49 Comments - Fusion - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 8:35 am: ==discriminate against Chicago school children by providing just 73 cents for every dollar that children in the rest of the state receive on average== ==CPS represents 20 percent of state enrollment but gets just 15 percent of state funding, even though 86 percent of our children live in poverty.== If this is true — and I have no reason to doubt Claypool on these stats — then what in the world is going on here?? - Anon221 - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 8:41 am: But everything is peachy in North Chicago… http://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/lake-county-news-sun/news/ct-lns-dold-rauner-early-education-st-0121-20160120-story.html - Juvenal - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 8:42 am: Yes, Rich. A lawsuit is coming. I believe the city will prevail. It would be interesting to get Madiar’s thoughts, and John Bouman’s. - Demoralized - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 8:49 am: I’m sure there are other school districts who don’t get a share equal to what their student population is. Are you telling me some of those rich suburban districts get the same percentage of funding as they have students? Are we now at the point where we are budgeting based on percentage of students? CPS also gets block grants for education from the state. I’m pretty sure that other school districts don’t think that’s fair. This fight could get ugly between Chicago and Downstate. - CD Sorensen - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 8:53 am: Does anyone know how many years this CPS revenue imbalance has been the case, or where one could find the current and historical numbers behind this situation? Because this feels like just as much of a distraction as the Illinois GOP proposal to take over the district. They’re just kinda arguing past each other with these proposals. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 8:58 am: - Anon221 - “Bruce has no social agenda.” - Diana Rauner. I do find it “exciting” that the President of Ounce of Prevention was telling Mr. Fold how important programs like that are. I guess a lack of self-awareness is… missing? “Bruce has no social agenda.” - Diana Rauner To the Post, Goin’ to court, it ain’t Governin’. Bein’ dragged into court for the politics of not governin’, that’s borderline malpractice. - Hoping for Rational Thought - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 8:59 am: Doesn’t Chicago assess property at less than 33.3% for tax purposes than the rest of the state? In essence they may get less state money but their property taxes are at a lower level than the rest of the state. So if they get more state money but continue to pay less property taxes Chicago gets the best of both worlds. - wordslinger - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 8:59 am: Why not? Judges seem to be the only ones interested in governing the state. - Qui Tam - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:00 am: Lawsuit makes sense. In the absence of a budget, we administer through court orders. - Cassandra - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:07 am: When you factor in the block grants, is the funding more or less equal between Chicago and Downstate. On Chi Tonight yesterday, school funding was discussed and Steans made the point that funding problems are statewide. I don’t believe any of the participants brought up the block grants though. That’s important information, if accurate. Chi Tonight is one of my favorite programs, but some of the interviewers need to get tougher. They often tiptoe around the elephant in the room-tax increases-when discussing various state budget problems. How hard is it to ask on a regular basis: how much will this cost, who will pay, and how much will they have to pay. Will the wealthy pay more? Thus, we are rarely reminded that this mostly Democratic state’s tax system strongly favors the wealthy. Very strongly. - Crispy - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:08 am: Wow, what a novel idea. How about a lawsuit to force the governor to present a genuine budget, cease trying to “bust out” the state, and demonstrate good faith in negotiating–well, anything, really. - Anon221 - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:10 am: Yep, “no social agenda” except the one in which he prevails with the types of social programs and school systems he feels are the best for the rest. Down right amazing that the reporter didn’t delve into the disconnect between One Hope’s mission and what other programs B. Rauner had ordered basically shutdown do to his Executive Order in June/July 2015 and failure to use the amendatory veto. Either the First Lady is totally on board with his strategies, or she is turning a blind eye to the millions of other families and children in the State. MrJM’s post from yesterday of 32,000 would be a good piece of contemplation for her. - The Historian - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:11 am: Nationally over the past 25-30 years, indeed ever since San Antonio v. Rodriguez (1973), most if not all such lawsuits have been filed in *state* courts, invoking state constitutional language regarding education. I defer to others more knowledgeable about IL regarding what if any useful language the 1970 Constitution may include… - nobody - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:23 am: Proration of General State Aid since 2012 disproportionally impacts poor children in property poor school districts. That is the real discrimination that apparently no one in the state government cares about (the General Public has no clue ). Where are the headlines and editorials about this deplorable situation? - Anonymous - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:24 am: Rauner would probably welcome a lawsuit. It gives him a chance to A Highlight that he did not create this separate but unequal funding system, but some in Springfield have watched it develop for decades B Sit back while CPS burns more money on lawsuits they do not have to spend - OutHereInTheMiddle - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:25 am: Is a lawsuit coming? OF COURSE! Isn’t that how we ‘govern’ these days???? I assumed that Gov Rauner wanted to take over CPD so he could not do a budget for them also. It’s working so well . . . . - Cheryl44 - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:26 am: This is the same school system that “worked” when he clouted his suburbanite daughter into it. - Amalia - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:27 am: “Bruce has no social agenda.” right, cause few people want to hang around with that guy! my money is on Claypool’s lawsuit. - Norseman - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:31 am: Word +1 - Ahoy! - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:38 am: –PS represents 20 percent of state enrollment but gets just 15 percent of state funding, even though 86 percent of our children live in poverty.