Now more than ever, get out of your bubbles
Wednesday, Mar 18, 2020 - Posted by Rich Miller
* The American people have a real problem…
* And then there’s this sort of insanity…
* From Monday…
It shouldn’t be surprising that Britain, which bravely survived being bombed every day by the Germans for months in WWII has come up with the adult and rational strategy to not only survive Coronavirus, but to defeat it and make it go away without causing massive damage to their economy. As the Germans bombed London every day causing massive damage, the Brits adopted the brave strategy of “Keep calm and carry on” and in the end they did just that and helped defeat Germany. And that is exactly what they are doing with the Coronavirus. While the rest of the world is collapsing under fear and hysteria and destroying their economies in defense of the Coronavirus by isolating everybody, Britain is using science, logic, bravery, and common sense to protect their people by just isolating vulnerable people, not strong and healthy people.
While most of the world is shutting down everything from restaurants, bars, travel, museums, sports, and even churches to isolate everybody which will cost trillions of dollars and cause massive economic harm for everybody, Britain is focusing on just isolating the most vulnerable people which are people over 60 with other health issues while letting the majority of people continue to live their lives with very little risk.
* Tuesday…
British Prime Minister Boris Johnson unveiled much more stringent measures to tackle the coronavirus outbreak after new research indicated a quarter of a million people would have died under previous plans to control the spread of pandemic.
* As a result, things are starting to change on the right…
And now the left needs to start waking the heck up. If Fox News can change, so can everyone else. We need to take this more seriously, folks. A lot more seriously. And we need to try to pull together.
- Cubs in '16 - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:21 am:
Sage advice Rich. Well said. Too many folks live in paranoia that nearly everything is fake news propagated by the opposing party to hurt them in some way. Think big picture. It’s not always about you.
- NotRich - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:29 am:
I am waiting for the Rauner “because Madigan” tweet
- 32nd warder - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:30 am:
thanks for this, Rich. While we are staring down some difficult times, we must work hard to be smart, be kind, and to work together. I’m hopeful that we will learn from this experience and come out better on the other side. Its our challenge to accept.
- Red Raider - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:31 am:
Groundhog Day: Remember, this didn’t start with Putin. There have been naysayers about the established science of climate change, for example, years before Putin’s disinformation machine was fully armed and operational.
- Powdered Whig - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:34 am:
This needed to be said Rich. Thanks for posting. I have become very concerned with the state of our country right now. It is so polarized that facts don’t matter. Science doesn’t matter. People don’t matter. All that matters is the agenda - the worst case of the tail wagging the dog that I have ever seen.
- the North - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:34 am:
Platforms like Twitter and Facebook must do better to remove patently false and dangerous “facts” from entering the discourse. This isn’t simply a matter of freedom of speech. But with the current FCC and the fact that many congressional electeds are much older and either ignorant of or unwilling to understand the changing media and communications landscape, I don’t think we’ll have stronger laws regarding what may be considered news or facts anytime soon.
- Comma Chameleon - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:36 am:
Re: “most everyone I know in IL is for Bernie.”
An elderly acquaintance of mine still chuckles over the responses some of his own friends had to the 1948 election. He told me they complained, “How could Dewey have lost? Everyone I know voted for him!”
- Scamp640 - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:36 am:
Fox News continues to gaslight us, though. Last night, Laura Ingraham used a whole segment of her show to try to tell us that in 2018 Trump did not make cuts to the federal office that tracks pandemics. Fox News will endanger lives rather than criticize Trump.
- Candy Dogood - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:37 am:
I’m a staunch supporter of the 1st Amendment, but surely there’s gotta be some legal action that can be taken against Fox News?
- Friendly Bob Adams - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:40 am:
Sanders seems like a decent guy with a few good ideas, but his supporters are genuinely unlikable. And also pretty poorly informed about a range of topics, including how elections work.
- Soccermom - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:42 am:
Duuuuude. We will be staying in our bubble for the next few weeks.
- Rich Hill - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:43 am:
As people have time to read and/or watch films, checking out the book or film version of Merchants of Doubt is a good way to spend time.
