Today, the Rauner campaign is launching a new TV ad titled “No More Extra Money.”
The ad features Denise Smith, a lifelong Illinoisan who is worried about the potential for new taxes if JB Pritzker and Mike Madigan take total control of Springfield. Specifically, she focuses on the Vehicle Mileage Tax, a new tax that would force Illinois families to pay for every mile they drive. Pritzker expressed an interest in the idea during a Daily Herald editorial board.
Pritzker would not only raise income taxes on hardworking Illinois families, but also push new taxes like the Vehicle Mileage Tax, taxes Illinoisans can’t afford.
I have lived in Illinois all my life. Our taxes have been growing for decades. JB Pritzker wants to raise our income taxes, but worse yet he wants a car tax which will also come along with a tracking device. How much is that going to cost us, just to drive to a family member’s house? There’s no more extra money in my budget to start paying additional taxes. If JB Pritzker gets in office, I think we’re going to seriously consider leaving Illinois.
Pritzker has said he’d consider a pilot project, but voters don’t do nuance.
Here’s how much the Pritzker Crew is behind in understanding messaging.
Think on this.
It’s so “off”… that Rauner gets to argue that the progressive income tax proposal is a tax hike… and… Rauner talking points also discuss that the “earliest” this tax can even be considered… is 2020.
That’s how disappointing the Pritzker Crew messsging actually is… because they have no idea what their plan looks like, how it’s implimentation will/could happen, and the Pritzker Crew wants vague to be accepted to whomever, and whatever will appease “the moment”.
Why is all that important?
Here with the mileage tax… again… it’s about appeasement and lacking a plan (or nuance) and leaving a hole a truck can drive thru to hammer and shake the lacking.
It’s confusing, to me, to continually be hammered on all sides of taxing issues, be they property taxes, income taxes, in this case mileage taxes, because the williningness to spout half baked policy in appeasement of things because it’s too difficult to message and defend a stance?
The mileage taxing, this ad, is also nuance, but the vagueness is to the negative, “Pritzker is raising your taxes”… so, the nuance, or lack thereof, is playing into these cuts, be they one or one thousand.
At times, Rauner owning the messaging, is making Pritzker seem like the incumbent, when Pritzker could easily and thoughtfully clarify “things” beyond having to wonkingly go deep on nuance.
JB needs to first focus on things he uses to get around, like helicopters, private jets, limousines and sedan chairs.
This ad works because there’s two things JB is thinking about which I couldn’t tolerate - monitoring my movement like I’m on furlough, and paying everytime I move.
JB must stop it with these horrible ideas, or he’ll lose.
- Back to the Future - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 9:43 am:
JB should strike back with “Since Bruce hasn’t found any waste, fraud, & abuse after four years of searching, those making more than a million dollars a year are going to have to make up the difference.”
Insurance companies are way ahead of the government on this, and customers are signing up to be tracked voluntarily.
I know, I know, I don’t like it either. But one could argue that it’s a fairer way to pay for roads (and it is). It would also result in fewer miles driven overall, with whatever air pollution reduction that comes as an extra bonus.
Well, it would kind of half to be more or less a tracking device wouldn’t it.
Thinking how it would work, it would likely need to get to a GPS signal and record where you went and when, so you could bill for the correct month and not bill for out of state travel.
So the easiest way for the device to work is it would sense it is moving and it would breadcrumb every minute or second more likely every second to more accurately reflecting road distance traveled vs just point to point as the bird flies. That would be fed into some central repository so you could do the ‘tax math’.
You could build a device that would sit in the car and do the math, but it likely would have to retain some amount of trip data as well and calculate a running total. Putting that logic in the car device would make the car device more expensive IMHO since it would have to do more calculation work.
Now imagine how long it would take before someone said “Hey we can use this data to calculate when people have sped in school zones and start writing tickets for that, after all, it is to protect the kids”
It’s the same ad they’ve been running for months, and will have the same result.
- Back to the Future - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:13 am:
Is this the “issue” JB needs to run on?
JB needs to put less money into his campaign for consultants to spent and put more focus from local dem volunteers on what can get him elected.
Is the current system really that broken that we need this kind of change?
And yes I know that it seems that working more with local Dems comes up in every statewide campaign for at least the last 30 years or so. This JB campaign seems out of touch.
I wonder at J.B.’s naivete, and I am for him. This is Illinois, don’t mention taxes. In reality, this is about electric cars. I am for it, and I own one. But tracking? Just raise plate cost on electrics. K.I.S.S.
