90 Comments - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:02 am: ===“The House acted in May to avoid any disruption of a wide range of core programs and services important to middle-class and struggling families. Those are the people who will be harmed by a shutdown,” Madigan said. “Every House member is entitled to hear how the administration will determine which services will continue, allowing advocates to assess the impact of the governor’s shutdown and his agencies’ shutdown decisions…=== “…of the governor’s shutdown and his agencies’ shutdown decisions…” Governors own. The House hearing is solely to reinforce that absolute, and framing all that will be discussed as owned by Governor Bruce Rauner. You can run Ads, call things “shams”, try and place at the feet of decisions made as consequences of… other Governors’ decisions… but the reality is… “..,of the governor’s shutdown and his agencies’ shutdown decisions…” That’s the ball game. Rauner and his Crew know, they own it, because, why all the effort to NOT own it? - Skeptic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:06 am: Cue the Republican response with the words “phony” and “sham” in 3….2….1…. - Goldwater Republican - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:09 am: I’m going to start taking a shot every time MJM uses the word “Reasonable”. The weekly Tuesday Madigan Press conference will hence forth be known as Happy Hour. - O.W.L. - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:14 am: I think it is hilarious that anybody thinks these committee of the wholes are effective PR weapons. Goldwater- I’m afraid I would spit out the shot from all the laughing at who is “reasonable” and “extreme”. - Wordslinger - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:14 am: The more focus on the budget, the better. That’s where the rubber hits the road for all citizens, not the governor’s dorm-room debating club agenda. Of course, the governor has extraordinary amendatory and reduction veto powers to advance the proposition with the bills he has, if he continues to refuse to take any role in crafting a tax and spending plan. - anon - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:18 am: reyes, let me correct you. The state was already way beyond crap. The Governor is trying to correct the mess accelerated over the past dozen years. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:20 am: - O.W.L. -, It’s not the PR at play here as much as reminding the givernkr that he, Bruce Rauner, will be held accountable for a shutdown. Think of it as… “fair warning”… - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:22 am: - anon -, Well then, you should have no problem applauding Governor Rauner for the decisions Governor Rauner makes… - Former Merit Comp Slave - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:28 am: Well played Mr Speaker. This is the info John Q Public needs to hear - Just Me - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:28 am: Will the hearing include an examination of the blatantly unconstitutional bill the Democrats passed? - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:30 am: ===Will the hearing include an examination of the blatantly unconstitutional bill the Democrats passed?=== Rauner just signed the Education breakout of it… So there’s that… - walker - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:32 am: Not sure who the audience is for these PR hearings. This one is obviously of no help to any one, unlike the others which at least had some policy-related content. Is it just for a handful of press reporters? Is it to use in some future campaign communications? Is it to embarrass any agency heads who decide to show up? Is it just to torture the minority caucus members until they decide to take a serious vote? I call “sham.” on this one. - Langhorne - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:36 am: JM, are you referring to the budget bills as unconstitutional? The budget doesnt become law until the gov acts on it (or the clock runs out, not likely). He has an assortment of powers available to bring it into balance. He can also seek passage of another bill to raise more revenue. It aint soup yet. - downstate commissioner - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:37 am: Walker-I agree, it is a”sham”, but the objective has probably already been met: “Rauner Shutdown” is the brand, and Bruce Rauner will own it… - Snucka - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:38 am: I hope that this hearing is conducted in moderation. Not in the extreme. - facts are stubborn things - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:38 am: MJM continues to frame the debate in terms — Rauner is operating in the extreme and not moderation and problems will get solved only if everyone is reasonable…..mix of revenue and cuts. MJM is also establishing the narrative that if there is a shutdown it is the Rauner shutdown…..the legislature has sent Rauner spending bills so Rauner can use his constitutional authority and keep government running. - Ducky LaMoore - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:40 am: @Walker Agreed. They are playing a straight with two pair on the board. While I don’t necessarily disagree with Madigan’s take on the budget, I think he is starting to overplay his position. In turn, might actually take some heat off the gov instead of applying more. But then again, the casual bystander may not have been paying too much attention to this point. I don’t know, I just don’t like it. - PublicServant - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:42 am: ===…to assess the impact of the governor’s shutdown and his agencies’ shutdown decisions and determine appropriate alternatives to his approach.