Timing is everything
Monday, May 20, 2013 - Posted by Rich Miller
* AP…
Seeking to keep pace with changing technology, Illinois toughened penalties Saturday for those who use social media and text messaging to organize violent “flash mobs” like those that have occurred on Chicago’s Michigan Avenue and in other tourist areas.
Gov. Pat Quinn signed legislation doubling the maximum prison term for offenders to six years. The legislation was in direct response to recent incidents in downtown Chicago that left business owners fearful that tourists and other visitors would be scared off. Bill sponsor Rep. Christian Mitchell, a Chicago Democrat, has said it will also make neighborhoods throughout the state safer.
“Nobody should have to worry about a violent mob attack when going about their daily lives,” Quinn said in a written statement, calling the use of technology to organize such action a “troubling trend.”
Police say groups of young people used Facebook and Twitter, as well as text messaging, to organize and publicize a mob action along Michigan Avenue in March. They say several hundred people — most of them teenagers — ran up and down the upscale shopping area, yelling and bumping into people.
* WGN…
Chicago Police arrested 11 juveniles and one adult for obstruction of traffic and recklessness according to Chicago Police News Affairs. Charges are now pending.
Before roughly 7 PM Saturday, a large group of teens gathered in front of Saks Fifth Avenue on Michigan Avenue. A second group gathered near Oak Street Beach and another moved west on Chicago Avenue from Michigan Avenue. Witnesses say one group blocked traffic on LaSalle Street. Police say they weren’t violent, but one witness tells WGN he saw a group attack and beat a young woman.
Police officers on bicycles flooded the area and moved the group along.
The disturbances caused by these large groups of teens came just hours after Governor Pat Quinn signed a new bill cracking down on flash mob violence organized through the use of social media.
* By the way, a whole lot of commenters here about this new law have been badly misinformed. The new penalties only apply to those already convicted. From the synopsis…
Amends the Unified Code of Corrections. Provides that using electronic communications to solicit or commit mob action may be used by the court to impose an extended term sentence upon conviction. [Emphasis added.]
The law merely gives judges an avenue to throw the book at people who’ve already been convicted of mob action.
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 11:01 am:
It remains sort of boggling that CPD does not seem to get that on warm weekend nights, this sort of stuff happens.
The response was good once it arrived, but it was late.
It seems like we need a change in Chicago. If Rahm won’t make changes in CPD, we need to look at other alternatives.
- Anon - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 11:04 am:
How many people have been convicted and sentenced to 3 years under to old law?
We talking hundreds?
- wordslinger - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 11:16 am:
–It remains sort of boggling that CPD does not seem to get that on warm weekend nights, this sort of stuff happens.–
People are getting gunned down in the neighborhoods. On North Michigan Avneue, no assaults, no robberies, no guns, no body counts.
Groups of youths hanging around and causing a ruckus at that McDonald’s at State and Chicago ain’t a new development. It’s been going on for decades and it seems to me the cops were on it right away.
My guess is that with the Red Line being shut down, there will be less groups of youths running in traffic on North Michigan Avenue, so we can all breathe a sigh of relief — unless you live in the neighborhoods, where the real trouble is.
- Responsa - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 11:27 am:
Nothing will kill a tourist and primo business/sightseeing area quicker than getting a reputation that marauding gangs of thugs are intimidating and threatening people who are just minding their own business. The actual percentage of crime may in fact be quite low and as others have said, the groups may be able to be easily dispersed by police presence and pressure. But the issue that cannot be ignored here is the perception that the area around the Mag Mile has become significantly less safe and less pleasant–and that despite Rahm’s and the police chief’s continual assurances to the contrary, that perception/reputation is definitely out there and is being fed by the word of mouth of folks who have witnessed it.
- Precinct Captain - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 11:43 am:
==If Rahm won’t make changes in CPD, we need to look at other alternatives.==
So Rahm should meddle in the day-to-day operations of the police department? Is FOP going to walk along with this? Chiefs? Commanders?
As for “marauding gangs of thugs” mentioned by Responsa, this is exactly the kind of attitude that is insidious in society. A group of black kids cussing loud is supposed to be the ultimate group of loose criminals and it’s all linked to their heritage and such? Funny how no one says them same thing about the Beverly kids who invade the Rock Island Line every summer creating rackets like there is no tomorrow and illegally consuming coolers of beer at beaches. What’s the difference between them and these incidents that make the news?
- Chavez-respecting Obamist - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 11:48 am:
I work some odd hours right off the Mag Mile, and I’ve seen no gangs of thugs marauding around. I have seen lots of Chicago’s Finest out on foot if it’s after dark though.
