* Perhaps the most futile gesture ever…
Republican members of Illinois’ congressional delegation want Attorney General Lisa Madigan to sue to block the new health care overhaul.
Six lawmakers signed a letter Tuesday urging Madigan to join more than a dozen other state attorneys general who are claiming in court the law is unconstitutional.
Madigan’s office says it isn’t filing a lawsuit. Gov. Pat Quinn, a fellow Democrat, says Illinois won’t do anything to try to block health care reform.
The letter to Madigan was signed by U.S. Reps. Don Manzullo, Aaron Schock, Peter Roskam, Judy Biggert, John Shimkus and Tim Johnson.
This was about the “base,” not about any hopes that AG Madigan would act on this request.
Also, notice that Mark Kirk isn’t on that list of letter writers. [ADDING: Kirk’s absence is a bit puzzling since he promised just the other day to “lead the effort” to repeal the new law.]
* But top Democrats in the GA are nervous about this law. A week ago, the House took up a resolution on the national healthcare issue…
[Resolved] we urge President Obama and the United States Congress to take immediate action to adopt meaningful heath care system reform in keeping with the Obama administration’s articulated goals
The resolution passed with just 62 votes, even though the Democrats have 70 seats.
Democrats voting “No” were Reps. Crespo, DeLuca, Farnham, Franks, McAsey, Sente and Walker. Rep. Jehan Gordon voted “Present.”
Except for Franks and probably Gordon, that’s most of the people on the Republican target list. The Repubs said they’d be whacking the Dems who voted “Yes” and claimed it was an indication that President Obama’s bill is not polling well in key districts. Perhaps the biggest surprise on that “No” list is Rep. Carol Sente, who has a north suburban district formally represented by Kathy Ryg, who quit the seat last year to take a job running Voices for Illinois Children, a statewide group that lobbies for greater health care spending, among other things.
* A new report by NCSL about states introducing measures to repeal or limit healthcare laws is probably destined to get some media coverage. From the report…
As part of state-based responses to federal health reform legislation, individual members of at least 36 state legislatures are using the legislative process to seek to limit, alter or oppose selected state or federal actions, including single-payer provisions and mandates that would require purchase of insurance. In general the measures seek to make or keep health insurance optional, and allow people to purchase
any type of coverage they may choose. The individual state language varies.
Make sure to keep a few things in mind if this does break through. First and foremost, an introduced bill or resolution often means nothing. The Senate Republicans here could introduce a bill banning compliance with the national law and it would never get out of Rules Committee, for instance.
And then there’s this…
None of the other proposals [besides Virginia and Idaho] listed have been finally approved; Arizona’s resolution of June 2009 was the first measure to have passed the legislative process; A Utah bill passed both chambers and awaits action by the governor. A Tennessee and a Georgia bill has passed one chamber; Constitutional resolutions have advanced through initial steps in Florida, Georgia and Missouri (3/16/10). One amendment failed to pass in Georgia on 3/18/10.
“Did not pass” measures: So far in 2010, bills have been rejected or failed to pass in: Indiana, Mississippi, New Hampshire, New Mexico, South Dakota and Wyoming. A Non-binding resolution in Indiana passed the Senate but did not pass the House.
Many of the measures appear to modeled on the conservative legislative group ALEC’s “Freedom of Choice Act,” which was unveiled in 2008. Most of these state proposals appear to have been introduced last year, and they haven’t moved since.
Also, keep this in mind…
In 29 of the states, the proposals include a proposed constitutional amendment by ballot question. In a majority of these states, their constitution includes an additional “hurdle” for passage - requiring either a “supermajority of 60% or 67% for passage, or requiring two affirmative votes in two seprate years, such as 2010 and 2011.
* Related…
* State Insurance Director Michael McRaith discusses the impact of health care reform on Illinois: Right now, ICHIP is prohibitively expensive, with premiums of $12,000 to $16,000 annually. It’s funded two-thirds by premiums and one-third by general revenue funds. The federal law shifts that burden so enrollees pay no more than 35 percent of the cost of the program. That’s about a 30 percent reduction in costs. Our expectation is that we’ll get clear guidance from Washington (about who can get insurance through the pools) within 90 days. We expect an implementation time of 15 to 45 days following that. Since individuals in Illinois can be denied health insurance for any reason other than race, religion, color or national origin, we expect a large number of people will sign up.
- wordslinger - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:02 am:
Kirk’s smart to go his own way and not get tied down by the other GOP members. He can always call for it on his own.
