73 Comments - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 2:53 pm: WIU has not demonstrated that it is effective at attracting students. No more money should be sent there until we see improvement in enrollment. - Anon - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 2:59 pm: I am just dying to see these rates for the progressive tax. They will be eye popping when you consider the number of big dollar projects the progressive tax is supposed to fund on top of filling the structure budget deficit and handling the pension ramp payment increase on the horizon. People are going to be stunned when they see just how big a jump we are looking at. - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:00 pm: Anon, the rates will likely kill you, so you’ll get your wish soon enough. - Pot calling kettle - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:00 pm: Maybe the local members of the GA need to step up and discuss revenue. I’m guessing they expect the Gov to come in and save their university, but they also say the state has plenty of money and needs to cut its way to a balanced budget. Sorry folks, but you cannot have it both ways. Sen. Tracy and Rep. Hammond are both in leadership. What is the best policy for WIU? - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:01 pm: The Board also violated the Open Meetings Act several times and when they were forced to release the recordings of those meetings it was clear that President Jack Thomas was lying to the WIU community. - Iggy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:05 pm: a sad time to be a leather neck - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:13 pm: Iggy, sad times for everyone in Illinois. - Blue Dog Dem - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:14 pm: Applying standards to previous administrations, JB owns this. - City Zen - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:20 pm: “Buy into Western Illinois University” I’d like to, but SURS took my down payment. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:21 pm: Governor Pritzker will need to show a commitment to building these universities to where they were “20 years” ago, but that’s not going to happen in 20 minutes. I think if the Governor can illustrate that his words will match actions to stave off unreturnable decline, then that will be a good long term start for schools like Western. The fear, for me, is that what Pritzker thinks is staving off a disaster ending with tougher choices… might not be doing that staving off. The universities need to be organized, but with that reorganization, the universities not only keep their identities, but keep their full service status to be that regional engine for jobs, and most importantly education. This is a troubling day if you worry about Illinois higher ed. - cover - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:21 pm: = WIU has not demonstrated that it is effective at attracting students. No more money should be sent there until we see improvement in enrollment. = So the beatings should continue until the morale improves? - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:24 pm: Compare the salaries of faculty at WIU to faculty at UIS and ISU, the WIU salaries are too high. - BenFolds5 - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:28 pm: Governors own. It is laughable that for 4 years Rauner was blamed, rightly, for his part. Now, a new Governor and common sense that it’s a much bigger longer standing issue is the theme? As a proud Leatherneck, I chose my children’s future over my University. I give serious Kudos to JB not cutting any special deals. - jim - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:30 pm: Gee, I thought he promised everything to everybody. - Last Bull Moose - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:33 pm: Back when I did cost reduction as a consultant, costs came in as a step function. Individual cost saving ideas paid off if they permitted the company to close a shift. The big money was in closing a plant. The state needs a higher ed strategy that reflects current economics and demographics. Some of the regionals may be closed. Hope not. But we should act with a plan. We seem to be stumbling forward in blindness. - wordslinger - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:34 pm: It’s going to take time and commitment to restore public universities and community colleges to where they need to be. But there’s still something to build on, and the so-called “directionals” are critical for regional economic development. Once they’re gone, they ain’t coming back. - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:37 pm: Jay Robert, get that checkbook out and write a whopper to WIU. - Chicagonk - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:40 pm: I don’t know what the solution is for schools like WIU, SIU, EIU, and Chicago State. I definitely think WIU should look at going to D2 or D3 for athletics (same with EIU and Chicago State). They also need to be spending their money better when it comes to marketing and recruiting. - Ghost - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:41 pm: Rauner did a lot of damage by reducing student loans and holding back higher ed funding. the schools lost enrollment. they need to build that back to support the staff. they need to expand school funding to provide for cost reductions or free college for state residents. we export work to highly educated persons in foreign countries and are importing doctors because we are not educating sufficient numbers of our population. - Earnest - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:43 pm: >Three of the seven governor-appointed seats on the board are vacant while the terms of three sitting members expired in January. I don’t think Pritzker should be finding emergency money for things like these. He should focus on the longer term view. Appointing some strong board members would seem to be a good step. - City Zen - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:44 pm: ==Some of the regionals may be closed.