Capitol - Your Illinois News Radar » New York vs. Chicago on guns
SUBSCRIBE to Capitol Fax      Advertise Here      About     Exclusive Subscriber Content     Updated Posts    Contact Rich Miller
To subscribe to Capitol Fax, click here.
New York vs. Chicago on guns

Monday, May 30, 2016 - Posted by Rich Miller

* New York Times

The homicide rate in Chicago is just a little higher than in New York when guns aren’t involved. But when it comes to shootings, both fatal and not, Chicago stands out, suggesting a level of armed interaction that isn’t happening in New York.

…And Chicago is more lenient about illegal handguns than New York, prescribing a one-year minimum for possession versus three and a half years in New York. An attempt to match the New York law in 2013 was rejected by the Illinois legislature out of concern for skyrocketing incarceration rates for young black men.

The whole thing is worth a read.


  1. - Truthteller - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 12:21 pm:

    The article points out that NYC has more cops per capita. As I recall, Emanuel made a big deal out of cutting positions from the CPD budget early in his administration. Perhaps not such a wise move on his part. NYC has higher taxes and a lower murder rate. What’s better? The NY way or the Chicago way

  2. - DuPage - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 12:35 pm:

    Don’t toughen the laws against carrying illegal guns because of concern about people being locked up for carrying illegal guns? Insane!

  3. - Hit or Miss - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 12:37 pm:

    If you read the whole article you find that the words “concealed carry” do not appear. Proponents of concealed carry have given crime reduction as one of the main reasons they back the concept. The current increase in deaths using guns started about the time concealed carry started in Illinois. Concealed carry certainly did not cause the increase in gun deaths but one needs to ask why it did not stop or reduce the killings. Has concealed carry failed it promise to the citizens of Chicago?

  4. - Liberty - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 12:42 pm:

    So FOID cards don’t keep illegal guns out of the hands of criminals. I’m shocked.

  5. - Anon - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 12:45 pm:

    The end of the article points out the basic reason for the difference between Chicago and New York - Chicago’s problem with segregation and extreme pockets of poverty:

    But segregation in New York is nothing like in Chicago: The perfectly isolated neighborhood – where every man, woman and child is the same race – is rare in New York. Less than one percent of the population lives in such areas, and most of them are white. In Chicago, 12 percent of the black population is in a census block group that is 100 percent black.

    Racially segregated minority neighborhoods have a long history of multiple adversities, such as poverty, joblessness, environmental toxins and inadequate housing, Professor Sampson said. In these places, people tend to be more cynical about the law and distrust police, “heightening the risk that conflictual encounters will erupt in violence.”

    “The major underlying causes of crime are similar across cities, but the intensity of the connection between social ills and violence seems to be more persistent in Chicago,” Professor Sampson said. “You don’t get that kind of extensive social and economic segregation in many other cities.”

  6. - Interested observer - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 12:51 pm:

    Lengthy mandatory sentences did not lead to NYC’s stunning drop in murder. NY changed its law in 2006 to make illegal gun possession a 4.5 year mandatory minimum, after gun homicides had already dropped in NYC by 90% from a high in the 1990s. What’s more, after NYC changed the law the New York Times found that “fewer than half the defendants who had been arrested for illegal possession of a loaded gun in New York City received a state prison sentence.” This goes to show that there is nothing mandatory about mandatory minimums. All they do is transfer discretion from prosecutors to judges, which is where discretion belongs.

    In Chicago, the Sun Times found that the median sentence handed out by judges was four years for illegal gun possession by a felon. Chicago’s problem is not that the law fails to allow for lengthy prison sentences–it does; and it’s not that Cook County judges are afraid to sentence gun offenders to lengthy prison time–they do. Compared to NYC, Chicago’s problem–or at least a big part of it–is that there are significantly more guns on the street in the hands of people who shouldn’t have them.

  7. - Amalia - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 1:02 pm:

    NYC neighborhoods are WAY different than those of Chicago! there is an entire swath of the super rich and it keeps moving up into Harlem. Staten Island is literally an Island. Brooklyn is getting more and more millennial. it is truly a land of rich and poor and there are fewer poor there all the time. besides, what is the name of that beach town in Queens with the racially motivated beatings? so they are far from perfect. do think that the gun crime time law makes a difference, but with fewer legislators from poor neighborhoods than we have in Chicago, we get the wrong kind of time for crimes here and they have a better law.