- M - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:05 am:
Let’s not forget one key point- these states can pass all the laws they want limiting the scope of the new health legislation. They’re all meaningless. Federal law trumps state laws.
- Yellow Dog Democrat - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:05 am:
How dumb are Republicans?
With everything that’s going on in Springfield, they want to nationalize next fall’s elections?
Um, okay, Voters, who do you trust more: Barack Obama or Sarah Palin?
Done.
- Loop Lady - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:08 am:
These people need to do something constructive for government for once in their careers…they have naysaying and negativism down as an art form…
- VanillaMan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:09 am:
This isn’t unusual. Historically, whenever federal legislation had been passed that was questionably constitutional, states do this. This is how we create and craft our laws. Just because a law is federal, doesn’t mean states are automatically powerless. This is a federal system, so states can craft responding legislation and pass it if approved, so that the issue is best presented to the US Supreme Court for consideration.
While this is happening, proponents of the passed federal legislation review, amend, and change the legislation being challenged. Just because the US Congress passes something doesn’t mean it is a done deal just as they passed it. We live in a federal government system, not royalty.
That said, any opponents of any federal legislation within a state government can propose state laws that counter, or correct the federal legislation. How do you think we’ve gotten state-approved euthanasia, medical marijuana and other laws that counter federal laws?
I guess what is news here, is the fact that this federal legislation is only hours old. That is unusual. But not when you consider how partisan and how unpopular this federal legislation is. We have had rare occasions where federal legislation has been immediately countered at state levels, but not recently. This is happening now.
So, it is completely within any political party’s state power to craft state legislation countering, modifying, clarifying or correcting a federal law. This happens everyday all across the US.
With 2700 pages, there are more loopholes, more problems, more challenges ahead for this law. You simply cannot pass any law this size, covering every single American citizen, every single undocumented citizen, every single American yet to be born, and expect it to be rock solid and functioning immediately after a president’s signature.
Now I know that there is a sizable minority in the country willing to follow willy-nilly this legislation right off the nearest cliff. They are the faithful believers in god-knows-what. As for the rest of us, we still retain our constitutional rights to question this law. Considering it’s personal impact, fiscal irresponsibilities, and blatant unconstitutionality, this has to happen or we might as just well never have fought that Revolution against King George back in 1776.
The fact that this is political, doesn’t make it any less important or should lessen our responsibilities in dealing with it properly and legally.
- Team America - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:18 am:
Sente’s “no” vote was a pretty transparent attempt to establish some independence from Madigan & Co. to counter expected GOP hits that she’s simply a machine politician. But even if we tried to give her the benefit of the doubt, where was the press release listing her criticisms of ObamaCare that led her to vote no? Where were her calls to Congresscritters Foster and Bean, et al., to urge them to vote against ObamaCare? Dan Sugrue, an accomplished attorney, is going to have a field day with his cross examination…
- Small Town Liberal - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:20 am:
- The fact that this is political, doesn’t make it any less important or should lessen our responsibilities in dealing with it properly and legally. -
So the responsible thing to do is just immediately request that it be declared to be unconstitutional? Come on, I’m all for reasonable protest of federal regulation, and I agree with most of your post. But if you’re trying to excuse this behavior I’d have to say you’re reaching at best.
- Montrose - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:23 am:
*undocumented citizen*
VM
a) holy oxymoron, batman
b) if the health care bill covers undocumented individuals, they did an amazing job of hiding it.
- George - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:25 am:
Yawn.
- Justice - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:28 am:
If you want to assure that Attorney General Lisa Madigan does nothing, get this highly partisan group to sign a petition, and leave off any Democrat. Great Scott, that might show unity and the ‘party of no’ just can’t have that.
Divided we continue to stand. Looks like the Republican whine machine is kicking into gear, again.
Sure, there are going to be challenges for this legislation, but it might, just might help if we actually tried to make the best of it. You know, work together. But then I hope, and of late that hasn’t worked.
- Peggy SO-IL - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:30 am:
M–There is much SCOTUS case law protecting state regulatory rights, from the utility industries in particular. There’s also that thing called the 10th amendment. Feds don’t always get to preempt states. That said, my conclusion is that the utter failure of the 50 states to regulate insurers in a way to provide competition and lower prices has led us to this bad law.
I don’t expect Madigan to challenge the law. Why doesn’t she get with state insurance regulators, legislators, the govenor and hammer out some revised state regulation to remove barriers to entry and allow the offering of low-cost catastrophic-only coverage for young healthy people. That would be a great start.