Naturally this type of tax would be a tough sell in suburban and especially rural areas, where there is little to no mass transportation and people have to drive significant distances to get to stores, work, etc. Plenty of places downstate where the store, the doctor’s office, etc. are in the next town over.
It doesn’t have to be a tracking device. I wonder if that was scripted. Does anyone call their I-PASS a tracking device? They could just check the odometer when you get your emissions test and require reporting when renewing your registration.
The most salient point is that rauner is succeeding in making Pritzker subject to charges, like an incumbent. An incumbent who isnt responding. The wilson ad is the umbrella—2 or 3 taxes are coming. Now other ads, like mileage tax, are fleshing that out. Pritzker needs more than a “hes lying” ad. He needs to tear apart the failures of rauner mgmt.
- Anon with an idea - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:24 am:
This concept made the rounds in 2016. The issue is real, as cars go electric, they stop paying the MFT at the pump. Raising it would punish those who cannot afford an EV, and maybe push them into getting one. But at some point, the majority will be electric, it’s inevitable. So where are road funds supposed to come from?
As many have stated, the plan was pay a big flat fee or attach an OBD2 device to your car that tracks mileage driven. Contrary to most thoughts - it doesn’t work via GPS, just gets miles from the odometer. The problem with OBD2 is that this data connection also is capable of sending speeding information, harsh braking, quick acceleration etc. Again, still not a huge to do if we lived in a society of respect and privacy. But I can see a legislator one day finding that they can sell anonymized versions of this data to insurers. Then one day after that as revenue is still short - selling non-anonymized versions of this data to insurers… see where this is heading?
Since the road revenue shortfall seems to stem from increased EV sales, how about this… put the tracker on the charger or charger port of the EV. Measure how much electricity is purchased to charge the car, convert it to the known kilowatts per mile figure (since the car is registered, the state could easily have that data) and calculate it against the charge purchased to effectively mimic the current MFT paid by gasoline users. No GPS tracking, a fair share paid by EV users, same MFT paid by petroleum users and once the market swings over to EV, no conversion - we’re there.
Since every state and country on the planet is facing this issue, I am fairly certain that manufacturers would get on board with this so it’s not an Illinois only thing. Because taxing everyone mileage is wrong. As another stated, MFT already is setup to do that. We just have to fix the ones who no longer pay it, not punish all.
Top Hat, a good chunk of the State isn’t subject to emissions testing.
- Anon with an idea - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:38 am:
This concept made the rounds in 2016. The issue is real, as cars go electric, they stop paying the MFT at the pump. Raising it would punish those who cannot afford an EV, and maybe push them into getting one. But at some point, the majority will be electric, it’s inevitable. So where are road funds supposed to come from?
As many have stated, the plan was pay a big flat fee or attach an OBD2 device to your car that tracks mileage driven. Contrary to most thoughts - it doesn’t work via GPS, just gets miles from the odometer. The problem with OBD2 is that this data connection also is capable of sending speeding information, harsh braking, quick acceleration etc. Again, still not a huge to do if we lived in a society of respect and privacy. But I can see a legislator one day finding that they can sell anonymized versions of this data to insurers. Then one day after that as revenue is still short - selling non-anonymized versions of this data to insurers… see where this is heading?
Since the road revenue shortfall seems to stem from increased EV sales, how about this… put the tracker on the charger or charger port of the EV. Measure how much electricity is purchased to charge the car, convert it to the known kilowatts per mile figure (since the car is registered, the state could easily have that data) and calculate it against the charge purchased to effectively mimic the current MFT paid by gasoline users. No GPS tracking, a fair share paid by EV users, same MFT paid by petroleum users and once the market swings over to EV, no conversion - we’re there.
Since every state and country on the planet is facing this issue, I am fairly certain that manufacturers would get on board with this so it’s not an Illinois only thing. Because taxing everyone mileage is wrong. As another stated, MFT already is setup to do that. We just have to fix the ones who no longer pay it, not punish all. (sorry if this posts twice it didn’t show on refresh)
Red meat for those counties and locales that will have the VMT on their ballots at the General. B. And, if this is what send her family over the edge to leave Illinois, fine with me. They might want to check out other states and make sure they don’t move to another one considering the same tax. https://tinyurl.com/yblyvnd7
You can’t just have VMT on Illinois residents. Raising the MFT or the idea the Anon with an idea has above, would be fairer to everyone, Illinois resident or not, who travels Illinois roads.
Otherwise, it’s heaping an increased tax on a subset of drivers who use Illinois roads.