- Montrose - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:44 am:
There are still way too many people, particularly in government, that are planning based on a “if broader infection occurs” instead of “when broader infection occurs”. At what point you put infrastructure in place looks very different depending on which approach you take.
- Scamp640 - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:45 am:
Permit me to double down on the importance of an impartial and free press. Nobel Prize winning economist Amartya Sen makes the point that there has never been a famine in a country with a free press because elected officials are held accountable.
The situation in China got out of hand because medical professionals were censored when they tried to speak out. There was no Chinese media willing or able to report on the pandemic in the early stages of its onset. Consequently, the Chinese dictatorship put the whole world at risk.
Fox News is no better if it serves as the mouthpiece of a President trying to get reelected rather than to report accurate news as it happens to serve the public interest. Fox News has been shameful. Paradoxically, it likely put its primary audience at greater risk than America at large.
- Nick Name - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:47 am:
Fox news giving its viewers whiplash.
- Southern - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:48 am:
I’m a staunch supporter of the 1st Amendment, but surely there’s gotta be some legal action that can be taken against Fox News
The same could be said for CNN and MSNBC. All 3 networks have issues with facts.
- Scamp640 - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:50 am:
@ Southern. Neither CNN nor MSNBC have been reinforcing the Trump message that the coronavirus is a hoax. Fox News did that for weeks. So, no, I don’t agree with you that the “same can be said” of CNN or MSNBC.
- stwBQrSYucIj - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:51 am:
fvceMYWNCLjGn
- Master Shake - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:51 am:
The bubbles people live in are surely exacerbated by this Dem primary having such a stark age split. Under 45, 2:1 for Bernie, over 45, 2:1 for Biden (nationally so far, haven’t checked IL). Hard to hear, let alone understand, people of a significantly different age group.
- Amalia - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:52 am:
@Friendly Bob Adams, oh how I love your comment….
- Just Saying - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:56 am:
How can you people honestly say that Trump is saying Coronavirus is a hoax? Who ever says that is truly on the far left.
- Southern - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:56 am:
@ Southern. Neither CNN nor MSNBC have been reinforcing the Trump message that the coronavirus is a hoax. Fox News did that for weeks. So, no, I don’t agree with you that the “same can be said” of CNN or MSNBC.
Enjoy your bubble.
- Smitty Irving - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:57 am:
Southern -
Don’t you see the difference in degree of partisanship between Fox News and MSNBC? MSNBC is nothing more than a business decision; it was supposed to be something like Fox News-lite (a political version of CNBC, the “creator” of Tea Party), until they saw the blowback from firing Phil Donahue for opposing the 2003 Iraq War.
- Clowns to the Left of me - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:58 am:
Jokers to the right…
Had a wonderful conversation with a colleague yesterday and a person I really think highly of…until she just didn’t get why Bernie could possibly lose.
Explained that in 2016, he was an unknown to most people and the antithesis of a Hilary Clinton that was not well-liked. She was offended, and insisted that JB and the DNC had rigged the election against him.
Also look at the reactions of some of the Berners yesterday…wanting to postpone the election.
“JB is literally killing people!”
“We should sue Tom Perez and the DNC.”
Before that, Biden was going to kill these people. And before that, Trump was.
Bubbles, yes!!! But the people have spoken, and it ain’t no conspiracy, and if anything, young people actually going to vote yesterday gave Bernie a little boost while many of the “older” Biden voters stayed home.
Quite the conspiracy is right, Rich.
- Proud Papa Bear - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 11:59 am:
Biden supporters are everywhere. They’re just typically the kind of people who aren’t vocal about it.
Sanders supporters are more scarce but they’re typically the kind of people who broadcast it.
In 2016, many cut their nose to spite their face by refusing to support Clinton in the general. Let’s see how many say, “thank you sir, may I please have another?”
- Scamp640 - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:00 pm:
Nobel Prize winning economist Amartya Sen makes the point that there has never been a famine in a country with a free press. A free press holds politicians accountable. The pandemic in China got out of hand because the concerns expressed by medical professionals were not broadcast by a free press. Chinese leaders were not held accountable. Fox News represents a similar problem because it is not holding Trump accountable. By not offering timely, accurate news about the pandemic, Fox News literally puts the country at risk.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:00 pm:
The biggest wake up call you can get is when you realize you’re in a bubble of your own device, and that bubble isn’t something that “everyone” is in.
