Unreliable sources
Tuesday, Apr 3, 2018 - Posted by Rich Miller
* Illinois News Network headline…
Analysis: Court ruling on union pay to cost Illinois $400 million, could mean tax hike
* Now, read the story…
The Illinois’ Supreme Court recently decided it would not take up Rauner’s appeal of a lower court ruling that the state has to pay thousands of members of the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees Council 31 their automatic raises, called step increases. Rauner and lawmakers now have to figure out how to pay for those pay hikes that have been accumulating since summer 2015.
Rauner’s office won’t give any figures about how much the judgment will cost the state, but analyses of public payrolls estimate the cost to be $400 million over four years.
“About 40 percent of AFSCME employees are step eligible,” said Ted Dabrowski, president of financial watchdog Wirepoints. “When you include the cost of a higher salary and add the Social Security cost and other costs over four years, you’re talking about a $400 million increase in the cost of AFSCME employees over that time period.”
So, a purported average annual cost of $100 million could lead to a tax hike?
…Adding… The Wirepoints story is here.
…Adding… AFSCME…
We’re analyzing the data to determine what’s owed to employees whose progression through the pay plan Governor Rauner has illegally denied. Looked at in totality, step increases have only a small net cost to the state, because the progression of the newest, usually lowest-paid employees through the pay steps is largely funded by what the state saves annually through attrition as older, typically higher-paid employees leave the workforce.
- Retired Educator - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:38 am:
If they had not screwed around with this for the last 3 plus years, it would not be an issue.They have hurt workers, retirees, and all Illinois taxpayers by kicking the can down the road. Pay what is owed, including back pay, negotiate a contract, and get back to business. Not a hard concept.
- Perrid - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:40 am:
I’m sure he would say something like “death by a thousand cuts.” Which wouldn’t exactly be wrong, but yeah, it’s at least an exaggeration.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:41 am:
Curious that INN sets its hair on fire about a $100M pay bump, but saw no problema in Rauner adding $12 to the backlog of bills in just 2.5 years.
For those playing at home, $12B is $100M x 120.
- Grandson of Man - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:43 am:
Gee, if only Rauner negotiated in good faith with AFSCME instead of wasting so much time with his war and depriving taxpayers of savings through reasonable employee concessions. If only the contract dispute was allowed to go to arbitration, where a resolution could have ended this. Clever by half. Rauner in his arrogance is basically doubly stupid.
Rauner’s income skyrocketed while being governor: $279 million in two years. The dude could almost singlehandedly pay the bill for one year. That’s why we have to raise taxes on the rich.
- Real - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:44 am:
Is this the same Rauner that’s in a contact/investment dispute over saying he is owed more money than what was given? This same Rauner is refusing to give state employees what there contract said they were owed. I guess people like Rauner live by one set of rules but don’t want anyone else living by that same rule.
- JS Mill - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:44 am:
=For those playing at home, $12B is $100M x 120.=
And, what have the medicare mistakes cost Illinois? I think well past $100 million.
- A State Employee Guy - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:52 am:
Uh, yes?
- Omay - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:53 am:
Someone please remind me, how much prompt pay interest was accumulated just for Fy18? Wow, that tax rate will really have to increase.
- Juice - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:54 am:
Maybe someone from AFSCME would like to weigh in, but I am pretty sure that $100 million estimate is waaaaay on the high end. I’m pretty sure the actual cost is less than $50 million.
- Galena Guy - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:54 am:
To paraphrase another Illinois politician
“A half a billion here,half a a billion there, and pretty soon you’re talking about real money.”
- Anon221 - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 10:56 am:
And don’t forget the other $10 million in back pay raises owed caregivers-
https://tinyurl.com/y7envyqt
It’s more Rauner’s “Rich Man’s Game” than anything else. He may not Tweet like T, but he still celebrates in the manipulation of people’s lives under the guise of “governing”.
- Nick Name - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 11:08 am:
If only Rauner had paid people what they’re owed, when they’re owed it, this wouldn’t be an issue.
But thanks for taking a page from Gov. Quinn’s playbook, Gov. Gaslight.
- Sue - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 11:36 am:
Hey grandson- raise taxes on the rich and most will just move. Your post is pretty lame
- Generic Drone - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 11:43 am:
Sue. Let em move. They dont pay taxes anyway.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 11:47 am:
–Hey grandson- raise taxes on the rich and most will just move.–
Which explains why Park Avenue, Beverly Hills and Marin County are ghost towns.