Pritzker said he was going to study this. Cullerton rolled out the idea in 2016 and gained no traction. It’s a political hammer Rauner is trying to use, and Pritzker needs to remove the nails.
It doesn’t have to be a tracking device. I wonder if that was scripted. Does anyone call their I-PASS a tracking device? They could just check the odometer when you get your emissions test and require reporting when renewing your registration
Yes, there are people who refuse to get IPASS devices specifically for that reason, I know a few. The IPASS is optional (you get an obvious financial benefit in using one since you pay less in tolls).
Checking the odometer would require significant effort. Consider the level of security they use to prevent fraud by the folks you check your emissions, they get their eyes scanned before they can enter information. One would guess that the same level of security would be needed by ‘check stations’ across the state that would read your odometer. Having someone ‘trusted’ that checks the mileage of every car in the state every year is going to require real labor.
let’s say 2 million of them need to be checked then every year and it takes 5 minutes to check and record each car, that is 16,667 hours of effort or 4,166 person-weeks of effort at 40 hours a week or about 80 people working full time just to record the data.
If you live in MetroEast or other areas near state borders and drive to other states significantly I guess you are kind of screwed then.
===Rich do you think your phone company isn’t sharing that information already? Maybe not with the government yet…===
I was quite surprised during that Sycamore murder trial. The phone company came up with the record of a collect call from a pay phone in Rockford from 1957! That was long before widespread use of computers. If they kept that many records 60 years ago, just think of how much more they record now. Also, the auto manufacturers have things like OnStar that already know your mileage. I am sure for a small fee they would give that information to the state.
Im totally and vehemently against any VMT tax.
In addition to problems people already noted, why should the state receive tax dollars for miles you drive on roads the state does not maintain? Private roads, local roads, county roads, park roads etc.
I think the idea is way beyond outrageous. No other state does this either. This would be so unpoplar that anybody left would move away. No way, no how.
They do trucking because they use the interstates and are heavy vehicles -that makes sense because of roadway wear.
many proposed options do not consider mileage driven out of IL I drive a significant amount out of IL.
- Six Degrees of Separation - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 12:03 pm:
We have been granted a reprieve…if anyone told you in the year 2000 that gas would be as cheap in 2018 as it was then, they’d look at you with crossed eyeballs, but here we are. A raise in the MFT would be the best temporary solution to addressing rising road maintenance costs, but sooner or later the worm will turn with widespread adoption of electric or other alt energy vehicles. Maybe we have another 18 years to figure it out…maybe not.
It’s a good ad. It reinforces voters to expect more potential tax angst with a new twist that goes at everyone’s wallets– not just the “wealthy”. Grade A.
As Willy points out above, the fact that JB himself, and Pritzker’s advisers and those around him seem to consistently fail to anticipate or be prepared for the next issue thrown at them really does start to look like he doesn’t know what he is doing and/or hasn’t surrounded himself with the nest people. “Not ready for prime time” is starting to look like a thing and is not reassuring at this late stage of the gubernatorial race. He’s supposed to be better than Rauner. Remember?
A google search shows numerous studies debunking auto wear and tear on roads. None support it. The weather will destroy a road before auto traffic does Mileage based taxes are not supported by evidence. Increased plate cost is. Pay for road availability.
If it was instead of MFT and license plate fees, it might be more acceptable. As it is, for a car driven 10,000 miles a year, the license plate fee is slightly above 1 cent/mile paid up front. I have a second car that is only used occasionally, it got about 2000 on it last year. The license plate cost was 5 cents/mile. The less you drive, the more you pay. A flat rate per mile with a free or 1 dollar multi-year plate might be worth looking into.
1st, practically every road/street/interstate whether local, state or federal is supported by motor fuel taxes (except toll roads). Park roads are supported by park district taxes, and in this state, parks don’t charge admission, so those are coming from property taxes or the GR.
Next, VMT is truly the fairest way to collect user fees from the motoring public…the driver pays for the amount of the roads used. It eliminates miles per gallons disparity and those using the roads for free in electric cars (yes, license plates pay a bit, but their is no disparity between electric and combustion engines). The way this Governor, who hates infrastructure investment spins it is the VMT is another tax on top of the MFT, which is not as any MFT’S paid will be refunded on an indivual’s tax return. The state has to keep the pay-at-the-pump to allow for the collection of this “user fee” from visitors passing through the state or delivering goods via logistic companies.
