*** UPDATED x2 *** IHSA defies governor
Wednesday, Oct 28, 2020 - Posted by Rich Miller
* Sun-Times…
According to several sources, the Illinois High School Association will announce Wednesday that the basketball season can start as scheduled. It’s a totally unexpected move that directly contradicts the guidelines Gov. J.B. Pritzker and the Illinois Department of Public Health outlined on Tuesday. […]
“After diligent discussion, the Board has made the decision today to follow the recommendation of the IHSA SMAC as it relates to basketball,” IHSA spokesperson Matt Troha wrote in an email to athletic directors. “The Board remains considerate of rising COVID-19 cases in Illinois and understand the importance of adhering to safety guidelines for the good of all citizens. However, the Board has not been presented any causal evidence that rising COVID-19 cases make basketball more dangerous to play by the IDPH or any other health organization nationally or internationally.”
The email says the IHSA will “allow local school officials to make decisions related to participation.”
The disagreement between the IHSA and the governor/IDPH likely means the final decision will come down to the individual school districts. Theoretically the school districts would open themselves up to tremendous liability by playing against the guidelines of the governor and the IDPH.
*** UPDATE 1 *** Gov. Pritzker was asked about this today…
We’ve told school districts what the rules are and I think they all know. The IHSA may have their views on it but school districts know what the rules are and I think that it’s unfortunate, but they would be probably taking on legal liability if they went ahead and move beyond what the state has said is the mitigation standard.
*** UPDATE 2 *** From the state school superintendent: “Defying the state’s public health guidance opens schools up to liability and other ramifications that may negatively impact school communities”…
Dear Colleagues:
The Illinois High School Association recently announced its intention to move forward with the regularly scheduled basketball season, in contradiction to public health guidance. As COVID-19 cases rise across the State, the importance of following public health guidance has only increased.
We recognize the value of sports in students’ lives and share your hope that students can return safely to play this school year. However, at this moment, we urge you to prioritize health and safety, and to returning the 1.76 million students currently learning remotely to the classroom.
The parents and families of Illinois have trusted us as leaders not only with the education of their children but with their health and safety while in our care. Public health experts have determined that basketball poses a high risk of COVID-19 transmission and is not currently safe to play.
Defying the state’s public health guidance opens schools up to liability and other ramifications that may negatively impact school communities.
Our Illinois schools and communities are safer when we work together in support of public health standards. We are relying on superintendents and school leaders to make responsible choices to protect health and safety and to focus on bringing all of our students back to the classroom.
Sincerely,
Dr. Carmen I. Ayala
State Superintendent of Education
Illinois State Board of Education
- Bob Loblaw - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 2:58 pm:
what is the meaning of our country anymore? We give formal power to minority factions who can’t win the votes, and then when a majority does win, we allow the minority to simply ignore the rules. Nothing about society will recover until we get the virus under control, but 30% of the people simply don’t care. They’ll lead entire communities to slaughter for happy hour and friday night basketball. What are rational people supposed to do? I’m at my wits end 5 months ago
- Dotnonymous - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 2:58 pm:
Nip it…Quick…with prejudice.
- Skeptic - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:01 pm:
Yet the health and safety of the kids comes first?
- Cardinal Fan - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:01 pm:
Once again the IHSA shows their true colors and literally “drops the ball”.
- iggy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:02 pm:
oh calm down. i’m sure they will buckle and reverse this decision.
- dan l - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:02 pm:
wow. people are idiots
- Cubs in '16 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:03 pm:
Can’t have games that count without qualified referees. Good luck with that IHSA.
- Cardinal Fan - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:04 pm:
@ iggy - - I hope that you are correct and that the IHSA reverses their decision; but they have a history of punting decisions right to the school districts. Total lack of leadership at the IHSA.
- Hamlet's Ghost - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:05 pm:
Countless unpaid elected school board members thank you for passing the ball to them.
- Cool Papa Bell - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:05 pm:
A requirement will be all players coaches and referees to be wearing a mask at all times.
Let it go for 30 or 60 days and see if the mitigation efforts work and any games or practices result in super spreader events.
- Flying Elvis'-Utah Chapter - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:06 pm:
It’s time to recognize the IHSA is no more for the students’ best interest than the NCAA.
Just another organization that stands to grift off of free labor.
- Flying Elvis'-Utah Chapter - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:08 pm:
“result in super spreader events”
Yeah, let who knows how many people contract this thing before cancelling high school basketball.
That’s the kind of logic that will have COVID spreading well into next year.
- northsider (the original) - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:09 pm:
===what is the meaning of our country anymore===
The selfish & vocal minority doesn’t want a government. They just want the perks of government.
- Go Big - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:09 pm:
The IHSA knows the Governor will overrule them and therefore take all of the heat.
Saves them the backlash that could result from member schools dropping out of the IHSA, while pinning the “bad news” on a Governor that is wildly unpopular (at least downstate), yet willing to do the right thing.
One the one hand, it is complete cowardice, on the the other it exposes the need for the Governor to employ some more sophisticated political skills. Namely, don’t just sign up for taking all of the blame/heat. This Summer, the Governor oddly rushed in to announce no football before the IHSA had a chance to hold their own press conference to do the same.
- Bruce( no not him) - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:09 pm:
Wasn’t it just yesterday that the IDPH said basketball was a high-risk activity?
Guess IHSA disagrees. Or doesn’t care.
- Almost the weekend - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:09 pm:
Let the IHSA own this.
