SUBSCRIBE to Capitol Fax      Advertise Here      Mobile Version     Exclusive Subscriber Content     Updated Posts    Contact
CapitolFax.com
To subscribe to Capitol Fax, click here.
The religious opposition

Wednesday, Nov 6, 2013

* From yesterday’s debate

“This bill is the worst in the U.S. in protecting religious liberty,” said Rep. Jeanne Ives, R-Wheaton. “It does not have the religious protections most of us agree should happen.” […]

[Rep. Greg Harris] said the bill as written specifically immunizes religious leaders from having to perform same-sex marriages and also exempts religious facilities from hosting them.

Rep. David Reis, R-Willow Hill, said that didn’t go far enough.

“Why are religious rights only granted to priests, pastors and rabbis?” Reis said. “What about our rights? This is about individual religious rights.” […]

Rep. Dwight Kay, R-Glen Carbon, said biblical teachings should determine how someone votes on the issue.

“The Constitution has always looked to the scriptures for guidance,” Kay said. “I’ve heard nothing today about the scriptures. All I’ve heard about is human rights. My conviction is that this is wrong, but my conviction is scripture is right.”

* Also from the debate

State Rep. Mary Flowers, D-Chicago, who also voted against the bill, said the Bible defines marriage as being between a man and a woman, and no government has the authority to undo that.

“Even if the legal definition of the word ‘marriage’ was changed to include homosexual couples, those couples will not ever be truly married in God’s eyes,” she said.

* And

State Rep. David Harris, an Arlington Heights Republican, described meeting with a religious leader who urged him to vote “yes” and called him “homophobic” when he disagreed.

“It shows the tenor of the debate,” Harris said.

He said he rejects the suggestion people who vote against same-sex marriage don’t care about civil rights.

“Are those black ministers who represent so many African-American congregations … around this state, are they bigots who don’t care about civil rights? I think not,” Harris said.

* The Sun-Times caught up with Cardinal George and Bishop Trotter

“It’s no enormous surprise. There was a lot of effort placed into passage of this legislation. I think it’s bad legislation, but we’ve lived with bad laws before. It’ll make some people happy … but it will also, I think, change the nature of our society over a period of time,” Cardinal Francis George told the Chicago Sun-Times after speaking at Holy Name Cathedral. […]

Bishop Larry D. Trotter, who helped lead opposition to the bill, applauded legislators “who stood up for God.”

“Regardless of the passage of SB10, we will always believe that marriage is between one man and one woman,” Trotter said. “Yet we will still love the members of the LGBT community. We pray God’s grace, mercy and blessings over the state of Illinois and the United States of America.”

* From the Catholic Conference of Illinois

Today’s decision by Illinois lawmakers to change the definition of marriage not only goes against the common consensus of the human race – which understands that nature tells us that marriage is the union of one man and one woman – but it also undermines an institution that is the cornerstone of a healthy society. The optimal condition in which to raise children is a home that includes both a mother and father, since women and men are not interchangeable.

The Catholic Conference of Illinois is deeply disappointed that members of the General Assembly chose to redefine what is outside of its authority: a natural institution like marriage. We remain concerned about the very real threats to religious liberty that are at stake with the passage of this bill.

* Thomas More Society

“While we believe it regrettable that Illinois legislators have now purported to redefine marriage as something different from the union of one man and one woman, we are at least pleased and reassured to hear that legislators insisted during today’s floor debate in the House of Representatives that Illinois’ Religious Freedom Restoration Act and other constitutional and statutory guaranties of Illinois citizens’ religious liberties remain in full force and effect.

We will do our part to insure that those fundamental religious liberties are given robust and unstinting protection. The free speech and free exercise clauses of our First Amendment remain at the core of our constitutional order, and no law nor any public official may lawfully coerce anyone to deny or disavow his or her religious beliefs, or refrain from professing those beliefs in the public square, or to go against those beliefs in practice.

This is still a free country, and Thomas More Society stands ready to do its utmost to keep it free,” said Tom Brejcha, President and Chief Counsel of the Thomas More Society.

* But religion was also cited by the proponents

Advocates soon received additional help from Pope Francis, who warned that the Catholic Church could lose its way by focusing too much on social stances, including opposition to homosexuality.

“If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge him?” Francis said in July.