- Responsa - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 12:19 pm:
Geez, I had assumed that people would actually have read Rich’s post which included the governor’s statement and also clearly documented some actual incidences and dates where people were reportedly threatened and assaulted on or near the mag mile recently by marauding yoots. I also assumed that readers would notice that I specifically used the words “perception” and “reputation” in my comments to make a point, while being careful to say the numbers and percentages of crimes were small. Guess I should not assume.
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 12:37 pm:
Word,
On a warm weekend night, would you bring out of town guests to stroll down Michigan Ave?
I don’t think I would.
As you pointed out, this is nothing new. It is shocking only to our current Mayor and CPD.
Everybody else can easily predict it.
- wordslinger - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 12:40 pm:
–On a warm weekend night, would you bring out of town guests to stroll down Michigan Ave?–
Of course. Although it can be quite crowded with a lot of folks doing the same.
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 12:41 pm:
Precinct Captain,
Yes and he should go further and fire the people who are failing to respond.
This isn’t all that complex.
We’ve seen it over and over.
Stopping it seems pretty easy.
But it just doesn’t get done.
By the way PC, you are the only one who brought race into this. Don’t blame Responsa for it.
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 12:43 pm:
Word,
I’m not sure how much time you spend in the area.
I’ve lived there for about 20 years.
I’m OK walking in the area on warm evenings, but out of town guests? No, there are better options right now.
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 12:47 pm:
For what it worth, the reported stuff is only a small part.
Try sleeping with your windows open in the general area, and you will hear all sorts of conduct — a lot of drunks and a lot of gang members yelling at each other.
And then the next morning you see the alcohol bottles over the sidewalks.
Yet CPD says there is no issue.
- wordslinger - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 1:07 pm:
Henry, makes you wonder why all those multi-million-dollar condos, restaurants like RL, shops like Cartier and Tiffanys, and hotels like the Four Seasons, Peninsula and Ritz-Carlton are doing there. Sounds like a real combat zone, with no police presence at all.
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 1:23 pm:
“Henry, makes you wonder why all those multi-million-dollar condos, restaurants like RL, shops like Cartier and Tiffanys, and hotels like the Four Seasons, Peninsula and Ritz-Carlton are doing there.”
Really?
I don’t. I know they are there because it used to be a great area. Twenty years ago when I moved in, it was a wonderful area.
I don’t wonder why they are there. I wonder how long those places will stay. You mention RL. That’s a place more for the hicks without taste, but it is also a place that is at risk if this continues. Most of the activity is around Chicago Ave. If I worked for RL, I would be hiring additional security.
- TJ - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 1:29 pm:
Wait… so this would retroactively add jail time to people already convicted of offenses?
…. isn’t that the very definition of an ex post facto law?
- Rich Miller - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 1:40 pm:
===…. isn’t that the very definition of an ex post facto law?===
No.
- wordslinger - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 2:31 pm:
Obviously, downtown residents are quaking in fear.
Today’s Crains:
“Downtown apartment rents hit new high, but supply surge coming”
Read more: http://www.chicagorealestatedaily.com/article/20130520/CRED02/130529990/downtown-apartment-rents-hit-new-high-but-supply-surge-coming#ixzz2TrYzbhJk
Stay up-to-date on Chicago real estate with our free, daily e-newsletter
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 2:37 pm:
Word,
You really don’t seem to get the “plan for the future” concept.
Seriously dude, you’ve got the perfect Illinois mindset — “Stay the course and hope for the best.”
“We got a lot of money for rent, so let’s just ignore problems!” That’s your view, right?
Awesome attitude!
- wordslinger - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 2:37 pm:
–I’m OK walking in the area on warm evenings, but out of town guests? No, there are better options right now.–
Henry, every day of the year, thousands of out-owners pay hundreds of dollars a day — or even thousands — to spend the evening on North Michigan Avenue.
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 2:39 pm:
Yes Word, they do.
And if this continues, they will not.
Unlike you, I actually live in the area. Unlike you, I actually have my facts straight.
- Dan Bureaucrat - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 4:46 pm:
I doubt anyone thinks of this bill as anything but political pandering. It certainly won’t deter anything.
The best way to make a group of non-violent kids into violent, hopeless kids is to give them 6 years in prison.
- wordslinger - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 4:49 pm:
– Unlike you, I actually have my facts straight. –
Henry, please set me straight on my facts. And what “plans for the future” are you referring to?
- The Much More Patriot Person - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 5:02 pm:
My plans for the future would include adding police patrols to prevent this sort of stuff from happening.
I know, really radical.
