140 Comments - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:38 am: At some point, and it coming up real, real soon; Rauner will need to give the instructions and specific steps how he will clean up the spilled milk…instead of crying over the spilled milk. - Nick Naylor - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:41 am: It’s really easy for a guy who made $60 million last year, off his investments, to say a state worker is overpaid. - chi - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:42 am: Rauner’s claim about overpaid state workers is tired and isn’t going to fly. Not only does it fail to account for education, but if he is really going to dive into the “comparative data”, as he said he likes to do, he will find that since Illinois has the fewest state employees per capita in the country, he needs to account for the higher productivity required of these employees. If IL state employees are paid more than state employees in other places, it is because IL state employees must be more productive because there are less of them. Cost of living also needs to be accounted for, as well as the multiplier benefits involved in ensuring our state employees earn a decent living. Attacking public employees is so 2009… - Grandson of Man - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:42 am: *** “shenanigans” in the public employee pension system have made Illinois’ multibillion-dollar pension debt “a time bomb for taxpayers.”*** He should know. He managed public employee pensions for many years and even currently brags about what a benefit his firm’s management of pensions was to workers and taxpayers. Someone should call Rauner out on this. I’m hoping someone does. - Robert the Bruce - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:46 am: “Raising taxes, that issue alone…” “Raising taxes alone” I’m happy to see the word “alone” in there; he does seem quite open to taxes as being part of the budget solution. - Anonymoiis - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:46 am: ==He should know. He managed public employee pensions for many years and even currently brags about what a benefit his firm’s management of pensions was to workers and taxpayers. == Rauner’s groups handled the investment of the money. They weren’t the one’s borrowing against it and raidng it to shift funds around to pay other State bills. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:47 am: ===he does seem quite open to taxes=== I don’t think there’s as much daylight as you do. At least for now. There’s a crack, for sure, but listen to the whole thing. - lil enchilada - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:47 am: If he cuts salaries for the lowest paid employees in the state, they will have to look for other jobs. Rauner won’t be replacing them. Example: how long do you wait at the driver’s facility now to renew your license? Wait until half the staff is gone. - Del Clinkton - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:50 am: “government is being run more for the benefit of the people in the government rather than the benefit of the service recipients and the taxpayers.” - Bruce Now the government will be run for the benefit of my “good ole boy” network. Which may or may nor benefit recipients or taxpayers. Meet the boss, same as the old boss. Bruce aint shaking anything up. Just re-arranging the deck chairs. - AnalystRet - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:52 am: Cutting Medicaid is bad fiscal policy, considering FFP (Federal Financial Participation) — especially now under the Affordable Care Act. Net GRF (after FFP) has been relatively constant for years. Cutting Medicaid also has a negative economic impact on the health care industry which consistently complains about low and slow State payments for care. Cutting $1 from Medicaid costs the State FFP and simply reduces payments to hospitals, physicians, nursing homes, etc. Historically, lessons have been learned that cuts in some services has had a ripple effect on the health condition of patients, often resulting in higher ER costs. - Norseman - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:54 am: The Blago-like war on public sector employees continues. Can I change my vote to mostly disagree. - Demoralized - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:54 am: So basically stick it to poor people and state employees (who are solidly middle class). It’s also ridiculous to claim that state employees are overpaid, especially coming from a mega multi-millionaire. It’s just pathetic. - Sir Reel - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:54 am: Chi, just because Illinois has fewer State employees per capita doesn’t automatically mean Illinois State employees are more productive. Do you have any research to back up your claim? In my public sector experience (I’ve also worked in the private sector), it’s more difficult to increase productivity in the public sector because laws, regulations and agency policies and procedures limit employees. Think I’ll Procurement Act. - Chris - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:55 am: “Example: how long do you wait at the driver’s facility now to renew your license?” 15 minutes, tops, including the time to print the license. Once every 4 years. Not bad at all. - Skirmisher - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:56 am: Well when I left state government the annual raises for union rank and file had raised quite a few of their salaries to 6 digits or very near that point, most of them having salaries about as high or much higher than their non-union managers who has worked the job twice as long and carried all of the responsibility. In many cases, the union pay was higher than that of the agency director. It was a much different world than back in the days when there was an established salary range for a specific job and you got ahead by working hard and being promoted to a higher paying position with more responsibility. Unionizing government workers had its good side and its bad, and some of the bad is now obvious. - Sir Reel - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:57 am: Illinois Procurement Act. - illlinifan - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:58 am: Yes salaries need to be looked at….I took a look at the employee data salary data base and there are serious inequities. A head of a DHS office who promoted from a union position earns over $100,000 a year, but their boss a regional administrator who never went into the union and has worked for the state for 15 years more earns $65000 a year. Supervisors in offices often earn more their bosses, and their bosses bosses, all of this because some managers went into union covered positions others remained MC. Over the past 10 years it has resulted in the union people earning 20000 to 60000 a year more their senior management. Yes the salary structure seriously needs adjustment…..but it can’t be just slash and burn. It needs serious review. - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 10:58 am: Not too much sympathy for state employees, unions (except 150), teachers… “I’m voting against Quinn! Anything is better than Pat Quinn!” Welp, now we will see if it’s all that better. Elections have consequences. - Not Rich - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:00 am: I can’t wait for the new out of state people he hired yesterday to get here and start coming up with their new ideas.. - Wordslinger - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:00 am: – Rauner said his administration has closely examined agency budgets and contracts and concluded that “government is being run more for the benefit of people in the government than rather than the benefit of the service recipients and the taxpayers.”