The comments sparked a wave of soul-searching by several Catholic lawmakers who had battled to reconcile their religious beliefs with their sworn duty to represent their constituents who were increasingly supportive of gay rights even as Cardinal Francis George remained opposed.

“As a Catholic follower of Jesus and the pope, Pope Francis, I am clear that our Catholic religious doctrine has at its core love, compassion and justice for all people,” said Rep. Linda Chapa LaVia, a Democrat from Aurora who voted for the bill after spending much of the summer undecided.

House Speaker Michael Madigan also cited the pope’s comments in explaining his support for the measure.

“For those that just happen to be gay — living in a very harmonious, productive relationship but illegal — who am I to judge that they should be illegal?” the speaker said.

- Posted by Rich Miller        


55 Comments
  1. - ChicagoR - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 9:56 am:

    “This is still a free country, and Thomas More Society stands ready to do its utmost to keep it free”. Unless you’re gay, apparently.


  2. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 9:57 am:

    When did religious freedom come to mean that if it goes against your religious beliefs it violates your religious freedom? Nonsense. There are a lot of things I don’t like but I don’t go around spouting that my “freedoms” are being infringed upon. I was appalled at Rep. Reis and Rep. Ives and their comments. They essentially said that if we can’t continue to discriminate against gay people because we don’t like them then it violates our religious freedom. I fully expect the Thomas More society to start filing lawsuits when a flower shop objects to selling flowers to a gay couple. Defending hate and bigotry is their game.


  3. - A guy... - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 9:58 am:

    Measured responses all. As it should be.


  4. - too obvious - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 9:59 am:

    Jesus never mentioned homosexuality. At least never quoted in the Bible. Just sayin’.


  5. - CircularFiringSquad - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:01 am:

    The comments of Kay and Ives were especially disappointing and in many cases outright falsehood


  6. - Chicago Publius - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:03 am:

    I wonder why all of those so-called catholic leaders don’t express their opposition to divorce? In the new testament, Jesus says that those who get divorced and then marry someone else are committing adultery. So howcome catholic clerics don’t speak against that? Is is because they don’t want to risk alienating a large number of the people who sit in their pews and drop coins in their baskets?


  7. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:03 am:

    ==I’ve heard nothing today about the scriptures.==

    He heard nothing about the Scriptures? What room was he in. I would also remind Rep. Kay that the Scriptures aren’t the law.


  8. - walkinfool - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:04 am:

    Each of these religious leaders and legislators can continue to believe what they believe, and vote and advocate accordingly. They can maintain their concerns about future changes in society, and cultural values, and express those concerns. This bill doesn’t impact or change any of that.

    They just cannot insist that their beliefs and rules automatically be the law of the land. They cannot ignore the law, (outside of religious institutions, which are specifically exempted), because they don’t agree with it.

    That’s true for any law.

    Thank God for America and our Constitution!


  9. - A. Nonymous - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:07 am:

    “Why are religious rights only granted to priests, pastors and rabbis?” Reis said. “What about our rights? This is about individual religious rights.” […]

    Dear Rep. Reis, nobody has taken away your right to marry or divorce a gal.

    Nor is anyone forcing you to marry or divorce a dude.

    Thus, your soliloquy about rights rings hollow, at best.

    Cheers,
    A Happily Married Illinoisan who acknowledges love is in the air


  10. - TJ - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:07 am:

    The opponents of marriage equality can yap all they want, all they’re doing is increasing the odds that future generations will remember a gem from them with the same confusion that people of my generation look at segregationists in the 1950s and 1960s. Complete and utter confusion.


  11. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:08 am:

    I give loads of credit to those who spoke in opposition to SB10 on the HGOP side, and the only “blemish” I heard was from Rep. Morrison, who just can’t help himself with the “polygamy” arguement.

    Please stop with these arguements. This is the same Tom Morrisson who sent the email equating SSM to other forms of relationships that are not even being discussed in the SSM forum.

    Rep. Morrison was the disappointment yesterday. While there is a case for pointing out some hyperbole, Rep. Morrison just can’t help himself, dragging in polygamy, which made me think … immediately … to that constituent email… and the “If I offended…” faux apology.

    Rep. Morrison, please, leave the speaking against “social” bills to those who will not make My Party look Dopey, or to those I do not have to apologize for, because the Representative lacks the understanding of the issue at hand.