It is once again a political spin that an indivual needs to really investigate to truthfully know what the proposal is,
=== [sic] their is no disparity between electric and combustion engines
There actually is a HUGE disparity. Electric vehicles only pay $17.50 for a plate that regular gasoline engines pay $101 to get. (it’s actually codified by law.. (625 ILCS 5/12-805) at that)
I get trying to entice more people to go electric, but can’t punish those who cannot do so (Sure I can buy a lower price car than a Tesla, but have no way to charge it).
i to have lived here all my life gps really this is nuts this will cause more people to leave illinois . illinois is becoming very opressed with all the rules and taxes
Hey beekeeper what State isn’t becoming that? Houses are a lot cheaper where I live compared to across the State border. Milk is also a lot cheaper. Property taxes vary. Sometimes they are equal, or Illinois is higher, sometimes significantly higher. Gasoline is 20 cents a gallon or so higher. It really all equals out. Income tax is lower in Illinois than across the State line.
So, in addition to moving our guns out of state, we are now going to have to register our vehicles out of state as well? Add to that that we have already sold most of our Illinois real estate investments and reinvested in another state because of the rent control threats from JB.
My family has been in Illinois since the 1830s and over 1/2 of them have moved already. If JB becomes Governor, I guess we will be following the flood.
I only read the first third of the comments but, here’s a couple comments about having a mileage tax. I travel many miles out of state each year and it would not be fair to pay this type of tax on miles not traveled on Illinois roads. For the Illinois government to be able to use information as to where I’ve been isinvasion of privacy. That alone would not pass any government vote. The ACLU would tear that one up costing tax payers much more just to fight the case. The cost alone to place place these devices on every registered vehicle in the state would be prohibitive as this cost alone would drive the tax up even higher just to implement this type of program. Just legalize pot and use the proceeds to pay for infrastructure. Just doing this would free up funds that go to house these hardened criminals who were put in for minor drug infractions. At the same time send property taxes to a centralized fund that would pay school districts $X per each and every student statewide. Its time to do the hard thing here without hurting the lesser advantaged.
Why not do what many other states are doing? Look at other state’s tollway system where you are issued a “ticket” when you get on the tollway system and pay based on miles when you get off the tollway or leave the state. That way major roadways can be included without taxing every rural road statewide? This way mileage accrued while off-road wouldn’t be taxed either.
Look, if you really want to raise money in Illinois. Make a 1 cent per roll tax on toilet paper. I don’t care who you are or how much money you make, you use it. At 4 cents per typical package of toilet paper, who is going to notice. this is how you spread the taxes without bias.
During a discussion on the gas tax, Pritzker said that Illinois could look at a mileage tax to REPLACE the gas tax. This commercial is yet another lie from Rauner.
- A guy - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 9:26 am:
This one resonates with people. It’s a very good ad.
- Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 9:35 am:
===…but voters don’t do nuance.===
Here’s how much the Pritzker Crew is behind in understanding messaging.
Think on this.
It’s so “off”… that Rauner gets to argue that the progressive income tax proposal is a tax hike… and… Rauner talking points also discuss that the “earliest” this tax can even be considered… is 2020.
That’s how disappointing the Pritzker Crew messsging actually is… because they have no idea what their plan looks like, how it’s implimentation will/could happen, and the Pritzker Crew wants vague to be accepted to whomever, and whatever will appease “the moment”.
Why is all that important?
Here with the mileage tax… again… it’s about appeasement and lacking a plan (or nuance) and leaving a hole a truck can drive thru to hammer and shake the lacking.
It’s confusing, to me, to continually be hammered on all sides of taxing issues, be they property taxes, income taxes, in this case mileage taxes, because the williningness to spout half baked policy in appeasement of things because it’s too difficult to message and defend a stance?
The mileage taxing, this ad, is also nuance, but the vagueness is to the negative, “Pritzker is raising your taxes”… so, the nuance, or lack thereof, is playing into these cuts, be they one or one thousand.
At times, Rauner owning the messaging, is making Pritzker seem like the incumbent, when Pritzker could easily and thoughtfully clarify “things” beyond having to wonkingly go deep on nuance.
It’s confusing how this continues.
- VanillaMan - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 9:36 am:
JB needs to first focus on things he uses to get around, like helicopters, private jets, limousines and sedan chairs.
This ad works because there’s two things JB is thinking about which I couldn’t tolerate - monitoring my movement like I’m on furlough, and paying everytime I move.
JB must stop it with these horrible ideas, or he’ll lose.
- Back to the Future - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 9:43 am:
“Tracking Devices”?
Really?
- Rich Miller - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 9:52 am:
=== Really? ===
Yes, really. How do you think the government is supposed to keep track of our mileage?
Yeah, I know. Not cool at all.