- RNUG - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:10 pm:
There is a carefully phrased statement on their web site.
- Flying Elvis'-Utah Chapter - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:11 pm:
As a high school student in the early ’80’s I thought an absurd amount of resources went to sports instead of arts. I understood I saw things through a teenager’s eyes but that’s how I perceived them.
Time certainly hasn’t proven me wrong.
- Magic Dragon - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:18 pm:
Love the update…you mean the mitigation standard you arbitrarily changed yesterday to fit your narrative? Good for the IHSA for finally standing up and actually using evidence to support their position instead of hiding behind it.
- Lincoln Lad - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:18 pm:
The nonsense of all this is beyond me. I agree the selfish and vocal minority only wants the government that benefits them personally. Why don’t they just move to South Dakota?
- Graduated College Student - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:18 pm:
===It’s time to recognize the IHSA is no more for the students’ best interest than the NCAA.===
Shoot, I figured that out as a high school athlete in cross country and track and that was more than 15 years ago.
- illinifan - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:21 pm:
Can the teams practice and play if the school is closed? What gym would be open for these activities.
- 47th Ward - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:22 pm:
===arbitrarily changed===
If by arbitrarily you mean in accordance with the metrics and the plan he announced in July which was triggered by escalating positivity rates reached this week, then you’re correct.
Arbitrarily doesn’t mean what you think it means.
- Pundent - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:22 pm:
Our common goal should be to put this disease behind us, not play high school basketball. Kids need to know that part of growing up is recognizing that sometimes we make sacrifices for the greater good.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:23 pm:
Legal liability.
I guess the IHSA wants school boards to choose.
I guess the IHSA isn’t about safety for officials or students.
Very telling.
It’s probably about money…
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:23 pm:
@Magic Dragon:
Well I guess we can add you to the pile of other people who should be blamed for this pandemic continuing to be out of control. But good for you for cheering people for “standing up.” Because heaven forbid we can’t play high school basketball. Let’s kill a few more people so some of you can feel better.
You and those like you are the problem. But you just don’t care. The selfishness you and others exhibit amazes me.
- 47th Ward - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:24 pm:
===Magic Dragon===
One of my high school pals named his bong the Magic Dragon. Is that you Coop? How’s it going? Still smoking I see.
- Magic Dragon - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:26 pm:
==Kids need to know that part of growing up is recognizing that sometimes we make sacrifices for the greater good.==
One might argue that these kids you refer to have likely sacrificed way more already than most adults.
- Cardinal Fan - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:26 pm:
@ Magic Dragon . . . you might change your tune if you live in the school district that gets sued when basketball is played, someone ties COVID to the ball game that is played in that school district and the insurance company says “uhm, nope you’re not covered” . . . the property taxes will go skyhigh to fund that lawsuit and claim.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:28 pm:
The first school district sued… you think IHSA is gonna help,
I can’t just hear the family too;
“The school defied the Governor. Our child now has covid due to an unsafe extra curricular activity”
IHSA?
“Thems the breaks, good luck.”
- Magic Dragon - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:30 pm:
@Demoralized:
Bite me. That is an easy statement to make. What you don’t know is that I do wear a mask when out in public and behave responsibly by avoiding large crowds. At the same time, other states have proven that sports can be played responsibly and actions can be taken when issues arise. Just because my position doesn’t fit your narrative doesn’t make me selfish.
- JS Mill - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:32 pm:
Maybe this will get the state to take a closer look at the IHSA for once.
My suspicion is that they know (Matt Troha isn’t dumb) they will get over ridden (since they have no authority) by the state and this is a way to get people off of their back and make the governor the bad guy.
Basketball is their biggest money maker, so I am sure that is a part of their motivation as well. Unlike the IESA, the IHSA has a large cash reserve and can operate normally for a long time even without the tournaments. They also have an insurance pool that they have a relationship with, although I do not know what kind of revenue that generates for the IHSA.
Either way, they are wrong and they are doing what DeVore and the Eastern Block have been doing.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:35 pm:
Who’s to say a family doesn’t sue schools for having sports, defying the governor’s order.
“Family Sues School, Calls Sports ‘Super Spreader Events’”
A senior citizen?
“I’m a taxpayer and the school is promoting super spreader events with sports, infecting the community, and possibly putting me in danger, all in defiance of the governor’s order”
The IHSA?
“You’re on your own”?
- Earnest - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:36 pm:
-One might argue that these kids you refer to have likely sacrificed way more already than most adults.
Not more than those who have died. Not more than those who have lost someone they cared about. Not more than those who work in healthcare and put their own lives at risk taking care of others. Not more than those whose businesses have been ravaged due to fear of infection or a sense of personal responsibility to avoid spreading it.
- Jibba - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:36 pm:
Magic dragon: “other states have proven that sports can be played responsibly…”. cite please.
- Just Me 2 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:37 pm:
Children’s athletic activities should clearly take precedence over the health and safety of all Illinoians.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:37 pm:
=== One might argue that these kids you refer to have likely sacrificed way more already than most adults.===
The dead know only one thing: it is better to be alive
Anything else?
- Lt Guv - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:38 pm:
Magic Dragon,
You seem awfully fixated on “narrative” instead of illness & death. Sounds like a spin doctor to me.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:39 pm:
===… doesn’t make me selfish.===
A want to defy a health order to play a sport?
It’s a textbook definition of selfish, who you kidding?