  8. - Anonymous - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 1:19 pm:

    So it appears the root cause is segregation and poverty, which leads to gangs. Solve that and you should reduce the gangs. But that is going to take a stable environment, a consistent plan, tons and tons of money and generations of time.

    It also appears that, at least in NYC, additional police can have a deterrent effect. That also takes a stable environment, a consistent plan and tons of money.

    What does Illinois, and Chicago, lack?

    A stable environment, a consistent plan, and enough money.


  9. - RNUG - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 1:19 pm:

    1:19 pm was my comments

  10. - Amalia - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 1:40 pm:

    rough look at State Representatives in NYC districts….66 of 150 in legislature. of the 66 representing NYC, about 17 African American, 1 Asian American, 9 Hispanic, 39 white. But NYC is not the only place in New York with representatives of color though clearly the reps in NY state have no problem with increasing penalties. why is it different in Illinois?

  11. - DOI Chef - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 3:01 pm:

    So, if guns are the problem, why isn’t this whole state one giant OK Coral? This State has pandered to the criminal element for too long and always want to try to make them out as the victim, especially if the police are involved. If you don’t want to tangle with the police, don’t break the law! It is not the law abiding gun owner that is the problem, it is those that have a total disregard for others and will do what they want, when they want. And what does our State do? Pass more firearm restrictions for the law abiding citizen because we all know that the gangs will comply once they realize how sophisticated we’ve become.

  12. - Empty Suit - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 3:20 pm:

    In the 70s,80s, and early 90s the homicide rate in Chicago was, many times, close to double what it is today.

  13. - Formerly Known As... - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 3:39 pm:

    CPD Supt Johnson also wrote about the revolving door this month

    =For years, repeat offenders with violent criminal records have been able to continually cause harm in our communities with minimum consequences. Offenders tell me that as long as they can get out of jail in a matter of months for carrying a gun, they are going to do it again. And Martinez, the alleged offender in last week’s murder case, is the perfect demonstration: in 2014, he was sentenced to three years in jail on a gun charge, but walked free just over a year later.=

    =By our count, about 1,300 individuals — or less than one percent of the city’s population — are responsible for the vast majority of violence we’ve seen in recent months.=

  14. - Todd - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 4:03 pm:

    would have been nice to see a comparison of gangs and members between the two

  15. - RNUG - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 4:09 pm:

    The report noted that there were both Hispanic and black gangs, but the problems are primarily with the black gangs in Chicago. So maybe the question should be: why are black gangs in Chicago more violent?

  16. - Last Bull Moose - Monday, May 30, 16 @ 7:22 pm:

    Has anyone considered whether NYC has a better organized drug market. If Chicago has a more competitive illegal drug trade, there will be more violence as gangs fight for turf and market share.

    One of the arguments for state controlled distribution of less harmful drugs is to take funding from the illegal private drug distributors. A side effect is less violence.

  17. - Anonymous - Tuesday, May 31, 16 @ 4:07 pm:

    Who’s the second city now?

Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.

* Pritzker says White Sox stadium push so far is 'not enough to make it a priority' for Springfield
* Evidence-based funding falling behind in more ways than one
* *** UPDATED x1 - City files legal response *** More confusion on Bring Chicago Home
* It’s just a bill
* Should AG Raoul try to yank this guy's pension?
* ‘Nothing can be passed without our members’
* Open thread
* Isabel’s morning briefing
* SUBSCRIBERS ONLY - Today's edition of Capitol Fax (use all CAPS in password)
* Live coverage
* SUBSCRIBERS ONLY - Quick campaign updates
* Yesterday's stories

Visit our advertisers...





Main Menu
Pundit rankings
Subscriber Content
Blagojevich Trial
Updated Posts

February 2024
January 2024
December 2023
November 2023
October 2023
September 2023
August 2023
July 2023
June 2023
May 2023
April 2023
March 2023
February 2023
January 2023
December 2022
November 2022
October 2022
September 2022
August 2022
July 2022
June 2022
May 2022
April 2022
March 2022
February 2022
January 2022
December 2021
November 2021
October 2021
September 2021
August 2021
July 2021
June 2021
May 2021
April 2021
March 2021
February 2021
January 2021
December 2020
November 2020
October 2020
September 2020
August 2020
July 2020
June 2020
May 2020
April 2020
March 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004

Blog*Spot Archives
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005


RSS Feed 2.0
Comments RSS 2.0

Hosted by MCS SUBSCRIBE to Capitol Fax Advertise Here Mobile Version Contact Rich Miller