=== Bruce, the legislature would like to know just what parts of government you plan to shutdown, and which programs you plan to cut, if you decide not to sign any more of the bills that you have, and that would avoid balancing the budget on the backs of the poor and middle class citizens of this state. Remember, once you sign one of Madigan’s sham budget bills, signing the others should be easier. - Louis G Atsaves - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:42 am: When the House voted in May for a budget with a nearly $4 billion shortfall between revenue and expenses, did it anticipate that this would disrupt a wide range of core programs and services important to middle-class and struggling families? And now he wants Rauner to tell him how this disruption will take place and to whom? Or is this designed to force Rauner to sign the (remainder) of the budget just plopped onto his desk that would disrupt a wide range of core programs and services important to middle-class and struggling families? A disruption caused by the budget enacted by the legislature. Wow! - A guy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:44 am: ===“Rauner Shutdown” is the brand=== It’s one guy’s attempt at branding, but it’s hardly “the brand”. Funny thing….what if it becomes the brand and that’s the brand the public likes? Hmmmm. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:46 am: - Louis G Atsaves -, If you’re telling me Governor Rauner isn’t up to the task of both not having his own budget, and not up to owning a budget he will sign… What does Rauner do, when it comes to the actual giverning part of his job? You know, governors own. Rauner himself blamed Quinn for the hires, the agency spending, programs, taxes, anythibg and everything every governor owns… Now you’re saying that anythibg above Rauner’s signature ISN’T Rsuner’s “Wow!” - Langhorne - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:46 am: Good move by madigan. Show what a shutdown means in human terms. Feed the capitol press. Whats rauners response? State govt isnt important, so a shutdown is no big deal? Actually enacting draconian cuts? Will the public say its ok for gramma to lose home health care, as long as we get term limits? - Norseman - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:48 am: Word and Willy have effectively set the stage. I’ll just add that Z has some decisions to make. Will he allow agency heads to testify? If so, he better hope these superstars perform better than the frat boys. There has to be some administration presence to get their message out amid all the provider and advocate doomsayers. He then needs to make the wise decision of sending Tim Nuding (sorry Tim, this is your burden because you’re truly the superstar on this team) to the hearing rather than Goldberg. Silly me, I try to think of a reasonable response. They’ll probably send Goldberg with a big poster with the word “sham” hung on the podium. IOU coming for Demoralized’s jar. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:49 am: - A Guy -, It’s Governor Rauner’s Shutdown; Rauner has the bills. Rauner can sign, veto, AV, but at the end of the day, if the government shuts down, it’s Bruce Rauner’s. Governors own. They always have, they always will, and no matter what you think, Rauner is no different in the role of the Executive in that absolute fact. - Norseman - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:50 am: - Langhorne - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:36 am: - Well said. - Anon - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:51 am: –“In May, the House passed a spending plan that included close to $300 million in cuts to state agencies. Each day that passes without action by the governor creates unnecessary disruption and anxiety in every region of the state,” Madigan added.– So, does that “every day that passes…” include the month-and-a-half Madigan and Cullerton sat on the approp bills before sending them to the governor? This is pretty shallow for MM, IMO. More dog and pony show. Not unexpected. Hopefully something actually meaningful will happen soon. Until then, this is all lame theater and a waste of time. - Wordslinger - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:53 am: Louis, the guvs peeps should take this opportunity to publicly sell the governor’s competing budget proposal. You remember that one, don’t you? That’ll show ‘em. It will be sham-rific. It would be enlightening to finally hear, five months later, the proposed revenue source for its $3 billion plus shortfall. No hurry or anything, though. - pundent - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:54 am: Louis G Atsaves - I believe that the position of the GA is simple. They feel that the state and its agencies and critical services need to be funded at a certain level. It’s now up to Rauner (as it is to all governors) to decide which agencies will be forced to operate with less funding, which services will be cut or what additional revenue will