- Jocko - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 9:55 am:
JB should strike back with “Since Bruce hasn’t found any waste, fraud, & abuse after four years of searching, those making more than a million dollars a year are going to have to make up the difference.”
- 47th Ward - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 9:58 am:
===Not cool at all.===
Insurance companies are way ahead of the government on this, and customers are signing up to be tracked voluntarily.
I know, I know, I don’t like it either. But one could argue that it’s a fairer way to pay for roads (and it is). It would also result in fewer miles driven overall, with whatever air pollution reduction that comes as an extra bonus.
Just saying.
- OneMan - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:03 am:
Well, it would kind of half to be more or less a tracking device wouldn’t it.
Thinking how it would work, it would likely need to get to a GPS signal and record where you went and when, so you could bill for the correct month and not bill for out of state travel.
So the easiest way for the device to work is it would sense it is moving and it would breadcrumb every minute or second more likely every second to more accurately reflecting road distance traveled vs just point to point as the bird flies. That would be fed into some central repository so you could do the ‘tax math’.
You could build a device that would sit in the car and do the math, but it likely would have to retain some amount of trip data as well and calculate a running total. Putting that logic in the car device would make the car device more expensive IMHO since it would have to do more calculation work.
Now imagine how long it would take before someone said “Hey we can use this data to calculate when people have sped in school zones and start writing tickets for that, after all, it is to protect the kids”
- Huh? - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:04 am:
We already have a mileage tax called MFT. Have a low mpg vehicle you pay more. Have a high mpg car, you pay less. Would rather see increase in MFT.
- Arsenal - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:09 am:
It’s the same ad they’ve been running for months, and will have the same result.
- Back to the Future - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:13 am:
Is this the “issue” JB needs to run on?
JB needs to put less money into his campaign for consultants to spent and put more focus from local dem volunteers on what can get him elected.
Is the current system really that broken that we need this kind of change?
And yes I know that it seems that working more with local Dems comes up in every statewide campaign for at least the last 30 years or so. This JB campaign seems out of touch.
- wondering - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:13 am:
I wonder at J.B.’s naivete, and I am for him. This is Illinois, don’t mention taxes. In reality, this is about electric cars. I am for it, and I own one. But tracking? Just raise plate cost on electrics. K.I.S.S.
- Ron Burgundy - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:17 am:
Naturally this type of tax would be a tough sell in suburban and especially rural areas, where there is little to no mass transportation and people have to drive significant distances to get to stores, work, etc. Plenty of places downstate where the store, the doctor’s office, etc. are in the next town over.
- Hieronymus - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:22 am:
how do big rig truckers prove their mileage when filing their heavy vehicle use tax return?
Why wouldn’t tamper resistant odometers with random audits and stiff penalties for cheaters be sufficient? No need for GPS tattlers.
- TopHatMonocle - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:23 am:
It doesn’t have to be a tracking device. I wonder if that was scripted. Does anyone call their I-PASS a tracking device? They could just check the odometer when you get your emissions test and require reporting when renewing your registration.
- Langhorne - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:23 am:
The most salient point is that rauner is succeeding in making Pritzker subject to charges, like an incumbent. An incumbent who isnt responding. The wilson ad is the umbrella—2 or 3 taxes are coming. Now other ads, like mileage tax, are fleshing that out. Pritzker needs more than a “hes lying” ad. He needs to tear apart the failures of rauner mgmt.
- Anon with an idea - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:24 am:
This concept made the rounds in 2016. The issue is real, as cars go electric, they stop paying the MFT at the pump. Raising it would punish those who cannot afford an EV, and maybe push them into getting one. But at some point, the majority will be electric, it’s inevitable. So where are road funds supposed to come from?
As many have stated, the plan was pay a big flat fee or attach an OBD2 device to your car that tracks mileage driven. Contrary to most thoughts - it doesn’t work via GPS, just gets miles from the odometer. The problem with OBD2 is that this data connection also is capable of sending speeding information, harsh braking, quick acceleration etc. Again, still not a huge to do if we lived in a society of respect and privacy. But I can see a legislator one day finding that they can sell anonymized versions of this data to insurers. Then one day after that as revenue is still short - selling non-anonymized versions of this data to insurers… see where this is heading?
Since the road revenue shortfall seems to stem from increased EV sales, how about this… put the tracker on the charger or charger port of the EV. Measure how much electricity is purchased to charge the car, convert it to the known kilowatts per mile figure (since the car is registered, the state could easily have that data) and calculate it against the charge purchased to effectively mimic the current MFT paid by gasoline users. No GPS tracking, a fair share paid by EV users, same MFT paid by petroleum users and once the market swings over to EV, no conversion - we’re there.