- BobInPeoria - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 5:21 pm:
Wonder how the Chicago flash mobs will behave once Concealed Carry is finally legal in Illinois?
Should be interesting to see if some Concealed Carry supporters consider starting their own flash mobs later this summer, to send a message.
- Chicago Cynic - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 5:21 pm:
Two points on this. First, I work on S. Michigan Ave. and have previously pointed to the tagging problem. Look closely at the stickers on the planters and you’ll see what I’m talking about. It does create a perception problem.
Second, as I’ve said before, I think this is a prudent response to a real problem.
That said, let’s not overreact. I absolutely have and would bring out of town guests to Michigan Avenue on a warm summer’s night. It’s wonderful. And I’m still amazed at the huge numbers of tourists downtown late at night - but only amazed because I remember the 80s when it was a ghost town around here.
We have a vibrant downtown, but one we need to continue to be vigilant about to keep the tourists and their $$ coming in.
- wordslinger - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 5:25 pm:
–Should be interesting to see if some Concealed Carry supporters consider starting their own flash mobs later this summer, to send a message.–
What do you mean, Bob? Shooting kids for running in the street? Is that one of your 2nd Amendment rights — to be a vigilante?
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 5:32 pm:
Word beat me to it.
Word and I disagree as to whether a real problem exists, but we do agree that having some guy from Peoria open fire into a crowd is not the way to solve a problem, in the event that a problem does exist.
With regard to Chicago Cynic’s post — I think things are different as you get closer to Chicago Ave.
I’m out there pretty much every day. But it is one thing for me alone and it would be another if I had guests. Maybe I’m over-protective, but it does seems that when the temps go up, the conduct occurs and it is not something I want to deal with if I had family in from Montreal.
From what I can hear from my window (yes, I live that close), there seems to be more activity than in past years and I’m disappointed in the CPD response.
- BobInPeoria - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 6:16 pm:
word and HenryVK…Your bias betrays you….
Are you afraid to travel to the other 49 states of the US(that allow concealed carry)? Please don’t imagine what my point is.
Once people know you can carry legally in the city, they will be more likely to wonder if their victims(or nearby citizens) are packing. Which should lead to less of this flash mob behavior.
- wordslinger - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 6:21 pm:
–word and HenryVK…Your bias betrays you….–
No, Bob, your words reveal you.
–Should be interesting to see if some Concealed Carry supporters consider starting their own flash mobs later this summer, to send a message.–
Is your point not clear? What “message” do “flash mobs” with guns send?
And no, I’m not afraid to travel to any state. Or Chicago. Or of “flash mobs.” Or going about my daily business unarmed.
Just put me down as pretty much not afraid.
- HenryVK - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 6:21 pm:
Bob,
You are the guy who claimed that CC would be a solution.
We said that it is not a solution and that a flash mob of gun owners would be a bad idea.
We are not talking about 49 states. We are talking about you, Bob. We don’t think gun owners are dangerous. It is people like you who think that firing into a crowd is rational.
Firing into a crowd is a bad idea. Got it?
- CrookCounty60827 - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 9:25 pm:
Wait for the Illinois Appellate or Supreme Court to throw out the enhanced penalties as disproportionate, and thus, unconstitutional. Another flawed Illinois law to line lawyer’s pockets.
- Six Degrees of Separation - Monday, May 20, 13 @ 10:21 pm:
I agree that CC anti-flash mobs are not the solution. I wonder how the Chicago PD of, maybe 1968 or 1972, would have reacted to what’s going on now. Right or not, I have a feeling someone wouldn’t be feeling too good at the precinct station.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, May 21, 13 @ 12:03 am:
–I wonder how the Chicago PD of, maybe 1968 or 1972, would have reacted to what’s going on now–
If you’re talking about the hysteria over black kids running through traffic on North Michigan Avenue, I think you know what the CPD response would have been in 1968 or 1972.
Probably more than it would have been for white kids like me at Bluesfest in 1985 when Stevie Ray Vaughn played an extra hour at Petrillo in Grant Park.
After the show, we were hanging around smoking weed and drinking beer. About 1 a.m., the coppers said, “disperse,” one, two, three times.
After we ignored that, one of our crew took an old leather-tonged billy on the Achilles. We left in a hurry, dragging the poor fool through the park.
This kerfuffle over North Michigan Avenue, like many issues, makes me think many believe that God created the heavens and the earth two weeks ago, and all history is a week old.
For crying out loud, there’s blood running in the streets of the South and West Sides, and has been for some time. Michigan Avenue ain’t the problem, it’s not even in the neighborhood of the problem.