    Overall, the tempered and measured tone was gresat to hear/see, and I applaud those… those who understood that speaking against a Bill, should not be the same as soeaking against People, and keeping the focus where it needed to be, on SB10.


  12. - GoodGrief - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:17 am:

    This is why government should only be in the civil union business and leave marriage to the churches. This makes the government position inclusive while your religious beliefs are maintained in the church you choose to attend. If ANY couple wants the rights provided by the government then a civil union would be required. You want your union recognized by the church then find one that will perform the marriage ceremony.


  13. - RonOglesby - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:20 am:

    —This is why government should only be in the civil union business and leave marriage to the churches—

    Exactly. get gov out of the marriage business all together. Then these folks dont have to go begging to gov for the right to be “married”. some people against SSM are really apposed to MARRIAGE. but can take a civil union without choking too much. Fine. lets get gov out of marriage and everyone gets civil unions and marriage is something for the church. Done.


  14. - Southwest Cook - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:24 am:

    Ives: “It does not have the religious protections most of us agree should happen.”

    Did she propose any amendments or try to work in good faith to craft a bill she could vote for? Of course not. She (and others) wouldn’t have been a “Yes” even with the strictest language protecting “religious liberty”.


  15. - Wensicia - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:33 am:

    “It does not have the religious protections most of us agree should happen.”

    The only religious protection that would please these people is a ban of any marriage outside of heterosexual unions.

    This is not a theocracy, get over it people.


  16. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:52 am:

    Am I a bad person for taking some pleasure in the “pain” being expressed by Bishop Trotter, Cardinal George and some of the “religious” leaders? Although it feels good to see justice done and the good guys win, it also feels good to see them lose. Sorry,


  17. - A guy... - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:59 am:

    Chicago Publius at 10:03, why don’t you go sit in those pews. No need for you to drop coins, just listen. “Catholic Clerics??” Your statements belie your bias against Catholics. Fine. The Church does speak out against divorce (with few exceptions, abuse, etc.) and preaches the sanctity of marriage. Find something to believe in dude. Without the Catholics in the legislature, the bill wouldn’t have passed. Give that some thought.


  18. - CircularFiringSquad - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:00 am:

    And, of course, nothing in SB10 amends the Bible, the Sunday Missle or any other holy book. It is too bad some of these fools are honest enough to admit it


  19. - Anon - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:02 am:

    As a dyed-in-the-wool atheist, these kinds of statements make me cringe. I would agree with GoodGrief and RonOglesby except that A. I don’t wish to cede marriage as being the sole providence of the religious, which is an a-historical perspective. B. It stinks of Jim Crow-esque separate but equal bullcrap.

    Point B is also exactly why I don’t understand why (and I’m generalizing here) African-Americans can’t seem to get the civil rights connection with SSM. Standing up for your own rights does not make you a champion of civil rights, just like standing up for the freedom of one religion does not make you a champion of religious freedom.


  20. - Chavez-respecting Obamist - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:08 am:

    GoodGrief - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:17 am:

    - RonOglesby - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 10:20 am:

    You’re right, it is done. And the good guys won.


  21. - too obvious - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:16 am:

    Dwight Kay now looks like a fool for endorsing Tom Cross. Assuming Kay doesn’t take back that endorsement, he should probably just keep his mouth shut on the gay issue.


  22. - chad - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:19 am:

    Leaders of religious institutions need to recognize that they must increasingly focus on moral suasion from the pulpit on these kinds of issues. If you want to exclude gay couples from your churches, you can choose to do so. The processing of abortion, riverboats, civil unions, and now gay marriage issues reflects that non-religious institutions are less willing to use their power structures to assert what is, essentially, religious dogma.

    A relevant NGO example is the Boy Scouts, which determined recently to end its 20-year ban on gay youth membership (yes, a gay ban was not historic to that organization, but rather a mid-90’s development). Who made the decision in that case? About 1,500 small-town businessmen who had the voting responsibility to consider that issue – not exactly a bunch of lefty-pinko-wackos.

    To my many friends in the ILGOP, your future is really on the line as a relevant Illinois political party. Do what the BSA small businessmen did and get practical. Follow Obie, Uncle Jack and their friends and you will seep further into history with the Illinois Whig Party.

