SUBSCRIBE to Capitol Fax      Advertise Here      Mobile Version     Exclusive Subscriber Content     Updated Posts    Contact
CapitolFax.com
To subscribe to Capitol Fax, click here.
Weekend gun show under review

Friday, Jan 18, 2013

* They undoubtedly have a contract and it’s been scheduled for a while, and it starts tomorrow, so canceling now may not be easy, but we’ll see

At the same time Gov. Pat Quinn is pushing for a ban on military-style, semiautomatic weapons, some of those same guns will be for sale this weekend at the Illinois State Fairgrounds.

Advertisements for an event Saturday and Sunday at the state-owned facility indicate that Centralia-based Egyptian Collectors Association Inc. will feature some of the brands that could be affected by a state or federal ban.

The gun show comes to the capital city as officials who favor stricter gun control laws in other states are beginning to debate whether to ban gun shows from public property. […]

Quinn spokeswoman Brooke Anderson said Thursday the issue is on the governor’s radar screen.

“This is something we’ll be looking at,” Anderson said.

It’s billed as the largest hunting and trade show in Illinois, so there could be a whole lot of upset people if they cancel this thing.

As always with this topic, take a deep breath before you comment. I have no patience today for craziness.

- Posted by Rich Miller        


93 Comments
  1. - Fair Share - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:11 am:

    Rhetoric - meet - Reality


  2. - OneMan - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:20 am:

    Think you are going to get a lot of push back on a public property gun show bad from some county fairgrounds…


  3. - Roadiepig - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:20 am:

    As long as nothing (presently) illegal is up for sale there is no reason to cancel the show . Simple as that. Just because you don’t like something doesn’t give you the right to use you office’s power to make it to away


  4. - Kasich Walker, Jr. - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:26 am:

    I just want IL to get the Cannabis Cup show in 2015.


  5. - western illinois - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:28 am:

    “they have a contract”
    Cancel for sure that contract stuff means nothing ……


  6. - Jasper - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:29 am:

    Typical Illinois. Nobody thinks. Why was this approved in the first place?

    It is too late to do anything now, but whoever approved the sale of AR-15s on government land should be looking for a new job.


  7. - Ahoy! - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:33 am:

    They shouldn’t cancel it, but it might be ok to deny the sale of semi-automatic weapons and to ensure that all sales go through a back-ground check… isn’t there some kind of “gun-show loophole?” Close the loophole when it’s on your property.


  8. - onceademocrat - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:36 am:

    To the best Of my knowledge AR15’s are not illegal to own or purchase in the State Of Illinois,(yet) therefore let the gun show proceed as scheduled.


  9. - Stones - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:37 am:

    I would like others to weigh in but this battle over guns, both statewide and nationally, is probably the most passionately charged issue since abortion back in the Roe v. Wade days. At least that is my view.


  10. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:37 am:

    Well, at least at the fairgrounds, gun show organizers would have the force of law on their side in preventing those with loaded firearms from entering the grounds.

    As Roger Simon points out in Politico, many gun shows ban those with loaded firearms.

    –“No loaded firearms and no loaded magazines are permitted in any Crossroads gun show,” one site said. “Your personal safety is our No. 1 priority while you are at the show.”

    Personal safety? I thought loaded guns created personal safety.

    “The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun,” Wayne LaPierre, the CEO and executive vice president of the NRA, said a week after the massacre at Newtown Elementary School in Connecticut.

    So I don’t get it. What if a “bad guy” with a loaded gun, who had become deranged by playing a video game (which is one of the NRA’s greatest fears), barged into a gun show? Wouldn’t we want a whole bunch of “good guys” with loaded guns to stop him?–

    Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/leave-the-presidents-kids-out-of-it-86294_Page2.html#ixzz2ILFsuOQQ


  11. - Wensicia - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:42 am:

    They should have thought about cancelling it right after the Sandy Hook tragedy, why wait ’til the day before?


  12. - RNUG - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:43 am:

    Ahoy,

    Until different laws are passed, semi-autos are legal.

    Maybe you’re thinking of full autos (machine guns) which have been banned since 1934?


  13. - lincolnlover - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:44 am:

    Does anyone realize that this gunshow has been held at the Fairgrounds for years? It ain’t nothin’ new. If I were the gov and his staff, I would pay the price of admission and go talk to some gun enthusiasts to find out their point of view. Of course, my backbone actually exists, so Pat will be a no-show and continue to listen only to his toadies.


  14. - RNUG - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:47 am:

    As far as the State Fairgrounds in Springfield go, the State has long rented facilites out in an attempt to help pay for the upkeep and maintenance of the property. This started back when the State stopped fully subsidizing the State Fair.

    As far as I’m concerned, there is nothing to see here except some people trying to capitalize on a hot button issue at the moment.


  15. - Leave a Light on George - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:47 am:

    =Well, at least at the fairgrounds, gun show organizers would have the force of law on their side in preventing those with loaded firearms from entering the grounds.=

    Where did you get the idea that people with loaded guns could be on the state fairgrounds at any time?


  16. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:49 am:

    –Where did you get the idea that people with loaded guns could be on the state fairgrounds at any time?–

    They can’t, which was my point, exactly.


  17. - He Makes Ryan Look Like a Saint - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:49 am:

    This show has gone on annually for years, it is very well ran. They rent the facility which is REVENUE for the state. They sell LEGAL merchandise that brings in TAX REVENUE. There is a binding contract, cancelling now will result in a Lawsuit which the state will lose costing more money we do not have.