- Team Sleep - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:37 am:
This may have been a time when the GOP chiefs of staff in D.C. advised Kirk’s office against signing off on a “Dear” letter. The bills have already been passed, and Kirk will talk enough on the stump and trail that voters will soon learn of his displeasure with healthcare reform. Sometimes, a candidate and his staff have to be careful and judiscious. None of the MOCs who signed on to the letter have a tough race in November; Kirk most certainly does.
- The Doc - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:40 am:
Thanks for regurgitating the GOP talking points, VanMan. I typically ignore your tea-party fueled rants, but your most recent post irks more than most other of your overheated diatribes.
I’m confused as to what you find so repulsive about this legislation. I can appreciate that there are elements of the bill that you may disagree with (as I do); perhaps you feel that it addresses a problem that doesn’t exist.
You admit the gambit by IL Republicans asking Madigan to sue to block HCR is purely political, red meat for a frenzied base. Yet, in many of your posts, you take to the woodshed pols that engage in political theater and offer no viable alternatives.
The HCR lawsuit is the ultimate in political pandering - and you’ve explicitly endorsed it.
- Rob N - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:40 am:
So the Republicans who keep whining about the state’s red ink want the state’s Attorney General to waste the state’s money tilting at the GOP’s anti-Obama windmills?
I realize the GOP will simply oppose Obama no matter what but cognitive dissonance much?
The “ObamaCare” legislation he just signed is very much like policies the GOP of not-so-long-ago proposed as it is. Even Kirk’s titular campaign lead John Cornyn is saying the GOP shouldn’t repeal all of it just some ambiguous “some of it” … y’know, just the parts the teabaggerazzi hate … (which seems to be all of it).
PS - It’ll be interesting to see how polling in those targeted districts shifts since national insta-polling (ie, USA Today) already saw a pretty significant solidifying of support for the law.
- Will County Woman - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:46 am:
Kirk is smart to stay away from this issue, things are too hot and ugly right now. attacking Alexi g. on taxes is smart and exactly the type of things kirk should be doing. he should avoid hot-button issues as much as possible, or tamp them down as much as he can right now.
- Bill - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:51 am:
Vannie speaks as a person who already has a cadillac insurance plan (paid for by us, by the way). It is the typical “I got mine so who cares” attitude of the radical right.
- Boggles the Mind - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 10:53 am:
VM, for every person “willing to follow” the health care bill, I’m willing to bet there are two more who are opposing this bill for no other reason than they’ve been told by Glenn Beck and Co. that the bill will lead to the certain destruction of mankind as we know it. “Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together…mass hysteria!”
Reasonable people can point to certain aspects of the bill that concern them and that is why they oppose it; reasonable people also support it and can tell you specifically why. But there are plenty of nuts out there who have no clue what they oppose or why they oppose it. That kind of mob mentality and unwillingness to think for oneself is terrifying.
- Responsa - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:01 am:
Mr. McRaith has been blanketing the airwaves for the past two days. His approach seems to be that he praises the federal legislation without exception and is unwilling to give credence to any issues related to potential coverage, timeline or mandate flaws whatsoever. He routinely challenges anyone, doctors, economists, business owners, etc. who have legitimate concerns for consideration in the bill’s implementation–to the extent that he often seems argumentative. I have yet to hear him even acknowledge the massive new unfunded medical payment obligations being put on the already strapped states. He appears to be using the authority of his position to try to “sell” the new law to the citizens of Illinois which clearly is not his job. I don’t know who, but somebody needs to rein him in. He is obviously out to make a name for himself at the expense of the credibility of the state insurance department.
- wordslinger - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:06 am:
VMan’s singing the old nullification song, first made popular by John C. Calhoun and brought back by the tea-partiers.
The issue was settled at a little court house in Virginia in 1865.
- Henry Massingale - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:09 am:
3/23/2010: When I first started to build this web site to help President Obama I had no idea it would become the largest site in the United States. In order for you to understand, I like President Obama , and I will jump into any blog that speaks bad of him in a moral issue,” This will not be tolerated by me.” I even helped get him into office, But FASC Concepts is to reach out to President Obama and have him stand with the people and to be as one with us again. To remove this force pay and merge the views of 250 million people within this Bill to law. To build the most powerful Health Care Health Reform Stimulus Package ever thought of by me. But I have protested this Bill because of its lacks of moral value, against the People. Is There A Constitutional Infringement of a Moral Value for Health Care vs. The People
Part 1: 3/22/2010: { recapped for short input}
I had to wait for this Bill to be passed in order to show the Republican Party, GOP and FRC Action that it is the voice of the people that guides the destiny of this Country. I guess you could say I needed them to get out of the way so that the last Comic Standing will be FASC Concepts and we do not need the peoples money to assist the needs of the Peoples Rights.
