The implausible “New Illlinois”
Wednesday, Sep 4, 2024 - Posted by Isabel Miller
* Center Square…
Illinois Separation revealed that seven counties will vote on separating from Cook County and forming a new state.
Spokesman Eric Ivers, a member of the Jersey County Board, said he is confident that a vast majority of residents will vote to form a new state. […]
Iroquois County will be the first county to vote on the issue that is not more southerly than Peoria, as the movement has been predominantly in the southern half of the state. The other counties putting the question on the ballot include Madison, Jersey, Clinton, Calhoun, Greene and Perry counties.
Ivers said the possibility that downstate Illinois could become a new state increased recently when Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer expressed openness to next year ending the ability of minorities to block Senate legislation using a filibuster. It’s conceivable that Democrats could trade statehood for Washington D.C. or Puerto Rico in return for statehood for downstate Illinois.
Emphasis added by me, lol.
* WGN…
Should Cook County, home to Chicago and sprawling suburbs, break away from Illinois to form a new state? Voters in several Illinois counties could encounter a striking question, similarly phrased, on their ballots this fall.
The vote, however, is non-binding and doesn’t ensure such a change would happen. Instead, it serves as a declaration from voters toward the possibility of splitting Cook County from the rest of Illinois. […]
As recently as last year, Illinois Attorney General Kwame Raoul submitted an opinion that would seemingly strike down the idea of not only Cook County, but any Illinois county separating from the state. The opinion stated that “any referendum on the issue of county secession would have no binding legal effect.”
Based on Article IV, Section 3, Clause 1 of the U.S. Constitution, in the hypothetical situation that Cook County would separate from Illinois, such a possibility would need approval from the Illinois General Assembly, Illinois governor, both houses of U.S. Congress and the President of the United States of America.
* Justia…
There are at least two constitutional questions that the U.S. Supreme Court has never answered that might bear on New Illinois effort:
- Can new states be validly created out of territories located entirely within existing states? Founding history and past practice (especially the additions of Kentucky and West Virginia) would suggest that the answer to this is yes, but some scholars (most elaborately Michael Paulsen) have pointed out that Article IV’s text and punctuation could easily be read to mean that while new states can be formed out of the territory formerly belonging to two or more states, a single state cannot be carved up into multiple ones.
- Would the people (or their representatives) of eachof the newly created states have to agree to the new arrangement, or would it be enough for the people (or legislature) of the State as a whole (as Illinois currently exists) to agree? In other words, when Article IV speaks of the need for the consent of the “States concerned,” does that mean (in the context of a single state that is being subdivided) only consent of the mother state (which is to be divided), or also of the newly created states? Are these newly defined states “States [that are] concerned” within the meaning of Article IV?
Thoughts?
- Oklahoma - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 9:58 am:
I am in favor of Iroquois, Madison, Jersey, Clinton, Calhoun, Greene and Perry Counties dissolving and forming a single county government to reduce waste, fraud, and abuse.
- walker - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:01 am:
Copperheads Arise!
- low level - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:05 am:
Eric has way too much time on his hands imo.
- Three Dimensional Checkers - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:05 am:
Ridiculous. Probably not worth taking seriously, but would Puerto Rican nationalists even want statehood? Reminds me of Brexit.
- Michelle Flaherty - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:06 am:
–It’s conceivable that Democrats could trade statehood for Washington D.C. or Puerto Rico in return for statehood for downstate Illinois.–
No, it’s not.
If for no other reason than the alt-right Mary Miller’s of Congress who would want this would never vote for it because, a: they don’t for FOR anything; and b: if they did they’d be on record as supporting DC and Puerto Rico statehood, which would likely get them primaried and voted out of office in their new state they didn’t support creating.
Also, per the constitution, creating a state out of an existing state requires Congressional approval AND the approval of that state legislature.
Article IV, Section 3, Clause 1:
New States may be admitted by the Congress into this Union; but no new State shall be formed or erected within the Jurisdiction of any other State; nor any State be formed by the Junction of two or more States, or Parts of States, without the Consent of the Legislatures of the States concerned as well as of the Congress.
Have fun putting that roll call together.
Call me when the shuttle lands.
- Dragnet - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:07 am:
Special intense kind of stupid for so many reasons- can’t begin to take these people seriously.
- Siualum - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:14 am:
Sounds like the perfect legal gig for Devore.
- Dupage - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:14 am:
A few years back part of Cook County wanted to become part of DuPage County. After finding out they would have to pay higher taxes in DuPage County, the idea sort of disappeared. The same sort of thing might happen to the “new state” ideas.
- Larry Bowa Jr. - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:15 am:
Go for it. As someone who will never go back there it would be fun to see these rural counties try to run on austerity budgets based entirely on what their own decrepit economies produce.
