72 Comments - Chris - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 10:22 am: Completely unsurprising and the right procedural decision. - Urbs In Horto - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 10:34 am: I’m a bit confused. Rich, you say that the extension of time to file a cert. petition “also extended” the time before the Seventh Circuit issues its mandate. Is that so? Did the SCOTUS expressly order the Seventh Circuit to state the mandate? - Urbs In Horto - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 10:36 am: Wait - I think I just got it. Rich, you mean that the July 9 date is a new date, after being extended. Right? - RonOglesby - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 10:40 am: @URbs, the 9th was the new date for the stay to be lifted after lisa got a 30 day extension. (court said no other stays would be issued). This is from SCOTUS, extending Lisa’s time further for appeal to SCOTUS. So there is still a “cliff” as of July 9th, (the 7th’s stay is lifted) and now Lisa can appeal up to July 22nd. - Irish - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 10:55 am: A look into the future if Lisa becomes Governor. Another term of a Gov working night and day to do nothing. - Mason born - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:02 am: Seems to me if PQ really wants to stick it to LM he almost has to Veto in in order to blame her for not appealing. Otherwise signing the bill takes the pressure off of her I.e. no ban to appeal. - Anon - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:02 am: Apparently half a year isn’t enough to decide whether or not to appeal. - Esquire - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:06 am: To be more precise, Associate United States Supreme Court Justice Elena Kagan approved Lisa Madigan’s request for an extension of time to file a writ of certiorari. The US Supreme Court justices are assigned Federal Circuits for administrative duties and Kagan has responsibility for the 7th Circuit. As such, the routine decision was not unexpected. Kagan is an Obama appointee after all. The lead makes it sound as if the full US Supreme Court granted the extension. Not so. - Chris - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:08 am: “Seems to me if PQ really wants to stick it to LM he almost has to Veto in in order to blame her for not appealing.” She absolutely should NOT appeal until there is no compliant CC law enacted. That’s the point of the extensions. “Apparently half a year isn’t enough to decide whether or not to appeal.” This is a foolishly ill-informed criticism. - Chris - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:10 am: “As such, the routine decision was not unexpected. Kagan is an Obama appointee after all.” Do you genuinely believe that that has anything to do with it? That Nino or Alito would not have granted an extension for cert petition beyond the date where the basis for the cert becomes ripe? Perhaps they would have only extended the date to July 8 or 9, but that would seem unnecessarily churlish. - Esquire - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:21 am: “Do you genuinely believe that that has anything to do with it?” Granting an extension is a fairly routine decision, provided that the order also stated no further extensions. Off topic: As for Kagan’s sterling judicial qualities, why didn’t she recuse herself from the healthcare decision? Oh, because the Obama administration really needed her vote? - Stones - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:36 am: As a state, we stink at a number of things but kicking the can down the road isn’t one of them. - Hedley Lamarr - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:50 am: An extension from Kagan may be unsurprising, but the granting of a second extension without a petition specifying extenuating circumstances or why the first extension was insufficient is unusual and without the Justice stating a limit to the court’s consideration of petitions for endless extensions is highly unusual. - wordslinger - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 12:09 pm: –The lead makes it sound as if the full US Supreme Court granted the extension. Not so. – What’s your point, if you have one? - dupage dan - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 12:32 pm: So, Hedy, I mean Hedley, does that mean we can expect MOTS? Ad Nauseum? - Election Lawyer Abe - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 12:34 pm: Quinn still has until August 5th to act on the bill, so this just pushes the petition date past the 7th Circuit Deadline. - Formerly Known As... - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 12:53 pm: If Quinn was planning to veto before, he still vetoes now. Then he hits the Attorney General for not already appealing the ruling, thus forcing him to do her office’s job. He also forces her to make the decision - appeal and possibly damage the overall gun control cause or do not appeal and risk looking “weak” on gun control. This whole dance is now for the sake of Cook County votes in the Democratic primary. Nothing more, nothing less. - Libertyville's favorite son - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:04 pm: If Quinn was going to veto, he would have done it by now. - Sweet little lies - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:10 pm: Amazing how many Chicago Democrats in the GA voted for HB 183. Apparently this is not an issue in IL anymore. Sign it Quinn! - A. Nonymous - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:10 pm: “Apparently half a year isn’t enough to decide whether or not to appeal.” It’s odd that so many supposed Second Amendment “supporters” so vociferously and so bitterly complain about our democracy. Welcome to America y’all. - charles in charge - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:34 pm: -If Quinn was going to veto, he would have done it by now.