    Compliments to David Harris, who gave one of the most considered speech all day on the matter. While opposing the bill, he effectively called for respect on all sides.


  23. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:30 am:

    Whom God hath joined together let no man put asunder.


  24. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:34 am:

    - too obvious -,

    It is only bad if Dwight Kay or to others IF they believe that all in the ILGOP must agree 100% of the time.

    If it’s a muust for Kay or his supporters, then they will flake off Cross anyway. Being a Reagan Rule Republican means taking into consideration all they have in common, that counters what little they do not.


  25. - Sir Reel - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:43 am:

    I always thought “religious freedom” meant freedom to practice any religion. To some of the opponents, it seems to mean freedom to discriminate and prevent some in our society from obtaining the legal and financial benefits marriage provides.

    I wonder if the opponents would support eliminating all the legal and financial benefits of marriage so that it could become a strictly religious issue? None of them discussed anything like this in their comments.


  26. - Skeeter - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 11:49 am:

    “Those couples will not ever be truly married in God’s eyes”

    And that’s a problem for government why?
    Not sure why Rep. Flowers thinks that is relevant.


  27. - Chavez-respecting Obamist - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 12:45 pm:

    I’m glad I don’t believe in a God who would discriminate like that.


  28. - Sigh - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 1:06 pm:

    Will an elected judge be able to decline to officiate at a SSM ceremony if to do so violates his or her religious beliefs?


  29. - Gerry - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 1:31 pm:

    Some of you just don’t get it on the religious liberties part of this do you? Yeah the churches are protected and will not be forced to perform a same sex ceremony but what about the religious liberty of an individual? It doesn’t protect an individual’s religious liberty. This is what I’m talking about where the real problem with SB 10 is. There are Christian business owners out there who have said no to providing their services for a same sex ceremony because it goes against their faith and they’re being sued for it! That is not only wrong but unconstitutional. They should have the right to say no to providing for a same sex ceremony if it goes against their religious beliefs and they shouldn’t have to be forced into doing something that goes against their beliefs. If any of you don’t believe this just go look it up. There’s a bed and breakfast owner here in Illinois, a photographer studio owner in Arizona, and a florist in Washington.


  30. - Skeeter - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 1:33 pm:

    Gerry,
    They couldn’t discriminate before and they can’t now.
    Nothing has changed.


  31. - Skeeter - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 1:34 pm:

    By the way Gerry, those places also have to serve interracial couples, whether they like it or not.


  32. - BigRed Rightwinger - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 1:40 pm:

    OW, I don’t quite understand your attack on Rep. Morrison for bringing up polyamory.

    SB10 strips marriage from its procreative role and makes it about the State affirming the love and commitment of people. The proponents of SB10 argue that it is discriminatory not to provide the same rights and privileges to same sex people as heterosexuals. Why is it not wrong to deny the same rights and privileges to 3 or more people who are in love and in a committed relationship? It is discriminatory. If marriage is about love and commitment what rational reason is there to limit it to two people?

    Please enlighten me. Your post seems to be more about politics than principle.


  33. - Skeeter - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 1:42 pm:

    Strips marriage from its procreative role?

    You realize, of course, that under current law people in their 80s can marry?


  34. - MrJM - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 1:46 pm:

    Will an elected judge be able to decline to officiate at a SSM ceremony if to do so violates his or her religious beliefs?

    Were they able to decline to administer the death penalty because doing so violated his or her religious beliefs? Are infantry soldiers able to decline firearms training because doing so violates his religious beliefs? Can a government meat inspector convert to Jainism and then refused to do her job because it violates her religious beliefs?

    If you don’t want to do your government job, then quit and get another job.

    – MrJM


  35. - Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 1:50 pm:

    - BigRed Rightwinger -,

    When Utah wanted to join the Union, they had to outlaw polygamy.

    Fifteen states now have SSM, and they are still in the Union.

    “One of the conditions for granting Utah statehood was that a ban on polygamy be written into the state constitution. This was a condition required of other western states that were admitted into the Union later. Statehood was officially granted on January 4, 1896.”

    Precendent. the legal aspect of a state in the Union recognizing Polygamy is not goig to be possible.

    Polygamy is aganst the Law, prevented a state from joining the Union, and the mere fact that this Dopey idea is on the table shows a lack of understanding of where we are in history, where we were, and where we are going … and not going.


