31 Comments - DOWNSTATE - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 7:43 am: Just one more of Blago’s bunch that feels violating the law is o.k.. - Gregor - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 7:56 am: I think you want to try to come as close to breaking even as you can, but this has never been, was never supposed to be, a paying proposition, at least in Springfield. As has been said, it’s something the state supports to provide a benefit to the citizens, to support and nurture agriculture, etc. DuQuoin is a more complicated question. I don’t know any other state that runs two independant state fairs. DuQuoin was a private for-profit venture that went bankrupt. Under Thompson’s administration the state bought it and took it over as a way to generate jobs and tourism money in a very very destitute area of the state that didn’t have much else going for it. This strategy was by and large successful. The next question might be, can that fair be re-privatized, put on a self-supporting basis, and still fulfill it’s tourism function there? - zatoichi - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 8:23 am: The Fair is a pretty good, inexpensive deal for everyone. As a city kid it was my first exposure to rural stuff. Should it be a money maker like the law says? Apparently the State Fair is about a $4M loss every year. Seems to be cheap PR for Illinois products. The Fair seems to be the exact same event year after year, except to see what food product will be the new heart attack, fried bomb. I have no idea what it costs to have a booth, sponsor a tent, or bring in an act. Raising prices may cover the loss but drop attendance. Corporate sponsorship seems a likely way to go. “Wal-Mart Presents - The 2007 Illinois State Fair” would make the Chicago alderman really happy. In the end this seems like a drop in the bucket. If Illinois can drop almost $500,000 on some tollway signs for Rod’s name, spending this money on the Fair is nothing. - Anonymous - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 8:54 am: Two state fairs is excessive. Du Quoin probably doesn’t attract much non-tax money from outside Southern Illinois, especially compared to the amount of money sent out of the area for gas. Why is the state involved in what is really a regional fair? There are far better ways to help Southern Illinois. If the state owns Du Quoin fairgrounds, it’s time to sell it off and let someone else try to make a profit. Clearly, more should be done to reduce the losses, especially since Springfield already benefits from the tourism. For example, charging more for vendors would better tap all the volunteers, vendors, and staff who get free admission and parking. Restricting the admission of food and drink would improve vendor sales. A lot of parking revenue is lost to neighbors who charge for parking on their lawn, which is apparently legal, or at least not enforced. To prevent entrance prices from rising, some way of selling cheap $1 event tickets (probably at the gate) would help cover the costs of bigger entertainment shows and DNR’s special area that are currently free. For really big fundraising, perhaps lottery-type games could be offered in various state agency tents? - Larry Mullholland - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 9:03 am: It appears that the loss numbers do not account for tax revenues as a result of the State Fair. The taxes from hotel and gas & sales taxes I would guess are in excess of 4 mil. This does not take into account any payroll or income taxes as well. - ButterCow - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 9:04 am: The fair sucks - Sporty41 - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 9:12 am: A couple of quick questions: Have the fairs made money? It has always been my impression that Springfield did ok, but DuQuoin was always a budget buster. - Thelma - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 9:19 am: I agree with Gregor, it should come as close to breaking even as possible, but the fair, to my knowledge, has never been about making a profit. (although it would certainly be nice if it would) I’d be interested to know how other Midwest State Fairs compare profit-wise. As to the DuQuoin Fair, while it may have been well intentioned, perhaps privatize the fair? Sell it off? Can that be done without severe econimic hardship to that area? All that said, $9.2 Million in the red seems excessive. Right now the state dollar focus should be on balancing the budget and funding the pension. My understanding is the only state that has a more underfunded pension than IL is W.VA., according to MSNBC.com. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13306633/ - 105th Blues - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 9:21 am: It’s the “state fair” for pete’s sake. You go with your family to eat snowcones and taffy and other types of unhealthy foods all day and look at exhibits like the butter cow and get little free trinkets and have your kid feed the fish over at Conservation World. I don’t think anyone expects or thinks of it as a business and it is one of the few things left that is actually nice and for the public to enjoy. Leave it alone please, I like my fair. - Ty - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 9:36 am: State fairs are nice, but why do we need to spend $9 million to showcase Illinois to its own residents? - VanillaMan - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 9:50 am: I love the fair. As a city kid, it was an opportunity to see agriculture at his best. But both Fairs need to go. They need to be sold to Disney, or Six Flags, or an operation in Las Vegas that knows how to do this right. I bet if