Excuses, excuses
Wednesday, Aug 7, 2013 - Posted by Rich Miller
* Yikes…
A month after reporting that Southern Illinois University had lost 257 computers in 2012, Auditor General Bill Holland found a similar situation within the state’s sprawling adult and youth prison systems.
In audits released Tuesday, Holland said 156 computers were deemed “lost” at the Illinois Department of Corrections, and another 84 were unaccounted for at the Illinois Department of Juvenile Justice.
The loss of 240 more state-owned computers within the state’s penal systems is problematic, Holland said.
* The DoC was rather blasé about the whole thing…
According to a new audit,there’s a risk confidential information stored on the computers could be exposed.
But D.O.C. spokesman Tom Shaer says that’s not likely.
“We don’t believe that these computers are laying around somewhere compromising security.”
Shaer says per the audit’s recommendation, the department is working to track them down.
“We’ll show, we believe, that these computers are either still in inventory and possibly service. Or were properly wiped clean, no security risk with information, and were discarded or properly disposed of. We just didn’t complete the paperwork due to human error during a time when the department was short-staffed. And it still is short-staffed.”
Shaer’s “explanation” is what a citizen might call “typical stupid government.”
Meh, so we lost some computers. I’m sure there’s no problem. Don’t worry. Trust us, they’re around here someplace. We’ll find them, just as soon as we get more money to hire more people.
Good managers find a way to make do with less. Bad managers blame budget cuts for everything that goes wrong.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:11 am:
It’s not an excuse but there is, in fact, a staff shortage. Ignore it if you want but it’s a fact. You should probably know a little bit more before you talk about it.
- LincolnLounger - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:13 am:
A staff shortage according to whom?
Corrections is just a wasteland.
- Formerly Known As... - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:15 am:
=== We don’t believe that these computers are laying around somewhere compromising security. ===
Whew. I was worried for a moment.
So you DO know where they are and what’s on them, after all, right? Right? Ummm, guys?
- WhoKnew - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:19 am:
First rule of Bureaucracy 101 – Sustain the Bureaucracy!!!!
- Small Town Liberal - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:21 am:
This is a bit overblown. I’m guessing these were old PCs taken by CMS for disposal, but not properly logged. Out of the thousands and thousands of state computers turned over each year, some paperwork is going to get messed up eventually.
For perspective, read the last paragraph, 15k computers at SIU alone, and most of those missing were old and outdated.
I’m not saying the agencies shouldn’t strive to be error free, but treating this as a crisis is a little much.
- gwece - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:21 am:
They are not lost, we just don’t know where they are!
- Stones - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:23 am:
Shaer was better when he was broadcasting sports on morning radio.
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:25 am:
Nothing of import will be on the computers, nothing is saved directly to the hard drives at DOC (all information is on the network applications or intranet drives).
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:28 am:
===but treating this as a crisis is a little much. ===
Y’all in the governor’s office make this sort of argument way too much.
Nobody is treating this as some big crisis. Enough with the red herrings. Just own up and fix the problems.
- Formerly Known As... - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:28 am:
When the spokesman for the agency under scrutiny says that our Golden Horseshoe winner(the I.G.) is making much ado about nothing, I tend to trust the Inspector General over the spokeman.
Speaking of which, this ties nicely with a recent & relevant local story: “Man Finds Confidential Files in Cabinets Purchased at Sears Liquidation Sale” - http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/sears-employee-confidential-files-217825531.html
Not sure where the files or computers went with all that confidential information?
Meh. Why worry? They’ll turn up somewhere.
- Hat Trick - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:34 am:
Hire more guards to guard the computers since the managers are understaffed? Or are they saying hire more managers because the lack of guards means managers are multi-tasking as guards, too? Or are they saying hire more guards because a lack of guards makes it easier to make off with PCs and laptops? I get it. Hire more guards AND managers. That will obviously solve it, unless there aren’t enough HR people to get the hiring done. Then you’ll need additional HR people, too. Oh, forget about it . . .
- langhorne - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:40 am:
clue. less.
just say we take the finding seriously, and are hot on the trail to find out where they may be, and what happened to them. not, look over there, or there, its something shiny.
- WOW - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 11:58 am:
WHAT?
“Good managers find a way to make do with less. Bad managers blame budget cuts for everything that goes wrong.”
Correctional leaders are in a “no win” situation. It is a train wreck.
Would you like to take it over?
- Charlatan Heston - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 12:21 pm:
I am amazed that they actually have 84 computers identified as being AT DJJ
- Stuff happens - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 12:30 pm:
In my experience it’s the laws and policies that lose computers, not managers.
“That grant is still active, so you can’t surplus that computer. Put in storage for ten years and *then* you can surplus it.”
“You can’t have access to the inventory database, and the representative for your 300-person unit is out on maternity leave right now.”
etc.
Usually, when we track down a ‘lost’ computer, it was swapped out under warranty for a new one (with the hard drive removed or scrubbed first) and the database was never updated.
- Ghost - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 12:43 pm:
In DOC’s defense its not like they are a high security agency where it should be extremly difficult for anything to be removed or smuggeled in or out, so no need for concern when hundred thousand dollars or more of stuff disappears.