Since every state and country on the planet is facing this issue, I am fairly certain that manufacturers would get on board with this so it’s not an Illinois only thing. Because taxing everyone mileage is wrong. As another stated, MFT already is setup to do that. We just have to fix the ones who no longer pay it, not punish all.
- Cheryl 44 - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:28 am:
How does anyone here think IL can pay for road repairs we need if the state isn’t taking in as much money via the gas tax?
- Cheryl44 - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:29 am:
OF Your phone is already tracking your every move.
- Back to the Future - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:30 am:
Forgot to rate the ad. Sorry about that.
Solid B. Would have been higher except I am just getting tired of the Michael Madigan punch line.
- Rich Miller - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:31 am:
===Your phone is already tracking===
But my state government isn’t… yet.
- Arthur Andersen - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:34 am:
Top Hat, a good chunk of the State isn’t subject to emissions testing.
- Anon with an idea - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:38 am:
This concept made the rounds in 2016. The issue is real, as cars go electric, they stop paying the MFT at the pump. Raising it would punish those who cannot afford an EV, and maybe push them into getting one. But at some point, the majority will be electric, it’s inevitable. So where are road funds supposed to come from?
As many have stated, the plan was pay a big flat fee or attach an OBD2 device to your car that tracks mileage driven. Contrary to most thoughts - it doesn’t work via GPS, just gets miles from the odometer. The problem with OBD2 is that this data connection also is capable of sending speeding information, harsh braking, quick acceleration etc. Again, still not a huge to do if we lived in a society of respect and privacy. But I can see a legislator one day finding that they can sell anonymized versions of this data to insurers. Then one day after that as revenue is still short - selling non-anonymized versions of this data to insurers… see where this is heading?
Since the road revenue shortfall seems to stem from increased EV sales, how about this… put the tracker on the charger or charger port of the EV. Measure how much electricity is purchased to charge the car, convert it to the known kilowatts per mile figure (since the car is registered, the state could easily have that data) and calculate it against the charge purchased to effectively mimic the current MFT paid by gasoline users. No GPS tracking, a fair share paid by EV users, same MFT paid by petroleum users and once the market swings over to EV, no conversion - we’re there.
Since every state and country on the planet is facing this issue, I am fairly certain that manufacturers would get on board with this so it’s not an Illinois only thing. Because taxing everyone mileage is wrong. As another stated, MFT already is setup to do that. We just have to fix the ones who no longer pay it, not punish all. (sorry if this posts twice it didn’t show on refresh)
- Cheryl44 - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:41 am:
Rich do you think your phone company isn’t sharing that information already? Maybe not with the government yet.
- Kyle Hillman - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:45 am:
“Worse yet, JB wants a car tax”
Umm, we can ditch the “worse yet” car tax if we can have a progresssive income tax. I mean if the car tax is the worse yet…
- Anon221 - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:50 am:
Red meat for those counties and locales that will have the VMT on their ballots at the General. B. And, if this is what send her family over the edge to leave Illinois, fine with me. They might want to check out other states and make sure they don’t move to another one considering the same tax. https://tinyurl.com/yblyvnd7
You can’t just have VMT on Illinois residents. Raising the MFT or the idea the Anon with an idea has above, would be fairer to everyone, Illinois resident or not, who travels Illinois roads.
Otherwise, it’s heaping an increased tax on a subset of drivers who use Illinois roads.
Pritzker said he was going to study this. Cullerton rolled out the idea in 2016 and gained no traction. It’s a political hammer Rauner is trying to use, and Pritzker needs to remove the nails.
- OneMan - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:56 am:
Yes, there are people who refuse to get IPASS devices specifically for that reason, I know a few. The IPASS is optional (you get an obvious financial benefit in using one since you pay less in tolls).
Checking the odometer would require significant effort. Consider the level of security they use to prevent fraud by the folks you check your emissions, they get their eyes scanned before they can enter information. One would guess that the same level of security would be needed by ‘check stations’ across the state that would read your odometer. Having someone ‘trusted’ that checks the mileage of every car in the state every year is going to require real labor.
There are 4.5 million cars registered in Illinois,
https://www.statista.com/statistics/196036/number-of-registered-automobiles-in-illinois/
let’s say 2 million of them need to be checked then every year and it takes 5 minutes to check and record each car, that is 16,667 hours of effort or 4,166 person-weeks of effort at 40 hours a week or about 80 people working full time just to record the data.
