40 Comments - HorseShoe - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:08 am: Rauner’s Legacy, he must be so proud. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:13 am: This is purposely inaccurate. ===The strain, as the data shows, has mostly fallen on Illinois’ public universities. Schools such as Northern, Southern and Western Illinois universities were among the hardest hit when the state legislature failed to pass a budget for nearly three years.=== Rauner refuses to sign budgets. Franks, Drury, and Dunkin… and the 99th GA Raunerites flat out refused to fully fund higher education. It was not the General Assembly. Raunerism. The phony “both sides”. It was those like Mr. Barickman and Mr. Rose, the phonies who care about higher ed that forced universities to be crippled… for Bruce Rauner. I have the receipts. “I’m frustrated too but taking steps to reform Illinois is more important than a short term budget stalemate.” - Skeptic - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:17 am: “those price hikes have amounted to double-digit percentage increases” Although, the UofI had double-digit percentage increases even during the fat days of the 90’s. https://www.chronicle.com/interactives/tuition-and-fees - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:19 am: ===Raunerism.=== It was a problem before Rauner. Rauner just made it worse, a lot worse and very quickly. But let’s not pretend like the universities were well funded 5 years ago and tuition wasn’t exorbitant compared to instate rates for universities in neighboring states. For decades the people of Illinois have been attempting to avoid paying for the government they expect, and this is part of it. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:21 am: ===It was a problem before Rauner. Rauner just made it worse, a lot worse and very quickly.=== Again. Since the 1850s, no governor refused to fully fund higher education, starving universities, in hopes of closures. Enough of this “well, it was already…” No. Stop. This was about closing schools, not about paying the appropriate amount. Ugh. - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:41 am: Oh c’mon OW. Serious question - how long has it been since the State of Illinois has fully funded state government programs and services? 50 years sound about right? As for Rauner’s efforts, there are those that will say it got seriously worse during his tenure. There are others that will argue that he (and others) didn’t go far enough to try and fix the imbalance between what people expect state and local government to do and what they are willing to pay for it. And the answer to that question is still pending. Let’s see how JB does. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:48 am: No “c’mon”… no excuses… no baloney. Chancellor Jones? ===“Given the financial challenges facing higher education over the past 25 months, our focus has been on protecting our students’ Illinois experience and ensuring their success,” Urbana-Champaign Chancellor Robert Jones said in a statement. “We are proud that despite the state budget crisis, our graduation rate, freshman retention rate, admitted student quality and reputation among peers and high school counselors all held steady or improved. Our class sizes crept up, but only slightly.”=== Enough is enough with this utter nonsense that… “Yeah, but before…” No. Stop. Rauner vetoes ALL funding to higher education. Rauner then “allowed” some allocation of funds, but never at the full funding requests or necessities. Sorry. No. No. No governor… none. Only Rauner did that. ===There are others that will argue that he (and others) didn’t go far enough to try and fix the imbalance between what people expect state and local government to do and what they are willing to pay for it.=== “Because taxpayers”? We’re all taxpayers. 114/63 … Dems in the General Assembly. All 6 statewide offices. Dems. The people spoke for themselves, maybe it’s the “taxpayers” who aren’t paying attention. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:50 am: ===…how long has it been since the State of Illinois has fully funded state government programs and services? 50 years sound about right?=== Cite, please. Thanks. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 9:57 am: In 1999, Jim Edgar has a signed budget that included a billion dollars in surplus. That was 19 years ago. That was also a time before Edgar Ramp drama. - A Jack - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 10:02 am: This trickles over to state government as well. If you make a degree such as Master of Social Work, prohibitively expensive, then you aren’t going to have qualified people to fill Child Protection Specialist positions. So then you get 80+ vacancies at DCFS and the inability to protect our most vulnerable citizens. - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 10:07 am: ===Rauner vetoes ALL funding to higher education=== First anon here. I think we’re talking about different things. What Rauner did was terrible, but there was a structural problem that was driving up tuition before Rauner was ever elected. The universities were in trouble before Rauner was elected. Rauner made the problem a more urgent one and more difficult to solve, but at the time the root of any mechanism used to solve the problem of increasing tuition and declining enrollments is increased funding from the State which will require new revenues. I’m not a Rauner fan and I am certainly not defending what Rauner did, and while I agree with you that “governors own” at the end of the day the People of Illinois bare the responsibility for addressing the problems that Illinois has. And so many of our problems come from our decade long refusal to pay for the goods and services we demand. That whole “hollowing out of state