- OneMan - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:40 pm:
It would seem that after saying for months that it wouldn’t be considering Basketball a contact sport and it would be treated one way, it might be helpful if the IDPH share with everyone very publically why they changed their mind about Basketball.
I would suggest the IHSA share the report from its medical committee about why they have come to the conclusion they have come to when it comes to Basketball.
That way the science is out there for everyone to see and school districts and others have all the information.
I would suggest you read the IHSA statement. It provides some insight into the restrictions they will be placing as well as what in part led to their decision.
https://www.ihsa.org/News-Media/Announcements/ihsa-board-acts-on-winter-sports-at-special-board-meeting
- Blue Island Goose - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:40 pm:
Let’s see. The Governor’s orders have been challenged by the Mayor of Chicago and the IHSA.
But a national mandate will be universally accepted and magically fix everything? LOL
- Unconventionalwisdom - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:40 pm:
So will Pritzker ‘Stand Up’ or ‘Stand Down’ on this matter?
- Leigh John-Ella - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:42 pm:
If you look at what’s been done at the pro level and then at the college level for those that have had sports seasons, you’re looking at massive testing programs and protocols in place to catch infections and quarantine those who are infected.
Wisconsin just canceled its football game with Nebraska because of a rash of infections that includes the QB and the coach. In the Big Ten, a football player that tests positive can’t return to play for 21 days and must undergo cardiac screening to make sure it’s safe.
NCAA basketball protocols call for screening players and personnel 3 times a week and separating players and priority personnel into a basketball bubble away from others whenever possible.
Does the IHSA have something like that set up for every high school team in Illinois? I don’t see testing protocols in any of the IHSA return to play guidelines on the website. I don’t see standards for how long a student athlete is out of competition if he or she tests positive. I don’t see any health screenings for student athletes who are infected.
Why not? Does the IHSA not care as much about student athletes?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:45 pm:
=== But a national mandate will be universally accepted and magically fix everything?===
New Zealand and Australia, even Canada… not our spread.
The Covidiots are the selfish who want the bench-riding senior to go to his weekend job and infect others.
It’s selfish, “but sports”
- Ducky LaMoore - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:46 pm:
“ Just because my position doesn’t fit your narrative doesn’t make me selfish.”
If you want to turn your back on your family, friends, neighbors, and country, that is your business. Just admit that is what you’re doing.
- Reality - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:47 pm:
School districts can decide to make their own, local decisions.
Governor can decide to withhold state funding.
- JS Mill - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:48 pm:
=I would suggest you read the IHSA statement.=
I did when it was emailed to me by Matt Troha the IHSA executive director.
Let me see, and organization with zero legal authority or the IDPH/ISBE. Hmmm, I wonder which one I am going to follow?
Nice of the IHSA to set up every school district for additional attacks and confrontation. Like we need more.
I am checking their by-laws to see if that is part of their mission. /s
- Club J - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:48 pm:
So why have a Governor or Health Department for the State. Seems nobody wants to believe this pandemic is real. My Alderman is complaining about the mitigation’s coming to Springfield and it’s West Side Bars. Yet for 25 years I’ve never seen his face in my subdivision worrying about anything. I just don’t get it. Over 225,000 people dead, 1000 a day dying and we can’t get our act together enough because we can’t stop going bar hopping on the weekends. I’m grateful my child is grown.
- Abbey - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:52 pm:
Small school district with just over 30 teachers. One Covid+ on Saturday; one more on Tuesday. School shut down all approximately 400 students sent to remote learning.
Wednesday, 3rd staff member Covid+.
What’s a helo ride to Rockford cost for us rural residents that might survive Covid?
Why is everyone in such a hurry to rain financial ruin and possible death on their neighbors? Why would the IHSA and sports parents decide their entertainment is worth more than my life? How do they decide a lifetime of health complications is a justified cost of dribbling a ball
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 3:58 pm:
=== So will Pritzker ‘Stand Up’ or ‘Stand Down’ on this matter?===
Do you have any idea what you’re trying to say?
- Blue Island Goose - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:02 pm:
“The Covidiots are the selfish….”
OW,
So is Mayor Lightfoot a “covidiot” because she disagrees with Pritzker?
LOL. She’ll be glad to know that.
- Dotnonymous - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:02 pm:
“Just because my position doesn’t fit your narrative doesn’t make me selfish.” - Magic Dragon
Yes…it does.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:03 pm:
== doesn’t make me selfish==
Yeah it does. Each time you open your mouth you prove it.
- Demoralized - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:04 pm:
I’m going to say the same thing here I said when the discussion was about football. Will all of these mommy’s and daddy’s be willing to let their kiddos play but in the interest of safety let them do it without anyone in the stands? I’d love schools to say, “Ok, we’ll play. But nobody in the stands.”
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:05 pm:
===is Mayor Lightfoot a “covidiot” because she disagrees with Pritzker?===
She’s now switched positions and is with the governor. What does that make you?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:08 pm:
=== So is Mayor Lightfoot a “covidiot” because she disagrees with Pritzker?
LOL. She’ll be glad to know that.===
“Mayor Lori Lightfoot’s dropped her challenge to Gov. Pritzker’s ban on indoor dining and bars. She didn’t have a lot of options, even though she was upset with the governor’s plan.”
It appears she walked it back. Keep up, please.
- Interim Retiree - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:09 pm:
The IHSA is a Principals organization.