  18. - Rebel13 - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:49 am:

    Legal products being sold?
    Check
    Legal Binding Contract?
    Check

    Then it should proceed.

    Also, there is no “gun show loophole” in IL. All firearms transaction, be it from an FFL Dealer or a private seller to another private seller, must undergo a manadatory background check.

    Please stop believing everything the reporters and politicians say.


  19. - walkinfool - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:50 am:

    An opportunity for some legislators to attend and learn something. Some vendors are perfectly fine at explaining the ins and outs of the gun show trade, if they happen to have the time and you’re polite.


  20. - Leave a Light on George - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:53 am:

    =Also, there is no “gun show loophole” in IL. All firearms transaction, be it from an FFL Dealer or a private seller to another private seller, must undergo a manadatory background check.=

    Facts, facts we don’t need no stinking facts!


  21. - Rebel13 - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:55 am:

    Need to clarify my statement, all transactions at gun shows need to go through a backgraound check.


  22. - Past the Rule of 85 - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 9:59 am:

    It’s a no-win situation for the Governor, just like most of his situations. If he doesn’t cancel he’ll be accused of not standing up to the gun lobby. If he cancels the gun rights people will use it as evidence the black helicopters are on their way. He’ll also be blamed for costing the state money when he’s sued by the show sponsors.


  23. - Fan of the Game - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:00 am:

    It’s legal.

    It’s contracted.

    Open the gates.


  24. - Ready To Get Out - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:00 am:

    Gun show–It is legal, they pay for use of the facilities, the fairgrounds needs the revenue, don’t see the problem unless the law is changed. As RNUG says, “nothing to see here.”

    Binding contract–and that bothers Quinn? Ask AFSCME about that.


  25. - RNUG - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:01 am:

    word @9:37,

    In Illinois, other than law enforcement and a very few concealed carry permits issued to some security firms, it’s not currently legal for anyone to be carrying a loaded weapon other than on their own property. Admittedly, they could be carrying an UNLOADED AND ENCASED weapon … but not quite the same thing.


  26. - Amuzing Myself - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:01 am:

    This knee-jerk-type stuff is what’s wrong with government. If this was such a problem, they should never have renewed the contract for this show. It’s been going on for MANY years now, and waiting until this close to the event is typical. Yes. Let’s screw everyone involved who has already invested in travel plans, inventory and the state itself which would be clearly in violation of its own contract so that someone can feel better or “less dirty”. C’mon! The hypocrisy is laughable. If only they could react so quickly to other state business, like, I don’t know… a budget $10 BILLION in the whole?!!! Look! A kitty…


  27. - Loop Lady - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:02 am:

    Too late for second thoughts on this event this year…

    I am a proponent of gun control, specifically handguns and semiautomatics, not guns used for hunting and other outdoor pursuits.

    I do think that any gun sold needs to have a record of that sale, just like cars…


  28. - OneMan - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:03 am:

    Also guessing any ‘no gun shows on public property’ would exempt Sparta…


  29. - c'mon - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:09 am:

    As mentioned, this show has been going on for years and they follow all state and federal laws. So why now is everyone concerned there will be guns-a-blazing and laws thrown to the side for any waiting period or background check? This is the same hysteria going on with lawmakers and it makes no sense.


  30. - Aldyth - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:12 am:

    As long as everyone is complying with all applicable laws, leave it be. Those laws may change and compliance will have to change accordingly. As long as everyone follows the law, I see no objection to it.


  31. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:16 am:

    RNUG, I get it, believe me. I was more intrigued by the irony in that conceal-carry states some gun shows feel the need to ban loaded firearms for safety reasons.


  32. - Not It - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:25 am:

    Rich, what days do you have patience for craziness?


  33. - Skirmisher - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:26 am:

    “whoever approved the sale of AR-15s on government land should be looking for a new job.”

    Get real, Jasper- You or I, or any other civilian who has a clean record and otherwise qualifies can go buy an M-1 semi-automatic rifle from the federal government right now. So how about canning Obama while we are at it?? And, as others have already pointed out, Illinois gun shows are operated very tightly to assure that all laws are strictly complied with. You can’t go buy an AR-15 or much of anything else without going through the background check, etc. Quinn, as usual, is shooting off his mouth without first considering the facts and the consequences.


  34. - 3rd Generation Chicago Native - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:26 am:

    Ducks in a line, and the invitations are out. Can’t cancel. That would be open for litigation, from a number of participants.


  35. - Bemused - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:29 am:

    I have to go along with the Pro Folks on this one.
    If you don’t like this type of thing at the Fair Grounds then change the rules. Until then the folks there would seem to be doing nothing against the law. Even the bad timeing angle is not thier fault. I am sure this was set up long before the recent events, nobody seemed to care then.


  36. - Jasper - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:30 am:

    Skirmisher,
    Get real?
    Yes, it is legal to buy these things.
    Just because it is legal, does not mean that we should encourage it by doing it on public land.
    And what in the world does the President have to do with it?
    Calm down and give it some thought, son.


  37. - Leave a Light on George - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:34 am:

    =…I get it, believe me. I was more intrigued by the irony in that conceal-carry states some gun shows feel the need to ban loaded firearms for safety reasons.=

    At a firearm show their are lots of people handling guns. Picking them up, looking at them, pointing them…

    Why on God’s green earth would you want them to do that while the gun is loaded!!?