As predicted , the first stages of the Health Care Bill was passed. Why, you ask ? It is because people wish to be seen for their in put of a view and not unite. What is lost is respect with in a concept of { Freedom Of Choice } to be a part of this system or not, with in this Health Care Force Pay Matrix.
What is offered by FASC Concepts is the Freedom Of Choice to President Obama, because we feel it is unconstitutional to force pay into the failures of Health Care Insurance Companies and then Tax that money. Even the insurance compainies plan to file suit. As you can see our elected officials are paying little attention to the public. As I reach out to my computer and I knock , knock, knock on the screen, and I say is there any body out there?
Health Care within a moral value, is to , {GIVE LIFE TO HOPE WHERE THERE IS NONE}
You will not find any lies posted at our site, that is not clarified…..
You can find the details on p23. At the link site for www.thebluepill.mysite.com on page 100 at the main site.
FASC Concepts in and for Pay it Forward covers the web, join us in a trickle effect on p23 the blue pill link, ? It will take 60 seconds of your time….
on google , yahoo, and aol www.fascmovement.mysite.com
Join us in the
“International Boycott Of The Arabic Drug Empire” When I wrote my first “International Boycott Of The Arabic Drug Empire” I just wanted to see the trickle effect it would have, with out stepping into a forth dimension and having my in site lost…..
The Arabic Drug Empire is the only one in the world that seeks to kill every last man woman and child in the world in order for their chosen few can repopulate the world….
Some say that a Boycott is a waist of time, but it would depend on what is said…
Henry Massingale
FASC Concepts in and for Pay It Forward
www.fascmovement.mysite.com on google look for page 1 american dream
- VanillaMan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:13 am:
Thanks for regurgitating the GOP talking points, VanMan. Just because the GOP is bring this issue up, doesn’t mean it won’t be the Democrats doing the exact same thing on another issue, using the same legal procedures. This is normal procedures happening every day. This is how our laws are crafted. Get over it.
Reasonable people can point to certain aspects of the bill that concern them and that is why they oppose it; reasonable people also support it and can tell you specifically why. So why are you confronting reasonable people addressing their concerns? Your politics is over-riding your own common sense.
Vannie speaks as a person who already has a cadillac insurance plan I was already told that my health insurance premiums will be going up 50%. I can’t afford a Cadillac, or even a used Kia, thanks to the all-knowing Wizards of DC.
I realize the GOP will simply oppose Obama no matter what… I thought a year ago there were millions upon millions of “GOP Obamacans”, so how could you just make a statement so full of millions of holes?
I’m confused as to what you find so repulsive about this legislation. Any legislation passed in this manner is repulsive. The issue it attempted to address is inmaterial. I don’t care if the law promises everyone a free pony, you don’t support partisan legislation overriding popular opinion - ever. You don’t let governments dismiss you - ever. Even in wartime I would expect our governments to respect those opposed to war and listen. What has transpired has not been about health care. It is about a group of government leaders of only one political party, dictating the terms on an issue involving your life. I don’t care which party. I don’t care which issue.
And I am not the only Democrat unhappy over this. So stop accusing me of being a GOP-anything.
- dupage dan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:14 am:
The koolaid must be mighty tasty today. The abyss we have jumped off is without a bottom. With all the fiscal horror we face in this state and in this country the choice to enact this legislation is simply mind bending. Drink up folks.
All this talk of reducing gov’t spending at the state level is meaningless in the face of this monstrosity. Yeah, everyone can point to the sad story of any number of individuals who have had a hard time of it medically. This new program will solve all those problems? You really think so?
So much of this comes from our belief that we have a right to visit a doctor anytime we have the sniffles and someone else will pay for it. It comes from our belief that we have a right to endless life - immortality is just one medical breakthru away.
The Scots think death is imminent.
The Canadians think death is inevitable.
Californians think death is optional.
- Loop Lady - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:16 am:
Rich,
The last post is giving me a severe case of the willies…please help me (hint, hint)
- Brennan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:23 am:
Rich: “Freedom of Choice Act”
ALEC: “Freedom of Choice in Health Care Act”
Can you explain Rich? I think that deserves a correction.