I am sure these Principals don’t get upset when students &/or parents defy school rules./s
- Rich Hill - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:11 pm:
Fantastic idea. Keeping amateur sports going has worked so well in Wisconsin this fall. What could possibly go wrong?
- Dotnonymous - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:19 pm:
Is there a word for both disappointed but not surprised …in English?
- Haven't picked one yet - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:26 pm:
I’m curious if your all against playing sports for fear of spread are you also against the protesting and looting? Are we giving fair treatment to all who come before us? I watched thousands walk hand in hand. That didn’t get as much attention about Covid-19 as your post has here.
- Soccer mom - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:33 pm:
“I’m curious if your all against playing sports for fear of spread are you also against the protesting and looting?”
That’s different. Because we say so.
/s/
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:34 pm:
===I’m curious===
No you’re not. Nothing about your question is of a curious nature.
===against the protesting and looting?===
Asked and answered… dozens of times.
Do you stand up for Black Lives Matter?
If you want to make it about race… the reality is quite clear;
The super spreader sports the IHSA wants schools to play… the schools are liable, not IHSA… and going against the governor.
One lawsuit… just one…
- Give Me A Break - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:47 pm:
More than a few school board members are about to realize the joy of hearing from vocal voters. And I’m wondering how many school district’s attorneys will advise them to just go ahead ignore what IDPH says and play away.
- Club J - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:47 pm:
*** I’m curious if your all against playing sports for fear of spread are you also against the protesting and looting? ****
First. Thanks Soccer Mom well said.
Well I’m not throwing my child out to protest. The people I’ve seen protesting are adults. I did see children at the Bailey Circus with no masks along with everyone else sadly. It’s like if you were working in yard and a big patch of poison ivy is there. You would glove up and take care of it. You wouldn’t throw Jr. in there and say hey if you get it oh well.
Have some common sense about this. It’s children playing school sports against a virus that can cause them problems for the rest of their lives or the could die. I guess it depends on the kind of parent you are.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:48 pm:
=== That’s different. Because we say so.===
Should we schedule “in conference” or “out of conference” super spreader events?
The SEC, for example has testing 3 times a week, everyone in the program… every… one…
Is the IHSA going to pay for the hundreds and hundreds of winter athletes, those defying the governor’s order?
Why or why not?
I’ll give you a hint;
The SEC… the millions spent on football alone… the IHSA doesn’t have that cash. Neither do schools.
Defy the Governor, you best better be testing at a high level, multiple times, honestly.
What, you think “Joe College” QB testing positive is going to be sat against that crosstown rival.., “he has no symptoms”
One lawsuit… one.
- Leigh John-Ella - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:48 pm:
- Haven’t picked one yet -
I’m curious why you’re so eager to sign a waiver absolving your local school of any medical and health care responsibility so that a student can knowingly go against medical recommendations and be put at risk, any risk, of contracting a virus that may in fact carry lifelong health risks.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/long-term-effects.html
The IHSA passes the buck to the schools.
The schools are going to pass the buck to the parents.
And if by chance your kid has a negative outcome, oh well. You signed the waiver. Hope you’ve got good health care because the school isn’t going to pay a dime and the IHSA isn’t going to pay a dime.
It’s all school spirit and rah-rah until something goes wrong. And time after time history has shown that the school will walk away from that problem, because it’s not their problem. You signed a waiver.
Think about it. At the very least, more should be demanded from the IHSA.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:51 pm:
=== First. Thanks Soccer Mom well said.===
What‘s well said about it?
The protests to open up… are they as bad as any protest?
It’s an ignorant “whatsboutism”, laced with a racist bend, all so parents can watch kids maybe infect their grandparents who are coming to the game because “it’s just like the flu”
- DocNoyes - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:52 pm:
Maybe it’s also time to dissolve the IHSA. How can a private group who has no accountability or allows the public to look at any financial records be in charge of schools?
- walker - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 4:55 pm:
Trial lawyers are watching with interest.
IHSA is not in any way accountable to voters for the public health.
- MyTwoCents - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:25 pm:
The IHSA took the cowards way out, define IDPH and put it all on the local schools and wipe their hands of the whole situation. Real profile in courage. As for their statement, the protocols sound good in theory, but how are the going to work in practice? They are expecting every single player to constantly wear a mask the entire game? Really? The IHSA says they’re going to require the protocols to be followed, but how are they enforcing compliance? As for their sports medicine advisory committee, I’m sure it’s great for sports medicine, but how does that translate to addressing a global pandemic the likes of which we haven’t seen in a 100 years? Looking at who is on the committee, they are all sports medicine experts, not public health/virology/epidemiology.
As for the “but but other states…” the problem is as a nation we are still woefully lacking in testing and contact tracing capabilities. The outbreak for the Wisconsin football was quickly discovered because there’s constant testing. With a younger population that is more likely to be asymptomatic (or pass it off as minor cold and never get tested) the odds of discovering the origin of a infection probably isn’t all that great. If player A gets COVID from player B on the other team, and passes it around to friends or family and 2 or 3 infections down the line it hits an elderly relative, how is anybody going to be able to track it back to the basketball game?
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:25 pm:
I have a serious question. Why are NCAA and and NFL allowed to play in the State of Illinois? Why has that not been shutdown as well?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:33 pm:
=== I have a serious question.===
No you don’t. The context of IHSA… and this?
=== Why are NCAA and and NFL allowed to play in the State of Illinois? Why has that not been shutdown as well?===
Will IHSA pay for the rigorous testing that the NCAA and NFL are doing?