  36. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:10 pm:

    –Will an elected judge be able to decline to officiate at a SSM ceremony if to do so violates his or her religious beliefs? ==

    Boy, that’s a tough one. Did this hypothetical judge swear an oath to uphold the laws of Illinois and the United States?

    Or is this judge enforcing Sharia law?


  37. - ChicagoR - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:11 pm:

    I just don’t understand why those so upset about the supposed “loss of religious liberties” here aren’t out screaming for religious exceptions to all our other laws. There are (or were at the time of passage our civil rights laws) certainly those whose religions don’t agree with serving individuals of other races or religions. But we don’t have religious exceptions for businesses from those laws.


  38. - catrike - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:14 pm:

    So proud to live in Illinois today. The anti gay arguments sound more hollow each repeating.


  39. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:23 pm:

    ==Some of you just don’t get it on the religious liberties part of this do you?==

    No, we get it. You don’t. Why should a business owner be allowed to discriminate against gay people? Should we have a checklist people must fill out when they go into a business to make sure that their life and actions are OK with the business owner? Your religious liberties are NOT being violated. Enough with that nonsense. If you operate a business then you don’t get to pick and choose which people you want to serve. If you can’t operate your business without discriminating then you shouldn’t be able to operate a business at all.


  40. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:37 pm:

    ==Find something to believe in dude.==

    I think they have. The right of a gay couple to get married. At least they have a view, unlike you.


  41. - A guy... - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:39 pm:

    Demo, I have 2 views that I’ve given darn near equal weight. I catch up to you at the next Mensa meeting.


  42. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:42 pm:

    ==I catch up to you at the next Mensa meeting. ==

    Thanks for keeping it classy. Arrogance is an ugly thing.


  43. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:46 pm:

    @A guy:

    I seem to recall somebody saying this . . . “Occasionally, you drop a cheapie.”

    Who would that have been?


  44. - A guy... - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:49 pm:

    You were correct to point out my cheapie. Apologies.


  45. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:55 pm:

    ~ but what about the religious liberty of an individual?~

    What is it in this law that prevents you from remaining a bigot? Nothing. It just means two consenting adults are allowed to marry each other without having to worry about whether or not you approve.


  46. - Demoralized - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 2:58 pm:

    @A guy:

    All is well. I’m a big boy. lol


  47. - walkinfool - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 3:00 pm:

    Gerry: We get your argument — we’ve heard it a million times, (with the same three cases always cited). And we’ve considered it from many angles.

    You retain your rights to practice your own religion, provided it doesn’t infringe on the legal rights of others. Nothing has changed impacting your religious rights.

    You cannot illegally discriminate, which was the case before this bill was passed.

    That’s called a country of laws.


  48. - Jaded - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 4:40 pm:

    Business owners will be OK. If they don’t want to do the wedding they can just be busy on that day or even better, jack the bid up a couple extra grand. If the couple wants to pay the extra cash subcontract and have a nice day. Win, Win, Win.


  49. - liberal muse - Wednesday, Nov 6, 13 @ 5:40 pm:

    Separation of church and state is a pillar on which this country was founded. A belief that stemmed from our forefathers fleet to avoid religious persecution. Today, we are a melting pot of people, ideas, politics and religious beliefs. To say that the bible defines marriage as one man and one woman we are not only refusing to acknowledge separation of church and state, we are also refusing to acknowledge any group of people whose faith may not involve the Christian bible. Politics works far better without the intrusion of religion and religion works far better without the intrusion of politics.


  50. - Gerry - Thursday, Nov 7, 13 @ 1:15 am:

    @Demoralized, So in other words what you’re saying is a Christian business owner should just forget about their strongly held Christian beliefs, values, and morals and be forced to give in and provide for a ceremony that is not only immoral but goes against everything they believe in just because they have a business and if they don’t they should have one at all? If that’s really what you think then you are a complete fascist and care nothing for the First Amendment. This is nothing at all like the segregation days and refusing service to someone because of their skin color which one has no control over, but a ceremony of 2 people of the same sex in a lifestyle that they knowingly entered into and CHOSE on their own free will is vastly different and not at all comparable to one’s color. In that case those business owners should have every right to say no and they should not be forced to drop their beliefs just because they run a business. That’s what you so called “progressives” do is pressure people who don’t agree with you and back them into a corner. I hear all these anti bullying campaigns all the time which are put on by people like you but the funny truth is so called “progressives” are the biggest bullies out there. Everything that you “progressives” accuse us conservative Christians of are the same things that you guys do on a regular basis. You call us discriminative and intolerant bigots all the time but yet you guys are the biggest ones of them all. You so called “progressives” are nothing but fascist hypocrites.