    Word you are showing your ignorance today when it comes to gun safety.


  38. - Jasper - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:37 am:

    Leave,
    That’s not possible.
    The NRA tells us that all gun owners practice gun safety.
    The NRA also tells us that many loaded weapons makes us safer.
    Are you suggesting that loaded weapons are dangerous?
    Don’t tell Todd.


  39. - Jasper - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:38 am:

    It is sort of funny that the gun advocates want loaded weapons in schools around kids but not in gun shows around adults.


  40. - Anonymous - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:47 am:

    Wordslinger….
    Common sense tells me the shows probably like the guns empty because of all the people passing their guns around for admiration. Nice cheap shot tho.


  41. - Arthur Andersen - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:48 am:

    word, that is, as they say, a delicious bit of irony. I always thought the folks checking guns brought in to a gun show were there just to preclude the “Whoops” factor.

    To the post, Quinn would be foolish to intervene at this late moment and break a valid contract. Maybe he will just deputize Squeezy for the weekend and have him put a cordon
    around the Fairgrounds.


  42. - c'mon - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:51 am:

    Well if we are going to start banning a gun show at the fairgrounds because it offends people that would never attend anyway, maybe we better start a list of things we need to ban. Not because they are illegal but some people disagree with it. PETA, religious organizations and anti-religious organizations, Greens, MADD Groups, all need to speak up now. There are bad things going on on govt property.


  43. - johhnypizza - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:51 am:

    The term “semi-automatic” brings ferarful visions of a “Wild Bunch” gatling gun scene or a pair of bank roobers in body armor outgunning the police to many peoples minds. The semi automatic assault rifles in question are .223 caliber rifles capable of firing 15 to 25 rounds. They are roughly equivalent to a rifle used to kill deer (if that was permitted in Illinois). They are typically used for target practice. It is not what is being bought to walk down the street in L.A. trying to mow down police officers after a failed bank robbery attempt.


  44. - More Courage - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:54 am:

    Jasper - actually, Skirmisher put some good thought into his statement and made a great point. What does the president have to do with it? Like he said, you can go on a federal website today and purchase an M-1 and a variety of other semi-auto rifles. That’s just a fact, son.


  45. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:55 am:

    Leave a Light, are you willfully missing the point?

    I’ll try again: the irony is, that at some gun shows in conceal carry states, they ban those attending from carrying in their own loaded firearms for safety reasons.


  46. - Norseman - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:55 am:

    My son purchased a historical gun from a gun show at the fairgrounds a couple of years ago. He had to wait a day for the background check before he picked it up. This was no difference from the local sports store.

    We’re planning on attending tomorrow. See you there!


  47. - lincolnlover - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:13 am:

    I believe the reason (aside from legalities) that gun shows typically prohibit loaded weapons is for safety concerns. You don’t have to have a FOID card to enter and you don’t have to prove that you know how to handle firearms to pick up a gun. Therefore, it makes sense to prohibit anyone from handling a loaded gun at a show. In fact, this point was underlined at a gunshow in Bloomington last year when a dealer loaded a gun and handed it to a potential buyer who accidentally discharged it. One man was seriously injured and another, I believe, died.


  48. - walkinfool - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:13 am:

    Sometimes, with highly emotional issues like guns, gays, abortion, we just cannot hear the simplest things the other people are saying. We have to take a breath, and try again.


  49. - Anon - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:25 am:

    @lincolnlover
    Here’s the story on the Bloomington show: http://www.pantagraph.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/article_4ed885c6-92b3-11e0-b7b5-001cc4c002e0.html


  50. - USMCJanitor - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:26 am:

    Just so everyone is on the same page. In the state of Illinois there is no Gun Show loophole.

    In Illinois even Face to Face, non-dealer to non-dealer transaction requires that the buyer and seller show Illinoid FOID cards, and record the information and maintain it for 10 years. This is also no way to get around the Illinois Waiting Periods. 24 hours for long guns and 72 hours for handguns.

    You must follow these face to face or in a gun shop.


  51. - Jasper - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:26 am:

    More Courage,
    So what?
    Why would that matter?
    Try to focus. This is about a gun show in Illinois.
    If you want to whine about the President, go someplace else.


  52. - Skirmisher - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:30 am:

    Thank you, More Courage. Jasper couldn’t grasp the point so I am glad someone does. In fact, this is all a perfectly legal activity, no different in the view of many of us than selling fishing gear at the fairgrounds. Been going on for years, and is widely supported down our way. Quinn is screwing up again badly if now he plans to jump on his high horse and further alienate downstate Illinois and their elected representatives (Both parties). The guv should have much, much higher priorities in getting the state’s fiscal house in order, and this sort of grandstanding for the benefit of his Cook County constituency is potentially very counter-productive. The man should stay focused on what needs fixing and not on what does not.


  53. - Crime Fighter - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:36 am:

    =”some gun shows in conceal carry states, they ban those attending from carrying in their own loaded firearms for safety reasons.”=

    This lays bare the gun lobby’s phony “everybody packin’ makes us safer” argument.

    The gun show folks in CC states sound like their infringing on their attendees’ 2nd Amendment Rights.