Disney ran the show, the Fair wouldn’t be open only two weeks. It would have an incredible 19th Century Small Town theme. It would be clean. It would be Disney’s State Fair and offer visitors a learning experience, a family-friendly atmosphere, and make Springfield a place to vacation. You combime Disney and Lincoln, and you will get an exciting combo that will draw crowds. Instead, we have a state agency that simply goes through the motion. We have trough urinals, greasy crap food and ginzu knife salesmen. We have Walmart shoppers pushing sweaty kids through dust. We have aged hair bands performing 1970 hit singles at night. Today’s Fair is more flea market than it is Mayberry. It provides a diversion for the state agency worker’s families for two weeks, and then they lock it up again and go back to sleep until next year. Illinois needs to either do it right, or shut them down. - TomD - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 10:03 am: One State Fair is plenty. It ought to run very close to a break-even proposition — that is, a loss of not more than than $500,000. - Anonymous - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 10:08 am: Just because you don’t like the lower class Wal-Mart (and rural ag) atmosphere, doesn’t mean the fair isn’t worth keeping…it still attracts millions. Doing it right means breaking even, which can be done in Sprinfield by tweaking it, not costly and risky Disneyland overhauls. Opening a casino during the fair would certainly solve the funding issue and attract a lot more tourists. - NW burbs - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 10:27 am: …There are plenty of examples of fairs and festivals which pay their own way. Frontier Days in Arlington Heights pays its own way (including paying musical acts) — even has money left over to pay for police work during parades and donate some cash to local organizations. It’s just a question of whether or not it’s run like a business (or even non-profit) or a state agency. - Anon - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 10:28 am: I don’t know about the DuQuoin Fair, but the Illinois State Fair in Springfield has only run a profit one or two years in recent history — around 2003 and 2004, if my memory is right. Unfortunately for the Fair, the guy (Mark Kolaz) who managed to run it without busting the budget was promoted by Blago to a Governor’s Office position… Personal opinion here — Shut down or sell off DuQuoin, but hold onto the one in the capitol, just make sure you actually COLLECT the entrance fees, vendor fees, etc. Even if the Fair runs a couple (read maybe 5 at most) million in the hole, the tourism dollars created and the tax revenues involved will make up for the deficit easily in the long run. And regardless, having a State Fair is one of the more effective ways for the entire State of Illinois to come together, have a good time, and forget about how corrupt Chicago and Downstate pols are. But that’s just my opinion… - Truthful James - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 10:28 am: We should be seeing an increase in Fair attendance from the tourists who come to see the new Lincoln Museum, provided they are marketed together. There is not but should be a link, timing wise, with the County Fairs, with the winning Ag exhibits being put in competition in Springfield. Compared with Wisconsin, ours has a heckuva smaller marketing campaign, but they can drag people from the Chicago Metro region to go to Milwaukee. Then there is the problem with the tropical Springfield summer. It could be pushed back to Labor Day weekend at least. But what’s Fair is Fair. - leigh - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 10:50 am: The DuQuoin state fair should definetly stay. We live in the Chicago area and go to the DuQuoin fair, not the one in Springfield. We prefer it for many reasons including its location. I would love to see the budget and how much is spent on promoting office holders. - BBishere2 - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 10:54 am: No reason that the fairs can’t be ran to break even or make some profit - doesn’t have to be a lot, but should more than pay for itself. This can happen and still be enjoyable to go to - more enjoyable to go to a fair that’s profitable than to go to one and wonder how much taxes will be raised to pay for it. You people out there that seem to think it’s ok that here’s yet another state (read that funded out of your pocket) project that isn’t paying for itself need to wake up. Privately ran companies do not exist that keep running in the red year after year, they close. Why then is it ok for the government to keep running in the red year after year? At least those private companies are running out of their own money - not just losing tax dollars that comes out of yours and my pockets from our work efforts. Add things like this to all of the other spending and you soon see why our state budget of billions of dollars keeps on climbing upwards. - One Man Can Make A Difference - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 11:16 am: This should be a chance to showcase Illinois within reasonable spending limits. - Reddbyrd - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 11:33 am: Wait…Don’t tell all the downstate hand wringers that the state is spending (and losing)money outside Chicago. It will harm the myth. Now Judy Bore will attack GRod for the fairs and promise to lose more when she and the Brickhead take over. - anon - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 11:41 am: The GA just spent $800 million on pork projects in the last session. Surely we can spent $4-5 million per year on an event that attracts so many people