35 Comments - ahoy - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 4:42 pm: It is curious how Lisa Madigan and Dan Hynes were pretty quite this session only popping up every once in a while to say that they wouldn’t raise taxes. I”m not saying that their posturing for higher office or anything… - Cassandra - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 4:46 pm: Didn’t our Blago try that excoriating the legislators approach. I don’t think it worked very well. - Steve - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 4:49 pm: Does Pat Quinn weep for the budget cuts families will have to make to pay for higher taxes? - Princess - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 4:50 pm: What, no video? Bet Quinn didn’t have a twinkle or smile today. Yeah, Cassandra, but with Rod it was never about ‘the people’ it was only and always about Blagojevich. At least Quinn is sincere. - Rich Miller - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 4:50 pm: Let’s keep the drive-by comments out of here, please. - A Citizen - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 4:51 pm: If this tit for tat pettiness is what is going to pass for politics and governing then perhaps we need to empower and impose a House of Commons and a House of Lords over it and get some decision making accomplished. We could keep the house and senate as dreadful relics and reminders of a failed past experiment. And of course the governor would be mostly ceremonial, of course. - Rich Miller - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 4:52 pm: ===What, no video? === The governor was in Chicago today and Mike the videographer was in a session-ending coma. I did my coma yesterday. lol - Reformer - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 4:54 pm: Quinn’s mistake was in believing he could cajole some Republicans into voting for his income tax plan. He won’t jawbone them into support either. - Anonymous - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 5:03 pm: His fight would be so much more effective if he included the middle class, like most Dems do, and not just the poor. Most middle class feel pretty poor these days yet aren’t included in Quinn’s rhetoric. - BoxingCross - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 5:20 pm: Quinn did sound very Rod-like scary He was right — about Hynes and Lexi. The A.G. was thumbs down on the tax hike from day one. Refocus on GOP legislators with facilities What would the Jims Do???? - Boscobud - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 5:35 pm: The gloves are on!!! Madigan VS Quinn. The GOP just needs to focus on ideas and ignor the Madigan Quinn mess. - Phineas J. Whoopee - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 6:05 pm: The dems who voted no know they have plenty of political cover for their vote and shaming them simply isn’t effective which means Quinn is blaming them for his own political cover. Another words, the campaigning has officially begun. - Plutocrat03 - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 6:22 pm: Note the lack of even a symbolic effort to ferret out the wasteful and unnecessary spending which also steals money that could be used for the poor. The shame of it is that nothing the government does can be done more efficiently than it is today….. NOT - Emily Booth - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 6:38 pm: The conversation at work today was about how much the Democrats are like the Republicans. It’s very sad. - collar observer - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 7:33 pm: The House Dems should be ashamed all on their own (except for the 42 yes votes) and I pray Quinn holds out on the capital plan - even though I know it is critical - BUT - we need to morally do all of this right - and that takes leadership like Quinn is displaying in his speech. - Louis Howe - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 7:53 pm: Verbally attacking legislators at this phase in the process is too little too late. He should begin making the cuts and let the legislators catch the flack for the cuts. Quinn has already lost the “Gov proposes the legislature disposes” phase. Make the cuts!!! Stop the extra school aid payment….announce early release of prisoners …start executing your dooms day budget. Then at each announcement, refer to the budget these legislators sent to you. Schedule the news announcements every couple days and dribble out the bad news over the next few weeks. - Gregor - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 8:31 pm: Howe, hopefully he’s not quite to that stage yet, you should never make a threat you don’t carry out, first rule of the schoolyard…. but he does seem to be hinting that way. Really I am ashamed of the cut and run Dems sneaking out of town without passing a full budget and gritting their teeth and passing the tax hikes. A golden opportunity to be heroes for fixing the mess escaped and