* Tribune…
Trump press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said during Monday’s briefing that “there’s a time and place for a political debate, but now is the time to unite as a country.”
Asked about the issue again, Huckabee Sanders went on to bring up Chicago violence, as the president often has.
“I think one of the things that we don’t want to do is try to create laws that won’t create or stop these types of things from happening,” Sanders said. “I think if you look to Chicago, where you had over 4,000 victims of gun-related crimes last year, they have the strictest gun laws in the country. That certainly hasn’t helped there. So, I think we have to, when that time comes for those conversations to take place, then I think we need to look at things that may actually have a real impact.”
Some of Chicago’s previously tough gun laws, though, have been struck down in court. The Supreme Court has thrown out the city’s bans on handguns and gun stores. And a court decision led to Illinois now allowing for the concealed carry of firearms.
* PolitiFact looked into this last year…
Donald Trump said, “In Chicago, which has the toughest gun laws in the United States, probably you could say by far, they have more gun violence than any other city.”
Chicago once had very tough regulations against guns, but they’ve been considerably watered down after the Supreme Court ruled that cities can’t ban handguns.
Additionally, the state at one time didn’t allow concealed carry, and now it does. Its rules for allowing concealed carry are more relaxed than in California or New York — states that allow local jurisdictions to regulate concealed carry within their boundaries.
Nor are penalties for violating gun laws in Illinois the toughest in the United States. Mandatory minimum sentences make New York state’s laws tougher than those in Illinois. […]
We rate this statement Mostly False.
* Also, too…
* Related…
* NFL gear to be shot at in shooting range near Ottawa, IL: Below Buffalo Range’s announcement, a woman asked on Facebook, “What are you going to do with (the gear)? Burn it?” The range replied, “Destroy it the only way we know how…,” with an image of a handgun at the end of the sentence.
* Buffalo Range answers criticism over NFL event
* What Researchers Learned About Gun Violence Before Congress Killed Funding
* Vegas gunman had device turning weapon into automatic
- Chicago Cynic - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:17 am:
I really wish they’d stop using us as a punching bag. Robin Kelly is 100% right. Ask the FBI and they’ll tell you the problem with illegal Chicago guns is Indiana and to a lesser extent Wisconsin.
- James the Intolerant - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:20 am:
When can the discussion be had?
- G'Kar - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:22 am:
From the article: Buffalo Range “said it is not working to silence voices, but rather to say the players’ method is not working and is hurting the cause.”
I don’t think using NFL jerseys as targets will help the Range’s cause.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:23 am:
I don’t recall anyone ever walking into a Michigan Avenue hotel with 23 rifles, thousands of rounds of ammunition and unloading on the crowds below.
Clearly, that’s pretty easy to do in Nevada. What are the laws like there?
- Cheryl44 - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:23 am:
There are no printable words to describe what I think of this person.
- Epic - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:34 am:
The hypocrisy of the White House statement is almost overwhelming, Trump politicizes any terrorist attack almost immediately like the Pulse night club shooting if it suits his agenda. A reporter really needs to ask Sanders why it’s okay for her boss to do that but no one else.
- Ducky LaMoore - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:36 am:
“there’s a time and place for a political debate, but now is the time to unite as a country.”
Sounds a lot like Penn State when the Paterno stuff blew up. Horrific crimes that just can’t be discussed because we have to “unite”. Please. Give me a break.
- Sox Fan - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:43 am:
===Sounds a lot like Penn State when the Paterno stuff blew up. Horrific crimes that just can’t be discussed because we have to “unite”. Please. Give me a break.===
To be honest, it sounds exactly like the last time a mass shooting happened.
- We'll See - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 11:55 am:
This type of pivot needs to be challenged every single time — Chicago’s violence is tied to very complex social and economic issues. Vegas, one guy with horrifically deadly weapon.
Does anybody have an idea on what we could do about that?