Campaigns are notorious for that.
What’s happened with MSNBC, Fox, etc… being in a constant “campaign mode” of thinking, and folks taking that campaign thinking as “reporting” and “fact”, the truth of things gets warped and shaped instead of being… truth.
The eroding of fact, of the “alternative fact” campaign spin, has allowed bubbles to only believe “their” own “accepted” facts.
It’s why your “in-law uncle” thinks he’s always right, the far left believes their bubble is gospel as much as the “in-law uncle”… and those bubbles can’t be wrong.
The first issue is recognizing the bubbles are around, and instead of pointing to others in bubbles, recognize if we are all in bubbles too.
- SWIL_Voter - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:01 pm:
To be clear, this website is and always has been a bubble for older white illinois people who mostly get news from TV and print
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:04 pm:
=== this website is and always has been a bubble for…===
… those closest and most active in governing, and those willing to listen and understand how things work well outside the simple media explanations or partisan thumping of policy and politics.
Fixed it.
- 17% Solution - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:06 pm:
== How can you people honestly say that Trump is saying Coronavirus is a hoax?==
At a rally at North Charleston South Carolina he said of the Coronavirus “And this is their [Democrats] new hoax”
https://www.businessinsider.com/five-times-the-trump-administration-downplayed-the-coronavirus-2020-3
- SWIL_Voter - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:09 pm:
Exactly OW,
Those in the bubble always think they’re right, and you can just look at the state of Illinois to see whether they have been
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:14 pm:
=== Those in the bubble always think they’re right, and you can just look at the state of Illinois to see whether they have been===
(Sigh)
… and yet post after post discusses changes from one administration to the other, the policies and where they are failing or succeeding, and citing other sources, reporters, media, actual reports issued and dissected to the politics and policy…
It’s more like a “trade” website with those closest to the action get the information and feedback outside of those *in* the trade itself.
- SWIL_Voter - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:19 pm:
Laughable, I used to read this site a lot more but was told specifically that this isn’t a place for beginners and not to ask so many questions, lol, most of my posts get moderated if they’re even slightly outside orthodoxy
- Ambrose Chase - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:22 pm:
Sorry. Fox doesn’t get a pass for years of harmful propaganda, then changing their tune for a few days.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:23 pm:
=== that this isn’t a place for beginners and not to ask so many questions, lol, most of my posts get moderated if they’re even slightly outside orthodoxy===
Dunno if that makes this place a bubble…
I hear ya on the bubble aspect of industries and trades, and governing is both, an industry and a trade.
I’ll leave it there.
Hope you and yours are well, stay safe and vigilant
OW
- @misterjayem - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:24 pm:
“I used to read this site a lot more but was told specifically that this isn’t a place for beginners and not to ask so many questions, lol, most of my posts get moderated if they’re even slightly outside orthodoxy”
Sad story.
Sounds like you should start your own blog.
– MrJM
- SWIL_Voter - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:26 pm:
Let’s all come together around bashing these two very specific groups, refusing any self introspection, and then pushing people away if they suggest it. That’s literally a bubble
- Responsa - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:32 pm:
The comments on this helpful and well-meaning post by Rich for the most part sadly display the near futility of getting people out of their bubbles. Nice try, though, Mr. Miller.
- Excitable Boy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:37 pm:
- but was told specifically that this isn’t a place for beginners and not to ask so many questions, lol, most of my posts get moderated if they’re even slightly outside orthodoxy -
I hope you find your safe space soon.
- Pundent - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:37 pm:
I like people who agree with me. And in other news water is wet. We’ve got to ignore the “crazy uncles” on Twitter. There’s a tendency to see random tweets and think that these people speak for the “left” or “right.” Most of them speak only for themselves or the handful of people they tend to associate with.
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:50 pm:
SWIL_Voter, I did a quick search. You’ve commented 91 times, held in moderation about 10 percent of the time. That was mainly for the use of words that triggered automatic holds and I likely didn’t see the comments to release them.