- Wrong, wrong, wrong. - RonOglesby - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:35 pm: @formerly, — This whole dance is now for the sake of Cook County votes in the Democratic primary. — Yup. Its coming. The cards (short of some hidden whole card) have all been put on the table, the bets made. This is just theater here at the end. - RonOglesby - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:35 pm: hole card… Damn you auto correct. - Just Observing - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:43 pm: === “Apparently half a year isn’t enough to decide whether or not to appeal.” It’s odd that so many supposed Second Amendment “supporters” so vociferously and so bitterly complain about our democracy. Welcome to America y’all. === @A. Nonymous - 1. I think its quite a stretch to state that the commenter “vociferously” and “so bitterly” complained. 2. What is undemocratic about criticizing the actions, or lack thereof, of public officials? - Logic not emotion - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:45 pm: Maybe her office has been too busy updating the Guide to the Open Meetings Act on her website dated August 2004. - Logic not emotion - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 1:52 pm: To be fair, the other portion of her website related to FOIA and OMA is good. - Mason born - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 2:16 pm: As far as this being Kagan issuing extension. the wording may have been different but any supreme would have issued the extension. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 2:19 pm: July 9th isn’t going to be pretty at this rate. - Stay tuned - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 2:27 pm: Im not so naive as to think this is about guns. What is the really all about? - Stay tuned - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 2:28 pm: What is Quinn really waiting for? Every Chicago machine member signed off on this. - Stay tuned - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 2:32 pm: Quinn short veto today, let the GA override him tomorrow and be done. This has nothing to do with guns. - Stay tuned - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 2:34 pm: Here we go. Special session to convene in July. You’ll get your bill then. Watch. - Stay tuned - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 2:47 pm: Quinn will not veto leaving every community in this state rushing to create their own laws. He will veto or amandatory veto just to let the GA override. The July special session will be timed just for that. - A. Nonymous - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:01 pm: @ Just - I was commenting on 2A commenterS … Plural. Simple used that quote as but one example from among many. Regardless, it is odd to be professing support for one single supposedly ill-defined right while complaining about our other rights. I use the phrase “Ill-defined” based on other gun enthusiasts’ claims that these court cases are simply attempts to help define the language used in the Second Amendment. For folks who know their history, 2A was well-defined up until about 1977 when the NRA changed leadership and 2A suddenly became ill-defined, thus requiring incessant law suits. - GA Watcher - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:07 pm: Looks like the Governor has been given a two-week extension for his veto review as well. - Gray - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:12 pm: “For folks who know their history, 2A was well-defined up until about 1977 when the NRA changed leadership and 2A suddenly became ill-defined, thus requiring incessant law suits.” Except the NRA did everything possible to squash any Second Amendment lawsuits in 2003 & 2004. SCOTUS did not accept an NRA 2A case, it decided a case filed by Alan Gura and funded by Robert Levy, who were not “NRA” nor funded by such. - A. Nonymous - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:15 pm: Rich needs to do a new QOTD — What will Gov. Quinn do with the CCW bill? 1. Full veto 2. Amendatory veto 3. Sign it as is 4. Avoid signing and let it go into effect on its own - A. Nonymous - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:16 pm: Fine Gray. Exchange “NRA” with “gun activists”. Means the same thing. - Just Observing - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:19 pm: === I use the phrase “Ill-defined” based on other gun enthusiasts’ claims that these court cases are simply attempts to help define the language used in the Second Amendment. For folks who know their history, 2A was well-defined up until about 1977 when the NRA changed leadership and 2A suddenly became ill-defined, thus requiring incessant law suits === Lots of laws and constitutional rights were “defined” and subsequently further “defined” by the courts over the years. The position you are seemingly advancing is that the courts today really agree with the constitutionality of laws such as prohibiting cc in Illinois, but they have become puppets of the NRA and are unable to remain unbiased. Moreover, I never really understood the argument used that the NRA should be tied to circa 1977 positions. Can’t organizations change their positions? Isn’t that internal-democracy at work? That’s like saying the Democratic party should still be pro-slavery because they once were. Or the Republican party should never change their position on gay marriage otherwise it would by hypocritical. - Stay tuned - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:19 pm: I don’t blame the AG. She is just trying to force him in to a decision. This is a good thing. Problem for her: she doesn’t