  54. - Cheryl44 - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:45 am:

    I don’t think the people seeing the irony in not allowing loaded guns in the show are talking about the guns on display. You can’t bring your own loaded gun into a gun show. You know, the way the NRA wants us all doing everywhere else on the planet.


  55. - Rod - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:45 am:

    Rebel 13 is basically correct in relation to gun shows in Illinois. The purchase of any kind of firearm, be it rifles, shotguns, or handguns, require that an individual have a FOID card if they are an Illinois resident. Rifles and handguns are subject to a holding period of twenty-four hours, while handguns have waiting period of seventy-two hours for actual delivery. The exception to the waiting period provision is that it does not apply for law enforcement officers, an authorized dealer, or a non-resident at a gun show that has been approved by the Illinois State Police.

    Most shows have a separate table set up to run back ground checks for everyone. The show that I went to in Illinois, made arrangements for handguns to be available for pickup at a date at least three days after the show ends. The gun show promoter picked a gun dealer to do the transfers if the seller is a private or from some distance away. My friend paid the seller, and he transfered the gun to the dealer (right in front of us) then an arrangement with the dealer was made as to where to pick up the gun. My friend bought a 1945 M1 Garand WWII era rifle and he paid over a thousand dollars for it. He is a serious collector who lives in Suburban Cook county.

    What we are starting to see in relation to the gun issue in Illinois is mass confusion on the part of non-gun owners who support President Obama’s proposed changes at the Federal level, but are unaware of how laws are currently written in Illinois. We are seeing this in Chicago right now in relation to gun registration fines and penalties, new laws are being added on top of existing laws that will probably be meaningless and the Aldermen for the most part have no idea what the law might mean but they for sure aren’t going to be targeted by the pro-gun control forces as an opponent.

    The gun show at the State Fair grounds suddenly is on the radar screen of all the gun control forces. Do we have any doubt that news crews will be lurking around to take video of the Patriot Militia types or colorful bikers?


  56. - USMCJanitor - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:45 am:

    =”some gun shows in conceal carry states, they ban those attending from carrying in their own loaded firearms for safety reasons.”=

    Often this is also done because the county/state property the event is held on is deemed “public” like a government building and it is LAW. So the show posts it at the doors and in the website and flyers to make sure they comply.

    Sometimes, it is a private property held event and its in the contract (the property owner requires it). This is often negotiated during the contract phase and is something they asked for not the gun show mgmt.

    Here you see law abiding citizens often going out of their way to ensure they are legal.

    Using this in your arguments weakens them because of ignorance.


  57. - USMCJanitor - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:46 am:

    And I should say in Illinois, should you load a weapon (gun show or not) you are in violation of the state’s uuw or auuw laws. Why would a gun show mgmt team want you to break the state laws at their event.


  58. - Roadiepig - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:50 am:

    c’mon - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:51 am:

    Exactly! My thoughts exactly!


  59. - lincolnlover - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 11:55 am:

    Thanks for the link, Anon. I was going on memory which isn’t always the best method!
    As for the NRA saying that “everybody packin makes us safer”, the NRA is adamant about firearms training BEFORE anyone makes a purchase. As I noted in my previous post, not everyone at a gunshow has been trained. The first rule of firearms training is always make sure there is nothing in the chamber before you hand it off to someone else.


  60. - Ken_in_Aurora - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 12:10 pm:

    “Leave a Light, are you willfully missing the point?

    I’ll try again: the irony is, that at some gun shows in conceal carry states, they ban those attending from carrying in their own loaded firearms for safety reasons.”

    Word, the innocent bumpkin impersonation isn’t very flattering on you.

    You are aware that basic firearm safety insists a weapon be cleared before it is administratively handled (such as at a gun show, or in a store), right?

    Or, are you simply chumming for a reaction?

    Hmmm. I wonder which it is.


  61. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 12:16 pm:

    –You are aware that basic firearm safety insists a weapon be cleared before it is administratively handled (such as at a gun show, or in a store), right?–

    I’m talking about someone attending a public event with their own loaded weapon. Not one that’s on sale at a gun show or in a store.

    If you can’t attend a gun show with your own loaded weapon for safety reasons, why is it cool at the movies or the mall?

    Sorry, Rich, didn’t mean to put everyone off topic. I’d literally read Simon’s column a couple of minutes before your posting. Thought it was marginally relevant.


  62. - USMCJanitor - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 12:31 pm:

    word,
    there are several reasons (see my posts just a few lines above) and note that at a movie or a mall people are not pulling out and handling weapons, testing actions, changing mags, etc while determining whether they want to buy or trade a gun (lots of trades go on).

    If a show determines that it wants to say “no loaded weapons” its because you are now in an area where casual handling is taken place. This is VERY common at shooting ranges. Youre weapons (when not on the “line) need to be unloaded. Everyone around you expects that. You only load the weapon at the line.

    Also, lots of times this has to do with Insurance for the show. The shows are commercial entities and offen insurance providers (not to mention the people you rent the facility from) will ask for this.

    Nothing untoward here, but very expected in “gun culture”


  63. - State Worker - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 12:56 pm:

    Ever heard of a shooting at a gun show???


  64. - Skirmisher - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 12:58 pm:

    Upon further consideration, Quinn’s idea would at least be somewhat consistent if at the same time he ordered a ban on alcohol on all state property. I recall seeing some girls pretty much under the weather at one of the State Fair’s numerous beer tents last August. Alcohol, like a firearm, can become a very dangerous thing if abused.