As far as straying outside the “orthodoxy” getting you moderated, you posted this comment: “This is what police do. It’s what they’ve always done. Terrorizing black people is the name of the game”
https://capitolfax.com/2020/02/13/todays-must-read-30/#comment-13222262
- SWIL_Voter - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:51 pm:
== I hope you find your safe space soon.==
You can tell it’s a bubble because jokes haven’t evolved within it for the last 4 years. I agree people need to get out of their bubbles. But that goes for everybody. A little self awareness goes a long way. I listen to a lot of sports talk radio. But if I want a sports opinion that deviates from what old mostly white guys think, I have to seek that out specifically on twitter or blogs, etc. Same story here. If I want to know what old mostly white former state workers think, I check here. If I want younger diverse voices thinking about the future, I go elsewhere. A safe space is the last thing I want or need
- SWIL_Voter - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:53 pm:
I had to create this username because I got my old username banned for asking what, aside from his money, the Democratic Party saw in Pritzker. Never got another post through after that
- SWIL_Voter - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:55 pm:
And how is moderating my opinion about police a convincing argument that this place isn’t a bubble? That’s exactly the point. So what I don’t like cops? I’m allowed to think that. I’m far from alone
- ZC - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:55 pm:
I’m all for everyone coming together so long as that isn’t some kind of code for “Don’t tell the truth about how Trump has utterly screwed up this coronavirus response, because it will upset sensitive Republicans / conservative ears.”
We are watching in real time one of the most incompetent, inept presidential responses in modern history. It’s going to get more people killed. It is utterly unacceptable and a disgrace that should stay with his legacy forever.
Anyone who says I can’t point out this obvious truth, because “we need to get out of our bubbles” or “we need to band together” - I can’t join with.
Other than that, yes, many of the Bernie Bros are in their own headspace and they need to rejoin reality too and get off their insular social media.
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 12:59 pm:
===And how is moderating my opinion===
Ok look. I’m not gonna call you a moron or an idiot. I’m just gonna say you posted that comment and it never got moderated. So pull your head out or you’ll be banned. How about that?
- Independent - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:04 pm:
First, I hope for the least severe outcome with COVID-19. When the dust settles it’s time for a moment of reckoning. Ignoring highly knowledgeable scientists and experts in favor of practicing cheap populism and spouting bumper sticker slogans is incredibly dangerous. I hope after this a consensus builds that the experts are experts for a reason and they should be listened to.
- Excitable Boy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:04 pm:
SWIL - I’m a mid 30s Bernie supporter with very left leaning views. I disagree vehemently with many folks on this site regularly, including the host. What I don’t do is whine about it, try to do better.
- Jibba - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:07 pm:
“what, aside from his money, the Democratic Party saw in Pritzker”
And have you now seen the light?
And to the Bernie bros…please don’t take your ball and go home. Only one candidate on the ballot this fall will help you achieve many of your goals. Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
- Excitable Boy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:20 pm:
- what, aside from his money, the Democratic Party saw in Pritzker. -
The question I usually ask myself is “Compared to whom?”.
- Pundent - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:25 pm:
=But if I want a sports opinion that deviates from what old mostly white guys think, I have to seek that out specifically on twitter or blogs, etc.=
Proving the larger point. If I want an “opinion” that conforms with my own I have to seek it out to so I can prove that I’m right.
I would respectfully suggest that you’re not interested in opinions, you’re looking for confirmation. If that’s the case you won’t be happy here.
- City Zen - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:30 pm:
==And to the Bernie bros…please don’t take your ball and go home.==
Form your own team.
- SWIL_Voter - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:31 pm:
== Proving the larger point.==
How does seeking a variety of opinions prove that I’m in a bubble? Doesn’t it show the literal opposite?
- Lester Holt’s Mustache - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:31 pm:
Many thanks to Just Saying for perfectly epitomizing the headline of the post:
==How can you people honestly say that Trump is saying Coronavirus is a hoax? Who ever says that is truly on the far left.==
Not even Rich could provide such a clear example
- Collinsville Kevin - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:39 pm:
As a 60-year-old Bernie Bro, I look forward to voting for Jill Stein again. The Democratic establishment has made it clear that there is no room in the party for the left, and I welcome its disdain.