== How about some of the regionals’ regionals? Does WIU need two campuses? - Phenomnyous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:45 pm: At least their student workers will be making a living wage. I mean, it won’t help them if the university closes…but if you can’t afford to pay people at least $15 an hour, then you should probably rethink your business model. Am I right? - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:45 pm: The regionals need to refocus on a mission that is sustainable, since those who can afford 4 years of residential education are diminishing. How about a 3 year plan? Co-op education? Eliminating the grad college and the accompanying expectations for faculty research? Increasing teaching load if faculty are primarily appointed to teach? Lots of meat available to change delivery of education in a fund-limited future. Praying for the 1970s is not a plan. - histprof - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:50 pm: Great point, Ghost. The problem is how to transition preparing much needed Doctors or Nurses, etc. Here the barrier is likely to be lack of college prep. We need more college graduates, but we have to accept more and more students who are not ready because of demographic decline. This will take a national comprehensive strategy. The question is how long Western can hang on until that happens. (Or we could just continue to import educated people. But will Trump voters turn on them as they have on lower skill immigrants? If past is prelude . . . ) - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 3:57 pm: - Last Bull Moose - Once you close a university, it’s not coming back. Governors open schools, they don’t close universities. I’d like to see, again, a reorganization, and with that, the regional schools make their hay servicing Illinoisans, and make the local educating the big seller to keep students here, We’re losing too many students when the way the schools won’t attract local students. More needs to be done. Closing universities is damaging to these regions. - 2nd Highest - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:03 pm: Illinois spends more money on higher education per pupil than any other state. In 2017, the total educational expenditure per full time equivalent (FTE) in Illinois was $23,228, 64 percent higher than the national average of $14,151 per FTE student (State Higher Education Executive Officers 2018). With a 43.2 percent increase, or an increase of $7,005 per FTE, no state in the country has increased total educational revenue per FTE more than Illinois from pre-recession levels. While tuition rates have increased, so has state and local educational appropriations. As of 2017, Illinois had the second highest appropriations in the country at $16,055 per FTE. 2017 marked the all-time high in state and local support per FTE in Illinois’ history. - CPA - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:06 pm: Calling this “Progressive Taxes” is just advertising. Reality is a lot of people will pay more taxes by increasing the rates. Or they will cut some the credits / deductions like dividend subtraction, property tax, tuiton, 529 reductions? Surprised nobody talks about the existing credits/deductions in Illinois. - Trapped in the 'burbs - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:08 pm: State schools are not on the radar for most kids in Illinois. Out of state schools offer significantly better financial deals for our kids. Unless Illinois makes a significant commitment to keep Illinois kids in Illinois, it will continue to be bleak. - Jibba - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:08 pm: Chicagonik…every state school loses money on athletics including Illinois. Perhaps some of the directionals should consider dropping athletics altogether. Would you really avoid a school that didn’t have a football team if it were affordable and provided a good education? U of Chicago seems to have survived dropping athletics. - lake county democrat - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:09 pm: –School statistics show WIU lost more than 4,000 students over the past ten years.– I’m all for getting WIU more money, even with the need to tighten our belts and raise taxes, but hard to avoid any layoffs with that kind of decline. - Doing Human Things - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:12 pm: While emergency funding would be a HUGE help to the large number of people who have lost their jobs, getting a new board seated ASAP is just as much a priority (and the petition addresses this). A big reason why WIU is in as bad of a situation as it’s in has been the inept (and sometimes actively malicious) leadership by the top-level administration and the board of trustees. WIU needs the new board members put into place so they can clean things out and get people into place who can actually get things moving in the right direction. EIU was in a similar position and they’ve started to turn things around. It can happen, but WIU needs new leadership first. - Henry Francis - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:13 pm: What if Bruce and Di wrote them a big check? The Rauner School of Economics at WIU has a nice ring to it. - City Guy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:15 pm: I don’t know if it would work, but it would be interesting to see if one of the directional schools could be developed as a stripped down inexpensive but quality choice for students. All decisions would be focused on providing a good education for as little as possible while maintaining quality. This may mean not having some sports or some programs that require advanced laboratories. Professors would be encouraged to consider the cost of books. The school could make use of web learning and condensed schedules to graduate students in 3 years instead of 4 or 5 to save the student more money. The goal would be to attract students who want a good inexpensive education from Illinois and elsewhere. - 47th Ward - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:15 pm: ===The school saw what was coming and pulled the plug=== The calvary is not coming to save the Leathernecks. They’re going to have to rely on themselves. Operating a university is hard, but they’ve seen enrollment and revenue decline for at least a decade. They need to align their spending with their revenue. That means layoffs. It’s not like they can simply raise tuition to cover the difference. Those days are over. Now it’s prioritizing and there are no easy answers. Also, it