- VanillaMan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:23 am:
VMan’s singing the old nullification song, first made popular by John C. Calhoun and brought back by the tea-partiers.
Nah, I’m just asking that the pro-Obama forces consider the way laws are passed, processed and judicated. Just because The One has passed a law, doesn’t mean we have to suspend all of our rights and bow down to him. We don’t do that for any president.
wordslinger’s singing the old Loyalist’s song, first made popular by the King’s Men during the Revolution and brought back by Chicago Democrats.
- Boggles the Mind - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:23 am:
===So why are you confronting reasonable people addressing their concerns? Your politics is over-riding your own common sense.===
Re-read my post, friend. My issue is with the dittoheads who blindly listen to whatever talk show hosts tell them, irregardless of whether it is factual. In fact, common sense is exactly what I am arguing for, if you bothered to pay attention to the post instead of jumping to conclusions and getting defensive. Stop. Read. Digest. Then write.
- CLJ - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:24 am:
=They are the faithful believers in god-knows-what.=
Believing in the “Life” part of “Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness” is pretty key to the whole belief structure of our nation. Without life, you sure can’t have liberty or happiness. It is long over due that healthcare become a right and not a consumer product. Using market principles for healthcare is set up for failure. This is precisely what we have seen in this country. The demand for healthcare will never decrease, everyone wants to live healthy! So why would the market place decrease prices. You pay whatever they say so you can continue to live.
So I’d say some of us are faithful believers in living a long healthy life.
Love the Calhoun “nullification” reference. Calhoun had no problem backing down when Jackson threatened to send Federal troops into Charleston and hang him from a tree.
- wordslinger - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:25 am:
–Any legislation passed in this manner is repulsive. The issue it attempted to address is inmaterial. I don’t care if the law promises everyone a free pony, you don’t support partisan legislation overriding popular opinion - ever.–
You mean by a vote of the elected Senate and House and the signature of the elected president?
“Overriding popular opinion?” I guess it depends on what posse you’re rolling with. It certainly seemed unpopular among the spitting, n-bomb- dropping crowd at the Capitol last weekend. But I’m guessing they really don’t speak for anyone.
LBJ, Democrats and Republicans like Dirksen and Javits passed the Civil Rights Acts of the 1960s that were highly unpopular in some parts of the country. It gave the South to the GOP, but that’s life in the NFL.
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:25 am:
VMan, enough. Stay on topic or you’re gonna find yourself in a timeout today.
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:28 am:
VM - “Partisan legislation overriding popular opinion?” Huh? The majority of people in the country support either this legislation or something stronger. Obama and the Democrats ran on passing health care reform — and won the election of 2008.
Even if a temporary majority of a particular were against the law, we have a republic. Representatives are elected and use their judgment. If they’re defeated, they’re defeated. But we don’t pass law by polls. Or by Fox talking points.
- Brennan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:29 am:
=LBJ, Democrats and Republicans like Dirksen and Javits passed the Civil Rights Acts of the 1960s that were highly unpopular in some parts of the country. It gave the South to the GOP, but that’s life in the NFL.=
Dems to GOP: Here. Take the Midwest too.
- VanillaMan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:29 am:
You admit the gambit by IL Republicans asking Madigan to sue to block HCR is purely political, red meat for a frenzied base. Yet, in many of your posts, you take to the woodshed pols that engage in political theater and offer no viable alternatives.
Everyone knows this, and yes it is condemnable. What we also must recall is that this is how laws are crafted in a federalized government system. The fact that this has an overwhelming political angle doesn’t mean we should dismiss it as only a political stunt. This new law is real, and we should treat it as real.
The more our party attempts to suffocate concerned Americans over this bad legislation, the stronger the backlash will be in November.
I liked it better when our party pretended to care.
- wordslinger - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:30 am:
–The One has passed a law, doesn’t mean we have to suspend all of our rights and bow down to him.–
I missed that bit. What rights are you talking about? When does the suspension start?
What’s “judicated?”
- Brennan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:31 am:
Vman: Take the lumps and tatoo the Democrats with their sudden embrace of the Republic because 12 months from now they’ll be rejecting the Republic and saying we’re a Democracy again.
- VanillaMan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:33 am:
VMan, enough. Stay on topic or you’re gonna find yourself in a timeout today.
Sorry. I’m upset over the new poll showing my Congressional friend down 12 points. This legislation is a disaster for us and we have to start turning this around by listening and respecting those opposed to it.