How about pay for each and every school… a Covid-19 protocol observer, to regulate all things testing and compliance?
Let’s start there.
You sure you’re asking a serious question?
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:41 pm:
I did ask a serious question. Is U of I paying for the testing? Do they get public funding from our tax dollars? Didn’t they just play in WI? Will they bring back COVID? Are they quarantined like the NBA or are they free to roam the campus?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:43 pm:
=== Is U of I paying for the testing? Do they get public funding from our tax dollars? Didn’t they just play in WI?===
Google is your friend.
Search;
Big Ten Covid 19 protocols and costs.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:47 pm:
=== Will they bring back COVID?===
Rigorous testing thru the week should answer that question, then there’s rigorous testing… next week.
I’m sure the IHSA, with basketball as an example, will pay for each and every programs 3 tests per athlete, coach, trainer, student scorers…
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:53 pm:
=== Is U of I paying for the testing? Do they get public funding from our tax dollars? Didn’t they just play in WI?===
Well Oswego Willy, I did search and the answers are yes, yes and yes.
- Leigh John-Ella - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:57 pm:
And in all fairness to the U of I, they put their big brains together and developed their own test.
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:59 pm:
Seriously Oswego Willy, shouldn’t be up to the grandparents if they want to go and watch the game? Worried about lawsuits? How about having waivers signed and on file? just a thought.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:59 pm:
===I did search and the answers are yes, yes and yes.===
Congrats. How is that now germaine to IHSA… or is the Little Sisters of the Poor going to pay itself for the testing rigors matched by Illinois Football?
- Southern Dude - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 5:59 pm:
The IHSA took the cowards way out, define IDPH and put it all on the local schools and wipe their hands of the whole situation.
Yep, just like the Gov did when he punted to the School Boards on the decision to open for in person learning.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:02 pm:
=== Worried about lawsuits? How about having waivers signed and on file? just a thought.===
No waivers, friend.
It only takes one innocent family getting sick because some parent or grandparent gets sick at a IHSA basketball super spreader event.
No waivers. Plus, go after the school district.
Schools will be going against the governor’s order.
No waiver. Nope.
- northsider (the original) - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:05 pm:
School boards need to worry about insurance coverage for more than Covid. If they are hosting basketball in defiance of the order & somebody gets their nose broken or a spectator trips on the bleacher and breaks a hip, their carrier isn’t going to cover them.
- Leigh John-Ella - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:06 pm:
Southern Dude, and those locals schools have for years demanded that decisions be left to them. That is until there’s a tough one and suddenly the $400,000 superintendent needs the state to handhold them through every move.
- Not picked one yet - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:07 pm:
None of you answered the question. It’s obvious protesting would be super spreader events if a 5 on 5 basketball game would be. That has nothing to do with Race either. You can’t group at church because of super spreader but we can hold hands and walk down the street or destroy a Wal-Mart for no reason. I’m sure science is totally against those super spreader activities.
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:10 pm:
It appears that there is an assumption that there would be spectators ” super spreader events”. There are no spectators at NCAA or professional sports events, why would you assume there would be at the IHSA level?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:11 pm:
=== You can’t group at church because of super spreader but we can hold hands and walk down the street or destroy a Wal-Mart for no reason.===
Racial signaling again?
Couldn’t choose the example of the Covidiot protests to open up the state… nope…. had to dog whistle.
“I want sports because the racist thought to some protests make it sound good”?
Hmm.
- Parker Latin - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:12 pm:
Does anyone this effect dressage? Sport jumping?
People need to know these things.
- Not picked one yet - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:12 pm:
FYI, you will all love this. My kid has played in Indiana since April and no one has got Covid-19 on the team. No one died can you believe it? Me either. My kid will also play school ball if it’s I’m session. Before you ask We all wear masks and vote Democrat so don’t try that anti Republican junk. We just trust that kids and parents are allowed to make the decision to take the risk and if you don’t want to you get to make that choice to. That’s what’s great about America we don’t have to agree.
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:13 pm:
I also agree that there will be no way that school districts will buck the Governor. He holds to many strings. But it could be done.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:15 pm:
=== There are no spectators at NCAA or professional sports events, why would you assume there would be at the IHSA level?===
#2 Alabama, after Nick Saban falsely tested positive and had to retest 3 times, played #3 Georgia with 20,000 folks, the World Series had fans….
… are you speculating after defying the Illinois governor’s order to have basketball, all of a sudden no fans will be tolerated here in Illinois?
Hmm.
Parents want to watch the kids, it’s the feature of this, not the bug.
- Southern Dude - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:16 pm:
Southern Dude, and those locals schools have for years demanded that decisions be left to them. That is until there’s a tough one and suddenly the $400,000 superintendent needs the state to handhold them through every move.
I don’t disagree with you. They have made some really bad decisions, and yet the Gov gave them the power to make the decision to open schools.
- Leigh John-Ella - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:17 pm:
I don’t think the decision will ever get to the gov. School board/district lawyers aren’t know for the trial experience. All of their advice is based on NOT doing any legal work.
Also, there are spectators at college and pro football games. Leagues limit attendance and spacing. There was a college student section recently cleared out and kicked out because they weren’t following protocols. Again, nothing in the IHSA guidelines.
If the IHSA wants sports it should build the system that could pass muster and make the case. Instead, it punted.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:18 pm:
=== vote Democrat===
Yeah, the virus doesn’t care about how you vote, it cares if you can host it.