– Wow. Did you find the state Book of Secrets or something in Lincoln’s Tomb? I thought all the budget stuff had been in the public domain forever. You mean the money hasn’t been going to school districts, health-care providers, nursing homes, prisons, paying back debt and such? But just for the benefit of those in government? Whoa, this is big. Tell us more. Please trot out those administration officials and lets see the results of all things sinister they found in their deep dive into budget and contracts. Speaking of those contracts you’ve been examining that are of benefit to people in government, you know you have an obligation to report anything hinky to law enforcement, right? Dude, you can stop spinning. We’ve been listening to you for about two years now that things ain’t right. Surely, during all that time, you’ve developed some ideas on what you propose to do about it. You wanted the gig, you got it. Now get down to it. - Chris - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:01 am: “It’s also ridiculous to claim that state employees are overpaid, especially coming from a mega multi-millionaire.” One has very little to do with the other. State employees are overpaid, or not, regardless of the person making the statement. Would Rauner’s position suddenly become true if he gave 100% of his assets to Charity X, and was living solely on the Guv’s salary? That’s what you’re saying when you say ‘especially coming from [rich guy]’. - Cassandra - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:01 am: It’s all posturing at this point. The first salvo in upcoming labor and legislative negotiations. I wouldn’t expect anything less. But…does he really have “months and months” to negotiate, work and so on. I think not, at least from what I’ve been reading about the state’s dire financial straits. It’s a little over 5 months to the next fy. And not everything is resolved for this fy. - Yatzi - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:02 am: It is difficult to want to contribute more time and effort when someone comes in without knowledge and pre-judges staff and their efforts. It is also difficult for non-union staff who went without a raise since 2003 and took furlought days to hear how we are over paid - it is truely inspireing - if these things go through (this spring session will be interesting) - staff will leave and Illinois will suffer - staff bring in hundreds of millions of $. - Pot, meet kettle - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:02 am: This is too easy, but what the hey. Anyone who would whine about state employees making too much just days after hiring a chief of staff for his wife at $100,000 a year is beyond tone deaf. Rauner well understands the power of symbolic gestures–$18 watch, cruddy van, bad clothes, etc. There’s no excuse. - Demoralized - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:04 am: ==One has very little to do with the other== I was pointing out the hypocrisy of his statement. If you can’t see that then you are blind. - Mason born - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:05 am: Ok Gov here is a suggestion. Get a bill passed requiring that all State Workers be paid within 10% of their private sector counterparts State or County average whichever is greater. Make it National with a Cost of living adjustment for those w/o private counterparts (state Troopers etc.) Of course the result may be some rather large wages for professional staff. Contract negotiations with Afscme will be corralled to the +- 10% range just like you say you want. win win - Norseman - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:07 am: === Rauner says he is working with analysts offering their services for free to go deep into agency spending, contracts and hiring decisions. === I’m sure these free analyses will be well researched and fair. - Carl Nyberg - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:08 am: We live in a rich country. We live in a rich state. The idea that pensions are bankrupting our society is suspect. It’s not like life expectancy is going through the roof. Remember Ken Griffin, Bruce Rauner, Rahm Emanuel, & their pals in the financial sector have found ways to ensure the hedge fund investors keep getting richer & richer. The problem isn’t that there isn’t money to pay the bills, it’s that the capital class uses its advantages to steal money from everyone else. - Chris - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:09 am: “I was pointing out the hypocrisy of his statement.” So, if he wasn’t a hypocrite, it would be true? When working stiffs, making $38,000 in the private sector, say that State Employees make too much money, they’re RIGHT? If you can’t see that focusing on Rauner’s ‘hypocrisy’ doesn’t help your side of the argument *at all*, you’re blind. - Demoralized - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:11 am: ==Rauner says he is working with analysts offering their services for free to go deep into agency spending, contracts and hiring decisions== That’s scary to me because that’s the exact same attitude Rod Blagojevich came into office with. Completely distrusted everyone. Assumed everybody in Springfield was incompetent and corrupt and could not be trusted. He had some consultants come in pro bono. What they got in return was their money’s worth, which was squat. Their “analysis” was crap because they didn’t have an understanding of the laws, rules, etc of the state. They made all kinds of assumptions on the budget, revenues, etc. Then the people in the know pointed out all of their mistakes in their assumptions etc and pretty much all of that analysis was thrown in the trash. We are in for a tough road I fear. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:12 am: Please, don’t dominate the rap, Jack, if you’ve got nothing new to say. - Del Clinkton - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:12 am: @pot: Just a reminder, Illinois Intern-Governor Rauner is not taking a salary. - pundent - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:14 am: I fully believe that Rauner will do two things. He will continue to demonize “union bosses”, government employees and wasteful spending. And then he will raise taxes. - Anonymous - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:14 am: I am not sure what employee salary data the Gov is using. I assume it include any and all overtime paid. Because of staff reductions, there is a good deal of overtime earned in various classification due to the increased workload resulting from decrease headcount. Is it cheaper to hire more staff, or pay existing staff more money in overtime? Oh, and this overtime bumps up the pension calculation. - Arsenal - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:15 am: In his video message to state workers last week, Rauner talked about letting them take home more of their paycheck. Now he claims they’re overpaid. Transparently disgusting. - walker - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:17 am: He needs to be a quick learner, because a lot of what he says so far