45 Comments - Ducky LaMoore - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 9:50 am: ===Or maybe at the Illinois Policy Institute, which has a new “right to work” poster boy who complains about alleged minority and female preferences?=== Wow. Just wow. - Spliff - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 9:50 am: Clearly teacher pay and tenure are the problem here. If we spent less money on teachers that clearly don’t do their jobs then we would have more money for qualified high paid administrators at the State Board of Ed. which of course would solve all of our problems. - Anon - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 9:57 am: That percentage is worthless. Would be more telling to know the number of times a student can be suspended in one year before expulsion, and otherwise find an average number of those that are suspended multiple times. Showing half of a student population being suspended is misleading. Not a good trend, to be sure, but not really useful in seeing true percentages of kids that are suspended. - Anonymous - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 9:57 am: The raw number of suspensions is not an accurate metric for this purpose. Many of those suspensions may have been repeat “offenders” - buffalo bill - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 9:58 am: Rich has it upside-down here; Instead of thinking of the teachers how about the kids ? The current union dominated education system has utterly failed these students. And instead of criticizing the system - we get an attack on those looking for another way. These are exactly the the type of districts where parents are craving for the ability to choose which school to send their kids to and to be able to ask the schools to compete based on outcomes. - Rich Miller - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 9:58 am: ===Many of those suspensions may have been repeat “offenders” === Well, duh. But it doesn’t detract from my main point here. - Dance Band on the Titanic - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 9:58 am: Regarding the new IPI poster boy, he appears from the photo to at least be in his 40s. So after serving four years in the Marines directly out of high school, he was denied for union membership. He would have been in his early 20s at the time. Basically, IPI is highlighting a decision that happened well over two decades ago to make their point about policy today. Typical. - Anonymiss - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 9:58 am: So is IPI setting up recruitment tables at Trump rallies now? - Sue - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:00 am: Now if you could please do the same analysis for Chicago Public Schools, including the charter schools….that is, if you can pry the data out of their hands without them claiming that it’s “proprietary” information. And while you’re at it, please find out how a publicly-funded operation has any “proprietary” information. - Anon - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:04 am: ===But it doesn’t detract from my main point here.=== Don’t worry about that, Rich. 9:57 AM Anonymous was just throwing out the “It’s just a few bad apples” talking point to avoid getting too deep into the realization of what these data implies. - downstater - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:09 am: ESL, Venice, Madison & Cahokia are all neighboring districts in the Metro East. They’re all high crime, high poverty communities full of single (or no) parent homes. They’re also terrible school districts full of corruption. These numbers come as no surprise to me. - Sue - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:12 am: The CPS analysis - please break out the data school by school - not as a whole district. And…. Many of those suspensions may have been repeat “offenders”……. And what does THAT say about the school district? How may times do you have to suspend a kid to know that it’s not working and you need to try a different strategy? - illini - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:21 am: “That’s just mind-boggling.” Four of the five are metro-east districts. Eight years ago my cousins daughter ( honors graduate of SIUE ) accepted the challenge of teaching third grade in one of these districts knowing that racially she would be a minority. She was up to the challenge and had the strong support of the administrators. Yet it was taking its toll both mentally and physically. Now the students in Edwardsville will be fortunate to have an exceptional teacher. - Carhartt Representative - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:22 am: CPS has been pressuring schools to lower suspension numbers for 4-5 years. I think they’re probably extremely low. This isn’t a good thing because they haven’t replaced suspensions with anything else. One of CTU’s demands is to have somebody in charge of restorative justice with requisite training at every school. This person would be an administrator and not a part of the union. When CPS switched to a restorative justice model, it did so half way. Restorative justice seems like the best discipline system. It also seems like the most expensive, time consuming, and requiring the most training. In other words, probably doomed at CPS. I believe in most CPS schools, restorative justice means go hang out with the clerk for 15 minutes, then go back to class and say you’re sorry. I’m really not advocating for more suspensions, but a school has to replace them with something else. Replacing suspensions with pleading with the student to behave isn’t an acceptable solution. - Been There - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:27 am: I wish my nuns had to keep incident reports from every time they whacked me upside the head. My file would have been a foot thick. - ArchPundit - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:29 am: Pekin stands out as the odd duck in these five. The metro east districts have significant problems, but