- dupage dan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:34 am:
Boggles,
The word should be regardless or irrespective. Your word - “irregardless” contains a double negative within it. Not proper english. Just sayin’
CLJ,
A brief review of the market forces at work in one area of healthcare - lasic surgery. Not supported by insurance plans, generally. Was expensive when first brought out - like any product or comodity in the early going. Later, innovation, economies of scale and efficiencies were brought out as various competitors worked to secure their corner of the market. The gov’t role of ensuring safe effective procedures were in place. Voila - as if by magic - costs went….down! How to explain?
To claim that the current system was in any way a free market is to ignore the facts. Insurance companies not allowed to compete across state lines is but one of the devices that prevented a free market from operating. The whole system is fubar anyway. Doesn’t work because most medical costs are paid by 3rd party payors. A recipe for disaster. Medicare works, people say. Really? It is nearly bankrupt - can’t be sustained. Medicaid costs are humongous - can’t be sustained. The solution - expand it. Insanity.
- MikeMacD - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:36 am:
It is my understanding that no one is actually “mandated” to have health insurance under this bill. If you don’t have insurance you simply pay more in income tax (16th amendment). Sort of like if you don’t have children you pay more tax than if you did or if you don’t install solar panels you pay more tax than if you did.
- Deep South - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:45 am:
Lets see:
The GOP lost in 2006;
The GOP lost in 2008;
The GOP lost in 2010 (HRC);
If the GOP and it’s noisy minions keep it up…their goal of winning majorities in Nov will be lost. Then the party in-fighting begins…and then, well, there may be no more GOP.
- Brennan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:51 am:
Look on the bright side. The President’s “Patients Bill of rights on steroids” doesn’t kick in for children until 2014.
Mark McGwire has questions about the effective application of these steroids.
- dupage dan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:51 am:
DS
=and then, well, there may be no more GOP=
That has been said about both political parties over the years. They are both still here. Silly.
- fedup dem - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:56 am:
I was surprised to note the absence of Cong. Roskam from the nonsenical request made by his fellow dwarfs/Illinois Republican Congressmen. (Of course the difference between these seven and the ones in Snow White’s tale is that only one from the latter group was Dopey!)
- Deep South - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:57 am:
DD…
But you agree with the rest of my post?
- Carl Nyberg - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 11:58 am:
VMan, which constituency makes more sense for a Democrat to court.
1. Activists opposed to the health care bill.
2. Low information voters who have a gut reaction against the bill, but don’t much about it.
My guess is the activists are Republicans who are implacable.
My guess is that a Democrat’s best strategy is to try to win over the low information voters by highlighting parts of the bill they like or getting them to focus on something else where they agree with the Democratic Party.
I apologize if I have continued to move the conversation away from the original topic, but VMan’s comment made me think of the choice facing Dems.
- dupage dan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 12:08 pm:
DS,
You posted known facts but drew a faulty conclusion. What’s to agree with?
- Ghost - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 12:11 pm:
I find it hypocritical that the GOP people fighting the health care bill are almost all on a government backed and finacially supported health insurance plan.
Lets ammend state and federal law to prohibit elected officials from having insurance through their elected offices and/or that are backed by the govt or paid for weith tax payer dollars. Let them purchase it all in the private secotr as an individual or try and pick it up via a spouse. Then we can talk.
- CircularFiringSquad - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 12:11 pm:
Yikes!
StateWide Tom, RxRon and the blowhards were beat to the punch by Manzullo …..talk about snail’s pace.
And what about CommandoKirk? Did he not want to get his shiny flight suit soiled by asking anything of the AG
As you remember the old flight suit was solied when the AG said BOO and the Commando dropped plans to run for governor.
Maybe the crew can call BrickHeadJoe Birkett and get a suit filed in DuPage by one of those hacks BHJ pays to file at the airport cases.
- Brennan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 12:16 pm:
=I find it hypocritical that the GOP people fighting the health care bill are almost all on a government backed and finacially supported health insurance plan.=
It’s employer mandate isn’t it? Nobody forces them to work in Congress. They choose to.
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 12:19 pm:
Again, people, stick to the topic at hand. Final warning.
- Ghost - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 12:32 pm:
==== It’s employer mandate isn’t it? Nobody forces them to work in Congress. They choose to. ====
huh?
- The REAL Anonymous fka Anonymous - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 12:38 pm:
CFS, all of your spewing, crticism, muckracking, rumor mongering, etc. is helping unite v. divide. I hope that’s your objective, because you’re failing miserably if it’s not.