seems to be more IPI-style positioning than hard fact. He also needs to be skeptical about the motivations of some of his free “analysts”, I am guessing — unless he got them from his business associates and they have no obvious political agendas. He’s right about there being a lot of hard, serious work in the coming months. - chi - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:17 am: Sir Reel- No, I don’t know of any research as to the productivity of Illinois employees compared to other states’ employees. My conclusion is based on the fact that Illinois govt. operates with less employees per capita than any other state. Therefore, the employees must be more productive, because no other state operates with so few employees. - Ahoy! - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:17 am: – In other words, said one of the study’s authors, Rauner’s premise doesn’t account for a key factor in what drives labor costs: education – This is not necessarily true in the private sector as by and large (and there are always exceptions) the key driver in wages is output. Education is more of a secondary factor that helps drive the primary (output). In government, education is a key driver since employment and wages are more about checking off boxes and jumping through hoops. These are two different systems and in my opinion, hard to compare. State workers are paid well, have excellent benefits and guaranteed income that those of us in the private sector do not have, but we pay for someone else’s generous living long after they stop working. Personally, instead of giving up 2% of my salary to pay for other people’s pensions, I would rather put it toward my own retirement. Also, I would have been surprised if the U of I (State workers) came out with a study that said public salaries are too high. - k3 - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:18 am: Is this guy ever going to start governing and stop campaigning? Quickly losing my sense of optimism with this new administration. - D.P.Gumby - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:19 am: Reinforces why I said “always disagree” even though I haven’t seen the details. His rhetoric is now picking his own “facts” in delusion of substantiated facts. Sounding like a Congressional Republican. And he warned us that he was a Scott Walker. - AC - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:21 am: Pat Quinn had similar rhetoric regarding state employee pay, and even proposed a 2 grade pay reduction that had AFSCME considering a strike. Thus begins the negotiation dance, and since he’s gotten the press, I guess he’s leading. Let’s see if Roberta and Bruce can tango. - Langhorne - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:22 am: I would like to see CY 14 salary statistics from the state comptroller. Should be easy. Tax info just went out. Ms munger? Ms munger? - Norseman - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:22 am: The irony of this presentation was that his staff used the timing of it to release the announcement of his “Turnaround” team. A group of high priced officials performing duplicative functions of others already appointed to his staff. Talking about the proverbial pot calling the kettke … - Norseman - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:23 am: Darn iPhone. “Kettle” - Illinoisvoter - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:26 am: Is any of this a surprise to those who watched the debates between Rauner and Quinn? Calling Quinn again and again a failure not his policies or his leadership but him as a person? Maybe if you make 60 million a year government is the enemy, but for many of us it’s our daughter that’s a teacher, our friend that’s a Judge, or just the reference desk at the library. Is our State going to have things shaken up or shaken down? - Walter Mitty - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:27 am: I do agree with Pot…. Seems a bit tone deaf…but is the popular opinion that state workers are over paid? Walk around the buildings last week shaking hands thanking them. This week posture for any public sector union negotiations…. Election results, meet consequences. - Carhart Representative - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:27 am: I think he’s worried that a married couple of state employees might be able to come up with the entrance fee for his wine club. I’m underpaid. Everybody else is overpaid. That’s America in 2015. If we cut every state employee’s salary down to minimum wage, it still wouldn’t cover the cost of all the corporate handouts that we’re giving away. - Demoralized - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:28 am: I think a more helpful analysis would be to look at average salaries within specific titles. An average salary statewide doesn’t tell you very much in my opinion because you don’t know the detail driving that number. - VanillaMan - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:28 am: The Governor is really messing up. He isn’t an outsider anymore, he is now the governor. Using language which sets up an “us and them” situation is a loser for a governor. What he is failing to do is find a positive way to describe the economic fixes he would like to see employed within the State. Instead, Rauner is accusing people he doesn’t know, but now manages, of being unworthy of their income and benefits. That crap might have worked as a candidate, but he is going to lose if he thinks he can govern with that message. He needs those public employees to do their jobs and he needs to show voters that he can run a stable and professional government. The words the Governor is using aren’t going to get him the goals he hopes to accomplish. For a salesman, he is exposing himself as completely lacking in salesmanship. Even if he gets what he believes he wants, he isn’t going to get where Illinois needs to be, because of how he got there. He has a big problem. His corporate successes have blinded him to better ways of governing. In his previous world, he could saw off a piece of a big market and call it good, but as governor, he cannot do that. He cannot saw his way to a good resolution here. Instead, Bruce Rauner needs to actually lead and govern. His words are revealing an inability to understand how governing works. He might recognize our problems - but that isn’t why he was elected since we could all see our problems. He was not elected to solve our problems either! Bruce Rauner is now a governor who needs to LEAD the state towards solutions to our problems. Those solutions may not be what he is imagining, and based on what he is saying right now - can’t or won’t imagine - because as governor, he needs to find a solution based upon the approval of everyone, not just a fragmented market of buyers. So - please Governor Rauner, please expand your mind into recognizing that today’s problems are the results of governing a diverse state, and that the solutions to those problems will be found within that same diverse group. What we needed was good governing. You were elected to find a way of governing us towards those solutions, not forcing us into your fragmented corporate world viewpoints. - ZC - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:29 am: Still reserving final comment until I see his first budget. Rauner still has us all Rorschach-ing. We won’t have to wait much longer. I will say though that his announcement of some of his top “superstars” to turn IL around, Donna Arduin in particular, is a worrisome sign. I’ve always considered it a real possibility that Rauner has meant and believed in what he basically implied all last year, that he is a) an austerian (slash government spending, and growth will follow); b) a hard core supply-sider (cut taxes on really rich people, and growth will follow). It’s really dangerous not to listen closely to what candidates say on the campaign trail. When you start saying too much, “Oh, he can’t really believe that, he’s just saying stuff,” I think you get burned more often than if you take their rhetoric seriously. - Grandson of Man - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:32 am: “Rauner’s groups handled the investment of the money. They weren’t the one’s borrowing against it and raidng it to shift funds around to pay other State bills.” This does not diminish the fact that he profited off of public employee pensions. Some union recently reported or alleged that GTCR was managing almost $5 billion in public pension funds. As some Latin baseball player would have said (I forgot who): “Pensions have been bery, bery good to Rauner.” - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:35 am: - VanillaMan - I think you might miss Quinn coming up soon. - Patty - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:36 am: If you are curious go to the lL accountability portal & search by position. You will find that some appear to be very high but could be due to overtime - certainly with some like corr officers. - sparky791 - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:37 am: -Ahoy- -Also, I would have been surprised if the U of I (State workers) came out with a study that said public salaries are too high.- So you are saying the U of I people doing the research must be corrupt? Nice. - Anonymoiis - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:39 am: ==Pensions have been bery, bery good to Rauner.”== You expect a private investment firm to do it for free. His firm also made the pension fund a lot of money, overperforming the average. The problem wasn’t who was making the pension money for the State, it was those in the State who were deciding what to do with the money they got back - Anonymoiis - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:42 am: ==So you are saying the U of I people doing the research must be corrupt?== Well the school does have a reputation in the recent past of fudging numbers to obtain preferred results…. - RNUG - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:42 am: Probably tick everyone with this post … The problem we, both the State, the employees, and the taxpayers, have is there is a partial truth in each position. And we all bring our own bias and filters to our viewpoint, so it’s tough to be objective about the subjects under discussion. For the new people here, I’m going to rehash a bit of history. I come from a union family (including a founding member of a local) on one side and non-union farmers & shopkeepers on the other side. When I was a state employee, I was either civil service or merit comp, all non-union positions. Anyway, enough about me and my bias’ … When it comes to state employee salaries, some people are grossly overpaid and some are grossly underpaid. Years ago (1960’s, 1970’s), there was a salary tier structure that clearly delineated between management and labor. Even after the unions gained major influence under Thompson (1980’s), that structure stayed pretty much in place. But over the years, the union wages have grown somewhat out of proportion and totally skewed the structure. If I was to generalize, the lower skilled positions are way over paid, the medium skilled positions are probably a bit overpaid or even, and the highly skilled technical or upper middle management jobs are generally underpaid. The people at the very top have usually been pretty well paid, although there are also some disparities / underpay there. I understand that the State has upgraded the education / training levels for the various positions, and that is part of what has driven up the salary levels. Even allowing for that, it seems to me there are some semi-skilled positions that are overpaid. So how does this imbalance get fixed? == Mason Born == has a pretty decent suggestion at 11:05 but he doesn’t go quite far enough. The whole “step raise” process should be eliminated for all union positions. getting both the step raises and the union raises every year is part of what has driven the union salaries way up. On the other hand, there should also be a formal COLA process that covers all positions. If the union can an actual raise on top of this formal COLA in their deals, good for them. And the COLA should be automatic and tied to some federal measurement so it can’t be manipulated at the state level. Anyway, that is what I would do if I had control of the salaries. You can fix the imbalances and public perception of unfairness in the salaries. But we are still arguing over pennies on the dollar when it comes to the State budget. You could totally eliminate all state salaries and not make much of a dent in the state budget. - Wordslinger - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:42 am: All politicians tailor their message to the audience, but Rauner’s message at U of C is diametrically opposed to the bonuses and more money for agencies message he’s been peddling while meeting with state employees. Nearly two years of campaigning (ongoing) and we still don’t have a clue as to what the guy proposes to do from his public statements. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:47 am: ===we still don’t have a clue=== I think he provided some clues yesterday. Go listen to his speech. - Wordslinger - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:48 am: –The problem wasn’t who was making the pension money for the State, it was those in the State deciding what to do with the money they got back– Huh? The money stayed with the pension funds, for the payment of pensions. It doesn’t go back to GRF. Geez, some basics, please. - TwoFeetThick - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:48 am: If Rauner is smart, he will quit demonizing state employees. As their boss, their performance will reflect directly on him. They can make him look like an absolute buffoon. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:49 am: ===If Rauner is smart, he will quit demonizing state employees=== He ain’t gonna do that. Just wait ’til the negotiations begin. Oof. - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:53 am: ===He ain’t gonna do that. Just wait ’til the negotiations=== Rauner did make a point he would shut down the state if need be… Rauner isn’t backing down, Rauner doubles down. - RNUG - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:58 am: == He ain’t gonna do that. Just wait ’til the negotiations begin. == … and when the unions start to ‘work to rule’. Going to be fireworks … but hopefully not to the extent of the southern Illinois coal mine wars or the Chicago taxi cab wars. Glad I’m on the sidelines for this one. - Anonymoiis - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:58 am: ==Huh? The money stayed with the pension funds, for the payment of pensions. It doesn’t go back to GRF. Geez, some basics, please.