=== We just trust that kids and parents are allowed to make the decision to take the risk===
The mere fact you’re “cool” with risking lives not yours, or your kids, or lives of people you don’t know… in a global pandemic… isn’t a reason to think America is great… or you’re “keeping America great”…
- thoughts matter - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:24 pm:
I’m amazed that people who have spent the last 4 years shouting law and order are now shouting ‘ignore the governor and the department of public health’. These are the civil equivalents of law and order. Go ahead, teach your teenagers that they can disobey whenever they want because they want something. But don’t be surprised if they then disobey you about curfew, smoking and drinking.
There is an infant and a six year old currently hospitalized for Covid. Your children are not immune.
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:25 pm:
Oswego Willy, I don’t think it would be good to have spectators at the games. You could easily require waivers for the athletes, coaches, trainers, etc. to protect from liability. Some parents want a sense of normal for the kids. Lots of psychological issues going on with kids because of all of this.
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:28 pm:
You said it perfectly. That’s what we are seeing in the looting.
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:30 pm:
Thoughts matter, isn’t what they’re doing now? And the infant and the 6 year old hospitalized with COVID, are you suggesting it’s the parents fault? I don’t get the connection to your prior statement.
- Not picked it yet - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:31 pm:
We will never know but, I would be willing to bet you none of these Millennials looting had their butt whipped like most of is old folks did. If they had this would not be their mode of making change.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:33 pm:
=== You could easily require waivers for the athletes, coaches, trainers, etc. to protect from liability===
Nope.
If it’s so safe, why would there be a need for waivers.
Also, a parent gets it, gives it to a neighbor… the school district should be held liable. It’s a global pandemic and playing a sport against the governor’s order means consequences.
The neighbor should sue the school district… in their violation of ignoring a health order.
You wanna play… you may pay.
IHSA ain’t gonna help.
=== Some parents want a sense of normal for the kids. Lots of psychological issues going on with kids because of all of this.===
Same with doctors and nurses, holding hands of those dying, no family around.
Rich had a link how teenagers were coping, it said they were coping well.
It’s the parents that aren’t coping… it’s quite sad.
It’s the parents… driving 5-6 hours out of state to tournaments… to watch… to watch the kids.
Friend, we ALL are struggling to cope. Everyone around the world.
Not playing a high school extra curricular is low… compared to those losing homes and apartments, jobs, businesses….
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:35 pm:
=== We will never know but, I would be willing to bet you none of these Millennials looting had their butt whipped like most of is old folks did. If they had this would not be their mode of making change.===
* Angry in-law uncle entered the chat *
- Swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:42 pm:
Oswego Willy, come on? Are you really going to try to tell me that the only place a parent could get COVID is watching an IHSA event therefore the school district is liable? How about everywhere else they go daily? The contact tracing lawsuit thing doesn’t hold water. How many law suits have been filed against businesses, bars restaurants, etc because someone got COVID 2nd hand? It’s rhetorical.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:46 pm:
This is the same person?
=== We all wear masks and vote Democrat===
They vote “Democrat” and…
=== We will never know but, I would be willing to bet you none of these Millennials looting had their butt whipped like most of is old folks did. If they had this would not be their mode of making change.===
Hmm.
Not many angry in-law uncles are pulling “Democrat” ballots this year.
If the IHSA wants sports as they see them, and defy the Governor, will the IHSA match pro sport protocols… as they are *choosing* to defy the health order of the Governor.
Will the IHSA cover all liability for every student, school, and conference? Every dime?
No waivers, you’re defying.
- Blue Dog Dem - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:49 pm:
I don’t much care what the polling data says. What old Blue sees with his own eyes, in Region 4 and 5, there are tens of thousands of Illinois residents who apparently made the decision that they have had enough of mitigation efforts. Not just the young either. I feel I have practiced the M,S, and W pretty well, but that has been my decision. I won’t disparage those who have gone back to their lifestyles.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:50 pm:
=== Are you really going to try to tell me that the only place a parent could get COVID is watching an IHSA event therefore the school district is liable?===
You see how easy it was to trace the White House super spreader event?
You think you find 3, 4… 7 parents or students get the virus… you can’t trace that spread?
You must not know any personal injury lawyers, lol
=== How many law suits have been filed against businesses, bars restaurants, etc because someone got COVID 2nd hand? It’s rhetorical.===
We’re 8 months in, are you in a hurry?
This is also a defying a health order.
Lawyers love folks who ignore things when it comes to liability
- thoughts matter - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:54 pm:
==Thoughts matter, isn’t what they’re doing now? And the infant and the 6 year old hospitalized with COVID, are you suggesting it’s the parents fault? I don’t get the connection to your prior statement.==
I don’t get your first sentence. People who disobey the governor are thumbing their noses at law and teaching their teens to do the same.
As to the question. I have no idea where the infant and 6 year old were exposed. I am not blaming their parents for anything. I am noting the fact that children are currently hospitalized are therefore children in general are nit immune to this virus. Peopke who want their children to play basketball think they are immune.
- Not picked one yet - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:55 pm:
Willy are you saying Democrats don’t get spankings in the old days? Not sure how that fits?