- Pundent - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:42 pm:
=How does seeking a variety of opinions prove that I’m in a bubble?=
With no objective evidence you’ve concluded that everyone on this blog is old and white. And you have to seek out opinions that align with your own. So yeah, you’re in a bubble.
- JIbba - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:47 pm:
“The Democratic establishment has made it clear…”
Kevin, the establishment didn’t vote yesterday, Democrats did. Sorry the majority doesn’t see everything your way. Progress toward areas of collective agreement can still be made, just perhaps not as much as you would like. An all-or-nothing mindset often leads to nothing.
- Archpundit - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:53 pm:
For those who think moderation is some sort of filter based on ideology–I get put in moderation all the time. Mostly because I cannot remember the moderated words and such. That’s on me.
- Pundent - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 1:56 pm:
The democratic primary was the most diverse ever. Every demographic group was represented. Your candidate did not win. That’s the will of the voters. Blaming the “establishment” is a cop out.
- Six Degrees of Separation - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 2:44 pm:
===The democratic primary was the most diverse ever.===
If the woke electorate won’t vote for your candidate in the primary, how do you think they’d do in the general?
- Grandson of Man - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 3:15 pm:
Bernie is getting trounced. The “Democratic establishment” doesn’t force people to vote a certain way. The voters are rejecting the Sanders campaign. Saw some graphics of how certain voter demographics moved from Sanders to Biden, thus winning so many counties Hillary lost.
- 618er - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 4:10 pm:
I would guess that the ‘Berners’ don’t realize there are enough people around voting that realize a social democrat isn’t electable. To many around that still remember communism, or have the sense to know that everything can’t be free.
- Da Big Bad Wolf - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 4:36 pm:
===To many around that still remember communism===
Sanders is a social democrat which has nothing in common with communism. Those capitalist countries like Norway and Finland have a lot of social democracy for example.
- Bourbon Street - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 4:40 pm:
==most everyone I know in IL is for Bernie==
Well, apparently you don’t anyone in IL who is old enough to remember when the Berlin Wall came down and the free world cheered its destruction. Either that or most of your IL acquaintances lied to you.
- Da Big Bad Wolf - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 4:47 pm:
===the Berlin Wall came down ===
The Berlin Wall? That’s one thick bubble.
- quincy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 4:52 pm:
Lets don’t forget it was Trump two weeks ago ho said it was a Hoax
- quincy - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 4:55 pm:
We’ll get threw this bad thang like true American do.May God Bless this good old USA.
- Bourbon Street - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 4:56 pm:
@Wolf. One thing Sanders is not and that’s a Democrat.
Say what you want about the Berlin Wall, but it is historically significant. These’s a famous quote about what happens to those who do not learn from history.
- Da Big Bad Wolf - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 5:27 pm:
===Say what you want about the Berlin Wall, but it is historically significant.===
Say what you will about the Berlin Wall, it has nothing to do with the person who said “most everyone in IL is for Bernie”
There is someone in government building a wall, however.
The quote is by Kurt Vonnegut: “We’re doomed to repeat the past no matter what. That’s what it is to be alive.”
- Don't Bloc Me In - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 5:44 pm:
Regarding Bernie bubbles: it’s safe to say I like Bernie more than many of his supporters. Ever engage one on social media? Dont.
- All this - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 6:54 pm:
== it’s safe to say I like Bernie more than many of his supporters. ==
I’ve met only nice and friendly Bernie supporters, Biden supporters and Trump supporters. I guess I live in a pretty chill bubble.
- Grandson of Man - Wednesday, Mar 18, 20 @ 9:08 pm:
“Sanders is a social democrat which has nothing in common with communism.”
Very true. Scandinavian countries tend to be happiest. But lots of Americans are not educated on that and think a Nordic economic model is communism. It’s an ancient fear in America, and why we can’t improve in key ways.
Many Sanders supporters will vote for Biden. The hardcore ones who won’t, we’ll just have to muddle through without them. They are the “loud” ones who get our attention with their negativity.
- 17% Solution - Thursday, Mar 19, 20 @ 8:10 am:
Not sure which concept is weirder, that members of ones social circle are representative of the majority, or that Medicare for all leads to the Berlin Wall. Some people should probably just stay in their bubbles and leave the rest of us in peace.