– This was asked above and was wondering about the facts of this. While the person above thought they had no reason to doubt a politician, I have plenty. I would like to see the facts from the ISBE, it should be easy to do if good records are kept. I would also like to see apples to apples comparison, take the schools enrollment, - Ahoy! - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:40 am: sorry, some how the last post was posted before I was done. take the schools enrollment and ALL STATE FUNDS (I mean everything) and get the percentage. If we can’t get this easily, we’re not keeping good enough records. - anon. - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:50 am: Wow, what a novel idea. How about a lawsuit to force the general assembly to pass a genuine budget, cease trying to “bust out” the state, and demonstrate good faith in negotiating–well, anything, really. - JS Mill - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:57 am: Forrest is using hi sown math (not unusual for a politician of an party) but his math isn’t correct. Chicago get’s it’s fair share and then some. Could they use more? I am sure they want more and could find a place to spend more money. - Ferris Wheel - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 9:58 am: ==Are we now at the point where we are budgeting based on percentage of students?== What’s wrong with that? Shouldn’t each student in Illinois have the same amount of funds spent on their education? - Demoralized - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:06 am: ==What’s wrong with that? Shouldn’t each student in Illinois have the same amount of funds spent on their education?== You’re telling me that the state should provide the same amount of money to a student in a super wealthy district vs. a student in a very poor district? You want to wipe out some school districts then do that. You start giving everyone equal treatment then you better be prepared to put a ton of money into education. I have no idea why people have the idea that we need equality. This argument is akin to making sure we send the exact same amount of money a local government provides to the state via sales taxes, etc. I mean, after all, it’s not fair if they don’t get an equal amount back, right? You provide funding based on need. You don’t provide it based on making sure everyone is treated the same. - Demoralized - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:08 am: ==What’s wrong with that? Shouldn’t each student in Illinois have the same amount of funds spent on their education?== Also, they don’t receive the same amount of money. There is funding disparity all over the state depending on how much schools get from local taxes. And you want the state to make sure that state money is distributed evenly? The point of state funding is to try an ensure some sort of minimum funding per student. You don’t get there by making sure the state provides an equal amount of resources for every student. - Jack Stephens - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:08 am: I’m tired of funding the Downstate Republican Jobs Program called Prisons. Want to save a half a billion? Let the pot smokers out. Close all but 2 prisons. Fire the union workers. Hire Big Box greeters part time to serve the bologna sandwiches. They can supply their own guns. Maybe the NRA chips in the ammo. - Ferris Wheel - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:10 am: ==I have no idea why people have the idea that we need equality.== Yes, I do believe in equality. I don’t see why all students shouldn’t be treated the same. But even to the rest of your point, if CPS has the greatest proportion of poor and low-income students, don’t they also have the need for an increase in funding? - Will Caskey - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:10 am: Given Claypool’s attempt to sweep special ed funds for general expenditures and threat to lay off a quarter of the teaching force I doubt he wants to make a literal federal case out of CPS. - JS Mill - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:11 am: =Proration of General State Aid since 2012 disproportionally impacts poor children in property poor school districts.= Look up Cicero 99 and help me understand how they are being disproportionately affected. This district, along with the other three districts that serve Berwyn and Cicero, are mainly funded by state aide (GSA). Yet Cicero 99 has consistently run seven and eight figure annual budget surpluses and amassed a fund balance of $150,000,000, so much that they can build a new building with cash on hand. They receive millions more than they have determined that they need. Good for them but this surplus of GSA funding could help many, many other districts. And that is the problem with the state funding formula, it is filled with these little oddities that starve one district and lavish another. = Are you telling me some of those rich suburban districts get the same percentage of funding as they have students?