67 Comments - Dee Lay - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:00 am: If the spelling and grammar in these posts are any indication of the quality of education in the state of Illinois, then we have been under funding education for far too long. - PJ - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:00 am: It’s always refreshing to hear from such a well-informed citizenry. This stuff makes me want to go live as a hermit in Nova Scotia. - winners and losers - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:03 am: If you start the fire in a circle all around you, you are likely to get burned. - Amalia - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:04 am: The Drudge report has at left near the top that Illinois may be the first state to go bankrupt. Two nationwide lotto services are abandoning us at the end of the month. to all involved, including purveyors of the above snark and endless bickering, get it together. - Sideline watcher - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:05 am: It’s not surprising at all. They are repeating the IPI’s stances. They’ve been spoonfed this junk for years. We have intentionally dumbed down the electorate. Its compounded by the fact that now you can stay in your own bubble and never be confronted with facts that might cause you to rethink. - Joe M - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:06 am: All the more reason for the dems to sit back and wait for the GOP to introduce a tax hike bill - to go along with all the other budget bills the GOP introduced this week. Ranuer and the GOP need a tax hike to make the state work, just as much as the dems do. - Gruntled University Employee - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:07 am: These folks are hopping mad and I don’t blame them, they feel like they’ve been betrayed. But still, as mad as they are now they will never support a Democratic candidate over Rauner, they may very well stay home on election day but most will never vote for a Democrat. - sonny chiss - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:07 am: That’s the funniest thing I have read in a long time. Funny and sad, they’ve been reading the wrong blog. - Real - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:08 am: I’m sorry but the admins of IPI have never at any point been for Madigan. They are Rauner lapdogs. - JPC - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:09 am: W and L nails it. Sadly, we’re all going to burn. - Honeybear - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:10 am: Perfidy has consequences - Pelonski - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:11 am: The sad thing is that these types are now the core of the Republican party. I, and all the other thinking Republicans I knew have left the party and become independents. The core is now made up of individuals who can’t think for themselves. Their views on issues are based on what they hear from Limbaugh, Hannity, and the like who thrive on government dysfunction. - Hamlet's Ghost - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:11 am: Madigan and Cullerton should sit on their hands until the tax increase bill is filed in the IL House with Jim Durkin and Jeanne Ives as lead co-sponsors followed by 34 additional GOP mushrooms jumping on as co-sponsors. Then 36 Dems join in for a structured roll call. - Evanstonian - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:12 am: This is why I simply don’t believe IPI is speaking for Rauner on this one. The last thing in the world Rauner wants is have negative ads targeting his base telling them he supports tax increases. If the goal was to kill the tax hike the IPI would have targeted legislators. No, this is clearly IPI firing a warning shot at Rauner. But, hey, to the posts title, you reap what you sow… - Ole' Nelson - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:12 am: I thought you couldn’t get any more crazy than the Trib comments. I was wrong. - Gruntled University Employee - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:12 am: I’ve expressed this to Rich privately but I want to state it publicly as well. Reading the comments on the IPI FB page reaffirms my appreciation for Rich’s refereeing of this blog, even when he censors me. - Three-Finger Brown - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:13 am: Let’s see: Randomly capitalized words? Check Botching “your” / “you’re” Check Ellipses with more than 3 dots? Check Random insertion of “We the people”? Check Classic Trump Ian pentameter. Courting the angry rabble is always a great strategy, till it ain’t. - 47th Ward - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:14 am: IPI: “The peasants are revolting Governor!” Rauner: “They sure are.” - JPC - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:17 am: From what I can gather from twitter conversations with actual representatives, few of them seem to appreciate (or will publicly admit) the revenue increase at the core of Rauner’s budget. - Anon221 - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:20 am: Maybe, just maybe, this is what Raunet wants. If his “base” is up in arms about a tax increase, doesn’t that give him cover TO veto it even IF the budget package ends up with bipartisan votes? Just think about that for a minute. Not too unlike the school vote where he drive over the ILGOP a couple of years ago. He doesn’t donate to IPI for nuthin’. - Anonymous - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:21 am: Ooooo, “domocraps”. That’s the kind of biting, nuanced debate I would expect in an IPI Facebook post. - lake county democrat - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:26 am: Though it’s not immediately relevant, the dynamic behind these comments is a large part of the impasse: even if taxes are