for just money, without having to give up prospects, is a GMs dream.
Comment by wordslinger Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:28 pm
@scholar athlete - Please get your Gilda Radner character correct!!!! Emily Latella said “Never mind.” Roseanne Roseanadana coined the phrase “It just goes to show - it’s always somethin’. If it’s not one thing it’s another”.
Comment by Bogey Golfer Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:30 pm
5 tool player includes home runs. He had 13 last year.
Having said that, Cub fans will really enjoy watching him play. He will save some runs and is a real quality clubhouse guy. You didn’t give up players but you will give up about $52 mil a year for Lackey, Zobrist and Heyward.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:35 pm
For realistic in depth Cardinals discussion, please feel free to check out the #bestfansstlouis Twitter feed from last week!
Comment by Lester Holt's Mustache Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:43 pm
–5 tool player includes home runs. He had 13 last year.–
He had 27 his last year in Atlanta. I like my chances with the Wrigley power alleys.
Comment by wordslinger Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:48 pm
“And Heyward took less money to play in Chicago” See? Rauner is already driving down wages in Illinois!
Comment by Skeptic Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:51 pm
- He had 27 his last year in Atlanta. -
He had 11 HRs his last year in Atlanta.
Comment by Birdseed Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:53 pm
Here are JHey’s homer totals through the years—18, 14, 27, 14, 11, 13
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:56 pm
Give Rauner credit, he must have help recruit Heyward to Chicago so he would earn $23 mil in Illinois.
For those keeping score at home, $23 mil > $20 mil.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:58 pm
Excuse me, 27 in 2012 in Atlanta.
I still like my chances at Wrigley.
I’m pretty sure the Cards wanted to sign him.
Comment by wordslinger Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 2:59 pm
Disappointed to read about the violence that took place near Wrigley Field this weekend. A few more of those incidents and could really start to impact tourism to the area. Frightening to think if that would have occurred during the summer
Comment by Tie Your Shoes Kyle Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:01 pm
Word, Cardinals definitely wanted Heyward but not at $23 mil a year with an opt out in 3 years. They don’t do business like that.
What happened around Wrigley this past weekend?
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:04 pm
Rich is gone..lets cuss!
Comment by Empty Suit Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:04 pm
The very last thing you want to do is find out later you’re banned.
Cards Fans,
Heyward isn’t Pujos, when Albert left. Heyward can play out his 5 years before the “option” he has, and okay at a high level. Heyward is in his prime, not on his decline.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:10 pm
First opt out is after 3 years, not 5.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:14 pm
Even better, 3.
Opt outs work both ways, no matter who holds the option.
See, “Rose, Derrick” on the pitfalls of long-term guarantees.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:16 pm
Afternoon smile:)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Qdiqf8UNbs
Comment by Anonymous Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:18 pm
- Heyward is in his prime, not on his decline. -
That’s the point. He’s in his prime, but doesn’t hit for power, doesn’t hit for average, and doesn’t drive in a ton of runs. He plays good defense - for a right fielder.
Comment by Birdseed Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:18 pm
Afternoon smile:)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Qdiqf8UNbs
Comment by Anon221 Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:19 pm
Willy, if Heyward is doing really well in 3 years, he will break the bank. Cubs will have to pony up 30-35 mil a year or risk losing him.
And, so you understand the opt out, everything is in Heyward’s favor. If he is playing just so-so, guess what—He will choose to stay and collect $23 mil a year.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:26 pm
=== - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:16 pm:
Even better, 3.
Opt outs work both ways, no matter who holds the option.
See, “Rose, Derrick” on the pitfalls of long-term guarantees. ===
I don’t think you understand Heyward’s contract. It’s guaranteed all right - to be the floor of his compensation.
Comment by Birdseed Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:26 pm
I understand. Understand completely;
For 3 years, Heyward is in Chicago with the Cubs best chance to win in decades over those three years!
The future, especially in baseball, isn’t guaranteed.
It’s a great deal for both. Love it.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:29 pm
“Rich is gone..lets cuss!”
