65 Comments - twowaystreet - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:31 pm: Smith’s ordinance doesn’t impose penalties for individuals not complying. Sounds like it should have just be a resolution encouraging people to wear face masks. - the Edge - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:38 pm: I’ve been home for 5 weeks now, and there is no reason why I shouldn’t ba allowed to walk on the golf course with my mates. Walking by nature keeps players socially distanced. JB and Lori must use some common sense applicable to others not living in densely populated areas. - SSL - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:42 pm: I’d be more surprised if he didn’t extend it to May 30th. It would be nice to see more quality masks available for purchase. If he allows golf it would be greatly appreciated. I know of no documented case attributed to a golf course, and with the right preventative measures put in place, there is no reason to punish these businesses further. - Just Me 2 - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:42 pm: Oh my gosh, a drive-in theater would be an awesome service right now. Customers can social distance in their cars. That guy could make bank. (lots of banned punctuation). - Rich Miller - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:44 pm: === Customers can social distance in their cars=== You gonna use a public restroom in these times? - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:46 pm: ===no reason why I shouldn’t ba allowed to walk on the golf course with my mates.=== #FirstWorldProblem Selfishness is not a good look in a global pandemic, but I’m, as always, appreciative when people tell us who they are. By the White House’s own measure, Illinois is not ready to move forward. It’s best to recognize truth. - up2now - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:48 pm: I do wish the state parks and conservation areas would reopen. My favorite birding area is a 3,000-acre fish and wildlife site near me. I have almost always been the only person out there when I go. Can’t imagine a safer place to be. - Almost the weekend - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:53 pm: If golf was not a white male dominated middle and upper class hobby this would be a non issue. - PGW - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:54 pm: Open up parks and golf courses for everyone to take a healthy walk. No need for the balls and clubs. - Soccermom - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:56 pm: PGW — apparently other countries allow walkers in golf courses during off hours. Not a bad idea. - Victory Farmer - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:56 pm: ===no reason why I shouldn’t ba allowed to walk on the golf course with my mates.=== #FirstWorldProblem Selfishness is not a good look in a global pandemic, but I’m, as always, appreciative when people tell us who they are. OW - I think what people see is the wide spread of what is allowed. People packed into a Wal Mart or Lowes and then contrast that with being able to really stay six feet apart on a golf course or state park. It’s perceived as a strange distinction to draw. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:57 pm: - Victory Farmer - Explain the word… “Essential” - Almost the weekend - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 12:59 pm: Victory Farmer Will you still golf 18, if you are not allowed to use a golf cart? - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:00 pm: === apparently other countries allow walkers in golf courses during off hours. Not a bad idea.=== - Soccermom - In normal times… The coolest thing about The Old Course, at St Andrews, is that it is a walking park for the the town, in summer there’s a 40 minute guided tour, not just of the course but what makes the town and course so symbiotic. - Trying to Be Rational - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:03 pm: My impression is that the bulk of commentators on this site haven’t missed a check. That the bulk of commentators are essential employees (especially of the govt variety), white collar workers who can work from home, or retired. Miss a few checks and attitudes here might change. Using a public restroom: Where do you think postal carriers and FedEx or UPS delivery personnel go to the restroom? They don’t drive back to the post office or home office to go, they have to use public restrooms. First World activities indeed: Birding, golfing, etc. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:06 pm: === postal carriers and FedEx or UPS delivery personnel=== Explain the word “essential” === Miss a few checks and attitudes here might change.=== 1) You have no idea my situation, as smug as you seem to be 2) You can’t un-die. 3) Looking to golf … in a prism of sorting “who” is getting paid, not paid, talk about time deaf… - DuPage Saint - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:08 pm: I never golfed seemed like a waste of time. But I guess I must have missed out on something. I never saw more complaints about something (except various governors) on this site before And to opening up golf course so people can walk DuPage Forest Preserves are shutting down some access as people don’t keep a distance. As did Morton Arboretum - CapnCrunch - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:10 pm: Anyone know if the grass and weeds stopped growing on the golf courses when the Governor ordered the shutdown? - JoanP - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:11 pm: To everyone who says “open the parks/golf courses, etc. because people can easily stay 6′ apart” - “can” doesn’t equal “will”. Take a look at the images of Florida beaches, packed after DeSantis opened them, no social distancing happening. I’d like to think Illinoisans are smarter than Floridians, but I wouldn’t put money on it. - WacoKid - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:12 pm: Essential is a funny word here. For example, I can go to Home Depot or equivalent and buy mulch, grass seed, and any other garden items around a number of people. Are any of those essential? Yet I can get them. I don’t think the restrictions are and ever have been well defined. - Pundent - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:16 pm: The distinction of whether or not something is essential is important. It’s a necessary function or service to sustain life and get us through the emergency. It is the gating criteria that allows us to prioritize life’s essential activities vs those that are “nice.” Golf is not essential. And I say that as a golfer. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:16 pm: ===I can go to Home Depot or equivalent and buy…=== … and likely, hopefully, alone or with whom you are quarantined with, work around your house, or worse repair something necessary for your home to be livable. You see Home Depot as a luxury. Cool. Someone who had damage to their house, have something endangering those residing, that’s… essential. - Nagidam - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:17 pm: ===By the White House’s own measure, Illinois is not ready to move forward. It’s best to recognize truth.=== What you’re going to see outside of Cook County are areas that will catalogue their data and reference the White House directive as a reason to open up their county or region. I’m actually surprised the various mayors and legislators that have been calling to open things up have not looked at the numbers to see if they would qualify under the federal directive. - dirksen - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:18 pm: pretty disappointing that in a state with such a great medical infrastructure at both the private and public level that our testing is so abysmal. States that acted well behind us are now catching up to us on tests administered. That needs to get fixed and it’s not an entirely Federal issue. - Blue Dog Dem - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:18 pm: And yet every nursery in illinois is open for business….free golf. - Just Me 2 - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:20 pm: Good point, Rich. I suppose you could just close them, but that could create a mess. - EmptyMailbox - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:20 pm: * Explain the word “essential” * Once upon a time making a living was considered essential, but that is lost on this crowd. - WacoKid - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:20 pm: That’s the thing. In order for Home Depot to be truly essential, it needs to be limited to things that are only repair related and not luxury related. It’s easy to use essential as a catch all, but harder to apply it as it relates to big box stores being open and selling everything. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:21 pm: - Nagidam - All you say may even be accurate, but this virus isn’t stopping at borders or regions. We have folks “here” talking about going to Wisconsin or Indiana… to golf. Mobility is the biggest threat and the largest hurdle to isolate hot spots properly. The more i think about those clamoring to go to Wisconsin or Indiana to golf, the concern of mobility of the virus shines thru. - Rich Miller - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:21 pm: ===it needs to be limited to things that are only repair related and not luxury related=== Ask Michigan’s governor how that went over. - ajjacksson - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:22 pm: “My impression is that the bulk of commentators on this site haven’t missed a check. That the bulk of commentators are essential employees (especially of the govt variety), white collar workers who can work from home, or retired.” I’ll be the first to say–my wife and I can both work at home, and haven’t missed a paycheck. It’s easy for people like me to sit in the cheap seats and tell people that can’t pay their rent, and can’t feed their kids, how they ought to believe and behave. - Pelonski - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:22 pm: I’m sure this is something that weighs greatly on the decision makers. We want the spread of the virus to slow, but we also want people to be able to make a living. I’m glad I’m not in their shoes. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:25 pm: === since your comments indicate you are very concerned about dying === I’m going to respond to you as such. You have ZERO idea what my personal concerns are, and anyone… anyone … who openly mocks restrain by trying to make it personal… you are indeed the selfish that worry me the most… for my own reasons… besides the science… and your own blabber that’s based on your alleged math without factoring in asymptomatic carriers. Do NOT assume you know anything about my thought to ME… or think for ONE second your snide way of looking at those endanger of contracting the virus is… trivial. Stop. Move on from me. - Retired Educator - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:26 pm: While I fully understand the horrible tragedy going on in The Greater Chicago area, we who live in small towns are not having the same problems. Keeping the shut down in place for certain sectors of Illinois. makes sense. There are however large sections of the state that are forced into the lock down, with few corona virus positives. It would make sense to open up some areas, and keep some other areas closed. Just the opinion of a small town guy, who has seen little true effects. - WacoKid - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:26 pm: “Ask Michigan’s governor how that went over.” Exactly. However, if the argument is that things can’t be opened even with taking proper precautions because they are not essential, then it makes no sense that other places can be open and sell items of which would not be considered essential. - Rich Miller - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:27 pm: ===we who live in small towns are not having the same problems=== Open your restaurants and watch outsiders flock in. lol - CG - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:27 pm: I think that the issue with the golf courses is it seems targeted towards the elite in a pandemic where the poor and minorities are suffering the greatest losses. It’s an us vs. them issue. This is a public health crisis but public sentiment is obviously also very important. If they open up the golf courses, they need to balance that with something geared towards less privileged sections of the population - certain medical screenings, state parks, and, if they can handle the restroom issue, drive-in movie theaters. Or maybe golf courses are only opened as “parks” like the comment above, but they can charge a lower fee in lieu of the usual golfing fee to let people walk around. - EmptyMailbox - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:27 pm: *Ask Michigan’s governor how that went over.