be sought to avoid these actions. Seems pretty straightforward. We can have all the committee hearings that the GA wants or run all the commercials that the governor deems necessary. But it doesn’t fundamentally change the responsibilities. - Kodachrome - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:56 am: The citizens of this state will decide who owns what, no matter what anyone here says or cites to. THATS the ballgame. - Worth It - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 9:59 am: With Rauner’s support from the newspapers and his ability to run ads statewide, he will not own this, certainly not like any other governor would. At worst blame will be shared at best it will further expose the fact that the Madigan led democrats are not willing to make the changes necessary to fix this state. If the voters felt incremental change would work they would have stayed blue and not elected Rauner. - Skeptic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:01 am: “Sham-a-rific.” I like that! Can we add phoney-bologna? Moderation-iness? Extreme-a-tude? - VanillaMan - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:01 am: It is really very simple. If a governor allows the state government to shut down, then that governor isn’t governing and he is failing in his job. As governor, the buck stops with him. Political finger pointing might pacify his supporters, but politics isn’t a good enough excuse when a governor allows the state government to shut down. Crashing the car within six months of obtaining the responsibility to drive it, shows an inability to drive. Crashing a government within six months of inauguration, shows an inability to govern. It is that simple. - Skeptic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:02 am: “If the voters felt incremental change would work they would have stayed blue and not elected Rauner.” As has been mentioned repeatedly, electing Rauner wasn’t a shift toward the right it was a thumb in the eye of Quinn. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:06 am: ===If the voters felt incremental change would work they would have stayed blue and not elected Rauner.=== Ugh. “Stayed blue”, Rauner courted Democrats, had history with navy Democratic leaders, donated to Democrats all over the country, and even voted in a Democratic Primary while living in Chicago, after clouting his denied Daughter into Paytin Prep through, you guessed it, Democrats. It’s not a “Blue/Red”… “thing” - Kodachrome -, that’s Rauner’s hope. Why? Rauner can’t face that he does own it, and even after the smoke clears. Whatever Rauner signs, vetoes, “chooses”, it’s always on a governor. - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:11 am: Oswego, I’m not as convinced as you. Citizens know there has been decades of incompetence Illinois. Citizens also know that Rauner has only been in office a very short time. What’s past is prologue…until it isn’t. Majority leaders in the U.S. House never lose primary elections…until they do. Illinois was the only state without concealed carry…until it wasn’t. I could go on. The Democrats are great at spin, truly. But Rauner has the money to hammer home a very simple, very true message: Democrats like Madigan own the budget situation more than anyone. It’s not a complicated message. The Democrats have had an easier lift in the past. I’m not so sure that’s true today. - White Denim - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:11 am: I wouldn’t be all that surprised if the Governor’s office responded that this was a “phony, sham” hearing since, you know, that’s exactly what it is. - O.W.L. - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:17 am: I heart all of the Madigan apologists on here, I really do. If a shutdown brings about term limits and a nonpartisan map, it will be worth it, and IL will be better for it. Cue more nonsense in 3…2…1… - MickJ - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:20 am: Energy assistance funded entirely with rate payer money - Rauner is about to shoot those hostages. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:20 am: - Liandro - I have no doubt Rauner will try, heck IS trying to point the blame, and with a million a week in Ads, yeah, Rauber has a better than 50/50 shot. What many are forgetting is those effected, they know what agency they get monies from, how chosen cuts work, their lobbyists know that the Governor is the end game, and phone trees and letters and protests are pointed at governors, because those closest to these things, they know who to voice their frustration at. I’ve never seen/heard a governor so intent on NOT claiming the duties of the office, and not accepting the consequences of their own actions. Ever. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:22 am: - O.W.L. -, Rauner signed the bill. Rauner threw the GOP GA under the bus. Rauner used a pen, purposefully made a decision only a governor can. Get over it. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:23 am: - Decker -, you are a troll, please take the “R” with you. Please. Thanks. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:25 am: - O.W.L. -, How will term limits and fair maps come out of a shutdown. Show your work, please. - Worth It - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:27 am: I’m not saying that the citizen’s have shifted their ideology to the right. What I am saying is that in a blue state (it remains blue) the citizens of Illinois went against their normally solid democratic party leanings and elected Rauner because they felt it was necessary to implement a change in the way the state is being run. Rauner has the ability to get his own message out there and also gets the benefit of being perceived as the outsider compared to the entrenched MJM. Most voters acknowledge that IT was broke before January 2015, to say that Rauner is going to shoulder this blame over the legislature and Madigan is wishful thinking (for some). - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:27 am: Oswego, I happen to strongly believe that some of the things Rauner is advocating for (eliminating prevailing wage, for example) ARE hugely beneficial for Illinois financially. Cities and school districts would get so much infrastructure done for so much less. You’re convinced that is all “poison pills” and “not accepting consequences”. I’m not, although I certainly have some questions about all of it. That’s a major different between the two of us. To the politics of it: Bill Clinton was a master politician. He let a Republican Congress take the majority blame for the shutdown, yet gets the praise for balanced budgets/surpluses that never would have happened without the Republican shutdown. Yes, I’m over-simplifying (cue the history lessons), but my point is this: no, the executive branch doesn’t always take the blame. Rauner is not Clinton, but Madigan has baggage, and Rauner has money and passion. Don’t score the points on this one quite yet. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:30 am: ===their ideology to the right. What I am saying is that in a blue state (it remains blue) === 10 Democratic U.S. House members 8 GOP U.S. House members The Constitutional Officers are split even. Stop. Please stop with this “blue state” painting of generalities. It’s tired. - downstate commissioner - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:31 am: Willy’s being a little harsh this morning, but that’s okay: He’s right. Madigan wins. Again. - VanillaMan - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:32 am: Governors are responsible for the people’s government, not just his politics. A governor has to demonstrate that their priority values governing over politics. This governor is failing to do that and has been failing ever since he demonstrated that campaigning was more important to him, than governing. This governor’s priorities are wrong. If they were right, this governor would discover that his politics would become more successful. This governor has his priorities backwards. If he focused upon governing, he would discover the power governing can have over politics. This governor wouldn’t need to spend a million dollars on television campaign ads. The current governor is making it harder for him to reach his own goals by failing to govern. The current governor isn’t building consensus. He can’t claim that he is governor for all citizens when he isn’t trying to build bipartisanship. When a governor governs, he builds support, but that isn’t what we are seeing with this governor, is it? The current governor needs to advertise on television because he is failing. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:37 am: - downstate commissioner - My apologies. I keep reading these excuses, and this idea it’s on a, any, governor but Bruce Rauner is absolved is the rationale to explain away deliberate governor actions… I mean, at least be honest what’s going on and make an argument, don’t tell me blatant moves aren’t owned. With respect. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:42 am: @Liandro: “I happen to strongly believe that some of the things Rauner is advocating for (eliminating prevailing wage, for example) ARE hugely beneficial for Illinois financially. Cities and school districts would get so much infrastructure done for so much less.” How exactly is cutting wages of hard working construction workers ‘beneficial’ for Illinois? I suppose if your boss sauntered into your office and said “Great news, I’ve just cut your salary 25%, saving the company money. Go home and share this wonderful news with your family, and don’t forget to share how much better the corporation will be for your sacrifice!” Or even better, how about your company hire in a bunch of H-1B visa workers, and YOU get to train them to do your job, then get fired, while they make 40% less than you did! What a great plan. Devastate families so we all can save a few bucks up front, and pay out the wazzoo in food stamps, welfare, and housing assistance. Maybe next, Illinois can begin paying workers with “Illinois Cash” that’s only redeemable at State Stores ™? Remember, cutting wages is only good if it doesn’t happen to you. - Anonymous - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:48 am: - so much infrastructure done for so much less. - Spoken as someone without a bit of experience with construction. We’re not talking about building mediocre sandwiches, but schools, roads, and bridges. Only the feeble minded want to use cut rate, fly by night contractors for those. - Skeptic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:50 am: “felt it was necessary to implement a change in the way the state is being run.” Right. They didn’t like how Quinn was running it, and since they had no other options, Rauner won. That’s not necessarily an endorsement of Rauner. It’s entirely possible a head of cabbage could have beaten Quinn. - Enviro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 10:52 am: ==If the voters felt incremental change would work If the voters felt incremental change would work they would have stayed blue and not elected Rauner.