government” post Rich did this morning — every single one of those things is a consequence of the People of Illinois failing to adequately fund their government. The real world consequences of that are embarrassing and cruel, but we live in a land where refusing to tax any federally taxed retirement income is more important than testing rape kits. So, maybe, the People of Illinois should have a tough conversation about what our priorities are, because right now it’s refusing to tax guaranteed payments from partners reported on Schedule K-1s and not testing rape kits or making college more affordable. - Handle Bar Mustache - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 10:35 am: Thank you OW. Entertaining as heck to listen to Rauner Republicans squirm and stammer about higher education in Illinois pre/post Rauner: “but, but, but…c’mon…higher ed was hurting BEFORE Bruce took over…he just made it a bit worse…c’mon…he’s not so bad. Madigan!” I’m looking at you, Tim Butler, Norine Hammond, Dale Righter, Chapin Rose… - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 10:45 am: ===In 1999, Jim Edgar has a signed budget that included a billion dollars in surplus.=== How much of that budget included funding for pension benefits? But this also represents moving the goal posts — a budget can be balanced but that doesn’t mean that it’s not assisting with creating the circumstances which create a future “structural gap” between spending and revenues. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 11:06 am: ===Rauner made the problem a more urgent one and more difficult to solve, but at the time the root of any mechanism used to solve the problem of increasing tuition and declining enrollments is increased funding from the State which will require new revenues.=== Again… Claiming “before”, while Rauner made “before” worse, and made structural changes by refusing to fund higher ed… If you fund something at a level of zero… … you want it eliminated. That’s how budgets works. Fund something at zero, it won’t exist. Stop this… “before”… “it’s always” No. Not the same. Zero is zero. ===at the end of the day the People of Illinois bare the responsibility for addressing the problems that Illinois has.=== Rauner decided higher ed deserved no funding. Twice. Addressing the problem is eliminating higher ed? One or two universities? (Sigh) ===How much of that budget included funding for pension benefits?=== Just because you don’t like Charlie Wheeler refuting your “50 years” doesn’t make it wrong. Edgar left a surplus. That’s a fact. Again, not liking something that’s a fact doesn’t make it less factual. - Handle Bar Mustache - ===Tim Butler, Norine Hammond, Dale Righter, Chapin Rose…=== Phonies. Raunerites. They aided and abetted the higher ed destruction. Until they acknowledge their complicity… - Tom Threat - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 11:09 am: “In 1999, Jim Edgar has a signed budget that included a billion dollars in surplus.” If you don’t count things like pension debts. It’s not like the pension system was fully funded AND we had $1 billion in the bank. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 11:13 am: ===If you don’t count things like pension debts. It’s not like the pension system was fully funded AND we had $1 billion in the bank.=== (ENTER the Edgar Ramp) Which governors decided to skip payments? Hmm. - Perrid - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 11:18 am: OW, you are ignoring the problem by focusing 100% of your attention on Rauner. Yes, the budget was terrible for higher education. There can be no arguing that point. It wasn’t doing too good before the impasse though. Rauner is gone, he’s not a problem anymore and there isn’t going to be a budget impasse anytime soon, but the systemic and historic funding problems still exist. Rauner’s moving on, you should too. - Whatever - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 11:21 am: ==because right now it’s refusing to tax guaranteed payments from partners reported on Schedule K-1s == Off the subject, but who says Illinois does not tax guaranteed payments to (not from) partners? - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 11:23 am: ===It wasn’t doing too good before the impasse though.=== Again, deciding to fund higher education at a level of zero, then “accepting” 30% or so of what is needed, deciding to say “before” ignores the most critical aspect… … … schools weren’t on the brink of closing or not mowing their lawns before Rauner. “The patient has had that bone spur for years, let’s correct that before we address the severed limbs” Enough. Stop. Full stop. ===Rauner’s moving on, you should too.=== Funny thing is… the recovery now is based on the funding Rauner denied, not the “structural issues” you want to discuss. The damage will be a decade or more project. Can’t move on from that kind of rebuild. - Smitty Irving - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 11:47 am: Oswego Willy - How sad is this? Starting with Walker, who is the only Gov. to make required (by practice or law) pension payments & NOT try to reduce the amount due? George Ryan. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 11:49 am: - Smitty Irving - Quinn? Yeah, the Edgar Ramp in of itself is the rearranging of financial priorities to meet goaling in budgets. Sad indeed. - Bigtwich - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 12:02 pm: -In 1999, Jim Edgar has a signed budget that included a billion dollars in surplus.- I have trouble believing a Governor signed a budget between January 1 and January 11. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 12:05 pm: ===I have trouble believing a Governor signed a budget between January 1 and January 11.