Better yet, let use the phrases and words that shall not be spoken. We are the Knights that shall say Ni.
Comment by Give Me A Break Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:30 pm
The Cubs have him locked up for three years, bottom line. Their new TV deal is supposed to kick-in within three years, giving them a lot more money to spend on payroll. The new stadium improvements will be done by then too, generating more revenue at a time when long-term deals for Bryant, Schwarber, Russell, maybe Baez, etc., will come due. They might re-sign Arrieta to a long-term deal too.
However you want to spin the Heyward deal, it really doesn’t matter as long as his production doesn’t drop off. He’s a big improvement for the Cubs.
And judging by all of the squealing and sour grapes, it’s a big loss for St. Louis.
Comment by 47th Ward Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:33 pm
Please let Force Awakens be good, please! If it’s bad, I don’t know that I can handle it again! I can’t watch any of the prequels, too painful.
Comment by L.A. Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:36 pm
Serious question:
How does Rauners union busting affect pro athlete’s and actor’s unions? If it doesn’t, why?
Comment by Tuesday's Pizza Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:40 pm
“And judging by all of the squealing and sour grapes, it’s a big loss for St. Louis.”
For a lot of us Cards fans we are frustrated that “Mo” didn’t pull off keeping him. In any event, we will go back to waiting for the Cubs to beat the Mets, or for that matter, beat anyone when something other than a divisional series is on the line.
Comment by Give Me A Break Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:41 pm
–What happened around Wrigley this past weekend?–
LOL, dude, you sure are a sore loser.
If you’re worried about crime at the old ballpark, I guess you better not take a look around your surroundings the next time you’re at Busch.
The #1 murder-rate city in country is just across the river from the stadium. St. Louis proper is #12.
Chicago, despite what you hear from the hysterical Chicago media, isn’t in the Top 30.
You’re worried about Wrigleyville? Crain’s reported a few weeks ago more than $1 billion in private construction going on right now in Lakeview.
I guess they’re not worried. Lot of residential going up around Busch?
http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/top-lists/highest-murder-rate-cities/
Comment by wordslinger Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:44 pm
47th, you think they can sign all those guys to long term deals??? LOL
No sour grapes from this guy, Cubs got a good player. Theo is making the push to win now. Better hope Rizzo doesn’t dive into a fastball or Schwarber lets a sky high fly ball nail him or Arrieta gets hurt.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:44 pm
Geez Word, I just asked the question posed by a poster because I had not heard anything. Lighten up dude, I’ll just Google it.
I know things are not great in STL. But, you may want to see a counselor for your temper. Sheesh.
Comment by anon Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:47 pm
Just got back on and found out this was a Cards - Cubs discussion. Let me collect my thoughts and I may be back.
Comment by illini Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:49 pm
Epicure
The cigar in the old Meters Brothers Department is closing 12-31-15….way to shake it up SuperStars
Comment by Anonin' Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:51 pm
On reflection - I will sit back and enjoy this conversation. Please continue.
Comment by illini Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 3:55 pm
Maybe the Bears should trade Robbie Gould for a starting pitcher.
Comment by Skeptic Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 4:10 pm
Happy Holidays, Rich and all who post regularly on this blog. I cannot begin to express how much I learn and continue to learn from your expertise and opinions!
Also, happy holidays and a pat on the head to Oscar, the wonder dog!
Comment by G'Kar Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 4:32 pm
Considering who the Cardinals had to play without last year I think next year should be a breeze!
Comment by WhoKnew Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 4:55 pm
Heyward is a big deal, a great signing by the Cubs.
And their lineup looks sick; a lot of HR potential, a lot of good line drive hitters as well.
Stud SP and SP depth. And they still could move Soler or Baez for an arm.
Maybe as many as 1 in 4 Cub fans at the state’s biggest beer garden will watch the action on the field this year?
Comment by Robert the Bruce Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 5:06 pm
If the Cubs do meet all the forecasted success, how long will the White Sox stay in Chicago?
Comment by Robert the Bruce Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 5:07 pm
http://www.strosechronicle.com/fresh/political-corruption-museum-coming-to-albany/
just when you think that Illinois has cornered the market on something….