there are other districts in the Chicago area that deal with students without suspension as the default. However, Pekin? What the heck. - DeKalb Guy - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:31 am: From the CapFax Feb. 4 2015, [Rauner] is expected to call on unions with state contracts to include more minorities in their apprenticeship programs, and require work crews on taxpayer-funded construction projects to “reflect the diversity in the surrounding area,” according to a Rauner aide. The move has the political benefit of tweaking unions while also appealing to minority voters. - DeKalb Guy - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:32 am: As for the school suspension numbers, it is just mind blowing. How does anyone learn in those environments? - Reality Check - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:32 am: According to his bio, the author of the IPI piece previously worked at “Peak6 Investments in Chicago.” The CEO of Peak6 is Matthew Hulsizer who gave $2 million to Rauner’s Democratic stalking-horse PAC, IllinoisGO. Rauner himself has been, and according to his latest statement of economic interest remains, a partner at Peak6. “Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive.” (Side note: Hulsizer’s & Rauner’s Peak6 knows something of deception. It was fined by the SEC for illegal short-selling in 2013.) - Shoe Searer - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:36 am: What do teachers unions (or one’s anti view of them) have to do with this? If the point is that teachers in these situations are rather helpless, and normal evaluation methods are likely inapplicable, I would tend to agree. These communities have absolutely failed their youth, and to expect a teacher to have some transformative effect from 8-3 is comical. Teachers unions are still a problem, but irrelevant in these worst of the worst cases. - ArchPundit - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:37 am: Looking at the longer list I have a bit of an idea what is going on–districts that have faced significant demographic change in the last decade seem to be present. So it isn’t just poverty (though ESL is a case of that), but demographic change and the difficulty in managing that change. The central Illinois districts are fairly high and several of those are becoming more diverse and facing higher poverty rates. - Soccermom - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:42 am: Ugh. My mom taught in a public grade school in Rockford, and every single day one of her fellow teachers sent a child (the same child) out in the hall for the day. Every single day. I wonder how much he learned that year. (And ten points to the person who guesses that child’s race…) - Arizona Bob - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:43 am: I’ve always opposed out of school suspensions. it hurts more than it helps. Put the kids in the “Breakfast club” or increase public service requirements. Most high schools require at least 25 public service hours to graduate. Make these kids spend their Saturdays (starting at 7am) picking up trash along the roads for 8 hours instead of giving them a free day off. Or would that be stepping on some municipal union jurisdiction?LOL - Man with a plan - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 10:53 am: That IPI report is likely a complete lie. The Department of Labor prohibits racial preference/discrimination in apprenticeship programs. It’s not even a characteristic that is taken into the application process. This is just a case of “This guy at the bar said…” To quote Game of Thrones… Shame. - Arsenal - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:10 am: ==Instead of thinking of the teachers how about the kids ?== False dichotomy. Bad for the teachers is bad for the kids. ==And instead of criticizing the system - we get an attack on those looking for another way.== Yeah, ’cause “another way” isn’t good enough, we need a *better* one. The Rauner/IPI crew ain’t offering it. ==These are exactly the the type of districts where parents are craving for the ability to choose which school to send their kids to and to be able to ask the schools to compete based on outcomes.== These are the exact kind of districts craving better schools, full stop. - walker - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:15 am: Nothing like a reality-slap in the face. - Cps - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:15 am: In cps’ defense they do publish the suspension & expulsion data. It is on a spreadsheet on their website under the school data section. Also, when you search on the website under a specific school the suspension numbers are under the report section. - Apocalypse Now - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:22 am: Well, at least there is no racial bias in the suspensions. - Arizona Bob - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:31 am: @Arsenal ==Instead of thinking of the teachers how about the kids ?== False dichotomy. Bad for the teachers is bad for the kids.= Never taught, have you Arsenal? Getting disruptive influences out of the classroom makes the teachers’ job easier. They have to provide less discipline. Excluding the kids no doubt is bad for them. - Jocko - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:34 am: Steve’s complaints about Union Membership reminds me of Cruz/Rubio complaints about immigration. I enjoyed the line about the “freedom to negotiate”, as if tradesmen are MLB pitchers. Suspensions should drop once Public Act 099-0456 kicks in, but keep in mind high schoolers are fighting, distributing photos of underage girls, and coming to school under the influence. Do you want these kids coming back to class 24 hours later? - Carhartt Representative - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:35 am: I’m kind of at a loss on what this has to do with teacher’s unions. The decisions to suspend are made by non-union administration. I know of no school district where teachers