=== “Quoting” Edgar from the Schnorf Memorial. When they left in 1999. You can take this up with Edgar. - Smitty Irving - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 12:05 pm: Oswego Willy - Quinn (along with others) gave us Tier II. Remember Quinn in 2012 saying he was going to reduce benefits for current employees, giving rise to the SERS Class of May 2012 when twice as many people retired as projected? Causing such a problem Madigan actually issued a statement saying the House would not pass any such legislation? - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 12:07 pm: - Smitty Irving - While only responding to Quinn and payments made, the larger scope of pensions, tiers, payments, budgets… there are no easy solutions, but the ILSC says one fact exists, they can’t be diminished, and they need to be paid as a solution. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 12:14 pm: My apologies… ===We left a billion and a half dollar surplus when we left in ‘99. As budget director, Steve had a lot to do with that.=== Edgar stated he and Schnorf didn’t leave a billion. It was a billion and a half. - Bigtwich - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 12:47 pm: ===I have trouble believing a Governor signed a budget between January 1 and January 11.=== He may have left a billion or so somehow but his term ended January 11, 1999. I doubt he signed a budget in 1999. - Oswego Willy - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 12:55 pm: - Bigtwich - LOL… again, take it up with Edgar. - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 12:59 pm: ===No. Not the same. Zero is zero.=== Not enough is not the same as zero, but zero is also not enough. - City Zen - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 1:40 pm: What would Lovie Smith do? - Pick a Name - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 2:13 pm: Remember when universities guaranteed the same tuition rate for all 4 years. Well, to do that, they started increasing tuition 8-10% a year for incoming freshman, pretty much every year. There is your culprit. Anybody remember who enacted this smart move? - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 2:14 pm: ===Off the subject, but who says Illinois does not tax guaranteed payments to (not from) partners? === The state considers guaranteed payments to partners to be “federally taxed retirement.” The Retirement Income Tax Subtraction allows for a taxpayer to subtract all “federally taxed retirement” from the Federal AGI while calculating Illinois Base Income. Whether or not this is legally accurate or intended, that’s currently how the Illinois Department of Revenue is treating the subtraction. - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 2:27 pm: To Elaborate, you can find the details on Publication 120. They specifically state guaranteed payments to retired partners reported on Line 17 of the US 1040. I don’t know how the state would know the difference between a guaranteed payment to a retired partner and just a regular old guaranteed payment to a partner and what would make that partnered count as “retired.” http://www.revenue.state.il.us/publications/pubs/pub-120.pdf - Filmmaker prof - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 2:33 pm: UIUC has held tuition the same for the past three years. - Whatever - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 3:00 pm: ==I don’t know how the state would know the difference between a guaranteed payment to a retired partner and just a regular old guaranteed payment to a partner and what would make that partnered count as “retired.”== 86 ILCS 5/203(a)(2)(F) allows the deduction for retirement pay, including “retirement payments to retired partners, which payments are excluded in computing net earnings from self employment by Section 1402 of the Internal Revenue Code.” To be exempt from self-employment tax on partnership income, the payment must be a guaranteed payment (ie, not a percentage of partnership income) and the retired partner cannot have any interest in the partnership other than the right to the retirement pay. So if the K-1 shows the partner has a capital account or shows the partner’s income is subject to self-employment tax, the payment isn’t deductible. - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 3:12 pm: ===So if the K-1 shows the partner has a capital account or shows the partner’s income is subject to self-employment tax, the payment isn’t deductible. === But does the Revenue Tax Specialist reviewing the return know that? Does the PSA that writes the procedures for the Revenue Tax Specialists know that? Is it in the standard operating procedures? I strongly suspect the answer to all three of those questions is no. - Whatever - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 5:55 pm: Well, the Dept. of Revenue manages to catch them on occasion. General Information Letter IT 11-0008-GIL, 03/23/2011. - Anon - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 7:15 pm: ===manages to catch them on occasion=== That’s the exception, not the rule. Plus you may want to consider the amount of turn over that the Department has experienced — especially in the Accounts Processing and the date of that ruling. - Whatever - Monday, Nov 26, 18 @ 8:55 pm: ====because right now it’s refusing to tax guaranteed payments from partners reported on Schedule K-1s == You’ve run a long way from your first statement, haven’t you? - Doing Human Things - Tuesday, Nov 27, 18 @ 8:55 am: > Filmmaker prof, “UIUC has held tuition the same for the past three years.” As has WIU. Actually, for WIU, the current tuition rate for new undergrad students from anywhere in the US is $284.70 per credit hour. That’s the exact same as it was in 2016, cheaper than it was in 2015 and 2014, and only ~$4/hr more expensive than students who started in 2013. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.