  51. - Gerry - Thursday, Nov 7, 13 @ 1:47 am:

    @WalkingFool Yeah and I’ve heard your side’s repugnant arguments a million times too so what of it? Myself personally, no I’m not a business owner but I feel for those Christians who are that have to deal with this crap. In regards to those 3 cases, I’m sure there’s several more out there that I just don’t know about. But this isn’t just about Christian business owners, this will affect all Christians in general. Another concerning fact is how children of Christians will be taught in schools(at least public ones anyway) about this. In states where gay “marriage” has already been legalized gay teachers and plenty of “progressive” ones as well have started using their classroom as a platform to push their views on kids as young as kindergarten! They’re teaching kids that homosexuality is a normal genetic trait and that any kind of conservative view is hateful and bigoted. So you’re really telling me that nothing has changed? That’s a bunch of crap right there and its a lot of people on your side that are doing plenty of infringing on other’s beliefs and pushing their own, and that can even be discrimination too if their telling kids that everyone who has conservative views is hateful and bigoted. If you don’t believe me on any of this then go look it up for yourself. David Parker is the best example to start with, the man who was technically arrested for “trespassing” when really people just didn’t like that he was opposing his son being taught homosexuality in his grade school. Of course I’m sure many on your side either deny or disclaim that. That same kind of stuff will happen here in Illinois, I guarantee it. So it goes far more deep than just a Christian owning a business and on top of that, anybody who tells Christian business owners that they can’t let their faith be a part of their business and let it be a part of how they run their business is very discriminatory and bigoted. People like you tell us to be tolerant towards gays and their views well where is your tolerance for Christians and theirs. Again its “progressive” liberal hypocrisy.


  52. - wordslinger - Thursday, Nov 7, 13 @ 7:41 am:

    Gerry, see you in church.


  53. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Nov 7, 13 @ 8:16 am:

    - Gerry -,

    With your “Lifestyle Choice” argument, and the “everyone who is not of the ‘Christian’ ideal is bigoted towards Christians” follow up…

    I am shocked your argument didn’t have more sway…

    Or am I?

    Probably not.


  54. - Gerry - Thursday, Nov 7, 13 @ 10:00 am:

    @Oswego Willy, What all do you want to know? Tell me and I will go further. For the time being its very simple, people who live gay made that decision on their own to go through with it. All this talk about it being genetic and the whole “born that way” stuff is garbage. They do not have to live that lifestyle if they don’t want to but they do because that’s what they want not because some gene or force is making them. As for the bigotry towards Christians its very true. “Progressives” like you are very bigoted and intolerant towards Christians. They have no tolerance for their beliefs and they think any kind of opposition they have towards homosexuality is hate when its not the case at all. Every opposition you face you spin it around and turn it into hate when really its you guys who are hateful. The whole Chick Fil A thing last year is a perfect example. The CEO simply says he’s not for gay marriage, nothing hateful at all there but left wing “progressive” liberals cry hate when there was none and they try bullying him into a corner and try to ruin him and his business. Mayors of San Francisco, Boston, and Emmanuel of Chicago pretty much forbid him from building a franchise there. That is Christian bigotry at its finest.


  55. - wordslinger - Thursday, Nov 7, 13 @ 10:13 am:

    Gerry, when did you decide to be heterosexual?

    Also, the Chick Fil A at State and Lake gets really busy around noon. Try to get there early.


Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.


* Proft busts caps in Bertino-Tarrant race
* Today's quotable
* Funding stuff that works
* Question of the day
* Caption contest!
* More complicated than it already looks
* Caught in a vicious cycle
* How can we miss you if you won't go away?
* Rules bent a bit to move ConAgra headquarters to Chicago
* Trump raises money in Illinois for out of state candidates, while NRSC jumps in for Kirk
* *** UPDATED x1 CPS responds *** CTU says 95 percent voted to strike
* Video gaming could be a huge revenue generator for state, Chicago
* Let's tone it down a little
* Safe Roads backers begin TV blitz
* Kasper speaks
* The transformation is almost complete
* Caps off in comptroller's race
* SUBSCRIBERS ONLY - Supplement to today’s edition
* Yesterday's blog posts

Support CapitolFax.com
Visit our advertisers...