- Wow said I - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:01 pm:
It doesn’t account for those new employees who couldn’t wait and simply left the state employment. The turnover cost should be examined cause it’s got to be high.
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:02 pm:
Which explains why Park Avenue, Beverly Hills and Marin County are ghost towns.
It explains why mansions aren’t selling in Lake Forest and Wilmette and home values aren’t increasing in Illinois at the rate of other large cities. Citing New York and California is a pretty short sided argument considering the offerings in those two cities compared to Illinois.
- RNUG - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:05 pm:
The other day Rauner knew where he could find the money through a savings plan of his.
Did he forget?
- Man with a plan - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:07 pm:
Dabrowski was the labor policy guy at IPI, now a financial watchdog. Some good old fashioned fake news.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:08 pm:
–It explains why mansions aren’t selling in Lake Forest and Wilmette and home values aren’t increasing in Illinois at the rate of other large cities.–
What does?
Grandson was proposing a graduated income tax with higher rates on the rich. Sue said if that happened, the rich would move away. But it hasn’t happened.
So what are you talking about? Or are you just having a hard time following along?
- Demoralized - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:18 pm:
That’s some pretty in-depth analysis there Mr. Dabrowski. Do that on the back of a napkin did you?
Mr. Dabrowski’s been on twitter today bashing AFSCME. Refer to what he said below. Not sure he’s exactly clear on how the contract works but those workers do in fact have a contract - the one they had has simply been extended pending a new contract. And as for “getting their way” Mr. Dabroski doesn’t seem to be a big fan of the rule of law. The Supreme Court said they should get it.
Mr. Dabroski is a notoriously and rabidly anti-state employee. It doesn’t surprise me that he’s having a Donald Trump moment on Twitter.
==Illinois AFSCME workers could see pay increases even if their union won’t agree to a contract. And if they get their way, it will be expensive. The step increases alone will cost the state – and taxpayers – more than $400 million. ==
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:25 pm:
Big boys like Rauner, with 9 homes, are worried sick about people earning 30k getting a pay raise, putting them at 31k. Worried sick about how to make those people pay more in taxes so that their (relatively speaking small) retirement income won’t kill the state. Meanwhile, he and those in his income bracket are taking in so much money that they need a 10th house somewhere. Maybe an 11th.
When will working people understand that they are all in the same boat and they need to stop ripping on each other and look to the people who can (that is can but won’t) help pay the states bills? I don’t begrudge those who’ve done well for themselves, but it’s become apparent, at least in this state, that those who actually work for a living are being disparaged and punished, while others languish in their wealth seemingly taking little financial responsibility toward helping fix our state. INstead, their solution is just to pay the working folks less. I believe the word crumbs has been mentioned. Ridiculous.
- Honeybear - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:30 pm:
Rauners illegal withholding of the step increases
Personally has cost me $9,657 dollars
I just did the math.
Now what I want to know is
Wasn’t the cost of the workforce already baked into the budget and equations?
If not then the Rauner Administration
Purposely didn’t include the steps which
Were negotiated wages in the 2012
Collective bargaining agreement
Did the legislature not include the steps?
If so the GA is complicit in the wage theft
Regardless
9,657 dollars
Was illegally withheld from me.
The 2011 Collective Bargaining Agreement
Is still in force and has not been replaced or nullified
How would you feel if nearly 10k
Was stolen from you?
The monies for the steps should never have been subtracted from the appropriations for the workforce.
If they were where is it now?
This again is perfidy
Crying that the state is poor and we don’t have the money
When in fact the cost of the steps was a known appropriation and should still be there.
It is simply Rauner perfidy
To again blame unionized public servants
For Rauners
Unprecedented failure
To gain
A single
Achievement in office.
That is 9,657 dollars
That could be used to
send my older daughter to college next year
Buy a used car for my 16 year old
Replace my ancient minivan before it strands me again in East St.louis
The list goes on.
I am of tremendous value as a caseworker to Illinois
I care for the states poor, elderly and disabled
Giving the dignity and respect they deserve to every single person who walks in this crowded understaffed office
(approx 52,000 a year)
When I took this job after coming from hospice
I was promised a small yearly increase from my
Lower starting salary.