want to announce her own bid before he makes a decision. She’ll be asked if she would sign it if she were Guv - Stay tuned - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:25 pm: Quinn has more to lose not signing it. He will sign or do nothing - Rich Miller - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:28 pm: ===She’ll be asked if she would sign it if she were Guv === Agreed. - Sprungfield - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:28 pm: Keep in mind. Quinn, Emmanuel and Preckwinkle support HB183. He will sign when he gets what he wants. - Too legit - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:39 pm: Keep in mind, if Quinn vetoes , he would essentially be telling the constituents of the Democrts who voted for HB183 they put their safety at risk. Not going to happen. - Rich Miller - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:41 pm: ===Not going to happen.=== That assume he cares. - Too legit - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:42 pm: To Mr Miller: I forgot to add. It’s an election year. He needs their support, right? - Mason born - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:53 pm: – Not going to happen. – Sorry but just like he needs AFSCME support. See contract mess. (yes union got sweet contract in end but till then) See Pushing Madigan bill. Just like he needs the support of the Sierra Club and similar in cook county. See Fracking rules. PQ has his own little calculus that he uses. To be honest i am not sure how he makes his equations balance but he seems to be unafraid to push away his base. I think his desire for Gun control is a “principle” thing with him. It’s hard (impossible) to imagine him signing it without doing something. - Mason born - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 3:59 pm: okay Sierra club was a bad example please replace with NRDC. - Real American - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 4:54 pm: When are the People of Illinois wise up and get rid of theses clowns running the State. Delay, Delay, Waste time and money… Their all a bunch a Criminals - RonOglesby - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 5:07 pm: @ Just Observing, Dont argue with A. Non… he wishes to re-argue Heller. and pretty much every decision since. All of that makes no difference (though I like your thought process). We are where we are today and we deal with it or not. - Games of thrones - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 5:17 pm: Quinn will veto, Madigan appeals and SCOTUS stays the lower courts injunction. - Ummmm - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 5:35 pm: Quinn cannot sign 183. He said squarley that he would sign concealed carry legislation. He will NOT give Lusa or any other candidate that “ammo”. He would let it sit and become law on its own first. It’s far more likely he amends it and sends it back to the ILGA. Once there Forby SHOULD refuse to bring it to a vote and this forces Lisa to appeal and there’s nothing Michael can do about it. Lisa is then known nationally for being the one who destroyed fully the gun control agenda across the country. All because her clan wanted to keep Chicago immune to enumerated rights. Quinn can ride side seat to the Democrat primary victory with Forby driving - he and Rahm save face fully and leave the madigans holding responsibility for everything from pensions to carry. Right now the amendatory veto awaits the go button with consideration afforded to outright veto. Forby — you have to know that gun owners will be torqued if you bring that basket case up for an override vote and it passes. You have to know that your duty is to see that bill die and anything Quinn amends die too. Are you a hero for individual liberty or are you a democrat patsy, Mr Forby? Hmmmm? It is your choice…. - crunch - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 5:51 pm: To think the people of Illinois voted for both of these people - Preaching to the choir - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 6:20 pm: This is the state of Illinois. We don’t need the governor for anything. Quinn can sit, sign or veto. The GA has the power. PS. It’s already been decided. No senator or representative is going against the Madigans. Quinn has never had support in the party. He is the accidental governor. - A. Nonymous - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 6:39 pm: @ Ron - “Dont argue with A. Non… he wishes to re-argue Heller.” That’s right. When you know you’ve lost the debate you just pick up your ball and go home. The fact remains that for more than 200 years the meaning behind the Second Amendment was settled via legislative and judicial precedent at the state and national levels. Then Scalia, et al decided to re-define it. As for… “We are where we are today and we deal with it or not.” We’re all Americans here. I choose to rest my case on 200+ years of American history. That is how I “deal with it.” You choose to rest your case on a few decades of revisionist-based history which magically began appearing en masse about 40 years ago. That is how you “deal with it.” This process of re-defining the Second Amendment will inevitably lead to more deaths by gun. Not because gun owners will suddenly go nuts — I don’t think that for a second (no matter how many times gun owners put those words in people’s mouths). But because the reality is that gun ACCIDENTS are incredibly common. So common the news media virtually ignores them. In other words, for however safe you think you and your weapons are… keep your loaded gun away from me and mine. I don’t need to be accidentally shot while shopping or at the movies even though you think you’re loaded gun will somehow protect you from unseen boogey men who might pop out at any