- Deep South - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 1:30 pm:
DD:
===If the GOP and it’s noisy minions keep it up…their goal of winning majorities in Nov will be lost. Then the party in-fighting begins…===
- Rob N - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 2:05 pm:
Will County Woman says, “attacking Alexi g. on taxes is smart and exactly the type of things kirk should be doing.”
…As opposed to advocating a repeal which, by the way, would eliminate small business tax breaks that will help cover insurance costs for employees?
…As opposed to saying he’ll lead the fight for that very repeal but then being strangely absent and silent when his Congressional colleagues call on the AG to help in the effort to eliminate those tax breaks for small businesses (among other things)?
Then again, maybe Kirk is still “waiting” (ie, cowering) to see what Lisa Madigan will do first anyway.
- Rob N - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 2:36 pm:
Brennan opines, “It’s employer mandate isn’t it? Nobody forces them to work in Congress. They choose to.”
Same for the insurance coverage clause in the healthcare legislation which too many are mislabeling as some sort of “mandate”.
It is, rather, a choice between purchasing coverage or paying a tax to cover the societal costs (ie, ER costs) of your lack of coverage.
Moreover, this only comes into play if you are not already covered through some other means (ie, your job) and only if you are able to afford coverage in the first place. If you cannot afford it, there will be credits available to help cover it.
- the Patriot - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 2:37 pm:
This is a loser for Republicans because we know the dems won’t do anyting, but especially Lisa Madigan. Rather then ask for a fight, I would ask for her legal opinion as to whether or not it is legal and Quinn’s opinion on how much it will cost us. It is not federalizing the state elections when an unfunded mandate the Governor and AG support will cost the state billions when we are already broke. Quinn already admitted he doesn’t know the cost. Pushing Lisa Madigan for a legal opinion would pin her down because it is obviously raises some Constitutional questions.
If I was her opponent I put this as issue number one. The fact is Lisa Madigan and her staff lacks the legal minds to perform the legal analysis and that is why she will duck it and stick to the what daddy will let her do.
Pingback Illinois Republicans Work To Repeal Health Reform, Attorney General Lisa Madigan Not Interested | GoodPorkBadPork.com - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 2:56 pm:
[…] “This was about the ‘base,’ not about any hopes that AG Madigan would act on this request,” Capitol Fax blog’s Rich Miller pointed out. […]
Pingback Illinois Republicans Work To Repeal Health Reform, Attorney General Lisa Madigan Not Interested | Blog All Over The World.com - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 2:58 pm:
[…] “This was about the ‘base,’ not about any hopes that AG Madigan would act on this request,” Capitol Fax blog’s Rich Miller pointed out. […]
- Brennan - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 3:17 pm:
Any update on that correction Rich?
- T.J. - Wednesday, Mar 24, 10 @ 8:37 pm:
“Perhaps the biggest surprise on that ‘No’ list is Rep. Carol Sente, who has a north suburban district formally represented by Kathy Ryg, who quit the seat last year to take a job running Voices for Illinois Children, a statewide group that lobbies for greater health care spending, among other things.”
I don’t understand how the district is formally represented by Ryg. Is Sente informally acting representative until Ryg comes back? Only in Illinois.
- Henry Massingale - Thursday, Mar 25, 10 @ 10:19 am:
3/08/2010
There is a unity lost between Governing Parties that is needed to help the people feel secure. The moral building block for Health Care.
To see the true Health Care Tax forum you must stop thinking in 3-D,This multi tax forum is against a $100 Trillion Dollar system.. …
To force pay into another system of failures within Health Care Insurance Groups.
This economy will not balance with this concept of a tax forum against the Health Care System. The issue of how to force pay into this system of Health Care may have worked but I am still troubled over the progressive tax forum within this Bill. It covers so many items and Countries that it only forces the system to adjust itself. In some areas, increases against the people and the troubled economy, and in other areas, less effects will be felt.
But this is my big problem, Government Officials seek help and they are to proud to ask us, “the true working force of Government.” It is understandable they have failed the People and within the United States Of America all we ask is to see us as who we are and not try to bring us into this world of the intellectual. I guess our Prime Directive is that of Star Trek, so it must be understood that for millions of people we are just as happy as can be making $13.00 per hour and we have no interest in this world of politics, and how to be a Enstine. Government Officials must understand that there is a level of people within different parts of this Country, that seek to be only that they find to make them happy.
As for this economy well, it is said that the U.S.A. Arms Division has created enough arsenal to destroy every last creature in the world 2 times over,built with tax dollars. This would be funny if not for the irony of it. And now as time has passed Government Officials keep failing. Before 9/11 all the way to today.
