Buried numbers
Monday, May 9, 2016 - Posted by Rich Miller
* WaPo looks at that New York Times poll of Chicagoans that we discussed last week…
The new survey found a city that described race relations as generally bad, while majorities of all residents think there is some or a lot of discrimination against black and Hispanic residents. There is a sizable racial divide separating how people feel about certain issues like education, city services and the conditions of public facilities.
This gulf is particularly acute when it comes to how people perceive the police department. One in 3 residents said the city’s police officers are doing an excellent or good job. While nearly half of white residents (47 percent) and more than a third of Hispanic residents (37 percent) felt this way, just 12 percent of black residents echoed that opinion. When people from these three groups were asked whether police were doing an excellent, good, fair or poor job, the highest single response was from black residents, nearly half of whom answered “poor.” (Three out of 4 residents said they had not personally interacted with an officer within the past six months, and for most of those who had, they said their interactions were positive.)
* OK, but check out the poll itself…
What is the single biggest problem facing Chicago today? (INTERVIEWER: DO NOT PROBE IF GIVE A STRAIGHTFORWARD ANSWER, I.E. – “CRIME”) (DO NOT READ LIST. ENTER ONE ONLY) (IF RESPONDENT GIVES MORE THAN ONE RESPONSE, PROBE WITH: “I understand, which of those would you say is the biggest problem?)
The results…
“Crime/violence/gangs” vastly tops every other issue across every racial demographic. “Police/police shootings/community relations with police,” barely registers. They appear to be more upset at the cops for not protecting them from criminals than anything else.
* But, yes, Chicagoans also say the cops need to get their house in order…
And thinking about Eddie Johnson, Chicago’s new police superintendent, do you think it is more important for him to focus on (reducing crime) or (reforming the way the police department operates)? [INTERVIEWER NOTE: IF RESPONDENT SAYS “BOTH EQUALLY”, PROBE ONCE WITH “WE KNOW BOTH OF THESE THINGS ARE IMPORTANT, BUT IF YOU HAD TO CHOOSE ONE TO BE THE TOP PRIORITY…”] (rotate items in parentheses)
Results…
- AC - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 9:57 am:
Gangs and criminals benefit from the lack of community policing and a poor relationship between the police and the communities the protect. Reforming the police department would go a long way towards reducing crime, both are a different aspect of the same problem.
- wordslinger - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 9:57 am:
I doubt that there is a big city in the United States where Crime/Violence/Gangs would not be at the top of the list, despite the steady decline in crime over the last 20 years of so.
I can’t think of a likely candidate. I think it’s just a given in large, urban, high-density populations.
- Phil T - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 10:01 am:
I wonder what percentage of Chicagoans know the city’s annual murder count is almost half of what it was in the early 1990’s or that the city’s violent crime rate in 2014 was it’s lowest since 1966?
That doesn’t mean crime isn’t an issue — it is, especially in a handful of hard-hit neighborhoods. And even though crime has decreased in Chicago over time, it hasn’t decreased nearly as much as it has in cities like New York and LA.
Would be nice to have some context injected into the if-it-bleeds-it-ledes mindset.
- Formerly Known As... - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 10:05 am:
My eyes continue focusing on those Crime/violence/gangs numbers among Hispanics and Blacks in the poll.
That overshadows everything, particularly in a city where a fifty-eight-year-old man was killed this weekend by a stray bullet that came through the front door and hit him while sitting at his kitchen table.
Few, if any, American cities face the scope of a gang and violence problem on par with Chicago.
- Anonymous - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 10:19 am:
Rahm is responsible for the policing crisis. Because he opted to economize by operating a short staffed police department, there is a demoralized and overworked group of police patrolling the streets. Overtime is being used to cover the shortages in the department. Too many tired and stressed cops means more problems in the precincts.
- Rich Miller - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 10:20 am:
===opted to economize by operating a short staffed police department===
Chicago has more cops per capita than NY and LA (lots more than LA).
- Precinct Captain - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 10:21 am:
AC is right on the money.
Jill Leovy, author of Ghettoside, also said it really well, “too much of the wrong kind of policing, not enough of the policing we actually want in these neighborhoods.”
http://www.npr.org/2015/01/26/381589023/ghettoside-explores-why-murders-are-invisible-in-los-angeles
- crazybleedingheart - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 10:27 am:
Jobs, economy, budget, poverty, taxes, housing, blight are 7 different “money” categories.
Not how people think.
- crazybleedingheart - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 10:29 am:
==Chicago has more cops per capita than NY and LA (lots more than LA).==
Because we use sworn officers to do things other cities hire regular govt workers to do.
- crazybleedingheart - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 10:35 am:
As wordslinger said, everyone answers crime in cities. Local news definitely doesn’t spend 2/3 of airtime covering jobs, housing, and education. Still, 20% said money, including the mere 1% (poetic) who said taxes.