and provides learning skills for our youth. Its a double edge sword - charge too much and no one will show up charge too little and the fair looses money. I think they have a good balance right now. - Smitty Irving - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 11:54 am: The notion that the State Fair should “make” money was dreamed up under Edgar so his pal Bud Hall would be removed from the direct oversight of the Appropriations Committees - nothing more, nothing less. It will never make money, nor should it. It is about showing off Illinois agriculture. - Denby - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 11:54 am: >>Surely we can spent $4-5 million per year on an event that attracts so many people and provides learning skills for our youth. - Jon Musgrave - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 12:10 pm: Before you jump on whether the state fairs make or lose money, it’s important to figure out if we’re talking about the fairs themselves, or the overall annual operation of the fairgrounds. Under Edgar the DuQuoin State Fair actually broke even and may have made some money. When former fair manager Ron Summers, R-Thompsonville, ran for state senate two years ago, he was blamed for “lying” about how the fair broke even, when in “fact” it lost money. Actually, he and Edgar were correct in their statement that the 10-day fair had broke even. It was the only when you took the two weeks of fair revenues and put them against 52 weeks of operating the overall fairgrounds that they lost money. Obviously, what’s needed is more year-round use of the fairgrounds. How we get there is the issue. To say that we should close the fairgrounds because they lose money means that we should also shut down the state parks and historic sites because they lose money as well. What Illinois needs is a new agency (Illinois Park Service? HeritageIllinois?) that combines the fairgrounds, state parks, state historic sites, and the Illinois State Museum. (Let the Abraham Lincoln Presidential Library and Museum be on its own). Give the new agency the three-fold focus of preserving, developing and enhancing: 1) the state’s natural resources (traditionally our state parks); 2) the state’s cultural resources (historic sites/state museum/state fairs); and, 3) the state’s recreational assets (state parks/state fairgrounds/shooting sports complex/trails). Sites need to charge where it makes sense (entrance into historic structures/fair admissions or parking fees/pavilion reservations) but keep free some things (Lincoln’s tomb/hiking and biking trails/picnicing). Two other points should also be made for the new agency: 1) Ongoing opportunities for public input must be made in developing and updating management plans for each and every site; and, 2) The agency must recognize and take into consideration the role of each site in its local economy and wherever possible and feasible should become a positive force in creating jobs for that economy. - Gregor - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 1:11 pm: That old saw about running government like a for-profit business, or indeed letting businesses run government, is utter nonsense and shows a poor understanding of the differences between the two. But back to the fairs. Both fairgrounds, SPI and DQ, do many other revenue-bringing things year-round. DQ recently built a new large indoor arena building that can be used for anything from trade shows and concerts to indoor motocross, year-round. A good thing; that will bring in tourism and tax money in an area that needs it badly. DuQuoin’s fairgrounds is absolutely lovely, a camping destination unto itself, but the infrastrucure there has been in decline for the better part of a decade now. The wooden parts of the classic buildings are rotting, the steel is rusting, and all they can afford to do is throw another coat of paint over it and pray for better the next year… This administration has not been kind to anything south of I-80, and they are running things on a shoestring down there. Perhaps a private entity could run the fair down there in a more stable manner, without the periodic disruptions of polical seasons. In DQ it’s all about the horses, with some smaller amount of attention paid to the test plot crops and ag equipment, but a LOT of that market has been taken away by the Farm Progress Show. DQ fair is a ghost town in the hot, sunny daylight, the horse races being the main draw. At night all the locals from a 50-mile radius come out to eat, drink and see the bands. That’s not ag-related. My issue about the Springfield fair is that is has, in my opinion, strayed too far from agriculture in an attempt to get more mainstream audience attendance and “pay it’’s own way”. What’s supposed to happen is the ag competitors from all the county fairs hold their run-off contests and the best of all of those come to Springfield to compete and display the state’s very best. That’s not really happening now. But all the promotions and advertising and news coverage of the fair seems to try and pretend all that stuff isn’t even there. The main streets are all full of obnoxious and tacky Maxwell-street type junk. Stuff you see at city weekend festivals like the old Lincolnfests. Most any fair entrance assails you with advertising for beer, for cell phones, buy a car,sign up to win a vacation trip, etc. and there is very little agriculture-themed anything there. What they push are food, beer tents, horse and car races, and the grandstand shows which are likely the biggest cash producers and money sinks at the same time. Disney-fying the State Fair would be a mistake and bad investment. It is not meant to be an amusement park. Forget the quibbles