== Or more likely if voters knew that Rauner’s agenda would result in right to work zones, destroy organized labor, and weaken the financial security and prospects of middle income workers they would have stayed blue and not elected Rauner. == - Frenchie Mendoza - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 11:04 am: — …felt it was necessary to implement a change in the way the state is being run. — Problem is — and Rauner doesn’t understand this — he didn’t *run* on any of things he wants to change. He didn’t run on changing the prevailing wage, he didn’t run on anti-unions, he didn’t run on any of his “Turnaround Agenda”. The Agenda thing — like Scott Walker’s attack on collective bargaining — appeared *after* Rauner won. Essentially, Rauner lied to get the governorship — and, like Walker — decided to keep quiet during the election of his real agenda. That’s not partisan — that’s true. Had Rauner *run* on the Turnaround Agenda, he would have lost. Period. No matter how much money he’d throw against it. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 11:13 am: At what point does the Turnaround Agenda become the Runaground ™ Agenda? - thunderspirit - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 11:13 am: The only dog I have in this fight is Illinois and my fellow residents — not a Rauner fan, not a Madigan fan — but I’m not yet ready to call this match in Madigan’s favor. The public reaction hasn’t been scored, so it could still be a toss-up. I *will* say that the Speaker is much more experienced at playing politics than the Governor, which certainly tilts the odds his way. It’s always possible Madigan has overplayed, but it would be a surprise if he miscalculated on this. - Mama - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 11:19 am: Is the information the governor collected from all of the agency heads earlier (in case of a strike) not available to Madigan? - Demoralized - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 11:39 am: ==Is the information the governor collected from all of the agency heads earlier (in case of a strike) not available to Madigan?== I doubt it. Those are planning documents and those don’t have to be released to anybody. - Rich Miller - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 11:40 am: ===those don’t have to be released to anybody.=== The House has subpoena powers. - Demoralized - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 11:46 am: ==The House has subpoena powers.== That would be an interesting thing if it happened. I would imagine that the Executive branch would asset a separation of powers argument. Information requested by the GA is denied sometimes and other times only selective information is provided. I wouldn’t hand over the information regardless. - Demoralized - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 11:47 am: Assuming I wouldn’t go to jail for refusing to do so. - Anonymous - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 12:04 pm: Anything to deflect attention from Madigan and his agenda bankrupting the State. Pull a Blagovich and surround yourself with kids and old folks to hide behind. - Rich Miller - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 12:09 pm: ===deflect attention from Madigan and his agenda bankrupting=== Lance? Is that you? lol - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 12:11 pm: ===Pull a Blagovich and surround yourself with kids and old folks to hide behind.=== Aww, you must’ve missed all the speechin’ and campaignin’ by Rauner. It was in a the papers, Tee-Vee too… - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 12:13 pm: … and I’m talkin’ about in the past few weeks, toutin’ that Turnaround Agenda… - VanillaMan - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 12:20 pm: Anything to deflect attention from Madigan… Madigan doesn’t attract attention unless we don’t have a governor. DO WE TODAY? - JS Mill - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 12:27 pm: “Madigan doesn’t attract attention unless we don’t have a governor. DO WE TODAY?” Direct hit. You sunk his battleship. - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 1:01 pm: Mediocre sandwiches and feeble-mindness? Your talking points are weak, but your ad hominums are pretty decent. I give you points for using “feeble”, that’s a fun one. - Joe Bidenopolous - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 1:04 pm: Seems to me the audience for this are the members, the administration and to a lesser extent, the press corps and their dwindling readership. They’re educational in nature. For GOP legislators in particular, I wonder how many will continue following down the yellow brick road when faced with the pain. Sure, $20 million soothes a lot of souls, but the pain they’re feeling now has been inflicted by the governor. And they now know he’ll sell them down the road again if it serves his purposes. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 1:22 pm: I wonder if the GOP feels a little like Julia Roberts in Pretty Woman? Except now they find out that in this version, he drives off in the limo all by himself at the end leaving them to deal with the mess he’d left? - Formerly Known As... - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 1:50 pm: ==We urge a balanced approach, one that includes spending reductions== Did I miss the cuts Mr Madigan recommended? What is he recommending to cut? - Rich Miller - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 1:51 pm: ===Did I miss the cuts Mr Madigan recommended?=== There were some fairly substantial Medicaid cuts in the budget he passed, among other things. They haven’t really highlighted it, although he does mention if occasionally to reporters. - Anonymous - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 2:01 pm: - Your talking points are weak - By all means, Mayor, elaborate on your extensive knowledge of cost and quality control outside the sandwich industry. - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 2:16 pm: In the private sector, I’ve done roofing, demolition crew, multiple development projects on my properties, and have even GC’d one of my own commercial projects that I then leased out. On the federal level, I’ve spent my entire decade+ as an Army Engineer…which is just another way of saying I’m an construction worker. At the City level, I’m deeply involved in several multi-million dollar infrastructure projects and meet with engineers multiple times a week on numbers and plans. Oh, and I put my name on my posts. Any other questions? - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 2:19 pm: As a side note, many of my fellow Army Engineers are in construction unions, so we have some fun conversation, lol. - Anonymous - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 2:35 pm: That’s great Liandro Courageous. I’m guessing the Army pays way under scale for their projects, right? Do you have experience managing cost and quality with experienced, reputable contractors vs. cut rate? Can you read a bid and figure out if the low bidder demonstrates understanding and acceptance of the scope? If the answer was yes, you wouldn’t make the claim that prevailing wage alone would save tons of money. Thankfully Dixon has a city manager to actually run the town, they’re usually not as easily duped. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 3:09 pm: @Liandro, Army Engineer eh? I bet we could save a bundle farming that out the the Chinese or Indians. Why pay you those high-service wages when we could have someone do it for much, much less? I bet those conversations with the Union guys are fun. Here’s a tip, they are not laughing with you. - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 3:33 pm: Actually, the Federal government often did farm it out…to private contractors that made twice as much as enlisted Soldiers. That’s not exactly a secret. Also, I’m not really sure why either of you think “high-service wages” Soldiers make anything close to as much as union shop guys, but the internet is open if you want to actually research that. I’m not anti-union, but I also don’t support forcing taxpayers into inflated contracts that have no bearing in what things actually cost in rural markets. Reform the system and you’ll have a better leg to stand on. Currently west of us, which is based off a different market, is dramatically cheaper for prevailing wage despite have similar cost of living. Even local Democrats recognize that (if their not on the record). Heck, a union-member elected (D) State Rep acknowledged the need for reform–although it was in the context of (strenuously) saying he’d never vote to eliminate it. - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 3:39 pm: Also, how do Chinese or Indians (scare-monger much?) relate to bidding competition with other Americans? These are your neighbors, not the Chinese. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 3:48 pm: @ Liandro: “Also, how do Chinese or Indians (scare-monger much?) relate to bidding competition with other Americans?” Oh I don’t know. (http://www.npr.org/2011/09/16/140515737/california-turns-to-china-for-new-bay-bridge) “California is spending more than $7 billion building what it says will be an architectural marvel: the new San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge. But the state saved a lot of money sending some of the construction work overseas.” “…This assembly will be performed early next year by American labor. But the massive cable, key sections of the iconic tower and deck were all made in China, which is emerging as an infrastructure powerhouse in more places than San Francisco. For example, Chinese companies have contracted with New York City for a bridge, the subway system and a commuter train platform.” (http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/04/us/last-task-after-layoff-at-disney-train-foreign-replacements.html?