Rauner unilaterally and illegally stow that from me and spent it on IT projects that torture me every day (IES)
Every single one of my union coworkers
Is similarly motivated to destroy Rauner in November
Steps are why Janus will fail in Illinois
Rauner took our steps.
Think of the tens of thousands of Afscmes
Who will knock on doors against Rauner
Theft is a powerful motivator
Rauner would be best to pay now and let us return to our natural state of apathy
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 12:46 pm:
I am sure JB will give a tax increase, to the middle class, in his first term as governor.
- Sue - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 1:04 pm:
Word- ask the Governor of CT how it worked for him. They raised rates and actually had a drop in revenue from personal income tax and then GE moved out of State. They had one taxpayer move to Glorida who was responsible for a full one percent of all personal income tax. He was a hedge fund CEO
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 1:16 pm:
- Sue - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 1:04 pm:
I thought that was New Jersey that lost that super rich 1%er according to prior complaints that 30,000 is too much for the rest of us
- Sue - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 1:19 pm:
It’s CT. I forget the name of the individual but his income in 2016 was something like 2 billion and he moved his personal residence but the Hedge Fund is still in CT
- Anon - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 1:47 pm:
And having an uber-rich hedge fund CEO in your state helps everyone else how?
- The Dude Abides - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 1:52 pm:
Being a persistent rascal has sure cost this state a lot of money.
- VanillaMan - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 2:09 pm:
Rauner and his supporters are the reason our constitution had to be written to protect citizens. The writers knew that there are some people who use politics to justify theft.
- AnonAnon - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 2:23 pm:
@ honeybear…unfortunately the agencies did not include the step increases in their proposed budgets to the general assembly. Quite unfortunate they decided to do that since now they have to try to “find” the money to take care of the situation almost everyone knew was clearly illegal. Would be nice if they bumped everyone to the step they should be on effective immediately and then they can figure out how to take care of the back pay. Taking care of current employees will be a big headache. I feel for the people who retired while being owed one or more steps. I believe they will have no way to try to be made whole.
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 2:41 pm:
Gee Sue, your unsourced anecdote about that one guy whose name you don’t know and you can’t remember anything about just hasn’t convinced me. Did you go the Katrina Tronc School of Research?
Meanwhile, it’s an indisputable fact that many of the world’s wealthiest people choose to live in the highest taxed, most expensive locales in the world.
Probably because they have a lot of money.
- Honeybear - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 3:08 pm:
Anon anon. There are only 8 steps, at least in my classification. Thus only 8 possible years of small increases. You can’t be vested until 10 so I doubt anyone would retire being owed steps. The majority of folks in my office are new an thus very effected. Most of our senior folks retired because of Rauner. In just a few years I moved up so fast in seniority I get to take time around Thanksgiving. 10 years ago I would have had to be here 15 to 20 years before I could get such a privilege.
- Fed Up - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 3:47 pm:
Even if the $400 million estimate is accurate, which I doubt it is - it pales in comparison to the $1 billion(!) dollars in LATE PAYMENTS for overdue bills from the last fiscal year alone. So people can get irate over the money owed for contractually obligated step increases that were (illegally) withheld for work that has been completed by the state work force… But it’s honestly a drop in the bucket compared to the outrageous financial predicament that the current administration has created (interest on overdue late payments = $1 billion and counting; bill backlog has ballooned from $5 billion to $16 billion and counting). Where is the outrage for the current administrations financial reckless-nous??
Bottom line is, this whole thing is going to cost a great deal more (through lawsuits, time, and interest accrued) than it would have to just pay the step increases when they were due.
- Fed Up - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 4:18 pm:
Here’s another point that no one seems to discuss - one that AFSCME would be wise to frequently interject:
I’m a relatively new state employee (hired a little over five years ago). But in my particular department, I am the MOST RECENT HIRE. Conversely, since I’ve been here, I cannot even count how many upper-level employees, including many managerial positions, that have left or retired. I would venture a guess at around 130 or so for my entire agency. But the problem is, the state is not hiring staff to replace departed workers. Since 2005, my agency has seen a reduction in work force from approximately 725 people in 2005 to approximately 330 today (at the Springfield headquarters).