If you live in MetroEast or other areas near state borders and drive to other states significantly I guess you are kind of screwed then.
- DuPage - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 11:23 am:
@- Cheryl44 - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 10:41 am:
===Rich do you think your phone company isn’t sharing that information already? Maybe not with the government yet…===
I was quite surprised during that Sycamore murder trial. The phone company came up with the record of a collect call from a pay phone in Rockford from 1957! That was long before widespread use of computers. If they kept that many records 60 years ago, just think of how much more they record now. Also, the auto manufacturers have things like OnStar that already know your mileage. I am sure for a small fee they would give that information to the state.
- Team WarwickIm totslky - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 11:56 am:
Im totally and vehemently against any VMT tax.
In addition to problems people already noted, why should the state receive tax dollars for miles you drive on roads the state does not maintain? Private roads, local roads, county roads, park roads etc.
I think the idea is way beyond outrageous. No other state does this either. This would be so unpoplar that anybody left would move away. No way, no how.
They do trucking because they use the interstates and are heavy vehicles -that makes sense because of roadway wear.
- Anonymous - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 11:58 am:
many proposed options do not consider mileage driven out of IL I drive a significant amount out of IL.
- Six Degrees of Separation - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 12:03 pm:
We have been granted a reprieve…if anyone told you in the year 2000 that gas would be as cheap in 2018 as it was then, they’d look at you with crossed eyeballs, but here we are. A raise in the MFT would be the best temporary solution to addressing rising road maintenance costs, but sooner or later the worm will turn with widespread adoption of electric or other alt energy vehicles. Maybe we have another 18 years to figure it out…maybe not.
- Responsa - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 12:28 pm:
It’s a good ad. It reinforces voters to expect more potential tax angst with a new twist that goes at everyone’s wallets– not just the “wealthy”. Grade A.
As Willy points out above, the fact that JB himself, and Pritzker’s advisers and those around him seem to consistently fail to anticipate or be prepared for the next issue thrown at them really does start to look like he doesn’t know what he is doing and/or hasn’t surrounded himself with the nest people. “Not ready for prime time” is starting to look like a thing and is not reassuring at this late stage of the gubernatorial race. He’s supposed to be better than Rauner. Remember?
- JSI - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 12:32 pm:
Why is this not the only message the Rauner camp is playing? The only thing we should know about JB is that he’s going to make us pay a mileage tax.
Have to drive to get groceries? JB Pritzker is going to make you pay a mileage tax.
Have to drive to the doctor? JB Pritzker is going make you pay a mileage tax.
Have to drive the kids to school? JB Pritzker is going to make you pay a mileage tax.
- VanillaMan - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 1:06 pm:
I am not a furloughed felon, JB.
Don’t track me bro.
Don’t STASI my ride.
Warning you, if motorist oppose red light cameras, they’ll oppose you “Pritzkering” their wheels.
And that’s what Bruce should call it too: “Pritzkering”.
- wondering - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 1:29 pm:
A google search shows numerous studies debunking auto wear and tear on roads. None support it. The weather will destroy a road before auto traffic does Mileage based taxes are not supported by evidence. Increased plate cost is. Pay for road availability.
- SSL - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 2:01 pm:
How else can JB pay for everything he wants to do if he doesn’t increase existing taxes and come up with a few new ones.
Of course this one is a bad idea for all kinds of reasons. It is a regressive tax, out of state drivers won’t pay, etc.
And don’t think for a minute they would just test it. If it goes live, it is another permanent tax on the residents of Illinois.
Yet another reason to leave the state. Rauner isn’t very bright, but he’s smart enough to beat up JB for his love of taxing anybody but himself.
- DuPage - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 2:06 pm:
If it was instead of MFT and license plate fees, it might be more acceptable. As it is, for a car driven 10,000 miles a year, the license plate fee is slightly above 1 cent/mile paid up front. I have a second car that is only used occasionally, it got about 2000 on it last year. The license plate cost was 5 cents/mile. The less you drive, the more you pay. A flat rate per mile with a free or 1 dollar multi-year plate might be worth looking into.
- Taxedoutwest - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 2:37 pm:
1st, practically every road/street/interstate whether local, state or federal is supported by motor fuel taxes (except toll roads). Park roads are supported by park district taxes, and in this state, parks don’t charge admission, so those are coming from property taxes or the GR.