_r=0) “ORLANDO, Fla. — The employees who kept the data systems humming in the vast Walt Disney fantasy fief did not suspect trouble when they were suddenly summoned to meetings with their boss. …Some were performing so well that they thought they had been called in for bonuses. Instead, about 250 Disney employees were told in late October that they would be laid off. Many of their jobs were transferred to immigrants on temporary visas for highly skilled technical workers, who were brought in by an outsourcing firm based in India. Over the next three months, some Disney employees were required to train their replacements to do the jobs they had lost.” Would you like me to continue? There are literally HUNDREDS of these types of stories, where folks like yourself in the quest for destroying living wages, and fair working conditions savage the working class. If you are unaware, get educated. If you are just turning a blind eye to the never ending ‘race to the bottom’ shame on you. - Anonymous - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 3:52 pm: - that have no bearing in what things actually cost in rural markets. - That’s a red herring. Prevailing wages have to be justified by the respective county. If you disagree with the rates, take it up with the Dept. of Labor, I’m sure you’ll find a friendly ear. - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 4:06 pm: @How Ironic, First, a challenge: see if you can go a few posts without ad hominems. Things like “folks like you in their quest for destroying living wages”, etc., are just silly. My quest is to save the taxpayers money…most of whom make far, far less then prevailing wage. Yet they fund it. And some of it will be saved by, yes, union members–all of whom also pay taxes. On average, prevailing wage takes money from money from people lower in the economic ladder and directly transfers that money to people who already make more money. You’re social justice angle just falls flat with me. Second, if your true concern is the Chinese, there are a ton of legislative options to deal with that. Those cases are outliers in the first place. In Dixon, prevailing wage forces the City to use out-of-town contractors far more then it ever helps local contractors. Far, far more. As for prevailing wages being justified by the respective county…pointless. The formula is broken and has been for a long time. Adjusting it to local areas is a talking point that is meaningless in the real world. - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 4:07 pm: Also, very sorry for all the there/they’re/their and then/than mistakes. Was typing in a hurry…have a g’nite. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 4:14 pm: @Liandro You accused me of being a “scare-monger”. Now with specific examples of very common, and increasingly common business models you suggest they are ‘outliers’. Your desire to do away with prevailing wage, is very simply a ploy to reduce wages of working families. There is no other way to cut it. You want the work done as cheaply as possible, with no mechanisms to ensure that families can actually live on the wage. At least be honest about it. But, when your job gets passed off to the lowest bidder, save the tears. If you haven’t already, read the Jungle. Then ask yourself if maybe worker, and wage protection is such a bad thing. We’ve tried minimal regulation in the past. It always ended badly for the worker, and their families. - Liandro - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 4:32 pm: Common to rural America? No. Prevailing wage could be heavily reformed in rural Sauk Valley and still be well above local averages. That’s why your social justice angle falls so flat with me. I don’t want work done as cheaply as possible, and one valid concern without a prevailing wage is not always taking low bit. Dixon just voted to skip lowest bid on a project. That one I agree with you on. - A Citizen - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 4:55 pm: Really? I think of the coming Shutdown as a Madigan State Services Shutdown. He should step up to the plate and walk over to the guv’s office and get some work done. Frankly, his cute phraseology is lost on me. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 5:19 pm: @ A Citizen: “He should step up to the plate and walk over to the guv’s office and get some work done.” He probably would, but who would he meet with? The gov’s out campaignin’ and ad writin’. He doesn’t have time to sit down and do real work. - A Citizen - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 5:23 pm: Really? Frankly, your cute phraseology is lost on me too. You must of gone to the same school as ow. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 5:49 pm: @ A Citizen, I’m flattered. Maybe the Gov should have been meeting with the 4 tops, rather than driving all over the state in campaign mode for the last 4 months. Maybe one of his advisers can clue him in that he won the election, now it’s time to govern. And the shutdown? That’ll be on Rauner. He’s the boss now remember? When a company holds a lockout, they don’t blame the COO. They blame the CEO. - A Citizen - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 5:58 pm: I am amazed you are flattered, you should not be. Especially after categorizing Cullerton and Madigan as CooCoo. - How Ironic - Thursday, Jun 25, 15 @ 6:11 pm: @ A citizen, Maybe you can give me some schoolin’. Please give me some examples where rather than giving speeches and running around the state, the Gov has actually been working on his job? I mean, besides that half-baked, out of whack budget proposal he gave in Feb? The one where he relied on bogus, unrealistic pension savings? I have a feeling I’m going to have to wait a long time for your response. This Gov is acting like he bought the job…wait a sec….. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.