This brings me to my point - since 2005 the staff at my agency has seen over 50% reduction in staff, which means that the remaining staff are doing the work of several, not just one. Not only that, but the salaries of those higher paid workers that have left or retired are staying in the state coffers. With the massive reduction in work force, and the massive savings recouped by not re-staffing and replacing the work force, paying the step increases and pension payments should be no problem. WHERE IS THAT MONEY GOING?!?
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 4:46 pm:
==WHERE IS THAT MONEY GOING?==
Out the door. You should be right behind that exit door.
- Sue - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 4:47 pm:
Word- you are a credit to your fellow bloggers- the name Mr smarty pants is Paul Tudor Jones. David Tapper in NJ did the same thing- move to Florida to escape increased state taxes- Maybe your wonder boy JB will find a way to make it more palatable to retain highly mobile billionaires but I doubt it
- Honeybear - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 4:54 pm:
Fed up- exactly. The collapse of the workforce is astounding.
The money is going to Doit for IT pinstripe patronage, consulting contract pinstripe patronage and to cover other expenses because nearly 800 million has been forgiven from Edge tax incentives to large corporations, corporate welfare.
Like Rivian didn’t have to send in 50 million in income tax withholding. We didn’t get 50m so that executives from a car company that has never made a single car could live fat on our tax money.
That’s where
- Sue - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 4:57 pm:
For those of you who don’t think the wealthy won’t flee Illinois when JB raises taxes- read a May 2017 US News and World Report article which describes how CT lost 45 percent of its revenue from its top 100 tax payers in one year between 2015 and 2016. It totaled 200 million in tax revenues adding to Ct’s Tax woes. But of course people won’t think of that if we become even more hostile to our wealthy residents. People in that category can live anywhere and still retain businesses wherever they want
- RNUG - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 5:14 pm:
== You can’t be vested until 10 ==
Um … you are vested in the SERS pension system at 8 years.
- Anon - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 5:28 pm:
Fine, let the wealthy flee. We are not subservient to them and will get by just fine without them.
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 5:29 pm:
It’s not hostility toward high earners………..it’s basic math.
- Sue - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 5:32 pm:
Anon you truly seem to be at a loss to understand basic math- if you lose tax revenue from your wealthiest residents- you are going to have a problem paying for all of your public sector salaries and benefits. The wealthy don’t add a dime to the States spending burden but they pay for folks like you
- wordslinger - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 6:38 pm:
–Maybe your wonder boy JB will find a way to make it more palatable to retain highly mobile billionaires but I doubt it–
Well, he’ll stay for sure if he wins, don’t you think?
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 7:05 pm:
Some positions take ten years to reach the highest Step
Like my position
I have been stuck on step seven for almost three years and am owed a lot of back pay and my final Step
We only have 5 people soon to be 4 in my area and full capacity is 18. We are very over worked and only get sticks and no carrots.
- Ron - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 8:32 pm:
JB is a joke. He should kept his philanthropy job.
- Tom Stephens - Tuesday, Apr 3, 18 @ 11:39 pm:
Sue, my guess is you’re a merit comp with an axe to grind against AFSCME. I don’t really care. Why don’t you take it somewhere else? Nobody here agrees with you or cares what you think. You can find other places where people agree with you.
- Anon - Wednesday, Apr 4, 18 @ 7:23 am:
Sue, my math skills are fine. You, on the other hand, seem to lack common sense. The rich people you adore don’t support the rest of us. They have their money squirreled away in tax shelters and investments.
- thoughts matter - Wednesday, Apr 4, 18 @ 8:57 am:
== You can’t be vested until 10 ==
Um … you are vested in the SERS pension system at 8 years.
I think she meant Tier 2 retirement system eligibility.
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Apr 4, 18 @ 10:41 am:
-So what are you talking about? Or are you just having a hard time following along?
And I stated that Mansions aren’t selling. That means the people with money are selling but other people with money aren’t moving in. It’s not me that isn’t following along.
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Apr 4, 18 @ 10:55 am:
-The rich people you adore don’t support the rest of us. They have their money squirreled away in tax shelters and investments.
Um… did you miss Sue’s point about Connecticut? I don’t disagree with a lot of the points made here, but surely most people here can see there is an argument to be made here about the tipping point of taxation?
- Anon - Wednesday, Apr 4, 18 @ 11:50 pm:
I don’t care about what did or didn’t happen in Connecticut. I support a progressive tax as found in the majority of other states, many of which still have rich people and which haven’t collapsed.