raised, the Democrats are seen as the ones pushing it and the Republicans as the ones doing their best to limit it. By refusing to raise the issue of progressive taxation, the Democrats have exposed themself to a taxpayer revolt. Maybe it comes with the income tax hike. Maybe it comes after one-too-many tax hikes or fees hit Chicago/Cook County and the solid blue electorate turns light blue or even purple. - PJ - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:27 am: Here’s the really cool part - we now have literally no choice but for several (at minimum) Republicans to sign on to a tax hike or the state implodes. They have two options: one is to try and explain to these people that they’ve been deeply misinformed, and that this is the only option. We’ll call that the Rep. Andersson approach. Two is to keep playing the pandering flute while Rome burns because keeping their job and saving that extra 1% or so on their taxes is more important to them than schools opening. We’ll call that the Rep. Ives approach. - Highland IL - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:30 am: My representatives in Springfield, Meier & McCarter, haven’t shared this IPI “news”. They usually are good for a repost. - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:40 am: This is actually the push back against vertical integration; people responding to your counter-narrative. You can’t use your vertical integration, left-handedly, and promote and remind your bought caucuses what can happen to them by showing the ginned-up “pressure” you are putting on yourself for something you have no intention on doing, “today”, signing a tax increase. It’s too smart by half. The phony outrage, from an organization Rauner and his allies fund, towards Rauner isn’t something that can be dialed up and down with people. You can’t have your flank covered and then do what needs to be done, and have all angles covered to get 50% + 1 on an action you want framed as bad to them, but ok to others, and have both sides “with you” The mental gymnastics here, to figure out how thus all helps with a base and not alienate that same base later… people remember things. - Nick Name - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:44 am: @11:08 a.m.: “They are Rauner employees.” Fixed it for you. - Cubs in '16 - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:49 am: I have never read or followed any of IPI’s sites/pages. I’m stunned by the lack of awareness and honest, civil discourse. Just wow! - RNUG - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:54 am: I’m now fully convinced Rauner has decided his ONLY play is to try to FORCE a state default, so ALEC and the rest of the alt-right can try to get a state bankruptcy bill through the US Congress. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 11:59 am: ===civil discourse=== You don’t know the half of it. There were a lot worse comments. Even a couple of people talking about assassination. It’s a horrible place over there. - Mama - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:00 pm: “I’m now fully convinced Rauner has decided his ONLY play is to try to FORCE a state default” RNUG, you are right on the money. I believe Rauner thinks if the state defaults, the state won’t have to pay pensions anymore. Isn’t that how businesses got out of paying their worker’s a pension? - Liberty - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:01 pm: Idiots exist on both sides… the web magnifies it… - PublicServant - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:01 pm: Governor, IPI says you’re supporting a 5 billion dollar, 33% tax hike on Illinois taypayers. Is that true? - Anonymous - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:02 pm: These types of rants have been around since the birth of this country. At the tavern, around the wood stove, diners.. but now they are on vast display unfiltered via Twitter, blogs etc.. Stupidity, misinformation, choleric passion has been given the same ‘voice’ as reasoned opinions. A Grave New World. - dude - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:07 pm: —I’m now fully convinced Rauner has decided his ONLY play is to try to FORCE a state default, so ALEC and the rest of the alt-right can try to get a state bankruptcy bill through the US Congress.— RNUG is always on target. This is a bulls-eye x 1000 Ka-Boom - RNUG - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:10 pm: Here’s how I see it playing out: a) if the GA passed his bills mostly intact, Rauner signs the budget bills b) Rauner vetos the revenue bill c) part way through the year, Rauner starts the State defaulting on payments d) Rauner then tells the Federal court system the State can’t pay everything that is ordered and the only solution is the US Congress granting the State bankruptcy status. I don’t see the courts buying it, but that’s what I see as the attempted end game. - Aldyth - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:15 pm: Nothing I can say would be adequate to just how disheartening it is to read this stuff and know that there are actual people out there who are thinking it. - Morty - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:19 pm: Obi Wan -”A wretched hive of scum and villainy.” Rich- “You don’t know the half of it. There were a lot worse comments. Even a couple of people talking about assassination. It’s a horrible place over there” That’s comforting considering the events of the other day…/s - Lawsuit - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:23 pm: The Liberty Justice Center — friends of IPI - threatened to sue over SB 9 https://capitolfax.com/2017/05/28/group-threatens-suit-over-senate-tax-hike/ - Morty - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:26 pm: Rich- “You don’t know the half of it. There were a lot worse