- Not picked one yet - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 6:57 pm:
My dad would have spanked the whole neighborhood political views wouldn’t have anything to do with that.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:00 pm:
=== are you saying Democrats don’t get spankings in the old days? Not sure how that fits?===
How many adults… adults… are propagating “spanking in my day” as the reason “people these days…”
… aren’t our angry in-law uncles, who tell you not only are they voting for Trump, Trump is law and order… oh… and they vote… “Democrat”
C’mon friend, you’re fooling no one. We all have this in-law uncle, he’s not voting Biden, lol
Try again.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:17 pm:
=== It’s definitely entertainment.===
It’s easy when folks pretend to be who they are.
I enjoyed it too.
Sincerely; be safe, wear a mask, wash your hands. My best to you and your family. OW
- JS Mill - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:31 pm:
=$400,000 superintendent=
What planet are you joining us from and what does compensation have to do with it? How much do you make and what do you do?please share your list of superintendents making $400k.
I checked with our liability insurance broker (not carrier, I am waiting for them to get back to me) and his belief is that we would not be covered for any athletic liability issues related to activities that are not allowed by the state
That is really all we need to know to make a decision.
- Blue Dog Dem - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:38 pm:
Speaking of insurance. Does anyone know when the refunds will be sent out? With mitigation efforts in place, schools aren’t nearly at risk. Gram shop? Buses aren’t on the road as much. Appears to be many needed dollars coming back…..I think.
- Anonymous - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:41 pm:
===People who want their children to play basketball think they are immune.===
I don’t think that is a true statement at all and a gross mischaracterization. They may get sick but they will recover.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:44 pm:
===They may get sick but they will recover.===
To paraphrase “Anonymous” because …
“I don’t think that is going to be a true statement in all cases, and it’s a gross mischaracterization.”
#NoMoreAlternativeFacts
- swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:51 pm:
Sorry, that was my statement. My name must have been left off.
I only offer this as a rebuttal so before I get flamed by everybody, I’m just stating facts here. There have only been 8 deaths out of the 9619 deaths in Illinois in the
- Pundent - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:51 pm:
@JS Mill - I believe your carrier will second what your broker is saying. And importantly it would be any liability not just liability arising from Covid. If the state is not allowing an event the insurer would likely deny any liability arising from the prohibited event. It would be similar to having a slip and fall claim in a bar you operated without a valid liquor license.
- swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:53 pm:
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:53 pm:
=== only been 8 deaths===
Your family first.
“Only Eight” isn’t a swaying argument when you see life so frivolously.
- swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:55 pm:
,20 age group. Yes they may get sick, they are not immune (13% of the cases. but statistically they will recover. 99.92%. That is not a gross mischaracterization.
- Theshow - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:58 pm:
Good for the IHSA. I’d much rather have these high school kids attending organized practices and games with rules requiring masks and no fans, streaming the games to those who care to watch under the supervision of people whose livelihoods depend on keeping them healthy than having them hanging out at unsupervised spreader gatherings.
The data and spiking cases show that these kids are not going to hide out at home in quarantine for the greater good and the health risk for them personally is minimal. Let’s occupy their time in a controlled manner.
As for the school district’s liability, that’s what waivers are for. Want to play, you agree that you could get Covid and die or kill someone else. Sign here… As for Pritzker, he now has the political cover he needs if some kid dies or an outbreak gets tied back to sports. He passed the buck like a veteran and everyone gets what they want. Isn’t political theater fun to watch…
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 7:58 pm:
===they are not immune===
Shoulda stopped there.
Gambling with others’ lives, that’s selfish, gambling with you kids’ or family’s lives… whew.
“they are not immune”
Nope.
The rest is… a gross “mischaracterization”
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:00 pm:
=== As for the school district’s liability, that’s what waivers are for.===
You can’t wave away liability from defying a government order.
“That’s what trial lawyers are for”
- swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:01 pm:
I state facts, let you know I’m going to be just stating facts and you make a comment like that in an effort to discredit. the facts are what they are and that has no bearing on the way I look at life, which is not frivolously BTW.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:04 pm:
=== that has no bearing on the way I look at life, which is not frivolously===
Hmmm.
===only been 8 deaths===
Please stop digging, you’re embarrassing yourself.
“only been 8 deaths”
Your family first.
- swimdad13 - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:04 pm:
well when you don’t like the numbers but can’t dispute them, that’s the kind of response I’d expect. Who are you to be telling people how to raise their kids?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:07 pm:
===only been 8 deaths===
That’s someone who sees lives so frivolously… they are mere… I’ll let you say it;
=== when you don’t like the numbers but can’t dispute them===
Lives are mere numbers… to dispute.
How many must die before they matter where you don’t see lives as frivolous?
Give that number to the IHSA…
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:08 pm:
=== Who are you to be telling people how to raise their kids?===
I’m not, you’re telling me 8 deaths are “mere facts”…
- Pundent - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:09 pm:
= As for the school district’s liability, that’s what waivers are for.=
Waivers won’t be worth the paper they’re written on. Even when drafted correctly waivers apply to accidental injuries not global pandemics. And courts routinely invalidate them when they aren’t negotiated in good faith or involve minors.
A few months ago some municipalities toyed with the idea of openly defying the governor’s orders. And then their attorneys weighed in. The IHSA has offered an opinion. No resources, protocols, guidelines, or testing. That will be the burden of the schools. There will be no accepted standard or codified set of rules to follow. It has all of the effect of the Chamber of Commerce weighing in on mitigations.