they gave the repubs more ammunition for making a comeback. I used to be pretty partisan Dem but now I’m equally disgusted with both sides, they are out and out cowards. The key to effective legislators seems to be to elect people that don’t care if they get fired. Then they can just do what’s right and what’s best, instead of playing all these stupid games with people’s lives. This is why I think Quinn should never have announced he was running for re-election. He could then afford to wear the jacket for all the unpopular stuff but save the state. - Bobs yer - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 9:03 pm: As already noted by others, this seems very Blago-like. Which means it won’t be effective. He needs to think twice before he takes advice from the same people again. No Illinois governor since I’ve lived here got to advance his personal agenda unchanged. The smart ones (Thompson, maybe Edgar) learned how to live within the system they inherited. Pat me bye, you’ll be happier and more sucessful if you accept the universe you live in. Trying to play the martry only makes you look silly. - hmm - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 9:11 pm: Bobs yer… This is all Quinn. None of Blago’s advisors are still around, except for his budget director (she fills more of a technical and policy role, not a media role). - Bobs yer - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 9:11 pm: Oh, and bad idea to attack Lisa Madigan. She can be beaten, but not effectively insulted. Don’t forget, she’s the only one who had the guts to try and avoid the Roland Burris fiasco before it even happened. - Bobs yer - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 9:14 pm: hmm, defer to you on this. My guess is that its either Pat’s call or some rookies. - Zoble - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 9:18 pm: Wait a minute….Gov. Quinn is blasting the lawmakers for not treating our Veterans better. And putting them out?? Is this the same Gov. Quinn that threatened to close the Veterans Homes if his tax increase wasn’t passed?? He learned well from Blogo. If you don’t get your way, take your ball and go home. - Illinois Taxpayer - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 10:23 pm: Quinn previously mentioned that this budget is a “shared sacrifice” A family of 4 making 30k would get a 72% effective decrease. A family of 4 making 150k would get a 77% increase. How is dropping taxes by 72% for some people and increasing them by 77% for others anywhere near a “shared sacrifice”? How come no one is talking about how wrong this is? Did spending really increase 41% in the last 6 years? If so, on what? Why isn’t there a huge fuss over the under-funded pensions? There’s a huge fuss over 11+ billion deficit but aren’t the pensions underfunded by 30+ billion? Why don’t we cut employee benefits for state workers? (We can’t afford them.) Democrats+Republicans=Unfettered bloat with a constant shift of blame to keep the uneducated citizens in a fog. - DuPage Dan - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 10:36 pm: Illinois Taxpayer, As has been explained in great detail in this arena, the pensions are not as lucrative as you may think. The cost has not been bloated by late career bump ups (rare) but by the legislature/governor transferring the funds into the general operating fund or just not putting up their share. I, and the dwindling members of the state gov’t you appear to so easily toss aside, have been paying our share, even increasing our share, all along. Our ranks have shrunk in the last 10-15 years and make up a small part of the deficit problem. If you think that by reducing the number of state employees will somehow reduce the under-funded pension obligation you are delusional. Spending did increase in the last 6 years with RodB’s unfunded kid’s care program among others (remember the un-asked for free seniors ride the CTA gambit?). You are right about the constant shifting of blame/last minute maneuvering that is going on, tho. We are not getting the true picture of the catastrophe. Come the next election - we throw the bums out! - JohnR - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 10:42 pm: “unfunded kid’s care program” I assume you mean All Kids, which costs around $70 million a year. And which was paid for by switching Medicaid to a Disease Management and Primary Care Case Management model (report says that saves $100 million a year). Maybe I am not one of the kool kids who can just make up soundbites on the fly, but $70 million does not equal $11 billion. The REAL answer to “Illinois Taxpayer”’s question is - no, state spending did not increase 41% in the last six years. That’s ridiculous. The rest of his post is rather pointless from that “stat” on. - Illinois Taxpayer - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 10:53 pm: I didn’t state anything about reducing number of state employees to reduce