takes an official declaration of financial emergency before tenured faculty can be terminated. This is that, and is the beginning of a long process I’m sure. There is a way forward for WIU, but it will be as a smaller, leaner organization. Lots of eyes on it too, because WIU is only the first, it won’t be the last public university to go through this right-sizing process. Somebody (Archpundit?) said it better on a previous thread, but it’s true. If WIU doesn’t focus on its students first and foremost, and give them what they want, it won’t be able to give the community anything. - sulla - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:17 pm: “WIU has not demonstrated that it is effective at attracting students. No more money should be sent there until we see improvement in enrollment.” That’s tough when the region your university serves is hemorrhaging population. I don’t think a lot of folks really understand how bad “Forgottonia” has gotten whacked by population loss. Here are the population deltas between 1980 and today for WIU’s region: Adams County: -7.1% Hancock County: -22.5% Schuyler County: -17.3% Fulton County: -18.7% McDonough County: -17.2% Henderson County: -25.5% Warren County: -20.9% Knox County: -17.3% Henry County: -13% Mercer County: -18.6% - Michelle Flaherty - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:21 pm: Rauner starved higher ed and the individual fiefdoms all but imploded themselves. Now the question is whether they can get past/over themselves to figure out what they can be and should be before it’s too late. Face it, you aren’t going back to anything. What can your school be going forward? You have about two months to figure it out. - City Zen - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:29 pm: ==Illinois spends more money on higher education per pupil than any other state.== I never would have guessed, but it indeed appears Illinois has one of the highest spends per pupil on higher education in the country. But guess where that money’s going? “increased by 56% in Illinois (wheremuch of the funding went to under-funded pensions), and by smaller amounts in nine other states.” I hope SURS has a good research facility. https://trends.collegeboard.org/college-pricing/figures-tables/state-local-funding-student-1000-personal-income-state-2016-17 - Pot calling kettle - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:34 pm: ==Governor Pritzker will need to show a commitment to building these universities to where they were “20 years” ago, but that’s not going to happen in 20 minutes.== Very true, but he should have the backing of the state reps and senators that represent those universities. Some of them finally stepped up in 2017 after two years of disaster, but they quickly went back into their shells. It would be very helpful if they would form a caucus that supports a recovery plan. The painful part for the Republicans in that caucus will be the revenue side. The money to rebuild Western, Eastern, and SIUC will need to come from somewhere. What are those Republicans willing to support? Will they lead based on the needs of their districts, or will they continue to follow a few wealthy donors who don’t live downstate and don’t care what happens to the regionals? If JB asks for support, which side will those folks be on? - Robert Lincoln - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:35 pm: Why is consolidation or elimination never considered as an option? Grade schools do it. High Schools do it. A university does not have a predestined right to exist. - BenFolds5 - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:35 pm: Pension obligations need to be paid. But, they are going to sink this state. This wasn’t a Rauner issue. It was many years issue. This is bleak. - Scamp640 - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:47 pm: @ 2nd Highest. The numbers you cite to say IL has such high expenditures include the pension payments. Try some simple math. Let’s say WIU has 8000 students. JB is going to give WIU $50,000,000. Divide $50,000,000 by 8,000 and you get $6,250. You can increase this number to include some MAP grant funding. But the number is nowhere near what you have cited. - Alton Adam - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:48 pm: Is anything in Illinois going well? - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:53 pm: - Pot Calling Kettle - Agreed. Those are downstate, mostly ex-Raunerites, that some found their way, but now… Those GA members need to be willing to work with this administration… if this administration is willing to that commitment too. Well said. - City Zen - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:54 pm: ==Governor Pritzker will need to show a commitment to building these universities to where they were “20 years” ago== If the goal is 20 years ago, then seriously under-funding their pensions would be a good start. Because that was the secret ingredient of 1999. That and Ricky Martin. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:55 pm: ===the individual fiefdoms all but imploded themselves. Now the question is whether they can get past/over themselves to figure out what they can be and should be before it’s too late.=== The universities have to have a want to exist, and meet new challenges. - Michelle Flaherty- calls this correct too. - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 4:57 pm: - City Zen - The goal here is to find solutions to get things better and not repeat past failing for a sugar high fix. You know this, but if you’re not bashing pensions, labor, and the “unfairness”, what are you adding? - Last Bull Moose - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:02 pm: OW. I recognize that a closed university is gone for good. I would like to keep them all. It may not be possible. Whatever survives will be different than what exists today. Ordering the tide not to come in still doesn’t work. - Lester Holt’s Mustache - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:06 pm: ==A university does not have a predestined right to exist== Good point. Why, exactly, does the state need to bail out Western? As Pot calling Kettle notes, Sen. Tracy and Rep. Hammond have leadership positions yet are unwilling to support new revenue for anything else on the long list of things in