As it is in a world of a system, when employees continue to fail, one or two things happen, one; you get fired, two; if you see into a person a good, then it is political correct to implement a penalty or roll back in pay. But this implement of penalty is more favored in the course of action in the Federal Employment World. So how to fix the economy and unite it with the Health Care issue. It would be in the Countries best interest to implement a 10% per cent penalty against every State, County and Government Official within this Matrix of failures. Hey what is that old saying, what is good for the Goose is good for the Gander. I am serous about this, it is past due to show that our Government Officials they have failed, their system failure reaches into this world of warnings that they brush aside as if the information is not worthy noting. From Pearl Harbor to 9/11/2001 to 3/07/2010 of our tax system and Health Care Reform. This 10% per cent penalty should go into the Health Care Forum.
The big problem that Government Officials have is that they have no street credit. President Obama still has some but if he does not take his family and step away from these dueling Parties, that fight over this Health Care Dollar, and stand with Us he will lose all credit from the streets to the county.
President Obama, I would say to you, you have one last chance to regain the hopes and dreams of the American People. To reach out in a concept that states, if there is 250 million people in trouble because of these failures, I would give all my money to them and then I would say to all that I gave money to, “I have no money left, would you all please give me $1.00 back and then I would have $250. million dollars to start all over again.”
As for this $100,trillion dollar in site………….
Results 1 - 10 of about 685,000 for net worth of medicine development industry
Just to show how deep this Health Care Tax split petition reaches. The term split petition is used because of the Tax factor plan that is not seen because of the intent not to show a capital Taxing of close to a $100 trillion dollar package, a yearly system income, not profit…..
Some have stated that I clam to have spiritual in site or something of the sort. I assure you this is not true, so when I state that I asked God to help, it is my way of saying hey Bobby show me how to work on theses Chevy engines. But I do thank you for the consideration. Consider me a cross of Jethro Bodine from the Beverly Hill Billies with my 10th. Grade education and Vin Diesel from the move Pitch Black.
So drop on by and see page 100 at our site and follow the blue pill link
Health Care within a moral value, is to ,
{ GIVE LIFE TO HOPE WHERE THERE IS NONE }
Henry Massingale
FASC Concepts in and for Pay It Forward
www.fascmovement.mysite.com on google. yahoo, and Aol.com
please take the time and visit all my new friends on the net and if you wish to post with FASC Concepts you will be most welcomed. So join us and share your ideas as one in one voice.
- Joe Bell - Thursday, Mar 25, 10 @ 5:16 pm:
=== 1. Activists opposed to the health care bill. ===
=== 2. Low information voters who have a gut reaction against the bill, but don’t much about it. ===
Hi Carl, interesting classification scheme, but fraught with dangerous assumptions. My own experience is that I, as an independent, become more “implacable” the more I know about what’s in the bill. Most people who have bothered to actually read any of the several versions that have emerged over time have noted a number of problems with the bill’s constitutionality. There are multiple fundamental rights that hang in doubt in this bill. Freedom of contract, for example. Freedom of association. Basic medical privacy rights. Oh, and the freedom to do just nothing. Yes there is such a thing. It’s called the no duty rule, and I used it recently to get my guy out of a subrogation case.
Freedom is a beautiful thing. It lets us define ourselves. Unless some enlightened federal bureaucrat comes along and demands, for example, that I pay for someone else to destroy the life of an unborn child. Somehow, that just doesn’t fit my definition of me, and never will. But oh yes, it’s in the bill. Just ask Bart. Or read it for yourself, if you must.
So once upon a time, there was freedom …
But now there’s the Individual Mandate (and yes it is too a mandate – the “tax” is a thinly disguised individual penalty for disobedient behavior – woof woof). Under the Individual Mandate, we will all have a newly minted duty (that never existed before in all the history of common law), imposed on us simply for existing, to pay for everyone else’s bet that they will get sick or hurt and win the healthcare lotto. Because that’s what health insurance is, a bet between you and the insurer that you will incur higher medical costs than you will pay in premiums. Otherwise, who would pay a thousand dollars a month and never even bother to get really sick? What a waste of money that would be. No ROI, no joy.
So I think the Democrat’s best ploy to regain control of the social debate is to keep dumbing down voters to where they can’t read bills and don’t expect their congressmen to do so either. That way, with such low expectations, they will never be disappointed. Who knows? Congressional ratings might even improve.