== So all that borrowing against it, using what’s there as an asset for purposes other than what it’s purposes for, never occurred? - Demoralized - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:59 am: ==If Rauner is smart, he will quit demonizing state employees. As their boss, their performance will reflect directly on him. They can make him look like an absolute buffoon.== So the solution would be to purposely under-perform? That helps negotiations how? That changes a negative view of state employees how? - RNUG - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:00 pm: - Anonymoiis - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:58 am: - Demoralized - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:01 pm: ==So all that borrowing against it, using what’s there as an asset for purposes other than what it’s purposes for, never occurred== Investment income goes back into the pension funds. No money was taken from those funds. The issue was the state not paying the required contributions. Two separate issues. - RNUG - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:03 pm: try that again - Anonymoiis - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 11:58 am: Point of fact … the State never borrowed money that was put into the funds … they just never put the money there in the first place, instead keeping a vague “IOU someday” in their desk drawer. - JS Mill - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:04 pm: =So - please Governor Rauner, please expand your mind into recognizing that today’s problems are the results of governing a diverse state, and that the solutions to those problems will be found within that same diverse group. What we needed was good governing. You were elected to find a way of governing us towards those solutions, not forcing us into your fragmented corporate world viewpoints. = Truer words never spoken. =Rauner did make a point he would shut down the state if need be…= Maybe the entire state. These “state workers” (I ma pretty sure he is referring to just about all public employees) that will be taking a haircut participate in the economy as well. Less money=less economic activity. So do the businesses that do business with the state. Slow to no payments=slow to no growth. - Amused - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:04 pm: His example of the state employee contributing around $40K to the pension fund and taking out north of 800K in just 20 years was pretty telling. Expect major changes the next 4 years. Lot of clues given in this speech. - Wensicia - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:07 pm: Rauner playing the victim already? - Wordslinger - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:07 pm: Anonymoiis, no, that didn’t happen. They stiffed paying into the funds, they didnt skim from the funds. Fund investment earnings stay with the funds. - Demoralized - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:07 pm: ==Just wait ’til the negotiations begin.== Do we expect them to end with a contract before the conclusion of his first term in office? That comment was only partially snark. - Stuff Happens - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:07 pm: I believe that Rauner will shut the state down. It gives him bargaining power with the unions, but also saves money. It has the added benefit of decreasing salaries for those near retirement, lowering pension payouts when they do retire. The rhetoric we’re hearing is just a warning shot as the board is being set up. - foster brooks - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:09 pm: So the email I received from him the other day about bonuses is a pile of bull? - Springfield guy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:13 pm: Rauner seems like a PR guy so far not a Governor. Stop having press conferences and start working. It seems he has a large ego and just likes the attention. Governor, follow the example of Madigan in some ways. Be quiet and get the work done behind the cameras. - Anonymoiis - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:15 pm: == They stiffed paying into the funds, they didnt skim from the funds. Fund investment earnings stay with the funds.== And to circle back to the original point, who were “they”? Was it Rauner’s firm? No. Was Rauner’s firm making money off of those decisions? No. GTCRs job was simply to invest the money, which they did a pretty good job at. - Mason born - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:17 pm: As for Rauner shutting the State down. I’m not so sure. Assuming that Rauner wants cuts (I know he basically said it) and wants to be reelected at a certain point a State Gov shutdown affects the second goal. Most folks may believe that State Workers are overpaid and as RNUG explained there certainly are areas where that is true. However the last thing he needs is for the services people actually do use are unavailable that blame will be laid at his feet. - Anonymous - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:24 pm: When looking at the number of state employees per capita in Illinois as compared to other States, keep in mind Illinois outsources workload to a significant degree to consultants, vendors, contractors, and management firms. It’s hard to get an apples to apples comparison. Another factor is the number of local governmental units in Illinois as compared to other States….last I read, we are significantly higher in that regard as well. - Norseman - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:26 pm: === So the email I received from him the other day about bonuses is a pile of bull? === Maybe. What is your definition of bonuses? His might be that your bonus is that instead of taking a 10% pay cut, you’ll only get a 5% reduction. What a bonus. He’ll also save you dues money by shutting down the union. That will help you pay for higher insurance copays and loss of salary. Smile, you’re serving the people. You should want to do this for board and care! - Handy Andy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:27 pm: So let’s say he wins in AFSCME negotiations and every employee pays more in health insurance costs, gets a pay cut of 10 percent. What does the state gain in the big picture? By the way, someone with some time should check to see how some of his replacement employees are getting paid more than those who got the pink slip. - Secret Square - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:29 pm: “the employees must be more productive, because no other state operates with so few employees.” Could that be in part attributable to the fact that IL has more LOCAL units of government than any other state, and that employees of these local governments are likely performing functions that, in other states, would fall to state employees (e.g., road and park maintenance)? I’d be interested to know how the total number of state AND local government employees per capita in IL compares to other states. - Mouthy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:33 pm: So are we going to see Squeezy recycled as “Squeezy, The Overpaid State Employee Python”? Recycling will save a few bucks… - Carl Nyberg - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:36 pm: Shutdown the State of Illinois? If the voters elect Republicans they get Republican antics. - Anonymous - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:37 pm: Mouthy-Maybe we will see Squeezy again. Probably be just as effective as the first time. From my experience in both the private and public sectors, RNUG hit the nail on the head at 11:42. - Anon - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:39 pm: Apologies if I’m repeating an earlier post, but could that average employee income in Illinois be skewed due to overtime paid to understaffed state facilities? - shaken - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:39 pm: Foster Brooks, you’ll have the opportunity to get a bonus, but the real question is will that bonus get you back to where you are right now after the pay and benefit cuts Rauner wants. - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:40 pm: ===However the last thing he needs is for the services people actually do use are unavailable that blame will be laid at his feet.