Next, VMT is truly the fairest way to collect user fees from the motoring public…the driver pays for the amount of the roads used. It eliminates miles per gallons disparity and those using the roads for free in electric cars (yes, license plates pay a bit, but their is no disparity between electric and combustion engines). The way this Governor, who hates infrastructure investment spins it is the VMT is another tax on top of the MFT, which is not as any MFT’S paid will be refunded on an indivual’s tax return. The state has to keep the pay-at-the-pump to allow for the collection of this “user fee” from visitors passing through the state or delivering goods via logistic companies.
It is once again a political spin that an indivual needs to really investigate to truthfully know what the proposal is,
- Anon - Tuesday, Sep 4, 18 @ 5:02 pm:
to @Taxedoutwest…
=== [sic] their is no disparity between electric and combustion engines
There actually is a HUGE disparity. Electric vehicles only pay $17.50 for a plate that regular gasoline engines pay $101 to get. (it’s actually codified by law.. (625 ILCS 5/12-805) at that)
I get trying to entice more people to go electric, but can’t punish those who cannot do so (Sure I can buy a lower price car than a Tesla, but have no way to charge it).
- beekeeper - Wednesday, Sep 5, 18 @ 4:57 pm:
i to have lived here all my life gps really this is nuts this will cause more people to leave illinois . illinois is becoming very opressed with all the rules and taxes
- freedomwriter - Wednesday, Sep 5, 18 @ 5:23 pm:
Hey beekeeper what State isn’t becoming that? Houses are a lot cheaper where I live compared to across the State border. Milk is also a lot cheaper. Property taxes vary. Sometimes they are equal, or Illinois is higher, sometimes significantly higher. Gasoline is 20 cents a gallon or so higher. It really all equals out. Income tax is lower in Illinois than across the State line.
- ChanceMcCall - Wednesday, Sep 5, 18 @ 5:36 pm:
So, in addition to moving our guns out of state, we are now going to have to register our vehicles out of state as well? Add to that that we have already sold most of our Illinois real estate investments and reinvested in another state because of the rent control threats from JB.
My family has been in Illinois since the 1830s and over 1/2 of them have moved already. If JB becomes Governor, I guess we will be following the flood.
- Good grief! - Wednesday, Sep 5, 18 @ 6:39 pm:
I only read the first third of the comments but, here’s a couple comments about having a mileage tax. I travel many miles out of state each year and it would not be fair to pay this type of tax on miles not traveled on Illinois roads. For the Illinois government to be able to use information as to where I’ve been isinvasion of privacy. That alone would not pass any government vote. The ACLU would tear that one up costing tax payers much more just to fight the case. The cost alone to place place these devices on every registered vehicle in the state would be prohibitive as this cost alone would drive the tax up even higher just to implement this type of program. Just legalize pot and use the proceeds to pay for infrastructure. Just doing this would free up funds that go to house these hardened criminals who were put in for minor drug infractions. At the same time send property taxes to a centralized fund that would pay school districts $X per each and every student statewide. Its time to do the hard thing here without hurting the lesser advantaged.
- Cooper15 - Wednesday, Sep 5, 18 @ 7:11 pm:
Did Denise Smith really mispronounce JB’s name? Pritzner?
- freedomwriter - Wednesday, Sep 5, 18 @ 8:32 pm:
Actually Good grief Illinois has several “gun sanctuary counties”
- Steve Engelbrecht - Thursday, Sep 6, 18 @ 6:27 pm:
I WANT TO SUPPORT JB BUT MILEAGE TAX WILL BE A DEAL BREAKER FOR ME.
- Twinsdad - Thursday, Sep 6, 18 @ 7:10 pm:
Why not do what many other states are doing? Look at other state’s tollway system where you are issued a “ticket” when you get on the tollway system and pay based on miles when you get off the tollway or leave the state. That way major roadways can be included without taxing every rural road statewide? This way mileage accrued while off-road wouldn’t be taxed either.
- hearyago - Friday, Sep 7, 18 @ 12:24 pm:
Look, if you really want to raise money in Illinois. Make a 1 cent per roll tax on toilet paper. I don’t care who you are or how much money you make, you use it. At 4 cents per typical package of toilet paper, who is going to notice. this is how you spread the taxes without bias.
- popgrandma - Wednesday, Sep 12, 18 @ 9:23 am:
Another ridiculous political ad. Goodbye silly woman. You won’t be missed.
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Sep 12, 18 @ 6:34 pm:
I dont believe denise smith is even from Illinois, how much did she get paid for this BS ad?
- Nancy - Thursday, Sep 13, 18 @ 6:25 pm:
During a discussion on the gas tax, Pritzker said that Illinois could look at a mileage tax to REPLACE the gas tax. This commercial is yet another lie from Rauner.