- Phil T - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 11:03 am:
@ Formerly known as said: “Few, if any, American cities face the scope of a gang and violence problem on par with Chicago”
Actually, Chicago’s crime rate doesn’t put it in the top 20 of most dangerous cities. The raw numbers are high because the population is high — and that’s what the media focuses on. But If you’re a resident of St. Louis, Indianapolis or Milwaukee, you are much more statistically likely to be a victim of violent crime than a resident of Chicago.
- Formerly Known As... - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 11:23 am:
==everyone answers crime in cities==
==Everyone== does not answer that question by the same margins, do they?
Hispanics and Blacks, who disproportionately live in the areas affected by this violence, say this is the top problem by nearly twice the margin as Whites in this poll. It is rarely Whites being shot by stray bullets while sitting in their own kitchens or playing at the park. The 63% of Blacks and 60% of Hispanics placing it as their top concern are reacting to more than just the ==local news==.
- just saying - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 12:00 pm:
L.A & NY both have other agencies doing police work. LA county police patrols large parts of LA. In New York the port authority and transit authority have large departments.
- crazybleedingheart - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 12:10 pm:
Yes, of course, FKA.
- Formerly Known As... - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 12:14 pm:
@crazybleedingheart - we are on the same page then.
- Formerly Known As... - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 12:16 pm:
@Phil T - The gang and violence issue is not the same as the raw crime numbers or per capita crime rate.
The Chicago Crime Commission and former CPD Superintendent Jody Weis explain this in the CCC Gang Book. Chicago has more gang members than any other city.
- Anonymous - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 12:18 pm:
What’s really changed in Chicago is the DISTRIBUTION of crime in the city. It’s far more concentrated in neighborhoods like Englewood now.
Also remember that back then the CHA projects still had a lot residents, and those were gang and shooting hotbeds. It was often made worse when one major project was closed and the residents were moved to another project where a different gang ruled. Eventually Daley transferred this “problem” out of the city through scattered site housing and Section 8, which moved much of the problem to the suburbs.
In the early 2000s I worked in the “make ready” program for CHA for the relocation of residents. I saw open air drug setups in courtyards that looked like crack and smoke flea markets. CPD and CHA cops knew about them, but for whatever reason (bribes, politics or fear) just let it go on.
- IRLJ - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 12:31 pm:
Surveys are fun but suspect, of course, and I’m not a sociologist, but public perception of Chicago you know is bad when you have a cousin in New York who makes snarky comments about relative crime rates in the two cities. Fact is, this is a complex matter.
- Anon E. Mouse - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 12:32 pm:
I am not sure what the relevance of the police numbers from Los Angeles and New York is. Many Chicagoans know that their police department has had a reduction in the number of law enforcement officers which has coincided with the rise in murders, shootings and street violence. Many would prefer more police officers as opposed to a presidential library, a Star Wars museum or a basketball arena for the DePaul Blue Demons.
- Payback - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 1:43 pm:
“…thinking about Eddie Johnson, Chicago’s new police superintendent, do you think it is more important for him to focus on (reducing crime) or (reforming the way the police department operates)?”
The Chicago Police Board held public hearings and interviewed candidates, then Mayor Emanuel canned the Boards’ recommendation for top cop. Emanuel shows that he is in thrall to the police bureaucracy and has no respect for the people of
Chicago by disregarding the selection process.
Setting up a question about whether the new top cop should focus on reducing crime or “reforming” the C.P.D. is an attempt to draw attention away from police criminality. As if taxpayers should accept police committing crimes against citizens, or they have to accept higher crime rates. Once again the old threat that police will not do their jobs if the citizens complain about them breaking the law.
- Tone - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 2:04 pm:
“Many would prefer more police officers as opposed to a presidential library, a Star Wars museum or a basketball arena for the DePaul Blue Demons.”
And many are complete morons. The things you listed have nothing to do with CPD funding.
- Formerly Known As... - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 2:32 pm:
==The things you listed have nothing to do with CPD funding.==
To be fair, all of it is paid through one source: tax dollars.
If someone overspends buying a new television but doesn’t have money to pay the electric bill, they probably should have bought a cheaper television or repaired the old set. Instead, they are left with a new television - or stadium or museum - wondering why they can’t afford other things like the light bill or more police. It is all part of one larger budget picture.
- frisbee - Monday, May 9, 16 @ 3:36 pm:
====Gangs and criminals benefit from the lack of community policing and a poor relationship between the police and the communities the protect.====
Gangs and criminals also benefit from illegal markets, especially drug markets. Just like Al Capone benefited from illegal alcohol, the current gangs are benefiting from illegal drugs, illegal prostitution and other activities that if legalized would take the criminal element out of the industry and significantly reduce violence. How many bartenders are being shot/killed every weekend fighting over tips or turf? Pharmacists? Lottery sales clerks? Of course if there were some other economic outlets in some of the most troubled neighborhoods the illegal trades wouldn’t be as appealing but when it comes down to it a minimum wage job in fast food, at a currency exchange or big box store just isn’t going to cut it.