  65. - c'mon - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 1:03 pm:

    Some are really making some efforts at a gotcha moment, but you don’t understand the culture. USMC hits the nail on the head. Safety is always a concern. In a CC state, it is not OK to causally handle a firearm in a public place like it is expected at a gun show. You can bring a firearm to sell or trade, it must be unloaded and cased. There is no crime happening at a gun show. Just because there are firearms does not mean there are bad people looking to get out of hand. Why do some continue with this presentient message. You’ll shoot your eye out!


  66. - Skeeter - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 1:06 pm:

    “Ever heard of a shooting at a gun show???”

    Yes, read the thread.


  67. - Doug - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 1:09 pm:

    ===

    - c’mon - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 10:51 am:

    Well if we are going to start banning a gun show at the fairgrounds because it offends people that would never attend anyway, maybe we better start a list of things we need to ban. Not because they are illegal but some people disagree with it. PETA, religious organizations and anti-religious organizations, Greens, MADD Groups, all need to speak up now. There are bad things going on on govt property.
    ====

    Can I get an Amen?


  68. - Liandro - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 1:23 pm:

    Word, you are flat out wrong on this one. As others have mentioned above, organizers recognize that at a gun show people are going to be handling, moving, examining, and in general manhandling scores of weapons. In such an environment–not at all a normal gun-handling situation–prudence might well dictate taking extra safety steps that surpass normal.

    For example, military base regulations are NEVER the same at a gun range as they are walking around base. And regulations are different in the chow hall than in either of those two other situations. And they are different again in the presence…well, I think you get the idea.

    Different situations call for different regulations. That is just part of gun safety. In in the country, you can drive 55. In the city, you can drive 30. Same car, same driver, different situation.


  69. - Ken_in_Aurora - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:06 pm:

    “Ever heard of a shooting at a gun show???”

    Negligent discharges, sadly yes. That’s why all guns are required to be unloaded at shows.

    Mass shootings? I don’t think there’s ever been a mass shooting at a gun show.


  70. - 47th Ward - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:14 pm:

    ===Different situations call for different regulations. That is just part of gun safety. In in the country, you can drive 55. In the city, you can drive 30. Same car, same driver, different situation.===

    Thanks Liandro. So you’re saying Chicago should have different, possibly more restrictive gun regulations than rural areas. I agree.


  71. - Endangered Moderate Species - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:15 pm:

    Wordslinger,

    We understood your point the first time. There is no need to continue hammering us from your pulpit of semantics.


  72. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:16 pm:

    –Negligent discharges, sadly yes. That’s why all guns are required to be unloaded at shows.–

    A sound policy at public events.


  73. - Skeeter - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:25 pm:

    “Mass shootings? I don’t think there’s ever been a mass shooting at a gun show.”

    Sure Ken, because as we know, gun shows ban loaded weapons.


  74. - Liandro - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:31 pm:

    47th Ward,

    Sure, I agree that regulations should be more restrictive for concealed carry than to own in the home. And that regulations for carrying in public should be, again, different than just owning in the home. I have no problem with required training to concealed carry, etc…Chicago, or anywhere else in public. I already commented on Rich’s school-carry post that I felt anyone whose job description required/allowed public carry should be well-trained–which is certainly a form of regulation.

    The problem is that Chicago has attempted to use regulation not as a way to enhance safety, but as a way to infringe on the ability of law-abiding citizens to own/use weapons at all. They’re agenda isn’t safety regulations, their agenda is control, and they have completely ignored the 2nd Amendment (and their own success at reducing gun crime) in the process.


  75. - downstate commissioner - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:31 pm:

    I plan to attend some time this weekend; have no intention to purchase any firearm, although I might buy another pocket knife. I just enjoy looking at guns, occasionally handling something different or unusual. In the past several years, FOID card rules have changed: while you don’t have to show one to get in, you have to show one to actually handle a firearm, which irritates me. I can go into a car dealership, look at a car, sit inside it, even start it up, without showing a license; can’t drive it, but at a gun show, you can’t shoot the gun, either.


  76. - Liandro - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:35 pm:

    They’re=their. Rich, comments should be allowed a 60-second time window to edit, heh. What’s that? Spell right the first time? Shenanigans!


  77. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:38 pm:

    –We understood your point the first time. There is no need to continue hammering us from your pulpit of semantics.–

    What do you mean?

    From my reading, some thought I was under the impression that guns-for-sale were loaded. I did not think that.

    I like “pulpit of semantics,” though. I don’t know what it means, but I like it. I’m putting that one on ice.


  78. - Ken_in_Aurora - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:44 pm:

    This is turning into a slightly more adult version of “I know you are, but what am I?”


  79. - c'mon - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:45 pm:

    Thanks to skeeter, word, and 47th. Once in a while I’ll get a silly thought, but you make me realize I need to maintain my zero compromise attitude - the exact opposite of yours.


  80. - Skeeter - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:50 pm:

    Not sure how “Isn’t it funny that the gun lobby tells us that more loaded guns makes us more safe, but let’s not have loaded guns at guns shows because that would not make us safe” amounts to “zero compromise.

    Of course, I’m one of the calm and rational ones that probably would be able to reasonably handle a weapon.

    How about you? You seem a bit wound up. Feeling OK? Maybe you should think about whether owning a weapon is the best thing for you.