- anon2 - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 12:00 pm:
The lack of funding for research prevents policy makers from having a good idea about what kind of policies are effective and ineffective. Such research would suggest that some if not most gun control proposals wouldn’t achieve their intended purposes. Consequently, I’d think the NRA would like that kind of outcome.
- We'll See - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 12:00 pm:
This type of pivot needs to be challenged every time. Chicago’s violence is tied to very complex social and economic issues.
In Vegas we had one person with horrifically deadly weapon — anybody have an idea what we could do about that?
- Blue dog dem - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 12:02 pm:
I agree with State Rep Costello. Get rid of the FOID card. It is useless when it comes to preventing gun crimes.
- 47th Ward - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 12:04 pm:
You could argue that the relatively recent court decisions that have weakened or ended Chicago’s attempts at gun control have led to the alarming increase in gun violence here.
I wouldn’t make that case, but the record-breaking gun violence is a relatively recent phenomenon and coincided with several court cases that removed the few gun control ordinances the city once had in place.
Just saying.
- Skirmisher - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 12:07 pm:
I had not heard of a “bump stock” until today, but I know the sound of fully automatic weapons and it was the use of fully automatic firearms that set this act of terror apart from all others and indeed made it possible. I am an avid shooter and an NRA member for 45 years. But there is absolutely no excuses for anyone outside the regular military to own or have access to any fully automatic firearms or device which makes a semi-auto function like one. No one in the civilian world needs these, and I include law enforcement officers. The 2nd Amendment does not permit a citizen to own nuclear bomb and it should not be construed to permit such obviously military weapons as machine guns. Yet in a few marginal state’s such as Nevada almost anyone can have one. I am ashamed that this person was able to acquire this stuff legally.
- justacitizen - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 12:21 pm:
IMHO, Chicago doesn’t have a gun problem. It has poverty, lack of family values, drug/alcohol, and disrespect for authority problems.
- Nick Name - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 12:25 pm:
When a bridge collapses, we talk about improving infrastructure. When fire destroys a building, we talk about improving fire safety. When terrorists attack, we talk about improving national security. When there are floods, earthquakes, and other natural disasters, we talk about improving public safety and speeding up the delivery of aid. And so on.
But when an individual with legally obtained semi-automatic weapons and piles of ammo kills a dozen, twenty, thirty, sixty innocent people, and wounds hundreds more, suddenly we can’t talk about legally obtained firearms and ammo. Meanwhile, politicians bought and paid for by the NRA send “thoughts and prayers.”
America: do you have any idea how sick and dysfunctional we look to people from other countries? All because of an imaginary “right” invented by a bunch of 18th century Enlightenment deists.
- jimk849 - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 12:58 pm:
The guns may come from In. and Wisc. but the shooters come from right here in Chicago, Robin
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:01 pm:
What about partnering with the NRA to help solve Chicago’s gun violence problem, instead of making the NRA play defense all of the time? Or would that be wrong, asking for help from gun safety experts?
- Toast - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:06 pm:
the few gun control ordinances the city once had in place.
Like a total hand gun ban, how did that work out?
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:09 pm:
= @ 12:04 pm =
I don’t think the people creating the record breaking violence are worried about any ordinances.
- Toast - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:10 pm:
All because of an imaginary “right” invented by a bunch of 18th century Enlightenment deists.
Just curious, do you feel the same about the other 9 amendments in the bill of rights, or just the ones you find distasteful?
- Retired Educator - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:11 pm:
In terms of the current laws and ordinances, Trump’s talking points are off base.
Nevertheless, before the litigation and the passage of the concealed carry law (which passed over a gubernatorial veto with a Federal Court threatening to write its own opinion if the legislature failed to act), the strict gun laws had no meaningful impact on shootings or murders in Chicago. Remember when the Tribune printed all of the dead persons who had been shot after a high school basketball star became a casualty? I think more than 1,000 were shot dead that year.
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:16 pm:
Skirmisher- bump stocks are pretty much legal everywhere. You can buy one at Cabela’s in Bolingbrook
- Rich Miller - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:23 pm:
===the strict gun laws had no meaningful impact===
Except, what has happened since those laws were repealed?