...............

...............

...............
<


Search This Blog...

Search the 98th General Assembly By Bill Number
(example: HB0001)

Search the 98th General Assembly By Keyword

  
* Lenovo lays off about 1,000, mostly in Motorola
* Huawei ‘Nexus’ tablet may be a second Andromeda device
* If Google buys Twitter, there’s a perfect spot for it in YouTube
* Project Loon achieves new milestone in flight time
* Twitter is being pursued by Disney
* Three HTC Ocean phones might take touch controls to the next level
* Images of Chromecast Ultra show up, Chrome logo doesn’t

* Rodon's shutdown start captures road series
* 50th big league start is large for stellar Rodon
* Rodon's shutdown start captures road series
* White Sox mourn loss of superstar Fernandez
* Rodon's shutdown start captures road series
* Rays, White Sox set for clash in Windy City
* White Sox mourn loss of superstar Fernandez

...............


Main Menu
Home
Illinois
YouTube
Pundit rankings
Obama
Subscriber Content
Durbin
Burris
Blagojevich Trial
Advertising
Updated Posts
Polls

Archives
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004

Blog*Spot Archives
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005

Syndication

RSS Feed 2.0
Comments RSS 2.0
WordPress

Loading


* Cornerstone Building Brews New Business - Peori.....
* 44th District hopefuls urge thinking beyond par.....
* Community colleges say they’re forced to rely m.....
* Study: Illinois video gaming has generated abou.....
* Safe Roads backers begin TV blitz – The Capitol.....
* First Gold Star Family Day proclaimed in IL - KFVS..
* Gov. Rauner on tonight's debate: Next question .....
* Governor Rauner Proclaims First Gold Star Famil.....
* Gold Star Family Day - IllinoisHomePage.net..
* Illinois Gov. Rauner Ignores MMJ Pleas, So Loca.....


* Man charged in shooting at popular Chicago tourist spot
* Study: Illinois video gaming has generated about $785M
* Study: Illinois video gaming has generated about $785M
* Some retired educators in suburban Chicago receive bonuses
* Illinois man to plead not guilty in wife's 1990 death
* Chicago teachers vote to authorize strike in contract talks
* Police: Hammond officer shot, injured armed suicidal man
* The Latest: U of Illinois plans vigil after deadly shooting
* David Gill appeals to US Supreme Court to get name on ballot
* $3.5M bail set for suspect in kidnapping of Wheaton student

* Chicago teachers vote to authorize strike in contract talks
* First Gold Star Families Day observed at Capitol
* Donation lifts fundraising caps in Illinois comptroller race
* Planning underway locally for Illinois' 200th birthday
* Attack on state senator leads to arrest of murder suspects
* Illinois Supreme Court overturns law allowing 6-member juries
* Local unemployment of 4.6 percent still lowest in state
* Elderly frozen-treat seller gets $380,000 from GoFundMe page
* Creation of Amish history museum in central Illinois underway
* Privately funded Executive Mansion work will follow traditional wage, bidding rules

* Beer wars heat up as Miller Lite calls out Bud Light by name in ads
* Bats needs to close this deal before somebody buys CBOE
* Variable pay could be headed up for Chicago workers in 2017
* Beer wars heat up as Miller Lite calls out Bud Light by name
* Your salary might not go up in 2017, but about that bonus . . .