You cant expect them to have gates and guards on all those prisons after all….
- Downstater - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 12:45 pm:
=Good managers find a way to make do with less. Bad managers blame budget cuts for everything that goes wrong. =
President Obama should adhere to this.
- Barney Fife - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 1:30 pm:
Every item of property with value of $100.00 or more must be inventoried. Thet can’ t be just laying around. It appears to be short staffed when convienant? A staff assault is not a staffing issue but missing equipment is? Hmm.
- wordslinger - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 1:40 pm:
It’s not unheard of in any workplace for property to go out the back door and end up in someone’s home. That’s why inventory is required.
- Aldo - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 1:43 pm:
There is one central theme lost in all of this - CMS. When agencies finally get new computers, it can take CMS more than a year to install them. So people go about their business and new computer sit in a box somewhere, maybe never to be seen again.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 2:03 pm:
A lot of you have no understanding of the state inventory process. We still hand count items for pete’s sake. Been trying to get an electronic system with bar codes and scanners and . . . well . . . try and buy something in state government some time. Anywho, when you hand count things and rely on a spreadsheet (yes, we do that) to keep track of things errors are going to get made. We have things “missing” on our official inventory probably every audit. We can generally find them and the error was simply that it did not make it on the sheet. Tags are there but not recorded. I’m not going to berate DOC over this because it’s just not a huge issue. Auditors do a good job of making everything into a crisis. I remember an audit report we got where the big headline was that we “misspent funds.” Gasp!! No, actually it was an accounting error on ONE bill (out of 4,000 mind you) where something was paid from the wrong line. But auditors like to gin up controversy and make everything into the end of the world. This is a non-issue.
- High speed - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 3:29 pm:
Not all prisons record or do correct inventories. Theres a prison that cut up over 100 bed frames put them in scrap and nobody cared. A call to the hotline went unanswered.
- Cassandra - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 3:48 pm:
Exactly what I was wondering-hasn’t the private sector found technical solutions to tracking inventory. I wonder how much stuff disappears out of a Walmart storage facility, for example.
- Anyone Remember? - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 4:07 pm:
Cassandra
My private sector CPA type friends tell me private sector inventory is nothing like CMS inventory management. In the private sector, you depreciate things, and quite often when fully depreciated, they are replaced.
CMS / IOC only depreciate things in excess of $5,000. Anything less is carried at purchase price for as long as used (some agencies have file cabinets dating to the 1960s).
Specifically, as it relates to PCs / IT, many agencies have / had stuff laying about because they couldn’t afford to ship (at commercial freight rates) to the Quad Cities to Premier Computer, the Blago designated IT recycler. Since then, agencies have been trying to play catch-up under an ever changing CMS set of rules / vendors - who remembers the main floor of the Armory being 3 - 4 feet deep in computers?
- Barney Fife - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 4:12 pm:
High Speed. Your so correct in not all facilities do proper inventories. The current Administration in IDOC has allowed a lot of practices to go by the way side. The big question is why has the re-appointment of the Agencies Director never been called for a vote before the Executive Appointment Committee?
- Dirty Red - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 4:14 pm:
They can “believe” all they want. It isn’t like the public release of this audit is the first time they have heard this was a problem. If the solution is that easy, one would hope it would have been done.
= Nothing of import will be on the computers, nothing is saved directly to the hard drives at DOC =
That’s so weak. Saving files on the hard drive of a work station plugged into a network is actually easier in most cases. Sometimes the computer even chose the hard drive by default. Moreover, temporary files, such as an attachment in Microsoft Outlook, wouldn’t save onto the network.
- Steve Earle - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 4:22 pm:
Before I retired from IDOC, part of my “other duties as assigned” was property control. Whether computers, desks, chairs, you-name-it, people move things around from office to office, building to building without notifying property control. When unusable, outdated, or broken, an item may be simply thrown away.
- Arthur Andersen - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 4:29 pm:
-it’s just not a huge issue.-
-it’s a non-issue.-
The guy who wrote the audit report, the reporters who are writing about it, and a great deal of the people who are paying the freight would beg to differ with you.
Take some responsibility. “Waiting on a bar code system” is a lousy excuse and won’t help your underlying problem, poor record keeping, anyway. Spend the time, once, to get it right and commit to keeping it current and your hand count will work just fine.
Why give the auditors an easy finding? Make them earn their fee.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 5:14 pm:
@AA:
And I disagree with those people. And we do take responsibility. If you think it’s such a breeze come in and take a crack at it. People make errors. I was simply pointing out the limitations of the current set up. There isn’t anybody that could go in and do a thorough audit of the records. Nobody has the time. I suppose we could hire somebody on contract to come do it but I doubt that will happen. It’s easy to criticize from the outside. But feel free to come offer you expertise. We’ll take the help I’m sure.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 5:15 pm:
@AA:
By the way, I’m not talking about Corrections. I have no idea what their system looks like but given that Shared Services handles our “official” inventory and they are located at Corrections I would imagine it looks similar.
- Arthur Andersen - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 5:30 pm:
As you may know, Demo, AA is in the con$ulting business. If my partners agree, we would give your agency a special “Capitol Fax Commenter Deal,” ok?