the pension obligation - not sure where you got that. I stated that we need to cut benefits from state employees as we can’t afford them. You may not be aware, but the private sector actually cuts benefits when revenues drops. It’s not much of a stretch to ask the same of our state employees. Of out curiousity, what ranks have shrunk in the last 10-15 years? As far as cutting government employees…I do happen to agree that it’s a grand idea at all levels. Government involvement always yields more government involvement…at what point does it stop? Is the pension deficit in fact 31 billion dollars? How is that a “small part of the deficit problem”? It’s not a small part of anything at that size. Of course it’s because weak polticians spend the general fund dollars..it’s similar Social Security and why it’s underfunded. Pension obligations are a liability that should be accounted for in a normal budgetary system. Being allowed to play the shell game with the money is insanely short-sighted, as is much of politics. - JohnR - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 10:58 pm: “Of out curiousity, what ranks have shrunk in the last 10-15 years? “ FY00 state employee headcount: 69,254 FY08 state employee headcount: 54,267 That’s a big drop. Seriously… do some fact checking first. It ain’t hard. And the unfunded pension liability is actually closer to $60 billion I believe. - Illinois Taxpayer - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 11:27 pm: JohnR - I didn’t drop any figures, or suggest any numbers at all for state employee counts. I have no idea how many people on on the roles, which is why *I ASKED*. So, politely go fact check yourself..seriously. As far as pension numbers.. I think it’s a horrible thing to underfund pensions, and I asked if it was 31 billion, which is the last number I remember seeing. As a ‘fact check’, here’s a link about pension myths that states 54.4 billion. http://facultysenate.siuc.edu/0209jbcapx2.pdf This link refers to a 20 billion increase in just a ‘few months’ http://www.codretirees.org/news/Current%20Pension%20Issues-CTBA.pdf So…there’s at least two large problems with underfunded pensions. First, the obvious one - government spending general fund money, and second big reason is it’s apparently a poorly managed fund. (At least poorly divisified and the market crash tanked it even further.) There should be plenty of talk about investigating who’s managing this fund… Compare the drop of 20 billion in a few months to what’s requested in this tax increase. Where’s the press on this $20 billion drop? We wouldn’t need to be bickering about big or small government issues in our little debate about which bums to throw out… Time would be better spent on asking who made money managing the pension funds? Did someone get fired at least?? Pension funds, especially underfunded ones, should be a bit conservative in their investment choices, wouldn’t you think? - DuPage Dan - Tuesday, Jun 2, 09 @ 11:29 pm: IT, It has been discussed here ad nauseum about the reduction in the ranks of all state gov’t rank and file employees over the last 10-15 years. Illinois has the fewest state employees per capita when put up against comparable states. As far as reducing benefits, that won’t reduce the amount of pension debt that the state owes now for future obligations that will HAVE to be paid. That historic fact can’t be changed. You can’t change that reality no matter how you cut it. Cutting benefits will only effect pension obligations that are yet to be accrued. How many different ways can it be said before you realize that you are presenting useless rhetoric? - Odyssey 2010 - Wednesday, Jun 3, 09 @ 12:13 am: this is a disaster. Unfortunately, the budget deficit is made worse by the trust deficit that Quinn and Madigan are making worse. Taxes just have to be raised. However, the taxpayers of Illinois are owed an analysis that everything that could have reasonably done (without sacrificing other policy goals) was done before resorting to taxes. This was NEVER done. Shame on the governor, the Speaker, the Senate President AND the “do-nothings” in the opposition. - Illinois Taxpayer - Wednesday, Jun 3, 09 @ 12:18 am: DD - I in no way was equating cutting benefits to cutting the pension fund deficit. Apparently it’s been discussed here before and you are confusing me with ‘them’. I came by based on a link and I’m not a regular as political discussions gives me acid reflux. You are quickly discounting comments as useless rhetoric if anything apparently crosses your untouchable position. The pension obligations are only going to be solved by changing the way the government operates which is hard to do if you are constantly on the defensive protecting your holy position, whether how left or right it may be. Future pension obligations are going to be reduced based on the link I provded earlier, so benefits are indeed being cut - however, I agree, that the