Comment by Amalia Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 5:08 pm
YouTtube about OODA loops– enjoy!
https://youtu.be/D1F5g8SFO4s
Comment by Anon12 Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 5:28 pm
By the way Willy - your fake Facebook page finally went down Friday afternoon. Yet when I checked Friday morning I think you had 70 Friends. Thanks to everyone that helped to get it taken down.
Comment by illini Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 5:31 pm
- illini -
Yeah, I saw later it had vanished.
I was waitin’ to thank everyone again during The Wordslinger Commenter Golden Horseshoe Awards.
To all the commenters, vigilant in helping to take down the Facebook page, my heartfelt thanks.
It’s truly special what Rich has built, the blog, and the community. This was just another example how great this place is, and how special this blog Rich built is, and the community that rallies around this place too.
It was humbling the support I got.
Thanks to all.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 5:46 pm
Pete Rose belongs in the Hall of Fame. It’s long overdue.
Comment by Wensicia Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 5:46 pm
Willy, I was disappointed though that you did not ask me to be a Friend!!!!!!
Makes no difference, I feel that I have made many anonymous Friends on this site.
Comment by illini Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 6:04 pm
We need an interpreter for Anonin’ again.
Comment by Miami Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 6:05 pm
- Illini -
Both the Fake OW and I apologize.
Since there wasn’t a Facebook page for “illini”, I’m sure we both just got confused, lol
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 6:08 pm
I, too, believe Pete Rose should be in the Hall of Fame, along with Shoeless Joe Jackson.
Here’s the only way I would be on board, however.
Bob Costas, and two people of his choosing, gets to write what should be on both plaques, and no one but those 3 could approve their work-product. No “input”, no “MLB drafts”, “Hall of Fame Agreement”, or Pete Rose or Joe Jackson family veto.
Then, I agree, both go in.
Comment by Oswego Willy Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 6:19 pm
I see Star Wars: The Force Awakens on Thursday evening Do we see Leaders Meeting: The Farce Continues that morning?
Comment by Jwscott72 Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 7:10 pm
“I, too, believe Pete Rose should be in the Hall of Fame, along with Shoeless Joe Jackson.”
I’m in favor of Rose in the Hall, but he should wait till after he dies to be enshrined..
Do you think Rose has a bet in with his rookie on the year he will finally be enshrined?
Comment by some random person Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 7:31 pm
With the Cubbies so hell bent on finishing ahead of Stl, I predict the following Tribune sports headline next Oct: Cubs beat Cards, Finish 4 Games Behind Bucs in NL Central
Comment by justacitizen Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 7:34 pm
Watching the rumble in Las Vegas - no clear winner yet and no knock down punches, but more to come.
Comment by illini Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 8:31 pm
Late breaking news: cards trade for Votto. CARGO deal imminent.
Comment by Blue dog dem Tuesday, Dec 15, 15 @ 10:48 pm
Glad the Vegas thing is history; CNN’s weird promo was starting to freak me. Colbert had a spoof, but it was kind of a self-spoof anyway.
Comment by X-prof Wednesday, Dec 16, 15 @ 12:45 am
No Pete Rose in the Hall of Fame. He deserves the same fate as “Shoeless Joe”…
Comment by Mouthy Wednesday, Dec 16, 15 @ 7:07 am
“Bob Costas, and two people of his choosing, gets to write what should be on both plaques, and no one but those 3 could approve their work-product. No “input”, no “MLB drafts”, “Hall of Fame Agreement”, or Pete Rose or Joe Jackson family veto.”
This is the best take I’ve seen on this issue. Unfortunately, there is a finite amount of plaque space, which Costas may push, but still.
Comment by Stormfield Wednesday, Dec 16, 15 @ 7:59 am
The 2015 World Series Champion Washington Nationals just called Addison & Clark to remind people that championships are NOT won on paper.
Comment by Blago's Luxurious Grey Mane Wednesday, Dec 16, 15 @ 8:16 am