* Indeed. Having a few things to do around the house is likely keeping a few of us from becoming full-blown alcoholics. - OpentoDiscussion - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:28 pm: The Governor had better take a close look at the data for cases on a county by county basis. This would include actual per capita numbers and trend lines. I would also suggest that he start taking this two weeks at a time instead of a month. - Rich Miller - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:28 pm: WacoKid, I had a post on this the other day. The answer is basically there are no easy or right ways of doing anything. So, take a breath, relax, and wait for the presser, which starts in a little over an hour. I mean, it’s right there in the headline. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:29 pm: === makes no sense that other places can be open and sell items of which would not be considered essential.=== Risking lives for first world asks is how this virus will become overwhelming. This isn’t a trivial whim. - bogey golfer - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:34 pm: My understanding is the Meijer stores in Michigan are open to the food and pharmacy only. Housewares, clothing, sporting goods and garden centers are closed off. No such restrictions are here in Illinois. - no one - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:36 pm: ===No such restrictions are here in Illinois.=== And they should not be - Boog Alou - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:36 pm: == Miss a few checks and attitudes here might change.== Lose a few family members and attitudes might change, too, so let’s stop pretending that this is a one-dimensional problem. - OpentoDiscussion - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:37 pm: Our Wal Mart garden center is closed while the rest of the store is open. So the open area is closed and the enclosed areas are ‘open’. Ummmm. - Nagidam - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:41 pm: ===All you say may even be accurate, but this virus isn’t stopping at borders or regions.=== We are dealing with this issue between Illinois and Iowa now. We will eventually deal with this issue when state open up and others don’t. These guidelines also have triggers that close things back up if there is a recurrence and the hospitals start to get overwhelmed. - Responsa - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:41 pm: Excerpt below is from my county’s daily Coronavirus report received via email this morning. 61 of the total 93 deaths are from nursing homes/long term health facilities. “This brings the total number of Lake County COVID-19 cases to 2,388 including 93 deaths (as of April 22, 2020, 1:30 p.m.). “The eight new deaths reported are all among residents who had underlying health conditions, a risk factor for severe illness from COVID-19. “The Health Department is investigating 30 long-term care facilities in the county that have two or more positive cases. These 30 facilities have a combined total of 437 confirmed COVID-19 cases and 61 deaths.” Lake County seems like a place where the Federal guidelines would logically allow Gov. Pritzker to lift his stay at home order before say, Cook County, so long as the nursing homes were isolated/protected and other social distancing for the general public was maintained . - park - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:42 pm: Please folks, “golf” is a noun, not a verb. You play golf, not ‘golf’. And yes, you can walk 18 holes. Average course, a little less than 4 miles of walking. - CapnCrunch - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:45 pm: Dr. Lydia Bourouiba is the director of the Fluid Dynamics of Disease Transmission Laboratory at MIT. She is the scientist who studies how a cloud of virus droplets emitted when someone coughs, sneezes or exhales is dispersed and is frequently quoted in the press (NYT April 14). In an interview last week (USA Today, April 15) about preventing the inhalation of the virus droplets in the air, she said “The best defenses are the outdoors and open windows which dissipate the clouds or droplets. When one is outside, with air circulation or wind, the cloud and its payload is easily dispersed and less concentrated.” Golfers would just like to follow her advice. - Pony soldier - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:45 pm: Instead of focusing on what to open, how about we look at what else we need to close to get through this quicker…specifically in the city of Chicago (CTA, anyone?). - First Amdt Lawyer - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:47 pm: ===Selfishness is not a good look in a global pandemic=== Come now, OW, enough with the moralizing. You are starting to sound like a 21st century puritan. - Moody's Blues - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:52 pm: This is a valuable point, wise beyond the reach of one thread, something we never should forget: “You have ZERO idea what my personal concerns are, and anyone… anyone … who openly mocks restraint by trying to make it personal …” If this is a fair extrapolation: Maybe all of us should — as Rich occasionally cautions — stop making so many debates so personal. A little less snark toward one another (and toward punching bags who aren’t here to defend themselves), a little more appreciation for one another’s different situations … We could do that. One point resonating in some comments today stops me cold: How terrifying this moment must be for blue collar / pink collar / often younger people who don’t have the insulation that many of us do. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:53 pm: === You are starting to sound like a 21st century puritan.=== Now, if I can get that groovy pilgrim hat… Meh. I sound like I listen to the White House briefing… when it’s *only* Dr. Fauci and Dr. Birx talking to the real… I recognize that wishing this away isn’t an option and illinois, while doing what it can, still isn’t near a phase to ease things without a plan that is thoughtful to science. That’s what I sound like. - Former ILSIP - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:54 pm: In lieu of asymptomatic/other carriers being able to infect people weeks and even months after exposure and recovery, is the stay-at-home order doing sufficiently more than delaying the inevitable surge of cases at this point to justify keeping it in its current form? That is, would an incremental opening of the economy (graduated increased business operations over time) of progressively more non-essential businesses (while adhering to social distancing, masks, etc.) allow a sufficiently flat curve to not overwhelm medical facilities while allowing individuals to be more active? The increased incidence of sickness, death due to lack of treatments (for example, cancer screenings/biopsies are elective procedures in many places), mental strain, and family/child abuse are growing in number and severity at this point. At what point does this outweigh the benefits of the stay-at-home order? - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 1:56 pm: - Moody’s Blues - Well said. Thanks for that pause too. - Kelly - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:07 pm: We’re all going to have to face the virus eventually. You all get that, right? It’s not going anywhere. You’re just postponing the inevitable. Covid Puritanism is real. And there will be a price paid for it, come election day. - Kelly - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:09 pm: Selfishness is you insisting that your fear is more important than my freedom. Shouldn’t work that way. YOU stay home, and let the rest of us get back to work supporting pensioners, the gov’t and ourselves. - Oswego Willy - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:14 pm: === insisting that your fear is more important than my freedom=== Your freedom to die or infect others who may die? Take a think on that. That’s silly on its face. === YOU stay home, and let the rest of us get back to work supporting pensioners, the gov’t and ourselves.=== It’s folks staying home that won’t frequent your business, your companies, and it will be you overwhelmingly hospitals, endangering health care professions… If your credo is to ignore science… for freedom… and the opportunity to work where people might not go… dunno if that’s the best argument to open a golf course. The three T’s are a good measure. - SKI - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:16 pm: Is there any sign of the Legislature convening to weigh in on the response to Covid 19, or are they content to allow the Governor to continue with no oversight indefinitely as he issues 30 day order after 30 day order? Sorry but from a constitutional standpoint, I’m very disappointed in how our government has responded. - SAP - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:19 pm: ==CTA, anyone?== Betcha a dollar there are some health care workers who rely on public transportation to get to and from work. Just one example of why it’s so difficult to figure out where to draw the line. - Demoralized - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:21 pm: ==insisting that your fear is more important than my freedom== Americans are sone of the most arrogant and self centered people on the planet. We are in the middle of a pandemic. It is the responsibility of the government to take care of the health and welfare of it’s people. Other countries have had far more restrictions put in place and have gotten a better handle on this than we have. But we have people arguing about not being able to golf for crying out loud. We aren’t talking about having restrictions forever. It has only been a little over a month and we aren’t in a position yet to move on like nothing is happening. And you are selfish no matter what you tell yourself - Nagidam - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:22 pm: There are quite a few folks that support this President that now don’t believe his plan to open up the economy. I find that fascinating. Same folks that think a woman should carry her baby to term even if it means she would die but now want to cause genocide on old people so they can play golf or get a haircut. The stay at home order worked to keep the healthcare system stable and save lives. The President has a viable plan to open up the economy. Listen to him. - Pundent - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:22 pm: =YOU stay home, and let the rest of us get back to work supporting pensioners, the gov’t and ourselves.= This seems premised on the belief that most people feel the way that you do. Polls suggest otherwise. People don’t feel that it’s safe to return to work at this point. When the “rest of us” feel the way that you do this will have some merit. I want to see our economy return for everyone’s sake, not for a handful of people that are willing to deny science and the advice of medical professionals. - Annonin - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:28 pm: Wonder if the McHenry dude gets the write off his special decals/stickers/? job now? - Rich Miller - Thursday, Apr 23, 20 @ 2:31 pm: I asked people to calm down and a bunch freaked out. You don’t even know what’s in the order yet. I’m shutting down this post. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.