- Jibba - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:23 pm:
===Yes they may get sick, they are not immune===
How many people did they give it to, including Grandma? This is how pandemics work. People give it to others, even if some are asymptomatic or don’t get seriously ill themselves. Same logic as restaurants. You shut down places where transmission is likely to occur.
- JS Mill - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 8:31 pm:
@Pundent, you are exactly right.
@theshow- from where do you derive your liability expertise? I mean since you know more than I dustry experts. That “waiver” you mention might as well be the word “waiver” written on a piece of kleenex.
- Theshow - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 9:44 pm:
If the waivers don’t cover the districts, tort immunity is a nice warm blanket (willful and wanton negligence when you can’t prove causation is a pretty high bar). The point was we are all better off with these kids in organized sports than swapping spit with 15 friends in a basement. The idea that you’re going to get these kids to sit at home when they have minimal personal risk is not reality. The spiking numbers prove it out.
- Suburban Mom - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 9:46 pm:
Hey, you know what kids are suffering a lot more than kids who play high school sports? Disabled and medically fragile kids who aren’t receiving services and/or cannot attend school in person because it isn’t safe.
But please, tell me again how the GOP is the “party of life” that is “standing up for society’s most marginalized members” … apparently the high-achieving athletes are our most marginalized members, silly me. I thought disabled children would be high on the list, but it turns out, NOPE, they don’t even appear on the list.
What about those children? High school sports are more important than disabled children? “It’s unfortunate, but some kids are going to lose out” — okay, but why are you choosing the disabled children not getting necessary services as the ones to lose out, rather than high-performing athletes who can attend school remotely without a problem? 16% of Illinois students have IEPs, and virtually none of them are receiving the full amount of their legally-mandated services, because school can’t be in-person.
Why are high school sports more important than those children? Why do you completely forget the disabled exist, or decide they matter less than athletes?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 9:51 pm:
===… willful and wanton negligence when you can’t prove causation is a pretty high bar…===
… and yet, when programs like today, the University of Wisconsin Football program shuts down, you think when a school’s basketball team can’t play because of positive tests, games played in defiance of a state order, no tort lawyer will pounce?
That high bar is now a stick on the ground for teams with multiple positives(?)
- Theshow - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 9:55 pm:
What percentage of the $10,000 cap on school district liability if the case is not dismissed outright by statute does that tort lawyer get?
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 9:56 pm:
To update 2,
=== Defying the state’s public health guidance opens schools up to liability and other ramifications that may negatively impact school communities.===
Yeah. Lawyers. Liability.
I don’t think the IHSA is gonna be a help in any of that.
- Oswego Willy - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 9:57 pm:
- Theshow -
I’d check “Update 2”
- ArchPundit - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 10:07 pm:
I’m not sure if it is universal, but let’s talk about what is happening at some of the Big-10 schools for athletes. Those that get the virus are then put on a nearly 2 month period of monitoring for stress tests on their hearts. This is because even asymptomatic athletes have shown at least temporary heart damage after having Covid-19.
Is the IHSA going to do that for teens who are 1-4 years off in age? If not, stop comparing it to college or pro sports.
We don’t understand the extent of the damage this virus does to even people who appear healthy after having it. You may be condemning a probably small number of young people to permanent health damage and then even more if they go back to athletics without appropriate monitoring.
Back in September 1/3 of Big 10 Football players who had contracted Covid-19 developed myocarditis. That probably has fallen since then as we are doing better monitoring and understanding the disease, but if it not a trivial number who have developed it.
- Theshow - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 10:13 pm:
==opens schools up to liability==
Point ceded. At $10,000 per incident, if the plaintiff can prove causation and willful and wanton neglect… I personally don’t see the lawyers lining up for that, but they line up at the court house (or used to) to fight traffic tickets at $100 a pop so who knows…
- Still Waiting - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 10:15 pm:
I eagerly await IHSA’s announcement that they will pay for all Covid testing for Illinois student athletes multiple times a week. Surely their profit sharing from the insurance program they endorse (after getting the requirement passed into law) could be 100% donated to the effort with complete financial transparency, just like school districts are required to provide. Show us the money, IHSA.
- Pundent - Wednesday, Oct 28, 20 @ 10:26 pm:
= I personally don’t see the lawyers lining up for that=
You don’t think there’s another Thomas DeVore lurking out there? And you still have to absorb the cost of defending the suit. Tell that to the local property tax payers.
- PMS - Thursday, Oct 29, 20 @ 8:33 am:
I have a couple first hand experiences. Son plays football in the WIAC conference - testing the athletes would cost each school over $700k. None of the schools had it and they will not have a fall or spring season. Son got covid early in the semester, no symptoms, his roommate had it so he had to mandatory test. He still can’t fully practice, NCAA protocols have him gradually adding minutes to his daily supervised workouts. Today he gets 30 minutes of practice. The team Dr, not the trainer, is who signs off on him daily. High schools do not have the money to do this.
- ArchPundit - Thursday, Oct 29, 20 @ 10:32 am:
===I have a couple first hand experiences. Son plays football in the WIAC conference - testing the athletes would cost each school over $700k
PMS–thanks for posting–are they doing stress tests on your son? Just curious–what you describes seem prudent. Even if it’s overkill, I’m not sure I want to put a college student’s health on the line for a football game.
- PMS - Thursday, Oct 29, 20 @ 3:09 pm:
No stress test, now I want to know why. As and aside, their practice was cancelled today, coaches and half the team have covid (he said half, I have nothing to back that up with)