Illinois that need funding. JB should offer a trade - their votes for progressive income tax for a WIU bailout. Otherwise, hard pass - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:11 pm: Choosing to close university(ies) will be a significant stagnation to the downstate region losing it. Unlike a prison… Apartments, businesses, restaurants… pensioners don’t use those things, but students do. Then add the workforce, the money spent by all… prisoners aren’t spending in these towns. Being flippant thinking you’re being frugal won’t help this state… as you think it helps in budgets. - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:26 pm: Another problem is that universities think they must always grow, in both number and complexity of programs. Not every regional needs to become like Illinois. Adding expensive grad colleges, Engineering, flight schools, etc. simply makes them more expensive and less connected to their home population. When they are running at half capacity as they are now, they need to focus on undergraduate education for students in their region. Quicker, cheaper, and smaller will survive rather than trying to create Champaign in Macon. - lost in the weeds - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:28 pm: I am not understanding why losing a university is a good thing. Western Illinois is already a basket case. How does closing the University help? Keep hearing about we need jobs and build an economic engine, etc. What is better than a University to do that? - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:40 pm: ===Western Illinois is already a basket case. How does closing the University help?=== Western Illinois is already a basket case. How does pouring more money into the basket case help? - City Zen - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:41 pm: ==The goal here is to find solutions== You don’t find a solution until you clearly admit what the problem is: We are already making a large investment - one of the largest investments nationwide - in higher education. For better or worse, SURS is our primary higher ed investment vehicle of choice. This needs to be 100% clear to every resident, including all the higher ed advocates who conveniently leave out pension costs from education spend. They are one in the same. It’s a painful yet necessary step in the process towards a solution. People cannot make an educated decision otherwise. But if we’re spit balling band-aid fixes, how about $100M of those $300M yearly increases currently earmarked for lower ed goes to higher ed? Or all of it? If higher ed is the priority, then make it so. If not, then don’t. - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:46 pm: Nonetheless, the problem child of the university system continues to operate with all of its special funding in place. Chicago State actually used to get a specific cut of lottery dollars. CSU has enrollment problems that are worse than WIU. - Scamp640 - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 5:56 pm: I note several “drive by” commentators such as anonymous at 5:40pm who don’t have much to add to the discussion. There are many fantastic teaching and research faculty who work hard to educate the students. It is true that a restructuring process was needed to to get payroll in line with the student size. However, please keep in mind that WIU’s operating budget is still not even equal to what it was in 2015. So many people making comments here who don’t know what they are talking about. The level of commentary here is usually better than this. - JohninChicago - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 6:10 pm: EIU went through layoffs and program reductions during the two years the state budget was in limbo. EIU didn’t get extra funds to prevent the layoffs. The University increased its marketing and has attracted more students in the Fall and Spring Semesters since refocusing their marketing and working harder to attract new students. A complete year long review of campus programs and offerings was conducted with colleges being merged to reduce administrative costs and attractive new program offerings were made which helped in recruiting. Proud EIU Alumnus - wordslinger - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 6:42 pm: ==A university does not have a predestined right to exist== Thanks for the sermon, padre. Illinois is a big state with many regions. It should be noted that the only areas of population growth Downstate have been anchored by universities. They and the community colleges can provide the educated workforce that will attract private capital for real economic development, not fly-by-night corporate welfare handouts. There’s still a foundation to build on the regionals. But once one is gone, it ain’t ever coming back. Then some will be calling for new prisons in those areas, calling it “economic development.” https://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/February-2016/Where-Is-Illinois-Losing-Population/ - Yooper in Diaspora - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 6:49 pm: - 47th Ward “Also, it takes an official declaration of financial emergency before tenured faculty can be terminated.” There have already been layoffs of tenured faculty over the past few years–including full professors–at WIU, and in many institutions of higher ed across the country. You don’t need to declare financial exigency to be able to lay off a tenured professor. I agree with Scamp640 that many comments in this thread don’t reflect a deep knowledge of higher ed. The pension payments aren’t an excuse for Illinois not to invest more deeply in higher education. They pose a challenge for doing so, but they aren’t a sufficient excuse to disinvest in the common good. - Anonymous - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 6:54 pm: Maybe the President of WIU could do some recruiting while traveling around the country interviewing for other jobs? - Oswego Willy - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 7:13 pm: ===But if we’re spit balling band-aid fixes, how about $100M of those $300M yearly increases currently earmarked for lower ed goes to higher ed? Or all of it? If higher ed is the priority, then make it so. If not, then don’t.