  81. - Endangered Moderate Species - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 2:56 pm:

    Word,

    The Pulpit of Semantics seem likes a place a Wordslinger would sling words from.


  82. - 47th Ward - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 3:02 pm:

    Liandro, for what it’s worth, I agree with you that Chicago’s history is plagued with bad ideas and bad gun laws that haven’t worked. I actually agree with the Supreme Court ruling that scrapped Chicago’s handgun ban.

    But reasonable people can agree that there are certain places where possessing a loaded, ready to use weapon creates a safety concern. And it stands to reason that densely populated cities have more of these places in closer proximity than smaller towns and rural communities.

    Illinois is going to pass a conceal/carry law soon. I think it should provide flexibility for local communities and even private property owners to decide for themselves whether and under what circumstances to allow loaded firearms to be carried in public.

    Just like this gun show is doing.


  83. - Rich Miller - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 3:05 pm:

    Let’s get back to the topic at hand. C’mon, people. Enough is enough.


  84. - Anonymous - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 3:14 pm:

    Could the banning of guns at a gun show be like banning carrying a box of cereal into a grocery store?


  85. - Ken_in_Aurora - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 3:16 pm:

    Let the show go on so long as they’re following all applicable state and local laws. Letting the Gov’s contentious political position get in the way is both bad form and partisan politics at their worst.


  86. - Todd - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 3:18 pm:

    I’m in vegas as the SHOT show….

    Trying to get away from some of this


  87. - Rod - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 3:37 pm:

    As a Chicago citizen with a FOID card I agree with Liandro in relation to his response to 47th ward. The City is passing ordinances that will not be enforced and in fact in many cases haven’t been enforced by the State’s Attorney. In the past two yeara based on news reports there have been at least two cases of home invasion in the city where the home owner shot the intruders with an unregistered weapon. Actually in one case it was a bar owner after hours who lived above the bar.

    No charges were filed against the inviduals in either case according to the media but the weapons were confiscated. But I do agree that the City should have some home rule powers in relation to gun ownership and registration.

    I don’t disagree with a level of training for concealed carry, in fact I don’t disagree even with a finger lock or safe requirement. I am sure there are NRA members out there that would disagree with me on that issue too. But as Liandro points out the City’s primary motivation is to discourage all gun ownership in the City, not to create an efficient registration process.

    I have posted on Rich’s blog links to the forms we have to fill out along with fingerprinting here in the City. This could all be made easy, we could have on line forms plug in our FOID numbers list our guns by type and serial number pay a fee and be done with it. But that is not the way it’s done here, it’s a nightmare and people of all ages, races, men and women are evading registration in the City right now, both the Mayor and Police Superintendent are right when they say people are not reporting when weapons are taken in home burglaries. It is because many, many gun owners are going underground in the City. New laws are going to make it even worse.


  88. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 3:53 pm:

    Rich, like I said earlier, sorry, I thought it was a marginal point. I didn’t mean to hijack the thread. My apologies.

    I was surprised that in states that have conceal-carry that gun shows would ban folks from walking in the door with their own concealed and loaded weapons.

    I still don’t get it, considering they’re cool allowing loaded weapons in other venues, but whatever. Didn’t mean to strike a nerve.

    For what it’s worth, I’m against breaking the contract at the fairgrounds. A contract has been signed and exhibitors and attendees have made plans. I’m not in favor of taking money out of peoples’ pockets who are operating under the law.


  89. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 4:04 pm:

    Todd, when you run into LaPierre, tell him that some of us miss him. That big-money hitter does more heavy lifting for my point of view than an unpaid schmuck like I ever could.

    Have fun, dude. Going to get nasty cold back here this weekend.

    If you haven’t been, check out Hoover Dam. It’s one of the great wonders of the Lower 48. The folks who built it were amazing.


  90. - SO IL M - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 4:13 pm:

    Really. Given Quinns Track Record does anyone really think he will actually cancel this show?


  91. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 4:15 pm:

    –Thanks to skeeter, word, and 47th. Once in a while I’ll get a silly thought, but you make me realize I need to maintain my zero compromise attitude - the exact opposite of yours.–

    Help me out here, cousin: “I need to maintain my zero compromise attitude - the exact opposite of yours”

    What do you mean? Do I have a 100% compromise attidtue? What’s that mean?

    If you could throw me and Skeeter and 47 out of the equation, what is it you’re willing to compromise about? Because you haven’t even defined the issue we’re talking about, allegedly.


  92. - RNUG - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 4:50 pm:

    word,

    That’s one thing we can agree on. Hoover Dam is awesome. I remember back when you had to drive over it. The first time I saw it, I stopped on the east bluff and just stared down at the dam and lake.

    Haven’t been back to Henderson since they built the new bridge; the photos of it make me want to go see it.


  93. - wordslinger - Friday, Jan 18, 13 @ 5:04 pm:

    RNUG, I think we agree on a lot more than Hoover Dam.

    But if you’re worried about it, just give me a holler and I’ll tell you what to agree on, lol.

    I kid.


Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.


* Reader comments closed for the holiday weekend
* Fracking rules finally unveiled
* Question of the day
* A big IDOT roundup
* Even Steven, for now
* *** UPDATED x1 - Confirmed *** Report: Libertarians file charges
* Big guys dinged a bit, but little guys helped a lot
* Today's photo
* Yesterday's blog posts

Support CapitolFax.com
Visit our advertisers...

...............

...............