- @misterjayem - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:16 am:
“Democrats could trade statehood for Washington D.C. or Puerto Rico in return for statehood for downstate Illinois”
A
Statehood for D.C. *AND* Puerto Rico plus merge the Dakotas (a total pop. of 1.7 million, i.e. 31% Cook County), and then we’ll talk.
– MrJM
- H-W - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:18 am:
Virtue signalling at it’s apex - the segregationist “we hate people who differ from us” virtue. It is no coincidence that this movement is arising in those places that advocated for introducing slavery into the Illinois Constitution in 1821, after Missouri was admitted as a slave state. In 1821 or so, these same counties supported the call for a constitutional convention to change the three-year old Constitution of Illinois. Today, they want to secede, rather than grow up.
I hope most residents of these counties will stand up again, and reject the same hate that wanted to reintroduce slavery into Illinois.
- Sox Fan - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:19 am:
I realize this will never happen but the question that never gets brought up is: wouldn’t other counties outside of cook (namely the collars) align with the new state of cook county vs the new downstate “state”? Downstate Illinois would become one of the poorest states in the nation with little chance of building a competent tax base.
- Mason County - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:26 am:
There is no doubt that Illinois has become at least two or maybe three states in terms of outlook and ideology. Things change over a period of time and it is important for the naysayers to recognize this whether they like it or not.
Having said that, the proponents of this move had better provide a detailed plan as to who this would work. If not they are just rattling the cage for no good effect.
- Grandson of Man - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:28 am:
“such a possibility would need approval from the Illinois General Assembly, Illinois governor”
The super-minority will dictate nothing to nobody. They don’t like Illinois? then leave. Go be a tax burden in another state and benefit disproportionally from government spending while screaming socialism at Democrats.
- Steve - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:30 am:
It’s doubtful D.C. can be a state. The land, I believe , would revert back to Maryland.
- John - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:33 am:
The Center Square isn’t even trying to be a credible news outlet anymore.
- Flyin'Elvis'-Utah Chapter - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:36 am:
My thoughts are the sheep was ordained to be shorn.
- Person 8 - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:36 am:
In other new, each borough of New York will also apply for statehood to give the Dems more seats in the senate.
Oh and did I mention that Chicago will split into 50 smaller states as well. 3 electoral votes each!
- Route 50 Corridor - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:37 am:
I just hope those people that get $.84 for every dollar in taxes they pay to the state never decide that this is a good idea. Because the people here would have a hard time making up that $2 we get back for every dollar we pay.
- A - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:37 am:
Self reliance is a good thing. In this case, however, it would be a death wish.
- Baloneymous - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:40 am:
===There is no doubt that Illinois has become at least two or maybe three states in terms of outlook and ideology.===
Name a time in Illinois’ history when the entire state was ever aligned as just “one state” the way you seem to think it was?
- Vote Quimby - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:40 am:
It’s almost like some politicians are in it just for the show and not to accomplish anything /s?
- Garfield Ridge Guy - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:41 am:
If it’s true that the places that want to secede get more than they pay in, shouldn’t the people who live in the places that pay more than they get back be celebrating this? If those people aren’t celebrating, then it doesn’t seem likely that the seceding-area-people truly get more than they pay for.
Secession is not going to happen, but let’s call spades spades.
- hisgirlfriday - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:43 am:
The non-Cook County Illinois vote in 2020 went for Trump over Biden by less than 15,000 votes (way less than the # of 3rd party votes in those 101 counties).
You sure this New Illinois is the utopia you seek, Jersey County fella?
- fs - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:45 am:
== plus merge the Dakotas (a total pop. of 1.7 million, i.e. 31% Cook County), and then we’ll talk.==
While we’re doing States that are perceived as basically the same by a lot of people and less population than Cook County, let’s go ahead and also merge Maine, New Hampshire, and Vermont as well. And Connecticut should just absorb Rhode Island.
- Grimlock - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:47 am:
I assume that should the New Republic of Free Illinois actually come to fruition, they would then sue the city of Chicago for alimony.
- SOIL M - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:48 am:
It is conceivable that this could actually happen. It is also conceivable that they will all sprout wings out of their backside and fly home too. And there is about an equal chance of both happening.
Stop wasting time on useless distractions that will never actually happen.
- Nitemayor - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:49 am:
New Illinois equals economic disaster. Has anybody addressed what happens to the current bond debt? Who is on the hook to pay it back? Add that to the drastic reduction in tax revenue equals a tax increase of monumental proportions. Calhoun county can kiss their new bridge good bye.
- Socially DIstant watcher - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:54 am:
@Garfield Ridge: or maybe nobody serious takes this idea seriously.
That’s the true spade in this deck.
- Pundent - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:01 am:
So they’re taking the money they receive from Chicago and the surrounding counties and wasting it on a referendum that will go nowhere?
- Mason County - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:03 am:
‘ Baloneymous - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 10:40 am:
===There is no doubt that Illinois has become at least two or maybe three states in terms of outlook and ideology.===
Name a time in Illinois’ history when the entire state was ever aligned as just “one state” the way you seem to think it was?