=== That’s where the $20 million PR money comes in to blame “career politicians” and “unions unwilling to sacrifice” . Rauner is a salesman. Rauner never loses. Of course the Veto-Proof Democratic majorities in both chambers will then give blowback in the votes they cast… Rauner is picking his battles. Is it checkers or chess? I dunno. - PublicServant - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:43 pm: The local units of government aren’t doing state functions, they’re doing municipal and county stuff. - Cook County Commoner - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:44 pm: Regarding the Univ. of Illinois wage study, shouldn’t the nature of the service performed be the benchmark in comparing salaries between the private and public sector, instead of education level? The college graduate working in the private sector may earn more because of more efficient talent utilization. And are the government benefits, both during employment and in retirement, monetized in the study for the private-government sector wage comparison? - Roadiepig - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:44 pm: - Mason born - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:17 pm: As for Rauner shutting the State down. I’m not so sure. Assuming that Rauner wants cuts (I know he basically said it) and wants to be reelected at a certain point a State Gov shutdown affects the second goal. Most folks may believe that State Workers are overpaid and as RNUG explained there certainly are areas where that is true. However the last thing he needs is for the services people actually do use are unavailable that blame will be laid at his feet. The last government shut down in Washington worked out well for the Republican party (after all, they gained seats again last November), even if it did cause major problems for the average citizen and for the economy. In some circles that is considered successful governing. Why not pull the same crap here- red meat for the folks who hate all government employees. Any damage done to the state’s economy is worth it for that crowd, damages to civil servant’s ability to pay their bills and provide a decent living for their families be damned. - WTF - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:49 pm: Related: Does everyone realize that the “INN” (Illinois News Network) quoted at the top is a subsidiary of the Koch brothers-funded Illinois Policy Institute and not a legitimate news organization? Can we not mix them in with actual fact gatherers? - RNUG - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:50 pm: == could that average employee income in Illinois be skewed due to overtime paid to understaffed state facilities? == In some positions / titles, that is probably the case. Without being able to do the analysis, since it would mostly affect a couple of agencies, I would guess the skew at 10% or less for the overall average … but that is strictly a guess. - Casual Observer - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:52 pm: I keep thinking the Governor has a deep desire to outsource as many government functions as possible. I see a scenario where Union negotiations break down because the Governor insists on drastic cuts to wages. The union says “fine, we’ll shut down and walk out”. At that point Rauner pulls a contract out of his pocket where a private company will provide services at lower cost and the State won’t be responsible for employee benefits. Checkmate? Obviously not all services can be outsourced. I don’t believe he thinks a state trooper is overaid at $100k for example. Those who think their job can’t be outsourced has never talked to a consultant. A consultants answer to just about anything is “sure, we can do that”. - Larry the Cable Guy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:54 pm: Note to state employees….even those who voted for him.., He’s Just Not That Into You. - ZC - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:54 pm: >> The last government shut down in Washington worked out well for the Republican party (after all, they gained seats again last November), even if it did cause major problems for the average citizen and for the economy. In some circles that is considered successful governing. I’m hearing these meme a couple of times on the threads, also, “Well look at Kansas, Brownback may have hurt the economy but he got reelected there …” But Illinois is not the nation. And Illinois is certainly not Kansas. Illinois is not darkest-shade “blue,” but Rauner and a lot of Republicans may be in for a surprise, if they try to generalize Kansas, or DC, to the Illinois electorate. - Bulldog58 - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:55 pm: =Rauner did make a point he would shut down the state if need be…= Like to see what he’s gonna do with the THOUSANDS of prisoners… I’ll admit that I made A LOT more in salary last year than is spelled out in the contract but I worked HUNDREDS of hours of overtime (many of those hours were mandatory). The majority of state workers would love to see the overtime come under control. A lot of us are burning out. - RNUG - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:57 pm: Yes, the Gov can outsource but (a) he better not run afoul of the procurement laws and (b) get the legislature to give him the money since there is a limit on the amount he can reallocate. This ain’t private industry where the boss can do pretty much whatever he wants. - Pot calling kettle - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:58 pm: ==while comparing Illinois to neighboring states== ==the average public sector worker in the state makes almost 22 percent more than those in the private sector== These comparisons are troublesome. Whenever such comparisons are made, we should all ask: 1) Are we comparing apples to apples? 2) Are we seeing the whole picture? The U of I study would seem to be addressing #1; although, I would like to see a comparison related to job duties as well, to see if the disparity holds up. RNUG’s analysis is useful, but anecdotal. Mason Born’s suggestion would work, but only if everyone can agree that the comparison positions are appropriate. Rauner (and his opponents) are likely to violate #2; its just too tempting to cherry-pick comparisons. Will we see Rauner present a comparison of our income tax to that of neighboring states? Unlikely, flat taxes are unusual (for good reason). Illinois is not any other state, we have a mix of similarities and differences in population, economic drivers, history, etc. To take one state, say Florida, and say that they don’t have an income tax, so we don’t need one is clearly absurd. Comparisons are useful, but the utility has its limits. The Rauner folks need to be very careful using comparisons as foundation blocks in their attempt to build their reformed structure. Too many bad analogies will weaken the overall structure and lead to political collapse. $20 million will not be enough to sell such a structure. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:58 pm: ===Can we not mix them in with actual fact gatherers? === Take a breath. It was only a quote. - Formerly Known As... - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:59 pm: ==“It’s a myth,” Robert Bruno said== Until Mr Bruno and Mr Manzo publish an analysis of the public-private employee education gap in every state, just as Pew published their analysis of public salaries in every state, this conclusion cannot be drawn. For all anyone knows, state and local government workers in every state could be ==earning less on average than workers in the private sector with comparable educations==. Their work may be used to rebut any claim that Illinois public sector workers are overpaid in comparison to Illinois private sector workers, but it does NOT rebut Pew’s study showing Illinois public workers are paid more in comparison to their counterparts in other states. - foster brooks - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:01 pm: Fyi rauner arbitration never goes well for the state. - chicon - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:04 pm: Whole lotta NIMBY goin’ on around here! “Oh, I know the state is in poor financial shape, but leave my pile alone.” That will get us far…. If Rauner does his job correctly, there’s going to be a lot of people barking about him - big systems don’t like change, as is clearly evident in the comments here. I may not fully trust the new Governor, but it seems fair to give him more than a week or two before passing judgement. Doing so at this point is a bit telling on the writer, imo. - Poster - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:06 pm: Rauner can shutdown the government after the contract expires and he will have most of the public backing him up. Until the first DCFS child abuse case gets tied to the shutdown and the media gets ahold of it. Then the advantage swings the other way. - Mason born - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:07 pm: -Roadiepeg I suspect Rauner isn’t stupid enough to think that his election turned IL into TX or even Wisconsin. We are still a blue state like it or not. A republican shutting down Gov in this state is going to look a lot worse than if Perry had shutdown TX. That said contract negotiations are this summer and would give him 3 years to spin it. - Casual Observer - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:11 pm: Agreed RNUG (as always). But when it snows a private company will plow a private parking lot for $50 while a public employee is plowing the streets for +$50/hour. Procurement guidelines are a lot tougher now thanks to Blago but some contracts write themselves. - Roadiepig - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:17 pm: - ZC - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 12:54 pm: I guess you didn’t catch it , so I will add it here: /snark My point is to the far right fans of austerity, the ends justify the means no matter how much damage these actions cause. We should all keep an eye on Kansas (I have been for a while now) to see just how bad things end up there. Read somewhere yesterday (here, I believe that the government is proposing even more drastic cuts to the education system in Kansas. I guess it’s just taking time for enough people to see just how much damage these types of “leaders” are causing to the average citizens of their states. Kansas is a deep red state, we are (on average) a light blue state (please- no “Chicago vs. the rest of the state arguments. Just basing my statement on hiw voters typically vote in statewide elections). If Gov. Rauner can somehow change that to red ,just by the strength of his being in office, we could be in for similar long term measures as the failing ones in Kansas. I, for one, don’t think that will be the case . Time will tell. - Casual Observer - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:18 pm: I should add that just about every unit of government has snow plows/drivers. - UIC Guy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:23 pm: @ MasonBorn, 11:05 I don’t know about other branches of state gov, but professors at the U of IL would see significant RAISES if they had to be paid within 10% of their private sector counterparts. (AAUP puts out figures on the pay of professors, and always finds that private schools pay more.) Any my guess is that the same is true of a lot of lawyers employed by the state. Other categories, anyone? - Wordslinger - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:29 pm: CO, Mayor Daley did a swell job outsourcing some snow removal with his Hired Truck Program. Talk about innovation. Some of the people who got contracts didn’t have trucks or drivers licenses. - Pot calling kettle - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:31 pm: == I don’t believe he thinks a state trooper is overaid at $100k for example.== Based on what? He might well compare that to the pay of a private security guard and come to the conclusion that they are overpaid. Comparisons are very tricky things. - Formerly Known As... - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:32 pm: ==Some of the people who got contracts didn’t have trucks or drivers licenses.== How quickly we forget. - Casual Observer - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:32 pm: Slinger, I was using that as an example but point taken. Thanks. - Mason born - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:36 pm: UIC I suspect you are correct. If you read RNUG’s excellent piece at 11:42 he hits the nail on the head. The state, in general, has a lopsided pay structure towards many professionals. I suspect Lawyers, Engineers, Geologists etc. would do much better under my suggestion. I would argue they should. I would also argue that it is in the States best interest to hire the best individuals in those fields and retain those individuals. They are the core of the “institutional knowledge.” I also suspect that the 22% the governor mentioned would invert if those professionals were surveyed independently. It is IMHO the best solution. It keeps pay inline with the taxpayers , I know state workers pay taxes, while allowing the State to have a premium on those occupations where the bottom half of the class just isn’t good enough. It also lets society set the value of an individual occupation. - Uncle Buck - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:39 pm: Typical Republican here. I can make millions but, the little guy should make pennies with no benefits!! - How Ironic - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:42 pm: @ Casual Observer, “I should add that just about every unit of government has snow plows/drivers.” And I would like to add that unless your hiring jr high students to shovel a parking lot, you’re not going to find a private plow company to do lots for $50, as you earlier suggested. - Dinsdale - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:43 pm: The Comptroller’s web site has a section titled “The Ledger”. You can use it to sort the State payroll six ways from Sunday. - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:45 pm: Explaining how CMS actually works to Rauner and how to “fix” it would be fun to watch… “But I’m the governor…” - Formerly Known As... - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:50 pm: ==You can use it to sort the State payroll six ways from Sunday.