- Guzzlepot - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 6:16 pm:
I used to work in IT and I don’t see this is a big deal. Were the lost computers new computers or were they old ones that had been moved around and swapped out multiple times? If they were new computers that is a problem, if they were old computers it isn’t.
When I worked in IT we would cannibalize old equipment for parts or use them as test machines/doorstops/coffee tables all the time. If the missing computers are old machines they are probably hiding out in the back of a server room or comluter lab.
- wordslinger - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 7:01 pm:
–If the missing computers are old machines they are probably hiding out in the back of a server room or comluter lab.–
Or maybe they went out the back door. How do you know?
I appreciate the comments of those who say they don’t have the tools to do a proper inventory.
But they’re both problems: shoddy inventory, and shoddy inventory tools.
- Guzzlepot - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 7:10 pm:
Wordslinger,
You’re right, I don’t know. I used to work at private companies that had the money, the manpower, and the tools to do first-rate inventory. And even they were unable to account for every device. That is why I think in this case, without further information, the loss of three hundred machines is not a big deal.
I mean, I didn’t read the articles, but this is three hundred machines out of how many thousands.
- Guzzlepot - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 7:13 pm:
And again Wordslinger. How many machines are we talking about. If it is a set of tens of thousands then three hundred is not that big a deal. If the Departments database goes back ten or fifteen years then it is likely that we are talking about quite a few machines
- Emiily Booth - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 7:24 pm:
At my agency, all office equipment had a property tag number. Each quarter, the office manager did inventory. We once found a computer in a closet, tho.
RE: Wal-Mart, the retail industry allows a certain percentage of stock as “shrinkage”. It’s one of their metrics.
- Arthur Andersen - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 7:47 pm:
I can relate to those on the front lines who may not in fact have the time or tools to properly manage inventory and will wear the jacket for this finding. Unfortunate.
The problem with calling this a non-issue is two-fold. First, the auditors will tell you that agencies that can’t keep track of their stuff usually have other weaknesses in their internal controls. Secondly, as word points out, if property is actually being stolen, lousy property records leave no paper trail with which to investigate.
- walk in my shoes - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 8:03 pm:
They should have just had the Governor’s spokesperson come out and state “it’s an isolated incident”
- Guzzlepot - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 8:49 pm:
Well yes, if the property is being stolen then the thieves need to be prosecuted.
But again, what is the total universe of machines that we are talking about, and what percent are the missing machines of that universe?
I just read the articles, SIU has a total universe of 15,000 machines, the 257 missing are just over 1.5%. And the article says that many of that 257 are old and outdated machines that, again, probably were cannibalized for parts or are hiding in a storage room.
Heck, let’s round SIU’s number up to 2%, that is a bit high, but some misplacing of inventory or records is normal. I worked in IT for about 15 years at a half dozen different private companies. I remember doing a device inventory at one of the companys back around 2000. It was a medium-sized company with about 1000 users. We found machines in closets, in server rooms, behind piles of furniture in storage rooms, under desks, &c. We weren’t able to find every machine though. And we did primarily inventory for about a week.
Also, the articles don’t say that the auditor thought the machines were stolen. I think that is important.
And no, I don’t work for the State of Illinois. I probably won’t even vote for Quinn. I just don’t like seeing those departments raked over the coals for something that is unremarkable.
- I'm not lost - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 9:39 pm:
Having some problems with posting and moderation, excuse the repeat post
We had this problem in our office. The CMS property control people come put stripey stickers on everything we purchase from pencil sharpeners to furniture to vehicles, and enter the numbers into a spreadsheet.
Later in the year, the “zebra hunters” come by to spot-check and verify if some of the stuff is still here, using little laser scanner guns.
But.
Every year, we get a notice that x number of our things are not found, and immediately assumed stolen or lost. What drives us crazy is that the stuff they say is missing has been surplused, BY THE PROPERTY MANAGEMENT GUYS and the info sent to Property control, and every year, they seem to ignore our updates and copy-paste a list that’s several years old and out of date. There’s stuff on the missing list we keep striking thru and telling them that it’s been disposed of since Blago… and the next audit, bang, there it is again on the $%#$$ spreadsheet, and we waste a day trying to chase down ghost equipment until some office geezer says he remembers what the thing was, and the year it was trashed.
I can imagine some laptops “walking away” but nobody wants old PC towers built on the cheap from Gateway or Dell, running Windows 95. That stuff is long-ago recycled, and the paper trail is messed up, I guarantee you.
Blame CMS Property and Procurement for their slipshod record-keeping on behalf of agencies (which used to manage this stuff themselves).
- Barney Fife - Wednesday, Aug 7, 13 @ 9:57 pm:
Unremarkable? Taxpayer Outrage & Accountability! This Agency has down played every incident for two years, including 3 inmate murders in 3 Months. Everything falls on deaf ears of the Governors Office? Whats next?
- Anon. - Thursday, Aug 8, 13 @ 8:38 am:
==We don’t believe that these computers are laying around somewhere compromising security.==
They just walked out of the Moscow airport.