have the authority to suspend. - Keyser Soze - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:39 am: What a world we live in. Expulsions that may have at one time listed in the dozens now are in the thousands. By the bye, while I’m not a fan of teacher’s unions, the failure of schools should not be laid on the (union) teachers, or the school district’s tax base. If there is a gross failure, it traces to the student’s homes. Gold plated schools and expensive teachers can’t educate kids whose families don’t give a whit. - Highland, IL - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:40 am: How many of these kids ended up in a “Safe School Program”? I know the Madison County ROE runs a program for expelled kids. I believe the districts pay for their students plus transportation costs. - Anon - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:45 am: I would be interested to know more about the kids being suspended in these districts vs. the kids managing NOT to be suspended. SOMETHING is working for at least SOME of the kids or, in reverse, something is causing some kids to fail badly while their classmates manage to succeed. Sad state of affairs to be sure. - Lil Squeezy - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 11:48 am: For you small town Sangamon county readers: Auburn: 52 out of school suspensions Rochester: 65 out of school suspensions Riverton: 182 out of school suspensions Ummm…… What’s going on in Riverton? - Educated in the Suburbs - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 12:28 pm: “How many of these kids ended up in a “Safe School Program”? I know the Madison County ROE runs a program for expelled kids. I believe the districts pay for their students plus transportation costs.” In Peoria County, the “safe school” (which serves all districts in the county) typically fills up by October or November. There simply isn’t adequate capacity for student needs. The funding isn’t there. - Amalia - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 12:40 pm: I think any school has higher stats than we might be accustomed to from our own childhoods. reason: parents are too permissive these days and often leave any sense of discipline to others. and then complain about their perfect children, how could that possibly have happened? a recent discussion with a college coach led to the amazing comment that many of the athletes have never heard anything other than “you are awesome and perfect.” and then the kids get crushed by criticism. there is no sense of discipline in lots of ways in lots of neighborhoods. kids think they rule. - Arsenal - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 1:05 pm: ==Never taught, have you Arsenal?== If you can’t make your point without blindly guessing at my background, you don’t have a point. A situation where the teacher has to decide between throwing a kid out of their classroom and teaching everyone is bad for both. Go ahead and whine about teachers’ unions again and make up some fanfic about me, but it won’t change the fact that students and teachers are inextricably linked, and the people who try to separate the two clearly aren’t helping either. - Educated in the Suburbs - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 1:32 pm: ” a recent discussion with a college coach led to the amazing comment that many of the athletes have never heard anything other than “you are awesome and perfect.” and then the kids get crushed by criticism. ” This complaint, if it is valid, appears to be about wealthy suburban districts sending lots of kids to colleges, and therefore not really applicable to any of the schools on this list. - Amalia - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 2:07 pm: The complaint is by a well recognized coach. it mirrors comments I have read of late in the press about how parents have often absented themselves from the realm of discipline. - Formerly Known As... - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 2:12 pm: ==They’re also terrible school districts full of corruption.== The same schools have likely been topping this list for years. smh - Anon - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 2:30 pm: It has been a while since I filled out these reports but schools used to report the number of students and the number of days the students were suspended; 1-3, 3-5, 5-10. I believe that suspension numbers reflect the total number of suspension days not the total number of students suspended. Even at this rate I would agree the number of students suspended around the state is too high. A majority of the students being suspended fall in the “other” instead of one of the delineated categories such as violence, weapons or drugs. I would be interested what infractions are getting these students an out of school suspension. I also find the number of expelled students who do not receive any educational opportunities troubling. The Regional Safe School Programs were developed to provide districts and parents an option for expelled students to continue to receive an education and return to their home district after the expulsion on-tract to graduate. Why this option is not being utilized by districts should be looked into. - Federalist - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 2:31 pm: Glad I don’t have to “teach” in many of the schools listed. Alternatives to suspension? Good question that needs real discussion. But it must be H E L L to be a teacher in these situations. And with the new pension laws they will have to do it until age 67. - @MisterJayEm - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 2:45 pm: “comments I have read of late in the press about how parents have often absented themselves from the realm of discipline.” Oh, well, in that case… – MrJM - Mama - Thursday, Dec 17, 15 @ 5:37 pm: If we still funded the Regional Safe School Program, there would be every few suspensions. I’m more concerned about why the student was suspended. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.