= The answer to the question is almost certainly yes. You can find a prime example in the Normal (McLean Unit #5) district. Many of the “flat grant” districts receive $218 per pupil because of their local property wealth. If you make the comparison the CPS is trying to make, you really have to go district by district not CPS and everyone else. That type of comparison might have some very interesting math. For example- during the ARRA process the Fed made available to the state almost $1 billion in low to know interest school construction loan funding (QSCB) Chicago received access to approximately $500 million in bonding authority around 2009. The state only released the remaining capacity, roughly $495 million, to everyone else in the last two months (application were due 1/15/16). So Chicago, with 20% of the students received more than half of the availability years ahead of everyone else. Somewhat disproportionate I would argue. They may file suit but they won’t win. - Lincoln Lad - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:13 am: I think the lawsuit, if brought, would be dismissed. There are many factors of inequity in comparing one community to another. Enough with political gamesmanship to distract people from the real issues (on both sides). Go to work, find a compromise, effect some reform, cut some spending, add some revenues. Stop the ‘epic’ struggle, and take a step toward resolving problems that affect millions of people. - Demoralized - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:17 am: == I don’t see why all students shouldn’t be treated the same.== The point is they are not. State funding attempts to fix that (though it doesn’t even come close) and you can’t fix it by providing everyone the same amount of state money. If you do that you just make the gap between the rich districts and poor districts that much wider. == if CPS has the greatest proportion of poor and low-income students== And they get the greatest proportion of the poverty grant. If you are going to provide Chicago more money then somebody is going to lose. Or, you’ll have to create yet another Hold Harmless grant to ensure that Chicago can have their money while nobody else loses. But then Chicago will probably argue they want 20% of that too. - Ok - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:18 am: To those asking… All the school funding data is online. You just have to put in a little bit of effort on the data analysis to see the comparisons you want to see. You can’t just demand something in a comment section and expect it to appear. Go do the work. - Team Sleep - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:29 am: I disagree with Andy Manar on many issues, but i felt bad that the original SB 16 failed. The work he put into it - including convincing Chicago area officials to go along with the plan - was impressive. - Anon - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:35 am: This is potentially an interesting track to follow. The US Department of Education, Office of Civil Rights, has become much more active in recent years addressing issues under Title VI of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Recently they just signed an agreement with Toledo Public Schools to resolve a suite brought in 2010. Not sure how far they would get in an regular court but if I were looking for a redress I would look to OCR. - PT - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 10:46 am: Cassandra: Claypool’s numbers do include the special Chicago block grants. But he also includes pension dollars in per-pupil spending figures — and that’s the key to his argument. Each of the last four years, the state has made it’s full employer payments to TRS. The payment totaled about $3.5 billion dollars last year alone — that’s state money being spread among all the state’s school districts except Chicago. That’s what creates the incongruity. When the state was skipping or shorting pension payments to TRS year after year, the Chicago vs. the rest of the state per-pupil spend was pretty equal. - Sue - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 11:35 am: Forgive me for sounding like a know it all but after the S ct ruling- there is only one lawful way under state law to cap pension costs- legislate salary caps. If the State were to say school administrators can only be paid X and teachers Y- then the pension costs would have to be based on those salary maximums. It’s probably not PC but it would be lawful - Carhartt Representative - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 11:37 am: The per pupil state funding for Illinois students swings wildly. I used numbers from Reboot Illinois who aren’t exactly championing CPS. In 2014 CPS students received $4,738 per pupil from the state, Rockford kids received $4,454, and Waukegan students received over $7,400 in state funding. The funding shouldn’t be equalized across the state because of the vastly different costs. Chicago is more expensive than Peoria and Peoria is more expensive than Moline. Chicago also has more expensive students to educate. There are more Chicago students with PTSD, home life issues, and such who require counselors, special ed services, or tutoring. Chicago also pays less property taxes and has TIF districts eating up a lot of resources, plus $700 million per year in charter schools to support. It does seem like it is getting a bad deal from the state, but I don’t think it’s the whole story by a long shot. - Juvenal - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 11:37 am: @JS Mill - Thank you for your anecdote. Instructional spending for Cicero 99 is about 33% below the state average. Operational spending overall is about 25% below the state average. In 2013, they were averaging around 24 kindergartners per classroom while the state average was around 21 kindergartners per class. By contrast, in Rauner’s hometown of Winnetka, where they spend more than twice as much per pupil on instruction, there are 0% English learners, 0% low-income students, and the student population is 2.9 percent Hispanic and only 0.3% African American, the average kindergarten class has 14 students. So yes, Cicero is building a new school — because their classrooms are overcrowded beyond the standards of the governor’s own community. But even a blind man can see the de facto racial disparities created by our over-reliance on property tax wealth to fund our schools. A lawsuit is