A Deflection. Things can change and nothing is permanent
And never has it been more divided. If you do not know that you have not been paying much attention. Besides,
- Northsider - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:06 am:
A whole lot of nothing from a nobody nobody sent.
- James - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:06 am:
While this concept is easily mocked, it strikes me that there is never a willingness or desire to attempt to understand why rural Illinoisans would like a divorce. On the national scale, this mocking by the Urban political “left” of the conservative rural “right” has led to the rise of Trump, Bailey, etc etc. So while these movements may be silly in practice, they reflect a deeper discontent that drives the political polarization in this state and our country.
- Aaron B - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:12 am:
I added up the populations of all the counties highlighted on the redstatesecession site and surprisingly that new state wouldn’t be the smallest state since Madison County is in that list. It would be the 5th smallest state. I’m kinda disappointed in that succession site actually, their tag line is “Preserving the American parts of America”. I thought for sure they would say the quiet part even more out loud.
- Baloneymous - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:14 am:
===And never has it been more divided. If you do not know that you have not been paying much attention.===
yes I pay attention. and the entire country is divided. so civil war time?
- Pundent - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:15 am:
=And never has it been more divided.=
Things were pretty divided in the 1860’s. It would take another 60 years for the 19th amendment and another 40 for the Civil Rights Act to pass.
Of course we didn’t have Fox News back then.
- low level - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:15 am:
==And never has it been more divided. If you do not know that you have not been paying much attention.==
You are the one not paying attention. There used to be Chicago, Suburbs and Downstate with each having different voting patterns. Now the suburbs are closely aligned w the city and downstate is on its own. This reality is reflected in the makeup of both houses of the legislature and has existed for the past 20 years or so.
- DougChicago - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:15 am:
West Virginia and Mississippi are hoping this happens. The New Illinois will displace them as the most impoverished state in the nation
- Homebody - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:17 am:
How about we just give some border counties to Indiana, and we’ll take NWI in return?
- low level - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:23 am:
What is beyond dispute in so called “conservatives” doing more complaining than ever before. If you dont recognize that, you aren’t paying attention.
- Rabid - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:31 am:
Oh goodness another new state flag
- @misterjayem - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:32 am:
“If those people aren’t celebrating, then it doesn’t seem likely that the seceding-area-people truly get more than they pay for.”
Accounting tip: If the accounting vibes don’t match with the accounting math, trust the math.
– MrJM
- Jerry - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:34 am:
I think the prison inmates downstate should be counted as Cook County citizens for tax purposes and the revenue generated goes to Old Illinois and the expenses stay in New Illinois. Thats a part of secession.
- Rudy’s teeth - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:37 am:
Surely central and southern Indiana would welcome folks from Illinois who want to leave the state. Mike Pence is waiting with open arms.
Let’s add NWI to Illinois as so many identify with the Chicago area. Also, lots of industry and jobs in NWI to add opportunities for residents.
- DuPage Saint - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:41 am:
Everyone please reread Rich’s comments yesterday about where state money goes. Therefore as a collar county resident let them go. Please let them go
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:42 am:
===The non-Cook County Illinois vote in 2020 went for Trump over Biden by less than 15,000 votes===
I did the math, it’s actually about 143,000
- Rich Miller - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:48 am:
=== On the national scale, this mocking by the Urban political “left” of the conservative rural “right”===
Most of what I see are rural people calling cities hellholes. For instance, Darren Bailey’s entire campaign.
I don’t think urban people give rural folks much of a thought. Out of sight, out of mind.
- JoanP - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:52 am:
= It’s conceivable that Democrats could trade statehood for Washington D.C. or Puerto Rico in return for statehood for downstate Illinois. =
I want what he’s smoking.
- Bruce( no not him) - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:55 am:
My small rural county has not joined this movement yet. I expect it might in a few more years.
I wonder if my little 3 acre patch can then secede from New Illinois and go back to Old Illinois?
- JS Mill - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 11:57 am:
=b: if they did they’d be on record as supporting DC and Puerto Rico statehood, which would likely get them primaried and voted out of office in their new state =
In the spirit of the New America people I am a pointing myself Consul (in the Roman sense) to solve this issue.
1. The following states will become one state: Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, Nebraska, both Dakotas and Iowa along with the Illinois counties that wish to secede.
2 Vermont and New Hampshire will become one state.
3. Washington D.C and Puerto Rico will each become a state.
4. The counties seceding from Illinois will each take with them a 1/102nd share of the state debt. Roughly $2 billion per county. That will need to be paid in full ahead of separation, than you.
Final offer.
- lake county democrat - Wednesday, Sep 4, 24 @ 12:03 pm:
I’d be willing to trade statehood for D.C. for the State of Jefferson (upper California/lower Oregon). Congress long ago said Puerto Rico gets to decide to be a state - the GOP may regret or turn their back on that now, but until explicitly reversed that’s the offer.