Search This Blog...

Search the 98th General Assembly By Bill Number
(example: HB0001)

Search the 98th General Assembly By Keyword

          
        * Touchdown! Football Apps for Windows Phone
        * Is sapphire glass all it’s cracked up to be?
        * Galaxy Note 4 resolution confirmed by Samsung site, poster
        * Apple Finalizes Lineup for 2014 iTunes Festival in London, Starts Tonight
        * Why I wish I could charge my iPhone wirelessly
        * First ROMs for the NVIDIA Shield Tablet surface
        * Automate your Mac: four smart hacks for managing files

        * What is the blue light from our screens really doing to our eyes?
        * StoryWorth Squeezes Stories Out of All Your Family Members
        * Android One May Get Official On September 15th
        * Samsung Galaxy Note 4 Resolution Confirmed By Samsung’s Website
        * Apple Spaceship Campus Takes Shape (Video)
        * AT&T sues Cox over DVR patents
        * More Rumors Suggest That Reversible Lightning Cable Will Not Ship With iPhone 6

        * Breaks turn in Quintana's favor against Tigers
        * Molina outrighted; roster spot opens up for Rodon
        * Wilkins, Snodgress part of White Sox shuffle
        * Noesi looks to continue push toward season's end
        * Breaks turn in Quintana's favor against Tigers
        * Dunn to retire following season
        * White Sox deal Dunn to A's for pitching prospect


        Main Menu
        Home
        Illinois
        YouTube
        Pundit rankings
        Obama
        Subscriber Content
        Durbin
        Burris
        Blagojevich Trial
        Advertising
        Updated Posts
        Polls

        Archives
        August 2014
        July 2014
        June 2014
        May 2014
        April 2014
        March 2014
        February 2014
        January 2014
        December 2013
        November 2013
        October 2013
        September 2013
        August 2013
        July 2013
        June 2013
        May 2013
        April 2013
        March 2013
        February 2013
        January 2013
        December 2012
        November 2012
        October 2012
        September 2012
        August 2012
        July 2012
        June 2012
        May 2012
        April 2012
        March 2012
        February 2012
        January 2012
        December 2011
        November 2011
        October 2011
        September 2011
        August 2011
        July 2011
        June 2011
        May 2011
        April 2011
        March 2011
        February 2011
        January 2011
        December 2010
        November 2010
        October 2010
        September 2010
        August 2010
        July 2010
        June 2010
        May 2010
        April 2010
        March 2010
        February 2010
        January 2010
        December 2009
        November 2009
        October 2009
        September 2009
        August 2009
        July 2009
        June 2009
        May 2009
        April 2009
        March 2009
        February 2009
        January 2009
        December 2008
        November 2008
        October 2008
        September 2008
        August 2008
        July 2008
        June 2008
        May 2008
        April 2008
        March 2008
        February 2008
        January 2008
        December 2007
        November 2007
        October 2007
        September 2007
        August 2007
        July 2007
        June 2007
        May 2007
        April 2007
        March 2007
        February 2007
        January 2007
        December 2006
        November 2006
        October 2006
        September 2006
        August 2006
        July 2006
        June 2006
        May 2006
        April 2006
        March 2006
        February 2006
        January 2006
        December 2005
        April 2005
        March 2005
        February 2005
        January 2005
        December 2004
        November 2004
        October 2004

        Blog*Spot Archives
        November 2005
        October 2005
        September 2005
        August 2005
        July 2005
        June 2005
        May 2005

        Syndication

        RSS Feed 2.0
        Comments RSS 2.0
        WordPress

        Loading


        * Politicians to greet voters in Labor Day parades..
        * The Ice Bucket Challenge and its virality..
        * Quinn to live on minimum wage for week..
        * Illinois to spend another $102M on high-speed rail..
        * Quinn announces opening of Algonquin bypass..


        * Little League team honored with parade in Vegas
        * Rauner vow revives governor's mansion question
        * Quinn to live on minimum wage for a week
        * Infection affecting west-central Illinois soybeans
        * Newborn baby found alive inside Illinois trash bin
        * Bank loans used to collect unpaid medical bills
        * Man brings 2 military flares to Illinois sheriff
        * 4 shot to death in Chicago suburb of Elmhurst
        * Springfield drug suspect had reinforced door
        * Beyond governor race, big stakes in Illinois vote

        * Does the governor need to live in the Executive Mansion?
        * Statehouse Insider: Hands off investments
        * State of unions: AFSCME wins some, loses some on outsourcing
        * State of unions: Domination of Illinois' workforce becomes campaign issue
        * State of unions: Lawmakers approved keeping some workers out of unions
        * State of Illinois posts applications for medical marijuana businesses
        * DNR issues long-awaited ‘fracking’ rules
        * Quinn grants 38 clemency requests
        * IDNR issues long-awaited ‘fracking’ rules
        * Court rules state retirees can stop paying health insurance premiums

        * If only it were this easy to lift share prices
        * 'Chicagoland' star returns to school
        * Amid re-election fight, Quinn pushes through a tax on business
        * Chicago's worst IPO in 2014: Ryerson
        * Why ComEd is worried about your smartphone