== Have they already updated it with the exempt hires as well? It’s not working for me at the moment. - Demoralized - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:54 pm: ==Explaining how CMS actually works to Rauner and how to “fix” it would be fun to watch…== I don’t think CMS could actually explain how CMS works part of the time. - Wordslinger - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:56 pm: CO, understood, but “privatization” hasn’t been shown to be a panacea. Sometimes it’s a scam to award contracts, like a number of programs from every big business Republican’s (including Rauner) favorite mayor, Daley. - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 1:57 pm: ===I don’t think CMS could actually explain how CMS works part of the time.=== Y.E.S! You got it. This is where institutional knowledge woukd kinda be really useful… - UIC Guy - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 2:00 pm: Thanks, Mason. I like your idea, but I think implementing it would be a nightmare, and would (at the least) require a whole new bureaucracy of its own. But it’s interesting as an ideal. - Em - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 2:05 pm: As a non-union State employee, I feel offended by the comments Gov Rauner has made about State Employees making too much money. He needs to do less talking and more working if he thinks he’s going to get anything done. Gov Rauner, I think you were paid way too much in the public sector and your privilege is showing. - Yatzi - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 2:05 pm: One of the reasons there are large numbers of professionals is privatization - direct services are contracted out and the Services and contracts managed at the state lelvel (also federal requirements for those funds) - Casual Observer - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 2:14 pm: “Sometimes it’s a scam to award contracts”. My point exactly. I’m not advocating privatization, I’m just trying to figure where the Governor is headed and how he will get there. Awarding contracts to businesses of all sizes supports his base. He doesn’t want to bother with giving out state jobs like past politicos. It’s easier to give the responsibilities to private business and let them deal with hiring and benefits. - Del Clinkton - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 2:16 pm: @casual observer: Except Bruce is going to give the contracts to his buddies. Think “Bruceiburton”. “Meet the new boss, same as the old boss”. - Ahoy! - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 2:25 pm: sparky791, I never said they were corrupt (you did that), but you would have to admit there is a bias there. - Formerly Known As... - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:03 pm: ==I’m just trying to figure where the Governor is headed and how he will get there== Your clarification helps, @CO. You may be on to something there, and a lot may depend on how acrimonious the upcoming union contract negotiations become. - forwhatitsworth - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:07 pm: As far as “free” analysis, I can recall at least 5 recent free inspections I’ve had regarding my car and other house related items. I guess I shouldn’t have been surprised at the extensive laundry list of things that needed to be fixed after each inspection! - Anonymous - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:08 pm: I would like to know how generating more revenue by raising taxes to pay down debt and pay our bills is a very, very bad thing in a state that is wallowing in debt. Unless Rauner himself plans to write one very big donated check, I’m puzzled how generating more revenue could be considered kicking the can down the road. Secondly, I have to wonder how the most public representation of public employees would like to whip the public up into a frenzy of resentment and hatred of the public employee sector. Is this what most bosses do? - Pot calling kettle - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:19 pm: ==a private company will plow a private parking lot for $50 while a public employee is plowing the streets for +$50/hour== What is your point? If that private company plows out the lot in 15 minutes, that would be $200/hour. The public employee looks like a good deal. - Pot calling kettle - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:23 pm: ==I would like to know how generating more revenue by raising taxes to pay down debt and pay our bills is a very, very bad thing in a state that is wallowing in debt.== New revenue is often tied to new programs to get passage. Asking the voters to for higher taxes to pay for things they already have is not very popular. The trick will be to get that new revenue unencumbered by promises of more stuff. - Filmmaker Professor - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:28 pm: Does his average of state worker salaries include the U of I football and basketball coaches ($1.8 million each) and the U of I athletic director (approx. $1 million with bonuses)? And speaking of state expenses, check out this analysis of U.S. College Staffing Changes from 1987 - 2011. Growth in U of I (Urbana) administrators over that period: 116%. Those are certainly Rauner voters. http://college-table.wgbh.org/college_local - Casual Observer - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:30 pm: Pot, I was simply using that as an example where private businesses can perform government functions and are doing so already. Replace snow plows with schools or maintenance facilities. Again, I’m not for privatization per se, but I see the Governor at the negotiating table saying to unions “I don’t need you”. - Nervous state employee - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:34 pm: It sounds like there are some knowledgeable people here. Does anyone know how Rauner can cut union and merit comp salaries? Can he really just do across the board cuts by executive order? Does he have to provide notice? - Wordslinger - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 3:46 pm: CO, if we’re playing the “replace” game, replace “union” with “citizen” or “neighbor” or “working stiff.” Rauner hasn’t done anything yet but talk, and he talks out both sides of his mouth, so we don’t know what he’s going to propose. But if anyone thinks there’s enough money to squeeze out of state employees to “improve the economy,” whatever that means, hook me up with one of those Nobel Prize U of C professors who teaches that. - Casual Observer - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 4:01 pm: Slinger, I think we agree. I was only responding to the part of the post where the Governor thinks government workers are over paid and how I think he will address it. Will it solve the massive budget hole? No way close. But it’s definitely on his agenda. - Norseman - Friday, Jan 23, 15 @ 4:06 pm: === But if anyone thinks there’s enough money to squeeze out of state employees to “improve the economy,” whatever that means, hook me up with one of those Nobel Prize U of C professors who teaches that. === Looking at FY 14 numbers a 10% reduction in salary lines gives you about $500 million. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.