- dbk - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:30 pm:
Seconding what others said above:
(1) There should be a forceful and coordinated, official response to the remarks by the WH Press Secretary. I generally try to take her remarks in stride, but if we shouldn’t be having The Conversation about Gun Control, then we shouldn’t be having The Conversation about Chicago. Honestly, why can’t somebody bring this to her attention?
(2) If the per capita income on the West Side were $50,000 instead of $12,961 (East Garfield Park) or $10,934 (West Garfield Park), the crime rates in these neighborhoods would be different.
- Grandson of Man - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:32 pm:
Chicago is the GOP’s go-to racist dog whistle. The GOP should look at per capita gun deaths per state before judging anyone else. Of course suicides and accidental shootings are not as exciting to the base as black and brown shootings and homicides.
- Nick Name - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:55 pm:
“What about partnering with the NRA to help solve Chicago’s gun violence problem”
Someone started early today.
- Blue dog dem - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 1:55 pm:
I am not good at posting links. Refer to the American Enterprise Institute -gun violence stats. Some eye opening stuff. But i do realize stats can be used to enhance ones argument.
- We'll See - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 2:01 pm:
- jimk849 @ 12:58″
There’s the vailed “guns don’t kill people” line.
As we’ve seen, guns do indeed do kill.
- cdog - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 2:35 pm:
Reactionary politics is a losing proposition.
Trump is right to stay focused on hurricane relief, and the tax bill.
Maybe the lost souls of Chicago should make a free will choice of not using their weapons offensively.
No excuses.
- Retired Educator - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 2:35 pm:
@Rich Miller:
I also decry the homicide rate in Chicago, but my point was that the city reported unacceptable murder rates that were approximately the same when it had the gun ban in effect and private ownership was outlawed.
Then as is now, many of the crimes were committed using illegally obtained guns. I guess that many of those shooting are not applying for CC permits and FOID cards.
In addition to the former laws and ordinances, Daley was filing all sorts of expensive lawsuits against gun manufacturers that went no place, but cost the taxpayers plenty for mayoral propaganda.
- Blue dog dem - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 2:55 pm:
Skirmisher. I am a lifetime member of the NRA. I echo many of your sentiments.
Word. MGM and most other casinos dont allow guns on their properties. Not even after/during gun shows. Yesterday i alluded to the fact that these hotel/casinos could do some things to help prevent these types of massacres. The Wynn properties started today.
None of this brings back the loved ones lost, but we should never stop trying to make the world a better place. I emailed the NRA last night outlining my wishes for their lobbying efforts. Just like when i contact my elected officials, i fear sometimes it falls on deaf ears. That wont stop me from trying.
About thoughts and prayers. Some may laugh, but i get better results from this method of asking for change than I do asking for politicians to do something.
- We'll See - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 3:57 pm:
-cdog - @ 2:35-
“Maybe the lost souls of Chicago should make a free will choice of not using their weapons offensively.”
Wow, that’s a great idea — you just solved so many of the World’s problems. I see a Nobel Peace Prize in your future.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 4:07 pm:
–I am not good at posting links. Refer to the American Enterprise Institute -gun violence stats. Some eye opening stuff. But i do realize stats can be used to enhance ones argument.–
What are you trying to say? Anything?
What day is good for you to talk about these massacres? I know yesterday you said you needed a few to collect yourself, because you’re so broken up about them this one.
Hurry up, because the next one is right around the corner, and then I guess the clock starts again on your “grieving period.”
Phony.
- Amalia - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 4:37 pm:
Chicago as a punching bag is just code for Trump’s racism. By the pop with crime stats, Rockford is actually the more dangerous city in Illinois and Springfield surprisingly dangerous too. And many other cities not in Illinois more dangerous than Chicago. But those cities are not home of Barack Obama, the first Black President, or Hillary Rodham Clinton, the woman who got 3 million more votes than the blatherer in chief.