        * Pullman Park needs Congress’ support
        * Leave the Knee Defender at home
        * Dump ‘Fake IG,’  give Ferguson more power
        * Not so fast, say the grown-ups
        * When common sense and gun rights collide
        * Alvarez: Crime lab backlog held up DNA evidence on Evans’ gun
        * EDITORIAL: Jury still out on justice in Koschman case
        * Rogers Park woman killed in crash on Tri-State Tollway near Schiller Park
        * 2 dead, 10 wounded in shootings across Chicago since Friday evening
        * Women at work: Female ministers find obstacles on path to pulpit


        * Tammy Duckworth pregnant, expecting girl in December
        * 1 dead, 11 hurt in shootings across city
        * Cops: Man batters woman and child, throws toddler from vehicle
        * Tougher rules ahead on domestic abuse
        * New sculpture in Niles to be dedicated to St. John Paul II
        * 'As horrible as it sounds, it came out of love': family of 4 dead in murder-suicide
        * No bail for 2nd man charged in killing of woman days before Mother's Day
        * Area gun ranges defend training youths
        * Quinn takes on minimum wage challenge


        * Newborn Found Alive In Jacksonville Trash Bin
        * Donated Breast Milk Helps Sick Infants
        * DNR Releases Fracking Rules
        * Update From Ferguson Via KWMU's Rachel Lippmann
        * Listen to State Week - August 29, 2014
        * Inspector's Report Reveals Clout Hiring At IDOT
        * 'Belleville' The Movie Is NOT A Documentary
        * Journalist and doctor encourage honest conversations about death
        * Undocumented Immigrants Call For Presidential Orders
        * State Retirees To Stop Paying Health Premiums


        * Does the governor need to live in the Executive Mansion?
        * Our Opinion: Driving into floodwater a deadly practice
        * Angie Muhs: A debate in Springfield would send the right message from candidates
        * Charles Krauthammer: Lower corporate tax rates. Now.
        * Bernard Schoenburg: Dillman, Watson looking at possible runs for alderman
        * Statehouse Insider: Hands off investments
        * Statehouse Insider: Hands off investments
        * State of unions: AFSCME wins some, loses some on outsourcing
        * State of unions: Domination of Illinois' workforce becomes campaign issue
        * State of unions: Lawmakers approved keeping some workers out of unions


        * Labor Day parade steps off at 10 a.m.
        * Daily Digest 9/1/14
        * Winery festival homage to ‘Lucy’ grape stomping
        * New festival eyed for Gibson City
        * Area Calendar 9/1/14
        * Ag leaders honored for long service
        * Coach needs time to develop team
        * Bad schedule is by design
        * Coal mine would have future costs
        * Dey's articles on Salaita a pleasure


        * Roosevelt move part of 'tectonic shift' in education
        * How do you build I-290 bridge with 80,000 cars driving by a day?
        * Iraq veteran U.S. Rep. Duckworth announces pregnancy
        * Record-setting Kane County Cougars on a roll
        * Donnie Wahlberg and Jenny McCarthy wed in St. Charles

        * Representative Jan Schakowsky: On This Lab...
        * Schakowsky: House GOP to blame for gridloc...
        * Dems urge CMS to ensure accurate nursing h...
        * Connie Bruck Whitewashes Schakowsky--and J...
        * Legislation proposes mandating 24/7 nursin...
        * Statement by Representative Jan Schakowsky...
        * Farm Antibiotic Restrictions Proposed - Al...
        * Jan Schakowsky: Tom Marino's Response to '...
        * Telling Nancy Pelosi to do research is sex...
        * Schakowsky blasts Marino for 'sexist' atta...

        * Durbin On Social Security Shortfall...
        * Durbin On Social Security Shortfall...
        * Durbin On Social Security Shortfall...
        * Durbin On Social Security Shortfall...
        * Durbin On Social Security Shortfall...

        * Putin Hopeful Russia Won’t Lose Right to H......
        * Susquenita enters Tri-Valley League under ......
        * Putin hopeful Russia won't lose right to h......
        * Soccer-Putin hopeful Russia won't lose rig......

        * Rauner uses armed investigators to scare off third-party voters. This is what Rauner’s democracy looks like.
        * Labor Day.
        * Kristin Crowell. Beating Rahm requires deep organizing.
        * Life in Rahm’s Chicago. The death of a nameless homeless man in Logan Square.
        * Hidden in Plain Sight: The Architecture of Chicago's Labor Movement
        * Contemplating on Labor Day whether “labor” will influence this election
        * Durbin - Oberweis race tightening; Oberweis endorsed by Bishop Trotter
        * "The Tarot Show" Coming To Uptown Arts Center
        * ... Or Are You Just Happy To See Me?
        * Oberweis will attempt to bypass Quinn with veto override


        * Governor Quinn Invests $102 Million in High-Speed Rail Upgrades on Chicago-St. Louis Line - Funding Will Improve Capacity, Safety on Joliet-Dwight Segment
        * Quinn Refuses to Answer New IDOT Questions
        * IDNR Delivers Revised Rules to Implement Hydraulic Fracturing Regulatory Act - Rules strengthened to ensure public participation, improve transparency, toughen penalties and protect the environment
        * Governor Quinn Proclaims September as “Recovery Month” in Illinois - Encourages people to speak up about mental illness and substance abuse
        * Governor Quinn Dedicates Jane Byrne Interchange - Governor Renames Circle Interchange in Honor of Chicago’s First and Only Female Mayor to Date




            Hosted by MCS SUBSCRIBE to Capitol Fax Advertise Here Mobile Version Contact Rich Miller