about the parking, that’s a drop in the bucket. When the financial success or failure of the whole 10 days depends on how many fans of second string country music and retro metal bands attend the grandstand, you have a problem. I’m not saying the bands are not fun, or that they all need to go, just that we’ve lost our focus on what the fair should be about. A lot of the stuff I’m objecting to came about directly from these efforts to make the fair “pay it’s own way” through corporate donors and sponsorships. You have two competing things trying to go on at the same time, and two competing audiences. No wonder it’s always such a challenge to run. Maybe what could happen is, hold the traditional state fair with more of an all-ag and family focus, in the usual time slot, with all the county fairs held before it, to really make it a championship event… with prize money that’s appropriate… … and hold a more Linconfest/Chicagofest kind of multi-day event out there that’s run stand-alone as a for-profit thing, with all the bread and circuses and commercial corporate whoring and etc… Attendance for that would generally come from a 50-mile radius. It used to be the train tracks came right to the grounds and people rode the trains down all the way from Chicago and up from St. Louis to attend. Now the only practical way to come down is a 3-4 hour car ride each way, which makes day trips impractical without a more expensive overnight stay. So I think you really can’t expect to pull people from further than Champaign an Bloomington to attend any more. Hold two events instead of one, with enough time between them so as not to compete, you might double attendance and double the revenue. Make the non-ag edition perhaps in late spring, when the weather is cooler. The August date is there solely for ag resons of cfrop and livestock maturation. The entertainment fair would have no such restrictions. Just don’t name it “Blagofest”, please. - Truthful James - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 1:19 pm: An internet policeman I am not, but this thread, with the exception of one reprobate has gotten contributions of light rather than heat. Thanks for bringing it up Rich. - NumbersGuy - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 1:35 pm: Looks like we’ve a passel (sp?) of revisionist historians on the blog today. Let’s correct a couple of the big whoppers. Smitty-Although ol’ Bud Hall did talk a lot about making money at the State Fair, rest assured he never escaped the oversight of the Approp Committee. I think some other oldsters around here will back me up. Secondly, he was far from the first to suggest that the fair(s) could be self-sustaining-this notion was tossed about quite a bit at the time Thompson decided to buy DuQuoin. “10:28 anon” notes that Mr. Kolaz was the first fair manager in recent years to turn a profit, in 2003 & 2004. Gen. Holland’s report seems to directly contradict that rosy scenario and Blago’s related comments. I also recall the “four consecutive years of 1 million plus attendance” which was subsequently shot out of the water by the J-R and its army of teenagers with clickers-was that the GRyan years? My point in rehashing all this back to Rich’s opening question is simply-I suspect it’s impossible to have one, let alone two, profitable Illinois State Fairs and operate within our political and bureaucratic constraints. For me, the question then becomes, how much do we want to pay in subsidies to provide a “showcase” of limited value outside our borders to what is, I suspect, a declining core audience of attendees? - Anonymous - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 2:21 pm: There’s a huge difference between creating themed parks in Chicagoland and Springfield. One is far more viable than the other. Doesn’t the State Fair offer buses from the Amtrak station to some tourist sites and the fairgrounds? Perhaps state employees should be fired if they overspend the budget? - Budget Watcher - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 3:23 pm: I was anticipating a diatribe from Cassandra on why the $9 million deficit was the result of too many state fair workers and managers, earning too much money, driving too many golf carts, and cheating the fair thru non-enforcement of parking requirements. She kinda let me down. - So IL Gal - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 3:27 pm: Not only does the DuQuoin State Fair provide entertainment to the good folks in Southern Illinois, it provides jobs. Workforce development should be added to train students and work/school credit given to those who work during the fair. I would suggest that surrounding towns and villages be given free (or reasonably priced) space to promote their communities. More attention should be given to the seniors, who faithfully attend and spend their dollars. The Illinois Main Street program should partner with Tourism to promote to other Main Street towns throughout Illinois and the central United States. Dang it, the question! I think we should expect a reasonable profit. I believe the DuQuoin State Fair is a valuable asset to the State of Illinois. But can’t we figure out how to use this venue to promote sales of agriculture/livestock/biodiesal/community life to the rest of the world, not just the neighborhood? The fair needs to WORK FOR the people of Illinois. - Long Time Reader; First Time Poster - Thursday, Jun 22, 06 @ 11:42 pm: Wasn’t Blago quite proud of himself a year or two ago that the he made the state fair break even, and then talked about how wasteful George Ryan was? Am I crazy and remembering something that didn’t happen? Little help here. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.