* Man shot in Austin
* Fred Hoiberg is already feeling the pressure in his second season
* Brown: Is it safe to ride a bike in ‘America’s Best Bike City’?
* The Trump-Clinton presidential debate: Watch and react with us
* Dwyane Wade is 100 percent behind Colin Kaepernick’s message
* 4 charged in laptop theft at Crown Point tattoo parlor
* Big buck to osprey talons: Notes around Chicago outdoors
* One train cancelled after Union Station fire
* Doubek: Lockbox for road repair funds creates more problems
* Gov. Rauner on tonight’s debate: Next question


* Windsor school 'tasting menu' a big hit with students
* Donald Trump, Hillary Clinton finally face off in high-stakes debate showdown
* Washington mall shooting suspect confesses to slayings, is charged with murder
* Charges filed in fatal shooting near Millennium Park over weekend
* State police investigating Hammond cop shooting
* Emanuel modifies police oversight proposal to woo aldermen
* 6 shot on West, South sides, including boy, 15
* Double Door considering move to Logan Square as legal appeal continues
* Charles R. Walgreen III, oversaw growth of chain started by grandfather, dies
* Houston gunman wore military-style apparel with Nazi emblems, police say


The widget AQL4JYGHIY powered by Feed Informer does not exist.


* Chicago teachers vote to authorize strike in contract talks
* First Gold Star Families Day observed at Capitol
* Donation lifts fundraising caps in Illinois comptroller race
* Deckle McLain: Rise of bots can't be ignored in economy
* Bernard Schoenburg: Interesting twists in Troemper-Reid circuit judge race
* Statehouse Insider: Do you remember where you were during Rauner's Facebook Live session?
* Compass for Kids supports at-risk children
* Innovate Springfield gives boost to new businesses
* Eric Zarnikow: Aid changes mean students should act now
* Planning underway locally for Illinois' 200th birthday


* PODCAST: News Gazette Sports Page 09-26-16
* Wapsi approaching a top-10 flood
* Illinois marks first Gold Star Family Day
* Gill denied in last-ditch appeal to U.S. Supreme Court
* Illini searching for improvements
* Urbana man pleads guilty to wife's murder
* 09-26-16 Monday Morning Quarterbacks
* Hit-and-run investigation: Urbana police impound stolen vehicle
* Champaign middle-schooler struck by vehicle
* Fire damages Bloomington home


* Police: Elgin man in synthetic pot case said he didn't sell drugs 'anymore'
* Mundelein man who was shot in Champaign was visiting friends
* Arlington Heights library still discussing north branch
* 49ers coach Chip Kelly isn't ready to make a switch at QB
* 10th annual solar tour

* House lawmakers overcome hurdle on key tra...
* Rodney Davis talks funding with Bloomingto...
* The agency that fought Illiana gets a new ...
* Rep. Dold takes educational cruise down Ch...
* Lawmakers decry high turnover rate of VA h...
* CBD Oil, and politics
* Simon considering state Senate bid
* Killer Congressman Tom MacArthur trying to...
* Shutdown? State may not notice
* Rep. Bob Dold

* Government action on for-profit college ac......
* Wicker, Durbin Introduce Legislation To Pr......
* Illinois/Wisconsin briefs - Dubuque Telegr......

* Polls: GOP Closing Fast on Senate Seats - ......

* Trump vs Clinton in dead heat; Monday night's debates could be crucial
* Trump vs Clinton in dead heat; Monday night's debate could be crucial
* Gill Fights To Get Back On Ballot In Illinois' 13th Congressional Distict
* Lake County Jail Workers Union Voices Concerns Over Long Hours, Safety
* Cartoon Of The Day
* Oral Arguments On Landmark Clean Power Plan To Be Heard Tuesday
* Report: Income Inequality Is Worse For Black Workers Today Than In 1979
* EXTRA: It’s beginning to look at lot like a strike will take place this autumn
* Oral Arguments In Appeal Of Landmark Clean Power Plan To Be Heard Tuesday
* Cartoon of the Day - 9/26/16 Chgo citizens to cops: stop shooting us


* Governor Rauner Proclaims First Gold Star Family Day in Illinois
* IDNR Announces Campsite Reservations Open for Sites in Solar Eclipse Zone - Southern Illinois Will Experience Total Solar Eclipse Aug. 21, 2017
* IDOT Hiring in Preparation of Winter Weather - Temporary help needed to assist with snow-and-ice removal, public urged to apply
* Illinois Department of Insurance Reminds ‘Land of Lincoln Health’ Customers to Enroll In New Coverage - The deadline for ‘Land of Lincoln Health’ customers to enroll in a new plan is September 30, 2016; Consumers could experience a gap in health care cove
* Governor Rauner Celebrates Illinois’ Hunting Heritage on National Hunting and Fishing Day




      Hosted by MCS SUBSCRIBE to Capitol Fax Advertise Here Mobile Version Contact Rich Miller