- Blue dog dem - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 4:45 pm:
Word. I just needed some time. If you didnt, thats ok by me. It is very personal.
About the link. I dont mind the qty of guns out there so much. Its just the type. I believe there should be federal restrictions on the sale of partts used to turn a semi into full auto. I believe in mag capacity limits. I believe in shell type restrictions. I would like to see longer waiting peeiods and better background checks on certain guns.
Its ok if you dont understand my logic. It probably wont stop anything.
I know one thing that never works. Its what nearly all politicians do. The ‘its my way or the highway’ mentality. I hope you dont fall into that category.
Now that ‘phoney’ thing may have been a cheap shot in this very sad time in our countrys time of healng. But its ok. I still love you and dont even know you.
I would love to hear your ideas on stopping the senseless violencw out there. Heck, i might see it your way.
- Amalia - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 4:50 pm:
@Blue dog Dem, good stuff! trade abolishing FOID for all those restrictions you stated on the State level?
- Blue dog dem - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 5:06 pm:
Amalia. Deal. Maybe you and i oughta head to Spingfield/DC.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 5:10 pm:
–Chicago as a punching bag is just code for Trump’s racism. By the pop with crime stats, Rockford is actually the more dangerous city in Illinois and Springfield surprisingly dangerous too–
East. St. Louis, actually. Then Rockford, Danville, Harvey and Springfield, before Chicago.
https://rebootillinois.com/2016/11/17/illinois-cities-violent-crime-rates/
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 5:30 pm:
= Someone started early today. =
This is why you’ll get nowhere.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 5:30 pm:
–I would love to hear your ideas on stopping the senseless violencw out there. Heck, i might see it your way. –
I’m thinking you could get by in life with a couple of rifles — instead of 40+ — and maybe individuals buying load by the thousands of rounds might be looked at for not having the best intention for the use of their “tools.”
Because you know what? These massacres happen all the time now. No one who ain’t been directly affected deserves a grieving period to collect their “thoughts and prayers.”
That’s just b-s from the gun and ammo makers and their whores.
For crying out loud, if Muslims were behind all these regular mass shootings by loser old white men or their whack-job sons, half of Asia would be be a nuclear wasteland.
- Toast - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 5:46 pm:
* I’m thinking you could get by in life with a couple of rifles *
Why does it matter how many guns I own, I can only shoot one at a time. And target shooters buy/reload ammo by the 1000’s. Do you have anything relevant to add other than your overly emotional shrieking ? That must be an Oak Park thing, because you sound just like Harmon.
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 6:41 pm:
= But those cities are not home of Barack Obama, the first Black President, or Hillary Rodham Clinton, the woman who got 3 million more votes than the blatherer in chief. =
Those cities are also not racking up 6-700 murders a year. A person is shot every 2.5 minutes, and 4-5 are murdered every hour in Chicago. Call it blather, but that’s what the rest of the country sees on WGN news each night.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 7:26 pm:
–Why does it matter how many guns I own, I can only shoot one at a time. And target shooters buy/reload ammo by the 1000’s. Do you have anything relevant to add other than your overly emotional shrieking –
Yeah, me so emotional. So sad, can’t think straight.
Too bad you can’t ask Paddock why he needed 23 guns and all that load. I imagine he’d have a logical explanation for you as to why he needed all those “tools” to complete the job he set out to do.
Because he was a law-abiding citizen…. until he was a mass-murdering monster.
Toast, if I could, I’d suggest those like you load up on multiple electric guitars rather than rifles. It might help you cope with that thing you lack without a body count when you just can’t handle it anymore.
Draft-dodger Nugent needs guns and electric guitars, but maybe you aint’ that weak.
- Toast - Tuesday, Oct 3, 17 @ 9:37 pm:
No thank you, I never had the patience to learn the guitar, and I can handle life just fine without one. Credit where credit is due though, you did confirm what most of us on the pro-2A side already knew: you think the presence of a gun has the potential of turning its owner into a murderer. Nice job.