coming. It will be successful. - JS Mill - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 11:50 am: @Juvenal- With respect, mine was not an anecdote but factual information regarding funding of a so called poor school and how funds were being used. I did not make any qualitative statements on how they used the money or whether or not a new building is or is not needed. I would not do that, I am not interested in tearing them down to build someone else up. I just pointed out that the district, for reasons of their own, decided they did not need to spend a significant amount of funds provided by the state (and Fed for that matter) on instruction. Their choice. They also did not have a documented plan for putting aside the money for construction, more along the lines of “we have the money and could use a new building” was the plan when they put an advisory question on the ballot a few years ago. BTW- I have been in that building but it has been some time, so I do not recall how large the physical space is but by the numbers 24 student in a kindergarten section is not “overcrowded”, research would indicate that it is in the acceptable range for kindergarten class size. The is particularly true when you understand the support/intervention capacity within the district. If Winnetka is now the standard for all (an I am absolutely good with that) then I look forward to the easing of financial challenges for our district as well. In central Illinois we have districts that have 30 or more students per section in kindergarten and 1st grade. These districts are considered “wealthy” by the state. They are not. Respectfully, I disagree on your belief in the lawsuit and its’ probability of success. - JS Mill - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 11:55 am: = that’s state money being spread among all the state’s school districts except Chicago. That’s what creates the incongruity.= CPS is the only district in the state that has the ability to levy for the full amount of their teacher pension payment. Full payment. Only District. So, if they have been taxing for the pension payments and the payments have not been made, where has that money been going? I think that is a reasonably good question for CPS to answer since things are so “incongruous”. - mcb - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 12:22 pm: Chicago receives more than 20% of state ed dollars. Claypool is using bad math, picking what he wants to include. But as others have pointed out, state aid is supposed to level the playing field, not fund each student equally. Chicago has far greater property wealth than other districts(which is how local wealth is calculated) yet they are funded based on a formula that discounts that property wealth to give them more money, in addition to using older enrollment dollars. Chicago should be getting less than 20%, but the system is stacked in their favor. Any lawsuit that looks at the formula and compares Chicago funding with the rest of the state would be DOA. - Formerly Known As... - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 12:53 pm: == I think that is a reasonably good question for CPS to answer since things are so “incongruous”.== A more than reasonable question. - Formerly Known As... - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 1:00 pm: Catalyst Chicago has a good piece. From that ==While it’s unlikely such legislation would pass in Springfield, it wouldn’t be the first time CPS finances have come under the control of an oversight board. In 1979, mismanagement in the district led to a fiscal crisis and some payless paydays. Eventually CPS lost access to the financial markets and could no longer borrow its way out. The following year the state Legislature stepped in to create the Chicago School Finance Authority. The governor and Chicago mayor jointly appointed a five-member board that had the power to issue bonds and levy a separate property tax for that debt. Between 1980 and 2010, the Finance Authority issued over $1 billion in debt. “Don’t forget history. Sometimes history is not that bad,” says Donald Haider, a professor at the Kellogg School of Management at Northwestern University who served as vice chairman of the Finance Authority. “We’re trying to problem solve and keep schools open. What are the options? You used this once, and it was temporarily effective.” Haider, a former city chief financial officer, recently sent Rauner’s staff some materials on the Finance Authority and has been suggesting for quite some time that city and state leaders revisit the idea. In 2010, for example, he wrote an op-ed in Crain’s about the option.== - noname - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 1:56 pm: @mcb. you get a standing ovation. - mcb - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 2:08 pm: I think the only way the “plaintiffs” could get anywhere is to try to compare funding to local costs… If that worked, it would then become the antithesis for everything SB1 is supposed to be, because every poor district outside Cook would get screwed because the poor districts (low property wealth) tend to have low cost of living. The suburbs that he wants to take the money from however, they often have high costs of living, so the end result would be more money for CPS AND wealthy suburbs, less for everyone downstate. Just picture what that would do to East St Louis or even Decatur… - Let'sMovetoNorthDakota - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 2:12 pm: What a frivolous lawsuit and a waste of more tax dollars to attorneys . - Mama - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 3:17 pm: ++mcb - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 12:22 pm:++ “Any lawsuit that looks at the formula and compares Chicago funding with the rest of the state would be DOA.” You are right. - NeverPoliticallyCorrect - Thursday, Jan 21, 16 @ 4:27 pm: CPS needs a reboot. They get more than enough money to educate. The issue is how they spend their money and the hole they’ve dug themselves in debt. I am on a school board in a poor district and I’d love to have the money CPS has. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.