comments. Even a couple of people talking about assassination. It’s a horrible place over there” Sad when Rich sounds like he’s talking about Mos Eisley. After the events of a few days ago you would hope people would tone down that kind of (assassinations) talk. I guess not - not again - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:26 pm: I sometimes read the comments to get a different perspective, and I usually walk away in need of a stiff drink. It boggles my mind there are so many lunatics out there. I also find myself writing checks to charities just to shake off the crazy. - Rauners Carhart Costume - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 12:29 pm: The book - Death of Expertise - is a perfect description of these comments. These dopes think that IL can solve its economic woes by cutting spending and revenue. When that doesn’t happen, they blame the politicians - THAT THEY PUT THERE. Honest question: How many of the people in those comments know the difference between “debt” and “deficit”? We can thank Grover Norquist and his ilk for not just IL’s problems but the country. His stupid tax pledge has made it political suicide to even discuss a revenue increase. Republican’s steadfast resistance to tax increases, as economic inequality has ballooned and wage growth has stalled over decades, has put us in the situation that we are in now. - lake county democrat - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:11 pm: Rauners Carhart Costume: You know what the author of that book would suggest for Illinois though… Actually Illinois (unlike some states) could solve a lot of economic woes by cutting spending - look at the studies showing how much government work can be automated. And the insane number of governmental units in Illinois. I’d rather raise taxes too and spend it on social programs and infrastructure, remember that our income taxes are *flat* — when we raise them, there is REGRESSIVE effect (because even though the raise is flat, at the $60,000 median family income level, far more vital things are cut from the budget than from a family making $500,000). The budget battle is not just the 1% vs. the 99%. It’s also the 10%, state government employees, and the poor vs. the middle class (admittedly oversimplified, but it’s the latter that makes this so complicated). - Morty - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:17 pm: IPI has linked to this site. I imagine there will be a lot of annoymous posters today I can’t help but feel a little sense of schadenfruende as I read the comments…IPI, the snake oil salesmen that they are, have fed them tales of illusions, magic beans, and pixie dust…anyone who tried to point out the reality of the situation- that revenue via a tax increase was ALWAYS going to happen were shouted down and denounced. Now the Raunerites have the equivilent of a room full of 5 years with their fingers in their ears shouting “La la la, I can’t hear you!” - Signal and Noise - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:19 pm: It’s the Domocraps!!! This is the funniest thing I’ve read in months. - Hamlet's Ghost - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:22 pm: @RNUG Regarding state bankruptcy - assuming the US Congress amends the law to allow it, would a voluntary filing approved by the General Assembly violate the IL Constitution’s protections of pension obligations? In other words, would the ILGA (or Governor) have authority under the IL Constitution to authorize a bankruptcy filing if the result will be an impairment of a constitutionally protected pension? - Johnnie F. - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:23 pm: A number of years ago there was a liberal talk radio host in Chicago who frequently describe these callers to his show as “brainstems”. I think of that often when I read these types of internet comment sections. So glad for Rich’s site! - Daniel Plainview - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:25 pm: At least they’re finally recognizing IPI as fake news. - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:35 pm: If IPI is upset Rich is highlighting all the mouth-breathers that visit their page and then comment as they do, they could just delete those comments. “We represent the people, just don’t expose what those people say?” Is that the response IPI is saying? - Me Again - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:41 pm: My favorite quote was: “Legalize and tax the hell out of marijuana you jack-wagons!!!” - My button is broke... - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:44 pm: I can’t wait to see IPI’s cartoon about the tax hike and the Governor. I usually disagree with them, but those cartoons are great. - RNUG - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 1:49 pm: - Hamlet’s Ghost - @ 1:22 pm: Generally, federal law overrides, but usually there isn’t a specific State Constitutional Clause guaranteeing payment. It would raise some interesting legal points. As I’ve pointed out before, the Feds usually take a hands off approach to States dealing with direct State employees. I’ve also noted that in various government bankruptcy cases (Detroit, Stockton, Puerto Rico so far, to name 3 high profile ones), the Federal courts usually / mostly protected the state pensioners and employees, primarily because government pension systems are not covered / protected by ERISA, the PBGC, and often did not participate in Social Security. Those former government employees have no safety net at all. Bottom line: your guess is as good as mine. All we can do is look at past actions. - Hamlet's Ghost - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 2:01 pm: @RNUG My guess is that two things need to happen for IL to discharge pension obligations in a federal bankruptcy proceeding: 1. The US Congress creates the option - and - 2. The IL Constitution is amended to allow state officials to choose that option. IMHO & FWIW - Cheswick - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 2:11 pm: Even if congress changes law, I don’t see a BR judge letting Illinois off the hook w/out increasing taxes, selling assets sufficient to discharge any debt. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 2:15 pm: ===Even if congress changes law=== Nobody, including anyone from the Illinois delegation, has asked Congress to do this. Until they do, this topic is for thumbsuckers and people who believe pensioners should get the shaft. Move along. - Grandson of Man - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 2:32 pm: >> A number of years ago there was a liberal talk radio host in Chicago who frequently describe these callers to his show as “brainstems”. - Grandson of Man - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 2:36 pm: Sorry, something went wrong with my post and it got cut off. The Chicago radio talk show host who called people brain stems was Jay Marvin. He said he moved to Colorado and did radio there. He said he stopped calling people brain stems after the Columbine massacre. - Skeptic - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 3:04 pm: RNUG: re: Your 12:10pm Right away I can see the court saying essentially what the ILSC said to Quinn with the “police powers” argument: “Did you have a chance to raise revenue? Yes? And you vetoed it? Tough doughnuts, this is a crisis of your own making, pay up.” - dbk - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 3:07 pm: Excellent. As a new reader trying to catch up with the morass of IL politics, this site is proving invaluable, and I’m recommending it in blog comments and to friends - the situation is a lot more complicated than you are led to believe by national coverage, and the nuances come through in this site’s extensive coverage/excerpting. Re: IPI’s FB comments section, after the election I started reading Senator Durbin’s FB comments, and continue to peruse them a couple times a week. There are many, many, many commenters who think (a) Durbin represents only Chicago, (b) Durbin controls Illinois politics, including the budget crisis, (c) Durbin has never introduced any legislation in his career in the U.S. Senate. And there’s much, much more. - Gandy94 - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 3:17 pm: I read this comments and I see the words “mouth breather” or “idiot”, and it makes me cringe. This is what you think of the people who vote for you? I see people on here talking about hiring freezes, pay increases being stopped, but so what? I make 80,000 dollars a year, and I support a family of 4 comfortably. Most of you folks make more than that, and you demand a raise? For what? What have you, all of you, done in the past 2 years to deserve such a raise? Our state is on the verge of bankruptcy, people are leaving by the MILLIONS per year, major businesses are closing their doors, schools are not funded, roads are riddled with pot holes, condemned buildings all over the state, people unemployed, families living in ghettos. What exactly do you think you deserve a raise for? Do you know what would happen to my place of work if we ran it into the ground as you (Democrats AND Republicans alike) have done to this state? We would have to close our doors. You get what you earn in this life, and you’re not entitled to anything. You want raises? Get to work, and give the people who vote for you results. If any of you would be willing to email me and have a true and honest discussion about it, please do. I can be reached at gandenberger9491@gmail.com. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 3:36 pm: ===people are leaving by the MILLIONS per year=== Looks like one person heeded the call. - Oswego Willy - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 3:38 pm: ===Most of you folks make more than that, and you demand a raise?=== Where is your data showing “most” make more… Thanks. - titan - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 3:59 pm: ===Most of you folks make more than that, and you demand a raise?=== Who is talking about a raise? The talk is about the necessity of a tax increase, not anyone getting a raise (so as to pay the bills and debts of the state). The legislators don’t just pocket all the taxes as salary. - A mouth breather - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 4:03 pm: Thanks for the insults. This “mouth breather” is tired of extreme property taxes, increasing income taxes, poor economic growth, bad roads, bad laws, and Chicagoans looking down their noses at the rest of us. My family is probably moving across state lines soon, as well, because IL can’t get it together. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 4:06 pm: ===Thanks for the insults=== Nobody insulted you, personally, unless you posted one of those goofier comments listed above. Your comment seemed far more reasonable than the others. In other words, don’t be such a snowflake. - don the legend - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 4:29 pm: …this topic is for thumbsuckers and people who believe pensioners should get the shaft… Sadly there are a few regular commenters who do want pensioners to get the shaft. - Lakeview Dude - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 4:41 pm: Ugh. I feel like I was getting yelled at while reading that. I think I need a shower now… - Daniel Plainview - Friday, Jun 16, 17 @ 5:09 pm: - Chicagoans looking down their noses at the rest of us. - I’m from west central Illinois and spent 29 years there, and I’ve lived in Chicago for 4 years and have no idea what the hell you’re talking about. 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