cuts on the future obligations are tiny in comparison to the current situation. If benefits have been promised to state employees, they should be paid or someone should be hung by their toenails in reparation. As far as current obligations go - I’m talking about *protecting* what was promised. I’m just sick of over spending with no long term planning. All politicians seemingly plan each move solely on the next election. Isn’t it time we talk about securing long term plans? If we can’t afford to spend the money, then we shouldn’t spend the money! It’s pretty simple, Forrest. It’s a given that Obama’s cap-n-trade is going to spike energy costs in this country. If you want to ‘protect’ people, then think ahead a little bit for a change. Real people are going to be hurting even more than they are now. And now a majority happen to be maxing out their credit cards and living on borrowed money, kinda like our government. Where are we going to be at if we keep increasing expenditures by 41% every 6 years? Has your spendable income gone up that much in that same time? How many of us have the rate of income growth able to realize a similar increase? Surely not the middle class or the poor, which I’d wager you are a strident defender of. - Pot calling kettle - Wednesday, Jun 3, 09 @ 12:23 am: IT, It doesn’t matter how conservative the investments are if only half of the money that should be put in is. (The state has been skipping out on all or part of its share for years.) Even the best investments could never hope to regain that loss. And, because those non-contributions cannot gain value, the hole gets ever bigger each year. If the state would only have paid the equivalent of the employer portion of social security (which every private business has to pay) we would be in fine shape. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Jun 3, 09 @ 8:51 am: Illinois Taxpayer, don’t come back here until you do some basic research first. Your ill-informed comments aren’t appreciated. While we all learn here, this ain’t kindergarten. Not knowing that state employee headcount is dramatically lower now than it was ten years ago is kindergarten level ignorance. - Rich Miller - Wednesday, Jun 3, 09 @ 8:54 am: BTW, we are all “Illinois taxpayers” here. Just because you pay taxes, too, doesn’t make you somehow special. - Illinois Taxpayer - Wednesday, Jun 3, 09 @ 9:36 am: I wouldn’t assume knowing state employee headcount is a common knowledge item. And I *asked* so I would be informed. You are getting pretty ruffled feathers over questions. Quinn gave a speech that stated we all should make a “shared sacrifice” and I presented his new tax numbers which is a 72% effective decrease versus a 77% increase based on income levels. I asked why isn’t anyone talking about how wrong that is. Are those estimated numbers wrong…or is saying “shared sacrifice” correct with that big of a difference? No one commented on that at all. I asked why isn’t anyone making a big fuss over the underfunded pensions in addition to the budget deficit. When talking about one, you need to talk about the other and you don’t read much about underfunded pensions in the press. It’s a cooperative hiding of a huge problem. Let’s talk about 11 billion deficit and forget about the 70 billion that’s underfunded! Isn’t that pretty rediculous? Shouldn’t any article about a 11 billion deficit include at least a minor reference the 70 billion pension underfunding? That’s all I was saying about pension obligations and it was assumed I wanted to cut the underfunded pensions, which is exactly opposite of my position on current obligations. What I suggested to cut is future obligations which we obviously cannot afford. Are you saying the pension obligation is a minor issue? Shouldn’t it be an integral part of any budget conversation? I was told I was wrong about the increase in spending. Granted, I don’t have a reference to back up my 41% claim as I don’t recall where I read that, but here’s a link that has a nice graph for expenditures and revenue to visualize the obvious problem. http://www.ctbaonline.org/All%20 Links%20to%20Research%20Are as%20and%20Reports/Pension/ W%20R%209%202%2007%20I llinois%20burgeoning%20unf unded%20liability.pdf Am I wrong about 41% growth in spending over the last 6 years? What is the number then? Or, is it being ignorant to ask questions to discover the truth? Du Page Dan said my last comment was at least correct - You are right about the constant shifting of blame/last minute maneuvering that is going on, tho. What specifically about my comments are no appreciated or are ill-informed? I provided links to justify the budget deficit fact. I just provided another link to back up the increasing expenditures comment. You guys are pretty touchy and I wish you well. As on NPR, I’ll take my comments offline as it’s apparently not going to be reasonable responses. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.