=== Was that *so* hard? The trick here, and it’s a trick, is forcing the budgetary realities and funding at levels that make sense for all schooling levels. Investing in education, while also trying to manage pensions is now Pritzker’s charge. If you think I’ll give a pass, you’d be wrong. Budgets tell the real. Dollars are dollars. We’ll see if they will make things right, even after layoffs and structure issues. - Captain Obvious - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 7:28 pm: They need to align their spending with revenue.That means layoffs. It’s not like they can simply raise tuition to cover the difference. Those days are over. Now it’s prioritizing and there are no easy answers. Let’s substitute a couple words and apply this to state government as a whole. They need to align their spending with their revenue. That means layoffs. It’s not like they can simply raise tuition to cover the difference. Those days are over. Now it’s prioritizing and there are no easy answers. - Mama Bird - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 7:28 pm: My daughter is starting there this fall. I will say this much, they surely do need to work on their marketing skills. My D didn’t even want to go there, but when she did, the staff was fantastic and won her over. So unless you visit the campus, there is no real way of knowing all the WIU has to offer. - Captain Obvious - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 7:29 pm: That second part should read: That means cuts. It’s not like they can simply raise taxes to cover the difference. Those days are over. Now it’s prioritizing and there are no easy answers. - JS Mill - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 7:55 pm: =They need to align their spending with revenue.That means layoffs.= 132 today. I guess that is why you call yourself captain obvious? WIU is a nice regional university. They are marketing more aggressively but they need to be more effective. Closing them down would devastate western Illinois. Both in terms of education options for kids and the economy. No need to reach out to the legislators representing WIU, they helped Rauner bleed the school dry. = This needs to be 100% clear to every resident, including all the higher ed advocates who conveniently leave out pension costs from education spend. They are one in the same.= They are not one in the same. The annual cost of the pension is pretty doable. You are conflating two different things. The debt racked up by Illinois, and citizens like yourself, against the pension system is what is hurting Illinois finances. You people should have funded your own projects and allowed the poor legislature to fund the pensions as was required by statute. In stead you forced them to divert the money to pork barrel projects and that kind of stuff. Shame on you. (maybe some snark there) Don’t conflate the debt and the annual cost of the pension. They are not the same thing. - Cadillac - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 8:04 pm: WIU needs to make a call to East Jackson Street - Anon - Tuesday, Mar 5, 19 @ 9:57 pm: As “Mama Bird” suggests, WIU is a hidden gem. It has a surprisingly talented and caring faculty. WIU’s Honors Program is superb. Western students have excelled on CPA and nursing exams. You do indeed have to visit the WIU campus and meet its faculty and staff to fully appreciate the many fine qualities of this university. Although some additional funding might help Western better cope with its present crisis, it appears that the future prospects of this university would be enhanced by new confident, creative, and competent leadership. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 12:55 am: Too bad we can’t afford nice things in Illinois. Something will give. Higher Education will be harmed. - wordslinger - Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 8:54 am: –U of Chicago seems to have survived dropping athletics.– The Maroons have 20 DIII intercollegiate sports teams. They have lots of money, too. - Joe M - Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 8:57 am: Although WIU is a “regional” university, half or more of its students come from the Chicago area, especially Cook County. - City Zen - Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 9:27 am: ==Don’t conflate the debt and the annual cost of the pension. They are not the same thing.== Unfortunately, we report education costs on what is spent. And since that “spend” wasn’t accounted in prior years, it has to be reported when it was “spent” (ie now). Otherwise, it never gets reported. The debt is merely a reflection of the allocation of education spending from years ago. Instead of paying into higher ed’s pension plan, we took that money to expand services and pay salaries and generous health benefits of the employees in higher ed. Unless higher ed wages and hiring has been frozen for a few decades while we were shorting those pension payments. Have they been? It’s all the same. The fact that is goes into SURS and not the university operating expenses doesn’t change the fact it is higher education spend. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 10:16 am: It’s strange to not include the cost of employee benefits in the cost of education. - DownstateGirl - Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 11:09 am: Anon 10:16. Is is strange to categorize late fees and penalties as part of the universities’ costs of education when the payments were the state’s obligation to make and they knowingly chose not to. If you added just the public universities’ operations funds and their “normal pension costs” (leaving out the massive increases in costs associated solely with the skipped/inadequate/late payments by the state) the numbers would show a more accurate picture. Also the pension money literally never goes to the universities. It is a direct Approp (assuming it gets made) from the State to the pension system. So while the normal costs of university employee pensions are fair to include as a cost of doing business, you cannot blame the universities for the state’s budgeting methods/failures. - Anonymous - Wednesday, Mar 6, 19 @ 7:23 pm: Is money going towards the cost of running the education syatem? If so, it has to be included in the cost. Pension debt is part of the cost like any other debt. 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