moment. And yes, accidental shootings really are very common. It’s a big part of why the United States leads the civilized world in gun-related deaths. You can ignore facts and data but accidental shootings are how nearly a dozen American kids have died since the legislature passed the CCW bill (just kids, that doesn’t include adults) and why more Americans have died of gunshot wounds in just the few months since the Newtown tragedy than US soldiers were killed during the entire Iraq War. [Sources: #GunFAIL, a grassroots effort to record accidental shootings that happen in America every week, and National Journal http://www.nationaljournal.com/nationalsecurity/gun-deaths-since-newtown-now-surpass-number-of-americans-killed-in-iraq-20130530.] - just demoralized - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 6:49 pm: - Ummmmm Since Rep. Phelps was the Primary Sponsor of HB 183, doesn’t he get the first crack of deciding whether to override the Governor’s Veto or Amendatory Veto? - BR - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 7:00 pm: A. non… is clearly missing a major point.. Protecting oneself and ones family is a God given right… above all. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 7:55 pm: ==Protecting oneself and ones family is a God given right== Brother. Here we go with this God given right stuff again. Having a gun is not a God given right. I’m for CC and gun rights but I absolutely despise this misguided argument. - Demoralized - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 7:58 pm: @A.Non: You can argue what you want but you really need to just accept that the gun issue is what it is. The Courts have decided this stuff and you really need to move on and figure out a way to live with it as opposed to jump up and down and tell us all the ways you think this is all wrong. The bulk of the argument you make is lost. Get over it already. - Arthur Andersen - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 8:44 pm: Can we just get FOID Carry in Sangamon County and not worry about all this maneuvering? I’ve had the pistola oiled up for weeks ready to go and these delays are such a buzzkill. #snark - BR - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 8:47 pm: Demoralized… I am not your “Brother”… and really don’t care at all about your relationship with God. But I will protect myself and my family as is necessary and consider it my God given right… - wordslinger - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 8:52 pm: Gee Whiz, BR, you seem awfully in-tune with God in regards to your rights. Doesn’t God also want you to think of all men as your brothers? Or haven’t you gotten to that part yet? Where do you find the part about guns, anyway? Is it in the “Turn the Other Cheek” section, lol. - Gurnee livin - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 9:01 pm: Can we all agree the decision to sign or not has already been decided. ?? - BR - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 9:04 pm: No… You aren’t my brother…never goin’ to be. Don’t do Muslim. - wordslinger - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 9:31 pm: BR, thanks for your insights on faith and the Constitution. They’ve really added a lot to the discussion. Don’t forget to look under the bed tonight after you say your prayers. - BR - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:15 pm: Wordslinger take your condescending remarks… and…. - BR - Tuesday, Jun 18, 13 @ 11:19 pm: Sling this….. - A. Nonymous - Wednesday, Jun 19, 13 @ 7:21 am: @ Demoralized - “you really need to move on and figure out a way to live with it as opposed to jump up and down and tell us all the ways you think this is all wrong. The bulk of the argument you make is lost. Get over it already.” This line of discussion began with me pointing the hypocrisy in self-proclaimed rights activists complaining about democracy in process. It then led to a little history lesson for Ron Oglesby, Just Observing, etc. In fact, that history lesson puts the lie to your “get over it” admonition. The vocal minority in America that wanted to overturn 200 years of American history by re-defining the Second Amendment have not “gotten over it” for the past 30-40 years… Instead they’ve been “jumping up and down and telling us the ways they think 200 years of history was all wrong.” And they’re so good at “jumping up and down” that they’ve completely halted basic, common sense ideas like background checks even though 80-90% of Americans support it, including big majorities of gun owners. - Gurnee livin - Wednesday, Jun 19, 13 @ 7:39 am: Was this passed with a super majority in the GA to prevent Quinn from trying to even negotiate with any legislators on pension reform? He can’t hold anyone hostage. Now Madigan is pushing him to sign! - Pardon our dust - Wednesday, Jun 19, 13 @ 7:44 am: I think Quinn’s only power with CCW is simply not taking any action. He knows this will become law either way. - A. Nonymous - Wednesday, Jun 19, 13 @ 9:13 am: @ Pardon - he could make some AV’s and then work to convince enough leges to vote against override. Then call a press conference to slam Lisa for not appealing while lauding himself for making the law safer while lamenting that his hands were tied by the meanies on the Federal court. - Juan - Thursday, Jun 20, 13 @ 10:05 am: To the person saying that there are so many accidental gun related deaths every year, well you need to be informed that there is less than 700 gun related accidents nation wide every year and they are at an all time low. That includes men, women and children. Gun violence is at an all time low since 1993 and gun ownership is an at alltime high since then also. FBI data, by the way, I did not invented this numbers. Sorry, comments for this post are now closed.